They’re pretty holier-than-thou, in my limited experience, but they’re not quite at that level of rude with their self-righteousness, nor are they nearly as cult-ish.
Well, near as I can tell, Westboro Baptist is basically a family scam to make money by goading people to attack them and then suing. It barely even qualifies as cult, much less actually religion.
No, the WBC is totally a cult. I don’t have the links to hand, but it’s worth reading over some of the ex-members accounts of their time in the church. It’s a really awful environment.
Ye, I live close enough to them that I’ve seen more than a few of their protests in person. Which is usually about 5 kids of toddler to elementary school age being ordered to stand outside holding obscenely hateful signs they probably can’t read, while the parents sit in a nice, safe, climate-controlled SUV. It’s so scummy.
They’re a very “Stop having fun” sect of Baptism, in my experience. (They have a little niche in my area) Basically, if it’s fun, it’s a sin, and they will not hesitate to condemn. Loudly. And at length. They get off on it, I swear.
Ah yes, a congregation of people who find nothing more fun than experiencing schadenfreude, criticizing others, and feeling superior to people who know how to have fun that isn’t derived from hatred and fear.
Ah. So the type of church Mary obviously grew up in.
….Seriously. I’ve long thought that she must’ve been in one of the “having fun is a sin” denominations. Most places are now all about “you can have fun with Jesus.” There’s a reason that there was a ton of “extreme sports” stuff in the teens programming on Christian TV.
My experience with Baptists is that they have a pretty hard line on what they believe, and what they believe doesn’t include everything that’s talked about in the Bible. Spiritual gifts, tongues, DANCING, etc. Granted I could understand not wanting to encourage belief in spiritual gifts, since those sorta cross into X-Men abilities.
My aunt, uncle, and cousin went to a Faith Baptist church for years. My mother dragged me and my siblings to a “regular” Baptist church. Our church was the most white-bread, outwardly benign ’90s Protestant church you can imagine. Theirs forbade dancing and all forms of alcohol and had a fire-and-brimstone preacher. The church also ran a K-8 school, and a boy and a girl who were a year ahead of my cousin were expelled in eighth grade after they were caught holding hands. The aforementioned preacher told everyone that they were possessed by demons. I went to several of their services after Saturday night sleepovers with my cousin, and it became all too clear why she seemed to view expressions of faith as a competition.
Our old church is now in a new building and I’m told that the worship style has been completely changed. No more traditional hymns mixed in with the contemporary Christian music, a band with drums and guitars instead of a guy with a piano or organ, more entertaining/charismatic preaching, etc. In other words, a lot more like Joyce’s church seems to be. I have a hard time imagining that their church could have changed much at all.
Heck, my Catholic church now has an evening mass with drums, guitars, and contemporary Christian music. The Catholic church over on Large State University campus even has liturgical dancers for special occasions. We’re not the total sticks in the mud we used to be anymore.
Quarter refers to housing for military personnel in this idiom. Essentially taking a no quarter given stance means giving no housing to those you disagree with or not letting them into your house. It can also mean not negotiating or not taking prisoners.
That *is* called quartering, as in quartering troops, but that’s not what “no quarter given” means.
“Give no quarter” means that you show no mercy. Surrender is not accepted, prisoners are not taken, everybody dies. In a non-violent setting, it would translate into “never give an inch.” Hank’s saying that he never yielded on his principles, no matter how inconvenient it was. Housing military personnel has nothing to do with it.
Working on a head-canon: child-Jordan adorably dancing in the aisle to a catchy prayer, not understanding the vitriol thrown at him, Browns get thrown out?
i could really get into child jordan dancing in the aisles during worship and getting himself kicked out like “aren’t i supposed to dance to the joy of the lord mom??”
Arcade games now don’t bother with coins or tokens. You have to buy a souvenir card that is loaded with quasi-credit and swipe that on the game machine.
I’ve been to an arcade or two where they don’t even work on credits anymore, you buy a block of time to basically get “free” play in the arcade, it’s awesome, though expensive, unless you and a friend or two share the card.
Well, their business model kinda died as video games moved more and more to home systems like consoles and PC. Like anything else in business, when your main source of income dries up you adapt or die. There isn’t yet a really sustainable replacement for the old model common until the mid-90s that has wide acceptance. Well, except for the touch screen games you’ll find in most bars they seem to have the same pricing regardless of vendor.
I have every single arcade game I enjoyed as a kid, and a few I never even heard of, on my computer right now. If you (or I) told teenaged me about MAME, his head would have asploded.
While they do meet many definitions of a cult, even WBC doesn’t quite meet the definition you seem to be implying. They are just one of the best living examples of the kind of thing that hardcore closed-minded extremist fundamentalism can lead to.
I filked that filk a few years ago. Sung from the point of view of a “compassionate conservative”…
Minimum wage hike? No Quarter!
Fair housing? No Quarters!
Hiring decisions? No Quota!
Class warfare? …and though I cannot meet your eyes, I’ve just one thing to say: NO QUARTER!
Only the players worth their salt are. The others are Lawful Stupid. And to a comment beneath me, what ruleset got rid of that option, `cause I think I wanna avoid it.
In general, alignment restrictions are being pretty pointedly ignored now. It’s not like 3.5 kept paladins as purely lawful good, either. Paladins of Freedom, Tyranny, and Slaughter were added in that edition, and later editions just decided to make that a choice a paladin could make from go.
Agreed. Y’know, this is why I’d love for her to have her Walkyverse self’s powers but turned up to eleven. I could really see her as a Superman-like figure; trying to be the perfect paragon and an exemplar of doing the right thing no matter what in a world that neither understands nor really deserves it. All the while, her Batman expy (Sal, of course) mutters stuff from behind her mask that makes her sound like Rorscharch from ‘Watchmen’.
Also this is a particularly common error since we’ve had a generation or two of teachers drilling out “x and me” without clarifying WHY so people don’t know that no, sometimes it is “x and me.” So really this is one of the most important errors to keep in, for accuracy.
I say “me and your mom” simply because it flows better off my tongue than “your mom and me”, and “your mom and I” as the object of a sentence is incorrect.
Because honestly, I’ve never heard a compelling reason for the third-second-first rule of grammatical person in lists. Bring it on, prescriptivists.
Actually I don’t remember that 3rd person needs to come before second, but the way it was explained to me is that first person always came last in lists simply because of humility. We are supposed to be humble and modest, so we are supposed to put others before ourselves. It seems to be a grammatical quirk that stems from religious perspectives and “how to be a good person.”
It actually has to do with basic grammar association. (you) is always closest to the (action), because you’re speaking from your own perspective. That’s why the ‘remove the other person’ rule works- they’re the supporting addition to your personalized point.
Rather, if the other person’s pronoun was closest, you’d be indicating your point was expressed from their perspective, and you were only going along with it.
There might be a bit more to it than that, it’s been a while; In any case- no, not religiously based, just a consistent element of how sentence structure works.
In any case, hard grammar rules aside, as I noted above, the intent changes when you swap the pronouns, so best to keep that in mind.
akshully not sure about it in this context. ‘me’ matches the case of the sentence if ‘your mother and’ were omitted- ‘taken me to task’. I’m not super sure, but I think is the case agreement that’s important. So it’s ‘your mother and I think’, but ‘taken your mother and me to task’
Nonononono. It’s the role that the pronouns and nouns play relative to their verb that’s important. In the case of “your mother and I”, those people are doing the thinking, but in the case of “taken your mother and me to task”, mother and me are not doing the taking but are instead being taken by someone else.
…..
… phew. I got through all of that without letting on that I don’t know whether it’s still called the “subject” if it’s in a clause rather than the root of the sentence.
For example, “you overheard me and your mother” from the comic two days ago is right. RIGHT, I tell you! Exorcise the ghost of your English teacher and *think* about it.
I noticed this too and it grated. (Didn’t notice the quarter/quarters thing as I’d never heard that idiom before in the first place. I’m not a native speaker.)
I want some of that, too. People who’re willing to walk all over people while being self-righteous sure seem to sleep pretty well. As far as I can tell the ‘sleep of the just’ is way more restless and worried than it’s made out to be.
It’s actually the name of several distinct groups. There’s also the Church of Christ, etc. Some of the strongly reformist Protestant (but don’t call them that, they hate it) churches believe that those are the only names you can call a church. They also do things like split up over the question of whether or not God likes to hear musical instruments.
Presbyterian just means they don’t have bishops, so decisions about the church are made by councils (making them one of the earlier areas of democracy). There’s no need for presbyterians to hold any particular interpretations of christianity, but all puritans are (or used to be, anyway) presbyterian.
That holds true on a technical level, but when used as the name of a denomination, in the US at least, it implies Calvinist churches with local governance by a council of elders within each church and wider governance within a body to which each church sends one or more of said elders.
In the walkyverse there was a book that Joe took an…interest in when he visited Joyce’s parents’ house. He took it with him and naturally Hank couldn’t locate it later
Nothing is stated explicitly, but the fact that Joe took an interest in it and that Joyce refused to listen to anything he had to say about it during their trip back to Semme implies that this is the case
It’s probably the best book of the HP series true. Though I’m also one of those folks for whom Order of the Phoenix is her 2nd favourite (never got complaints about Harry in Book 5 being angry/a bit too dicky when you know, he’s basically at the end of his rope after watching Cedric die and then Sirius dies- like honestly he’s more of an unlikeable dick cheese in Book 6 to me but even that’s p understandable to me too given well… Sirius (I honestly think he’s subconsciously emulating teen!Sirius and his dad as a teen to cope with all the crap in his life, which is a lot- it’s just a problem that the books never see it as a problem), even if the prose is p awful in that book and the romance unintentionally hilarious and bad or uncomfortable in some cases).
(Still disappointed at Deathly Hallows though to this day, what a snore fest- kind of laughing really hard at the Cursed Child spoilers though- it sounds bad but it at least doesn’t sound boring like DH was even if I think A Very Potter Musical is probably better.).
(This has been a fangirl rant).
(Has anyone else seen the spoilers of the play? Or the play itself? I hear the effects and actors are good even if the… story isn’t. Though honestly that makes me want to see it even more.)
For the life of me, up until a few years ago, I thought the quote really WAS “blessed art the cheesemakers”, my logic being that cheese stored and aged well and could get you through a famine or hardship, so those with the talent to make cheese were to be blessed.
The world is full of people so sure and unsure of themselves all trying to find happiness, and joy, and help others do the same. When people see others doing what they think will hurt them, why wouldn’t they try to stop them? To live in the world is accept that you can’t help everyone, to accept that you will, not might, be wrong. And you will never know when you’re right until it’s too late, and it might not have been correct for the reasons you thought.
Principles lead to action. To helping. But I question if they can ever make someone happy.
Amber stuff is emotionally hard for me to, but it’s been in a good way. It’s real to me, and I like that we’re getting a story about an abuse victim with a mental health disorder coping extremely poorly with her trauma, and instead of the message being “Amber needs to learn not to be shit”, it’s that she’s a good person who needs help, and that Amber needs to realize she needs that help, and that there are people in her life who want to help her.
I am pretty confident that we’re gearing up for the endgame of that, though. She’s pushed Danny away, Amazi-Girl has started making active decisions for both alters and is outright referring to herself as a separate identity, Dina seems to be cognizant of Amber’s DID, and now the police are after her.
I connect with this series the most when it punches me in the gut.
Amber’s is super hard. I feel like it’s because it’s a story about someone gradually getting worse, instead of better; and sometimes you do have to, like, plateau before you can start work on recovery, but that’s still super hard. idk it’s also hard for me personally because I was very fond of Shortpacked!Amber, and this Amber’s so different from her in a lot of essential ways.
on the other hand it’s really grappling with the superhero identity in ways that don’t get grappled with often enough. -stares at Arrow, Batman- i’m watching you.
and it also talks about DID in ways that people who actually have DID seem to really appreciate? so i can definitely appreciate that.
idk like the place where Amber is is a really, really ugly place. and that’s both powerful and disturbing in meaningful ways. it’s like this weird intersection of trauma and violence and abuse and struggle. and it’s super, legitimately draining.
If reading about Amber is draining you right now, it should. ‘Cause mental illness is draining as fuck. It ain’t cute quirky Hannelore’s obsessive counting, it’s ugly and painful and sometime you just want to reach into your head and pull out your fucking brain just to make it stop.
I guess that’s why part of why I’m liking what’s happening now. Because we’re seeing that journey to the bottom, and we’re going to see her start to climb out of it, and it’s gonna hurt like hell because that’s just how it is. There’s no easy way to deal with trauma.
As for Amazi-Girl, the way she works for me is that I accept that in any real world context she’d be dead, so I just roll with her being a clever visual metaphor for Amber’s fracturing psyche. Also it is completely appropriate that a huge turbo nerd with massive anger issues would end up drawing strength through being a superhero, an entire genre dedicated to solving problems with violence.
haha i imagine that Amber's dad was trying to train her to be his successor, which was a hitman for the mob or w/e. kind of a Cassandra Cain thing. which is why Blaine had Amber in martial arts classes. so like her being Amazigirl is sort of taking back those skills and using them to fight what he did! which is positive. the rest of this is not so positive.
I’m not sure if Blaine is still connected to the mafia in this universe. I see him throwing Amber into self defense classes as him attempting to get her therapy, because to a total shitstain like Blaine, what Amber needed to do was toughen up and not be scared of people holding knives.
I guess part of the way I view Amber’s use of Amazi-Girl is that she’s trying to atone for what Blaine did to her. Like, he instilled into her all this rage and now Amber’s stuck with it, and she needs to validate what happened to her by doing something positive with it. That she can prove that it wasn’t just that Blaine violently traumatized her for her entire life, and that it didn’t break her, it made her stronger; she turned Blaine’s abuse into her own strength, and then every time Amber expresses some kind of anger, which only Amazi-Girl is allowed to do, Amber has to hurriedly shut it away and repackage it as a way to prove that Amber is shit, but Amazi-Girl is good.
I might be projecting, since I ended up doing the same thing to deal with my own abuse. That I would take what happened to me and use it to become a better person, rather than recognize that I was in a fucked up situation and whatever action I took was irrelevant to that, and that I didn’t need to make up for it.
I know it is a horrible remnant of my upbringing, but part of me is always surprised that Joyce isn’t attached to one particularea Christian group. However, I know that is just base on myour experiences with my childhood church believing anyone who didn’t subscribe to their exact beliefs were doomed to eternal damnation (and believe me it’s a pretty small group).
That must be pretty special, I never felt any tension around those things. My parents aren’t even from the same denomination, and we went to all sorts of churches (mostly Catholic, Melkite and Armenian Orthodox, in that order). The Armenians were the best. That communion bread! Sweet and aromatic (anise, I think), dipped in real wine. I think if we had stayed in Aleppo, I would’ve stayed Christian. Those Syrian Armenians were fabulous people. Catholicism where I’m at is quite horrid.
We’re seeing how Joyce is very much her father’s daughter.
Perhaps more importantly, he’s seeing it.
But while Joyce has always been confidently, almost unthinkingly outspoken, Hank is more inclined to keep quiet, not make a fuss, not cause a scene or start a fight. Depending on one’s perspective, some might call him a realist or a coward for that. I submit that neither label is entirely accurate.
The other thing to consider is that a lot of people are passionate crusaders when they’re young, but as they get older, many become weary of the fight and/or just want to find someplace to settle down and have a quieter life. Hank sounds like he might have been one of those.
maybe, yeah. like you keep looking and looking for the perfect Christian church you’re just not gonna find it. but, i mean, just cause you go to a church doesn’t mean you subscribe to everything that it preaches or everything that goes on there. but if you build up enough connections it’s usually easier to deal with it? Becky could have been one of those connections.
To put it in his children’s terms, Hank also has a bit of Jocelyne in him. Jocelyne realizes that it’s good to be passionate, but it’s best to keep it tactful.
“I must not have fun
Fun is the mind-killer.
Fun is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face fun.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fun has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
In my family having almost all 5 of us ready to leave, or had left allowed my parents to get the divorce they needed.
They were teen parents who tried to make a go of it after a party resulted in my older sibling. Both of my parents hate to fail at anything and they remained in subtly toxic marriage longer than one would be expected. Also both grew up in a strong RC culture which also contributed to the length of marriage despite not being suited to each other.
Having a lot of kids can be a sign of troubles and a delaying of a needed separation.
On a side note both my parents are much happier, and saner people now that they are no longer together.
It may be what eventually happens, but I dunno. It depends on the couple I suppose, why they got married and how they handle conflict. Joyce seems to be a source of friction between them, but to what extent? It’s pretty clear Joyce is going back to college after this, so it’s going to be interesting to see how that happens.
“People have always tried to create paradise for themselves”
“Not in their own time,” he said. “In any one individual’s time, all he or she can do is lay the groundwork. The next generation comes along and alters the groundwork to suit themselves.”
Because he didn’t stop to try and find out what happened. Because he lost his faith in his daughter in not assuming she had a good reason. Because everyone wanted him to be the perfect parent, and not be one that made a mistake for very understandable reasons.
And because people don’t like it when Joyce feels bad.
Yes, if the turning process started a while back. He was definitely “heel” in the horrifying “Take it to God” scene at the fountain, but it sounds like he was rethinking things even before the Toedad Shotgun Incident.
As nice as this is, just want to take a brief moment to remind everyone that Joyce is still struggling with a lot of emotions, and the whole point of coming to church was (At least in part) for things to be “back to normal”. While it’s great to see Hank being Cool Dad ™ here, this compliment may come across as awful to poor Joyce.
He just called her corrupt and malleable. In context, this is being presented as a good thing, and honestly, it IS a good thing. But Joyce is still very fragile (With good reason, her entire life has been flipped upside down, and many beliefs shaken to the core), and being told “You’re not the innocent girl you once were” might not exactly be what she wants to hear right now (See: Expression in last panel. Practically screams, “But I’m NOT happy…”).
Actually I get the impression what he’s saying is that Joyce /isn’t/ easily corruptible. But he’s implying if she was she might be happier. It’s a difficult road she’s on.
Thaaat’s not what he’s saying at all. He’s saying the exact opposite. He’s saying that she’s just like him, and people like the two of them CAN’T be more corrupt, because it goes against their principles. But even though he knows that it’s good to have those principles, it’s HARD, and he sometimes thinks that being corrupt might be an easier and happier way to be.
I don’t think that’s the case. I think this is just another instance where Joyce is realizing her parents are people too – that they have struggles, that they deal with many of the same things she does, and most of all that they (at least Hank) have considered given into the same things as she has.
This entire trip hasn’t just been about contrasting how happy she is at college versus home now, it also has been about her realizing who her parents are. They fight, they disagree, and sometimes they just want to punch a guy in the face as well. Kids grow up thinking their parents are heroes, or maybe villains. It takes distance and a look back to realize they’re more than that.
Her expression (at least to me) is one of discomfort. At first I thought it was because she’s learning more about a childhood that really wasn’t what she thought. With all of the revelations she’s had recently, this could be another uncomfortable one.
But thinking about it, it could also be that she realizes that she really is her father’s daughter. She seems to have never looked at her father in this way and it’s something she isn’t used to.
I’m 26 years old. One thing that’s been hard for me is to identify with any of the male characters outside maybe Mike (I enjoy Mike’s bluntness, even if it’s used for his own amusement)
Now I can see myself identifying with Hank. What the heck.
Uh, please explain what you’re trying to say in the last panel? “…I’d be happier if I were more corrupt or malleable, and parents want their kids to be happy.”
This isn’t a great sentence. I don’t understand the connection between the two phrases.
The follow-up reference to the Faith Baptist pastor, suggesting he’s a crazy person, is additionally confusing. Is it supposed to be a 1-off comment, or is it tied to the previous statements of corruption and malleability?
“You and I both stand up for what’s right, no matter what. I would be happier, albeit not a principled person, if I did not have this trait, and I believe the same is true of you. Therefore, a very small part of me wishes that you were more corrupt or malleable, so that you could be happy.”
ackdsfldjfkjdl I HATE THAT FEELING but i usually console myself with the assumption that however happy they may present they probably are not that happy overall because they’re still awful people lmaaaao
Hank thinks Joyce would be happier if she was less like him. He also thinks the Faith Baptist pastor was dishonest, which is presumably why the Browns left that church.
Living with the need to do right like Hank is talking about here is a special kind of hell. When you have it, you eventually realize it’s a compulsion, it can’t be stopped and won’t long be ignored. (And if you’re operating on bad information when it moves you, you’re in big trouble!)
Inevitably, you burn through one incident after another until you find out you’re really on the wrong planet. Everything here only rewards the ruthless and those who otherwise don’t give a damn.
If there were a drug that could turn this off, I might try to mainline it until I’m an unrecognizable wreck. Goodness knows nothing else so far has worked.
it’s weird, but um…I feel like when you’re a principled person, and you see the people around you doing things that are Wrong and you can’t shut up about it, it’s an easy conclusion to come to that if you could just be more like them then you would be happier. that if you could just be quieter, go with the flow, be that judgmental and terrible. you would be better off.
but I don’t believe that to be true. I believe that, nine times out of ten, if you stick to your guns and are willing to put the work in to understand and communicate and hold your boundaries, you’ll be happier in the long run. at the end of the day you have to live with everything that you are and that you’ve done, and if you’re not okay with yourself you’ll be more miserable than you would’ve been if you’d done the principled thing. you just kind of have to find the things and people that make you happy, I think, and not make your happiness depend on how people react to you. idk. that’s easier to say than to do, but i do believe in choosing happiness.
idk i fully believe in giving people every chance possible. but like everybody’s got to be responsible for themselves. and sometimes that means acknowledging that you effed up and sometimes that means that other people’s problems just…aren’t your problems. they were there before you were there and they will continue to struggle after you leave and you can’t fix everything in the world. it’s enough to take care of your corners of the world i feel like
no one person can make the world be a better place but together we can make the world around us better and that’s worth fighting for
Who says that the Faith Baptist Pastor can sleep at night? Sin and faith are warring in his soul. He tells himself that faith has won, but he also knows that he is but one of the multitude of unregenerate Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God. (Jonathan Edwards)
Unless he is just one of the hypocrites who give thanks that they are not as others.
I don’t read it that way at all, I interpret is as a metaphorical drug. Because Hank can’t imagine how any clearheaded person could do what the FB pastor did and still live with himself.
Willis, I swear if you reveal Hank to be a jerk face after this I swear my comments will be really pissy! I mean, I probably wouldn’t be too rude, and you can moderate the comments anyway, but it will take up a second of your life and that will be very mildly annoying, probably… okay I’ve got nothing.
This is going to make me cry. When I can catch my breath, I’d rather be sadder and wiser than still living the lie of the church life I had, abused by the man who was supposed to be my pastor, my boss, my surrogate father figure, but sometimes I forget that. Sometimes, I’m Hank too.
Hank makes me cry, he wants to be good and do the right thing but struggles with his own upbring, yet here he’s opening himself up to what is probably the most shameful thoughts he’s had to his daughter. I don’t know what it’s like to be a parent but being this honest and understanding is important I think.
I… feel Hank so hard right now on the whole “I think my life would be a lot easier if I could compromise on my principles more.” Thing. My conscience won’t even leave me be about the asshole I flipped off yesterday for damn near killing me on the highway, and it is only worse about shit that actually matters. Sometimes I wish it had an off switch.
A few days ago I commented hoping (not demanding as some took it) that there would be a good religious person, confident in their faith without being a total asshat. I didn’t really think anyone else really qualified so far and I thought that daddy here was going to lose his faith in the face of these new problems. But honestly, this is exactly what I was hoping for. Someone who knows what they believe and are still a good person. He might end up leaving this church, but he obviously knows the score. And that’s more important than what church someone ends up in. A good mentor figure for joyce to show that not all religious people are horrible. They’re just like anyone else, you got shitbags and saints. I guess what I mean to say is i’m glad this moment happened. Even if this is all fictional, it’s nice to see. I’ve been reading since the beginning and absolutely love this comic, despite being yelled at the other day >.< Not that I don't understand why I was yelled at, but still. This moment is essentially what I was "shipping" for lack of a better word.
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Don’t fight it, Hank
Let the Cool-Dad® flow through your veins
All aboard the best dad train” Cuz Hank is doing a fine job conducting
I’m game. Maybe he can share a beer with my dad.
Hanks reminds me of my Dad a lot so far. Joyce is lucky.
I saw “Cool-” and immediately thought Cool-Whip.
…I don’t have a problem.
I didn’t think Cool-Whip® flowed
Dammit your Gravatar makes this perfect.
anything can be made to flow
Just add heat!
But then it will be Warm-Whip.
What do you think creme brulee is?
Pure joy.
Just ask Frank Herbert
I defy you to find “The Spice Must Flow” in any of Frank Herbert’s Dune books.
That’s because it’s the whip that’s flowing; the spice was used in the decidedly non-flowing pies being baked… 😛
The spice… expands pastry.
He who controls the pies…controls the universe. After all, if you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe.
You mean cool-wHip.
We need a decades long Cool Whip drop experiment to see how long it takes to drip.
You can’t have a pie without Cool-Hwip!
im gonna eat a whole blueberry pie without cool-hwip
Nonono.
Hank’s not being Cool-Dad®.
Realize what he’s doing here.
He’s breaking down barriers and providing much-needed, refreshing relief.
He’s Kool-Dad®.
OH YEAH!
(PS: don’t drink the Kool-Dad®)
it is good to do things that are good but if you don’t take care of yourself you can’t help others.
I kinda wanna hear more about Faith Baptist.
Does Carol secretly miss Faith Baptist?
Sounds more like Westboro Baptist, perhaps Faith isn’t too far away spiritually.
They’re pretty holier-than-thou, in my limited experience, but they’re not quite at that level of rude with their self-righteousness, nor are they nearly as cult-ish.
Well, near as I can tell, Westboro Baptist is basically a family scam to make money by goading people to attack them and then suing. It barely even qualifies as cult, much less actually religion.
No, the WBC is totally a cult. I don’t have the links to hand, but it’s worth reading over some of the ex-members accounts of their time in the church. It’s a really awful environment.
Ye, I live close enough to them that I’ve seen more than a few of their protests in person. Which is usually about 5 kids of toddler to elementary school age being ordered to stand outside holding obscenely hateful signs they probably can’t read, while the parents sit in a nice, safe, climate-controlled SUV. It’s so scummy.
Fred might’ve started it as a scam…but Shirley’s a true believer by all accounts.
They’re a very “Stop having fun” sect of Baptism, in my experience. (They have a little niche in my area) Basically, if it’s fun, it’s a sin, and they will not hesitate to condemn. Loudly. And at length. They get off on it, I swear.
…. so they have fun doing it?
Ah yes, a congregation of people who find nothing more fun than experiencing schadenfreude, criticizing others, and feeling superior to people who know how to have fun that isn’t derived from hatred and fear.
Yes, I have met some of these people.
Ah. So the type of church Mary obviously grew up in.
….Seriously. I’ve long thought that she must’ve been in one of the “having fun is a sin” denominations. Most places are now all about “you can have fun with Jesus.” There’s a reason that there was a ton of “extreme sports” stuff in the teens programming on Christian TV.
We always regarded them as “old people churches.”
@Kris- Then watch Footloose.
and always remember to kick off your sunday shoes
My experience with Baptists is that they have a pretty hard line on what they believe, and what they believe doesn’t include everything that’s talked about in the Bible. Spiritual gifts, tongues, DANCING, etc. Granted I could understand not wanting to encourage belief in spiritual gifts, since those sorta cross into X-Men abilities.
My aunt, uncle, and cousin went to a Faith Baptist church for years. My mother dragged me and my siblings to a “regular” Baptist church. Our church was the most white-bread, outwardly benign ’90s Protestant church you can imagine. Theirs forbade dancing and all forms of alcohol and had a fire-and-brimstone preacher. The church also ran a K-8 school, and a boy and a girl who were a year ahead of my cousin were expelled in eighth grade after they were caught holding hands. The aforementioned preacher told everyone that they were possessed by demons. I went to several of their services after Saturday night sleepovers with my cousin, and it became all too clear why she seemed to view expressions of faith as a competition.
Our old church is now in a new building and I’m told that the worship style has been completely changed. No more traditional hymns mixed in with the contemporary Christian music, a band with drums and guitars instead of a guy with a piano or organ, more entertaining/charismatic preaching, etc. In other words, a lot more like Joyce’s church seems to be. I have a hard time imagining that their church could have changed much at all.
Heck, my Catholic church now has an evening mass with drums, guitars, and contemporary Christian music. The Catholic church over on Large State University campus even has liturgical dancers for special occasions. We’re not the total sticks in the mud we used to be anymore.
Given the last panel, it might even be something more directly bad, ala “catholic priest joke”. :/
Joyce & Hank: taking on the world!!
Also bringing Becky aboard!
They’ll fight their seven not-evil ex-churches!
Leveling-Up!
Is the incorrect idiom intentional?
Taken to task? Or no quarter given?
The second, quarter/quarters. Hank holds onto his principles not his change.
Probably then. Maybe Willis meant to make it sound like he’s gone through this multiple times.
Quarter refers to housing for military personnel in this idiom. Essentially taking a no quarter given stance means giving no housing to those you disagree with or not letting them into your house. It can also mean not negotiating or not taking prisoners.
That *is* called quartering, as in quartering troops, but that’s not what “no quarter given” means.
“Give no quarter” means that you show no mercy. Surrender is not accepted, prisoners are not taken, everybody dies. In a non-violent setting, it would translate into “never give an inch.” Hank’s saying that he never yielded on his principles, no matter how inconvenient it was. Housing military personnel has nothing to do with it.
The proper phrase is “Give no quarter” meaning to take no prisoners.
It is always intentional.
fight the power!
ROW ROW! FIGHT THE POWAH!
ROW ROW! FIGHT THE POWAH!
New Patreon strip: exactly what happened at Faith Baptist.
A story for which the world is not yet prepared.
“I am ready! *reads story*…I wasn’t ready…”
you let spongebob down
Working on a head-canon: child-Jordan adorably dancing in the aisle to a catchy prayer, not understanding the vitriol thrown at him, Browns get thrown out?
So, fundie Burning Man.
…never mind, I just realized that the strip didn’t load completely so I didn’t see the rest of that comment about drugs.
my theory is that it’s the plot of Footloose except they didn’t let the kids dance and nobody learned from their actions
I like this one more than mine.
i could really get into child jordan dancing in the aisles during worship and getting himself kicked out like “aren’t i supposed to dance to the joy of the lord mom??”
those sick moves just Too Much For Everyone
I mixed up Patreon with Slipshine. Let’s hope what happened at Faith Baptist would fall under Patreon.
More interesting would be a Slipshine for it…
Wasn’t Ryan’s dad a pastor?
No quarters given? Well, it’s a good thing Mike isn’t here, or he’d be asking for nickels.
I came to the comments tonight to make a similar joke.
Hank never let the kids play arcade games, lest they be corrupted. No quarters given.
id say ‘you win’, but you gotta pay to play
Arcade games now don’t bother with coins or tokens. You have to buy a souvenir card that is loaded with quasi-credit and swipe that on the game machine.
I’ve been to an arcade or two where they don’t even work on credits anymore, you buy a block of time to basically get “free” play in the arcade, it’s awesome, though expensive, unless you and a friend or two share the card.
arcades have changed so much since i was a kid
Well, their business model kinda died as video games moved more and more to home systems like consoles and PC. Like anything else in business, when your main source of income dries up you adapt or die. There isn’t yet a really sustainable replacement for the old model common until the mid-90s that has wide acceptance. Well, except for the touch screen games you’ll find in most bars they seem to have the same pricing regardless of vendor.
I have every single arcade game I enjoyed as a kid, and a few I never even heard of, on my computer right now. If you (or I) told teenaged me about MAME, his head would have asploded.
(and if you wanted to see it explode again, ala Pinkie Pie, just mention Pinball Arcade et al.)
Strap your helmet on and look up ‘Visual Pinball’ and ‘Future Pinball’.
Oh, I’m well aware, and was playing those (well, VP) long before Pinball Arcade came along and got the official licenses, etc etc.
So the better you are at a game, the more they rip you off?
What a horrible circle we have taken…
+1
Is Faith Baptist a reference to something? I can’t put my finger on it. I wanna say WBC but *shrug*
Sounds like Footloose, but it’s been a while since I last saw that movie.
… I don’t think they mean dancing in the way you’re thinking.
I think he meant ‘dancing’.
“Why don’t the faith baptists approve of sex standing up?”
“Might lead to dancing.”
They’re an offshoot of Baptism. Here’s one of their websites. Westboro Baptists are their own sect. (*cough* cult *cough*)
While they do meet many definitions of a cult, even WBC doesn’t quite meet the definition you seem to be implying. They are just one of the best living examples of the kind of thing that hardcore closed-minded extremist fundamentalism can lead to.
I think WBC is, above all, a cult of lawyers.
give in to the snark side
There is a song titled “No Quarter”. It was written as a fan tie-in to the Honorverse series. I wonder if I can find it somewhere…
is this the one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXxTB30lfv0
Yeah, you got it.
I love filk music.
I filked that filk a few years ago. Sung from the point of view of a “compassionate conservative”…
Minimum wage hike? No Quarter!
Fair housing? No Quarters!
Hiring decisions? No Quota!
Class warfare? …and though I cannot meet your eyes, I’ve just one thing to say: NO QUARTER!
There’s a famous Led Zepplin song too, but this is not it.
The Led Zepplin song was covered by Reggie Watts old band Maktub as well. you can hear it on their website, as well as probably youtube.
And for an encore, I guess I ought to nominate Huey Lewis & The News’ “I Want A New Drug”…
I was thinking “I Wanna Be Sedated” by the Ramones.
Hank advises Joyce as to the difficulties of a Lawful Good alignment, but she has her heart set on being a Paladin.
Ahhh, aren’t paladins Lawful Good?
No, that’s just it. He’s saying, “if you keep on this road, it’s gonna be… really hard”. But Joyce, being who she is, can’t not follow that path.
Ohh, thanks for the clarification.
Not the way I play ’em.
Only the players worth their salt are. The others are Lawful Stupid. And to a comment beneath me, what ruleset got rid of that option, `cause I think I wanna avoid it.
4th Ed onwards. They instead follow similar alignment restrictions as clerics.
I knew I stopped at 3.5 for a reason.
In general, alignment restrictions are being pretty pointedly ignored now. It’s not like 3.5 kept paladins as purely lawful good, either. Paladins of Freedom, Tyranny, and Slaughter were added in that edition, and later editions just decided to make that a choice a paladin could make from go.
She’d do better than Mary Miyazaki at being a paladin.
I understood that reference.
Please do not combine those names in this context ever again.
One day she will teach the dragon the difference between right and wrong instead of slaying it and they shall together, burn all the Biology books.
Good thing paladins don’t have to be Lawful Good anymore!
Honestly, never made sense that they had to be. Because. The Blues Brothers are totally chaotic good paladins.
Even without any And dknowledg, this comment is fire.
Ugh. **DnD knowledge
Gotta say, I like the Oath system 5e used to marry 4th’s free choice of alignment with older archetypes.
Agreed. Y’know, this is why I’d love for her to have her Walkyverse self’s powers but turned up to eleven. I could really see her as a Superman-like figure; trying to be the perfect paragon and an exemplar of doing the right thing no matter what in a world that neither understands nor really deserves it. All the while, her Batman expy (Sal, of course) mutters stuff from behind her mask that makes her sound like Rorscharch from ‘Watchmen’.
“Taken your mom and _me_ to task.”
Grammar is important!
*Some* grammar is important. This particular rule, not so much.
True, but rarely do people “speak” in grammatically correct sentences, and this spoken text, not narrative.
Also this is a particularly common error since we’ve had a generation or two of teachers drilling out “x and me” without clarifying WHY so people don’t know that no, sometimes it is “x and me.” So really this is one of the most important errors to keep in, for accuracy.
My schools taught it this way:
Take the other person out and re-read the sentence. If it still sounds right you’re okay, if not, change the self-reference and try again.
Right. *Your* English teacher’s ghost doesn’t need to be exorcised. 🙂
I say “me and your mom” simply because it flows better off my tongue than “your mom and me”, and “your mom and I” as the object of a sentence is incorrect.
Because honestly, I’ve never heard a compelling reason for the third-second-first rule of grammatical person in lists. Bring it on, prescriptivists.
Actually I don’t remember that 3rd person needs to come before second, but the way it was explained to me is that first person always came last in lists simply because of humility. We are supposed to be humble and modest, so we are supposed to put others before ourselves. It seems to be a grammatical quirk that stems from religious perspectives and “how to be a good person.”
It actually has to do with basic grammar association. (you) is always closest to the (action), because you’re speaking from your own perspective. That’s why the ‘remove the other person’ rule works- they’re the supporting addition to your personalized point.
Rather, if the other person’s pronoun was closest, you’d be indicating your point was expressed from their perspective, and you were only going along with it.
There might be a bit more to it than that, it’s been a while; In any case- no, not religiously based, just a consistent element of how sentence structure works.
In any case, hard grammar rules aside, as I noted above, the intent changes when you swap the pronouns, so best to keep that in mind.
” just a consistent element of how sentence structure works.”
That is, that things always associate to the closest noun or pronoun.
akshully not sure about it in this context. ‘me’ matches the case of the sentence if ‘your mother and’ were omitted- ‘taken me to task’. I’m not super sure, but I think is the case agreement that’s important. So it’s ‘your mother and I think’, but ‘taken your mother and me to task’
Nonononono. It’s the role that the pronouns and nouns play relative to their verb that’s important. In the case of “your mother and I”, those people are doing the thinking, but in the case of “taken your mother and me to task”, mother and me are not doing the taking but are instead being taken by someone else.
…..
… phew. I got through all of that without letting on that I don’t know whether it’s still called the “subject” if it’s in a clause rather than the root of the sentence.
…. wait.
…. crap.
Pronoun Trouble.
It is. A clause has a subject.
A lecture about grammar and you don’t even mention the incorrectness of “no quarters given”?
Well that bit was clearly talking about arcade games.
Bit? Wouldn’t “quarter” suggest at least two bits?
*applauds*
Saying “person and I” where “person and me” is correct is one of my biggest peeves.
No, it is *not* “person and I” every single time, no matter what your terror of saying “and me” or “me and” might suggest. 🙁
For example, “you overheard me and your mother” from the comic two days ago is right. RIGHT, I tell you! Exorcise the ghost of your English teacher and *think* about it.
I noticed this too and it grated. (Didn’t notice the quarter/quarters thing as I’d never heard that idiom before in the first place. I’m not a native speaker.)
I’m sure cooldad could not care less right now.
So what panel 3 is implying is that Hank starred in his own personal version of Footloose?
So everyone who meets Hank has a Kevin Bacon number of 1 from now on?
I want some of that, too. People who’re willing to walk all over people while being self-righteous sure seem to sleep pretty well. As far as I can tell the ‘sleep of the just’ is way more restless and worried than it’s made out to be.
self-righteousness: the sleep aid your doctor won’t approve!
I’ve met many doctors who seem to be hoarding the self-righteousness for themselves.
over the counter self-righteousness FOR EVERYBODY let’s campaign on washington
“Church of God” ? On some ways that might be more of a statement than a titled name but come on Canvas you be more creative?
They’re legit.
Are there no Churches of God near you? Look them up if you’re in the US, you might be surprised.
It’s actually the name of several distinct groups. There’s also the Church of Christ, etc. Some of the strongly reformist Protestant (but don’t call them that, they hate it) churches believe that those are the only names you can call a church. They also do things like split up over the question of whether or not God likes to hear musical instruments.
Christianity is a really weird scene.
They’re…(looks up how to spell word) Presbyterian, right? (WhateverTF that means)
Presbyterian just means they don’t have bishops, so decisions about the church are made by councils (making them one of the earlier areas of democracy). There’s no need for presbyterians to hold any particular interpretations of christianity, but all puritans are (or used to be, anyway) presbyterian.
That holds true on a technical level, but when used as the name of a denomination, in the US at least, it implies Calvinist churches with local governance by a council of elders within each church and wider governance within a body to which each church sends one or more of said elders.
Those kind of questions used to result in out warfare back in the early days.
There’s also the Nigerian based Redeemed Christian Church of God, which has congregations in Canada and the US.
Church of God is headquartered in Anderson, Indiana. Anderson University in Anderson is where Becky went to school.
Hank is too good for this world. Willis is probably going to do something evil to him eventually.
Well, he’s probably going to have an argument with Carol which will cause problems in their relationship.
there’s no problem in their relationship that the good book can’t solve…….the really good book that is
If they can find it…
zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance?
In the walkyverse there was a book that Joe took an…interest in when he visited Joyce’s parents’ house. He took it with him and naturally Hank couldn’t locate it later
It’s a Kama Sutra related book, isn’t it?
the joy of sex?
Nothing is stated explicitly, but the fact that Joe took an interest in it and that Joyce refused to listen to anything he had to say about it during their trip back to Semme implies that this is the case
It was the Kama Sutra or as Hank called it “the really good book”.
Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban is a good book.
It’s probably the best book of the HP series true. Though I’m also one of those folks for whom Order of the Phoenix is her 2nd favourite (never got complaints about Harry in Book 5 being angry/a bit too dicky when you know, he’s basically at the end of his rope after watching Cedric die and then Sirius dies- like honestly he’s more of an unlikeable dick cheese in Book 6 to me but even that’s p understandable to me too given well… Sirius (I honestly think he’s subconsciously emulating teen!Sirius and his dad as a teen to cope with all the crap in his life, which is a lot- it’s just a problem that the books never see it as a problem), even if the prose is p awful in that book and the romance unintentionally hilarious and bad or uncomfortable in some cases).
(Still disappointed at Deathly Hallows though to this day, what a snore fest- kind of laughing really hard at the Cursed Child spoilers though- it sounds bad but it at least doesn’t sound boring like DH was even if I think A Very Potter Musical is probably better.).
(This has been a fangirl rant).
(Has anyone else seen the spoilers of the play? Or the play itself? I hear the effects and actors are good even if the… story isn’t. Though honestly that makes me want to see it even more.)
But by whose interpretation?
The Kama Sutra?
I dunno, he’s already killed his parent quota I think. Killing off Hank to damage Joyce further would just be in bad taste.
I think something evil has been done to Hank already. He’s married to Carol.
If the comic is based on David’s real life, I might guess divorce and estrangement.
The only drug the Baptist preachers (and occasional deacon) I met were on was Old Crow.
…People actually drink that bathtub-swill?
Aparently it used to be the favourite drink of politicians.
Seriously? That stuff is genuine rotgut. I would think politicians could afford better.
that would mean spending more money though
Just because they can afford better doesn’t mean they know better.
Maybe not the Kennedys.
If it was any good it wouldn’t be of the Devil.
Politicians drink what is given to them FREE in exchange for services rendered/to be rendered.
That tumblr post by wackd made me think of Charlie’s Angels, but renamed Willis’ Angels (or maybe something less sexist?)
“Blessed are the righteous, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven” – but, contrarily, blessed also are the peacemakers.
“There are none who are righteous; no, not one.”
What’s so special about the cheesemakers?
They’re special because cheeses died for your sins.
It’s a metaphor for all those in the dairy industry.
For the life of me, up until a few years ago, I thought the quote really WAS “blessed art the cheesemakers”, my logic being that cheese stored and aged well and could get you through a famine or hardship, so those with the talent to make cheese were to be blessed.
I knew a girl named Faith, but I don’t know if she was a Baptist.
The world is full of people so sure and unsure of themselves all trying to find happiness, and joy, and help others do the same. When people see others doing what they think will hurt them, why wouldn’t they try to stop them? To live in the world is accept that you can’t help everyone, to accept that you will, not might, be wrong. And you will never know when you’re right until it’s too late, and it might not have been correct for the reasons you thought.
Principles lead to action. To helping. But I question if they can ever make someone happy.
So, is this what we are doing this week? Alternating between good parent and bad?
idk it’s kind of relieving for me to have the constant switching because it means less of a buildup of pressure
like can you imagine if we’d just had nonstop amber or joyce or becky in struggles? i think it’d be kind of exhausting tbh
Amber struggles are the most exhausting to me. I just one her and Sal to finally recognize one another at this point.
Amber stuff is emotionally hard for me to, but it’s been in a good way. It’s real to me, and I like that we’re getting a story about an abuse victim with a mental health disorder coping extremely poorly with her trauma, and instead of the message being “Amber needs to learn not to be shit”, it’s that she’s a good person who needs help, and that Amber needs to realize she needs that help, and that there are people in her life who want to help her.
I am pretty confident that we’re gearing up for the endgame of that, though. She’s pushed Danny away, Amazi-Girl has started making active decisions for both alters and is outright referring to herself as a separate identity, Dina seems to be cognizant of Amber’s DID, and now the police are after her.
I connect with this series the most when it punches me in the gut.
Amber’s is super hard. I feel like it’s because it’s a story about someone gradually getting worse, instead of better; and sometimes you do have to, like, plateau before you can start work on recovery, but that’s still super hard. idk it’s also hard for me personally because I was very fond of Shortpacked!Amber, and this Amber’s so different from her in a lot of essential ways.
on the other hand it’s really grappling with the superhero identity in ways that don’t get grappled with often enough. -stares at Arrow, Batman- i’m watching you.
and it also talks about DID in ways that people who actually have DID seem to really appreciate? so i can definitely appreciate that.
idk like the place where Amber is is a really, really ugly place. and that’s both powerful and disturbing in meaningful ways. it’s like this weird intersection of trauma and violence and abuse and struggle. and it’s super, legitimately draining.
Well maybe Ethan will step in at some point and speak with Sal.
“So uh you once held a knife at me at a convenience store…”
“you’re that kid! wow, it’s been forever. haha how you doing? … can i sign your yearbook”
This is about as perfect a summary as it gets.
If reading about Amber is draining you right now, it should. ‘Cause mental illness is draining as fuck. It ain’t cute quirky Hannelore’s obsessive counting, it’s ugly and painful and sometime you just want to reach into your head and pull out your fucking brain just to make it stop.
I guess that’s why part of why I’m liking what’s happening now. Because we’re seeing that journey to the bottom, and we’re going to see her start to climb out of it, and it’s gonna hurt like hell because that’s just how it is. There’s no easy way to deal with trauma.
As for Amazi-Girl, the way she works for me is that I accept that in any real world context she’d be dead, so I just roll with her being a clever visual metaphor for Amber’s fracturing psyche. Also it is completely appropriate that a huge turbo nerd with massive anger issues would end up drawing strength through being a superhero, an entire genre dedicated to solving problems with violence.
<33
ayyyyyyyyy
haha i imagine that Amber's dad was trying to train her to be his successor, which was a hitman for the mob or w/e. kind of a Cassandra Cain thing. which is why Blaine had Amber in martial arts classes. so like her being Amazigirl is sort of taking back those skills and using them to fight what he did! which is positive. the rest of this is not so positive.
I’m not sure if Blaine is still connected to the mafia in this universe. I see him throwing Amber into self defense classes as him attempting to get her therapy, because to a total shitstain like Blaine, what Amber needed to do was toughen up and not be scared of people holding knives.
I guess part of the way I view Amber’s use of Amazi-Girl is that she’s trying to atone for what Blaine did to her. Like, he instilled into her all this rage and now Amber’s stuck with it, and she needs to validate what happened to her by doing something positive with it. That she can prove that it wasn’t just that Blaine violently traumatized her for her entire life, and that it didn’t break her, it made her stronger; she turned Blaine’s abuse into her own strength, and then every time Amber expresses some kind of anger, which only Amazi-Girl is allowed to do, Amber has to hurriedly shut it away and repackage it as a way to prove that Amber is shit, but Amazi-Girl is good.
I might be projecting, since I ended up doing the same thing to deal with my own abuse. That I would take what happened to me and use it to become a better person, rather than recognize that I was in a fucked up situation and whatever action I took was irrelevant to that, and that I didn’t need to make up for it.
Hank is awesome. Precious cinnamon rolls
I know it is a horrible remnant of my upbringing, but part of me is always surprised that Joyce isn’t attached to one particularea Christian group. However, I know that is just base on myour experiences with my childhood church believing anyone who didn’t subscribe to their exact beliefs were doomed to eternal damnation (and believe me it’s a pretty small group).
Oh gods the typos. I recently got my first smart phone,& am getting used to auto-correct. I am mildly horrified.
Protip — smart phones are really only as smart as you are.
That must be pretty special, I never felt any tension around those things. My parents aren’t even from the same denomination, and we went to all sorts of churches (mostly Catholic, Melkite and Armenian Orthodox, in that order). The Armenians were the best. That communion bread! Sweet and aromatic (anise, I think), dipped in real wine. I think if we had stayed in Aleppo, I would’ve stayed Christian. Those Syrian Armenians were fabulous people. Catholicism where I’m at is quite horrid.
(Roman Catholic)
We’re seeing how Joyce is very much her father’s daughter.
Perhaps more importantly, he’s seeing it.
But while Joyce has always been confidently, almost unthinkingly outspoken, Hank is more inclined to keep quiet, not make a fuss, not cause a scene or start a fight. Depending on one’s perspective, some might call him a realist or a coward for that. I submit that neither label is entirely accurate.
…pragmatist, maybe?
idk maybe he’s just the guy who keeps going until the people around him go a step too far and he draws his boundaries.
That’s a good one, yes.
The other thing to consider is that a lot of people are passionate crusaders when they’re young, but as they get older, many become weary of the fight and/or just want to find someplace to settle down and have a quieter life. Hank sounds like he might have been one of those.
This. Feels like my dad, and also like I’m contemplating my future.
maybe, yeah. like you keep looking and looking for the perfect Christian church you’re just not gonna find it. but, i mean, just cause you go to a church doesn’t mean you subscribe to everything that it preaches or everything that goes on there. but if you build up enough connections it’s usually easier to deal with it? Becky could have been one of those connections.
To put it in his children’s terms, Hank also has a bit of Jocelyne in him. Jocelyne realizes that it’s good to be passionate, but it’s best to keep it tactful.
Puritanism – the desperate fear that someone, somewhere, is having a good time.
*insert no good time robot pic here*
Puritans… they don’t like fun.
I must not have fun
Fun is the time-killer
“I must not have fun
Fun is the mind-killer.
Fun is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face fun.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fun has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
“I had fun once, and it was awful.”
“Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.” – H. L. Mencken
Or Quakers.
Oh my god can Hank adopt me please??
Hank, its alcohol.
More like Cocaine and Heroin. And hookers.
But is Blackjack involved?
Only when they’re on missionary trips to Macau.
I would’ve betted on barbiturates. Or maybe .
Gosh, the link didn’t work. I meant
Ugh!!! Solveeeents. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anxiolytic#Inhalants
Does Hank not drink? I think he’d be fine with it, just not getting stupid drunk.
Carol I could see being fully against alcohol though. In that sort of “going the extra mile” way she seems to do.
It’s called Vorbis syndrome and is quiet common.
Fortunately in this case Joyce has Brutha syndrome.
I love Small Gods.
“But I’m me.”
Thank you for reminding me that I still have like an entire library of Terry Prachett I need to read ;_;
I promised myself I wouldn’t cry. Promise broken.
Will you ever be able to forgive yourself?
“But all he could remember was the sound of his own thoughts, bouncing off the inside of his own head”
We accept him, we accept him! Gooble gobble! One of us! One of us! Gooble gobble, gooble gobble! One of us!
Gobble gobble gobble gobble gobble! I witness that Hank is not a cabbage in disguise! Gobble gobble gobble gobble gobble!
Hank is a good dad.
Hank: We can dance if we want to, we can leave your church behind, because we all dance and if you don’t dance well your no church of mine.
Show me the dance of your people!
Divorce probably later down the road, eh?
probably, and they can put down the cause as irreconciliable differences
honestly id imagine its more of “A couple that hates each other but cant get a divorce because church” scenario.
I don’t see that. Hank and Carol have a LOT of kids. I would imagine if divorce was on the table, it would’ve happened a long time ago.
In my family having almost all 5 of us ready to leave, or had left allowed my parents to get the divorce they needed.
They were teen parents who tried to make a go of it after a party resulted in my older sibling. Both of my parents hate to fail at anything and they remained in subtly toxic marriage longer than one would be expected. Also both grew up in a strong RC culture which also contributed to the length of marriage despite not being suited to each other.
Having a lot of kids can be a sign of troubles and a delaying of a needed separation.
On a side note both my parents are much happier, and saner people now that they are no longer together.
Them being happier now is what matters.
It may be what eventually happens, but I dunno. It depends on the couple I suppose, why they got married and how they handle conflict. Joyce seems to be a source of friction between them, but to what extent? It’s pretty clear Joyce is going back to college after this, so it’s going to be interesting to see how that happens.
Considering that Joyce is more or less autobiographical for Willis, I would say divorce is pretty well guaranteed for Hank and Carol.
Hank confirmed for Joyce version #0.1.
Proto-joyce
Each generation has improved upon the foundation of the last. Joyce’s grandkids would probably send bigoted trolls into fits.
Will we live to see that?
Doubtful.
Is…someone taping conversations between me and my dad? And turning them into comics? Unlikely right? That’d be creepy.
Well since the national radio does that to me, I don’t see why comic people wouldn’t.
Turns out the real plan of the NSA was to give webcomic writers inspiration.
Each generation has improved upon the foundation of the last. Joyce’s grandkids would probably send bigoted trolls into fits.
Stupid reply link not letting me click it. Probably Becky’s fault.
Do you ever stop and realize that our grandkids are going to think of us the way we think of the 1950’s?
– The Last Master (1984) by Gordon R. Dickson
Parents want their kids to be happy… unless they get a haircut or shit like that. Then all bets are off.
Tattoos can send them into fits as well.
I suspect Sal knows a thing or two about that.
I kinda wish I wasn’t so awesome. GODDDDDD I’m awesome. You’re cool too.
Nope. Please nope.
Having principles in a world whose guiding philosophy seems to be “Mine! Give it to me! Now! All of it!” is a difficult thing to handle.
I’m sure you manage, unlike all those other people without principles.
yes 🙁
Would this count as a heel face turn?
No. Even taking for granted that he was ever a proper heel, his turn was a long time ago, his misstep the previous night notwithstanding.
I’m still not entirely sure what everyone was angry at him for that night though.
They DID take the car without asking him and he still did cover for them in the end.
Because he didn’t stop to try and find out what happened. Because he lost his faith in his daughter in not assuming she had a good reason. Because everyone wanted him to be the perfect parent, and not be one that made a mistake for very understandable reasons.
And because people don’t like it when Joyce feels bad.
Heaven forbid people have a right to be angry, right.
Yes, if the turning process started a while back. He was definitely “heel” in the horrifying “Take it to God” scene at the fountain, but it sounds like he was rethinking things even before the Toedad Shotgun Incident.
Not a shotgun. Why do people persist in ignoring this great bit of Willis artistry?
As nice as this is, just want to take a brief moment to remind everyone that Joyce is still struggling with a lot of emotions, and the whole point of coming to church was (At least in part) for things to be “back to normal”. While it’s great to see Hank being Cool Dad ™ here, this compliment may come across as awful to poor Joyce.
He just called her corrupt and malleable. In context, this is being presented as a good thing, and honestly, it IS a good thing. But Joyce is still very fragile (With good reason, her entire life has been flipped upside down, and many beliefs shaken to the core), and being told “You’re not the innocent girl you once were” might not exactly be what she wants to hear right now (See: Expression in last panel. Practically screams, “But I’m NOT happy…”).
He’s not saying she’s corrupt. He’s saying that it’s difficult for those who aren’t.
Actually I get the impression what he’s saying is that Joyce /isn’t/ easily corruptible. But he’s implying if she was she might be happier. It’s a difficult road she’s on.
It ain’t easy, being Lawful Good.
It’s like living under the midnight sun.
Well, that’s actually easy. If you’re in, like, Greenland or Alaska, that is.
Thaaat’s not what he’s saying at all. He’s saying the exact opposite. He’s saying that she’s just like him, and people like the two of them CAN’T be more corrupt, because it goes against their principles. But even though he knows that it’s good to have those principles, it’s HARD, and he sometimes thinks that being corrupt might be an easier and happier way to be.
he didnt say shes corrupt. he said the exact opposite
What Miz said. And Joyce’s expression in the last panel says “that would explain why I’m having a hard time being happy”. “Hehh” says recognition.
I don’t think that’s the case. I think this is just another instance where Joyce is realizing her parents are people too – that they have struggles, that they deal with many of the same things she does, and most of all that they (at least Hank) have considered given into the same things as she has.
This entire trip hasn’t just been about contrasting how happy she is at college versus home now, it also has been about her realizing who her parents are. They fight, they disagree, and sometimes they just want to punch a guy in the face as well. Kids grow up thinking their parents are heroes, or maybe villains. It takes distance and a look back to realize they’re more than that.
Her expression (at least to me) is one of discomfort. At first I thought it was because she’s learning more about a childhood that really wasn’t what she thought. With all of the revelations she’s had recently, this could be another uncomfortable one.
But thinking about it, it could also be that she realizes that she really is her father’s daughter. She seems to have never looked at her father in this way and it’s something she isn’t used to.
“And as for the Black Muslims, don’t even get me STARTED on those guys…”
I’m 26 years old. One thing that’s been hard for me is to identify with any of the male characters outside maybe Mike (I enjoy Mike’s bluntness, even if it’s used for his own amusement)
Now I can see myself identifying with Hank. What the heck.
You are now ready to be a dad. Grats 😤
Ok, that totes isn’t the emote I typed.
I’ll stick with my diabetic cat for now.
…aren’t all cats diabetic ?
Nope, not all of them. Some cats get diabetes like people and need insuline. Thankfully my cat is in remission. He just gets special food.
Uh, please explain what you’re trying to say in the last panel? “…I’d be happier if I were more corrupt or malleable, and parents want their kids to be happy.”
This isn’t a great sentence. I don’t understand the connection between the two phrases.
The follow-up reference to the Faith Baptist pastor, suggesting he’s a crazy person, is additionally confusing. Is it supposed to be a 1-off comment, or is it tied to the previous statements of corruption and malleability?
“You and I both stand up for what’s right, no matter what. I would be happier, albeit not a principled person, if I did not have this trait, and I believe the same is true of you. Therefore, a very small part of me wishes that you were more corrupt or malleable, so that you could be happy.”
“And that faith baptist pastor was very corrupt, very malleable, and very happy, and a part of me wants that even as the rest of me condemns it.”
ackdsfldjfkjdl I HATE THAT FEELING but i usually console myself with the assumption that however happy they may present they probably are not that happy overall because they’re still awful people lmaaaao
Hank thinks Joyce would be happier if she was less like him. He also thinks the Faith Baptist pastor was dishonest, which is presumably why the Browns left that church.
Living with the need to do right like Hank is talking about here is a special kind of hell. When you have it, you eventually realize it’s a compulsion, it can’t be stopped and won’t long be ignored. (And if you’re operating on bad information when it moves you, you’re in big trouble!)
Inevitably, you burn through one incident after another until you find out you’re really on the wrong planet. Everything here only rewards the ruthless and those who otherwise don’t give a damn.
If there were a drug that could turn this off, I might try to mainline it until I’m an unrecognizable wreck. Goodness knows nothing else so far has worked.
it’s weird, but um…I feel like when you’re a principled person, and you see the people around you doing things that are Wrong and you can’t shut up about it, it’s an easy conclusion to come to that if you could just be more like them then you would be happier. that if you could just be quieter, go with the flow, be that judgmental and terrible. you would be better off.
but I don’t believe that to be true. I believe that, nine times out of ten, if you stick to your guns and are willing to put the work in to understand and communicate and hold your boundaries, you’ll be happier in the long run. at the end of the day you have to live with everything that you are and that you’ve done, and if you’re not okay with yourself you’ll be more miserable than you would’ve been if you’d done the principled thing. you just kind of have to find the things and people that make you happy, I think, and not make your happiness depend on how people react to you. idk. that’s easier to say than to do, but i do believe in choosing happiness.
idk i fully believe in giving people every chance possible. but like everybody’s got to be responsible for themselves. and sometimes that means acknowledging that you effed up and sometimes that means that other people’s problems just…aren’t your problems. they were there before you were there and they will continue to struggle after you leave and you can’t fix everything in the world. it’s enough to take care of your corners of the world i feel like
no one person can make the world be a better place but together we can make the world around us better and that’s worth fighting for
Who says that the Faith Baptist Pastor can sleep at night? Sin and faith are warring in his soul. He tells himself that faith has won, but he also knows that he is but one of the multitude of unregenerate Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God. (Jonathan Edwards)
Unless he is just one of the hypocrites who give thanks that they are not as others.
I interpreted that to mean that part of the reason they left Faith Baptist was because the Pastor did a lot of drugs.
I don’t read it that way at all, I interpret is as a metaphorical drug. Because Hank can’t imagine how any clearheaded person could do what the FB pastor did and still live with himself.
Willis, I swear if you reveal Hank to be a jerk face after this I swear my comments will be really pissy! I mean, I probably wouldn’t be too rude, and you can moderate the comments anyway, but it will take up a second of your life and that will be very mildly annoying, probably… okay I’ve got nothing.
“Whatever drug that Faith Baptist Pastor is on that lets him sleep at night, I want some.”
This makes me want to hear that story, with the implication that the pastor is a druggie.
This is going to make me cry. When I can catch my breath, I’d rather be sadder and wiser than still living the lie of the church life I had, abused by the man who was supposed to be my pastor, my boss, my surrogate father figure, but sometimes I forget that. Sometimes, I’m Hank too.
Hank makes me cry, he wants to be good and do the right thing but struggles with his own upbring, yet here he’s opening himself up to what is probably the most shameful thoughts he’s had to his daughter. I don’t know what it’s like to be a parent but being this honest and understanding is important I think.
I… feel Hank so hard right now on the whole “I think my life would be a lot easier if I could compromise on my principles more.” Thing. My conscience won’t even leave me be about the asshole I flipped off yesterday for damn near killing me on the highway, and it is only worse about shit that actually matters. Sometimes I wish it had an off switch.
Apparently, in the Brown family, the gene that codes for not being a colossal shitwagon also codes for blue eyes.
A few days ago I commented hoping (not demanding as some took it) that there would be a good religious person, confident in their faith without being a total asshat. I didn’t really think anyone else really qualified so far and I thought that daddy here was going to lose his faith in the face of these new problems. But honestly, this is exactly what I was hoping for. Someone who knows what they believe and are still a good person. He might end up leaving this church, but he obviously knows the score. And that’s more important than what church someone ends up in. A good mentor figure for joyce to show that not all religious people are horrible. They’re just like anyone else, you got shitbags and saints. I guess what I mean to say is i’m glad this moment happened. Even if this is all fictional, it’s nice to see. I’ve been reading since the beginning and absolutely love this comic, despite being yelled at the other day >.< Not that I don't understand why I was yelled at, but still. This moment is essentially what I was "shipping" for lack of a better word.
it’s fun to switch between this strip and the last one to go from black eyes to Huge Blue Saucers
Is “no quarters given” just the clean old person variation of “no fucks given”?
It’s actually “take no prisoners”. To “give quarter” is to abstain from killing a defeated enemy.
I understood almost none of this panel.