I’m actually kind of disappointed that she actually made canon for the American Wizarding society. It kills my headcanon that Magical Diary is in the same universe.
Well in the real world; British education does use a house system while French education doesn’t; so I’d extend that to the fictional world of Harry Potter as well.
Oh please, Mary’s a fucking Fremen. She’d only be happy in a tribe full of people where you can kill someone for mouthing off, watch them get bled out and then drink the water from their rendered corpse.
A Strong case can still be made for House Harkonnen. Mary would oh so enjoy popping the recently installed heart plugs of POWs and and lower members of the house who disagreed with her personal agenda.
I’m not sure if it was canon or fan meta (I’m leaning towards the latter), but I read the idea that Riddle/Voldemort magically tampered with the sorting hat when he came to apply for the DADA job so it would sort students from families with anti-Muggle/Muggleborn prejudices all into Slytherin.
I find the theory interesting.
Dunno whether canon, either, but I IIRC the (epic, 1614 pages long) fan fiction “Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality” explores (amongs maaaany other things, like a Harry that grew up with loving step parents and reading Sci-Fi) a somewhat similar explanation.
Except in HPMoR, it wasn’t a deliberate thing; no one was deliberately stacking Slytherin like that. Public opinion was just gradually shifting, so hating Muggleborns was seen as less and less acceptable. Since Slytherin had a history of hating them more than the other houses, people were less willing to be sorted there (if you go under the hat thinking “anything but Slytherin”, there’s almost no chance you’ll be a Slytherin).
So fewer people went to Slytherin in general. So the hat, to compensate, started filling it with anyone who wasn’t turned off by the hating-Muggleborns aspect of it. And so it became a vicious cycle.
big ups on the MoR reference, i’ll admit to having watched the movies but not read the books (and remembering mostly nothing about the movies); the Methods of Rationality is canon to me at this point
People always seem to forget that the Houses all have multiple Virtues.
Slytherin’s include ambition and blood purity.
Crabbe and Goyle are pureblooded bigots, who have enough ambition to latch onto someone from whom they can gain reflected status and power (and enough cunning to know who that is).
Well, we know half-bloods can get in, because Tom Riddle, but I don’t think there’s any known case of a Muggle-born getting sorted into Slytherin.
But we do know that you don’t need to completely embody the House Virtues – Crabbe and Goyle will never be held up as the poster boys for Slytherin’s ideals, and it took Neville a time to grow into Gryffindor – just have some bare minimum of at least some of the qualities, as well as a respect for them.
Yeah, this. The Sorting Hat sorts based on potential. People can change, or else the hat might not choose the right potential traits.
Peter Pettigrew was a Gryffindor, but became cowardly. Snape was a Slytherin, but became brave. Also, JKR has explained that Neville Longbottom asked the hat to put him in Hufflepuff b/c he didn’t want the pressure of being in Gryffindor, but the hat was like “LOL NO”. XD
Also-also, I am a proud Slytherin, and try my best not to be a bigot. Ambition, yo!
As a Hufflepuff….hey! We’re nice people, but that doesn’t mean we’re inferior people! 😛
I feel like Joyce would be a super Hufflepuff – friendly with everyone! 🙂 Dorothy would be a Ravenclaw, she’s really bright and academically gifted. Amber is a Gryffindor, brave but does some stuff that kinda goes over into stooped (lol), and Billie is a Slytherin – ambitious personality, kinda uses people? Though Amber and Billie could probably switch really easily…
I haven’t seen it, but I know one of the leads in it. She went to my high school, and I’m Facebook friend’s with her mom, so I’ve heard a lot about the show. Based on what her mom has to say about it, which could be, y’know, biased, I recommend it.
I actually think that Billie is a Gryffindor. The whole “problem solver” aspect; the craziness she got into with Ruth in the beginning (fighting her in the meeting, sneaking into her room), taking on her grandfather to defend Ruth… she’s a fighter and she doesn’t get intimidated.
I don’t see anything that she does for ambition or personal glory, so Slytherin is out. She’s no Ravenclaw. And how could she be Hufflepuff with the Queen Hufflepuff right there?
Problem-solving and getting in fights are Slytherin traits, too (one of commonalities w/ Gryffindor, and why the two houses clash so much). Ambition doesn’t always have to mean personal gain. You can be ambitious to have the world around you live up to your ideals.
I’m apparently a hatstall Ravenpuff but I picked Hufflepuff for the people. People say the four houses are Brave, Smart, Evil and Miscellaneous, but I’m pretty sure the fourth is Nice. And in true puff fashion, I pick niceness, every time.
The fandom seems to have Flanderized the houses a bit at this point, and Slytherin gets the “ambitious/manipulative” label more than “evil” in my experience. I feel like that for many people there would be two, potentially three reasonable choices. Slitheryn and Hufflepuff could both easily cross over with Gryffindor or Ravenclaw, but probably less so with each other. In the face of all that, though, I scored something like 98% Ravenclaw in the Time/Cambridge test. Don’t recall the other components, other than a zero for Slytherin.
I have felt for a long time, that if there were no input from the child, the hat would place everyone in either ravenclaw, Hufflepuff, or Slytherin, and that the only way to gain admittance to gryffindor was to, as an 11 year old in a brand new place surrounded by strangers, involved in something much bigger than themselves, in some way stand up to the hat. That the inner dialogue between the hat and harry goes on pretty much with all the entrants.
I’d say it’s more like: Brave (possibly a little headstrong/rash), Academically Gifted (I wouldn’t be surprised if Hermione had nearly been a Ravenclaw instead), Ambitious/Manipulative, and Friendly/Loyal. 🙂
agreed. I noticed and appreciated in panel one that she was both polite in her refusal and appears to have a smile on her face. I got the feeling that Lucy may not be her cup of tea but she’s aware she could do a lot worse and just plans to roll with it.
While I don’t think much of the Hogwarts house quiz on Pottermore, I thought the Patronus quiz was absolutely fantastic. I thought it was so clever how they designed it. Your Hogwarts house is about how you choose to act, hence why the sorting hat often lets you choose. Your Patronus on the other hand is about your inner feelings, since it is basically made from a happy memory in order to ward off metaphors for depression, and you cannot change how you feel inside. This is why the Patronus quiz is different from the wand and house quiz, in that it doesn’t ask questions but just lets you pick the word that resonates with your inner self. I’m kind of obsessed with the Patronus quiz, everyone that I know has to take it. I got a Goshawk, my sister got a Newfoundland, my caseworker got a tortoiseshell cat, the guy who’s name I don’t know who I sometimes see down the pub got a badger… Sorry to go off on a tangent, you mentioning Patronus’s even as briefly as you did got me rambling. I love Harry Potter so much.
My sister also changed her name to Rowan, in part because her wand wood from the Pottermore quiz was Rowan. Harry Potter is a huge deal in my house. Also, completely random, but if anyone living in England is interested, next summer there’s going to be a real life castle being turned into a magical school for three days. You get sorted into houses,meet magical creatures. You don’t need to be a Harry Potter fan to enjoy it.
Sounds cool. 🙂 I’m sadly missing a Harry Potter festival here in Pennsylvania today, cuz I gotta do work. 😛 Also, to respond to your Patronus tangent, I got a dolphin on Pottermore. Strange, but kinda makes sense. Pottermore sorted me as a Hufflepuff, and as a Thunderbird for Ilvermorny. Between those two house sortings, it’s like Pottermore KNOWS I’m on Team Instinct…!
I’m kind of between Hufflepuff and (realistically not evil) Slytherin, I think? But mostly Hufflepuff. I’m kind of a nice pushover LMAO, I just want everyone to get along.
At the same time, I desperately want people to love/admire me so there’s a bit of Slytherin there. |D
Okay, I’ve consulted my deep knowledge of both Dumbing of Age character traits and Harry Potter lore, and I’ve carefully sorted everyone.
Amber: giant spider that lives in the forest
Becky: giant spider that lives in the forest
Billie: giant spider that lives in the forest
Carla: giant spider that lives in the forest
Danny: giant spider that lives in the forest
Dina: giant spider that lives in the forest
Dorothy: giant spider that lives in the forest
Ethan: giant spider that lives in the forest
Joe: giant spider that lives in the forest
Joyce: giant spider that lives in the forest
Mike: giant spider that lives in the forest
Ruth: giant spider that lives in the forest
Sal: giant spider that lives in the forest
Sarah: giant spider that lives in the forest
Walky: giant spider that lives in the forest
Mary would like to think of herself as Umbridge-like, but she doesn’t actually have the power.
Now I’m trying to think of a Toedad parallel.
What house would you put him in? I’d say Gryffindor– he has that recklessness and fierce belief that what he’s doing is right. God I hate him.
“Buckek” gave me a funny mental image of Buckbeak as a meme-obsessed, vaping millennial stereotype. He spends all day on /pol/, posting anime memes that nobody understands.
2. Mike got double-sorted into Slytherin and Hufflepuff, but he’s actually only considered to be in a single house at a time, based on his current sobriety level.
3. After seducing the sorting hat, Mike got put into each of the four houses, plus an extra one.
I’m a Ravenclaw, but I think Hufflepuff is the best house. I’m just so fucking Ravenclaw. My therapist is a Hufflepuff, though I think the approach she uses seems very Ravenclaw. I talk about Harry Potter in therapy sometimes.
Sometimes, I talk about my imaginary Hamilton-Harry Potter crossover where the characters of Hamilton attend Hogwarts, and a couple times I’ve talked about Korrasami/ATLA. I feel like I could get along with Lucy.
So, wait, wait, my Hamilton friends are never my Harry Potter friends, so I have to know: Hogwarts houses for all the Hamilton characters? And then, since you mentioned ATLA, possible elemental nations for the Hamilton characters?
Okay, I change my mind on some of them at times but:
Hamilton is a Slytherin (“they think me Macbeth / Ambition is my folly”; “Be careful with that one love / He will do what it takes to survive”), but he is a Gryffindor secondary. Which annoys Burr, who’s just so Slytherin because he’s like, “Why is this kid in my house? He got in a fight on the train ride here?”
Washington is a Gryffindor, Angelica is a Ravenclaw, Eliza is a Hufflepuff. I generally think of both Laurens and Hercules Mulligan as Gryffindors, though sometimes I like to split them up. Lafayette I go with Ravenclaw for.
Will have to think about more. It’s primarily the first act that I think about at Hogwarts.
Personally I’d put Hamilton is a Gryffindor, but Slytherin secondary. I mean Slytherin and Gryffindor are both sides of the same coin really. They both want fame and glory (J.k Rowling has stated that the reason so many people from Gryffindor wanted to fight in the Battle of Hogwarts is because they wanted to win glory in battle, in comparision to Hufflepuff which just wanted to help). So Gryffindors are pretty ambitious to, in there own way. Gryffindors have a more brash way of achieving there goals, whereas Slytherins have more finesse. But yeah, I completely see where you are coming from sorting him into Slytherin, that was where I first put him as well. He’s just one of those characters who is difficult to sort.
Yeah, I see him as like a Slytherin-Gryffindor-Ravenclaw in that order, as opposed to Burr, who’s like a Slytherin-Slytherin-maybe-Hufflepuff-but-probably-Slytherin. That’s also part of why I like him as Slytherin, because of the way it parallels and then diverges with Burr. And, funny enough, I went the opposite way with him, at first seeing him as a Gryffindor before developing my view of him to be more Slytherin. And he does have some finesse to him (“Room Where It Happens”).
All that said, I also see him as sharing that Gryffindor trait of sometimes needing to sit down and shut the fuck up. In my “inner fanfic,” as you put it, this really annoys Burr.
Sorry if calling it your ‘inner fanfic’ was offensive. If you talk about it in therapy it must be very important to you (though there’s no reason fanfic’s can’t be important. lot of people write them to help with anxiety and depression. I’m thinking of doing that myself.) But yeah, if I offended you with that phrase, sorry.
I hadn’t thought about ‘the room where it happens’, but you make a good point that he can be subtle when he really needs to be. He just seems to avoid it as a matter of Principle. Then again, he hardly ever really uses it owing to a very Gryffindor code of honor saying that people need to know all your positions on everything even if that is detrimental to your ambitions. Plus Burr was able to break out of his more subtle way of doing things and bravely stick his neck out in the hope of being President, even though this could (and did) severely damage his alliance with Jefferson. I see this as a case of a Slytherin and a Gryffindor learning from eachother.
After all, Snape was brave in being a double agent. This didn’t make him less of a Slytherin. Sometimes people do something that is out of character for them in order to survive.
Oh, I didn’t take it as offensive! I don’t know how I’d label it myself, but I don’t mind the label of inner fanfic. And sometimes the reason I talk about it in therapy is because I’m like, “Oh god, what should I talk about, I have suddenly forgotten all information pertaining to real life” and Hamilton-Harry Potter is where I end up.
I don’t view Burr’s actions as brave or Gryffindor like in that part, but it’s up to interpretation. To me that “Is there anything you wouldn’t do?” exchange (and the rest of the song) just shows a lot of Slytherin. Now I could see Hamilton were Gryffindor and Burr learned to be more Slytherin from him and Hamilton was like, “That is not what I meant AT ALL.”
Oh, but Hamilton, it kind of is.
Ok, that’s a relief. From the way you put quote marks around it, for some reason that made it seem like you didn’t like it. I can get like that in therapy to. I talk about all sorts of random things because explaining all my issues is so complex and I just dry up, but not saying anything at all is embarrassing. One of my past therapists asked me why I kept trying to make small talk with her and when we were going to get onto the real issues, causing me to freak out and stop going to therapy for a while because I thought was somehow doing therapy wrong.
Also, that is a really good point. I hadn’t thought of that quote in that way. I was thinking more of it like, Burr’s said he learned something from Hamilton, Hamilton is Gryffindor, therefore Burr learned to be a little Gryffindor. But now you point out the exact quote it does have a very Slytherin vibe to it. It may have been my confirmation bias using that quote as justification for Hamilton being a Gryffindor.
Yeah, with the first therapist I ever saw, it was kind of like that, where I struggled to talk about anything real (I was also 17 and was like, “okay, nothing that she’d tell my parents”). And then she basically ended up terminating with me within one session, and I cried in the car on the way home because I had “failed therapy.”
My last therapist basically wouldn’t let me talk about anything that wasn’t “real” or whatever– or she’d direct what I’d talk about a lot. That had the effect of shutting me down, or if not shut down, I’d just be quiet and then she’d start talking.
With my current therapist, I can talk about these things and then she’ll explore with me about why I talk about them and why that’s what my mind goes to, and it helps me feel more comfortable to talk about heavier things. Basically my current therapist is great and I love her.
Also, she’s into Hamilton herself, and in one of my earlier sessions, we had a conversation that was very therapeutic and also full of Hamilton references and analysis. It was great.
I’m really glad you’ve found a better therapist. I’m still searching for mine. Why are so many therapists so bad at what they do?
It’s really nice having a proper conversation with something on the internet about this kind of stuff. Any kind of human interaction, even across the internet, is a really big deal for me. My anxiety makes it almost an insurmountable challenge talking to anyone, so thanks for responding so much to me. You’ve made my day. (Of course I’ll be agonising over this conversation later, going over all the mistakes I made in it and imagining you thinking of me as an idiot, but I’ll just have to take that when it comes.)
Yeah, with therapists it could always just be that they’re not the right fit for you, but with some I’ve seen I’m like, “How is this what you do professionally?”
I enjoyed talking to you! It’s always fun when someone cares about the same fun stuff you do.
thanks for reminding me, I’m gonna have to start emailing my notes to my therapist again; too much is missed if they’re just on my phone.
…and I was gonna reply to a whole bunch of other comments but once again, now that I’m at a proper keyboard, the part of me that wanted to is fading fast… :/ and darn, I’m not in the OS where I can c&p my pile of links, I think Hannah might like the Feeling Good CBT book. (or you might hate it like I do but it still helps anyways)
I’m so glad that in my first appointment with my current therapist, I managed to talk about what I was scared she might do that would really not work for me.
Oh, ALSO, I see him as muggleborn (or hialf-blood but his dad never told him or his mom) and at first being like, “Okay, Slytherin’s fine” and then growing to wonder why he wasn’t in Gryffindor– things like having a “head full of fantasies of dying like a martyr” does seem very Gryffindor and even anti-Slytherin. But I think even in the first act he has a mix of traits that really spread out and still end up favoring Syltherin, and in my “inner fanfic” the sorting kind of ends up pushing him further in that direction.
OH, and I think it’s funny how Burr basically says he learned to be more Slytherin from Hamilton (“The Election of 1800”). Because Hamilton’s trait spread doesn’t mean he’s a little Slytherin, a little Gryffindor, a little Ravenclaw– the boy’s just A LOT in EVERYTHING.
That does sound really interesting. The conflicts, both from inside himself and from the prejudices of others, of him being sorted into Slytherin would be much more interesting than him being sorted into Gryffindor. I’ve also just had the thought that Hamilton would probably choose to be in Slytherin, since its full of the elite and would make it much easier for him to make political connections. I like to imagine he’d be under the sorting hat for ages, one of those rare hatstalls, since he’s so difficult to place.
It’s funny we both interpreted Burr’s line to Hamilton about learning to go after what he wants from Hamilton in different ways.
Oh, and since you asked about Hamilton and ATLA, I don’t have an answer for what you asked, but it does seem like a good time for some gratuitous self-promotion. Here’s am ATLA/Hamilton video I made: https://youtu.be/hIZlXTbSWyE
I LOVE Hamilton-Harry Potter crossovers! They are currently my two favourite fandoms. Do you know any good fanfics I could check out? Also, out of interest, what is your imaginary Hamilton-Harry Potter crossover about. ‘d be very interested to know the storyline of your inner fanfic.
Also, your just like me! I’m Ravenclaw (albeit with a small side helping of Slytherin), and I think Hufflepuff is objectively the best house. Even the sorting hat basically implied it, what with the 6th year sorting hat song basically being about the founders all being detrimentally picky about what students they wanted to let in, but Helga Hufflepuff was all like ‘naw, I’ll take the lot and treat them just the same’. It kills me when people use that exact same quote to justify their Hufflehate. ‘Ha see! Hufflepuff just takes the scraps the other houses leave behind’. Aaargh.
I’ve slowly shifted from Hufflepuff with a side of Gryffindor to Gryffindor with a side of Hufflepuff as I’ve gotten older–but I still call myself a Puff, just, one that will not hesitate to cut a creep in defense of self or others.
I’ve always identified as a Ravenclaw, but I also think that middle-school-me got into way to many fights to not have had the Sorting Hat going, “But…maybe…Gryffindor?”
one of my favourite fanfics starts off with the sorting hat berating everyone for obsessing over the houses, and it threatens to do away with the system entirely. 🙂 https://www.fanfiction.net/s/3979062/1/Hogwarts-Houses-Divided (…well technically the hat’s in chapter 3, but, close enough)
According to Not Literally co-founder Ginny Di, who has thought about this way more than any normal person, an online quiz is not going to read your mind the way the Sorting Hat would.
I wish I could put in a second link to her Hogwart’s Houses video. “Most of all, I think we all just need to calm down about sorting a little.”
But I feel super strong about Walky being a Ravenclaw. The time we’ve seen him freak out the most is when he started failing math. He doesn’t know who he is if he’s not effortlessly smart. He’s such a Ravenclaw.
I wrote my response below before I read this comment, and I am retroactively withdrawing my “absolutely not” comment about Walky being a Ravenclaw.
As you point out, Walky values being smart. But I don’t get the sense that he values knowledge, per se. But the Sorting Hat is the Sorting Hat, and I was wrong to make the blanket assertion that I did.
Remember, it’s also at least party about what the person themself wants, and I’m sure that Walky would at least want to be in the house with all the people who are smart like him.
They also value kindness and patience, which…
I see Malaya as a Slytherin, not because of the “Slytherins are evil and mean people are Slytherins” mentality, but because I could see her being considered resourceful and clever and having a strong value for her relationship with Marcie (fraternity).
Yeah, I apparently blanked on her. I could see an annoying Gryffindor or a not especially clever Slytherin. (I adore her, don’t get me wrong, but she ain’t perfect.)
Yeah, with the resourceful and clever I was thinking a bit of her efforts in learning sign language. It’d be like selective cleverness, only applied to the stuff she cares about.
I agree that Malaya is Slytherin, and that it’s not because she’s evil. She’s not smart enough for Ravenclaw nor good enough for Huff. An argument could be made for Gryffindor, but I’m going with Slytherin.
I agree with many of these (Danny is the MOST hufflepuff), but not all.
Ruth: Depression stole any ambition she might have had. Perhaps she’s a Gryff, because she has to actively avoid being a showy bully. We’d have to check in with her when she’s healthier.
Joyce: yes Gryff, and she was initially surprised not to be Puff but now it all males sense.
Amber: so Gryffindor!
Sal is brave, but she also had that speech about proving herself to her parents, so she gets the choice between Gryffindor and Slytherin.
Jacob: We need to know more about him.
Malaya: Gryffindor. Remember when she stupidly rushed Amazi-Girl in the parking lot?
I agree that charging at Amazi-Girl was hella Gryffindor, but I just don’t see her overall as being a Gryffindor.
Also, I don’t think Mary’s a squib; in-universe, squibs are at least a marginalized group, often a family shame, and Mary seems like she’d be one doing the shaming. I could see her as Slytherin with the self-preservation, determination, and cunning (of course all in a bad way for her), along with Slytherin’s reputation. I could also see her as a Gryffindor, but like the worst Gryffindor who eventually gets decked by someone in their common room.
Spot on that Joyce is surprised to be in Gryffindor. But even more surprised to be there is Amber, who is sort of an alternate universe Neville.
Your suggestion that Sal would be given a choice is brilliant. I think you’re right. Sadly, I fear she’d pick Slytherin because she doesn’t think she’d fit in at Gryffindor.
Ah, but Slytherin is totes racist (against muggle-born wizards)! That might not sit so well with Sal, and if Marcie is in Gryffindor too that’d swing it for sure.
oh, right. Hmmm, does Sal know they’re racist before she gets sorted?
If she doesn’t she would end up being the first student to declare themselves houseless. And Slytherins would hate her because she’s brilliant on a broom but refuses to play on the house team.
Joyce secretly wants to be a fighter pilot. Gryffindor confirmed.
Granted, she also wants her own cartoon show and to make her kids mac and cheese every night. So whatever house Willis is in. (She is autobiographical, after all.)
Jason is a Ravenclaw, I think. He’s not nearly patient enough for a Hufflepuff; a Gryffindor probably wouldn’t repeatedly bang a student despite knowing full well how against the rules (and unethical) it is; and while he’s not very good at it, he honestly does care about his students and their well-being and success, even when they irritate him, and seems to be a bit unrealistically idealistic about teaching (at least, according to Penny, who is probably a Slytherin through and through if only for that comment (“Oh Jason, poor, sweet, naive Jason–it doesn’t sodding matter!”) and the fact she’s been happily banging Joe without worrying about it a bit)–Jason is probably not a Slytherin either.
On the other hand, he does care about being a good teacher, and seems to value knowledge, and is definitely intelligent, so I’d put him square into Ravenclaw–although, with that idealistic streak, one might make an argument for Gryffindor. But I think that is overwritten by knowing his behaviour in regards to Sal is wrong, yet repeatedly doing it anyways.
Walky is absolutely not a Ravenclaw. He’s really smart, but he would rather do anything else than study. He also would rather do anything else than work, and he doesn’t seem to have any ambition, ruling out both Hufflepuff and Slytherin. Gryffindor by default.
And Jacob is not Slytherin. Ambition for its own sake does not seem to be a part of his personality, and I don’t think he’d agree with “the end justifies the means.” I could see him in any other house, though.
Malaya would refuse to be “in any dumb house,” as she would express it. And I’m still going with House Harkonnen for Mary.
Yes, Ethan is definitely a Hufflepuff. Sarah’s a Slytherin, though. Fiercely loyal to a chosen few, “smart and mean” in getting a certain car towed, most concerned about her scholarships and degree, etc.
Also, does anyone else have issues with those video ads on this site that autoplay and make it difficult-to-impossible to scroll down and type/read comments?
I startet to use Firefox clear. It allows for some ads but gets the really nasty ones.
Though the places to visit in wherever starts to get one my nerves…
Yeah, they seem to always be an issue when I check in on here from my PC. I just set Adblock Plus to not block ads on this site, then block the individual page if/when those ads show up while I’m reading comments.
Now, re: sorting: I say everyone is the same house.
Absolutely everyone. And we should all know which one that is.
Read Hall is basically UoI’s Hufflepuff House. Every misfit, mad person, outcast, beaten down pariah the rest of the campus has to offer ends up there. Either Hufflepuff or, if you want to rate it by the disaster-density per capita, Gryffindor. If neither of those two things, the next most appropriate point of comparison is the Defense Against The Dark Arts post.
They’re probably not Gryffindor, though. We already know which kid got the scar on his face.
Well I just checked, and according to Zimbo I’m a Ravenclaw. That’s…not particularly surprising. I’m not noble, I’m not ambitious (though I am evil), I’m not helpful, and I’m rather analytical.
Ya know, Billie, you could maybe ask HER questions instead, and try to get to know her and have a real conversation? And take care of your stuff later? Oh well, baby steps.
I kind of see your point (getting to know people is important), but at the same time, I would also prioritize getting my stuff up in this situation. If I don’t get my stuff up right away, it will take a while before I get it all settled.
From Billies smile and panel 1 comment, I feel like she’s in a good place to do this now, and doesn’t want to waste it.
But yeah, especially considering she just got out of a bit of a storm of new people, it makes sense to me that this was not the best moment to talk for Billie. She might do better later.
As someone who is very quiet and very private as a person, who takes a long time to establish the kind of relationship with someone where I’m okay being myself around them and talking about my non-academic interests, every time Lucy does something I cringe internally.
She’s not a bad person, but I’m uncomfortable with expectations of attention from strangers, I’m uncomfortable meeting new people in situations where I don’t already have a level of control and comfort, I’m uncomfortable with loud expressions of fandom fandom, I’m very uncomfortable with people who feel more that I’m their friend than I feel they’re my friend (and because I’m extremely polite IRL, there are a hell of a lot of those people). The level of secondhand discomfort I feel watching the way that Lucy interacts with Billie is not small.
And honestly it wouldn’t be that hard for Lucy to be less horrifyingly awkward? Like, all she would really need to do is have her own thing going on and exist in the space doing whatever that thing was until Billie initiated interaction or until there was a good opportunity to make introductory small talk. But Lucy doesn’t seem to be able to empathize with the private person with her own thing going on, since she super doesn’t seem to be one. Annnnnd. As a result, she doesn’t understand why this isn’t working, and she doesn’t know how to respond to it, and it’s unpleasant for everyone involved.
“And honestly it wouldn’t be that hard for Lucy to be less horrifyingly awkward?”
Yes, actually. That’s why people are horrifyingly awkward. Learning how to NOT be awkward is difficult and takes time. By the time she graduates, Lucy will no doubt be much better about things like this.
Though it takes even more time when people are “polite” and don’t speak up about their own discomfort (you’re not doing yourself any favors there, either). People aren’t going to change their behavior if they don’t know it’s bothering you.
Luckily, Billie seems to have learned from experience with Joyce, and is communicating with Lucy. If she keeps that up, they’ll get along just fine once Lucy settles down
I. Wasn’t really referring to the difficulty of social learning, though I understand how I might have been interpreted as doing so. I do understand that there is difficulty in learning–I just meant that the action in question is fairly simple.
I don’t know what kind of cultural situation you come from, and I assume it is one where frankness is valued reasonably highly, but um. It’s not that simple and it’s not always viable to be forthright? Clearly it is here, and clearly Billie is being, and that’s a good thing. But. I come from a culture where saying no to things anywhere near the amount I want to would cause problems, and I know because I’ve learned my attitude from it having done so in the past. With my friends and people I trust, I can be forthright about things, but if I did so in the broader community there would be issues. This is, I’m aware, a toxic element of said community, but there are other things that make it worth staying in. But that’s the position I’m coming from, is one where often I’m not in a position to be able to state my preferences regarding people and their behavior without causing all kinds of bullshit (within a threshold. I have avenues by which I can deal with things if someone starts being actively abusive).
Ah, I can imagine that would be very frustrating. If even politely, gently saying no or letting someone know what they’re doing makes you uncomfortable, I can see how someone acting like Lucy would just be torture.
I’m considerably more frank than is generally approved of, but I generally manage to get away with it. I would go completely mad in a situation where I couldn’t ask somebody to back off because they were making me uncomfortable, or where they couldn’t do the same.
I’m glad you have people who you can be honest with about that kind of thing, that’s really important to have
🙁 wow, I was so angry earlier at that sort of toxic culture, for what it does to people’s minds, for making it so unsafe to just *ask* for things, making boundaries and meaningful consent almost impossible, teaching kids that manipulation is preferable to using your words… grrr… I have a vague memory of getting a treat because I was sitting quietly (probably daydreaming) when some other kid asked for it. and I have plenty of memories of getting in trouble for being “rude” enough to cough or cover my face when someone’s tobacco set off my asthma. >:(
I hope you find a way out someday. I hope the whole *world* finds a way out someday.
It’s really not that bad. There’s the one shitty cultural element, but there are plenty of good things about it that I choose to be there for–I could leave if I so decided. It’s just that that’s tthe big negative in that space, and so if I’m going to be in that space I have to live with it in spite of it being frustrating.
I’m Canadian; but my Mum was British, and only just Post-War at that (WWII), and so I grew up with that very stiff-upper-lip, rigidly polite, upper middle class traditional British upbringing, so I know precisely what you mean when someone is making you uncomfortable but you can’t really say anything about it, ha ha.
Having said that, though, I do find that one can still tell when someone is uncomfortable (they become even more stiff and polite); the social cues are still very much there. But having said that, they tend to be pretty subtle, from a North American point of view, and so can be pretty easily overlooked if one isn’t used to dealing with them; and the culture (so far as I am aware) doesn’t really seem to have a way to escalate that conveying of discomfort without crossing into being unforgivably rude.
It’s a bit like dealing with someone else’s large, friendly, but over-enthusiastic puppy that keeps trying to jump up on you. It’s not malicious; but it is unwanted; but one doesn’t really feel one has the authority to enforce “Down!” and the puppy isn’t registering the more subtle “Yes, yes, you’re a very good boy; now, go over there,” cues. So all one can really do is to politely try to not be encouraging and hope that it will direct its attention elsewhere sooner rather than later.
I suspect Lucy has a 180 degree problem than you do.
She’s the extravertiest-extravert in the whole comic. If I had to guess her “driving motives” (in a dramatic sense), it’s that she wants to:
1. be seen for who she truly is (which means lying or even passive duplicity or dishonesty would be anathemic to her) which makes her very open right off the mark. Also, she might be bad at picking up when people are lying to her, along with other social cues. While at the same time, she wants to…
2. be kind / avoid rejection [could be either], since ultra-honest people are often too blunt and hurt feelings, Lucy wants to avoid that by complimenting people anytime a genuine compliment pops into her head. She wants to cultivate a sense that she appreciates and doesn’t judge other people, so they might respond in the same way–appreciating her and not judging her.
In essence, she’s trying to treat others she wants to be treated. She is sensitive to being judged, rejected, and lied to (possibly people lying about liking her or being her friend), so she is determined to accept and honestly like every person.
She, uh, reminds me of a teen version of me (so, I might be projecting the “almost never lies / bad at picking up lying” bit), and the aggressive liking was definitely a defense mechanism for me. It’s the opposite of the “pre-emptive rejection,” but it comes from the same insecure place. How can they possibly dislike me if I like *them* SO MUCH?
It, gahhh, makes me cringe in retrospect. But, also, I’m pretty sympathetic because I’ve been there, you know?
That makes plenty of sense. She seems like she’s a good kid, and there are plenty of people who would very much appreciate a Lucy in their lives.
The trickiest thing about growing up is learning that the actual golden rule isn’t actually “treat others how you’d like to be treated” but rather “treat others how they’d like to be treated. This is tough coming from both the strong introvert and the strong extrovert ends of the spectrum, and it’s a big thing you figure out as a teenager or young adult. Honestly, a real friendship with Billie would probably be very helpful to Lucy in trying to learn it, if it doesn’t end up turning into a mess over the whole alcohol thing.
I mean, in truth, there are multiple rules, and it’s a judgement call every time they contradict. “Treat others how they want to be treated,” but also, “Set and hold your boundaries” and also “when two or more people want conflicting modes of treatment from you in the same context…uh, learn that as you go I guess?”
That last one reminded me of a college friend-group situation where one person really only ever wanted to socialize with one or two people at a time, and more were overwhelming. Another friend always wanted to be included and invited to everything, and felt left out if two or three group people hung out without her.
We didn’t solve that one super well. Basically instead of figuring out the underlying reason the one friend always wanted to be invited and trying to meet that underlying need, without making every hangout an all-group person party and overwhelming the shy friend, we just totally stopped hanging out with the needy friend altogether. Essentially the group picked one over the other.
Last panel Lucy’s pose could not be more “slumber party / gabbing on the phone” if she tried. She is a bit more relaxed-looking once Billie told her to not just sit there silently.
That little biting of the lip in panel three, and the rather fixed smiling, is kind of breaking my heart. Lucy is kind of being incredibly hard to put up with, but it’s also very obvious that she’s starved for any kind of friendship, I suspect because of being a nerd. Billie’s said awful things about nerds and Malaya outright called her a loser; I’m going to lay some imaginary money that she’s very starved for friendship.
So she’s reaching out the only way she can imagine how, because being that isolated is seriously damaging. She’s definitely trying too hard, and the HERE LET ME DO THINGS FOR YOU feels a lot like she feels she might have made better friends (and again, she seems kind of lonely) with Malaya if she’d, like, done things for her. And she did leave when Malaya asked! It’s like Lucy feels like Billie will not like her unless she does things for Billie, which is kind of troubling. That’s incredibly sad.
She needs to back off, and needs a clue, and I feel really bad for Billie having to go through this. But I really, really sympathize with Lucy, in all that desperate attempt not to feel completely alone. We don’t know how her hallmates treat her, but rejection can be deeply wounding.
I say with decent self-awareness, you’d know where you’d belong better than any test anyway, so I don’t put a lot of faith into them. I’m always a little disappointed when I ask someone who seems to be a Harry Potter fan what house they’re in and they’re like, “Well, the quiz I took said…”
Yeah, the Pottermore quiz put me Gryffindor somehow, which is probably the house I belong the least in. Everyone who knows me agrees.
I’m feeling very self conscious making so many comments, I usually comment very rarely.
For what it’s worth, I didn’t notice you were commenting a lot. And when I went back and read your comments, they seemed to fit well. If your brain is telling you everyone is looking at you for making so many comments, well, I’m a counterexample.
I lack the Slytherin ambition to actually change the world like I want to, so instead I’ll find a quiet Ravenclaw corner to read all about how fucked up it is.
I personally find the quizzes more useful, though, in part because I don’t know myself well and have no idea where I’d rather be and because I can use the results of the quiz to work backward to see why I was put in that house( I’m far better at working backwards from a conclusion than coming to a unbiased conclusion with what I have)
I thought the quizzes were pretty clever. I mean if we left it up to people to decide 75% of the world would be Gryffindor with dragon patronuses.
I’m a Gryffindor which aligned with my own feelings on the house, but my patronus was an eye-opener. I got a sparrowhawk which on one level fits me pretty well but I’ve never been a big fan of birds so I probably wouldn’t pick it myself.
Well, the point of Sorting is that it’s not about what qualities you have presently, it’s about the qualities you value. If you value a house enough to game the quiz, it’s probably a good indicator that you belong there. Also, the hat sometimes does requests.
On the other hand, Neville wanted to be in Hufflepuff because he felt he didn’t live up to Gryffindor’s reputation, and the hat argued with him a good deal before putting him in Gryffindor, so it’s not as simple as ‘it’ll give you what you ask for’. Apparently the Sorting Hat’s never been wrong, so that’s gotta be some powerful magic.
The hat will never sort you into a house where you don’t fit, but ‘I don’t want to be there’ is counted toward not fitting, whereas ‘I don’t believe I’m that good’ doesn’t – since the Hat would see the potential, and that they do value the house virtue.
Pretty sure Dumbledore thought it had sorted wrong on occasion (like in canon he says “sometimes I think we sort too soon”). Not sure how you would define “wrong” anyway. Except a Ravenclaw who had no intelligence whatsoever but completely stupid people are pretty rare and I’m sure the hat would see them coming a mile off. The other houses don’t have such clearly defined traits.
That requires the hat to sort based on what you are and not what you value, like it does in canon. Case in point: Goyle and Crabbe are total lackeys, but they value ambition and tradition, so into Slytherin they went.
Nothing to do with today’s comic, but it’s so weird it sounds like it came out of a strip. I sometimes hang out with a woman who is Christian who is kinda on the pushy side. You see, I’m not and she often tries to “save my soul” which can frankly get annoying. But the latest one was a real head scratcher. Her and her husband showed me a video of them in church with him doing mime (face paint and all) choreographed to gospel music. Then they looked at me almost expecting… I don’t know. Magic? I just said that it must have taken a lot of work to do to which they tried to explain how it had “saved” someone in their church that the stuff hadn’t clicked with before. I said religion can be a beautiful thing and tried to drop it, but they kept on while looking disappointed like they had to explain it more… so I mentioned how one of the hand movements kinda looked like he was using an insulting Italian or French hand sign. XD
I totally missed it until just now, but in the third panel Lucy has the mouth crinkles that are idiomatic to Willis’s style. The first time we saw those crinkles, Walky had them and they indicated that he was crushing on Dorothy in a completely awkward way.
I think that’s just a sign of how the silence is bothering her. She’s trying to be quiet since it seems that’s what her awesome new roomie wants and it’s killing her. See how it goes away the moment Billie starts talking again?
I think it’s just how Willis draws someone biting their lower lip. Why they are biting their lip, though, can vary. Uncertainty? Trying to not talk? Attracted to someone? Different people and different motivations.
Billie is hard to sort. She really has no ambitions, so Slytherin is out, nor is she particularly smart to be a Ravenclaw. Hufflepuffs and Gryffindor is all that’s left. Id have to go with Gryffindor, she stood her ground from day one with Ruth.
I disagree about Slytherin. She’s not someone who would generally be considered “ambitious,” but she is ambitious socially. Plus, there are other traits that I feel fit– resourceful, clever, determined. I feel those things describe her both now and in her previous life (most likely) as “head cheerleader, problem solver.”
Anyone who knows anything about the characters of Lucy and Billie won’t be surprised by today’s strip. Lucy is a comic book geek (indeed, Willis originally created her to be the face of happy, optimistic comic book geekdom). Billie on the other hand most certainly is not.
I’m getting a definite echo from these two of the relationship, such as it is, between Joyce and Sarah!
I will say one thing to Billie though: ‘Puffs make the best friends; they try harder!
I long ago sorted all of my co-workers into Hogwart’s houses. Not that I’ve told them, of course. But I don’t think of it as being particularly worse than the Myers-Briggs clade of personality tests.
Anyway, I really need to go to bed, but I’m currently trying to teach someone a bit of crisis intervention skills so they can help talk to someone who may be in crisis because of an internet disagreement, and this is all happening on Neopets. Life is so fucking weird.
[shrugs] It picks Houses based on certain personality qualities and potentials. It puts like-minded people in the same group so they don’t feel lonely. I’ve seen worse ways to treat kids at a school.
Putting like-minded people together and then fomenting rivalry with every other house is a terrible idea because you then just end up with everyone stagnating socially because the only people they interact meaningfully with are people who are similar to them. Like hey, maybe if you didn’t put all the children of blood-purist bullies together they’d be exposed to differing ideals and might actually have a chance of growing into decent human beings.
Good point though I think that it’s Exactly because of that, that the blood purist families would howl up to the Moon against that idea…
Things were probably less full of crap back in the days of the Founders.
Back in the days of the founders one of them literally wanted to murder every muggleborn child in the school and even took steps to enact this so probably not. Honestly the fact that Hogwarts has a house honoring a genocidal maniac and nobody bats an eye at it is a pretty grim condemnation of wizarding Britain as a society.
Yeah except you are forgetting to mention how wizards were persecuted by the Muggles and murdered. Like they say, it’s only paranoia when they are Not trying to get you. As monstrous as Slytherin’s plans were he had very good reasons to feel that way.
It’s only human unfortunately. It’s only human to hate all those who caused you pain, fear and suffering. And it’s only natural to want them to disappear. All of them. It’s not humane but in a world where your survival is at stake you don’t hold back. I’m sure that many who have been victims of bullying harbour some pretty dark thoughts about what they’d love to do to bullies.
Also I remember reading some stuff about muggle-born leading other muggles to wizards when they were sleeping or otherwise had their guard down. To Salazar they might have been just traitors in waiting.
Maybe it’s different in the British school system, but what I did in high school – including which clubs I belonged to – while hugely important to teenaged me at the time, ended up mattering very little later in life.
Then again, I do recognize that children and teens are the target audience for these books, which are written to their expectations – including the possibility, nay, the certainty of finding not only lifelong friends but true love during those 4-8 years… a span of time which, on the far side of 40, goes by with barely a nod and perhaps a fond reminisce.
(I imagine a future job interviewer idly noting one’s former house affiliation with the same polite almost-interest as commenting that they too used to be in the Scouts/Girl Guides, or 4H, or on the yearbook staff. And that’s it.)
But that’s not how it’s portrayed with the adults in the books. They still know and care about everyone’s House.
Which makes a little bit of sense, given that they are magically sorted by personality.
There is also the issue that Wizard society is much, much smaller than the Muggle one and everyone knows everyone.
Not to mention that the really influential families all sit in Slytherin or have connections to those who were in it and reinforce the segregation.
And then there is the fact that the Only real Employer is the Ministry where everyone and their mother works.
I think it’s less “Scouts/Guides/4H/etc” and more the whole Jock/Nerd/Social Climber/Genuinely Nice Kid Who Doesn’t Stand Out Much personality cliques in North American schools.
Most adults I know remember exactly where they were in their high school’s social pecking order, and that place was a formative experience of their life, for good or ill. Furthermore, these shared experiences often form the basis of bonding or distance in adulthood: ex-Jocks bond over jockishness, ex-nerds bond over our persecution complexes (hi I totally was a bullied nerd and a lot of us totally do still have persecution complexes from it, me included), and so on. And they can also form the basis for adult animosity: a lot of ex-Jocks still have anti-intellectual leanings, a lot of ex-nerds still view those with hyper-macho or hyper-feminine personas with a reflexive suspicion, etc. Hell, a former coworker of mine, when she left, mentioned she was never able to warm up to me because I reminded her to much of the kids who made fun of her for being “dumb” in high school – for my part, I couldn’t warm up to her because she reminded me too much of the ringleader of the bullies who tried to bully me to death in school – all hyperfeminine fake laughter to seem approachable and fake-uncertainty in statements to not seem too much of a know-it-all. We tried to keep things professional and cordial, but in all honesty I always viewed her with suspicion she didn’t earn and she viewed me with resentment I didn’t deserve, and it colored all our interactions – all because of where we were in our high school pecking orders half a lifetime ago.
See, the whole jocks / nerds / preps thing was *way* too broad for my high school of, er, about 1500 students when I graduated.
Take jocks. What sport you played (and what gender you are) correlated a lot not only with race and class but also personal beliefs, attitudes, budding politics, and how friendly or unfriendly you are with other cliques.
So, for instance, there were three mainly female cliques that were comprised of and embraced bisexual and lesbian women: girl’s basketball team clique, girl’s softball clique, and uncool thespians / cosplayers clique (as opposed to cool thespians, who were quite attractive and were often the center or gossip and drama).
I was the only (closeted) lesbian in my clique, which was “Visual Art Students And Poets Who Make Short Films” [labeled “hippie clique” by others]. I really wanted to hang out with the other wlw in my school, but girl’s basketball team clique couldn’t be my scene because I was too white and kind of fragile, and I found loud events overwhemling; girl’s softball team clique disliked me because I was too vocally “liberal” and I just didn’t enjoy the same books / movies / shows they liked; and uncool thespians welcomed me with open arms, but it turned out deeply analytic fandom conversations are a “sometimes food” for me.
So, hippie clique it was. (To be fair to softball girls’ clique, many of them grew up to be much less judgemental post high school; and to be fair to basketball girl’s clique, I was frankly intimidated by their confidence and non-closeted lesbianism and had a massive crush on a girl who lived across the street from me and I was *way* weird and in denial about it).
It’s always a bit odd now, because often people assume I was in a nerdy clique in high school. If I went to a smaller school, I might’ve been, especially since “Hippie Clique” isn’t necessarily an option in a lot of schools. But when you mentioned having a persecution complex due to bullying, I think that was one thing being in hippie clique helped me avoid. Most other students didn’t notice hippie clique, positively or negatively, unless someone made a phenomenal painting and it was on display, or someone wanted to “debate” women not shaving and then realized that the only unshaved women in the school were the harmless hippies who wanted to legalize weed.
The lack of judgement from others (not being popular enough for others to want to take down a peg; not being obviously uncool enough to be an easy target of mockery) meant I actually emerged from high school with far more confidence than a lot of my friends now. And this is probably why, even though I love a lot of geek culture, I have a hard time labeling myself as a geek or nerd. I don’t have that mindset.
I don’t think I’d ever put all that together before.
That’s…..actually pretty much in line with how education works in Europe. In Germany they basically decide at age 11/12 whether or not you get to go to college.
This is a blatant lie. Maybe that’s how the education system works in GERMANY, but that’s your problem, and the way to fix it is the way to fix most everything – vote better.
I don’t actually live in Germany, but we are German immigrants with family back there so I know how it works. After four years of elementary school depending on your performance you get sorted into either Hauptschule, (worst) Realschule, (middle) or Gymnasium (top). Traditionally, Realschule existed to prepare people for the trades and Gymnasium was for the college bound, but it’s not that rigid anymore and if you do well in Realschule you can still go to college. However, if you get sorted into Hauptschule you can basically forget about college in Germany.
The idea of Harry Potter being a secret aristocrat who would discover the person he was born to be also reminds me of Kind Hearts and Coronets, where a young man, whose mother married a man beneath her station, tries to slaughter his way thru eight successors to inherit the Dukedom. Funny as hell, but still comes from a real place.
Now I just want to see if someone has done a Ripping Yarns-style Harry Potter.
(*British “public” is like American “boarding” or “prep” school.)
As for me, I have no idea what house I’d be in because I feel like I could do okay in any of them, but none of them would be a particularly good fit either. Maybe Hufflepuff, since they take in anyone. But, see, I’m not especially loyal or hard-working or friendly. Plus I have a strong rebellious streak, which might point to the daring of Gryffindor or the indivualism of Ravenclaw. But I’m also quite cowardly, anxious, and heavy on self-preservation (as is Jocelyne on this last one! I could see her being a Slytherin actually). It really depends on the situation. And I’m also rather slow and not witty at all. Slytherin? I’m not ambitious; I’m not resourceful…
You can see why I’m hesitant to put myself in any one house.
I’d probably be Hufflepuff. The Sorting Hat would ask me if I wanted to be in Ravenclaw, and I’d freak out that they’d all be smarter than me and back out, because that’s how I roll.
Lucy is one of those socially awkward extroverted people who doesn’t really know how to Do Friends but wants to, and is overcompensating as a result.
I’d bet she was one of those extroverted-by-nature kids who’s socially isolated and/or bullied in middle- and high school because her interests don’t really jive well with the rest of school, and who bought the “UNIVERSITY IS THE BEST YEARS OF YOUR LIFE AND YOU WILL MAKE THE BEST FRIENDS EVER WITH YOUR ROOMMATE” schtick hook, line and sinker from parents or society. In reality, she’d be way better off aiming for genial cohabitation with the roommate and getting her companionship at a club for her interests.
She wants friends and wants to be a good friend, but she doesn’t really know how to friend or how to boundary. Which is a shame.
(If she were a bit more charismatic, I’d be suspicious of her – overly friendly naturally charismatic people tend to be the kind of people who want something and drop you as soon as they got what they wanted – but she’s just awkward enough I think her hail-fellow-well-met routine is genuine).
As a note: since everyone always asks who is which house… I think I’m Ravenclaw primary with either Gryffindor or Slytherin secondary. I don’t think I’m honorable enough for Gryffindor (though I totally will fight you over stuff I care about) secondary or quite devious enough for Slythein secondary, but it’s one or the other. Annnnd Hufflepuff is dead last for me, mainly because I am and have always been rather selfish by nature. Hufflepuff is for genuinely nice people, and I’m not a genuinely nice person. I value being polite to others and respecting them, but let’s be real I don’t donate to the food bank out of the goodness of my heart, I donate to them because I needed it when I was in school and it’s my way of repaying a perceived debt. I don’t donate blood out of the goodness of my heart either – I was a preemie and needed like thirty-odd blood products before I came home from hospital. And more blood products when I had my tonsils out and had complications from it. Soooo yeah I would like there to be blood in the bank if I ever get hit by a bus because the blood bank has already saved my life many times over – it only makes sense for me to donate.
… y’know. Scratch “maybe Gryffindor secondary.” I’m totally Slytherin secondary. My way of thinking is all cost-benefit analyses and “Do I want this?” and “How does [organization I support] existing benefit me or things I care about?” But I’m a scientist and value my intellectual honesty way more than any personal benefit, so Ravenclaw primary.
On that note: I seriously wish Rowling had included a few Good Slytherins among the kids in her books rather than having all the Slytherin kids being bullying assholes. Cunning and ruthlessness are personality traits that are often not valued in our society – but those traits can also be used for good, and I would’ve liked to see some nuance on that point. Plus, as a person with a lot of Slytherin traits to me – the stereotypical Slytherin possessiveness extends to people, as in if you screw with my people, I screw with you.
Haven’t read the Cursed Child yet but scuttlebutt is that it explores some of the more redeeming qualities of the Slytherin house, which is good to hear about.
Part of the problem with the Houses is that all the official qualities are essentially informed characteristics. We’re told what the values of the Houses are and that there are good and bad people in all of them, but the characters we see don’t actually reflect that.
Not just in Slytherin, but throughout, though we don’t really get to know enough Ravenclaws or Hufflepuffs to judge.
One interesting part is that for both Ravenclaw and Slytherin, the members of their houses that most correspond to the stereotype are the odd ones out.
Ravenclaw – Luna Lovegood – eccentric oddball, the very image of a airhead intellectual. But in her own house she is an outcast, compared to much less extreme Ravenclaws like Cho Chang or Marietta Edgecombe.
Slytherin – Tom Riddle. Muggle-raised, charismatic, brilliant non-name. The very face of ambition… but most of the other slytherins we see are “sons of gentlemen” riding the cushy train to a high level job, like class clown Draco or wanna-be-bullies Crabbe and Goyle.
In Hufflepuff, however, Cedric Diggory seems like the allround great chap you except to champion the house of badgers.
Have you read Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality? By Eliezer Yudkowsky of LessWrong. It’s a metafictional fanfiction that explores scientific concepts in the wizarding world and the nuances of Slytherin, among other things. I recommend it to any Harry Potter fan who is interested in metafictional commentary or ‘criticism’ of the original books.
Or you could just look it up and try it out for yourself! I myself found out about it from a commenter here years ago.
A warning to those who are not scientifically-inclined: Some of the science stuff is a bit long and convoluted, so I kind of skip parts of that.
I have to disagree. I thought it was lousy. Harry acts pretty much nothing like Harry (I don’t care if it’s an AU, they have to be somewhat recognizable), or even an 11 year old for that matter. Not to mention it gets really obnoxious and preachy. Also, the guy uses the Stanford Prison Experiment at face value and he’s terrible at physics. He throws in a lot of scientific buzzwords without really understanding the concepts. Draco’s somehow written even worse )making a joke about rape) and we have yet another ‘abused Draco’ fic (which, c’mon guys, that’s the one POSITIVE quality the Malfoys have – they genuinely love each other). And the author completely missed the point of Ron – Ron signifies emotion and the every man between himself, Harry, and Hermione. That sounds like a great chance for him to develop right? Nah, Harry basically doesn’t talk to him (though, in Ron’s defence, Harry’s an asshole who hangs out with Malfoy, so I wouldn’t talk to him either). You betcher ass Hermione is there though – the author likes Hermione. Even though Draco would treat her like garbage.
If you enjoyed it, that’s great, but those were my problems with it.
I loved HPMOR. It takes a few plotholes in HP and spins them into a logically-consistent wider universe. Harry acts very different, but there are strong Plot Reasons for that. Draco is callous, but not evil (Yeah, the rape joke made me uncomfortable, but it’s supposed to. Draco’s messed up). I don’t recall that Draco was abused in this story. His love for his father is a recurring plot point (not that those two are exclusive).
Obnoxious and preachy, though? You got me there. It’s definitely a pro-hard science propaganda piece. It gets a little ham-fisted at that, and it sacrifices some of the original characters for the story.
But I love it because it explains wizarding genetics, why Potions is different from Transfiguration is different from Charms, what happens if you attach a Newtonian-physics-following rocket to an Aristotelian-physics-following broomstick, why Slytherins in Hogwarts are all blood purists even though the deciding quality should be ambition, where the Marauder’s Map came from, and a million other things. And I like the strict Game Theory rules that the clever Slytherins follow (similar to Light and L in DEATHNOTE). I came out with a more deeply-realized sense of the wizarding universe.
Obviously we treat it very differently. I don’t mind Harry being completely different from the original. He’s the author’s self-insert to explore science and metafiction stuff. That seemed to be the author’s main goal, at least at first, so I don’t mind the alterations made in order to serve the author’s original purpose. Also I guess I don’t really mind the bad writing, although I do notice it sometimes. Some things are really weird, like the stuff about Draco’s mom, but I just roll with it. I don’t remember Draco’s rape joke or his abuse backstory…perhaps because I haven’t read up to that part yet. I think I’m on Chapter 80 or around that.
The science stuff often goes over my head, actually; I don’t pay too much attention to it. (I admit I only mentioned it in my original comment to catch the attention of those who ARE scientifically-inclined.) However I enjoyed that Harry taught Draco about genetics, which is a simple enough topic for me, to cause doubt in Draco’s blood purism.
Mainly I enjoy HPMoR for Draco/Slytherin redemption, good humorous characters/scenes (ie. Daphne and her friends, Neville), funny and self-aware use of tropes, the nuances of Slytherin house, and various other things.
And, um, honestly I don’t like Ron. I found him annoying in the original books. I could relate to Harry’s emotion and angst though, and also to certain traits of his in HPMoR. So yeah, I don’t like Ron; I kind of like Harry; I’m neutral on Draco. And Hermione – I don’t like how the author treats her as utterly good, pure, moral. At least so far as I’ve read. Even in Philosopher’s Stone she breaks the rules a bit. I guess she serves as a counterpart to Harry and his dark side, but to me it’s not interesting. At first I also quite liked McGonagall, but then she got wayyyy too caring and kind. Similar to Hermione.
And those are my opinions. I spent too much time on this.
And all of that is perfectly fine. Everybody’s mileage varies. I, personally, don’t like Draco redemption stories because they often write him as a better person than he actually is. And when it comes to AUs, my thinking is either keep the characters personalities as close as possible, only changing what’s needed to fit the new circumstances or keep the circumstances as close as possible and only change what’s affected by the new personality. Otherwise you may as well just write original fiction. And it’s fine not to like Ron, but Ron The Death Eater (making a character worse than they are or ditching their importance to someone else because you don’t like them) is where I, personally, draw the line.
I forgot to mention – the mystery that is Professor Quirrel is a big reason I read it. I am CERTAIN there will be satisfying answers revealed about him. I will be very disappointed in the whole thing if his story turns out to be anti-climactic.
“He’s the author’s self-insert to explore science and metafiction stuff.”
And that’s pretty much why I couldn’t get very far into it. The main character wasn’t actually a character. He was a mouthpiece for the author to lecture me.
yup. if you’re interested in the content of the lecture, it’s quite entertaining. otherwise, yeah, it’s probably just an annoying lecture with a side of Draco In Leather Pants.
yeah, likes her so much he (rot13) fghssrq ure va gur sevqtr.
I still liked the story, but I was sad about that. so then I went and found a good Hermione-centric story… but damnit, I don’t have a bookmark and google isn’t showing it any more, wtf :/
Me (paraphrased): I wish Rowling hadn’t demonized cunning and ambition so much, as those traits are morally neutral and can be used for good as well as evil, our current society’s beliefs on that matter notwithstanding.
You (paraphrased): Yeah well the founder of the house was a genocidal arse so what do you expect?
Me: 😐
… Like, way to both completely miss the point of what I was complaining about and illustrate it perfectly in a single sentence.
By which I mean: Slytherins are sorted on the basis of personality traits and whether they value those personality traits in themselves. Rowling had a great setup to explore the need to examine the beliefs you were raised with in a skeptical and thoughtful manner with the Slytherins – cuz yeah it totally makes sense that ambitious people born into a position of privilege will be more likely to support the system that sets them up as privileged – see also why a lot of cis people passively support anti-trans bigotry, white people passively support racism, men passively support sexism, and so on. Death Eaters being more common among pure-blooded Slytherins makes sense, and I don’t have a problem with that.
What I have a problem with is that none of the Slytherin characters showed any more backbone whatsoever. Not. A. One.
Cuz, see ambitious people can and sometimes do have a strong moral center. They can and do fight against injustice, often at significant cost to their ambitions. In Canada, Justin Trudeau’s father, Pierre Eliot Trudeau, was undoubtably an extremely ambitious man. He wanted and craved power. He sought it out. He started a forty-year-long trend of collecting power to the Prime Minister’s Office here in Canada. And yet, he decriminalized homosexuality in the 1960s. He got death threats, suffered huge political costs, and to this day is hated by the Conservative wing of the Canadian public. He made the decision to support decriminalization knowing fully well it could cost him all of his ambitions because he firmly believed that the state has no place in the bedrooms of a nation. More recently: Consider Elizabeth Warren. A lot of people think she could end up being the first woman US president. She’s undoubtably highly ambitious, and has made all the big career moves one would expect of someone seeking out an eventual presidential nomination. And, knowing fully well that swing voters don’t tend to take kindly to unapologetic support for abortion, she’s led the charge on filibusters and other political tactics to try to frustrate anti-abortion legislation.
My point is even very ambitious people will take a hit to their ambitions for their principles at times. And Rowling could have explored that and given the kids who are ambitious a sense that they’re not destined to be morally-deficient social climbers without any spine to speak of. But she didn’t. She had a chance to, and she didn’t. On purpose. Very pointedly, she symbolized that there is nothing redeeming about being cunning and ambitious.
Regulus Black’s storyline wasn’t good enough. An actual character who the main characters got to know, and maybe never like because Harry has a bias against Slytherin and all but grew to respect over time (without being a petty tyrant like Snape because seriously fuck Rowling’s “he had a sad boner so it’s all okay” reasoning with Snape the dude was a bully who chose, as a grown-ass adult, to violate the core tenant of what it is to be a teacher and target children to be the victims of his bullying – Draco for his part doesn’t count because he basically spent the entire last book doing whatever he thought would let himself survive…).
And she could have avoided sending that message to ambitious kids very easily. Two possibilities: One, have Regulus appear on screen. Have him personified as a real human character with flaws but also a strong commitment to justice. Or two, add a Dorothy type to Slytherin the story: Someone who is incredibly ambitious and aiming for the biggest job in the nation, but who also is human and has principles they’re willing to stand for.
on your last point:
Yeah, I hated that in the final book, every Slytherin – to a one – got up and walked out. Not a single one had any (visible show of) conscience or, for that matter, saw potential personal advantage to be gained. All those half-hearted claims that not all Slytherin are completely terrible, right out the window. When the time comes, they’re House Evil, in lockstep.
Harry’s parents getting, but faaaaaamily was bullshit. I would’ve liked Dudley apologizing at some later date and exploring how the Golden Child is often manipulated to enact the more explicit abuse against the Problem Child that the parents know they can’t get away with – cuz that is a real thing and I do think Rowling was trying to hint that Dudley had started to realized how screwed up their family situation was. But “but faaaaamily” made me see red.
Also yeah: House Evil in lockstep was what stuck with me. Not one of them was a modern Regulus? None? Really?
And Snape got the “But saaad boooner!” line, like that excuses stalking, terrorizing children and being a bigot. His sad boner made him become a double agent after his own bigotry drove the girl he liked away and his own pettiness saw him fall in line with genocidal assholes and then take part in the plan that got her killed. Like, really?
I could see Ethan in Hufflepuff. The reason I place him in Ravenclaw is because his nerdy side is very argumentative. He cares a lot about his knowledge of trivia and winning arguments online.
As for Dorothy, check out my other comment for my reasons for placing her in Gryffindor.
I persist and claim Dorothy for Gryffindor. Yes, she studies a lot, but so does Hermione. Yes, she’s ambitious, but so was Percy Weasley. Dorothy, while ambitious and studious, really cares about doing the right thing and having the courage of her convictions. She means to follow her ambitions, but she allows many things to go first. She keeps Amber’s secrets rather than expose them, she watches cartoons with Walky and helps him with his math, she reveals she would have stepped down and let Roz be RA if she’d known her actual reasons for wanting to move. She demonstrates time and again that she values “doing the right thing” more than her studies or ambitions
I persist and claim Dorothy for Gryffindor. Yes, she studies a lot, but so does Hermione. Yes, she’s ambitious, but so was Percy Weasley. Dorothy, while ambitious and studious, really cares about doing the right thing and having the courage of her convictions. She means to follow her ambitions, but she allows many things to go first. She keeps Amber’s secrets rather than expose them, she watches cartoons with Walky and helps him with his math, she reveals she would have stepped down and let Roz be RA if she’d known her actual reasons for wanting to move. She demonstrates time and again that she values “doing the right thing” more than her studies or ambitions.
ME TOO, LUCY!
Though I’m way less extroverted so it mostly manifests as helping people who ask or seem obviously in need of it, and trying to be fair to people.
And, we’re still doing that whole “one school for the entire United States” thing, huh?
Gotta love everyone on that side of the pond who just can’t seem to grasp how big this country is.
Not just a matter of land area.
The United Kingdom has a (Muggle) population of 65 million.
The United States has a population five times that.
Even if we cut that ratio in half, and say that most magical families and bloodlines stayed in Europe, and the US doesn’t have enough of its own to entirely make up the difference… that’s still going to be one very large or very crowded school.
Basically, we have roughly the size and population of all of Europe.
How many schools do they have?
(rhetorical question, though I’m sure it’s documented :p)
And, lest anyone think I’m engaging in pure nationalist chest-beating here:
Take it to the logical next level, and consider how many magical academies must be hidden in the hinterlands of the Middle Kingdom (i.e., China).
And how old they are.
You think the Ministry of Magic is a thing?
Those are the people who invented bureaucracy, and the system of civil service schools to feed it, back when we were still painting ourselves blue.
the Alexandra Quick books have enough schools for some magical shopkeeper to ask which she’s going to.
unfortunately there hasn’t been a new book in years. they’re really good books, though. my only disappointment is there’s no mention of how witches deal with menstruation, only birth control. 🙂
I did say “at least one other school” so there’s probably more than two.
Look on the bright side, though! It’s still better than what we’ve got in South America. Our only representation so far has been a stray mention of a Brazilian wizard who one of the Weasley brothers was pen-pals with, and only one school that apparently takes in every single South American wizard (because who cares about the language barriers, right?).
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well THAT explains it
ok fine Billie is a Beaubaton
Which begs the question: do those Frenchies have houses at their school as well?
I think only Hogwarts and Illvermorny use the house system.
I’m actually kind of disappointed that she actually made canon for the American Wizarding society. It kills my headcanon that Magical Diary is in the same universe.
Well in the real world; British education does use a house system while French education doesn’t; so I’d extend that to the fictional world of Harry Potter as well.
Mary is House Duras.
I was going with House Harkonnen.
Oh please, Mary’s a fucking Fremen. She’d only be happy in a tribe full of people where you can kill someone for mouthing off, watch them get bled out and then drink the water from their rendered corpse.
You make a good point.
I could also see her as a Sardaukar. A soldier-fanatic who uses cruelty as a weapon? I’d buy it.
A Strong case can still be made for House Harkonnen. Mary would oh so enjoy popping the recently installed heart plugs of POWs and and lower members of the house who disagreed with her personal agenda.
Mary is absolutely a Harkonnen. Or a Butlerian fanatic.
I’m pretty sure Mary would be a Fish Speaker. Strong fanaticism, brutal efficiency, and extreme devotion.
I don’t think she’d approve of the cleavage windows.
Mary has to be house Slytherin.
*Watches video*
You know, I heard that Lucy saw a bird once…
She’s the girl with kaleidoscope eyes.
@Jay I came here to say the exact same thing, this comments section never disappoints
Lol yes it does.
Just wait til she sleeps and smoother her with a pillow. Its for the best.
Guess Lucy’s a good finder, then. Wonder if she can find the hint.
“Which Crying Breakfast Friend are you, Billie?”
Bille prefers the T.V. Puppet Pals.
“What’s your Sleep Number, Billie?”
She’s a total 56, let’s just be honest.
I’m gonna say Billie’s the ‘Sad Waffle’.
Yes, Lucy, yes you are.
Puff pride! 😀
That *should* be an oxymoron.
Have you heard of the play Puffs?
Unless the pronunciation I’m thinking of isn’t actually spelled that way, this is a little bit funny.
I’m with Billie… who would want to hang out with a Hufflepuff?!?
Hey, Hufflepuffs are loyal, I don’t mind hanging with loyal people.
Juste get a dog then.
Dogs are all Hufflepuffs.
Also, if you lack the bravery of a gryffindor, the cunning of a slytherin, and the intelligence of a Ravenclaw, then Hufflepuff will take you.
More properly, if you lack the courage of a Gryffindor, the intelligence of a Ravenclaw, or the loyalty of a Hufflepuff, then Slytherin is for you.
Because when I read these books, I wasn’t impressed by the “cunning” of Crabbe and Goyle.
“Informed traits”
Mostly the hat seemed lazy and sorted people based on their families.
I’m not sure if it was canon or fan meta (I’m leaning towards the latter), but I read the idea that Riddle/Voldemort magically tampered with the sorting hat when he came to apply for the DADA job so it would sort students from families with anti-Muggle/Muggleborn prejudices all into Slytherin.
I find the theory interesting.
Dunno whether canon, either, but I IIRC the (epic, 1614 pages long) fan fiction “Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality” explores (amongs maaaany other things, like a Harry that grew up with loving step parents and reading Sci-Fi) a somewhat similar explanation.
Except in HPMoR, it wasn’t a deliberate thing; no one was deliberately stacking Slytherin like that. Public opinion was just gradually shifting, so hating Muggleborns was seen as less and less acceptable. Since Slytherin had a history of hating them more than the other houses, people were less willing to be sorted there (if you go under the hat thinking “anything but Slytherin”, there’s almost no chance you’ll be a Slytherin).
So fewer people went to Slytherin in general. So the hat, to compensate, started filling it with anyone who wasn’t turned off by the hating-Muggleborns aspect of it. And so it became a vicious cycle.
The parallels with modern racism are fascinating.
big ups on the MoR reference, i’ll admit to having watched the movies but not read the books (and remembering mostly nothing about the movies); the Methods of Rationality is canon to me at this point
People always seem to forget that the Houses all have multiple Virtues.
Slytherin’s include ambition and blood purity.
Crabbe and Goyle are pureblooded bigots, who have enough ambition to latch onto someone from whom they can gain reflected status and power (and enough cunning to know who that is).
So would a mudblood not be able to join slytherin? Cause impurity?
Well, we know half-bloods can get in, because Tom Riddle, but I don’t think there’s any known case of a Muggle-born getting sorted into Slytherin.
But we do know that you don’t need to completely embody the House Virtues – Crabbe and Goyle will never be held up as the poster boys for Slytherin’s ideals, and it took Neville a time to grow into Gryffindor – just have some bare minimum of at least some of the qualities, as well as a respect for them.
Yeah, this. The Sorting Hat sorts based on potential. People can change, or else the hat might not choose the right potential traits.
Peter Pettigrew was a Gryffindor, but became cowardly. Snape was a Slytherin, but became brave. Also, JKR has explained that Neville Longbottom asked the hat to put him in Hufflepuff b/c he didn’t want the pressure of being in Gryffindor, but the hat was like “LOL NO”. XD
Also-also, I am a proud Slytherin, and try my best not to be a bigot. Ambition, yo!
I’m a Ravenclaw but if I were at Hogwarts would probably seek out Hufflepuffs to hang out with.
Hufflepuffs make awesome pals, they’re J.K. Rowling’s favourite, plus their common room is right next to the kitchen. What’s not to like!
Aaand hanging out with them gives you a nice feeling of superiority!
I kinda feel like I deserved that gravatar
As a Hufflepuff….hey! We’re nice people, but that doesn’t mean we’re inferior people! 😛
I feel like Joyce would be a super Hufflepuff – friendly with everyone! 🙂 Dorothy would be a Ravenclaw, she’s really bright and academically gifted. Amber is a Gryffindor, brave but does some stuff that kinda goes over into stooped (lol), and Billie is a Slytherin – ambitious personality, kinda uses people? Though Amber and Billie could probably switch really easily…
I’m a Hufflepuff, too! I actually have the Hufflepuff common room as my tablet wallpaper, and my Slytherin girlfriend got me a Hufflepuff pin.
By the way, has anyone seen Puffs, the Hufflepuff-themed stage musical? I’ve never seen it, but I’m curious.
I haven’t seen it, but I know one of the leads in it. She went to my high school, and I’m Facebook friend’s with her mom, so I’ve heard a lot about the show. Based on what her mom has to say about it, which could be, y’know, biased, I recommend it.
Wouldn’t Dorothy be a slytherin? She is ambition driven she just happens to be smart too. Do we include the Walkyverse version too?
Dorothy wants to be president and was taking notes on what people want, she could be non-cartoon Slytherin.
I actually think that Billie is a Gryffindor. The whole “problem solver” aspect; the craziness she got into with Ruth in the beginning (fighting her in the meeting, sneaking into her room), taking on her grandfather to defend Ruth… she’s a fighter and she doesn’t get intimidated.
I don’t see anything that she does for ambition or personal glory, so Slytherin is out. She’s no Ravenclaw. And how could she be Hufflepuff with the Queen Hufflepuff right there?
Problem-solving and getting in fights are Slytherin traits, too (one of commonalities w/ Gryffindor, and why the two houses clash so much). Ambition doesn’t always have to mean personal gain. You can be ambitious to have the world around you live up to your ideals.
I’m apparently a hatstall Ravenpuff but I picked Hufflepuff for the people. People say the four houses are Brave, Smart, Evil and Miscellaneous, but I’m pretty sure the fourth is Nice. And in true puff fashion, I pick niceness, every time.
The fandom seems to have Flanderized the houses a bit at this point, and Slytherin gets the “ambitious/manipulative” label more than “evil” in my experience. I feel like that for many people there would be two, potentially three reasonable choices. Slitheryn and Hufflepuff could both easily cross over with Gryffindor or Ravenclaw, but probably less so with each other. In the face of all that, though, I scored something like 98% Ravenclaw in the Time/Cambridge test. Don’t recall the other components, other than a zero for Slytherin.
I have felt for a long time, that if there were no input from the child, the hat would place everyone in either ravenclaw, Hufflepuff, or Slytherin, and that the only way to gain admittance to gryffindor was to, as an 11 year old in a brand new place surrounded by strangers, involved in something much bigger than themselves, in some way stand up to the hat. That the inner dialogue between the hat and harry goes on pretty much with all the entrants.
A+ ^-^
I’d say it’s more like: Brave (possibly a little headstrong/rash), Academically Gifted (I wouldn’t be surprised if Hermione had nearly been a Ravenclaw instead), Ambitious/Manipulative, and Friendly/Loyal. 🙂
*plays some Santana on the hacked Muzak*
Finally, something in today’s comments I can make heads or tails of!
Billie is a Slytherin.
To be a slythrin you need ambition, and that’s a quality I never got from Billie.
She likes being in charge.
Maybe, but I’d put her in House “Muggle Because This Whole Thing’s A Stupid Nerd Fantasy That Isn’t Real So Leave Me Out Of It.”
…. yes, she’d say all that and call it nerdy despite knowing what “muggle” means in this context.
I’ve actually been convinced by someone upstream that she’s Gryffindor.
Gryffindor for everyone!
I don’t FIND this surprising at all.
Who asked you Cedric!
I appreciate the character development here. Billie is REALLY trying to be nice.
She didn’t immediately respond with “shut up nerd!”
Character growth
Mm, progress. Hope Lucy doesn’t push hard and undo all that.
Not for lack of trying
agreed. I noticed and appreciated in panel one that she was both polite in her refusal and appears to have a smile on her face. I got the feeling that Lucy may not be her cup of tea but she’s aware she could do a lot worse and just plans to roll with it.
Hufflepuff and proud 💕💕💕 (I’m a Slytherin btw, anyone else?)
Me too! Also Slytherin.
She’s in the right house, baby, she was sorted that way. And you’ll always be on t-t-t-t-t-top.
Me, I’m Ravenclaw, reading in the commons, reading in the Great Hall.
On the old Pottermore site, I sorted as a Slytherin. I got resorted as a Gryffindor, after it was redone.
Ravenclaw here, but my sister is a HARD Slytherin. And then my mom and dad are Hufflepuff and Gryffindor, respectively. We’re a weird family.
Proud Gryffindor myself. My wand is ebony, 12¾ inches, moderately rigid, with dragon’s heartstring core, and my patronus is a dapple grey mare.
Cool. I’m a Ravenclaw and my patronus is a bottle of vodka. 😀
While I don’t think much of the Hogwarts house quiz on Pottermore, I thought the Patronus quiz was absolutely fantastic. I thought it was so clever how they designed it. Your Hogwarts house is about how you choose to act, hence why the sorting hat often lets you choose. Your Patronus on the other hand is about your inner feelings, since it is basically made from a happy memory in order to ward off metaphors for depression, and you cannot change how you feel inside. This is why the Patronus quiz is different from the wand and house quiz, in that it doesn’t ask questions but just lets you pick the word that resonates with your inner self. I’m kind of obsessed with the Patronus quiz, everyone that I know has to take it. I got a Goshawk, my sister got a Newfoundland, my caseworker got a tortoiseshell cat, the guy who’s name I don’t know who I sometimes see down the pub got a badger… Sorry to go off on a tangent, you mentioning Patronus’s even as briefly as you did got me rambling. I love Harry Potter so much.
My sister also changed her name to Rowan, in part because her wand wood from the Pottermore quiz was Rowan. Harry Potter is a huge deal in my house. Also, completely random, but if anyone living in England is interested, next summer there’s going to be a real life castle being turned into a magical school for three days. You get sorted into houses,meet magical creatures. You don’t need to be a Harry Potter fan to enjoy it.
Sounds cool. 🙂 I’m sadly missing a Harry Potter festival here in Pennsylvania today, cuz I gotta do work. 😛 Also, to respond to your Patronus tangent, I got a dolphin on Pottermore. Strange, but kinda makes sense. Pottermore sorted me as a Hufflepuff, and as a Thunderbird for Ilvermorny. Between those two house sortings, it’s like Pottermore KNOWS I’m on Team Instinct…!
Bah. The Patronus quiz gave me a Robin. I disagree with that way more than Gryffindor as my house. :p
Slytherin. Pottermore also gave me a fox patronus, which I was quite happy with. All of the cunning!
That sounds kinda dirty.
I’m a Slytherin! My BFF is Ravenclaw, and I have friends and lovers from all houses 🙂
I’m kind of between Hufflepuff and (realistically not evil) Slytherin, I think? But mostly Hufflepuff. I’m kind of a nice pushover LMAO, I just want everyone to get along.
At the same time, I desperately want people to love/admire me so there’s a bit of Slytherin there. |D
(Your icon is super cute by the way! ;w;)
Superman is a Hufflepuff. He said it himself: “I’m for everyone.”
He’d also make a good Ravenclaw. Who else would know Super Math?
Oh, come on. https://supermathematics.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/superman.jpg
Ravenclaw master race
Oh, Lucy, of course you are.
So I was going to say this anyway but by sheer coincidence there is a tenuous link to today’s strip:
I was binging some 2016 stuff and I rediscovered the “leer at objects until they turn gay” meme. Just thought I’d attempt to necromancy it.
Okay, I’ve consulted my deep knowledge of both Dumbing of Age character traits and Harry Potter lore, and I’ve carefully sorted everyone.
Amber: giant spider that lives in the forest
Becky: giant spider that lives in the forest
Billie: giant spider that lives in the forest
Carla: giant spider that lives in the forest
Danny: giant spider that lives in the forest
Dina: giant spider that lives in the forest
Dorothy: giant spider that lives in the forest
Ethan: giant spider that lives in the forest
Joe: giant spider that lives in the forest
Joyce: giant spider that lives in the forest
Mike: giant spider that lives in the forest
Ruth: giant spider that lives in the forest
Sal: giant spider that lives in the forest
Sarah: giant spider that lives in the forest
Walky: giant spider that lives in the forest
You forgot Jason: probably Dobby
Nah, I think he’s more like Winky. He already has the drinking part down.
I always forget about Winky.
Would Toedad make a good Umbridge?
I’d like to come up with a witty reply, but my brain keeps BSoD’ing whenever it tries to parse the phrase “good Umbridge.”
He’s too dumb, and lacks power within the school system. The closest one here is “sir” Clint.
Mary would like to think of herself as Umbridge-like, but she doesn’t actually have the power.
Now I’m trying to think of a Toedad parallel.
What house would you put him in? I’d say Gryffindor– he has that recklessness and fierce belief that what he’s doing is right. God I hate him.
Toedad is Filch.
I was taking him for Uncle Vernon.
Uh, Filch is the Doctor. He can’t be Ross.
Filch is the squib caretaker. Hogwarts’ medical staff seems to consist entirely of Madam Pomfrey.
I assumed Taffy’s comment was saying that Filch was The Doctor, as in Doctor Who, but I don’t know.
Good point – I’ve passionately hated Umbridge and how evil she is since forever.
Robin: big-ass snake that lives in the sewers
Leslie: eagle horse thing that killed a student or whatever
Anna: angry tree
The egle-horse hing ws he hippogriff Buckek, d he did’ kill none, he jus kicked ou Mlfo … who oll hd i coming.
The eagle-horse thing was the hippogriff Buckbeak, and he didn’t kill anyone, he just kicked out at Malfoy … who totally had it coming.
“Buckek” gave me a funny mental image of Buckbeak as a meme-obsessed, vaping millennial stereotype. He spends all day on /pol/, posting anime memes that nobody understands.
He kicked Draco because Draco is a cuck
So, which is more likely?
1. Mike managed to get sorted into his own house.
2. Mike got double-sorted into Slytherin and Hufflepuff, but he’s actually only considered to be in a single house at a time, based on his current sobriety level.
3. After seducing the sorting hat, Mike got put into each of the four houses, plus an extra one.
Mike got sorted into your mom’s house
For a nickel.
Mike was sorted straight into Azkaban.
^^^
3. Mike gave the Sorting Hat head.
……
…… and now the ceremonial sorting of every kid in Hogwarts seems icky. Thanks, Mike!
I’m more worried about the fact that every school year start with them putting the same hat on the head of every new eleven year old.
I bet Hogwarts have a huge lice problem, and it fits perfectly with how ineffective the wizarding world always manages to be.
Given that it’s the Wizarding World, the huge lice problem would consist of huge lice. Which, fortunately, are easy to spot.
LICE IN THE DUNGEON!!!
Well, yeah… there’s ONE louse. Per Head.
So basically, Hogwarts is responsible for Facehuggers? :/
On a random note, what’s on that door? Is it one of those “here is the floorplan and fire exits and ways not to burn to death,” like at hotels?
Probably. That’s where they were located in my dorm.
Yeah — Dave confirmed that that’s what they are in the hover text a few years ago
Billie that’s literally the least-nerdy nerdy thing one can say. You want ‘didn’t care about Harry Potter’ your options are mostly Joyce and Becky.
Or Jason.
…. yes, even if he’s British.
I’m a Ravenclaw, but I think Hufflepuff is the best house. I’m just so fucking Ravenclaw. My therapist is a Hufflepuff, though I think the approach she uses seems very Ravenclaw. I talk about Harry Potter in therapy sometimes.
Sometimes, I talk about my imaginary Hamilton-Harry Potter crossover where the characters of Hamilton attend Hogwarts, and a couple times I’ve talked about Korrasami/ATLA. I feel like I could get along with Lucy.
So, wait, wait, my Hamilton friends are never my Harry Potter friends, so I have to know: Hogwarts houses for all the Hamilton characters? And then, since you mentioned ATLA, possible elemental nations for the Hamilton characters?
Okay, I change my mind on some of them at times but:
Hamilton is a Slytherin (“they think me Macbeth / Ambition is my folly”; “Be careful with that one love / He will do what it takes to survive”), but he is a Gryffindor secondary. Which annoys Burr, who’s just so Slytherin because he’s like, “Why is this kid in my house? He got in a fight on the train ride here?”
Washington is a Gryffindor, Angelica is a Ravenclaw, Eliza is a Hufflepuff. I generally think of both Laurens and Hercules Mulligan as Gryffindors, though sometimes I like to split them up. Lafayette I go with Ravenclaw for.
Will have to think about more. It’s primarily the first act that I think about at Hogwarts.
Personally I’d put Hamilton is a Gryffindor, but Slytherin secondary. I mean Slytherin and Gryffindor are both sides of the same coin really. They both want fame and glory (J.k Rowling has stated that the reason so many people from Gryffindor wanted to fight in the Battle of Hogwarts is because they wanted to win glory in battle, in comparision to Hufflepuff which just wanted to help). So Gryffindors are pretty ambitious to, in there own way. Gryffindors have a more brash way of achieving there goals, whereas Slytherins have more finesse. But yeah, I completely see where you are coming from sorting him into Slytherin, that was where I first put him as well. He’s just one of those characters who is difficult to sort.
Yeah, I see him as like a Slytherin-Gryffindor-Ravenclaw in that order, as opposed to Burr, who’s like a Slytherin-Slytherin-maybe-Hufflepuff-but-probably-Slytherin. That’s also part of why I like him as Slytherin, because of the way it parallels and then diverges with Burr. And, funny enough, I went the opposite way with him, at first seeing him as a Gryffindor before developing my view of him to be more Slytherin. And he does have some finesse to him (“Room Where It Happens”).
All that said, I also see him as sharing that Gryffindor trait of sometimes needing to sit down and shut the fuck up. In my “inner fanfic,” as you put it, this really annoys Burr.
Sorry if calling it your ‘inner fanfic’ was offensive. If you talk about it in therapy it must be very important to you (though there’s no reason fanfic’s can’t be important. lot of people write them to help with anxiety and depression. I’m thinking of doing that myself.) But yeah, if I offended you with that phrase, sorry.
I hadn’t thought about ‘the room where it happens’, but you make a good point that he can be subtle when he really needs to be. He just seems to avoid it as a matter of Principle. Then again, he hardly ever really uses it owing to a very Gryffindor code of honor saying that people need to know all your positions on everything even if that is detrimental to your ambitions. Plus Burr was able to break out of his more subtle way of doing things and bravely stick his neck out in the hope of being President, even though this could (and did) severely damage his alliance with Jefferson. I see this as a case of a Slytherin and a Gryffindor learning from eachother.
After all, Snape was brave in being a double agent. This didn’t make him less of a Slytherin. Sometimes people do something that is out of character for them in order to survive.
Oh, I didn’t take it as offensive! I don’t know how I’d label it myself, but I don’t mind the label of inner fanfic. And sometimes the reason I talk about it in therapy is because I’m like, “Oh god, what should I talk about, I have suddenly forgotten all information pertaining to real life” and Hamilton-Harry Potter is where I end up.
I don’t view Burr’s actions as brave or Gryffindor like in that part, but it’s up to interpretation. To me that “Is there anything you wouldn’t do?” exchange (and the rest of the song) just shows a lot of Slytherin. Now I could see Hamilton were Gryffindor and Burr learned to be more Slytherin from him and Hamilton was like, “That is not what I meant AT ALL.”
Oh, but Hamilton, it kind of is.
Ok, that’s a relief. From the way you put quote marks around it, for some reason that made it seem like you didn’t like it. I can get like that in therapy to. I talk about all sorts of random things because explaining all my issues is so complex and I just dry up, but not saying anything at all is embarrassing. One of my past therapists asked me why I kept trying to make small talk with her and when we were going to get onto the real issues, causing me to freak out and stop going to therapy for a while because I thought was somehow doing therapy wrong.
Also, that is a really good point. I hadn’t thought of that quote in that way. I was thinking more of it like, Burr’s said he learned something from Hamilton, Hamilton is Gryffindor, therefore Burr learned to be a little Gryffindor. But now you point out the exact quote it does have a very Slytherin vibe to it. It may have been my confirmation bias using that quote as justification for Hamilton being a Gryffindor.
Yeah, with the first therapist I ever saw, it was kind of like that, where I struggled to talk about anything real (I was also 17 and was like, “okay, nothing that she’d tell my parents”). And then she basically ended up terminating with me within one session, and I cried in the car on the way home because I had “failed therapy.”
My last therapist basically wouldn’t let me talk about anything that wasn’t “real” or whatever– or she’d direct what I’d talk about a lot. That had the effect of shutting me down, or if not shut down, I’d just be quiet and then she’d start talking.
With my current therapist, I can talk about these things and then she’ll explore with me about why I talk about them and why that’s what my mind goes to, and it helps me feel more comfortable to talk about heavier things. Basically my current therapist is great and I love her.
Also, she’s into Hamilton herself, and in one of my earlier sessions, we had a conversation that was very therapeutic and also full of Hamilton references and analysis. It was great.
I’m really glad you’ve found a better therapist. I’m still searching for mine. Why are so many therapists so bad at what they do?
It’s really nice having a proper conversation with something on the internet about this kind of stuff. Any kind of human interaction, even across the internet, is a really big deal for me. My anxiety makes it almost an insurmountable challenge talking to anyone, so thanks for responding so much to me. You’ve made my day. (Of course I’ll be agonising over this conversation later, going over all the mistakes I made in it and imagining you thinking of me as an idiot, but I’ll just have to take that when it comes.)
Yeah, with therapists it could always just be that they’re not the right fit for you, but with some I’ve seen I’m like, “How is this what you do professionally?”
I enjoyed talking to you! It’s always fun when someone cares about the same fun stuff you do.
thanks for reminding me, I’m gonna have to start emailing my notes to my therapist again; too much is missed if they’re just on my phone.
…and I was gonna reply to a whole bunch of other comments but once again, now that I’m at a proper keyboard, the part of me that wanted to is fading fast… :/ and darn, I’m not in the OS where I can c&p my pile of links, I think Hannah might like the Feeling Good CBT book. (or you might hate it like I do but it still helps anyways)
I’m so glad that in my first appointment with my current therapist, I managed to talk about what I was scared she might do that would really not work for me.
Oh, ALSO, I see him as muggleborn (or hialf-blood but his dad never told him or his mom) and at first being like, “Okay, Slytherin’s fine” and then growing to wonder why he wasn’t in Gryffindor– things like having a “head full of fantasies of dying like a martyr” does seem very Gryffindor and even anti-Slytherin. But I think even in the first act he has a mix of traits that really spread out and still end up favoring Syltherin, and in my “inner fanfic” the sorting kind of ends up pushing him further in that direction.
OH, and I think it’s funny how Burr basically says he learned to be more Slytherin from Hamilton (“The Election of 1800”). Because Hamilton’s trait spread doesn’t mean he’s a little Slytherin, a little Gryffindor, a little Ravenclaw– the boy’s just A LOT in EVERYTHING.
That does sound really interesting. The conflicts, both from inside himself and from the prejudices of others, of him being sorted into Slytherin would be much more interesting than him being sorted into Gryffindor. I’ve also just had the thought that Hamilton would probably choose to be in Slytherin, since its full of the elite and would make it much easier for him to make political connections. I like to imagine he’d be under the sorting hat for ages, one of those rare hatstalls, since he’s so difficult to place.
It’s funny we both interpreted Burr’s line to Hamilton about learning to go after what he wants from Hamilton in different ways.
Oh, and since you asked about Hamilton and ATLA, I don’t have an answer for what you asked, but it does seem like a good time for some gratuitous self-promotion. Here’s am ATLA/Hamilton video I made:
https://youtu.be/hIZlXTbSWyE
Oooooh!! Thanks for the link, I’ll be interested in checking that out.
I was going to chime in, but your thread went in such a lovely direction!
I love your video.
Thank you!
I LOVE Hamilton-Harry Potter crossovers! They are currently my two favourite fandoms. Do you know any good fanfics I could check out? Also, out of interest, what is your imaginary Hamilton-Harry Potter crossover about. ‘d be very interested to know the storyline of your inner fanfic.
Also, your just like me! I’m Ravenclaw (albeit with a small side helping of Slytherin), and I think Hufflepuff is objectively the best house. Even the sorting hat basically implied it, what with the 6th year sorting hat song basically being about the founders all being detrimentally picky about what students they wanted to let in, but Helga Hufflepuff was all like ‘naw, I’ll take the lot and treat them just the same’. It kills me when people use that exact same quote to justify their Hufflehate. ‘Ha see! Hufflepuff just takes the scraps the other houses leave behind’. Aaargh.
Every time I take one of those “Which Hogwarts House Are You” quizzes I end up getting a different result, so I’m not really sure which I am.
Look inward, the real Sorting Hat was inside you all along.
Just ask for which house you want. It’s right there in the book.
I’ve slowly shifted from Hufflepuff with a side of Gryffindor to Gryffindor with a side of Hufflepuff as I’ve gotten older–but I still call myself a Puff, just, one that will not hesitate to cut a creep in defense of self or others.
I’ve always identified as a Ravenclaw, but I also think that middle-school-me got into way to many fights to not have had the Sorting Hat going, “But…maybe…Gryffindor?”
…Reminds me of Tonks.
I think I’m an INFJ.
one of my favourite fanfics starts off with the sorting hat berating everyone for obsessing over the houses, and it threatens to do away with the system entirely. 🙂 https://www.fanfiction.net/s/3979062/1/Hogwarts-Houses-Divided (…well technically the hat’s in chapter 3, but, close enough)
According to Not Literally co-founder Ginny Di, who has thought about this way more than any normal person, an online quiz is not going to read your mind the way the Sorting Hat would.
I wish I could put in a second link to her Hogwart’s Houses video. “Most of all, I think we all just need to calm down about sorting a little.”
Willis, what have you done.
Billie: Slytherin
Ruth: Slytherin
Joyce: Gryffindor
Dorothy: Slytherin
Dan: Hufflepuff
Amber: Slytherin
Dina: Ravenclaw
Becky: Ravenclaw
Roz: Ravenclaw
Sal: Gryffindor
Walky: Ravenclaw
Jason: Ravenclaw
Leslie: Hufflepuff
Carla: Gryffindor
Sierra: Hufflepuff
Jacob: Slytherin
Joe: Gryffindor
Malaya: Hufflepuff
Mike: Asshole
Mary: Squib
Oh, come on. Mike’s totally a Gryffindor.
(I also think Amber is Ravenclaw and Walky is… something else. Not Ravenclaw. Maybe Hufflepuff, but probably Gryffindor.)
The heck he is. Cunning, scheming, sneaky, and determined: he’s Slytherine through and through.
Don’t most Slytherin give a fuck, though? Mike gives zero fucks.
I think the hat would give him the choice, and he’d pick Gryffindor just screw with people.
Whichever house you don’t want him to be in?
Amber I will admit to being likely wrong.
But I feel super strong about Walky being a Ravenclaw. The time we’ve seen him freak out the most is when he started failing math. He doesn’t know who he is if he’s not effortlessly smart. He’s such a Ravenclaw.
I wrote my response below before I read this comment, and I am retroactively withdrawing my “absolutely not” comment about Walky being a Ravenclaw.
As you point out, Walky values being smart. But I don’t get the sense that he values knowledge, per se. But the Sorting Hat is the Sorting Hat, and I was wrong to make the blanket assertion that I did.
Walky SO values knowledge.
…. he just doesn’t value learning.
Remember, it’s also at least party about what the person themself wants, and I’m sure that Walky would at least want to be in the house with all the people who are smart like him.
No way Malaya would be Hufflepuff, the loyal house. She’s too selfish.
They also value kindness and patience, which…
I see Malaya as a Slytherin, not because of the “Slytherins are evil and mean people are Slytherins” mentality, but because I could see her being considered resourceful and clever and having a strong value for her relationship with Marcie (fraternity).
Yeah, I apparently blanked on her. I could see an annoying Gryffindor or a not especially clever Slytherin. (I adore her, don’t get me wrong, but she ain’t perfect.)
Yeah, with the resourceful and clever I was thinking a bit of her efforts in learning sign language. It’d be like selective cleverness, only applied to the stuff she cares about.
I agree that Malaya is Slytherin, and that it’s not because she’s evil. She’s not smart enough for Ravenclaw nor good enough for Huff. An argument could be made for Gryffindor, but I’m going with Slytherin.
You can be loyal AND selfish at the same time. And Malaya’s pretty loyal to the few people she lets in, like Marcie or Carla.
Also, if nothing else, Hufflepuff “takes in all the rest”
That’s actually very Slytherin.
Mrs. Figg did not watch over Harry for years to be in the same group as Mary.
You’re right. More Figg deserves way better.
Mrs. stupid autocorrect.
Yeah. Mary’s a muggle. Why is she even here? Bet her middle name is Petunia.
I agree with many of these (Danny is the MOST hufflepuff), but not all.
Ruth: Depression stole any ambition she might have had. Perhaps she’s a Gryff, because she has to actively avoid being a showy bully. We’d have to check in with her when she’s healthier.
Joyce: yes Gryff, and she was initially surprised not to be Puff but now it all males sense.
Amber: so Gryffindor!
Sal is brave, but she also had that speech about proving herself to her parents, so she gets the choice between Gryffindor and Slytherin.
Jacob: We need to know more about him.
Malaya: Gryffindor. Remember when she stupidly rushed Amazi-Girl in the parking lot?
Mike and Mary, spot on.
Yeah, I struggled with a lot of these. You’ve got a good point about Malaya, as do others. I’d switch her to Gryffindor based on y’all points.
I agree that charging at Amazi-Girl was hella Gryffindor, but I just don’t see her overall as being a Gryffindor.
Also, I don’t think Mary’s a squib; in-universe, squibs are at least a marginalized group, often a family shame, and Mary seems like she’d be one doing the shaming. I could see her as Slytherin with the self-preservation, determination, and cunning (of course all in a bad way for her), along with Slytherin’s reputation. I could also see her as a Gryffindor, but like the worst Gryffindor who eventually gets decked by someone in their common room.
I’d agree with BigDogLittle Cat then; Mary can be a muggle who hates all things shiny and wonderful. Somehow I don’t see her going in for witchcraft.
Yeah, I can see her as that type of Muggle too. But if she were at Hogwarts…goddamn she’d be annoying. She’d grow up to become Umbridge.
If Mary is not a muggle, she’s definitely Umbridge’s deputy. And Umbridge better watch her back.
Spot on that Joyce is surprised to be in Gryffindor. But even more surprised to be there is Amber, who is sort of an alternate universe Neville.
Your suggestion that Sal would be given a choice is brilliant. I think you’re right. Sadly, I fear she’d pick Slytherin because she doesn’t think she’d fit in at Gryffindor.
Ah, but Slytherin is totes racist (against muggle-born wizards)! That might not sit so well with Sal, and if Marcie is in Gryffindor too that’d swing it for sure.
oh, right. Hmmm, does Sal know they’re racist before she gets sorted?
If she doesn’t she would end up being the first student to declare themselves houseless. And Slytherins would hate her because she’s brilliant on a broom but refuses to play on the house team.
Sal might not know, but the Hat does! It’ll do her a solid and sort her to Gryffindor after all. ^^
Muggle borns have been stuck in Slytherin before regardless though. So she might get offered the choice after all.
Forget hexes though, anybody talking shit about muggle-borns while Sal’s listening is getting fucking decked.
Sal can’t be in Slytherin! No windows in dungeon!
Joyce secretly wants to be a fighter pilot. Gryffindor confirmed.
Granted, she also wants her own cartoon show and to make her kids mac and cheese every night. So whatever house Willis is in. (She is autobiographical, after all.)
Jason is a Ravenclaw, I think. He’s not nearly patient enough for a Hufflepuff; a Gryffindor probably wouldn’t repeatedly bang a student despite knowing full well how against the rules (and unethical) it is; and while he’s not very good at it, he honestly does care about his students and their well-being and success, even when they irritate him, and seems to be a bit unrealistically idealistic about teaching (at least, according to Penny, who is probably a Slytherin through and through if only for that comment (“Oh Jason, poor, sweet, naive Jason–it doesn’t sodding matter!”) and the fact she’s been happily banging Joe without worrying about it a bit)–Jason is probably not a Slytherin either.
On the other hand, he does care about being a good teacher, and seems to value knowledge, and is definitely intelligent, so I’d put him square into Ravenclaw–although, with that idealistic streak, one might make an argument for Gryffindor. But I think that is overwritten by knowing his behaviour in regards to Sal is wrong, yet repeatedly doing it anyways.
Clodia, most of those I don’t disagree with. But…
Walky is absolutely not a Ravenclaw. He’s really smart, but he would rather do anything else than study. He also would rather do anything else than work, and he doesn’t seem to have any ambition, ruling out both Hufflepuff and Slytherin. Gryffindor by default.
And Jacob is not Slytherin. Ambition for its own sake does not seem to be a part of his personality, and I don’t think he’d agree with “the end justifies the means.” I could see him in any other house, though.
Malaya would refuse to be “in any dumb house,” as she would express it. And I’m still going with House Harkonnen for Mary.
The real question is: what houses would Dexter and Monkey Master be sorted into?
…and even more importantly: what about Blowjob Cat?
Blowjob Cat is very, very ambitious. Gosh.
I know nil about the Potterverse, but I did take a House test out of interest. Got Hufflepuff and I’m pretty sure Sarah’s a Ravenclaw.
Ethan seems like a Hufflepuff as well.
Yes, Ethan is definitely a Hufflepuff. Sarah’s a Slytherin, though. Fiercely loyal to a chosen few, “smart and mean” in getting a certain car towed, most concerned about her scholarships and degree, etc.
Ah, good analysis regarding Sarah.
The house of Mr. Willis himself is pretty obvious. Anyone whose nickname is “Damn You” belongs in Slytherin.
Finally, someone more interested in.sorting the doa characters than themselves. Good show.
Also, does anyone else have issues with those video ads on this site that autoplay and make it difficult-to-impossible to scroll down and type/read comments?
Yes, sometimes.
It’s so bad for me tonight. I’m going to stab my computer.
I’ve been there. If you tell Willis what ad it is, he can pass it on to Kickstarter.
I got a couple. I remember one of them was about Prague.
Sometimes. I just reload the page and get a different ad.
Not just this site. Lots of sites. I wanna know how to disable that “feature” in my browser.
I startet to use Firefox clear. It allows for some ads but gets the really nasty ones.
Though the places to visit in wherever starts to get one my nerves…
Yeah, they seem to always be an issue when I check in on here from my PC. I just set Adblock Plus to not block ads on this site, then block the individual page if/when those ads show up while I’m reading comments.
Hey look everyone! A falling shoe.
Now, re: sorting: I say everyone is the same house.
Absolutely everyone. And we should all know which one that is.
Read Hall is basically UoI’s Hufflepuff House. Every misfit, mad person, outcast, beaten down pariah the rest of the campus has to offer ends up there. Either Hufflepuff or, if you want to rate it by the disaster-density per capita, Gryffindor. If neither of those two things, the next most appropriate point of comparison is the Defense Against The Dark Arts post.
They’re probably not Gryffindor, though. We already know which kid got the scar on his face.
Question is who’s Cedric.
Oh, Cedric? He’s that dead kid, right over there.
Oh, so Dana? 😛
Sorrynotsorry
Is Billie being indoctrinated into a cult?
No, Silliy. They just try to get her to lower her guard so they can eat her.
Well I just checked, and according to Zimbo I’m a Ravenclaw. That’s…not particularly surprising. I’m not noble, I’m not ambitious (though I am evil), I’m not helpful, and I’m rather analytical.
I know you all desperately wanted to know.
Ya know, Billie, you could maybe ask HER questions instead, and try to get to know her and have a real conversation? And take care of your stuff later? Oh well, baby steps.
I kind of see your point (getting to know people is important), but at the same time, I would also prioritize getting my stuff up in this situation. If I don’t get my stuff up right away, it will take a while before I get it all settled.
From Billies smile and panel 1 comment, I feel like she’s in a good place to do this now, and doesn’t want to waste it.
But yeah, especially considering she just got out of a bit of a storm of new people, it makes sense to me that this was not the best moment to talk for Billie. She might do better later.
Panel 3 Lucy: datbutt
As someone who is very quiet and very private as a person, who takes a long time to establish the kind of relationship with someone where I’m okay being myself around them and talking about my non-academic interests, every time Lucy does something I cringe internally.
She’s not a bad person, but I’m uncomfortable with expectations of attention from strangers, I’m uncomfortable meeting new people in situations where I don’t already have a level of control and comfort, I’m uncomfortable with loud expressions of fandom fandom, I’m very uncomfortable with people who feel more that I’m their friend than I feel they’re my friend (and because I’m extremely polite IRL, there are a hell of a lot of those people). The level of secondhand discomfort I feel watching the way that Lucy interacts with Billie is not small.
And honestly it wouldn’t be that hard for Lucy to be less horrifyingly awkward? Like, all she would really need to do is have her own thing going on and exist in the space doing whatever that thing was until Billie initiated interaction or until there was a good opportunity to make introductory small talk. But Lucy doesn’t seem to be able to empathize with the private person with her own thing going on, since she super doesn’t seem to be one. Annnnnd. As a result, she doesn’t understand why this isn’t working, and she doesn’t know how to respond to it, and it’s unpleasant for everyone involved.
So I’m wondering if you chose that avatar on purpose? (I kid)
“And honestly it wouldn’t be that hard for Lucy to be less horrifyingly awkward?”
Yes, actually. That’s why people are horrifyingly awkward. Learning how to NOT be awkward is difficult and takes time. By the time she graduates, Lucy will no doubt be much better about things like this.
Though it takes even more time when people are “polite” and don’t speak up about their own discomfort (you’re not doing yourself any favors there, either). People aren’t going to change their behavior if they don’t know it’s bothering you.
Luckily, Billie seems to have learned from experience with Joyce, and is communicating with Lucy. If she keeps that up, they’ll get along just fine once Lucy settles down
I. Wasn’t really referring to the difficulty of social learning, though I understand how I might have been interpreted as doing so. I do understand that there is difficulty in learning–I just meant that the action in question is fairly simple.
I don’t know what kind of cultural situation you come from, and I assume it is one where frankness is valued reasonably highly, but um. It’s not that simple and it’s not always viable to be forthright? Clearly it is here, and clearly Billie is being, and that’s a good thing. But. I come from a culture where saying no to things anywhere near the amount I want to would cause problems, and I know because I’ve learned my attitude from it having done so in the past. With my friends and people I trust, I can be forthright about things, but if I did so in the broader community there would be issues. This is, I’m aware, a toxic element of said community, but there are other things that make it worth staying in. But that’s the position I’m coming from, is one where often I’m not in a position to be able to state my preferences regarding people and their behavior without causing all kinds of bullshit (within a threshold. I have avenues by which I can deal with things if someone starts being actively abusive).
Ah, I can imagine that would be very frustrating. If even politely, gently saying no or letting someone know what they’re doing makes you uncomfortable, I can see how someone acting like Lucy would just be torture.
I’m considerably more frank than is generally approved of, but I generally manage to get away with it. I would go completely mad in a situation where I couldn’t ask somebody to back off because they were making me uncomfortable, or where they couldn’t do the same.
I’m glad you have people who you can be honest with about that kind of thing, that’s really important to have
🙁 wow, I was so angry earlier at that sort of toxic culture, for what it does to people’s minds, for making it so unsafe to just *ask* for things, making boundaries and meaningful consent almost impossible, teaching kids that manipulation is preferable to using your words… grrr… I have a vague memory of getting a treat because I was sitting quietly (probably daydreaming) when some other kid asked for it. and I have plenty of memories of getting in trouble for being “rude” enough to cough or cover my face when someone’s tobacco set off my asthma. >:(
I hope you find a way out someday. I hope the whole *world* finds a way out someday.
It’s really not that bad. There’s the one shitty cultural element, but there are plenty of good things about it that I choose to be there for–I could leave if I so decided. It’s just that that’s tthe big negative in that space, and so if I’m going to be in that space I have to live with it in spite of it being frustrating.
I’m Canadian; but my Mum was British, and only just Post-War at that (WWII), and so I grew up with that very stiff-upper-lip, rigidly polite, upper middle class traditional British upbringing, so I know precisely what you mean when someone is making you uncomfortable but you can’t really say anything about it, ha ha.
Having said that, though, I do find that one can still tell when someone is uncomfortable (they become even more stiff and polite); the social cues are still very much there. But having said that, they tend to be pretty subtle, from a North American point of view, and so can be pretty easily overlooked if one isn’t used to dealing with them; and the culture (so far as I am aware) doesn’t really seem to have a way to escalate that conveying of discomfort without crossing into being unforgivably rude.
It’s a bit like dealing with someone else’s large, friendly, but over-enthusiastic puppy that keeps trying to jump up on you. It’s not malicious; but it is unwanted; but one doesn’t really feel one has the authority to enforce “Down!” and the puppy isn’t registering the more subtle “Yes, yes, you’re a very good boy; now, go over there,” cues. So all one can really do is to politely try to not be encouraging and hope that it will direct its attention elsewhere sooner rather than later.
Yeah, you’ve described it perfectly.
I suspect Lucy has a 180 degree problem than you do.
She’s the extravertiest-extravert in the whole comic. If I had to guess her “driving motives” (in a dramatic sense), it’s that she wants to:
1. be seen for who she truly is (which means lying or even passive duplicity or dishonesty would be anathemic to her) which makes her very open right off the mark. Also, she might be bad at picking up when people are lying to her, along with other social cues. While at the same time, she wants to…
2. be kind / avoid rejection [could be either], since ultra-honest people are often too blunt and hurt feelings, Lucy wants to avoid that by complimenting people anytime a genuine compliment pops into her head. She wants to cultivate a sense that she appreciates and doesn’t judge other people, so they might respond in the same way–appreciating her and not judging her.
In essence, she’s trying to treat others she wants to be treated. She is sensitive to being judged, rejected, and lied to (possibly people lying about liking her or being her friend), so she is determined to accept and honestly like every person.
She, uh, reminds me of a teen version of me (so, I might be projecting the “almost never lies / bad at picking up lying” bit), and the aggressive liking was definitely a defense mechanism for me. It’s the opposite of the “pre-emptive rejection,” but it comes from the same insecure place. How can they possibly dislike me if I like *them* SO MUCH?
It, gahhh, makes me cringe in retrospect. But, also, I’m pretty sympathetic because I’ve been there, you know?
That makes plenty of sense. She seems like she’s a good kid, and there are plenty of people who would very much appreciate a Lucy in their lives.
The trickiest thing about growing up is learning that the actual golden rule isn’t actually “treat others how you’d like to be treated” but rather “treat others how they’d like to be treated. This is tough coming from both the strong introvert and the strong extrovert ends of the spectrum, and it’s a big thing you figure out as a teenager or young adult. Honestly, a real friendship with Billie would probably be very helpful to Lucy in trying to learn it, if it doesn’t end up turning into a mess over the whole alcohol thing.
Yep ^_^
I mean, in truth, there are multiple rules, and it’s a judgement call every time they contradict. “Treat others how they want to be treated,” but also, “Set and hold your boundaries” and also “when two or more people want conflicting modes of treatment from you in the same context…uh, learn that as you go I guess?”
That last one reminded me of a college friend-group situation where one person really only ever wanted to socialize with one or two people at a time, and more were overwhelming. Another friend always wanted to be included and invited to everything, and felt left out if two or three group people hung out without her.
We didn’t solve that one super well. Basically instead of figuring out the underlying reason the one friend always wanted to be invited and trying to meet that underlying need, without making every hangout an all-group person party and overwhelming the shy friend, we just totally stopped hanging out with the needy friend altogether. Essentially the group picked one over the other.
Anyway. It’s hard. I feel you.
Last panel Lucy’s pose could not be more “slumber party / gabbing on the phone” if she tried. She is a bit more relaxed-looking once Billie told her to not just sit there silently.
That little biting of the lip in panel three, and the rather fixed smiling, is kind of breaking my heart. Lucy is kind of being incredibly hard to put up with, but it’s also very obvious that she’s starved for any kind of friendship, I suspect because of being a nerd. Billie’s said awful things about nerds and Malaya outright called her a loser; I’m going to lay some imaginary money that she’s very starved for friendship.
So she’s reaching out the only way she can imagine how, because being that isolated is seriously damaging. She’s definitely trying too hard, and the HERE LET ME DO THINGS FOR YOU feels a lot like she feels she might have made better friends (and again, she seems kind of lonely) with Malaya if she’d, like, done things for her. And she did leave when Malaya asked! It’s like Lucy feels like Billie will not like her unless she does things for Billie, which is kind of troubling. That’s incredibly sad.
She needs to back off, and needs a clue, and I feel really bad for Billie having to go through this. But I really, really sympathize with Lucy, in all that desperate attempt not to feel completely alone. We don’t know how her hallmates treat her, but rejection can be deeply wounding.
Heck yeah Lucy’s a Hufflepuff. ^_^
…Am I allowed to say that unironically in 2017? …Meh, I’m sure it’s fine.
The sorting tests people are mentioning in the comments are so obvious and easy to game, you’ll just end up in whatever house you want to be in.
Which I guess was the moral in the book, too.
I say with decent self-awareness, you’d know where you’d belong better than any test anyway, so I don’t put a lot of faith into them. I’m always a little disappointed when I ask someone who seems to be a Harry Potter fan what house they’re in and they’re like, “Well, the quiz I took said…”
Yeah, the Pottermore quiz put me Gryffindor somehow, which is probably the house I belong the least in. Everyone who knows me agrees.
I’m feeling very self conscious making so many comments, I usually comment very rarely.
For what it’s worth, I didn’t notice you were commenting a lot. And when I went back and read your comments, they seemed to fit well. If your brain is telling you everyone is looking at you for making so many comments, well, I’m a counterexample.
Thanks, I needed that.
I agree with you, and I’d like to note that our stance about the quiz is the most Ravenclaw answer possible.
I lack the Slytherin ambition to actually change the world like I want to, so instead I’ll find a quiet Ravenclaw corner to read all about how fucked up it is.
I personally find the quizzes more useful, though, in part because I don’t know myself well and have no idea where I’d rather be and because I can use the results of the quiz to work backward to see why I was put in that house( I’m far better at working backwards from a conclusion than coming to a unbiased conclusion with what I have)
I thought the quizzes were pretty clever. I mean if we left it up to people to decide 75% of the world would be Gryffindor with dragon patronuses.
I’m a Gryffindor which aligned with my own feelings on the house, but my patronus was an eye-opener. I got a sparrowhawk which on one level fits me pretty well but I’ve never been a big fan of birds so I probably wouldn’t pick it myself.
I also enjoyed the wand quiz.
Well, the point of Sorting is that it’s not about what qualities you have presently, it’s about the qualities you value. If you value a house enough to game the quiz, it’s probably a good indicator that you belong there. Also, the hat sometimes does requests.
Hence, “whatever house you want”
Yeah, the hat totally wanted to put Harry into Snakehouse, but Harry said no, and that’s all it took.
On the other hand, Neville wanted to be in Hufflepuff because he felt he didn’t live up to Gryffindor’s reputation, and the hat argued with him a good deal before putting him in Gryffindor, so it’s not as simple as ‘it’ll give you what you ask for’. Apparently the Sorting Hat’s never been wrong, so that’s gotta be some powerful magic.
The hat will never sort you into a house where you don’t fit, but ‘I don’t want to be there’ is counted toward not fitting, whereas ‘I don’t believe I’m that good’ doesn’t – since the Hat would see the potential, and that they do value the house virtue.
That’s a smart fuckin’ hat. Neville’s a goddamn legend, whether he thought so or not. If he were a Pokémon, he’d be good ol’ #129, no room for debate.
Pretty sure Dumbledore thought it had sorted wrong on occasion (like in canon he says “sometimes I think we sort too soon”). Not sure how you would define “wrong” anyway. Except a Ravenclaw who had no intelligence whatsoever but completely stupid people are pretty rare and I’m sure the hat would see them coming a mile off. The other houses don’t have such clearly defined traits.
That requires the hat to sort based on what you are and not what you value, like it does in canon. Case in point: Goyle and Crabbe are total lackeys, but they value ambition and tradition, so into Slytherin they went.
Friend of mine gamed Pottermore to get put in Ravenclaw…but I guess that’s Slytherins for you.
Nothing to do with today’s comic, but it’s so weird it sounds like it came out of a strip. I sometimes hang out with a woman who is Christian who is kinda on the pushy side. You see, I’m not and she often tries to “save my soul” which can frankly get annoying. But the latest one was a real head scratcher. Her and her husband showed me a video of them in church with him doing mime (face paint and all) choreographed to gospel music. Then they looked at me almost expecting… I don’t know. Magic? I just said that it must have taken a lot of work to do to which they tried to explain how it had “saved” someone in their church that the stuff hadn’t clicked with before. I said religion can be a beautiful thing and tried to drop it, but they kept on while looking disappointed like they had to explain it more… so I mentioned how one of the hand movements kinda looked like he was using an insulting Italian or French hand sign. XD
>Christian mime act
Doc, come on, I wanna go back in the machine! Please, Doc, it’s scary here!
i expected hufflepuff but was given ravenclaw by pottermore. *shrug*
That was when I immediately lost interest in Pottermore.
I totally missed it until just now, but in the third panel Lucy has the mouth crinkles that are idiomatic to Willis’s style. The first time we saw those crinkles, Walky had them and they indicated that he was crushing on Dorothy in a completely awkward way.
Is Lucy crushing on Billie?
I think she’s just excited about her new roommate and the opportunity to be total BFFs. Which I’m sure could lead to a crush, eventually.
I don’t think so.
I think that’s just a sign of how the silence is bothering her. She’s trying to be quiet since it seems that’s what her awesome new roomie wants and it’s killing her. See how it goes away the moment Billie starts talking again?
I think it’s just how Willis draws someone biting their lower lip. Why they are biting their lip, though, can vary. Uncertainty? Trying to not talk? Attracted to someone? Different people and different motivations.
Billie is hard to sort. She really has no ambitions, so Slytherin is out, nor is she particularly smart to be a Ravenclaw. Hufflepuffs and Gryffindor is all that’s left. Id have to go with Gryffindor, she stood her ground from day one with Ruth.
I disagree about Slytherin. She’s not someone who would generally be considered “ambitious,” but she is ambitious socially. Plus, there are other traits that I feel fit– resourceful, clever, determined. I feel those things describe her both now and in her previous life (most likely) as “head cheerleader, problem solver.”
Anyone who knows anything about the characters of Lucy and Billie won’t be surprised by today’s strip. Lucy is a comic book geek (indeed, Willis originally created her to be the face of happy, optimistic comic book geekdom). Billie on the other hand most certainly is not.
I’m getting a definite echo from these two of the relationship, such as it is, between Joyce and Sarah!
I will say one thing to Billie though: ‘Puffs make the best friends; they try harder!
I’m not on twitter, but regarding this tweet:
I long ago sorted all of my co-workers into Hogwart’s houses. Not that I’ve told them, of course. But I don’t think of it as being particularly worse than the Myers-Briggs clade of personality tests.
Silly Willis, acting like we haven’t already sorted all of them through multiple comment threads over several yea-…
…. oh, wait. That’s how he knows we’ll do it again.
Anyway, I really need to go to bed, but I’m currently trying to teach someone a bit of crisis intervention skills so they can help talk to someone who may be in crisis because of an internet disagreement, and this is all happening on Neopets. Life is so fucking weird.
Of course you are a Hufflepuff Lucy, of course you are.
I look forward to her meeting up with Dorothy.
“I’m a Hufflepuff.”
“I’m a Ravenclaw.”
“Hermione is the best.
“Sure is.”
Joyce: “I was not allowed to read Harry Potter because of…”
Dorothy: “Satan. Yes, yes. I know.”
It’d be easier to list what she COULD consume.
Chicken fingers and tacos, mostly.
Yes, this.
… Is Lucy going to kill Billie?
I laughed out loud, because I am terrible.
I’m also Hufflepuff! Hard work, loyalty and fair play. And particularly good finders.
Billie would be probably from Slytherin… or at least old Billie would.
Fun thing with Hogwarts houses. Whatever a hat picks for you at the age of eleven is yours for the rest of your life.
It fits PERFECTLY with the aristocratic wizarding world, but maaaan is it a horrible way to treat children.
[shrugs] It picks Houses based on certain personality qualities and potentials. It puts like-minded people in the same group so they don’t feel lonely. I’ve seen worse ways to treat kids at a school.
Putting like-minded people together and then fomenting rivalry with every other house is a terrible idea because you then just end up with everyone stagnating socially because the only people they interact meaningfully with are people who are similar to them. Like hey, maybe if you didn’t put all the children of blood-purist bullies together they’d be exposed to differing ideals and might actually have a chance of growing into decent human beings.
Good point though I think that it’s Exactly because of that, that the blood purist families would howl up to the Moon against that idea…
Things were probably less full of crap back in the days of the Founders.
Back in the days of the founders one of them literally wanted to murder every muggleborn child in the school and even took steps to enact this so probably not. Honestly the fact that Hogwarts has a house honoring a genocidal maniac and nobody bats an eye at it is a pretty grim condemnation of wizarding Britain as a society.
Yeah except you are forgetting to mention how wizards were persecuted by the Muggles and murdered. Like they say, it’s only paranoia when they are Not trying to get you. As monstrous as Slytherin’s plans were he had very good reasons to feel that way.
Yes, very good reasons to want to brutally murder children because those exist.
It’s only human unfortunately. It’s only human to hate all those who caused you pain, fear and suffering. And it’s only natural to want them to disappear. All of them. It’s not humane but in a world where your survival is at stake you don’t hold back. I’m sure that many who have been victims of bullying harbour some pretty dark thoughts about what they’d love to do to bullies.
Also I remember reading some stuff about muggle-born leading other muggles to wizards when they were sleeping or otherwise had their guard down. To Salazar they might have been just traitors in waiting.
Maybe it’s different in the British school system, but what I did in high school – including which clubs I belonged to – while hugely important to teenaged me at the time, ended up mattering very little later in life.
Then again, I do recognize that children and teens are the target audience for these books, which are written to their expectations – including the possibility, nay, the certainty of finding not only lifelong friends but true love during those 4-8 years… a span of time which, on the far side of 40, goes by with barely a nod and perhaps a fond reminisce.
(I imagine a future job interviewer idly noting one’s former house affiliation with the same polite almost-interest as commenting that they too used to be in the Scouts/Girl Guides, or 4H, or on the yearbook staff. And that’s it.)
In the potter books that’s called the “Slug club”
But that’s not how it’s portrayed with the adults in the books. They still know and care about everyone’s House.
Which makes a little bit of sense, given that they are magically sorted by personality.
There is also the issue that Wizard society is much, much smaller than the Muggle one and everyone knows everyone.
Not to mention that the really influential families all sit in Slytherin or have connections to those who were in it and reinforce the segregation.
And then there is the fact that the Only real Employer is the Ministry where everyone and their mother works.
I think it’s less “Scouts/Guides/4H/etc” and more the whole Jock/Nerd/Social Climber/Genuinely Nice Kid Who Doesn’t Stand Out Much personality cliques in North American schools.
Most adults I know remember exactly where they were in their high school’s social pecking order, and that place was a formative experience of their life, for good or ill. Furthermore, these shared experiences often form the basis of bonding or distance in adulthood: ex-Jocks bond over jockishness, ex-nerds bond over our persecution complexes (hi I totally was a bullied nerd and a lot of us totally do still have persecution complexes from it, me included), and so on. And they can also form the basis for adult animosity: a lot of ex-Jocks still have anti-intellectual leanings, a lot of ex-nerds still view those with hyper-macho or hyper-feminine personas with a reflexive suspicion, etc. Hell, a former coworker of mine, when she left, mentioned she was never able to warm up to me because I reminded her to much of the kids who made fun of her for being “dumb” in high school – for my part, I couldn’t warm up to her because she reminded me too much of the ringleader of the bullies who tried to bully me to death in school – all hyperfeminine fake laughter to seem approachable and fake-uncertainty in statements to not seem too much of a know-it-all. We tried to keep things professional and cordial, but in all honesty I always viewed her with suspicion she didn’t earn and she viewed me with resentment I didn’t deserve, and it colored all our interactions – all because of where we were in our high school pecking orders half a lifetime ago.
See, the whole jocks / nerds / preps thing was *way* too broad for my high school of, er, about 1500 students when I graduated.
Take jocks. What sport you played (and what gender you are) correlated a lot not only with race and class but also personal beliefs, attitudes, budding politics, and how friendly or unfriendly you are with other cliques.
So, for instance, there were three mainly female cliques that were comprised of and embraced bisexual and lesbian women: girl’s basketball team clique, girl’s softball clique, and uncool thespians / cosplayers clique (as opposed to cool thespians, who were quite attractive and were often the center or gossip and drama).
I was the only (closeted) lesbian in my clique, which was “Visual Art Students And Poets Who Make Short Films” [labeled “hippie clique” by others]. I really wanted to hang out with the other wlw in my school, but girl’s basketball team clique couldn’t be my scene because I was too white and kind of fragile, and I found loud events overwhemling; girl’s softball team clique disliked me because I was too vocally “liberal” and I just didn’t enjoy the same books / movies / shows they liked; and uncool thespians welcomed me with open arms, but it turned out deeply analytic fandom conversations are a “sometimes food” for me.
So, hippie clique it was. (To be fair to softball girls’ clique, many of them grew up to be much less judgemental post high school; and to be fair to basketball girl’s clique, I was frankly intimidated by their confidence and non-closeted lesbianism and had a massive crush on a girl who lived across the street from me and I was *way* weird and in denial about it).
It’s always a bit odd now, because often people assume I was in a nerdy clique in high school. If I went to a smaller school, I might’ve been, especially since “Hippie Clique” isn’t necessarily an option in a lot of schools. But when you mentioned having a persecution complex due to bullying, I think that was one thing being in hippie clique helped me avoid. Most other students didn’t notice hippie clique, positively or negatively, unless someone made a phenomenal painting and it was on display, or someone wanted to “debate” women not shaving and then realized that the only unshaved women in the school were the harmless hippies who wanted to legalize weed.
The lack of judgement from others (not being popular enough for others to want to take down a peg; not being obviously uncool enough to be an easy target of mockery) meant I actually emerged from high school with far more confidence than a lot of my friends now. And this is probably why, even though I love a lot of geek culture, I have a hard time labeling myself as a geek or nerd. I don’t have that mindset.
I don’t think I’d ever put all that together before.
That’s…..actually pretty much in line with how education works in Europe. In Germany they basically decide at age 11/12 whether or not you get to go to college.
*hugs Swedish school system hard*
This is a blatant lie. Maybe that’s how the education system works in GERMANY, but that’s your problem, and the way to fix it is the way to fix most everything – vote better.
I don’t actually live in Germany, but we are German immigrants with family back there so I know how it works. After four years of elementary school depending on your performance you get sorted into either Hauptschule, (worst) Realschule, (middle) or Gymnasium (top). Traditionally, Realschule existed to prepare people for the trades and Gymnasium was for the college bound, but it’s not that rigid anymore and if you do well in Realschule you can still go to college. However, if you get sorted into Hauptschule you can basically forget about college in Germany.
Regardless, Germany =/= Europe. There were a couple of tiffs about it, too.
Wait, what?
What the fuck continent is it then?
I meant that Germany isn’t Europe, not that it isn’t IN Europe.
Ah, okay. I was so confused. XD Thanks!
I’m American. I saw back before the internet and have taken it as fairly representative how public* school reinforced and revealed the predeterminedness of British caste systems which still echo today, and I’m sure Rowling was doing something like this.
The idea of Harry Potter being a secret aristocrat who would discover the person he was born to be also reminds me of Kind Hearts and Coronets, where a young man, whose mother married a man beneath her station, tries to slaughter his way thru eight successors to inherit the Dukedom. Funny as hell, but still comes from a real place.
Now I just want to see if someone has done a Ripping Yarns-style Harry Potter.
(*British “public” is like American “boarding” or “prep” school.)
Ugh. I did not close my tag; sorry.
Supposed to be,
I saw the Ripping Yarns episode “Tomkinson’s Schooldays…”
I’m Ravenclaw, according to Pottermore
Would Dina be in Ravenclaw or Griffindor?
OF COURSE SHE IS a Hufflepuff
Jocelyne is a Ravenclaw btw.
As for me, I have no idea what house I’d be in because I feel like I could do okay in any of them, but none of them would be a particularly good fit either. Maybe Hufflepuff, since they take in anyone. But, see, I’m not especially loyal or hard-working or friendly. Plus I have a strong rebellious streak, which might point to the daring of Gryffindor or the indivualism of Ravenclaw. But I’m also quite cowardly, anxious, and heavy on self-preservation (as is Jocelyne on this last one! I could see her being a Slytherin actually). It really depends on the situation. And I’m also rather slow and not witty at all. Slytherin? I’m not ambitious; I’m not resourceful…
You can see why I’m hesitant to put myself in any one house.
Ah, but who gets sorted into Sparklypoo?
Badger pride!!!
“You know, I sometimes think we sort too soon.”
I’d probably be Hufflepuff. The Sorting Hat would ask me if I wanted to be in Ravenclaw, and I’d freak out that they’d all be smarter than me and back out, because that’s how I roll.
I usually get sorted as either Ravenclaw or Slytherin, depending on how I’m feeling that day. XD
I exclusively get Ravenclaw whenever I do quizzes and things. Well /excuse/ me for being a maths nerd
Lucy is one of those socially awkward extroverted people who doesn’t really know how to Do Friends but wants to, and is overcompensating as a result.
I’d bet she was one of those extroverted-by-nature kids who’s socially isolated and/or bullied in middle- and high school because her interests don’t really jive well with the rest of school, and who bought the “UNIVERSITY IS THE BEST YEARS OF YOUR LIFE AND YOU WILL MAKE THE BEST FRIENDS EVER WITH YOUR ROOMMATE” schtick hook, line and sinker from parents or society. In reality, she’d be way better off aiming for genial cohabitation with the roommate and getting her companionship at a club for her interests.
She wants friends and wants to be a good friend, but she doesn’t really know how to friend or how to boundary. Which is a shame.
(If she were a bit more charismatic, I’d be suspicious of her – overly friendly naturally charismatic people tend to be the kind of people who want something and drop you as soon as they got what they wanted – but she’s just awkward enough I think her hail-fellow-well-met routine is genuine).
As a note: since everyone always asks who is which house… I think I’m Ravenclaw primary with either Gryffindor or Slytherin secondary. I don’t think I’m honorable enough for Gryffindor (though I totally will fight you over stuff I care about) secondary or quite devious enough for Slythein secondary, but it’s one or the other. Annnnd Hufflepuff is dead last for me, mainly because I am and have always been rather selfish by nature. Hufflepuff is for genuinely nice people, and I’m not a genuinely nice person. I value being polite to others and respecting them, but let’s be real I don’t donate to the food bank out of the goodness of my heart, I donate to them because I needed it when I was in school and it’s my way of repaying a perceived debt. I don’t donate blood out of the goodness of my heart either – I was a preemie and needed like thirty-odd blood products before I came home from hospital. And more blood products when I had my tonsils out and had complications from it. Soooo yeah I would like there to be blood in the bank if I ever get hit by a bus because the blood bank has already saved my life many times over – it only makes sense for me to donate.
… y’know. Scratch “maybe Gryffindor secondary.” I’m totally Slytherin secondary. My way of thinking is all cost-benefit analyses and “Do I want this?” and “How does [organization I support] existing benefit me or things I care about?” But I’m a scientist and value my intellectual honesty way more than any personal benefit, so Ravenclaw primary.
On that note: I seriously wish Rowling had included a few Good Slytherins among the kids in her books rather than having all the Slytherin kids being bullying assholes. Cunning and ruthlessness are personality traits that are often not valued in our society – but those traits can also be used for good, and I would’ve liked to see some nuance on that point. Plus, as a person with a lot of Slytherin traits to me – the stereotypical Slytherin possessiveness extends to people, as in if you screw with my people, I screw with you.
Haven’t read the Cursed Child yet but scuttlebutt is that it explores some of the more redeeming qualities of the Slytherin house, which is good to hear about.
Part of the problem with the Houses is that all the official qualities are essentially informed characteristics. We’re told what the values of the Houses are and that there are good and bad people in all of them, but the characters we see don’t actually reflect that.
Not just in Slytherin, but throughout, though we don’t really get to know enough Ravenclaws or Hufflepuffs to judge.
One interesting part is that for both Ravenclaw and Slytherin, the members of their houses that most correspond to the stereotype are the odd ones out.
Ravenclaw – Luna Lovegood – eccentric oddball, the very image of a airhead intellectual. But in her own house she is an outcast, compared to much less extreme Ravenclaws like Cho Chang or Marietta Edgecombe.
Slytherin – Tom Riddle. Muggle-raised, charismatic, brilliant non-name. The very face of ambition… but most of the other slytherins we see are “sons of gentlemen” riding the cushy train to a high level job, like class clown Draco or wanna-be-bullies Crabbe and Goyle.
In Hufflepuff, however, Cedric Diggory seems like the allround great chap you except to champion the house of badgers.
Have you read Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality? By Eliezer Yudkowsky of LessWrong. It’s a metafictional fanfiction that explores scientific concepts in the wizarding world and the nuances of Slytherin, among other things. I recommend it to any Harry Potter fan who is interested in metafictional commentary or ‘criticism’ of the original books.
Or you could just look it up and try it out for yourself! I myself found out about it from a commenter here years ago.
A warning to those who are not scientifically-inclined: Some of the science stuff is a bit long and convoluted, so I kind of skip parts of that.
I have to disagree. I thought it was lousy. Harry acts pretty much nothing like Harry (I don’t care if it’s an AU, they have to be somewhat recognizable), or even an 11 year old for that matter. Not to mention it gets really obnoxious and preachy. Also, the guy uses the Stanford Prison Experiment at face value and he’s terrible at physics. He throws in a lot of scientific buzzwords without really understanding the concepts. Draco’s somehow written even worse )making a joke about rape) and we have yet another ‘abused Draco’ fic (which, c’mon guys, that’s the one POSITIVE quality the Malfoys have – they genuinely love each other). And the author completely missed the point of Ron – Ron signifies emotion and the every man between himself, Harry, and Hermione. That sounds like a great chance for him to develop right? Nah, Harry basically doesn’t talk to him (though, in Ron’s defence, Harry’s an asshole who hangs out with Malfoy, so I wouldn’t talk to him either). You betcher ass Hermione is there though – the author likes Hermione. Even though Draco would treat her like garbage.
If you enjoyed it, that’s great, but those were my problems with it.
Yeah, I didn’t even get that far with it, though I read a lot of lousy HP fanfiction for awhile. Way too much of an author tract for me.
According to the author, it ‘gets good’ in chapter 5 but if you don’t like it by chapter 10 you should give up. I couldn’t even make it that far.
I just saw this. So Draco’s rape joke and abuse are from very early chapters, and I either missed them or I just forgot.
No worries, it happens!
I loved HPMOR. It takes a few plotholes in HP and spins them into a logically-consistent wider universe. Harry acts very different, but there are strong Plot Reasons for that. Draco is callous, but not evil (Yeah, the rape joke made me uncomfortable, but it’s supposed to. Draco’s messed up). I don’t recall that Draco was abused in this story. His love for his father is a recurring plot point (not that those two are exclusive).
Obnoxious and preachy, though? You got me there. It’s definitely a pro-hard science propaganda piece. It gets a little ham-fisted at that, and it sacrifices some of the original characters for the story.
But I love it because it explains wizarding genetics, why Potions is different from Transfiguration is different from Charms, what happens if you attach a Newtonian-physics-following rocket to an Aristotelian-physics-following broomstick, why Slytherins in Hogwarts are all blood purists even though the deciding quality should be ambition, where the Marauder’s Map came from, and a million other things. And I like the strict Game Theory rules that the clever Slytherins follow (similar to Light and L in DEATHNOTE). I came out with a more deeply-realized sense of the wizarding universe.
Obviously we treat it very differently. I don’t mind Harry being completely different from the original. He’s the author’s self-insert to explore science and metafiction stuff. That seemed to be the author’s main goal, at least at first, so I don’t mind the alterations made in order to serve the author’s original purpose. Also I guess I don’t really mind the bad writing, although I do notice it sometimes. Some things are really weird, like the stuff about Draco’s mom, but I just roll with it. I don’t remember Draco’s rape joke or his abuse backstory…perhaps because I haven’t read up to that part yet. I think I’m on Chapter 80 or around that.
The science stuff often goes over my head, actually; I don’t pay too much attention to it. (I admit I only mentioned it in my original comment to catch the attention of those who ARE scientifically-inclined.) However I enjoyed that Harry taught Draco about genetics, which is a simple enough topic for me, to cause doubt in Draco’s blood purism.
Mainly I enjoy HPMoR for Draco/Slytherin redemption, good humorous characters/scenes (ie. Daphne and her friends, Neville), funny and self-aware use of tropes, the nuances of Slytherin house, and various other things.
And, um, honestly I don’t like Ron. I found him annoying in the original books. I could relate to Harry’s emotion and angst though, and also to certain traits of his in HPMoR. So yeah, I don’t like Ron; I kind of like Harry; I’m neutral on Draco. And Hermione – I don’t like how the author treats her as utterly good, pure, moral. At least so far as I’ve read. Even in Philosopher’s Stone she breaks the rules a bit. I guess she serves as a counterpart to Harry and his dark side, but to me it’s not interesting. At first I also quite liked McGonagall, but then she got wayyyy too caring and kind. Similar to Hermione.
And those are my opinions. I spent too much time on this.
And all of that is perfectly fine. Everybody’s mileage varies. I, personally, don’t like Draco redemption stories because they often write him as a better person than he actually is. And when it comes to AUs, my thinking is either keep the characters personalities as close as possible, only changing what’s needed to fit the new circumstances or keep the circumstances as close as possible and only change what’s affected by the new personality. Otherwise you may as well just write original fiction. And it’s fine not to like Ron, but Ron The Death Eater (making a character worse than they are or ditching their importance to someone else because you don’t like them) is where I, personally, draw the line.
I haven’t read as far as Ron being a Death Eater, but that is kind of weird. I agree with you on that at least.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RonTheDeathEater
🙂
Wait is ‘Death Eater’ supposed to be a metaphor? Ahh, okay.
Yeah, sorry, it’s a slang term for what that particular cliche is called.
I forgot to mention – the mystery that is Professor Quirrel is a big reason I read it. I am CERTAIN there will be satisfying answers revealed about him. I will be very disappointed in the whole thing if his story turns out to be anti-climactic.
“He’s the author’s self-insert to explore science and metafiction stuff.”
And that’s pretty much why I couldn’t get very far into it. The main character wasn’t actually a character. He was a mouthpiece for the author to lecture me.
yup. if you’re interested in the content of the lecture, it’s quite entertaining. otherwise, yeah, it’s probably just an annoying lecture with a side of Draco In Leather Pants.
“the author likes Hermione”
yeah, likes her so much he (rot13) fghssrq ure va gur sevqtr.
I still liked the story, but I was sad about that. so then I went and found a good Hermione-centric story… but damnit, I don’t have a bookmark and google isn’t showing it any more, wtf :/
it’s not in any of my fanfiction.net stuff either 🙁 I think the story might be really lost, or buried under similarly-named garbage.
OTOH, I did stumble on one I haven’t read yet: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/9950232/3/Hermione-Granger-and-the-Perfectly-Reasonable-Explanation
I mean how many good people do you expect to match up with the ideals of a bigot who wanted to ethnically cleanse the school?
Me (paraphrased): I wish Rowling hadn’t demonized cunning and ambition so much, as those traits are morally neutral and can be used for good as well as evil, our current society’s beliefs on that matter notwithstanding.
You (paraphrased): Yeah well the founder of the house was a genocidal arse so what do you expect?
Me: 😐
… Like, way to both completely miss the point of what I was complaining about and illustrate it perfectly in a single sentence.
By which I mean: Slytherins are sorted on the basis of personality traits and whether they value those personality traits in themselves. Rowling had a great setup to explore the need to examine the beliefs you were raised with in a skeptical and thoughtful manner with the Slytherins – cuz yeah it totally makes sense that ambitious people born into a position of privilege will be more likely to support the system that sets them up as privileged – see also why a lot of cis people passively support anti-trans bigotry, white people passively support racism, men passively support sexism, and so on. Death Eaters being more common among pure-blooded Slytherins makes sense, and I don’t have a problem with that.
What I have a problem with is that none of the Slytherin characters showed any more backbone whatsoever. Not. A. One.
Cuz, see ambitious people can and sometimes do have a strong moral center. They can and do fight against injustice, often at significant cost to their ambitions. In Canada, Justin Trudeau’s father, Pierre Eliot Trudeau, was undoubtably an extremely ambitious man. He wanted and craved power. He sought it out. He started a forty-year-long trend of collecting power to the Prime Minister’s Office here in Canada. And yet, he decriminalized homosexuality in the 1960s. He got death threats, suffered huge political costs, and to this day is hated by the Conservative wing of the Canadian public. He made the decision to support decriminalization knowing fully well it could cost him all of his ambitions because he firmly believed that the state has no place in the bedrooms of a nation. More recently: Consider Elizabeth Warren. A lot of people think she could end up being the first woman US president. She’s undoubtably highly ambitious, and has made all the big career moves one would expect of someone seeking out an eventual presidential nomination. And, knowing fully well that swing voters don’t tend to take kindly to unapologetic support for abortion, she’s led the charge on filibusters and other political tactics to try to frustrate anti-abortion legislation.
My point is even very ambitious people will take a hit to their ambitions for their principles at times. And Rowling could have explored that and given the kids who are ambitious a sense that they’re not destined to be morally-deficient social climbers without any spine to speak of. But she didn’t. She had a chance to, and she didn’t. On purpose. Very pointedly, she symbolized that there is nothing redeeming about being cunning and ambitious.
Regulus Black’s storyline wasn’t good enough. An actual character who the main characters got to know, and maybe never like because Harry has a bias against Slytherin and all but grew to respect over time (without being a petty tyrant like Snape because seriously fuck Rowling’s “he had a sad boner so it’s all okay” reasoning with Snape the dude was a bully who chose, as a grown-ass adult, to violate the core tenant of what it is to be a teacher and target children to be the victims of his bullying – Draco for his part doesn’t count because he basically spent the entire last book doing whatever he thought would let himself survive…).
And she could have avoided sending that message to ambitious kids very easily. Two possibilities: One, have Regulus appear on screen. Have him personified as a real human character with flaws but also a strong commitment to justice. Or two, add a Dorothy type to Slytherin the story: Someone who is incredibly ambitious and aiming for the biggest job in the nation, but who also is human and has principles they’re willing to stand for.
on your last point:
Yeah, I hated that in the final book, every Slytherin – to a one – got up and walked out. Not a single one had any (visible show of) conscience or, for that matter, saw potential personal advantage to be gained. All those half-hearted claims that not all Slytherin are completely terrible, right out the window. When the time comes, they’re House Evil, in lockstep.
… to my mind, it’s bad/lazy storytelling. Way to paint everyone in black and white (and green), JKR. 😛
and yet harry’s abusive foster parents got the “but faaaaaaamily” treatment. :/ that’s what bothered *me* the most.
Harry’s parents getting, but faaaaaamily was bullshit. I would’ve liked Dudley apologizing at some later date and exploring how the Golden Child is often manipulated to enact the more explicit abuse against the Problem Child that the parents know they can’t get away with – cuz that is a real thing and I do think Rowling was trying to hint that Dudley had started to realized how screwed up their family situation was. But “but faaaaamily” made me see red.
Also yeah: House Evil in lockstep was what stuck with me. Not one of them was a modern Regulus? None? Really?
And Snape got the “But saaad boooner!” line, like that excuses stalking, terrorizing children and being a bigot. His sad boner made him become a double agent after his own bigotry drove the girl he liked away and his own pettiness saw him fall in line with genocidal assholes and then take part in the plan that got her killed. Like, really?
I think the key to Hogwarts Houses is not what qualities you possess but rather which qualities you value most. That being said, I’d say:
Gryffindor: Dorothy, Roz, Amber/Amazigirl, Rachel, Sal, Marcie.
Slytherin: Billie, Mary, Mike, Galasso, Malaya
Ravenclaw: Ethan, Sarah, Dina, Jacob, Raidah, Jason
Hufflepuff : Lucy, Joyce, Walky, Danny, Becky
I’m not sure where to put Joe and Ruth.
I agree with most of these, but I’d place Ethan in Hufflepuff and Dorothy in Ravenclaw.
Agreed. Dorothy in Ravenclaw and Ethan in Hufflepuff. The rest as Nakams says.
Really? I’d put Dorothy in Slytherin. Ambition is her schtick.
I could see Ethan in Hufflepuff. The reason I place him in Ravenclaw is because his nerdy side is very argumentative. He cares a lot about his knowledge of trivia and winning arguments online.
As for Dorothy, check out my other comment for my reasons for placing her in Gryffindor.
I persist and claim Dorothy for Gryffindor. Yes, she studies a lot, but so does Hermione. Yes, she’s ambitious, but so was Percy Weasley. Dorothy, while ambitious and studious, really cares about doing the right thing and having the courage of her convictions. She means to follow her ambitions, but she allows many things to go first. She keeps Amber’s secrets rather than expose them, she watches cartoons with Walky and helps him with his math, she reveals she would have stepped down and let Roz be RA if she’d known her actual reasons for wanting to move. She demonstrates time and again that she values “doing the right thing” more than her studies or ambitions
I persist and claim Dorothy for Gryffindor. Yes, she studies a lot, but so does Hermione. Yes, she’s ambitious, but so was Percy Weasley. Dorothy, while ambitious and studious, really cares about doing the right thing and having the courage of her convictions. She means to follow her ambitions, but she allows many things to go first. She keeps Amber’s secrets rather than expose them, she watches cartoons with Walky and helps him with his math, she reveals she would have stepped down and let Roz be RA if she’d known her actual reasons for wanting to move. She demonstrates time and again that she values “doing the right thing” more than her studies or ambitions.
ME TOO, LUCY!
Though I’m way less extroverted so it mostly manifests as helping people who ask or seem obviously in need of it, and trying to be fair to people.
Oh she is just too cute. She’s trying so hard to make Billie feel welcome.
She’s coming off way too strong and kinda creepy but gosh darnit she’s adorable!
“Better to be thought the fool than to speak and remove all doubt”
Ravenclaw or die.
Moaning Myrtle begs to differ. You CAN have both.
Shit you’re right.
Since everyone’s doing this, I’m apparently Ravenclaw.
I’m a Hufflepuff too! (Ravenclaw was a close second.)
Also I’m gonna say Billie’s a hatstall between Slytherin and Gryffindor.
I am a Durmstrang. Fight me.
I’m an American. We don’t do houses.
Apparently you do.
Yes you do…if you’re a Wizard, anyway. (I got Puckwudgie, FTR.)
*looks it up*
“Mountains.” In Massachusetts. That’s cute. (I note that most of the alternate names in the Wikipedia article just use “hills” – more accurate, IMO.)
And, we’re still doing that whole “one school for the entire United States” thing, huh?
Gotta love everyone on that side of the pond who just can’t seem to grasp how big this country is.
“In Europe they think a hundred miles is a long way. In America they think a hundred years is a long time.”
They can teleport so size doesn’t really matter.
Not just a matter of land area.
The United Kingdom has a (Muggle) population of 65 million.
The United States has a population five times that.
Even if we cut that ratio in half, and say that most magical families and bloodlines stayed in Europe, and the US doesn’t have enough of its own to entirely make up the difference… that’s still going to be one very large or very crowded school.
Basically, we have roughly the size and population of all of Europe.
How many schools do they have?
(rhetorical question, though I’m sure it’s documented :p)
And, lest anyone think I’m engaging in pure nationalist chest-beating here:
Take it to the logical next level, and consider how many magical academies must be hidden in the hinterlands of the Middle Kingdom (i.e., China).
And how old they are.
You think the Ministry of Magic is a thing?
Those are the people who invented bureaucracy, and the system of civil service schools to feed it, back when we were still painting ourselves blue.
*facepalm*
the Alexandra Quick books have enough schools for some magical shopkeeper to ask which she’s going to.
unfortunately there hasn’t been a new book in years. they’re really good books, though. my only disappointment is there’s no mention of how witches deal with menstruation, only birth control. 🙂
No, there’s at least one other school in America. I still don’t know to link in the comments, but I think it’s called the Salem’s Witch Institute.
oh, so two schools, then.
located less than a hundred miles from each other (see Agemegos above).
*facepalm*
give me strength.
Hogwarts is a small kingdom so I don’t think space is an issue.
I did say “at least one other school” so there’s probably more than two.
Look on the bright side, though! It’s still better than what we’ve got in South America. Our only representation so far has been a stray mention of a Brazilian wizard who one of the Weasley brothers was pen-pals with, and only one school that apparently takes in every single South American wizard (because who cares about the language barriers, right?).
Gryffindor: Joyce, Amber, Becky, Sal, Marcie, Malaya, Robin
Hufflepuff: Danny, Ethan, Leslie
Ravenclaw: Walky, Dorothy, Sarah, Dina, Joe, Carla
Slytherin: Billie, Mike, Roz, Jacob, Raidah
Oddly enough hardest for me was Mike.
Mike was hardest for your mom.
BuzzFeed Hat sorts me as definitely Ravenclaw.
With a side of Hufflepuff.
See you in the Library.
Hugs!
I’m a Hufflepuff toooooo <3
Anyone who isn’t a Slitheryn is a filthy mugblood, who needs to be purged.
“Hufflepuff”? Is that part of the Young Kingdoms?
my house is “Detention”
Billie belongs in House Elf
Hufflepuff for Life!
Every day I’m Huffelin…
I just realized that Billy doesn’t have the high rise bed in the new room.
I’m really loving the hover text 😛