Oh. My apologies. I shall bow down and lick the boots of one so clever as to INJURE THE GREATEST WORTHLESS IMBECILES OF SKYRIM! The fools go about harassing the Dovahkiin constantly. Do you know that they tried to kill her after she saved us all for the crime of stealing a sweet roll? A SWEET ROLL! For her service to us all, she could go into the barracks, take a dump on your bed, and steal your coin purse and I wouldn’t give the tiniest bit of a skeever ass! The morons stood no chance of course seeing as the children of the hold are made of tougher stuff. Then what was I to expect from a group of Nords with the ability to somehow get stuck in the ground and a shorter memory than a torchbug!?!
was waiting for someone to say that. I wonder how it’s different from normal whiskey anyway. Distilled with the magical essence of elemental fire, perhaps?
I’m kind of amused that no one has commented that although she doesn’t have a wand and doesn’t actually summon any booze, her spell still manages to produce little star and circles.
How old’s Ranma 1/2? I’d doubt it could predate looney tunes, and like every character in that makes extensive use of hammerspace. The name may be derived from Ranma 1/2 (see tim’s comment below), but I’d be surprised if that was where the concept originated, or was even popularised.
The word “hammerspace” comes from – not Ranma 1/2 itself, either, but – the anime fanfiction community of the early-mid 90s, which invented it (i.e. the purported actual existence of a dimension that hammers can be summoned from and/or stored in) to ‘explain’ what was in the original material (be it Ranma 1/2 or any other comedy anime, someone else mentioned City Hunter) an unexplained sight-gag.
What?
You mean you have never used the encumbrance rules?
Yes, certain computer RPGs had encumbrance and enforced it strictly.
Just because it can fit in an inventory slot doesn’t mean you can effectively carry it.
[Man, why is my character moving so slowly? Duh, drop the marble statue H@xM@5t3r.]
“Look, I have 18 strength, I’m still not encumbered.”
“It’s not about the WEIGHT. It’s about the fact that you’re carrying, on your person, a bow, a two-handed sword, a full camp set, a quiver of arrows, two full sets of armor, a fortune in gold and silver coins, and three ten-foot poles.”
Cartoon I always wanted to see in/draw for the Dragon: two adventurers, one gaping at a roughly spherical mass of bags, chests, backpacks, a laden pack mule, etc tottering along on two little legs, as his companion nonchalantly explains:
“Oh yeah, that’s Bolo the Halfling. Found a belt of giant strength last week.”
I’m not talking the phenomenon of grabbing objects from nowhere, I’m talking the specific terminology of “hammerspace.” Looking it up, the term seems to, yeah, come from Ranma 1/2 fanfiction fandom. The phenomenon existed long before Ranma, but it wasn’t given that name until then.
It’s name derived from Akane’s ability to
produce a giant, wooden hammer from nowhere in order to hit Ranma over the head with it. Which she did quite often.
As others have said, it’s an old school cartoon trope – Bugs Bunny didn’t have pockets, but the name “Hammerspace” comes from Ranma, since that’s where hammers specifically being pulled out of nowhere was heavily used.
Actually it probably started as a reference to Ranma 1/2. One of the tropes in the series was people pulling giant hammers out of nowhere. Although a lot of people treat it as an Akane Tendo thing other characters in the series did it as well. Akane just seemed to do it the most.
The concept and name of hammerspace has been around for a lot longer than El Goonish Shive.
Doing just a quick search,
Seems the term started to be popularized in the 1980s by anime and manga fans of Urusei Yatsura and Ranma 1/2.
according to TVTropes the *name* hammerspace originated with Ranma 1/2, but the associated action has been around for at least as long as Mickey Mouse possibly being even older.
Correct, and you need to designate what it is you are summoning. Harry used the “Accio” charm in the 4th movie (HP and the Goblet of Fire) to summon his Quidditch broomstick (“Accio Firebolt!”) to outmaneuver his dragon in the first task of the Twi-Wizard competition, and he again used the charm (“Accio Dittany!”) to quickly find the essence of dittany in Hermione’s handbag when it was needed to treat Ron’s wounds when he was splinched while Apparating from the Ministry of Magic in “HP and the Deathly Hallows Part 1”.
I think you can also use it without designating the target – I seem to recall Molly Weasley using it as simply “Accio!” to grab some things from her children once. Presumably the item has to be in sight for that to work.
My impression was that it could be used with or without specification, with the objects being summoned determined by where the wand was pointed in the latter case. Specifying an object has the advantage of being able to summon a specific object from a greater distance (the Firebolt; I believe the Weasley twins used this for their brooms in OotP as well), or from amongst a group of objects (the dittany). Nonspecific Summoning (the aforementioned example involving Molly Weasley), on the other hand, has the advantage of summoning an unknown object from a known (nearby) location; if I recall the instance with Molly Weasley correctly, she used it to make the twins empty their pockets.
How exactly this interpretation would hold up in cases of wandless and/or nonverbal magic I can’t say for sure.
Ruth cleaned out all her booze due to the blackmail, along with anything Billie had stashed at the time, so I’d assume this is a new post-Ruth’s commitment stash.
Hopefully trying to help a friend? One more night of boxing isn’t going to hurt Billie, but a night of getting that load off her chest might help a lot. Call in an experienced hunch.
I’m currently, for entirely unrelated reasons, trying to figure out what Force a Detox spell needs to be in Shadowrun 3E to affect booze. Unfortunately, if alcohol has ever been assigned a Toxin Power and Damage Level in this edition, I can’t find where.
It specifically says in the spell description that you can use it for that. (I mean, not that that’ll stop an unreasonable GM.) Unfortunately, the numbers to provide actual game mechanics for that don’t appear to have ever been assigned.
Google, being extraordinarily helpful, referred me to my own website.
Would have hated to have had you for the game runner for our Mech 2Arrior back in the day. I went on a 45 min argument to successfully point out why shooting down at a target should get you a gunnery bonus while shooting up added to the ‘to hit’ modifier. Of course we all were new and still playing on just ice worlds to negate heat calculations
It’s easy to paint these characters in a more positive light sometimes but, yeah they are college students. College students drink. It’s not really Dorothy’s responsibility monitor Billie’s drinking habits.
She knows Billie drinks enough that she’d go into withdrawal. That’s definitely enough where it’s a problem and Billie should at least cut back, but Billie doesn’t seem to have any severe symptoms like blacking out or constant nausea.
As Dorothy noted from the lack of detoxing, Billie obviously has been drinking anyway. Joining her won’t likely lead to drinking more than she would have, but it’ll mean Billie will have someone else she can talk to, and who can keep an eye on her
You don’t need to recognize the specific spell to know that someone yelling pseudo-Latin and waving their wand around is doing some Harry Potter bullshit or another, though.
I only read the first two books, and that ages ago. I didn’t know what Accio does, but I recognized it as a Harry Potter reference.
Bullshit, dude. Neil Degrasse Tyson is the greatest human being on this planet (aside from a certain creator of fiction I could name), and the only way he could get any nerdier is if he did a Metamoran fusion dance with Bill Nye and Rebbeca Sugar. (Yes, three-way Metamoran fusion is possible.)
If fascists stopped being popular, nerds would rule the world.
…. also, I think the nerds trying to organize world-running would run into a herding-cats problem. Well, worse than herding cats. You can herd cats with a laser pointer, but no nerd would most nerds wouldn’t fall for that.
Actually, he didn’t. He got a Bachelor’s of Science (undesignated) when he joined the Navy. He was studying to be a Nuclear Engineer (which is an OPERATOR of a Nuclear Power Plant) and not Nuclear Engineering (which is a degree to DESIGN Nuclear plants). He didn’t finish the course because he asked for a Section 8 hardship discharge to take over running the family farm when his father died.
There is a subtle difference between an “Engineer” like Scotty on Star Trek, which is effectively an operator, and someone who practices “Engineering” which is what the people who make your iPhone do.
Scotty is probably the worst example you could name, given that he started the tradition of sci fi engineers being people who do impossible things (however unfair that is), and afaik DOES do engineering in canon. The example you want is probably going to be to maintenance staff, since railroad engineers don’t come up much in fiction anymore.
Note that, even running against the unelected successor to an administration that resigned in disgrace, he had to present himself as a peanut farmer to get elected.
MY son went through the NNPC training course. 18 months of heavy duty study and classes. The kind where missing a class was a military offense. Much more intense than college and more like law school. Navy nuclear engineers are highly tech people and highly sought in the power business.
Doesn’t mean he could design a road, but the Homer Simpson job is high tech in real life, if usually quite sedate.
Nerdiness may be chic, but even given that the mango man lost the popular vote, he did very well – and republicans have raged about experts since Iraq. It’s not as high key as racism but.
Truth. Plus I can’t think of any non-politician asked to run for the American presidency more than Stephen Colbert, the undisputed of white male nerdy liberal late night talk show hosts.
I like nerds and I’m a nerd. I’ve dated nerds. My best friends who are nerds (Sarah is an encyclopedia of awesome from her eclectic expansive reading and does pottery. Noel is a gamer, crafter, Magic: The Gathering enthusiasts, and book lover who enjoys dressing up and lore). I know more about Batman than I do most presidents (and Batman isn’t even my favorite!). I voted for Dorothy on the poll. Nerds rule the world my friend as they are the most awesome. 😉
Of the two in that room, Billie is just as likely to be elected to a major political office in 20 years, as Dorothy is.
I think we’ve learned that there’s no major connection between lifelong resumee and voter reaction, one way or the other, over the last 20+ years… and enough voters will ignore almost anything to vote their “tribal affiliation”.
Careful now. Next thing you know Billie will be acknowledging that she has hammer space. Then she’ll realize she’s in a comic. The fourth wall is in extreme danger!!!
Come on, Billie. Dorothy needs her nerdiness. It’s what she retreats into when she gets stressed out from working too hard, caring too much, and presenting a serious and mature facade to the world.
I’lm going to hold off on judgment until we see just what Dorothy’s actual end goal is here and just how far this is going to go… but her being aware of Billie’s alcoholism and suggesting drinking as a solution to any kind of problem really kind of horrifies me.
I don’t think she suggesting it as a solution. She’s wise enough to know Billie is drinking anyway – that’s awesome in a way because it implies she knows a lot about it – and thinks the benefits of Billie talking about her feels top the currently unrealistic wish she’d dry out.
I’m of two minds about her expectation this may help. I’m not sure how much of the stuff a drunk talks about or does really registers in their mind and body in a useful way. But the chance is greater than with Billie drinking alone.
Billie doesn’t want to go into therapy because she is still drinking, isn’t she?
Who wants a shit ton of art? It gets gradually more NSFW as you scroll down. Also if you’re at work you should focus on improving productivity instead of clicking on links in comic comment sections.
No, see the really “cool” kids will happily watch LOTR, Harry Potter, Game of Thrones etc but actually *admitting* that they remember any of the story would make them “nerds” in their own eyes…
Cue any number of ” I was into XYZ before it was cool” type expressions, or “only nerds and geeks care about the difference between nerds and geeks”…
But LOTR is one of the best (if not the best) selling and well-known series of fantasy literature of all time. Putting that as bar of nerd hood is much more inclusive than most would think. Now, the Silmarilion, that is nerdy. Then again there are various types of nerds, and which types should and should not be considered nerdy is up for debate.
First, words mean what they are actually used to mean. That is how words work.
Second, science fiction and fantasy have been associated with nerdiness for a very long time. Decades, at least. trlkly didn’t suddenly “redefine” it. That isn’t *even* new.
Third, in my experience, nerdiness is much more about the *approach* to a topic, rather than the specific topic chosen. The fun nerds, also in my experience, are the ones who can see, appreciate, and enjoy this enthusiasm in others, even if it is a topic they don’t have that enthusiasm for personally, rather than dismissing people as “insufficiently nerdy” for choosing the “wrong” subject or even daring to enjoy additional subjects. I don’t actually know anything about Transformers, but I like seeing Willis excited about them in his Twitter. I don’t say “pshaw, he’s not a real nerd because he enjoys something other than math or maybe physics!”
There do exist nerds who *would* say that, but they are additionally what I would refer to as a “snob” at best, but depending on context quite possibly also a “gatekeeper”. Nearly any set of people will *contain* snobs and gatekeepers, but that does not by any means make snobbery and gatekeeperiness a necessary part of belonging to that set.
With luck, “nerds are into science” was mostly joking and I merely misread your tone, but the prescriptivist approach to word definitions later also comes across as elitist and condescending and makes it harder to read the first bit as a light joke either.
It brings something to you from somewhere else, magically.
I personally thought it was a reference to Billie telling Dorothy to come to her and her arriving. But apparently it’s supposed to be to Billie getting the bottle a few panels earlier.
Would’ve been been a better joke, IMO, if we didn’t see her obviously rummaging behind her bed to get the alcohol. It’s too obvious where it came from.
And whatever does happen I do want to comment on people saying it’s somehow okay because Billie would have been drinking alone anyway? That’s kind of irrelevant? The important thing was that (as far as we know now) Billie was NOT drinking before Dorothy showed up and may not have been going to drink before Dorothy showed up but Dorothy suggesting drinking made that maybe become an actual thing that happened. So now it doesn’t really matter what Billie might have done. However bad this could get from here Dorothy is now partly to blame. And it might all turn out fine. Dorothy might just talk to Billie and help her smooth out some issues and do some much needed crying and get cut off before she goes too far. Billie might end up much better off for this but this is still an incredibly dangerous gamble Dorothy is taking with an incredibly fragile person and she has absolutely no idea how bad this could potentially go.
Okay she’s been a legal adult for all of a handful of months but sure whatever legally yeah she’s a grown up. I’d agree she should take full responsibility for this decision if she had made it all on her own in a stable emotional state. She’s not and she didn’t.
Her canonically neglectful parents who thought it would be a good idea to ship her off before successfully getting her treatment for her obvious addiction issues and as far as we know have made zero contact with her in the month since she’s left? Those parents?
Maturity and stability are not the same thing. Regardless, while Billie is responsible for her own decisions, it’s more than fair for fillerusername to think it’s irresponsible for Dorothy to offer. Personally, I’m a bit torn on whether it’s a good idea myself and hopefully it doesn’t backfire too badly.
Being a legal adult doesn’t automatically mean someone is mature enough it make their own (smart) decisions. I know people pushing 60 who still struggle with this. Age and maturity are by no means directly correlated.
That’s the point. If Billie was going to do it anyways, then Dorothy can’t be partly of the blame. To be partly to blame, you have to have a causal relationship to what happened.
The risk to Billie is actually less if Dorothy is with her than if Billie is by herself. Now, the risk to Dorothy is higher, but that’s a risk she’s willing to take to try and help a friend. (This is a huge risk to Dorothy’s ambitions if Roz finds out about it. In that regard, it is definitely a “mistake.”)
Now, there is an argument that Billie would not have had that drink if someone like Dorothy had not recommended it. Billie does actually seem to be detoxing. She seemed surprised by even the idea of drinking, not just that Dorothy offered it.
That is where you can blame Dorothy. We just don’t know that Billie was going to drink. While unlikely, she could have made it to her college-ordered appointment without drinking. And it’s definitely possible that this goes off the rails, as Dorothy is not any sort of expert on doing this, even if the general idea isn’t horrible.
We don’t know that she can control herself, let alone keep Billie from going too far.
Like I already said it doesn’t really matter what Billie MIGHT have done all on her own. We don’t live in that universe. By inserting herself into the situation and suggesting drinking Dorothy influenced however this night was going to go for Billie and so however it goes she holds some responsibility for it. She has a more than casual relationship to how this night moves forward good or bad.
Dorothy didn’t force Billie to drink. She didn’t even supply the booze that Billie apparently had ready-at-hand. She asked what Billie wanted, then accepted Billie’s answer. Should she have accepted Billie’s answer? Highly debatable. It’s definitely not something she should make a habit of accepting/enabling, but for right now, in this one particular instance where it at least looks to Dorothy that there’s something Billie needs even more than she needs to not be drinking? It’s not so cut-and-dry. I’m not saying Dorothy’s right here, but she’s not single-handedly destroying Billie’s life
And I just want to double-emphasize that Billie is whipping out her own booze in a room that Ruth -completely cleaned out of booze- just a couple days ago. If Billie’s going to get sober, it’s going to be if/when she participates in her own sobreity.
We didn’t ever get a reference to Billie detoxing. In the last two arcs, we never saw her throw out booze, we never saw her struggling with wanting a drink and deciding not to drink. We just never saw her drinking.
Speaking for myself, I thought that she stopped drinking but if I look back at what the comic tells us, I don’t see any indication of it. And Dorothy is right: if Billie were detoxing, we would have seen symptoms of that. And we didn’t.
So that was just wishful thinking on my part. And obviously yours, too.
Dorothy says right here “You definitely haven’t been detoxing”. We’ve seen no signs of it. It was always clear when Ruth was, but we’ve never seen anything similar for Billie – which was a big thing back when they’d made a pact to stop drinking, but Billie didn’t.
Billie has booze within reach. She’s making no effort to avoid it.
There was no way she wasn’t drinking tonight. There’s no way she hasn’t been drinking regularly. Quite likely, she’s not completely sober right now.
It’s worth arguing Dorothy shouldn’t be enabling her anyway, especially since she realizes Billie’s problem is serious enough to use “detoxing” to describe it, but there’s no need to pretend it makes any difference to whether she drinks or not.
“Incredibly dangerous, well-intended gambles involving alcohol and drama” sounds like the lives of most college-aged people I knew when I was a collegeketeer, so, points to the characters for realism, I think.
Although I was in college decades ago, Perhaps the “wiser youth of today” don’t make mistakes like that.
I mean, theoretically Billie might not have drunk tonight. She wasn’t actually drinking at the moment, so she could have thrown away the booze she’d bought to drink tonight and gone on the wagon, despite having shown no signs of any intention to do so.
But blaming Dorothy for her drinking is like blaming the guy who bought the first round at the bar for you drinking that night – you went to the bar. You were going to drink. Just because someone else took a step to start the process doesn’t change it.
I have said over and over I’m not placing all the blame for whatever happens tonight completely on Dorothy. I am saying that whatever Billie may have done on her own by deciding to be apart of what happens tonight Dorothy does share some responsibility for however it goes. I think/hope Dorothy herself is aware of this and will try not to let things go to far but I wish she was considering how potentially out of her depth she is. I’m confused though as to why I have to try this hard to explain my issue with her behavior. Again had Billie chosen to drink alone tonight whatever happened afterwards would have just been on her. By deciding to be apart of this decision Dorothy is now apart of whatever happens in this room going forward. I have already said I am willing to consider this won’t be a disaster but when you are dealing with a situation this fragile so many things could potentially go wrong. Dorothy is not equipped to deal with how wrong this could go. She’s not fully equipped to deal with Billie sober and it was Dorothy not Billie who suggested bringing alcohol into this and making things potentially more volatile. I really do not care if Billie’s been drinking off screen all this time before Dorothy showed up. I am talking about this specific situation that is happening right now and how it could potentially spiral. As for your example: As for your example yes it does? Change things? Because efore free booze is presented any number of things could happen? It’s a lot easier to opt out of drinking before free booze is placed in front of you. If you were one drink away from a bad decision guess what now you can potentially use that money to buy yourself another after the free one. And now that your liquored up with two drinks it makes it easier to want more. Look at that first drink like a set of dominoes. Also consider if that guy who buys the rounds knows the guy sitting next to him is already drunk or let’s say…a struggling alcoholic who may have walked out if a free drink wasn’t shoved in his face…or one more drink away from alcohol poisoning…then that friendly stranger does get some of the blame for what happens. As would the over serving hypothetical bartender. That’s the risk you take when you decide to influence another individual’s decisions. That’s the reason liability laws exist. Also consider how Billie’s decision making capacity is already compromised with what she’s been dealing with the past few days and that she has likely already been drinking. This is a potential powder keg of a situation. Dorothy is trying to help but again this is an extremely risky way to go about it.Again I am not saying this night will end horribly. I am not Dorothy’s some kind of monster. All I am saying is that this is a really risky move she’s making and she should be willing to take responsibility for whatever part she plays in it.Like it or not she is playing a part no matter how much people want to absolve her.
She could succeed in any of them, but I’d say Slytherin or Hufflepuff. She’s motivated either by a mixture of ambition and desire to help others. Studying is a means to an end, albeit one she’s good at and embraces.
Well, Slytherin is obviously the best because it’s so green. Plus, she’s definitely motivated by “ambition” because she wants to be president so much and is willing to do a lot to get there.
Calling it now. Leslie and Robin have sex and regret it bitterly and get drunk. Dorothy and Billie get drunk and have sex and regret it bitterly. Ethan and Mike drink and have Sex. Mike regrets nothing. He does however discover he has a horrifying alcohol problem.
…Yes, that’s why there are never any qualifiers like ‘computer nerds’ or ‘music nerds’ or, yes, ‘pop culture nerds’.
There are also multiple definitions of nerds – one is ‘an expert in a particular field’. Said field can very well be pop culture (or a particular fandom). The dictionary expands that to ‘technical field’ but by that definition math and science don’t count either, since neither are technology fields. Some include applied sciences as ‘technical fields’ but not math and not all kinds of science.
Frankly, this is silly because Billie’s being colloquial not precise in her word use, and by colloquial use, fandom stuff definitely counts.
Fantasy football is the nerdiest thing in the universe to me. Like…at least with Dungeons and Dragons you’re taking statistics of stuff that doesn’t exist. Fantasy Football is basically making sports Actuary work.
You can’t gatekeep my nerdery unless you prove to me you are a nerd. And I refuse to believe nerdboys/ nerdgirls/ nerdnonbinaries are real until you can replicate one from scratch in a laboratory. Go back into the driveway and shovel me some snow, fake nerd.
Seriously, I believe the current popular usage of “nerd” encompasses those of any interest who find their engrossing interest more important than social stigma attached, and the more social stigma, the more inherently “nerdy” the subject. Thus my interest in Silver-Age pulp authors is (somehow) considered more nerdish than Willis’ interest in Transformers, because so few people (exactly zero) are willing to engage my fan theories on, say, Harrison’s Deathworld, while there are millions of people who will happily get into an argument over which Pantone color best represents Rodimus Prime’s, um, racing stripes or whatever. (Willis’s actual deep-level drillfown in the subject matter may change the story, though, as might his ability to actually get people to take an interest in what he is saying about Transformers).
If you want to make “nerd is only about science/ math” “happen,” talk to the fellahin over at Merriam-Webster. Or give me a source. Don’t just talk like you have the right to police my language.
I have never read Harry Potter or seen the movies on the grounds that a proper wizard carries a staff, not a wand. It’s weird and wrong and I won’t stand for it
Panel One: Confirmation that Billie has not stopped drinking. Which I think we can tell. She’s not been showing any signs of detox ever. So, yeah, logical leap to assume she must have some somewhere.
Panel Two: I can’t blame Billie for being suspicious either. Dorothy can have a bit of a high horse sometimes when it comes to following rules. That’s not always a bad thing, but it can be irritating sometimes. And this WOULD be a huge wrench to her application for RA and Yale if she got caught, so the offer would be surprising.
Panel Three: But, because to Dorothy people matter more than ambition, yes, she is 100% serious. She will sit in the dark and drink with Billie and talk with her. And while I worry about the wisdom of drinking with an alcoholic (I realize it can be helpful but I’m one of those people who goes ‘YOU CANNOT EVER EVER EVER SO MUCH AS HOLD SCISSORS POINT SIDE UP WHAT IF SOMETHING BAD HAPPENS WHAT IF IT BACKFIRES?’ worry warts so please bear with me), I think it’ll do some good to get this off my chest. Plus I will not stop until at least everyone on the main cast page is one group of friends. This is my aesthetic. Fight me about it. 😛
Panel Four: And that’s got Billie thinking too. It’ll be good to get some of that litany of emotions off her chest. Even if she has to access them with booze and with someone she’s not a huge fan of. And, well, it’s one of the few genuine, acknowledging reach outs she’s gotten. Not a vague ‘hey, how are you’ or a ‘so how’s Ruth’ or ‘how’s things’, an offer to sit down and talk about whatever feelings about Ruth she wants to talk about. I think it was good timing too – yesterday was too raw, too recent, and now she’s still angry but she’s also tired and worn out and she wants to not be angry.
Panel Five: And she’s still cranky, but this isn’t quite as hostile. Sure, she calls her prissy, but she also pats the bed beside her and offers her to sit down. This is starting to feel more like the Billie that was a bit healthier (though not healthy in any way). Like the Billie who calls Joyce and Walky, as much as she likes them, ‘fucking nerds’. And, tbf, Dorothy is pretty prissy compared to Billie. Delightful, yes, but still prissy. 😛
Panel Six: Dorothy looks a little awkward here. This is only the third time in her life she’s gotten to drink and this time it’s with the intent of getting sloshed. And it’s in much more serious circumstances than either time before. So this is definitely awkward. Plus Billie totally pulled that out of hammerspace. 😛
Panel Seven: So on with the awkward clearing nerd joke! 😀 I’m not shocked Dorothy likes Harry Potter. It’s actually my head canon that Dorothy has a long list of shows, books, etc. she’s gaga over that she has a lot of meta and analysis on a usb tucked away as ‘kid stuff’ somewhere. Dorothy is having fun, so who cares?
And I think Billie is in a bit of a better mood to me. This is highly subjective based on the tone you read it in, but I’m reading this more like Billie calling Walky a fucking nerd or Joyce a dork. Billie’s irritated, yes, but it’s more light than the anger that’s all she can access anymore. It’s the Kool-Aid of irritation.
I can easily see Billie as the kind of friend who would go ‘Oh my god, you fucking nerd, this is so embarrassing why are you doing this to me – wait, what do you mean random people are being awful to you, HOW DARE THEY, you’re MY nerd! I’m gonna go kick their ass and then maybe stuff you in a locker for being a nerd.”
But that is a Billie for another day once these two have bonded. This is a pretty good start though. Bonding and boozing can be exactly what Billie needs. And also hopefully that bond will nudge her into not skipping therapy.
Yeah, as much as I think offering to drink with an alcoholic is a bad idea, there isn’t really a good alternative right now. Leaving her alone would be worse. There’s kinda in the dark until they can get Billie to a therapist and an addictions counsellor. Once she’s gotten that together and tapered off her consumption, we’ll see how good she is for booze (some recovered alcoholics are fine having one or two or on special occasions, while others need to stay away for good). But that’s a later issue and this is now.
You see, we’re not real nerds. We’re too diverse. For us to be real nerds, we’d have to stay segregated even if we were all shoved into a box together.
*braces for flames from the 98% who won’t get that joke*
Yes. A few places import them from the US and charge November ungodly amount for them but the carefree days of waltzing into a corner shop and buying nerds for 50p ended years ago.
This comic talks to me a lot. I already identify with Dorothy and…. I’ve been here. In panel 6. Sitting in a murder cave (figuratively in my case) with a self destructive friend or almost friend, knowing that I’m WAY in over my head…. but still hoping that I can do something good by being there, at least keeping them alive until morning.
This is Dorothy stepping up to be the team mom she wants to be. This is her actually helping people rather than just being a friendly smile in the corridor. This is her making up for dismissing Walky’s worries about Billie earlier. And I love her for it.
I’m also thinking that, as soon as Billie feels confident that Dorothy is lubricated enough not to remember anything, she’s going to pretty much spill all the pain in her heart. We’ll know, even if Dorothy won’t.
See, the RA is gone for ONE DAY and already little goodie two-shoe Dorothy is sitting with her goodie two shoes in the bed. ANARCHY I TELL YOU!!! ANARCHY!
Man people are willing to go through some hoops to justify someone enabling their alcoholism. It’s rough watching a character you like make a -terrible- decision.
From experience: Drinking with an alcoholic is almost always a terrible decision. But in this case, the other option is to leave Billie without any support network she feels she can rely on. Which would be worse. Lesser of two evils.
That said: I’m worried for Dot here. Like me when I first started drinking with an alcoholic (naive past me was told she “just likes to drink” and believed it at the time – see also autistic difficulty with subtext and reading people), she genuinely has no clue what the fuck she’s in for and also has no idea where her limits are. That’s a bad combo. That’s a wind-up-hurling-up-pizza-and-so-many-cheap-beer-you-lost-count-around-six-or-was-it-seven-in-your-kitchen-sink-while-your-partner-debates-whether-to-take-you-to-the-ER bad combo.
Plus, from experience: Part of how alcoholics work – especially social alcoholics like Billie (those who mask their alcoholism by pretending to be just someone who likes to party) – is to find social justifications for drinking. Oh, hey, want to go grab a beer after work? (That way I’m not drinking alone) You don’t? You’re no fun. You never come out with me anymore! C’mon, it’ll be fun! (insert needling, wheedling and emotional blackmail here until someone agrees).
Billie doesn’t have this issue – but the other thing that type of alcoholic does if they don’t have money to afford to drink is to try to get other people to pay for their drink-of-choice. You “take turns” buying pitchers – never mind that they drink 3/4 of each of the pitchers, at least, so you wind up paying for all of what you drink and at least half of what they drink. That person made a boatload more cash than me (literally 4x my pay at the time, and half again my current salary) but always had cash troubles and nobody could figure out why. The why: They spent over half of every paycheck feeding their addictions.
Thing is: The longer you give an alcoholic an excuse, or be their non-alcoholic beard, the worse they get. It feels like you’re helping them, by going out and socializing so they get some emotional support, but you’re not a fucking therapist and you’re completely unqualified to help in any real way with a problem of that magnitude. All they will do is give you a whopping case of caregiver depression and, if they’re abusive in their mindset, target you for emotional abuse to try to bring your spirits down to their level. Sooner or later you notice yourself picking up the same habits: Wanting to drink whenever you’re feeling stressed or tired or anything, never seeming to have a good day anymore, and just being an angrier, more tired, more unhappy person than you used to be. And then you wind up having to make a decision: Cut them off for your own mental wellbeing, or continue the path with them. Because fuck knows you’ve been trying to help for years and it’s not been working and you’re at your limit because a single amateur doesn’t have even a ghost of a fraction of a chance at helping a lifelong alcoholic out of their addiction on their own – as others before you have found to their own dismay.
I wound up having to choose to cut that person out of my life in a self-preservation sense. I do feel bad for it – but I wasn’t helping (if anything I was making the situation worse because she’d manipulated me into covering for her and contributing financial support for her addiction that I couldn’t afford to contribute, and I was allowing her to sabotage my relationships and my career), and I was not in a headspace where I could keep trying.
That’s the path I worry Dot is going to run into – because it’s a path to hell paved with the best of intentions that I’ve walked down myself.
I doubt Dorothy’s going to make a long term habit of this. Though tonight could be bad, if she tries to do anything like keep up with Billie. OTOH, they’re limited to however much alcohol Billie has on hand.
Billie’s also not just a social alcoholic. She is a party girl, though we’ve only seen her at one party and not even any real hints at more. She does most of her drinking in her room by herself – or locked in a room with Ruth. I’d bet that started over the summer, when she seems to have been cut off from most of her former social circle (hadn’t seen Alice(?) at all, for example).
It doesn’t happen overnight. It is incremental. Or at least it was for me. And Billie’s long line of burned bridges suggests she is prone to that pattern.
Agreed. It’s a real risk – a very dangerous risk – and coupled with Dorothy’s sense of responsibility as a self proclaimed “Team mom” it’s something she has to be careful with.
Here’s where a low level of culturally acceptable alcoholism and a legal drinking age of 18 really come into their own. When my mates got sad at freshers we just went to the damn pub like civilised people.
I had access to alcohol a lot younger than that, through the SCA, and it was never an issue. (Mostly for two reasons: I don’t like the taste of most of it, and I managed to screw up quite enough while being entirely sober.)
What a glorious coincidence that the Harry Potter reference occurs less than a week after I finish rereading the series, and while I’m halfway through reading the script for the stage play.
I see a lot AA-speak coming up in this discussion.
Interesting to note that nothing AA claims has any empirical or scientific basis, and that their actual success rate is barely higher than “cold turkey”.
Instead, there’s a lot of evidence that very different programs work for different people, and that a significant number of people who went back to drinking after AA, are subsequently able to *moderate* their drinking through other approaches. This also puts a pretty big hole in the assertion that anyone who has had a drinking problem is a lifelong addict who can only be “sober” or “not”.
I think this is some pretty spot-on insight. I’ve known former alcoholics whose alcoholism was essentially self-medication for some other issue (such as clinical depression). Once the root cause was properly addressed (such as SSRI medication, therapy, etc) drinking alcohol was no longer a compulsion and they were able to go on having 1 or 2 drinks on special occasions without it spiraling.
Obviously it’s not that simple for everyone, and I’m sure many alcoholics never can return to drinking safely, but everyone’s particular problems and solutions are different.
(That said, obviously Billie is not at the “can drink safely because root problem is solved” point yet).
Note: I typically use the term “sober” to describe the instantaneous state of not being intoxicated. That is the sense in which I use it here.
One thing that worries me is that it sounds like several commenters seem to be advocating for never ever another drink for Billie starting right now. But if she hasn’t been sober once for weeks, she probably has a *lot* to work out of her system. And unlike many other drugs, withdrawal from alcohol can be literally fatal. (Not to mention the dangers of removing a coping mechanism without replacement from someone so very depressed.) If she’s been drinking as much as it looks like she’s been drinking, she needs to taper *safely*. In the middle of worsening depression she might not be able to do this herself, but if someone who likes to take notes on lots of details had her trust and could help her count, that could be very beneficial.
She may well need to actually stop having alcohol entirely, once she has successfully tapered down, but if she stops too suddenly she can die. Even if stopping entirely is the end goal, it needs to be done *carefully*. And if Dorothy can gain her trust, I think she can be very helpful at that.
Additionally, if Dorothy can gain Billie’s trust, she might improve Billie’s chances of actually going to her therapy appointments which, unless the therapist turns out to be terrible, will also be very useful, and can also help with the alcoholism.
The claim that AA doesn’t work (any better than stopping to drink on your own) comes up often in the comments here. Can you provide sources? And comparisons to other approaches (especially those that do not cost an arm and a leg for months of clinical treatment)?
Worse than Tolkien is certainly possible. In fact, common. Tolkien’s really good.
Rowling’s a very different writer – not nearly Tolkien’s equal in many ways, but mostly writing with different intent and for a different audience.
Both have had tremendous influence on their fields, though we’ll see if Rowling lasts nearly as long.
Of course, if one or both isn’t too your taste, that’s fine. “De gustibus non est disputandum.”
Let’s just say, apropos of nothing, that novels with the name “Moorcock” plastered in big letters across the cover were probably not the best thing to be carrying around junior high.
Tolkien isn’t so much a writer – he’s atrocious – as much as someone who accidentally struck a chord with the fugue state of a post-imperial, post-war country which yearned for the pre-war days that resembled the Shire.
He tapped into adolescent fantasies in a big way, and created the modern market for fantasy.
It can be a response to that and still be genuine. She’d already tried to reach out to Billie before she even found out about Roz, so she clearly was already motivated to do so. The only change is her approach
Loading ...
Insert butterbeer reference
Butterbeer doesn’t hide the fact that Billie had to be enough of a nerd to understand the reference.
Bahahaha, yer damn right :3
Billie’s more into Fire Whiskey.
“I’d be a lot happier and a lot warmer with a belly full of mead”
By the 8! We cut you off for a reason. Do you remember the arrow incident?
of course why do you think we have so many guards in whiterun.
Oh. My apologies. I shall bow down and lick the boots of one so clever as to INJURE THE GREATEST WORTHLESS IMBECILES OF SKYRIM! The fools go about harassing the Dovahkiin constantly. Do you know that they tried to kill her after she saved us all for the crime of stealing a sweet roll? A SWEET ROLL! For her service to us all, she could go into the barracks, take a dump on your bed, and steal your coin purse and I wouldn’t give the tiniest bit of a skeever ass! The morons stood no chance of course seeing as the children of the hold are made of tougher stuff. Then what was I to expect from a group of Nords with the ability to somehow get stuck in the ground and a shorter memory than a torchbug!?!
That was perfect. o/
By the 9 you mean 🙂
(Yes Ulfric is a dick, but he’s right on this point)
Blasphemy!
No-one swears by the Almsivi or the Saints of the Tribunal Temple these days, and that is the bigger blasphemy.
By the old gods and the new…
Tiber Septim FTW!
+1
Horrified at all the blasphemy here.
I swear to the gods, I read that as “insert buttsex reference” and I was like “huh?”
Firewhiskey is funnier.
was waiting for someone to say that. I wonder how it’s different from normal whiskey anyway. Distilled with the magical essence of elemental fire, perhaps?
No.
She even sleeps nerdy.
Well, she sleeps with Walky, so, yeah.
She CAN not…
Dorothy, a witch? Better check her for ruby slippers.
Since she’s kind of a goody-two-shoes, I see her as being more like Magrat Garlick, but somewhat less of a “wet hen”.
Miss Tick, maybe? The teacher witch from the Tiffany Aching side of the Discworld books.
Please, if Dorothy is a witch we known which witch.
“You’re saying it wrong. It’s Wing-gar-dium Levi-o-sa, make the ‘gar’ nice and long.”
“You do it, then, if you’re so clever,”
RonWalky snarled.”Yesssssss, perfect reference. And the similarities *are* pretty strong.
Definitely not Magrath. Miss Tick when she was young?
I don’t know.
She reminds me more of the dragon princess.
No, she is a Which, not a Witch.
She’s Faintly Macabre, the Not-so-wicked Which?
Sure she is not the Wotch?
I’m kind of amused that no one has commented that although she doesn’t have a wand and doesn’t actually summon any booze, her spell still manages to produce little star and circles.
Not familiar enough with Harry Potter to know what that spell is supposed to do, but I’m guessing it’s not “make booze appear out of thin air.”
It causes a nearby object to fly over to you.
I think Hammerspace is a reference to El Goonish Shive (Which is awesome, go read it)
“Hammerspace” is much, much older. Think, like, Ranma 1/2.
And the gag itself is older than that, going back to the early days of animation. After all, Bugs Bunny doesn’t have pockets.
haha, avatar is relevant
How old’s Ranma 1/2? I’d doubt it could predate looney tunes, and like every character in that makes extensive use of hammerspace. The name may be derived from Ranma 1/2 (see tim’s comment below), but I’d be surprised if that was where the concept originated, or was even popularised.
Whoops, took too long writing that and got very ninja’d XD
The word “hammerspace” comes from – not Ranma 1/2 itself, either, but – the anime fanfiction community of the early-mid 90s, which invented it (i.e. the purported actual existence of a dimension that hammers can be summoned from and/or stored in) to ‘explain’ what was in the original material (be it Ranma 1/2 or any other comedy anime, someone else mentioned City Hunter) an unexplained sight-gag.
Old as we, not everyone is.
I was thinking Who Framed Roger Rabbit? Especially since it’s a boob gag.
Or every rpg ever. INVENTORY.
What?
You mean you have never used the encumbrance rules?
Yes, certain computer RPGs had encumbrance and enforced it strictly.
Just because it can fit in an inventory slot doesn’t mean you can effectively carry it.
[Man, why is my character moving so slowly? Duh, drop the marble statue H@xM@5t3r.]
“Look, I have 18 strength, I’m still not encumbered.”
“It’s not about the WEIGHT. It’s about the fact that you’re carrying, on your person, a bow, a two-handed sword, a full camp set, a quiver of arrows, two full sets of armor, a fortune in gold and silver coins, and three ten-foot poles.”
“That’s right.”
“HOW? Where are you keeping that?”
“Oh! In my pack.”
Cartoon I always wanted to see in/draw for the Dragon: two adventurers, one gaping at a roughly spherical mass of bags, chests, backpacks, a laden pack mule, etc tottering along on two little legs, as his companion nonchalantly explains:
“Oh yeah, that’s Bolo the Halfling. Found a belt of giant strength last week.”
Pretty much the starting concept for the webcomic Nodwick http://comic.nodwick.com/?comic=2008-01-24
Naaaaaaaaaa na na na nana na na…
Yup!
Wow, thanks Slarti, I ran across that comic years ago and forgot to bookmark it, and have been trying to find it ever since.
You should see the load of crap my Fallout 4 character hauls around. It even gets comments from the other NPCs in the game.
I find it odd that you’d quote Ranma 1/2 in a discussion of hammer space and not looney toons or something.
I’m not talking the phenomenon of grabbing objects from nowhere, I’m talking the specific terminology of “hammerspace.” Looking it up, the term seems to, yeah, come from Ranma 1/2 fanfiction fandom. The phenomenon existed long before Ranma, but it wasn’t given that name until then.
as, um, i guess 30 people below me also say, ah-heh
Christ, can you NOT be a nerd for like five seconds
Why would we want to stop being awesome?
…The man writes a WEBCOMIC. How can he stop being a nerd?
He could stop writing the webcomic for five seconds.
But then I guess maybe the buffer wouldn’t be out to April.
also stop being master of the Transformers wiki.
… yeah, no.
He’d still possess the quality of being the writer of a webcomic.
It’s name derived from Akane’s ability to
produce a giant, wooden hammer from nowhere in order to hit Ranma over the head with it. Which she did quite often.
tvtropes says Ranma 1/2
It’s much older than Ranma 1/2. I have been watching cartoons since before Clarabelle became Captain Kangaroo, and Hammerspace was old even then.
As others have said, it’s an old school cartoon trope – Bugs Bunny didn’t have pockets, but the name “Hammerspace” comes from Ranma, since that’s where hammers specifically being pulled out of nowhere was heavily used.
I first heard of it in fandom reference to the anime CITY HUNTER.
City hunter was the first 😛
Tell it!
Kaori bashes Ryô with a 100T hammer pulled out of nowhere whenever he does something perverted. The manga began in 1985.
Actually it probably started as a reference to Ranma 1/2. One of the tropes in the series was people pulling giant hammers out of nowhere. Although a lot of people treat it as an Akane Tendo thing other characters in the series did it as well. Akane just seemed to do it the most.
Hammerspace is a term for whenever a character pulls something outta nowhere. It’s been around for decades. :p
Not to be confused with plotspace which is a little used term for whenerver a writer pulls something out of their ass. It’s been around since Homer.
Uh-huh. Would’ve guessed it was a bit older than The Simpsons.
Think older. Think more Greek, less yellow.
You mean J wrapped in a bed-sheet with a wreath as a crown?
Hammerspace is way older than EGS. Though EGS is awesome.
The concept and name of hammerspace has been around for a lot longer than El Goonish Shive.
Doing just a quick search,
Seems the term started to be popularized in the 1980s by anime and manga fans of Urusei Yatsura and Ranma 1/2.
according to TVTropes the *name* hammerspace originated with Ranma 1/2, but the associated action has been around for at least as long as Mickey Mouse possibly being even older.
Not to be confused with Hammer Time, which is something else entirely.
Stop!
Touch ThisStop!
And definatly not confused with Hammerman
You mean Captain Hammer?
It’s a summoning spell, so you’re actually not far off!
Correct, and you need to designate what it is you are summoning. Harry used the “Accio” charm in the 4th movie (HP and the Goblet of Fire) to summon his Quidditch broomstick (“Accio Firebolt!”) to outmaneuver his dragon in the first task of the Twi-Wizard competition, and he again used the charm (“Accio Dittany!”) to quickly find the essence of dittany in Hermione’s handbag when it was needed to treat Ron’s wounds when he was splinched while Apparating from the Ministry of Magic in “HP and the Deathly Hallows Part 1”.
ACCIO BOOZE!
…hey, it worked!
And in the glorious Very Potter Musical he summoned an entire song number.
I think you can also use it without designating the target – I seem to recall Molly Weasley using it as simply “Accio!” to grab some things from her children once. Presumably the item has to be in sight for that to work.
Partially nonverbal magic?
My impression was that it could be used with or without specification, with the objects being summoned determined by where the wand was pointed in the latter case. Specifying an object has the advantage of being able to summon a specific object from a greater distance (the Firebolt; I believe the Weasley twins used this for their brooms in OotP as well), or from amongst a group of objects (the dittany). Nonspecific Summoning (the aforementioned example involving Molly Weasley), on the other hand, has the advantage of summoning an unknown object from a known (nearby) location; if I recall the instance with Molly Weasley correctly, she used it to make the twins empty their pockets.
How exactly this interpretation would hold up in cases of wandless and/or nonverbal magic I can’t say for sure.
There’s a secret booze cache cut into a hole behind the Leafs poster.
So THAT’S why neither Billie nor Ruth can detox. In that room, even turning over a new leaf is enabling.
….
*flees for dear punning life*
Too late.
Nope. I’m punching you for the use of “nor” which even when used correctly annoys me. *dumps fruit punch on Rel’s head*
Well, I mean, we could use “Billie nand Billie nand Ruth nand Ruth, nand Billie nand Billie nand Ruth nand Ruth”, but that’s unwieldy and unclear.
…
…
…
*Freezes new bowl of punch*
*Dumps frozen punch on John*
Hey now. You’re suppose to hit us with the punch on an UPWARD trajectory, not dumping it on us. That’s punching down.
Well, all logic gates in processors can be reduced to nands, and they’re very much at an age when they’re processing things with their nands.
You forgot the parenthesis.
Plausible and awaiting confirmation in canon.
Wingardium Booziosa!
oh, right! is this ruth’s room? is she drinking ruth’s booze, or has she stashed booze around there as well?
…or is she just developing a love of the leafs?
Ruth cleaned out all her booze due to the blackmail, along with anything Billie had stashed at the time, so I’d assume this is a new post-Ruth’s commitment stash.
It’s booziOsa, not boozioSAH.
Noted.
I am guaranteed to quote that line whenever someone pronounces something wrong around me.
If I am ever lynched, that will be the reason.
I just quote it whenever I encounter mimosas.
She’s a nightmare, honestly. No wonder she hasn’t got any friends.
Okay, so Dorothy IS aware of Billie’s alcoholism.
Just what does she think she is doing?
Hopefully trying to help a friend? One more night of boxing isn’t going to hurt Billie, but a night of getting that load off her chest might help a lot. Call in an experienced hunch.
Sigh boozing not boxing … I hate autocorrect.
I assumed it was one more night of toxing, the opposite of detoxing.
Technically, the reason it’s “detoxing” is that alcohol is toxic in large doses, so yeah let’s raise the toxicity
We’ll drink to that.
I’m currently, for entirely unrelated reasons, trying to figure out what Force a Detox spell needs to be in Shadowrun 3E to affect booze. Unfortunately, if alcohol has ever been assigned a Toxin Power and Damage Level in this edition, I can’t find where.
Any reasonable GM will houserule it to 1.
An unreasonable GM, like mine, will say that you can’t use it for that purpose
It specifically says in the spell description that you can use it for that. (I mean, not that that’ll stop an unreasonable GM.) Unfortunately, the numbers to provide actual game mechanics for that don’t appear to have ever been assigned.
Google, being extraordinarily helpful, referred me to my own website.
Would have hated to have had you for the game runner for our Mech 2Arrior back in the day. I went on a 45 min argument to successfully point out why shooting down at a target should get you a gunnery bonus while shooting up added to the ‘to hit’ modifier. Of course we all were new and still playing on just ice worlds to negate heat calculations
It’s easy to paint these characters in a more positive light sometimes but, yeah they are college students. College students drink. It’s not really Dorothy’s responsibility monitor Billie’s drinking habits.
What about after she becomes RA?
She knows Billie drinks enough that she’d go into withdrawal. That’s definitely enough where it’s a problem and Billie should at least cut back, but Billie doesn’t seem to have any severe symptoms like blacking out or constant nausea.
As Dorothy noted from the lack of detoxing, Billie obviously has been drinking anyway. Joining her won’t likely lead to drinking more than she would have, but it’ll mean Billie will have someone else she can talk to, and who can keep an eye on her
I think Dottie’s getting her two inner moms drunk again.
Someone explain this reference to the rest of us.
Accio causes an object to fly over to you.
Alcohol causes you to drive into objects.
Accio Alcohol causes collisions with pink elephants.
Its from Harry Potter. I had to google it myself. Billy’s got to be quite a nerd herself to get the reference.
…Do you know how many people read Harry Potter growing up?
Anyone can read it, but it often takes a special kind of mind to recognize each spell by name. 🙂
You don’t need to recognize the specific spell to know that someone yelling pseudo-Latin and waving their wand around is doing some Harry Potter bullshit or another, though.
I only read the first two books, and that ages ago. I didn’t know what Accio does, but I recognized it as a Harry Potter reference.
/me eyes his other comments on this page.
… not that I’m a good example of “not a nerd”…
And by “ages ago”, I mean “the preschooler I borrowed them from is older than Ruth oh gods I’m old”.
Not to mention the EIGHT movies. Harry Potter is a huge part of growing up for lots of people throughout the 1990s and 2000s.
This is why no one votes for you. No one likes nerds. Not even nerds.
Bullshit, dude. Neil Degrasse Tyson is the greatest human being on this planet (aside from a certain creator of fiction I could name), and the only way he could get any nerdier is if he did a Metamoran fusion dance with Bill Nye and Rebbeca Sugar. (Yes, three-way Metamoran fusion is possible.)
If fascists stopped being popular, nerds would rule the world.
IF.
But people vote for the fascists, not the nerds.
…. also, I think the nerds trying to organize world-running would run into a herding-cats problem. Well, worse than herding cats. You can herd cats with a laser pointer, but
no nerd wouldmost nerds wouldn’t fall for that.That statement implies that those 2 things are mutually exclusive.
Some nerds are cats?
When was the last time someone voted for a fascist nerd?
… in any election where there was actually a choice, I mean.
Ted Cruz keeps getting elected, unfortunately.
Yeah, but he’s not a nerd. He’s a religious person. They’re totally different things.
VOTE FOR DEANATAY 2016
HE’LL TAKE CHARGE LIKE RICK GRIMES IN SEASON 3
Obviously, we need some fascist nerds in office.
uhh
no fascists at all would be preferable
Hey. Hey. Nerd. Shut your face.
(would link Ogre, but am phone)
I can link stuff perfectly fine on my phone.
That’s nice. I can’t.
Nah. Not anymore. Being a nerd is cool. To the point that there are some actors who pretend to be nerdier than they really are.
Now, I don’t think a nerd has won an election yet. But politics seems to always be a generation behind, likely due to the age limits.
It’s a false sense of nerdiness. It’s cool people trying to act nerdy. Which is about as convincing as nerdy people trying to act cool.
Nerds are just a necessary evil for most others.
More likely because older generations are more apt to make it to the polls.
Carter had a degree in nuclear engineering. Good enough for me.
Actually, he didn’t. He got a Bachelor’s of Science (undesignated) when he joined the Navy. He was studying to be a Nuclear Engineer (which is an OPERATOR of a Nuclear Power Plant) and not Nuclear Engineering (which is a degree to DESIGN Nuclear plants). He didn’t finish the course because he asked for a Section 8 hardship discharge to take over running the family farm when his father died.
There is a subtle difference between an “Engineer” like Scotty on Star Trek, which is effectively an operator, and someone who practices “Engineering” which is what the people who make your iPhone do.
and of course, we point out and discuss/argue over the distinction…
Scotty is probably the worst example you could name, given that he started the tradition of sci fi engineers being people who do impossible things (however unfair that is), and afaik DOES do engineering in canon. The example you want is probably going to be to maintenance staff, since railroad engineers don’t come up much in fiction anymore.
Note that, even running against the unelected successor to an administration that resigned in disgrace, he had to present himself as a peanut farmer to get elected.
MY son went through the NNPC training course. 18 months of heavy duty study and classes. The kind where missing a class was a military offense. Much more intense than college and more like law school. Navy nuclear engineers are highly tech people and highly sought in the power business.
Doesn’t mean he could design a road, but the Homer Simpson job is high tech in real life, if usually quite sedate.
Nerdiness may be chic, but even given that the mango man lost the popular vote, he did very well – and republicans have raged about experts since Iraq. It’s not as high key as racism but.
Well president Obama is a huge nerd, and he managed to win at least three elections.
Truth. Plus I can’t think of any non-politician asked to run for the American presidency more than Stephen Colbert, the undisputed of white male nerdy liberal late night talk show hosts.
I like nerds and I’m a nerd. I’ve dated nerds. My best friends who are nerds (Sarah is an encyclopedia of awesome from her eclectic expansive reading and does pottery. Noel is a gamer, crafter, Magic: The Gathering enthusiasts, and book lover who enjoys dressing up and lore). I know more about Batman than I do most presidents (and Batman isn’t even my favorite!). I voted for Dorothy on the poll. Nerds rule the world my friend as they are the most awesome. 😉
Nerds are the best! <3
We’re better lovers, too.
Please tell me that’s a personal opinion, and not a ref to the horribly rapey-under-false-pretenses scene from the movie.
Hate speech.
Yeah we nerds suck…unless we’re the hot kind of nerds.
Excuse me. SOME nerds absolutely LOVE and cherish and support other nerds.
GO DOROTHY!!!
Of the two in that room, Billie is just as likely to be elected to a major political office in 20 years, as Dorothy is.
I think we’ve learned that there’s no major connection between lifelong resumee and voter reaction, one way or the other, over the last 20+ years… and enough voters will ignore almost anything to vote their “tribal affiliation”.
alt-text: The correct term is “Hammeredspace”.
And when you very swiftly return the booze to hammeredspace, that’s called slamming it back.
Nice.
This could backfire on Dorothy if Roz finds out.
Only if Roz becomes a complete hypocrite.
She learned it from Roomies! Danny.
At least she didn’t learn it from College Roomies From Hell, they’d all wind up mutated.
Or in non-update limbo. That comic is the nega-verse version of this one.
Dorothy is being adorkable again.
Adorthkable
Billy becomes the new RA.
Careful now. Next thing you know Billie will be acknowledging that she has hammer space. Then she’ll realize she’s in a comic. The fourth wall is in extreme danger!!!
Actually the real danger is if Becky finds out about it.
We’ll know when she starts talking in yellow speech bubbles.
HEY EVERYONE, I’M A WEBCOMIC CHARACTER!
Could be interesting if she manages to team up with Penny O’Brien.
Come on, Billie. Dorothy needs her nerdiness. It’s what she retreats into when she gets stressed out from working too hard, caring too much, and presenting a serious and mature facade to the world.
It’s also super adorbs.
Also, yay, Dorothy and Billie are bonding through nerdery and promoting alcoholism!
I’m entirely too happy about these horribly unhealthy developments.
Contrary to common belief, pop-culture references aren’t actually nerdy. Billie’s just really rude.
Did she sit on Billie’s glasses?
I’lm going to hold off on judgment until we see just what Dorothy’s actual end goal is here and just how far this is going to go… but her being aware of Billie’s alcoholism and suggesting drinking as a solution to any kind of problem really kind of horrifies me.
I don’t think she suggesting it as a solution. She’s wise enough to know Billie is drinking anyway – that’s awesome in a way because it implies she knows a lot about it – and thinks the benefits of Billie talking about her feels top the currently unrealistic wish she’d dry out.
I’m of two minds about her expectation this may help. I’m not sure how much of the stuff a drunk talks about or does really registers in their mind and body in a useful way. But the chance is greater than with Billie drinking alone.
Billie doesn’t want to go into therapy because she is still drinking, isn’t she?
Who wants a shit ton of art? It gets gradually more NSFW as you scroll down.
Also if you’re at work you should focus on improving productivity instead of clicking on links in comic comment sections.http://imgur.com/a/xoYeS
You spoil us rotten
I…. I got as far as the Billie/Dorothy one.
I’ll be in my bunk.
Oh my. Oh my indeed. Thank you kindly.
W00t! Thanks, Yotomoe!
Takes a nerd to know what “Accio” means, Billie.
(I don’t know its meaning personally)
Harry Potter is a normie thing. Nerds are into science.
Nah. Nerd culture has just become a lot more popular.
Being into fantasy and witches and wizards enough to actually cast the spells from the work is still being a nerd.
“There are more nerds now because I decided to redefine nerd as something other than nerds”
No doesn’t work that way. We’re talking about one of the most popular books in the entire world. Knowing a reference from it doesn’t make one a nerd.
Spoken like a nerd.
Obviously.
No, see the really “cool” kids will happily watch LOTR, Harry Potter, Game of Thrones etc but actually *admitting* that they remember any of the story would make them “nerds” in their own eyes…
Cue any number of ” I was into XYZ before it was cool” type expressions, or “only nerds and geeks care about the difference between nerds and geeks”…
But LOTR is one of the best (if not the best) selling and well-known series of fantasy literature of all time. Putting that as bar of nerd hood is much more inclusive than most would think. Now, the Silmarilion, that is nerdy. Then again there are various types of nerds, and which types should and should not be considered nerdy is up for debate.
yay, gatekeeping.
Yeah, seeing as that broadening of language is likely older than you, your sarcasm is incidentally correct.
First, words mean what they are actually used to mean. That is how words work.
Second, science fiction and fantasy have been associated with nerdiness for a very long time. Decades, at least. trlkly didn’t suddenly “redefine” it. That isn’t *even* new.
Third, in my experience, nerdiness is much more about the *approach* to a topic, rather than the specific topic chosen. The fun nerds, also in my experience, are the ones who can see, appreciate, and enjoy this enthusiasm in others, even if it is a topic they don’t have that enthusiasm for personally, rather than dismissing people as “insufficiently nerdy” for choosing the “wrong” subject or even daring to enjoy additional subjects. I don’t actually know anything about Transformers, but I like seeing Willis excited about them in his Twitter. I don’t say “pshaw, he’s not a real nerd because he enjoys something other than math or maybe physics!”
There do exist nerds who *would* say that, but they are additionally what I would refer to as a “snob” at best, but depending on context quite possibly also a “gatekeeper”. Nearly any set of people will *contain* snobs and gatekeepers, but that does not by any means make snobbery and gatekeeperiness a necessary part of belonging to that set.
With luck, “nerds are into science” was mostly joking and I merely misread your tone, but the prescriptivist approach to word definitions later also comes across as elitist and condescending and makes it harder to read the first bit as a light joke either.
‘When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, ‘it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.’
It doesn’t take a nerd to know that Dorothy yelling “Accio”, whatever that means, is nerdy.
Yeah it just gives up that impression I guess?
It brings something to you from somewhere else, magically.
I personally thought it was a reference to Billie telling Dorothy to come to her and her arriving. But apparently it’s supposed to be to Billie getting the bottle a few panels earlier.
Would’ve been been a better joke, IMO, if we didn’t see her obviously rummaging behind her bed to get the alcohol. It’s too obvious where it came from.
We don’t see her rummaging behind her bed. We see her patting the bed to tell Dorothy to sit down while pulling the booze out with her other hand.
And whatever does happen I do want to comment on people saying it’s somehow okay because Billie would have been drinking alone anyway? That’s kind of irrelevant? The important thing was that (as far as we know now) Billie was NOT drinking before Dorothy showed up and may not have been going to drink before Dorothy showed up but Dorothy suggesting drinking made that maybe become an actual thing that happened. So now it doesn’t really matter what Billie might have done. However bad this could get from here Dorothy is now partly to blame. And it might all turn out fine. Dorothy might just talk to Billie and help her smooth out some issues and do some much needed crying and get cut off before she goes too far. Billie might end up much better off for this but this is still an incredibly dangerous gamble Dorothy is taking with an incredibly fragile person and she has absolutely no idea how bad this could potentially go.
Which is why she has absolutely no business even trying this.
Billie’s a grownup and needs to take responsibility for her own decisions.
Okay she’s been a legal adult for all of a handful of months but sure whatever legally yeah she’s a grown up. I’d agree she should take full responsibility for this decision if she had made it all on her own in a stable emotional state. She’s not and she didn’t.
If she’s not mature enough to make her own decisions, she should live iwth her parents.
Her canonically neglectful parents who thought it would be a good idea to ship her off before successfully getting her treatment for her obvious addiction issues and as far as we know have made zero contact with her in the month since she’s left? Those parents?
Maturity and stability are not the same thing. Regardless, while Billie is responsible for her own decisions, it’s more than fair for fillerusername to think it’s irresponsible for Dorothy to offer. Personally, I’m a bit torn on whether it’s a good idea myself and hopefully it doesn’t backfire too badly.
Being a legal adult doesn’t automatically mean someone is mature enough it make their own (smart) decisions. I know people pushing 60 who still struggle with this. Age and maturity are by no means directly correlated.
That’s the point. If Billie was going to do it anyways, then Dorothy can’t be partly of the blame. To be partly to blame, you have to have a causal relationship to what happened.
The risk to Billie is actually less if Dorothy is with her than if Billie is by herself. Now, the risk to Dorothy is higher, but that’s a risk she’s willing to take to try and help a friend. (This is a huge risk to Dorothy’s ambitions if Roz finds out about it. In that regard, it is definitely a “mistake.”)
Now, there is an argument that Billie would not have had that drink if someone like Dorothy had not recommended it. Billie does actually seem to be detoxing. She seemed surprised by even the idea of drinking, not just that Dorothy offered it.
That is where you can blame Dorothy. We just don’t know that Billie was going to drink. While unlikely, she could have made it to her college-ordered appointment without drinking. And it’s definitely possible that this goes off the rails, as Dorothy is not any sort of expert on doing this, even if the general idea isn’t horrible.
We don’t know that she can control herself, let alone keep Billie from going too far.
Like I already said it doesn’t really matter what Billie MIGHT have done all on her own. We don’t live in that universe. By inserting herself into the situation and suggesting drinking Dorothy influenced however this night was going to go for Billie and so however it goes she holds some responsibility for it. She has a more than casual relationship to how this night moves forward good or bad.
If I run over someone who was going to be run over anyway, am I really responsible for killing them?
Dorothy didn’t force Billie to drink. She didn’t even supply the booze that Billie apparently had ready-at-hand. She asked what Billie wanted, then accepted Billie’s answer. Should she have accepted Billie’s answer? Highly debatable. It’s definitely not something she should make a habit of accepting/enabling, but for right now, in this one particular instance where it at least looks to Dorothy that there’s something Billie needs even more than she needs to not be drinking? It’s not so cut-and-dry. I’m not saying Dorothy’s right here, but she’s not single-handedly destroying Billie’s life
And I just want to double-emphasize that Billie is whipping out her own booze in a room that Ruth -completely cleaned out of booze- just a couple days ago. If Billie’s going to get sober, it’s going to be if/when she participates in her own sobreity.
The entire problem with alcoholism is that you ALWAYS need something more then to be not drinking. The alcoholic will find that thing, every time.
We didn’t ever get a reference to Billie detoxing. In the last two arcs, we never saw her throw out booze, we never saw her struggling with wanting a drink and deciding not to drink. We just never saw her drinking.
Speaking for myself, I thought that she stopped drinking but if I look back at what the comic tells us, I don’t see any indication of it. And Dorothy is right: if Billie were detoxing, we would have seen symptoms of that. And we didn’t.
So that was just wishful thinking on my part. And obviously yours, too.
Dorothy says right here “You definitely haven’t been detoxing”. We’ve seen no signs of it. It was always clear when Ruth was, but we’ve never seen anything similar for Billie – which was a big thing back when they’d made a pact to stop drinking, but Billie didn’t.
Billie has booze within reach. She’s making no effort to avoid it.
There was no way she wasn’t drinking tonight. There’s no way she hasn’t been drinking regularly. Quite likely, she’s not completely sober right now.
It’s worth arguing Dorothy shouldn’t be enabling her anyway, especially since she realizes Billie’s problem is serious enough to use “detoxing” to describe it, but there’s no need to pretend it makes any difference to whether she drinks or not.
this.
“Incredibly dangerous, well-intended gambles involving alcohol and drama” sounds like the lives of most college-aged people I knew when I was a collegeketeer, so, points to the characters for realism, I think.
Although I was in college decades ago, Perhaps the “wiser youth of today” don’t make mistakes like that.
I mean, theoretically Billie might not have drunk tonight. She wasn’t actually drinking at the moment, so she could have thrown away the booze she’d bought to drink tonight and gone on the wagon, despite having shown no signs of any intention to do so.
But blaming Dorothy for her drinking is like blaming the guy who bought the first round at the bar for you drinking that night – you went to the bar. You were going to drink. Just because someone else took a step to start the process doesn’t change it.
I have said over and over I’m not placing all the blame for whatever happens tonight completely on Dorothy. I am saying that whatever Billie may have done on her own by deciding to be apart of what happens tonight Dorothy does share some responsibility for however it goes. I think/hope Dorothy herself is aware of this and will try not to let things go to far but I wish she was considering how potentially out of her depth she is. I’m confused though as to why I have to try this hard to explain my issue with her behavior. Again had Billie chosen to drink alone tonight whatever happened afterwards would have just been on her. By deciding to be apart of this decision Dorothy is now apart of whatever happens in this room going forward. I have already said I am willing to consider this won’t be a disaster but when you are dealing with a situation this fragile so many things could potentially go wrong. Dorothy is not equipped to deal with how wrong this could go. She’s not fully equipped to deal with Billie sober and it was Dorothy not Billie who suggested bringing alcohol into this and making things potentially more volatile. I really do not care if Billie’s been drinking off screen all this time before Dorothy showed up. I am talking about this specific situation that is happening right now and how it could potentially spiral. As for your example: As for your example yes it does? Change things? Because efore free booze is presented any number of things could happen? It’s a lot easier to opt out of drinking before free booze is placed in front of you. If you were one drink away from a bad decision guess what now you can potentially use that money to buy yourself another after the free one. And now that your liquored up with two drinks it makes it easier to want more. Look at that first drink like a set of dominoes. Also consider if that guy who buys the rounds knows the guy sitting next to him is already drunk or let’s say…a struggling alcoholic who may have walked out if a free drink wasn’t shoved in his face…or one more drink away from alcohol poisoning…then that friendly stranger does get some of the blame for what happens. As would the over serving hypothetical bartender. That’s the risk you take when you decide to influence another individual’s decisions. That’s the reason liability laws exist. Also consider how Billie’s decision making capacity is already compromised with what she’s been dealing with the past few days and that she has likely already been drinking. This is a potential powder keg of a situation. Dorothy is trying to help but again this is an extremely risky way to go about it.Again I am not saying this night will end horribly. I am not Dorothy’s some kind of monster. All I am saying is that this is a really risky move she’s making and she should be willing to take responsibility for whatever part she plays in it.Like it or not she is playing a part no matter how much people want to absolve her.
Dorothy remains my favourite Slytherin.
Slytherin? Not Ravenclaw?
She could succeed in any of them, but I’d say Slytherin or Hufflepuff. She’s motivated either by a mixture of ambition and desire to help others. Studying is a means to an end, albeit one she’s good at and embraces.
Well, Slytherin is obviously the best because it’s so green. Plus, she’s definitely motivated by “ambition” because she wants to be president so much and is willing to do a lot to get there.
Calling it now. Leslie and Robin have sex and regret it bitterly and get drunk. Dorothy and Billie get drunk and have sex and regret it bitterly. Ethan and Mike drink and have Sex. Mike regrets nothing. He does however discover he has a horrifying alcohol problem.
Becky and Dina spend a torrid night eating cereal and looking at pictures of hatless dinosaurs.
Oooo! I like your universe.
Just in case anyone is confused:
SCIENCE AND MATH ARE NERDY.
POP CULTURE IS NOT.
Billie is just a bully who likes to insult people.
…she’s having a shitty-as-fuck week and she’s lashing out. That doesn’t make someone a bully, it means that there’s only so much they can take.
Tell it to Dragon-Con.
Better yet, tell it to Eliezer Yudkowsky.
…Yes, that’s why there are never any qualifiers like ‘computer nerds’ or ‘music nerds’ or, yes, ‘pop culture nerds’.
There are also multiple definitions of nerds – one is ‘an expert in a particular field’. Said field can very well be pop culture (or a particular fandom). The dictionary expands that to ‘technical field’ but by that definition math and science don’t count either, since neither are technology fields. Some include applied sciences as ‘technical fields’ but not math and not all kinds of science.
Frankly, this is silly because Billie’s being colloquial not precise in her word use, and by colloquial use, fandom stuff definitely counts.
Keep the gate, nerd
ANYTHING can be nerdy if you spend enough time obsessing about it. Even sports
Fantasy football is the nerdiest thing in the universe to me. Like…at least with Dungeons and Dragons you’re taking statistics of stuff that doesn’t exist. Fantasy Football is basically making sports Actuary work.
Take your gatekeeping and go somewhere else. You don’t get to define what is nerdy.
You can’t gatekeep my nerdery unless you prove to me you are a nerd. And I refuse to believe nerdboys/ nerdgirls/ nerdnonbinaries are real until you can replicate one from scratch in a laboratory. Go back into the driveway and shovel me some snow, fake nerd.
Seriously, I believe the current popular usage of “nerd” encompasses those of any interest who find their engrossing interest more important than social stigma attached, and the more social stigma, the more inherently “nerdy” the subject. Thus my interest in Silver-Age pulp authors is (somehow) considered more nerdish than Willis’ interest in Transformers, because so few people (exactly zero) are willing to engage my fan theories on, say, Harrison’s Deathworld, while there are millions of people who will happily get into an argument over which Pantone color best represents Rodimus Prime’s, um, racing stripes or whatever. (Willis’s actual deep-level drillfown in the subject matter may change the story, though, as might his ability to actually get people to take an interest in what he is saying about Transformers).
If you want to make “nerd is only about science/ math” “happen,” talk to the fellahin over at Merriam-Webster. Or give me a source. Don’t just talk like you have the right to police my language.
Where you get poison kreno?
Oh, Katie take it, now I am afire to know: what is your source? I’m thinking the theoretical origin of the word, M.I.T.?
Keener?
Shows how much I know about Harry Potter when my first thought after reading this was “The hell is she talking about?”
You fail the nerd test.
I have never read Harry Potter or seen the movies on the grounds that a proper wizard carries a staff, not a wand. It’s weird and wrong and I won’t stand for it
And, as everyone knows, a wizard’s staff has a knob on the end.
Ach, they’re all a load of hedgehogs here. Can’t be… bothered… about that at all.
Panel One: Confirmation that Billie has not stopped drinking. Which I think we can tell. She’s not been showing any signs of detox ever. So, yeah, logical leap to assume she must have some somewhere.
Panel Two: I can’t blame Billie for being suspicious either. Dorothy can have a bit of a high horse sometimes when it comes to following rules. That’s not always a bad thing, but it can be irritating sometimes. And this WOULD be a huge wrench to her application for RA and Yale if she got caught, so the offer would be surprising.
Panel Three: But, because to Dorothy people matter more than ambition, yes, she is 100% serious. She will sit in the dark and drink with Billie and talk with her. And while I worry about the wisdom of drinking with an alcoholic (I realize it can be helpful but I’m one of those people who goes ‘YOU CANNOT EVER EVER EVER SO MUCH AS HOLD SCISSORS POINT SIDE UP WHAT IF SOMETHING BAD HAPPENS WHAT IF IT BACKFIRES?’ worry warts so please bear with me), I think it’ll do some good to get this off my chest. Plus I will not stop until at least everyone on the main cast page is one group of friends. This is my aesthetic. Fight me about it. 😛
Panel Four: And that’s got Billie thinking too. It’ll be good to get some of that litany of emotions off her chest. Even if she has to access them with booze and with someone she’s not a huge fan of. And, well, it’s one of the few genuine, acknowledging reach outs she’s gotten. Not a vague ‘hey, how are you’ or a ‘so how’s Ruth’ or ‘how’s things’, an offer to sit down and talk about whatever feelings about Ruth she wants to talk about. I think it was good timing too – yesterday was too raw, too recent, and now she’s still angry but she’s also tired and worn out and she wants to not be angry.
Panel Five: And she’s still cranky, but this isn’t quite as hostile. Sure, she calls her prissy, but she also pats the bed beside her and offers her to sit down. This is starting to feel more like the Billie that was a bit healthier (though not healthy in any way). Like the Billie who calls Joyce and Walky, as much as she likes them, ‘fucking nerds’. And, tbf, Dorothy is pretty prissy compared to Billie. Delightful, yes, but still prissy. 😛
Panel Six: Dorothy looks a little awkward here. This is only the third time in her life she’s gotten to drink and this time it’s with the intent of getting sloshed. And it’s in much more serious circumstances than either time before. So this is definitely awkward. Plus Billie totally pulled that out of hammerspace. 😛
Panel Seven: So on with the awkward clearing nerd joke! 😀 I’m not shocked Dorothy likes Harry Potter. It’s actually my head canon that Dorothy has a long list of shows, books, etc. she’s gaga over that she has a lot of meta and analysis on a usb tucked away as ‘kid stuff’ somewhere. Dorothy is having fun, so who cares?
And I think Billie is in a bit of a better mood to me. This is highly subjective based on the tone you read it in, but I’m reading this more like Billie calling Walky a fucking nerd or Joyce a dork. Billie’s irritated, yes, but it’s more light than the anger that’s all she can access anymore. It’s the Kool-Aid of irritation.
I can easily see Billie as the kind of friend who would go ‘Oh my god, you fucking nerd, this is so embarrassing why are you doing this to me – wait, what do you mean random people are being awful to you, HOW DARE THEY, you’re MY nerd! I’m gonna go kick their ass and then maybe stuff you in a locker for being a nerd.”
But that is a Billie for another day once these two have bonded. This is a pretty good start though. Bonding and boozing can be exactly what Billie needs. And also hopefully that bond will nudge her into not skipping therapy.
“Bonding and boozing can be exactly what Billie needs”‘
This.
And Dorothy provides it, out of her depth as she is.
I think the slows steps with which they get closer to each other are adorable. They both know they take risks by opening up. But still they do it.
Yeah, as much as I think offering to drink with an alcoholic is a bad idea, there isn’t really a good alternative right now. Leaving her alone would be worse. There’s kinda in the dark until they can get Billie to a therapist and an addictions counsellor. Once she’s gotten that together and tapered off her consumption, we’ll see how good she is for booze (some recovered alcoholics are fine having one or two or on special occasions, while others need to stay away for good). But that’s a later issue and this is now.
Far too much nerd gatekeeping here in this comment sections. You all don’t get to tell people whether or not they’re nerdy.
Sorry.
sounds like something someone who isn’t a real nerd would say
Imaginary nerds are the best kind. Well, second-best. Nerds who bring me delicious food are the best kind.
I prefer complex nerds.
I’m an irrational nerd myself.
Only from the right angle. The rest of the time you can be a little obtuse.
Nonono, Bluewind, the little ones are ACUTE.
Honestly, basic angles.
Just keep repeating that. You’ll start to sound rational.
I’m a natural nerd who tries to stay positive.
Transcendental nerd, here.
Tangential to this whole conversation…
Then of course there are the virtual nerds who only look that way on the Internet.
You see, we’re not real nerds. We’re too diverse. For us to be real nerds, we’d have to stay segregated even if we were all shoved into a box together.
*braces for flames from the 98% who won’t get that joke*
Is it a reference to the awesome sweets that they stopped selling in the UK years ago because life is cruel?
… they stopped selling them in the UK?
Yes. A few places import them from the US and charge November ungodly amount for them but the carefree days of waltzing into a corner shop and buying nerds for 50p ended years ago.
Dorothy CAN not be a nerd, but she chose not to be.
It’s a calculated choice, surprising no one.
The real question is where the hell they pulled those beers from
This comic talks to me a lot. I already identify with Dorothy and…. I’ve been here. In panel 6. Sitting in a murder cave (figuratively in my case) with a self destructive friend or almost friend, knowing that I’m WAY in over my head…. but still hoping that I can do something good by being there, at least keeping them alive until morning.
This is Dorothy stepping up to be the team mom she wants to be. This is her actually helping people rather than just being a friendly smile in the corridor. This is her making up for dismissing Walky’s worries about Billie earlier. And I love her for it.
“ACCIO BOOZE!”
*Dorothy is buried under a pile of bottles*
Happens every saturday in Hogsmede
Everything Happening here is Morally Ambiguous, and the Characters should stop Doing so Much of It.
It’s also dumb.
STOP BEING DUMB!
Don’t you know that when you turn 18, you’re instantly an adult and therefore know everything? How could you not know that?
Dorothy, you’re so cute when you do that.
One can REALLY see Walky’s point in times like this.
Rude, Billie.
But better than just lying on the bed and staring into space alone, still. So… go nerd-based insults?
She’s reconnecting to happier times
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/05-media-rumble/onenote-2/
…or she’s just autopiloting. Whichever.
Nerd-based insults are how Billie says, “It’s not like I like you or anything, shut up!”
Tsundere gotta tsun.
I think that you’ve got the right idea here.
I’m also thinking that, as soon as Billie feels confident that Dorothy is lubricated enough not to remember anything, she’s going to pretty much spill all the pain in her heart. We’ll know, even if Dorothy won’t.
Billie Panel 2: “You are there for me? Really”
Dorothy Panel 3: “Yes.”
Billie Panel 4: *feels*
Bagge Panel 4: *All feels* “YOU PERFECT CINNAMON BUN, YOU ARE DOING GOOD”
The answer to Bille’s question is, of course, ‘no’. In the case of people like Dorothy the motto is: “I nerd therefore I am.”
ARE WE SERIOUSLY JUST GONNA IGNORE THE SHOES ON THE BED?
See, the RA is gone for ONE DAY and already little goodie two-shoe Dorothy is sitting with her goodie two shoes in the bed. ANARCHY I TELL YOU!!! ANARCHY!
Man people are willing to go through some hoops to justify someone enabling their alcoholism. It’s rough watching a character you like make a -terrible- decision.
From experience: Drinking with an alcoholic is almost always a terrible decision. But in this case, the other option is to leave Billie without any support network she feels she can rely on. Which would be worse. Lesser of two evils.
That said: I’m worried for Dot here. Like me when I first started drinking with an alcoholic (naive past me was told she “just likes to drink” and believed it at the time – see also autistic difficulty with subtext and reading people), she genuinely has no clue what the fuck she’s in for and also has no idea where her limits are. That’s a bad combo. That’s a wind-up-hurling-up-pizza-and-so-many-cheap-beer-you-lost-count-around-six-or-was-it-seven-in-your-kitchen-sink-while-your-partner-debates-whether-to-take-you-to-the-ER bad combo.
Plus, from experience: Part of how alcoholics work – especially social alcoholics like Billie (those who mask their alcoholism by pretending to be just someone who likes to party) – is to find social justifications for drinking. Oh, hey, want to go grab a beer after work? (That way I’m not drinking alone) You don’t? You’re no fun. You never come out with me anymore! C’mon, it’ll be fun! (insert needling, wheedling and emotional blackmail here until someone agrees).
Billie doesn’t have this issue – but the other thing that type of alcoholic does if they don’t have money to afford to drink is to try to get other people to pay for their drink-of-choice. You “take turns” buying pitchers – never mind that they drink 3/4 of each of the pitchers, at least, so you wind up paying for all of what you drink and at least half of what they drink. That person made a boatload more cash than me (literally 4x my pay at the time, and half again my current salary) but always had cash troubles and nobody could figure out why. The why: They spent over half of every paycheck feeding their addictions.
Thing is: The longer you give an alcoholic an excuse, or be their non-alcoholic beard, the worse they get. It feels like you’re helping them, by going out and socializing so they get some emotional support, but you’re not a fucking therapist and you’re completely unqualified to help in any real way with a problem of that magnitude. All they will do is give you a whopping case of caregiver depression and, if they’re abusive in their mindset, target you for emotional abuse to try to bring your spirits down to their level. Sooner or later you notice yourself picking up the same habits: Wanting to drink whenever you’re feeling stressed or tired or anything, never seeming to have a good day anymore, and just being an angrier, more tired, more unhappy person than you used to be. And then you wind up having to make a decision: Cut them off for your own mental wellbeing, or continue the path with them. Because fuck knows you’ve been trying to help for years and it’s not been working and you’re at your limit because a single amateur doesn’t have even a ghost of a fraction of a chance at helping a lifelong alcoholic out of their addiction on their own – as others before you have found to their own dismay.
I wound up having to choose to cut that person out of my life in a self-preservation sense. I do feel bad for it – but I wasn’t helping (if anything I was making the situation worse because she’d manipulated me into covering for her and contributing financial support for her addiction that I couldn’t afford to contribute, and I was allowing her to sabotage my relationships and my career), and I was not in a headspace where I could keep trying.
That’s the path I worry Dot is going to run into – because it’s a path to hell paved with the best of intentions that I’ve walked down myself.
I doubt Dorothy’s going to make a long term habit of this. Though tonight could be bad, if she tries to do anything like keep up with Billie. OTOH, they’re limited to however much alcohol Billie has on hand.
Billie’s also not just a social alcoholic. She is a party girl, though we’ve only seen her at one party and not even any real hints at more. She does most of her drinking in her room by herself – or locked in a room with Ruth. I’d bet that started over the summer, when she seems to have been cut off from most of her former social circle (hadn’t seen Alice(?) at all, for example).
It doesn’t happen overnight. It is incremental. Or at least it was for me. And Billie’s long line of burned bridges suggests she is prone to that pattern.
Agreed. It’s a real risk – a very dangerous risk – and coupled with Dorothy’s sense of responsibility as a self proclaimed “Team mom” it’s something she has to be careful with.
Here’s where a low level of culturally acceptable alcoholism and a legal drinking age of 18 really come into their own. When my mates got sad at freshers we just went to the damn pub like civilised people.
I had access to alcohol a lot younger than that, through the SCA, and it was never an issue. (Mostly for two reasons: I don’t like the taste of most of it, and I managed to screw up quite enough while being entirely sober.)
I had access to it earlier. But at 18 I could go to the campus bar with with my uni ID to get wasted. It was pretty great.
Christ, if I was the drinking type and had someone say that next to me I’d cringe so hard that I’d give myself a muscle cramp.
What a glorious coincidence that the Harry Potter reference occurs less than a week after I finish rereading the series, and while I’m halfway through reading the script for the stage play.
And the day after I saw Fantastic Beasts and Where To Find Them.
I thought Nerds were a candy…
I see a lot AA-speak coming up in this discussion.
Interesting to note that nothing AA claims has any empirical or scientific basis, and that their actual success rate is barely higher than “cold turkey”.
Instead, there’s a lot of evidence that very different programs work for different people, and that a significant number of people who went back to drinking after AA, are subsequently able to *moderate* their drinking through other approaches. This also puts a pretty big hole in the assertion that anyone who has had a drinking problem is a lifelong addict who can only be “sober” or “not”.
I think this is some pretty spot-on insight. I’ve known former alcoholics whose alcoholism was essentially self-medication for some other issue (such as clinical depression). Once the root cause was properly addressed (such as SSRI medication, therapy, etc) drinking alcohol was no longer a compulsion and they were able to go on having 1 or 2 drinks on special occasions without it spiraling.
Obviously it’s not that simple for everyone, and I’m sure many alcoholics never can return to drinking safely, but everyone’s particular problems and solutions are different.
(That said, obviously Billie is not at the “can drink safely because root problem is solved” point yet).
Note: I typically use the term “sober” to describe the instantaneous state of not being intoxicated. That is the sense in which I use it here.
One thing that worries me is that it sounds like several commenters seem to be advocating for never ever another drink for Billie starting right now. But if she hasn’t been sober once for weeks, she probably has a *lot* to work out of her system. And unlike many other drugs, withdrawal from alcohol can be literally fatal. (Not to mention the dangers of removing a coping mechanism without replacement from someone so very depressed.) If she’s been drinking as much as it looks like she’s been drinking, she needs to taper *safely*. In the middle of worsening depression she might not be able to do this herself, but if someone who likes to take notes on lots of details had her trust and could help her count, that could be very beneficial.
She may well need to actually stop having alcohol entirely, once she has successfully tapered down, but if she stops too suddenly she can die. Even if stopping entirely is the end goal, it needs to be done *carefully*. And if Dorothy can gain her trust, I think she can be very helpful at that.
Additionally, if Dorothy can gain Billie’s trust, she might improve Billie’s chances of actually going to her therapy appointments which, unless the therapist turns out to be terrible, will also be very useful, and can also help with the alcoholism.
The claim that AA doesn’t work (any better than stopping to drink on your own) comes up often in the comments here. Can you provide sources? And comparisons to other approaches (especially those that do not cost an arm and a leg for months of clinical treatment)?
Had to Google Accio. I know next to nothing about Harry Potter haha
She’s worse than Tolkien if that could be possible.
Why, yes, I have read both.
Them thar’s fightin words. 🙂
Worse than Tolkien is certainly possible. In fact, common. Tolkien’s really good.
Rowling’s a very different writer – not nearly Tolkien’s equal in many ways, but mostly writing with different intent and for a different audience.
Both have had tremendous influence on their fields, though we’ll see if Rowling lasts nearly as long.
Of course, if one or both isn’t too your taste, that’s fine. “De gustibus non est disputandum.”
Needs Moorcock.
Every hero needs to die, devoured by their own magic sword.
Let’s just say, apropos of nothing, that novels with the name “Moorcock” plastered in big letters across the cover were probably not the best thing to be carrying around junior high.
Should’ve read Phil Dick instead.
Tolkien isn’t so much a writer – he’s atrocious – as much as someone who accidentally struck a chord with the fugue state of a post-imperial, post-war country which yearned for the pre-war days that resembled the Shire.
He tapped into adolescent fantasies in a big way, and created the modern market for fantasy.
D:<
Possible result of this drunken conversation: Dorothy talks about the Ryan picture with Billie and hows she’s struggling with what to do.
I think she will talk about Walky.
Hammerspace is where Sledge keeps his gun when he’s not shooting at someone. Needless to say it’s never in there for long
Hey, I thought DoA was supposed not to have superpowers!
The Sentinels will take her away momentarily.
Of course, then Walky will become a mad scientist to get her back…
This would be heartwarming if in the aftermath of her confrontation with Roz, this didn’t come across as a play to become “more approachable”.
On the other hand, it’ll probably work and I’m kinda impressed at her savvy.
It can be a response to that and still be genuine. She’d already tried to reach out to Billie before she even found out about Roz, so she clearly was already motivated to do so. The only change is her approach
See, she’s not perfect, she’s a nerd.