Perfectly reasonable that he sees it that way, but I’ll defend Amber a bit here. Assuming they’re both overreading AG’s text to Ethan and it really just says “We’ve broken up”, not “I forbid you contact with Danny”, then it’s really just Sal that Amber has a problem with Danny talking to. And that’s all tied up in her triggery reaction to Sal, not in any attempt to control Danny. She didn’t have any problem with Danny going to Joyce’s party and talking to anyone there before she showed up – though she would have if she’d known that Sal was there.
Amber certainly has problems, serious ones, but that kind of controlling abuse isn’t one of them.
Yeah, I don’t think Amber is anything like her father. I think she’s badly handling her trauma, and obviously that’s causing her to act in a bad way, and be cruel to both the people she loves and herself, and she could use some therapy for sure- but she’s not an abusive person, and she’s not a bad person. I can’t imagine her trying to keep Danny and Ethan from talking, and even if she felt like she wanted to, I think it’d be based in hurt, because she feels like she keeps driving people away and they keep choosing someone else over her, (which would relate to her feelings about Ethan) rather than a desire to control anyone. I think the only person she wants to be able to control is herself. She’s a good kid, she’s just also not taking care of herself like she needs to be, and it’s coming out negatively. Danny had no way of knowing about her history with Sal, and /Sal/ doesn’t know about her history with Sal- if he had known, he probably would have been more tactful about it.
DOA has been good at showing how trauma manifests in different ways. Joyce can’t be alone anymore, because of hers, and Amber’s anger probably comes from not properly processing her trauma as related to her father and Sal. She probably would be able to move on from it after some therapy.
I don’t think Amber is the shitbag Blaine is. But I think she is understandably worried that she’s like him, and I think she does have some traits similar to him.
Her anger, for example. She genuinely does have anger issues.
Her tendency to externalize blame, as another example. Sal is the one at fault for saving Amazi-Girl’s life, not Amazi-Girl’s own mistakes in the chase. Danny is responsible for ‘betraying’ her, and Sal ‘turned’ Danny against her, rather than she considering the fact that Danny has no way of knowing her history with Sal and furthermore he might be speaking from concern for her well-being rather than a desire to betray.
Her tendency to initiate, instigate and inflame conflicts when she encounters them, rather than seeking to defuse and avoid them. See the parking lot fight, or the situation with the engineers vandalizing the sign – Amazi-Girl and Amber both look for the violent solution to the problem before non-violence is even considered.
I could go on here. I don’t disagree with you that it’s a response to the trauma of an abusive upbringing and having her best friend held hostage – but that doesn’t mean Amber’s worries of being like Blaine are entirely unfounded. I think she’s at a cross-roads, and depending on which way she decides to walk, she can either start to heal from her trauma, or she can continue to become more and more abusive and volatile.
From personal experience: That your abuser doesn’t want or intend to be abusive does not mean they aren’t. When I was growing up, my dad was Blaine-level awful at times, and genuinely thought he was doing good because he was less awful than his parents – stuff he would’ve gotten the switch or belt for, he hit me with his hands over, and stuff he would’ve been smacked for, he just berated me over at full bellow for hours while threatening violence if I started to cry. He thought – and was right – that he was doing better than his folks, but he used that to defuse any suggestion that he might be over-reacting or abusive. I worry that Amber is falling into the same trap.
Experience, as they say, is the best teacher. But no one ever said that The Experienced are necessarily the best students. In fact, as you implied, we often need an external perspective from someone we trust – a tutor, or a mentor, or a therapist – to actually make sense of our experience without becoming overly-immersed in our own understanding of our personal narratives, and to help us avoid indulging our own sometimes flawed assumptions.
Amber, by dint of putting on the pretense of an invulnerable heroic mantle (Amazi-Girl), does not trust anyone enough to acquire such a person of influence (except, possibly, Ethan), and is slowly losing what little attachment she has to what grounds her now (Danny). This state of perpetual distrust-by-default can of course be called paranoia, but it’s a little more complicated than that.
By engaging in this distrust, Amber makes and indulges several assumptions: that those who are violent are necessarily toxic (see: Blaine), that those who are toxic are necessarily those who behave violently (see: Sal), and that toxicity is inherent in some people (in her opinion: Blaine, Sal) and contagious to others whom she perceives as vulnerable without someone to protect them (probably: Danny, and though mostly irrelevant to this conversation, also Ethan).
Amazi-Girl, of course, defies these conventions – as far as Amber’s concerned, she has to – so she is violent but not toxic, and trustworthy but not vulnerable. She’s also very suspicious of the influence of individuals she deems toxic, of course (otherwise she’d have no idea who else to villainize or protect), but in her own mind Amber probably defends this as vigilance strictly against toxicity, and not a blanket paranoia or hypervigilance per se – which probably would have been a reasonable defense, if not for her trauma entering the mix at a very inconvenient time.
So now, while ego and alter-ego were both already inherently distrustful and suspicious of any interlopers and unknown quantities in Amber’s life, the distrust and suspicion were never as bad as they are now. As a result of her being triggered by an unfortunate convergence of events, this distrust apparently has evolved to extend to “people she trusted who she now is painfully aware do exist and can be exposed to contagious toxicity even when she’s not personally observing them”, and thus her worldview can at this point properly be called Paranoia.
(It’s probably apparent that I have some experience with this.)
In the present scenario, Amber is assuming Danny has been affected by what she perceives as influential toxic corruption in the form of Sal: He’s making the (“corrupt”) suggestion that she hang up her untouchable alter-ego (and not really giving her a reason she’d accept). In her worldview, listening to him is now equivalent to letting toxicity win or dominate, and his suggestion implies Danny has given himself over to Sal’s influence. Not only that, but as far as she’s concerned, he’s being just a tad evangelical about it, by suggesting there’s no reason Sal should be considered persona non grata in Amber’s book, and simultaneously outright stating that she isn’t in his own book.
By opposing these particular suggestions, and embracing her opposition to them with reckless abandon (which is itself an extreme and integral trait belonging to Amazi-Girl, manifesting another aspect of Amber’s idealized notion of heroism), she accelerates towards becoming self-centered, taking her attachments to things that are in reality external to her “self” (Danny) and being zealously territorial and domineering towards the objects of her attachments (at the moment, thankfully, it’s just Danny) which refuse to maintain the same boundaries she perceives as absolutely necessary.
In other words, by making the idea of Amazi-Girl so unbreakable, she has established several taboos for others, while reasoning with minimal or no grounding in an understanding of how trustworthy people behave or function – a behavior pattern which is, make no mistake, at the root of the development of many a sociopathic personal character.
Having no mentor or therapist, however, she isn’t cognizant of this flaw in her reasoning processes, and so doesn’t see how her character is becoming tragically more like her father’s, but as the audience, it’s quite apparent to us.
I don’t see it as abusive control, I think Amber’s engulfed in her internal coping narrative to the point where she’s lost sight of where it ends and reality begins.
She became angry when she caught Danny talking to Sal, then enraged when he didn’t understand why that was a problem for her, even though she never told him about it. Remember, the core law of Amber’s world is that Sal is evil. Danny associated with evil, then didn’t follow the script when caught, so now he’s blacklisted. The fact that he had no way to know Amber’s history with Sal is irrelevant, because anyone can tell Sal is obviously pure evil.
Her intentions explain her actions, the don’t excusethem. It is abusive control, it is just, like much abuse, partially predicated by her past trauma.
Her intentions mean she may be able to recognize this with time and improve, which is hopeful. And, as many have pointed out, this is relatively minor compared to much of what she’s been through, so she is fighting not to become the monster, which is admirable.
But what she does here and now counts. You don’t get a mulligan on hurting other people.
If only it were that simple. Amber’s is not someone with a normally functioning brain who grew up in an abusive household and thus considers lesser abuse to be normal. If that’s anyone, that’s Danny.
Amber is someone with a mental illness who has channeled her abusive parts into an alternate personality. One that she thinks she can control, but is clearly losing control over.
Her problem isn’t knowing what she’s doing is wrong. Or, at least, that’s not her only problem. Her big problem is that she’s losing control over herself.
In fact, I fully expect her to be beating up on herself fairly soon. As Danny says here, she literally hates a whole part of herself.
I don’t think she could actually become her father. I think her mental illness precludes that. What’s worse, though, is that she could lose control and become not her father, but a worse version of ToeDad.
Pretty much. And I’ll say this: Amber’s biggest quality that separates her from Blaine is that she usually realizes, at least after the fact, what she’s doing and who she’s emulating. She is abusive, but she isn’t trying to be, she isn’t blinding herself to that, AND she’s trying to get away from that part of her personality.
Unfortunately for her it’s not a quick process. She’s made it as far as being able to interact with people in general, as both personas, without revealing the extent of her damage. But she hasn’t made it far enough to be able to deal with the people closest to her when they do something she doesn’t agree with, or to deal with Sal, who she associates with her initial rage breakthrough. Amazi-Girl is better in both regards but not by much: as Amber, she gets enraged and becomes completely irrational; as Amazi-Girl, she still gets enraged, she can just control her actions.
Amber is not mentally ill. She is however messed up. She does not have alternate personalities, she has an assumed identity. She is perfectly aware of what she is doing as a coping mechanism. It is a less than perfect arrangement, but it allows her to deal safely with her aggressive and violent aspects by surrounding them with Amazigirl’s strict comic-inspired code. However insane attempting to be a super-hero may appear, by dent of hard effort and developed skill, Amber succeeds at it. At the same time, the Amazigirl identity is important to Amber and she is not going to be easily receptive to any suggestion that she give it up. When she tell’s Danny that Amazigirl is more important to Amber than he is, she is saying nothing more than the unvarnished truth.
There is plenty of evidence that Amber has issues with anger and violent impulses she can’t control. Repeated echoing comments to the contrary, there is no evidence that Amber is particularly controlling and no evidence that she is particularly abusive. She takes actions which are primarily dangerous to herself and not to other people. Even when a “wrong-doer” deals with Amazigirl, they are met with violence only in response to violence.
Amber believes that Sal is dangerous. This is a completely reasonable assumption given what she knows. Given that, it is completely reasonable she would fear Sal’s association with Ethan or Danny.
There has been quite a lot of Danny-hate in the past for not acting on information he didn’t have. Danning things up. But in this case, he actually screwed up badly. Amber was actually in the process of giving him the information he needed to know to understand where she was coming from so he would know what she needed to know. Instead of listening, he pushed ahead with the spiel supporting Sal’s point of view. What Amber does is dangerous. If Danny didn’t know her behavior was risky before this point, he is stupider than he has been shown as being. Taking that risk was part of why Danny was proud of her. Amber, and what she does hasn’t changed; Danny’s opinion of it has changed. Amber is completely right. Sal got to him. What she is hearing from Danny is exactly what she was hearing from Sal in the aftermath of the rescue. She trusted Danny to be supportive. He is failing that trust. She is angry about it and has every right to be.
Given communication the situation can be fixed. I am rather pessimistic that it will be in the short run and possibly not the long run either.
But: Amber is not crazy. Amber is not insane. Amber is not about to go postal. Amber is not dangerous except in a limited context. Amber is not abusive. Amber is not particularly controlling. Amber is not her father, albeit this is largely by choice.
Could I be wrong about any of these things? Well sure. Willis gets the last word.
Gabriel , I expect ,
A little feeling,
That your soul jumps into the water,
My body ocean .
Zephyr , the wind,
You lie like a child,
And you’re running around up there ,
Once your sky splits .
Are you done for him ,
Are you made me me?
I do not expect that In sign from you .
If you harm him,
I miss you,
So be it , but tell me … tell me
Oh oh oh…
Gabriel , my king ,
My angel in whom I believe ,
If love comes from above ,
Will you make a choice !
Zephyr , you lie ,
Fever in the blood,
I pray that again
You come back to me in time.
Are you done for him ,
Are you for me?
I expect a sign from you .
If you harm him,
I miss you,
So be it , but tell me … tell me
Oh oh oh…
Gabriel
Grabiel , expects ,
In more than one sense ,
A pleasure burning her skin,
The two wings forward!
This is what happens when an abuse survivor gets out and gets close to someone who isn’t terrible. Danny’s got no clue how to deal with someone who doesn’t spend their time convincing him he’s a useless shit.
(No, Amber didn’t, but she was too much of a mess in other ways to undo what his parents did)
Nonsense, Danny’s overflowing with self-esteem and totally believes that he’s worthy of awesome partners that don’t belittle him. And this is clearly because of all the wonderful support his family have given him, never treating him like he’s just ancillary baggage to whatever “great girl” who he manages to “tie down”.
It would have been interesting to see a little more of his and Dorothy’s relationship. I can’t see her spending her time convincing him he’s a useless shit. Granted they were younger and he was still with his parents everyday, but I’m sure she tried to help too.
Ah, but Dorothy is an overachiever. Which means while she would doubtless tell Danny he’s wonderful and worthy of love, she would also encourage him to live up to his potential and set a near-impossible-for-him example of what that means.
Combined with the denigration of others, Dorothy – through no fault of her own – would probably be “proof” that he’s just not as good as other people.
Though, even as an Amber defender, I would say that the way she broke up with him can count as making him feel like shit, like he was the one doing something wrong.
(in case you don’t know, I’m an Amber defended in the form of “she has a mental disorder and is not a horrible person” camp, not the “Amber didn’t do anything wrong” camp.)
Don’t either of them know about Amber’s mental illness? I assumed Ethan did.
I don’t know if they realize how problematic it is. I’m pretty sure they just assume it’s a persona that gives her extra freedom, not an actual near-split personality. It doesn’t help that Danny (as I remember) doesn’t have much knowledge of the background, so OBVIOUSLY couldn’t predict that Sal could be a trigger (and Ethan has never interacted with Sal at all).
Serial killers also have a mental illness. It’s called antisocial personality disorder. That doesn’t mean that they should be given a free pass when they go around murdering people.
Speaking as someone who has borderline personality disorder, which is characterised as an extreme instability in interpersonal relationships, I can either sit back and be like “well it doesn’t matter if I hurt people with my behaviour cause I have a mental illness” or I can do what I actually do, which is recognise the symptoms and stop myself before I go around hurting people.
There’s a difference between treating people like a horrible person just for having a mental illness, and treating people like a horrible person because they do horrible things regardless of their reason for doing so. It is never OK to hurt your loved ones.
… when I went to Uni, because I wasn’t being bullied and abused by people around me, I spent a lot of my time marveling at how nice everyone seemed and on the other hand also waiting for the other shoe to drop because I knew my dad could seem that nice but he wasn’t really so I was waiting for people to drop their masks, but it never happened.
Cue a bunch of really strange conversations I had with people where I was basically fishing for harsh criticism because I didn’t trust that they didn’t have it and apologizing excessively.
Eventually someone told me to quit apologizing for existing and that I’m not the monster I think I am, and that the only time I get annoying is when I’m trying to convince others of how horrible I am. Not exactly the most tactful way to put it, but it actually made me re-evaluate my base assumption of what I as a person was worth.
Hopefully Danny has someone to say something similar to him.
(Unless your mother is an abusive jerkface, in which case you totally don’t owe her jack. But if your mom is pretty good, give her a call, she worries.) 🙂
This one really hit hard. Amber is my spirit animal. I understand on a personal level what it’s like to hate everything you are. Seeing Danny react like this though? I need to change. I can’t hurt the people I love just because I hate myself.
I mean, hurting the people I love is par for the course, but I hate existing and I can’t stop because stopping would hurt them. They won’t stop loving me, so I’m trapped into existing because I’m not willing to hurt them that bad, but they don’t see how bad I am in their lives. It’s really hard, and the longer I live the harder it seems to get.
If they don’t see how bad you are in their lives, sorry to break it to you but it’s their own feeling about their own lives that counts, not your feeling about their lives. Acknowleding other people’s perspective rather than projecting yourself on them can do wonders for one’s appreciation of life.
I probably sound cold, but this actually is a little part of what I learned that got me out of similar patterns. I’m pretty happy now. (Which of course took many years of struggle and also some (mostly group) therapy.)
Well, if you sound cold, then so do I, because it’s what I just said as well; and it’s true. The true effect of a person on another person is judged by the one affected, not the one doing the affecting. That’s just as true in this situation as it is in any other.
Acknowleding other people’s perspective rather than projecting yourself on them can do wonders for one’s appreciation of life.
This. Been working extra hard on that lately and have never felt so connected to the people I talk to. It’s helps the depression.
Manapan, the self-realization and gratitude in your comment is beautiful. 🙂
HMH, I know that awful struggle. That hit me in the gut. I just wish I could reach through the screen and squeeze your hand and say that it gets better. I know it sounds like bullshit. But, it can, and will get better. Your feelings are all too real, but depression is lying to you to get you to feel that way because depression’s an asshole.
Anything you feel you’re taking from your loved ones, you also have the ability to return, even if you don’t feel that way now. They love you because your existence is precious to them. I’m a stranger and I’m rooting for you. You can regain your happiness to exist–and you 1000% deserve to. I know you’re weary. It’s slow going. You won’t wake up one random day ‘fixed’ all of a sudden. But happiness can return, drop by drop, if you don’t give up.
HMH, it could relax you to find other reasons to keep on existing besides “to stop would mean to hurt them”.
It would distribute tension and help balance things, which in turn would build a positive feedback loop.
Maybe they don’t see how bad you are in their lives because objectively you’re not as bad in their lives as you feel you are. Maybe they think that, whatever the complications of knowing you may be, they’re things they’re happy to keep dealing with because it means you’re still there to benefit them by your good traits. People who hate themselves tend not to think they have any good traits, but everyone has good traits. And the people who experience the benefits of knowing you are the ones who know whether they’re benefiting or not. It doesn’t make much sense to tell somebody that they don’t get as much out of knowing you as they think they do. Maybe you need to consider the thought that when they declare that you’re not a Net Bad in their lives, it’s because you really aren’t.
Yes, stopping to hurt the people we love by our self-hatred is important.
And finding a way to see where what we do actually hurts others and is our responsibility and where our mind goes off the deep end and tells us we do or are responsible but we are just caught up in the old thought patterns of self-hatred is mightily important.
I learned that my values were totally fucked-up where this was concerned and had been busy trying to control stuff that never really bothered anyone because in my mind it was a huge – and BAD – thing – and ignored stuff where I really hurt others.
And the same thing does not hurt different people in the same way. There are people who are really hurt when you snap at them (because history) and others who just snap back snarkily and it never touches their self-esteem.
Hope you all find a therapist, group or method where your feelings can all be there and the therapist does not fear them and who can point out to you where your mind tells you ridiculous things that make life complicated.
Most of those are either stuff someone told over and over again or the ways your mind tried to find an explanation for the uncontrollable and horrible things that happened – and most of those explanations are wrong! They just tend to stick around.
Amber’s “I’m not fit to be around people because I can’t be trusted to defend them physically when they are attacked with a weapon – and also I get very angry sometime and cannot be trusted not to attack people” is a prime example of fucked-up thinking.
Most people are not sure if they would defend someone in a physical attack. It doesn’t fit the superhero image we’d like to be but wtf? Not doing something in a particular situation makes you feel helpless and worthless but that reaction is totally independent of the real possibility to help you had.
The second one is a harder nut because it mixes a bad “solution” (not let Amber be around people) with a real, has to be addressed problem: Amber does get angry in dangerous ways *sometimes* and she has to find a way to deal with this.
Right now, both are totally mixed in her mind and just serve to fuel her self-hatred.
And as long as she does this Blain wins again and again.
Manapan and HMH: These are very important and serious thoughts/feelings, and you aren’t alone. Do you have a therapist or trusted person with whom to talk this out?
HMH, I was in exactly the same place as you a few years ago; I hated being alive and wanted to die, but I couldn’t kill myself because I didn’t want to hurt the people I love. At the darkest point of my depression (and reliving this still makes me cry) I was talking to a friend about suicide, and he made me realise something that ultimately became the turning point towards the road to recovery. I needed to find a positive reason why I was continuing not to kill myself, because if you die, you’re dead, nothing matters any more. He helped me rephrase my negative reason into a positive one, and this also applies to you: I was still alive because there were people who cared about me, and would care if I died. That one simple thought empowered me to start the slow process of healing, and it became an aegis that I could reach for when the darkness and the pain felt overwhelming.
Sorry for the rambly, morbid post; it was extremely hard for me to stay composed while writing this but I couldn’t just scroll past when I saw someone that I could just possibly help.
I doubt this post helps only one person. Thank you for telling your story even though it’s still so painful. And reading how your friend helped you so well makes me want to do celebratory backflips for you AND him. 🙂
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline
1 (800) 273-8255
This isn’t just for people having suicidal thoughts. If you know someone who is struggling and don’t know how to help, call. They can help you too.
Wow, Danny has been really likeable lately. Amber’s issues have really endeared him to me. He has a point though, how crazy is it that she went off at him for talking to Sal, when she’s never told him to not talk to Sal or even made him aware of her disdain for Sal
It’s actually a really good thing that they broke up because of that. if she had just gotten angry and said don’t talk to her. she would have started accelerating down the road to being her dad.
I like Ethan. Thank you Ethan, for being kind. I miss that one scene from years ago that was Ethan being frustrated and Dina was nice to him and they were just together in a scene handling the world in a healthy way for a minute. How many years has it been since we had a scene like that?
it’s been less than a year. In fact, in the last 12 months there have been two groups of strips that include Ethan and Dina being nice to each other and helping each other through challenging times. One even included them kinda coming out to each other.
Oh, sorry, I see what you mean. I just meant since we had a scene in which no one was being motivated by whatever dark piece of drama, I realize that people are nice to each other sometimes, even here. I really am sorry, I have to work on being clear and not introducing inappropriate hyperbole.
Is it just me, or did Ethan pull out the most uncomfortable looking chair he could find?
(And yes, I realize that lobbies aren’t exactly full of moveable chairs.
Aha, good Danny…there is the care for Amber’s feelings that I was looking for him to bring up to Ethan.
Yeah, agree with the hovertip, that is a nice looking butt on Ethan.
Maybe that’s part of the problem Danny can’t talk to him.
Ethan’s big broad shoulders and jaw are very close to perfect as well. it’s sad that they’re breaking up, but i have to agree with Danny that their relationship had a lot of problems. i’m still hoping that Amber will get better, even if they don’t go out again.
Panel 1: Aw, Danny’s appreciating all the close conversations with Ethan and is being willing to open up a bit about stuff. That’s definitely what he needs. I’m a little worried that he might be interpreting his ex’s mental illnesses as some deficiency on his part though given this and his early lines. Like, that might be a premature worry, but it definitely feels like he’s internalizing a lot more than he should.
Panel 2: Oh man, that first part as he goes a little bit into his trauma/shocked face a bit remembering and trying to deconstruct what exactly happened at the end there and the unreasonableness of Amber’s demands at that point. Poor Danny.
And that second part, oh poor Amber… cause yeah, Amber’s self-hatred really has gotten to a whole ‘nother level and it’s definitely rough at first dating someone who truly despises themselves, especially when you don’t have the requisite experience dating someone with suicidal ideation and depression.
Panel 3: Oh man, there’s so much in that unspoken phrase right there. “How much she’s damaging herself by not…” loving herself, protecting herself, being fully aware of reality, viewing her scattered pieces as irreconcilable. And that awareness may have hit more home than he might like, because she was by far not the only person in that relationship who did not view themselves as a full person or as inherently worthy of love.
Panel 4: Which I think he realizes here. Given how quickly he shuts things down and crawls back into himself.
And I think it also reveals how out of the ordinary in his life someone being supportive and caring and listening to him without judgment is. Joe would have mocked him by now. His parents would have mercilessly teased him about letting another “great girl” get away.
But Ethan cares about him and listens and gives him the space, but at this point, the censor is already in his head and won’t let him truly spill forth like he desperately needs to.
Probably doesn’t also help that he doesn’t fully trust himself to spill forth without possibly “ruining” his friendship with Ethan by acknowledging his attraction.
Panel 5: And here we get a poor Ethan moment, because he doesn’t really have anyone himself to be close to and he’s always defined friendship support as quietly supporting those he’s close to, especially with Amber. This is important to Ethan to be trusted and cared for and let in, especially as he’s scared that his current two better friends at the moment are splitting away from each other a bit. He needs Danny as much as Danny needs him.
Panel 6: Oh, Danny, when will you learn that putting your romantic interests on a pedestal helps no one?
Panel 6: I think Danny would really rather not put Ethan on a pedestal (or indeed, he’d probably rather not be crushing on him at all, as it’s confusing and inconvenient right now). But, Danny feels like Ethan isn’t giving him any flaws to work with, he’s not giving Danny the opportunity to take Ethan offa there.
And/or Danny feels that he’s terrible, and it’s really jarring that somebody is great and doesn’t think that Danny is also terrible.
From first-hand experience in a similar type of thing (people in general being far nicer to me than I was used to or at the time believed I deserved): Could also be that Danny doesn’t feel like he deserves to be treated with such compassion, and when Ethan treats him with compassion anyway, it’s frustration of the “God dammit, I know the niceness is some sort of a mask and it’s going to crack eventually so will you just slip already? You don’t need to be Saint Ethan, and I know I don’t deserve it so let’s just get on with it and tell me what you really think” variety.
… maybe projecting 18YO me into Ethan’s headspace a bit there, though.
Panel 3: Yeah, there are so much of Danny’s issues here, but that one is pure worry about Amber. Danny tried his best to keep her safe… and now he can’t do that any longer.
Oh no! Ethan is being TOO nice to Danny! What ever shall Danny do??? Maybe he should kiss Ethan as punishment! Yea, that’ll show that punk for being so nice and perfect and muscular and breathtaking and– you get the point
Yeah, as I suspected, Danny wasn’t ignorant of Amber’s many problems. Bless him, he was even trying to help in his sweet, ineffective way. The problem is, of course, that you can only help someone if they want to be helped and I’m not sure that Amber is in the mental and emotional place where she’s willing to accept help.
Yeah, Ethan is sort of disturbingly perfect sometimes, isn’t he? He’d be impossible if it weren’t for his toy obsession and lack of personal drive.
Sigh. Dammit Danny, you’re being far too hard on yourself. You remind me of my older days when I’d always blame myself on anything that happened to my parents’ relationship and I emphatise too much on what people are feeling to care about my own feelings. Give yourself credit for once in your life.
Sal has absolutely no idea that Amber hates her, let alone why. I mean, I’m sure she hasn’t forgotten neither her robbery attempt nor having her hand stabbed through, but she has no idea that the girl involved in those events was Amber.
Nope, she doesn’t know. The event didn’t traumatize her like it did Amber. While she did get stabbed, I’m not 100% sure she even got a good look at who attacked her. And even if she had…Ethan was the one she held hostage, and she only has a vague memory of what he looked like. Enough to look at him and think “hmm I know him from somewhere” but not enough to realize who he is.
Ehm, for some reason I get an access denied error when trying to access the site from my computer. Did my IP randomly change to that of someone who was blocked or something?
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Wow, the victim relationship part is really showing.
“there are people I shouldn’t be talking to”. He’s getting in his head those aren’t his choice anymore.
Add that to the text Amber sent to Ethan earlier too… 😐 controlling
not a perfect comparison but something i heard before
“It is good for your significant other to be your best friend. It is bad for them to be your only friend.”
That’s a fairly good point.
Yeah. This incarnation of Amber isn’t really far off from her father, isn’t she?
Perfectly reasonable that he sees it that way, but I’ll defend Amber a bit here. Assuming they’re both overreading AG’s text to Ethan and it really just says “We’ve broken up”, not “I forbid you contact with Danny”, then it’s really just Sal that Amber has a problem with Danny talking to. And that’s all tied up in her triggery reaction to Sal, not in any attempt to control Danny. She didn’t have any problem with Danny going to Joyce’s party and talking to anyone there before she showed up – though she would have if she’d known that Sal was there.
Amber certainly has problems, serious ones, but that kind of controlling abuse isn’t one of them.
Yeah, I don’t think Amber is anything like her father. I think she’s badly handling her trauma, and obviously that’s causing her to act in a bad way, and be cruel to both the people she loves and herself, and she could use some therapy for sure- but she’s not an abusive person, and she’s not a bad person. I can’t imagine her trying to keep Danny and Ethan from talking, and even if she felt like she wanted to, I think it’d be based in hurt, because she feels like she keeps driving people away and they keep choosing someone else over her, (which would relate to her feelings about Ethan) rather than a desire to control anyone. I think the only person she wants to be able to control is herself. She’s a good kid, she’s just also not taking care of herself like she needs to be, and it’s coming out negatively. Danny had no way of knowing about her history with Sal, and /Sal/ doesn’t know about her history with Sal- if he had known, he probably would have been more tactful about it.
DOA has been good at showing how trauma manifests in different ways. Joyce can’t be alone anymore, because of hers, and Amber’s anger probably comes from not properly processing her trauma as related to her father and Sal. She probably would be able to move on from it after some therapy.
I both agree and disagree.
I don’t think Amber is the shitbag Blaine is. But I think she is understandably worried that she’s like him, and I think she does have some traits similar to him.
Her anger, for example. She genuinely does have anger issues.
Her tendency to externalize blame, as another example. Sal is the one at fault for saving Amazi-Girl’s life, not Amazi-Girl’s own mistakes in the chase. Danny is responsible for ‘betraying’ her, and Sal ‘turned’ Danny against her, rather than she considering the fact that Danny has no way of knowing her history with Sal and furthermore he might be speaking from concern for her well-being rather than a desire to betray.
Her tendency to initiate, instigate and inflame conflicts when she encounters them, rather than seeking to defuse and avoid them. See the parking lot fight, or the situation with the engineers vandalizing the sign – Amazi-Girl and Amber both look for the violent solution to the problem before non-violence is even considered.
I could go on here. I don’t disagree with you that it’s a response to the trauma of an abusive upbringing and having her best friend held hostage – but that doesn’t mean Amber’s worries of being like Blaine are entirely unfounded. I think she’s at a cross-roads, and depending on which way she decides to walk, she can either start to heal from her trauma, or she can continue to become more and more abusive and volatile.
From personal experience: That your abuser doesn’t want or intend to be abusive does not mean they aren’t. When I was growing up, my dad was Blaine-level awful at times, and genuinely thought he was doing good because he was less awful than his parents – stuff he would’ve gotten the switch or belt for, he hit me with his hands over, and stuff he would’ve been smacked for, he just berated me over at full bellow for hours while threatening violence if I started to cry. He thought – and was right – that he was doing better than his folks, but he used that to defuse any suggestion that he might be over-reacting or abusive. I worry that Amber is falling into the same trap.
This one. This this this.
Amber isn’t trying to be the bad guy. She’s just trying to defend herself. But that’s not enough to make her behavior acceptable.
damn. it hurts how much i relate to this. and i genuinely like my dad! but he hurt me a lot growing up.
Experience, as they say, is the best teacher. But no one ever said that The Experienced are necessarily the best students. In fact, as you implied, we often need an external perspective from someone we trust – a tutor, or a mentor, or a therapist – to actually make sense of our experience without becoming overly-immersed in our own understanding of our personal narratives, and to help us avoid indulging our own sometimes flawed assumptions.
Amber, by dint of putting on the pretense of an invulnerable heroic mantle (Amazi-Girl), does not trust anyone enough to acquire such a person of influence (except, possibly, Ethan), and is slowly losing what little attachment she has to what grounds her now (Danny). This state of perpetual distrust-by-default can of course be called paranoia, but it’s a little more complicated than that.
By engaging in this distrust, Amber makes and indulges several assumptions: that those who are violent are necessarily toxic (see: Blaine), that those who are toxic are necessarily those who behave violently (see: Sal), and that toxicity is inherent in some people (in her opinion: Blaine, Sal) and contagious to others whom she perceives as vulnerable without someone to protect them (probably: Danny, and though mostly irrelevant to this conversation, also Ethan).
Amazi-Girl, of course, defies these conventions – as far as Amber’s concerned, she has to – so she is violent but not toxic, and trustworthy but not vulnerable. She’s also very suspicious of the influence of individuals she deems toxic, of course (otherwise she’d have no idea who else to villainize or protect), but in her own mind Amber probably defends this as vigilance strictly against toxicity, and not a blanket paranoia or hypervigilance per se – which probably would have been a reasonable defense, if not for her trauma entering the mix at a very inconvenient time.
So now, while ego and alter-ego were both already inherently distrustful and suspicious of any interlopers and unknown quantities in Amber’s life, the distrust and suspicion were never as bad as they are now. As a result of her being triggered by an unfortunate convergence of events, this distrust apparently has evolved to extend to “people she trusted who she now is painfully aware do exist and can be exposed to contagious toxicity even when she’s not personally observing them”, and thus her worldview can at this point properly be called Paranoia.
(It’s probably apparent that I have some experience with this.)
In the present scenario, Amber is assuming Danny has been affected by what she perceives as influential toxic corruption in the form of Sal: He’s making the (“corrupt”) suggestion that she hang up her untouchable alter-ego (and not really giving her a reason she’d accept). In her worldview, listening to him is now equivalent to letting toxicity win or dominate, and his suggestion implies Danny has given himself over to Sal’s influence. Not only that, but as far as she’s concerned, he’s being just a tad evangelical about it, by suggesting there’s no reason Sal should be considered persona non grata in Amber’s book, and simultaneously outright stating that she isn’t in his own book.
By opposing these particular suggestions, and embracing her opposition to them with reckless abandon (which is itself an extreme and integral trait belonging to Amazi-Girl, manifesting another aspect of Amber’s idealized notion of heroism), she accelerates towards becoming self-centered, taking her attachments to things that are in reality external to her “self” (Danny) and being zealously territorial and domineering towards the objects of her attachments (at the moment, thankfully, it’s just Danny) which refuse to maintain the same boundaries she perceives as absolutely necessary.
In other words, by making the idea of Amazi-Girl so unbreakable, she has established several taboos for others, while reasoning with minimal or no grounding in an understanding of how trustworthy people behave or function – a behavior pattern which is, make no mistake, at the root of the development of many a sociopathic personal character.
Having no mentor or therapist, however, she isn’t cognizant of this flaw in her reasoning processes, and so doesn’t see how her character is becoming tragically more like her father’s, but as the audience, it’s quite apparent to us.
I don’t see it as abusive control, I think Amber’s engulfed in her internal coping narrative to the point where she’s lost sight of where it ends and reality begins.
She became angry when she caught Danny talking to Sal, then enraged when he didn’t understand why that was a problem for her, even though she never told him about it. Remember, the core law of Amber’s world is that Sal is evil. Danny associated with evil, then didn’t follow the script when caught, so now he’s blacklisted. The fact that he had no way to know Amber’s history with Sal is irrelevant, because anyone can tell Sal is obviously pure evil.
Her intentions explain her actions, the don’t excusethem. It is abusive control, it is just, like much abuse, partially predicated by her past trauma.
Her intentions mean she may be able to recognize this with time and improve, which is hopeful. And, as many have pointed out, this is relatively minor compared to much of what she’s been through, so she is fighting not to become the monster, which is admirable.
But what she does here and now counts. You don’t get a mulligan on hurting other people.
It is abuse, and certainly isn’t excusable, but she decided to cut Danny out completely rather than force him into “his place” in her world.
If only it were that simple. Amber’s is not someone with a normally functioning brain who grew up in an abusive household and thus considers lesser abuse to be normal. If that’s anyone, that’s Danny.
Amber is someone with a mental illness who has channeled her abusive parts into an alternate personality. One that she thinks she can control, but is clearly losing control over.
Her problem isn’t knowing what she’s doing is wrong. Or, at least, that’s not her only problem. Her big problem is that she’s losing control over herself.
In fact, I fully expect her to be beating up on herself fairly soon. As Danny says here, she literally hates a whole part of herself.
I don’t think she could actually become her father. I think her mental illness precludes that. What’s worse, though, is that she could lose control and become not her father, but a worse version of ToeDad.
Pretty much. And I’ll say this: Amber’s biggest quality that separates her from Blaine is that she usually realizes, at least after the fact, what she’s doing and who she’s emulating. She is abusive, but she isn’t trying to be, she isn’t blinding herself to that, AND she’s trying to get away from that part of her personality.
Unfortunately for her it’s not a quick process. She’s made it as far as being able to interact with people in general, as both personas, without revealing the extent of her damage. But she hasn’t made it far enough to be able to deal with the people closest to her when they do something she doesn’t agree with, or to deal with Sal, who she associates with her initial rage breakthrough. Amazi-Girl is better in both regards but not by much: as Amber, she gets enraged and becomes completely irrational; as Amazi-Girl, she still gets enraged, she can just control her actions.
Amber is not mentally ill. She is however messed up. She does not have alternate personalities, she has an assumed identity. She is perfectly aware of what she is doing as a coping mechanism. It is a less than perfect arrangement, but it allows her to deal safely with her aggressive and violent aspects by surrounding them with Amazigirl’s strict comic-inspired code. However insane attempting to be a super-hero may appear, by dent of hard effort and developed skill, Amber succeeds at it. At the same time, the Amazigirl identity is important to Amber and she is not going to be easily receptive to any suggestion that she give it up. When she tell’s Danny that Amazigirl is more important to Amber than he is, she is saying nothing more than the unvarnished truth.
There is plenty of evidence that Amber has issues with anger and violent impulses she can’t control. Repeated echoing comments to the contrary, there is no evidence that Amber is particularly controlling and no evidence that she is particularly abusive. She takes actions which are primarily dangerous to herself and not to other people. Even when a “wrong-doer” deals with Amazigirl, they are met with violence only in response to violence.
Amber believes that Sal is dangerous. This is a completely reasonable assumption given what she knows. Given that, it is completely reasonable she would fear Sal’s association with Ethan or Danny.
There has been quite a lot of Danny-hate in the past for not acting on information he didn’t have. Danning things up. But in this case, he actually screwed up badly. Amber was actually in the process of giving him the information he needed to know to understand where she was coming from so he would know what she needed to know. Instead of listening, he pushed ahead with the spiel supporting Sal’s point of view. What Amber does is dangerous. If Danny didn’t know her behavior was risky before this point, he is stupider than he has been shown as being. Taking that risk was part of why Danny was proud of her. Amber, and what she does hasn’t changed; Danny’s opinion of it has changed. Amber is completely right. Sal got to him. What she is hearing from Danny is exactly what she was hearing from Sal in the aftermath of the rescue. She trusted Danny to be supportive. He is failing that trust. She is angry about it and has every right to be.
Given communication the situation can be fixed. I am rather pessimistic that it will be in the short run and possibly not the long run either.
But: Amber is not crazy. Amber is not insane. Amber is not about to go postal. Amber is not dangerous except in a limited context. Amber is not abusive. Amber is not particularly controlling. Amber is not her father, albeit this is largely by choice.
Could I be wrong about any of these things? Well sure. Willis gets the last word.
Willis STOP with that mouseover text
Telling Willis to stop talking about BUTTS? Good luck with that.
He got infected by JephJacques.
I think that was the other way around.
Pretty sure they just infect each other. Never ending butts syndrome
The Neverending Butt Disease, la la la, la la la, la la la
He love’s teasing the shippers, doesn’t he?
I’m so teased right now T__T
There is no cure for Butts Disease.
Only a treatment; ANAL LUBE!
And more cowbell
*keeps the Muzak in karaoke mode and hands the menu and microphone to the next one in line*
heheh, this should be good. 🙂
*taps mic* This thing on? *”Any man of mine” by shania twain starts on the karaoke machine*
“Any man of mine… better walk the liiiiinnne”
If you guys spoke French you’d understand that the only right song atm is this : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYmWLakvgIY
Hope the clip’s message is clear enough XD
Quick translation of the main lyrics : “Are you made for him, are you made for me”
Very nice. There is probably something by Edith Piaf that would be appropriately heart-rending as well…
Rough translation:
Gabriel , I expect ,
A little feeling,
That your soul jumps into the water,
My body ocean .
Zephyr , the wind,
You lie like a child,
And you’re running around up there ,
Once your sky splits .
Are you done for him ,
Are you made me me?
I do not expect that In sign from you .
If you harm him,
I miss you,
So be it , but tell me … tell me
Oh oh oh…
Gabriel , my king ,
My angel in whom I believe ,
If love comes from above ,
Will you make a choice !
Zephyr , you lie ,
Fever in the blood,
I pray that again
You come back to me in time.
Are you done for him ,
Are you for me?
I expect a sign from you .
If you harm him,
I miss you,
So be it , but tell me … tell me
Oh oh oh…
Gabriel
Grabiel , expects ,
In more than one sense ,
A pleasure burning her skin,
The two wings forward!
Are you done for him ,
Are you for me?
Close to perfect, or perfect when it’s close?
(answer: Yes)
This is actually really pathetic.
This is what happens when an abuse survivor gets out and gets close to someone who isn’t terrible. Danny’s got no clue how to deal with someone who doesn’t spend their time convincing him he’s a useless shit.
(No, Amber didn’t, but she was too much of a mess in other ways to undo what his parents did)
Nonsense, Danny’s overflowing with self-esteem and totally believes that he’s worthy of awesome partners that don’t belittle him. And this is clearly because of all the wonderful support his family have given him, never treating him like he’s just ancillary baggage to whatever “great girl” who he manages to “tie down”.
Just all the self-esteem.
It would have been interesting to see a little more of his and Dorothy’s relationship. I can’t see her spending her time convincing him he’s a useless shit. Granted they were younger and he was still with his parents everyday, but I’m sure she tried to help too.
Ah, but Dorothy is an overachiever. Which means while she would doubtless tell Danny he’s wonderful and worthy of love, she would also encourage him to live up to his potential and set a near-impossible-for-him example of what that means.
Combined with the denigration of others, Dorothy – through no fault of her own – would probably be “proof” that he’s just not as good as other people.
Appreciate the disclaimer.
Though, even as an Amber defender, I would say that the way she broke up with him can count as making him feel like shit, like he was the one doing something wrong.
(in case you don’t know, I’m an Amber defended in the form of “she has a mental disorder and is not a horrible person” camp, not the “Amber didn’t do anything wrong” camp.)
Don’t either of them know about Amber’s mental illness? I assumed Ethan did.
I don’t know if they realize how problematic it is. I’m pretty sure they just assume it’s a persona that gives her extra freedom, not an actual near-split personality. It doesn’t help that Danny (as I remember) doesn’t have much knowledge of the background, so OBVIOUSLY couldn’t predict that Sal could be a trigger (and Ethan has never interacted with Sal at all).
Serial killers also have a mental illness. It’s called antisocial personality disorder. That doesn’t mean that they should be given a free pass when they go around murdering people.
Speaking as someone who has borderline personality disorder, which is characterised as an extreme instability in interpersonal relationships, I can either sit back and be like “well it doesn’t matter if I hurt people with my behaviour cause I have a mental illness” or I can do what I actually do, which is recognise the symptoms and stop myself before I go around hurting people.
Doesn’t make it okay to treat you like a horrible person. That’s bigotry, and I do not stand for it.
There’s a difference between treating people like a horrible person just for having a mental illness, and treating people like a horrible person because they do horrible things regardless of their reason for doing so. It is never OK to hurt your loved ones.
Hi yes this.
… when I went to Uni, because I wasn’t being bullied and abused by people around me, I spent a lot of my time marveling at how nice everyone seemed and on the other hand also waiting for the other shoe to drop because I knew my dad could seem that nice but he wasn’t really so I was waiting for people to drop their masks, but it never happened.
Cue a bunch of really strange conversations I had with people where I was basically fishing for harsh criticism because I didn’t trust that they didn’t have it and apologizing excessively.
Eventually someone told me to quit apologizing for existing and that I’m not the monster I think I am, and that the only time I get annoying is when I’m trying to convince others of how horrible I am. Not exactly the most tactful way to put it, but it actually made me re-evaluate my base assumption of what I as a person was worth.
Hopefully Danny has someone to say something similar to him.
“Stop treating me with respect and consideration, god damn it! Who do you think you are, some sort of saint?”
(GDI someone get these children some self-esteem.)
Pretty sure Ethan can’t be a saint, but he is a mensch.
He’s not a saint, but he IS the second Eaton.
HEY! We all agreed never to talk about that crap again!
I spent an hour and cant find it
I believe the actual statement is “I have enough issues, please stop making me think about my sexual confusion as well.”
aw.
that’s a tall order
all he wants is a tall drink of water
A tiny glass of water! Now I can’t get that My Little Pony episode out of my head.
i like the cut of your jib
Ethan is the male Princess Clara from Drawn Together.
“I’m just another beautiful virgin with great pecs and a super-tight ass that continuously vibrates and tastes like wild berries.”
I have seen no evidence that he’s a giant racist, so maybe not. Also, isn’t Ethan Jewish? That seems like a deal breaker for Clara-hood.
Seeing Danny finally come to terms with Amber’s bullshit is kinda sad, but heartwarming at the same time.
Now if only Amber can do the same…
Passionate yet awkward admittance of attraction in five and counting! 😉
If Ethan didn’t see his pants tighten he’s either made of ice or amazingly oblivious.
…I hadn’t.
Ethan makes us all look bad. He probably got his mother a Mother’s Day gift, too.
And his mother is just awful ugh.
That’s what I’m saying, the guy is as we all wish we could be. He just needs a bit more confidence.
Probably got it weeks in advance of it, too.
A subtle way to remind everyone here to hurry out and get a gift~
nb : argh I keep doing tab+enter, and with the new form setup it erase my nick instead of submitting. uuurgh.
Hello, my friends, call your mothers!
(Unless your mother is an abusive jerkface, in which case you totally don’t owe her jack. But if your mom is pretty good, give her a call, she worries.) 🙂
And now I check and in france it’s the last sunday of may, haha. 3 more to go.
Wish I could.
I miss her.
Hey! I’m even getting it delivered to her 500 miles away… even if it’s scheduled to arrive a day late.
AND he writes thank-you cards.
“…. Sal now has the power to turn people GAY.”
Ethan will always be perfect. It’s science. Gay science. Which is the best science.
Happy is always best.
Ethan is perfect . . . but only in comparison to Danny. And as we all know, that’s a shamefully low bar to clear.
Something like a recipe, bits and pieces (and) bits and pieces. Gay Science!
Just sit on my face, why don’t you?
In my experience, telling someone to stop being perfect just makes them try harder. It can be a terrible road.
This one really hit hard. Amber is my spirit animal. I understand on a personal level what it’s like to hate everything you are. Seeing Danny react like this though? I need to change. I can’t hurt the people I love just because I hate myself.
Thank you, Willis.
I mean, hurting the people I love is par for the course, but I hate existing and I can’t stop because stopping would hurt them. They won’t stop loving me, so I’m trapped into existing because I’m not willing to hurt them that bad, but they don’t see how bad I am in their lives. It’s really hard, and the longer I live the harder it seems to get.
If they don’t see how bad you are in their lives, sorry to break it to you but it’s their own feeling about their own lives that counts, not your feeling about their lives. Acknowleding other people’s perspective rather than projecting yourself on them can do wonders for one’s appreciation of life.
I probably sound cold, but this actually is a little part of what I learned that got me out of similar patterns. I’m pretty happy now. (Which of course took many years of struggle and also some (mostly group) therapy.)
Hope this helps in some way shape or form.
Well, if you sound cold, then so do I, because it’s what I just said as well; and it’s true. The true effect of a person on another person is judged by the one affected, not the one doing the affecting. That’s just as true in this situation as it is in any other.
Acknowleding other people’s perspective rather than projecting yourself on them can do wonders for one’s appreciation of life.
This. Been working extra hard on that lately and have never felt so connected to the people I talk to. It’s helps the depression.
Manapan, the self-realization and gratitude in your comment is beautiful. 🙂
HMH, I know that awful struggle. That hit me in the gut. I just wish I could reach through the screen and squeeze your hand and say that it gets better. I know it sounds like bullshit. But, it can, and will get better. Your feelings are all too real, but depression is lying to you to get you to feel that way because depression’s an asshole.
Anything you feel you’re taking from your loved ones, you also have the ability to return, even if you don’t feel that way now. They love you because your existence is precious to them. I’m a stranger and I’m rooting for you. You can regain your happiness to exist–and you 1000% deserve to. I know you’re weary. It’s slow going. You won’t wake up one random day ‘fixed’ all of a sudden. But happiness can return, drop by drop, if you don’t give up.
HMH, it could relax you to find other reasons to keep on existing besides “to stop would mean to hurt them”.
It would distribute tension and help balance things, which in turn would build a positive feedback loop.
Maybe they don’t see how bad you are in their lives because objectively you’re not as bad in their lives as you feel you are. Maybe they think that, whatever the complications of knowing you may be, they’re things they’re happy to keep dealing with because it means you’re still there to benefit them by your good traits. People who hate themselves tend not to think they have any good traits, but everyone has good traits. And the people who experience the benefits of knowing you are the ones who know whether they’re benefiting or not. It doesn’t make much sense to tell somebody that they don’t get as much out of knowing you as they think they do. Maybe you need to consider the thought that when they declare that you’re not a Net Bad in their lives, it’s because you really aren’t.
Yes, stopping to hurt the people we love by our self-hatred is important.
And finding a way to see where what we do actually hurts others and is our responsibility and where our mind goes off the deep end and tells us we do or are responsible but we are just caught up in the old thought patterns of self-hatred is mightily important.
I learned that my values were totally fucked-up where this was concerned and had been busy trying to control stuff that never really bothered anyone because in my mind it was a huge – and BAD – thing – and ignored stuff where I really hurt others.
And the same thing does not hurt different people in the same way. There are people who are really hurt when you snap at them (because history) and others who just snap back snarkily and it never touches their self-esteem.
Hope you all find a therapist, group or method where your feelings can all be there and the therapist does not fear them and who can point out to you where your mind tells you ridiculous things that make life complicated.
Most of those are either stuff someone told over and over again or the ways your mind tried to find an explanation for the uncontrollable and horrible things that happened – and most of those explanations are wrong! They just tend to stick around.
Amber’s “I’m not fit to be around people because I can’t be trusted to defend them physically when they are attacked with a weapon – and also I get very angry sometime and cannot be trusted not to attack people” is a prime example of fucked-up thinking.
Most people are not sure if they would defend someone in a physical attack. It doesn’t fit the superhero image we’d like to be but wtf? Not doing something in a particular situation makes you feel helpless and worthless but that reaction is totally independent of the real possibility to help you had.
The second one is a harder nut because it mixes a bad “solution” (not let Amber be around people) with a real, has to be addressed problem: Amber does get angry in dangerous ways *sometimes* and she has to find a way to deal with this.
Right now, both are totally mixed in her mind and just serve to fuel her self-hatred.
And as long as she does this Blain wins again and again.
Manapan and HMH: These are very important and serious thoughts/feelings, and you aren’t alone. Do you have a therapist or trusted person with whom to talk this out?
HMH, I was in exactly the same place as you a few years ago; I hated being alive and wanted to die, but I couldn’t kill myself because I didn’t want to hurt the people I love. At the darkest point of my depression (and reliving this still makes me cry) I was talking to a friend about suicide, and he made me realise something that ultimately became the turning point towards the road to recovery. I needed to find a positive reason why I was continuing not to kill myself, because if you die, you’re dead, nothing matters any more. He helped me rephrase my negative reason into a positive one, and this also applies to you: I was still alive because there were people who cared about me, and would care if I died. That one simple thought empowered me to start the slow process of healing, and it became an aegis that I could reach for when the darkness and the pain felt overwhelming.
Sorry for the rambly, morbid post; it was extremely hard for me to stay composed while writing this but I couldn’t just scroll past when I saw someone that I could just possibly help.
HUGE HUG. (Or alternative preferred gesture)
I doubt this post helps only one person. Thank you for telling your story even though it’s still so painful. And reading how your friend helped you so well makes me want to do celebratory backflips for you AND him. 🙂
Leaving this here for anyone who needs it…
I Want to Live – by Erika Moen
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline
1 (800) 273-8255
This isn’t just for people having suicidal thoughts. If you know someone who is struggling and don’t know how to help, call. They can help you too.
Shoot. Not sure how I managed that particular HTML biff.
http://www.suicidepreventionlifeline.org
Wow, Danny has been really likeable lately. Amber’s issues have really endeared him to me. He has a point though, how crazy is it that she went off at him for talking to Sal, when she’s never told him to not talk to Sal or even made him aware of her disdain for Sal
It’s actually a really good thing that they broke up because of that. if she had just gotten angry and said don’t talk to her. she would have started accelerating down the road to being her dad.
This^. :/
But she was trying to tell Danny about Sal when he started attacking who she is, echoing Sal. He Danned up bad.
I mean, she’s still accelerating down that road Danny just isn’t in the passenger seat anymore.
Danny is far and away one of the most likable dudes in the comic imo.
I like Ethan. Thank you Ethan, for being kind. I miss that one scene from years ago that was Ethan being frustrated and Dina was nice to him and they were just together in a scene handling the world in a healthy way for a minute. How many years has it been since we had a scene like that?
What do you mean? It’s only been a couple of weeks, tops! 🙂
it’s been less than a year. In fact, in the last 12 months there have been two groups of strips that include Ethan and Dina being nice to each other and helping each other through challenging times. One even included them kinda coming out to each other.
Oh, sorry, I see what you mean. I just meant since we had a scene in which no one was being motivated by whatever dark piece of drama, I realize that people are nice to each other sometimes, even here. I really am sorry, I have to work on being clear and not introducing inappropriate hyperbole.
Is it just me, or did Ethan pull out the most uncomfortable looking chair he could find?
(And yes, I realize that lobbies aren’t exactly full of moveable chairs.
He just wants to feel short for once, not let his feet touch the ground.
The more comfortable a chair is the harder it is to move.
Gotta say I agree with Danny on this one.
Aha, good Danny…there is the care for Amber’s feelings that I was looking for him to bring up to Ethan.
Yeah, agree with the hovertip, that is a nice looking butt on Ethan.
Maybe that’s part of the problem Danny can’t talk to him.
Of course he’s not perfect. He’s missing some Transformers from his collection.
Ethan’s big broad shoulders and jaw are very close to perfect as well. it’s sad that they’re breaking up, but i have to agree with Danny that their relationship had a lot of problems. i’m still hoping that Amber will get better, even if they don’t go out again.
Well you know what they say Danny, hindsight is 20/20.
Hindsight. Heh-heh
dat gluteus
Well, now I’m just thinking about everyone’s butts.
To think I might even be able to see some canon butts on slipshine but I don’t have the $$$$
I thought we were gonna have some tension relief today… wrong. So wrong. UGH!!
Comic Reactions:
Panel 1: Aw, Danny’s appreciating all the close conversations with Ethan and is being willing to open up a bit about stuff. That’s definitely what he needs. I’m a little worried that he might be interpreting his ex’s mental illnesses as some deficiency on his part though given this and his early lines. Like, that might be a premature worry, but it definitely feels like he’s internalizing a lot more than he should.
Panel 2: Oh man, that first part as he goes a little bit into his trauma/shocked face a bit remembering and trying to deconstruct what exactly happened at the end there and the unreasonableness of Amber’s demands at that point. Poor Danny.
And that second part, oh poor Amber… cause yeah, Amber’s self-hatred really has gotten to a whole ‘nother level and it’s definitely rough at first dating someone who truly despises themselves, especially when you don’t have the requisite experience dating someone with suicidal ideation and depression.
Panel 3: Oh man, there’s so much in that unspoken phrase right there. “How much she’s damaging herself by not…” loving herself, protecting herself, being fully aware of reality, viewing her scattered pieces as irreconcilable. And that awareness may have hit more home than he might like, because she was by far not the only person in that relationship who did not view themselves as a full person or as inherently worthy of love.
Panel 4: Which I think he realizes here. Given how quickly he shuts things down and crawls back into himself.
And I think it also reveals how out of the ordinary in his life someone being supportive and caring and listening to him without judgment is. Joe would have mocked him by now. His parents would have mercilessly teased him about letting another “great girl” get away.
But Ethan cares about him and listens and gives him the space, but at this point, the censor is already in his head and won’t let him truly spill forth like he desperately needs to.
Probably doesn’t also help that he doesn’t fully trust himself to spill forth without possibly “ruining” his friendship with Ethan by acknowledging his attraction.
Panel 5: And here we get a poor Ethan moment, because he doesn’t really have anyone himself to be close to and he’s always defined friendship support as quietly supporting those he’s close to, especially with Amber. This is important to Ethan to be trusted and cared for and let in, especially as he’s scared that his current two better friends at the moment are splitting away from each other a bit. He needs Danny as much as Danny needs him.
Panel 6: Oh, Danny, when will you learn that putting your romantic interests on a pedestal helps no one?
Panel 6: I think Danny would really rather not put Ethan on a pedestal (or indeed, he’d probably rather not be crushing on him at all, as it’s confusing and inconvenient right now). But, Danny feels like Ethan isn’t giving him any flaws to work with, he’s not giving Danny the opportunity to take Ethan offa there.
And/or Danny feels that he’s terrible, and it’s really jarring that somebody is great and doesn’t think that Danny is also terrible.
I think this might be an All of the Above situation.
From first-hand experience in a similar type of thing (people in general being far nicer to me than I was used to or at the time believed I deserved): Could also be that Danny doesn’t feel like he deserves to be treated with such compassion, and when Ethan treats him with compassion anyway, it’s frustration of the “God dammit, I know the niceness is some sort of a mask and it’s going to crack eventually so will you just slip already? You don’t need to be Saint Ethan, and I know I don’t deserve it so let’s just get on with it and tell me what you really think” variety.
… maybe projecting 18YO me into Ethan’s headspace a bit there, though.
Panel 3: Yeah, there are so much of Danny’s issues here, but that one is pure worry about Amber. Danny tried his best to keep her safe… and now he can’t do that any longer.
Oh no! Ethan is being TOO nice to Danny! What ever shall Danny do??? Maybe he should kiss Ethan as punishment! Yea, that’ll show that punk for being so nice and perfect and muscular and breathtaking and– you get the point
The most awkward of boners.
All this talk about Ethan but, but what about his chest? What about Ethan’s glorious, glorious maaaaan-chest?
Ethan’s way of dealing with Danny is pretty close to how he deals with Amber. Passive but unconditional support.
but, dat gluteus
Will my OTP become canon?
Yeah, as I suspected, Danny wasn’t ignorant of Amber’s many problems. Bless him, he was even trying to help in his sweet, ineffective way. The problem is, of course, that you can only help someone if they want to be helped and I’m not sure that Amber is in the mental and emotional place where she’s willing to accept help.
Yeah, Ethan is sort of disturbingly perfect sometimes, isn’t he? He’d be impossible if it weren’t for his toy obsession and lack of personal drive.
not having any personal ambition or drive does allow one to appear perfect to some people, as long as they don’t become very close friends.
Ethan was never more interesting than when he kidnapped Galasso.
Of all people Danny was the last one I expected to be the tsundere.
I relate to Danny because I, too, am a useless bisexual
j/k, he’s actually handling this best he can. Good on him!
No don’t call him perfect then put your butt at the same height as his head
Danny, have you ever considered a career in diplomacy?
Sigh. Dammit Danny, you’re being far too hard on yourself. You remind me of my older days when I’d always blame myself on anything that happened to my parents’ relationship and I emphatise too much on what people are feeling to care about my own feelings. Give yourself credit for once in your life.
After checking one of Willis’s tumblrs, I no longer care about what happens here. Why is it so long until August? WHY IS AUGUST NOT YET HERE?!
That damn perfection, gets you every time!!
NOW KISS!!!! except Ethan’s too perfect to. Damn.
Ethan’s reply reminds me of Spock and Kirk (“I am and always will be your friend.”)
Only that Ethan didn’t die from radiation while doing that.
Alright Danny, now go talk to Sal. Find out why Amber does not like her so much.
Does Sal even know? My impression was that she’s entirely oblivious – that was all a long time ago and in a rather chaotic period of her life.
Sal has absolutely no idea that Amber hates her, let alone why. I mean, I’m sure she hasn’t forgotten neither her robbery attempt nor having her hand stabbed through, but she has no idea that the girl involved in those events was Amber.
Nope, she doesn’t know. The event didn’t traumatize her like it did Amber. While she did get stabbed, I’m not 100% sure she even got a good look at who attacked her. And even if she had…Ethan was the one she held hostage, and she only has a vague memory of what he looked like. Enough to look at him and think “hmm I know him from somewhere” but not enough to realize who he is.
Actually, I believe he was the one who thought he knew her from somewhere. She was sure she would have recalled someone who looked like him.
Ehm, for some reason I get an access denied error when trying to access the site from my computer. Did my IP randomly change to that of someone who was blocked or something?
Nevermind, right after posting this it fixed itself.
I was expecting the alt-text to say “Ethan is such a Mary Sue”, but butts are always a good option.
Butts!
Yesss… Everything’s falling into place.