My mother has some temper issues. There isn’t a scar, but I’ve been told more than a few times of an occasion where baby-me was bitten on the ear hard enough to draw blood in retaliation for being peed on.
First one I remember is when I was NINE. We were driving home from a theme park, I was tired from a long day of having fun, and dozing in the back seat. A wreckless driver nearly ran us off the road, and I muttered “Bastard” because I was half asleep.
I swear my mom’s head rotated 180 degrees to glare at me.
I made it to twelve, but my sister’s debut was at eight… that was disconcerting for me, seeing as I’d barely started myself. And no, she didn’t learn from me, she cursed in front of me before I cursed in front of her.
Mine was when I was, ooh, 10 or 11. Someone was threatening to spread a humiliating (at the time, it’s actually pretty petty now) rumor, so I chased them around outside yelling, and I quote:
“I’m going to fucking kill you! I swear, I’ll send you to Hell! Fuck you, I’m gonna kill you! Get back here, I’ll beat the shit out of you! Do you hear me? I’ll fucking kill you!”
That’s the exact quote. I almost strangled the kid before a teacher lifted me off ‘im.
“Bastard” was possibly my first swear word. And the first instance a teacher had no counter-argument for me, but still insisted they were right. I pointed out that technically I was a bastard, so it wasn’t really a bad word. That may have been 1st grade…
When I was four…My cousin was born and me being the selfish brat I was, I wouldn’t go unless they promised me McDonalds french fries. As soon as we saw her in the window, I turned to my parents and went ” We saw her, now where’s my fucking french fries?”
My three year old has learned that, when something doesn’t go right, the appropriate thing to say is “Shit!” It is both hilarious and adorable. And also something we really need to stop laughing at and start saying not to do, but damn it, it’s just so cute!
Haha, when I was about four my mom had some guests over and my baby sister’s crying started up on the baby monitor. Four year old Chris exclaims, “Oh SHIT, the baby’s crying!”
They watched what they said around me a little more closely after that.
I think it was second year at college, my parents came for a visit and we were talking as they were about ready to head home. They were in the car, I was standing. For some reason I said a curse word and my Mom reached out from the car window and slapped me across the face.
I kid you not…and my family was never all that religious.
We recently forced my thirteen-year-old niece to say “fuck” in front of us. (“We” consisted of her mother and stepfather and myself.) She’s Lawful Good and needs permission for everything – cursing included. I fully believe she could have made it to Joyce’s age without cursing if allowed. We’re a family who believes that words are words and as long as she’s not cussing out her grandma (her paternal one, at least, my mom has a mouth like a sailor), she should be allowed to say whatever she wants.
Making someone who’s uncomfortable swearing swear is not decent, especially a thirteen year old being pressured to swear by people older than them. Personal linguistic choices can be an important part of identity, and taking away those choices take away an important part of an individual’s autonomy. I didn’t swear as a teen and I had people do that to me and it’s really uncomfortable and I wished afterwards that I hadn’t let them do it to me.
I swear quite a lot, and once I was getting a ride home from college with a friend and her parents. She asked me in advance not to swear in front of them. Thing is, we were in a play and decided we could use the ride to rehearse our lines. The play was set among incompetent lowlife criminals whose every second word was “fuck.”
So there we are, in the bak seat of the car with the parents in front I’ve been told not to swear in front of, as we go through these lines where “fuck” and “shit” are used as punctuation…
Her mother did actually ask at one point what we were doing.
Pfft my daughter wasn’t even six when she uttered her first swearword. I was up late one night playing League of legends, and from behind me comes “Kill the bastards!” I popped her butt for being out of bed, and told here not to use that word in public.
My nephew drops f-bombs when things go wrong on occasion.
He is three.
We have all stopped even thinking about fighting it.
My other nephew used to be unable to correctly pronounce “bridge,” dropping the “r” and causing raised eyebrows and schoolgirl tittering when he called bridges… well, he wasn’t calling them drums.
I managed to avoid swearing in public until high school. Mainly because my parents kept telling me that swearing was a sign of being unable to express yourself. I did know the words, I just avoided using them in front of my family.
Actually, that’s a very good thing to teach your kids. Yes, just because you use swear words doesn’t mean you can’t not, but trying to avoid them DOES enrich and expand your expressive language.
For me, it was mostly picking up fictional swears. Still worth it though.
That’s what I tell my kids: “It demonstrates a paucity of vocabulary.” But I also tell them that they aren’t allowed to use those words until they’re adults themselves, because (a) kids will get into trouble for using those words even if we, their parents, say it’s okay; and (b) adults have the experience to judge when it is and is not appropriate to use such language; kids don’t necessarily.
We did try to not swear around them, but gave up about three months in. We couldn’t both avoid it, not completely; and we couldn’t completely curb our friends’ vocabulary (not successfully). So we gave up, and teach them when it is and isn’t appropriate, instead (inappropriate in a business situation; in these and these social situations; and for a kid, always).
^ This. I pretended for about thirteen seconds that we weren’t going to swear in front of my daughter once she was born.
Her dad is a truck driver. Her paternal granddad is a truck driver. Her maternal great uncles are all truck drivers. Her maternal uncle is an Afghanistan and Iraq veteran. I am a former college lifer with the mouth of a sailor.
My parents were openly racist around me and successfully taught me “we don’t say these words in public” to keep us from being publicly racist. (Yes, this is terrible. I get the fun job of teaching my daughter that her grandparents’ beliefs are both wrong and antiquated and that she needs to ignore what they have to say because trying to counter it with logic and correct ideas has never worked.) I think I can manage to teach my daughter that GODSFUCKINGDAMMIT is fine when you fuck up your drawing in your bedroom but not when you’re in the middle of a crowded aisle at Walmart. :p
I always found that argument ridiculous. You don’t expand your vocabulary in any real sense by avoiding words as though they were lepers. It’s just a comfortable, and mercifully, harmless, lie we tell kids to get them to try not to swear. You don’t want to overrely on them, but you shouldn’t make anything short of an article or ‘said’ a cornerstone of your speech.
Plus, having said that, you /really/ don’t prove your vocabulary with your interjections. Those are kinda the things you don’t think about by definition.
I was up there with Joyce, not really cursing until college, for similar reasons. I was raised in a weird semi-religious bubble, Catholic school and ‘Catholic’ family, but in a loose, vague sort of way. Like both parents considered themselves religious because that’s how they were raised, and that’s ‘just the way it was’.
They didn’t really push any issues or scripture, and church attendance was sporadic and done out of obligation (I got the feeling it was chore-like routine for them, like banking on redeemable ‘god-points’, or again, just doing it because that’s what people do). I think young me found more value in it than they did, and I think I took a sort of personal pride in avoiding profanity – especially when people tried to force it out of me.
The tipping point came late in high school, when reading aloud for English classes. Some of the characters would swear, and it would cause me to stumble, attempt to avoid it.
I realized that was stupid – a word shouldn’t have power over you like that, shouldn’t limit you. So I stopped worrying about it. And honestly, not a lot has changed. It’s not like I was constantly holding back a torrent of swears – Joyce seems to have been more ‘pent up’ in that respect. But taking away the ‘forbidden-ness’ of it, that lack of restriction -it’s nice. Like taking off a scratchy stuffy coat you never knew you were wearing.
I think I started using “damn” occasionally when I was in my teens. Very rarely, though. Mostly I still say “flip” and “sugar”. I’m British, and I’m still a bit wary about “bugger”, which most British people don’t even consider a swear. (I get my tendency not to swear from my mum, and she says it.)
(Actually, now I think about it, there was one time when I was 15 when I was very annoyed about something and used the f-word. Only it was under my breath and there was no-one else there, which is barely a step from thinking it.)
Oh, man, used “bugger” in front of my British mum as a teen once and did she flip out! Apparently, while it’s one step removed from “aw, cheese!” to North Americans, to old-school Brits it’s actually pretty rude. “It’s a reference to bestiality,” she said. (I could go further with particular connotations, these days, myself, but I won’t).
These days I use it and things like “wanker” when I want to express vehemence without actually offending anyone, because we are in Canada, not England, and no one here actually gives a damn about them.
I was about…now wait, it would’ve been while I was on Scout camp, ironically enough (given that they’re all about being upstanding members of the community and all), and I learnt that it was okay to swear from a couple of the girls who were the GSL’s granddaughters. Yeah really.
So I was a 13yo boy, learning to swear from two 11yo girls who I had crushes on. xD
I can also remember that my first swearword was “shit”.
It was a couple more years before I even dared to swear in front of an adult (so, about 15). Nowadays, I use swearwords mostly as colourful language and just dotted liberally through my bloody speech. 😉
Most of my troop were pretty innocent at that age, oddly enough.
A couple of years later, however, it was all change, and I was frequently the only sober member of the troop too. I don’t know how things changed that much in like 2 years. xD
Joyce swears like a sailor, she just uses other words for it. “Gosh darn it” was basically her catchphrase until she switched to real swears.
It’s not actually hard to condition yourself to only use certain words as swears. Much easier than go without the words you’ve gotten used to as swears at all…
Joyce is in for a bad time.
My first swear was in 3rd grade, it was jackass. My parents had told me I could say any word in the dictionary so when I found out that one was in there I had a FIELD DAY.
My sister’s first swear word was when she was in second grade and she didn’t say it out loud. She wrote it. In a paper for class. I can tell you my mom was not happy when she got a call from the school saying “your daughter wrote ‘George Bush is a dumbass’ in her school paper”. My dad and I, however, found it hilarious.
Young people have been cursing since time immemorial. What /is/ considered a curse changes. Let me put this into a little perspective, and the quote is simple enough that even my crappy memory should get it more or less right:
“Gol’dangit,” Almonzo /swore/.
I remember reading Farmer Boy as a little kid and thinking “Oh, my mom was right, Darn /is/ a swear word”. And in our house, it was, at least for me and younger sister.
Also the graffiti at pompei is fucking filthy, but I doubt it’s all kids.
Almost certain but only after they drive her to the breaking point and beyond with continual moral hypocrisy and attempted erasure of her friendship with Becky. Then Joscelyne turns up with an announcements and things get really stressful.
My concern right now is that this may be the last time Joyce and Joss are welcome at their parents home (although their siblings may not be so dogmatic about it).
…for the first time, I arrived at the comments section with only Ana Chronistic there. Hm.
Anyway, being someone who doesn’t swear, I always thought it was cool Joyce had a similar thing. It’s a little weird seeing her swear, still, and sometimes I think that’s what people think when I start swearing on rare occasion (rather than, as she and I once hoped, that it would promote seriousness)
I used to Very Rarely swear, as well.
It depends how you say it. Apparently, when a naturally-adorable person swears casually, it’s weird, but when the same person swears in anger, it’s more shocking.
(Pet peeve of mine, that people think I can’t get angry — like, yes, I do still have a full range of human emotion.)
Relieving because it could possibly mean that she’s started to get used to the idea of an unrequited crush on Joyce. And it’s plain adorable.
Worrying because it could also mean she’s gotten so used to this kind of heartbreak that she can just reboot nigh-instantaneously. And Heaven help us if she’s faking it.
Sadly, I think it’s part of growing up under Toedad. Oftentimes, you have to be very quick to bury your negative feelings and play-act like nothing’s wrong on a dime to stay safe. As someone who’s learned to turn on a dime with emotional states (albeit due to different reasons), I can definitely see it as a crucial survival method.
I lived under folks who were rather like Joyce’s/Toedad. You’re happy because you’re not allowed to be anything but happy and if you’re not happy, you hide away until you are or you put on a mask of happy because they don’t actually give a damn about what you’re feeling, they give a damn about how what you’re feeling makes them look, and if you’re feeling anything other than happy, you’re obviously just “having an attitude” to embarrass them or “turning on the waterworks” to “manipulate” them. Not because you’re legitimately hurting over anything.
Nothing you feel is ever seen as genuine. It’s all an act or manipulation to get something out of them. Unless you act happy. Happy is safe. Happy protects you. So you put on the happy mask. Because it’s the only way to eke out any security at all.
It doesn’t help that one of my classes is currently covering verbs and we just went over nouns. Ah, college writing courses! I laughed so hard I scared my boyfriend.
If I were Joyce’s dad/mom I’d be worried. We saw Becky’s dad disowning her so it’s unlikely he’ll ever appear again, but as far as they’re concerned he could be planning for a repeat performance as soon as he’s out of police custody.
Also, Becky and Dina have definitely been shown to be the best of the crew at crisis management on the fly (see Dina’s initial deflection of Toedad or Becky’s fast thinking to get him recorded on a 911 call threatening her friends’ lives).
They’re such great problem solvers when all the chips are down.
Agreed. Billie has been, too, with the fire alarm for Ruth, and at the Ryan-party. (Come to think of it, crises are the only time that Billie feels competent. I wonder whether she subconsciously contributes to crises, in order to solve them and feel competent.)
Actually, I wonder how Joyce’s parents would react to actually seeing Becky in-the-flesh, now that Joyce told them (or her mom, at least) that she’s a lesbian.
On an unrelated note, Becky is now tied for ‘Most Adorable Person’ with Sierra, Carla, and Mike Dina.
“Oh, look the Pastor decided to stop by special for dinner tonight. Now, let us all join in prayer circle that God may save the soul of those who have strayed from His path.”
That might actually be good if they don’t get too pushy about it, considering that Becky’s already decided that God’s path is wider than her Church said.
…Not likely they’ll be so decent, but I can hope.
That’s my former friend. He was very involved with his church in high school and was friends with his youth pastor. He was outed by someone after graduation.
In college, his parents wouldn’t visit him (they’d drive halfway across Texas to visit their daughter, but not 45 minutes to see their gay son), but every once in awhile the youth pastor would come to see him. Evidently at his parents’ request. He liked these visits at first
But after a couple years of these visits, he tells me, “I just wish someone would visit me because they want to see me. Not because they want to see if I’ve “changed my mind”
I’m sure Becky’s been the talk of the church (or cult, I’m still waffling on that definition) since Fundie’s arrest. Her reception downstairs, and at the Brown’s home, will be most enlightening. Both to us, and to Joyce.
That just makes me wonder if she’s going to let one slip out while she’s talking to her parents or she’s just going to hold it in for most of the day until one of them brings up the gun incident and she just explodes in a major rant and uses every swear word in the book.
I’m kind of waiting for the possibility that Jocelyn is also there, Joyce finds out, and when Joyce’s parents trip her out over the gun incident (or Becky, or Jocelyn, or whatever), Joyce totally table flips and is all, “FUCK THIS SHIT. Come on, Jocelyn, Becky, we’re out of here,” and leaves like a BAWS with one arm around Becky and one around Jocelyn. :3
Because I believe in implausible “perfect reaction” scenarios. ^^;
There was a Doonesbury strip, back around the time of the (first) Gulf War, where the soldier character had been called up again; he admitted to his new squadmates that he’d been out so long, he’d even forgotten the proper use of “the f-word”.
The great thing about the f-word is that it works as all parts of speech. You hardly need any other words.
“Fuck! The fucking fucker’s fucked. Fuck it.”
For me, it’s the same student ID that we use for meals and getting into our dorms. It would be decidedly more efficient if the laundry room card readers were consistent, but if they have to mess up on one of the three…
Yep. And it’s expensive. Mind you, it’s Vancouver, so stuff tends to be more expensive here anyways. We have to buy our laundry cards at the centralized hub between all the dorm houses, and reload said cards at the same place. We can even use debit cards to add money. The wonders of technology, Ladies and Gentlemen.
Man I really need to collect some of these for my English-as-a-foreign-language kids. There is test grammar, and then there is how people actually talk
And speaking from experience as someone who used to talk with “test grammar” people react to you about how they react to Dina if you speak with proper grammar and enunciation all the time and don’t use contractions.
Also verbing nouns is a wonderful part of slang which explains how being an adult, being adult, and adulting are all different things with different implications.
(Also, adulting is one of my favorite noun-verbs ever! Nothing else I’ve ever found has adequately put words to the sense of, “Yes, I know this is really petty and most other people my age do it without trouble, but shut up I just got the hang of something that’s really hard for me! Whoo!” that adulting encapsulates in a single word)
That’s always confused me, as someone who learned the “rules” “straight.” “Top form” English is my default, though I won’t pretend I don’t probably slip a bit here and there without noticing.
It actually takes me extra time and deliberate mental effort to write ungrammatically – including, yes, when I have to present dialogue as it is literally spoken, complete with hesitations, filler words, and fragments. Or l33t or txt-spk, etc etc.
Practice bloody practice. After a month or two of frequent exposure, even l3375p34|< can be read smoothly.
…though I don't see much benefit to it. Conversational English can be harder to write, though. Not sure practice can help with formulating ideas more loosely.
And since it’s at the point that every moment with Joyce’s parents is completely and utterly awkward and also paint them out to be completely ignorant A-holes. I’m just going to take a stab in the Dark and say the next few pages is going to be about Becky being shunned by Joyce’s parents and giving her crap for putting her in danger.
It would be interesting to see a flashback to the parents’ younger days. I suspect one or both of them were born again as adults, and might have come from a less religious background.
I have to admit even today I still prefer to wash some clothes at my parents home when I travel to see them, the weather tends to be nicer and the clothes dry faster there. I just pack them in a bag so they don’t combine with the clean clothes.
About 60 percent of my fellow undergrads were from the metro area about 2.5 hours drive from campus. It was expressed as, “Far enough the parents don’t just drop in, close enough to get the laundry home.”
Tbh I still take dirty laundry with me whenever I go home to my mom’s and I’m in my 30s…. xD (I mean, I go there maybe 5 times a year and she lives 11 hours away, so it’s not like she does all my laundry :p)
For me (similar age) it hits that point 2 days before where it’s like:
I could do laundry now, but I need to go to the bank to get quarters, hope the apartment washer/dryer isn’t in use, approximate how long the cycles are for time planning (not marked on machine).
Or I could do laundry there after my flight, while we’re off hiking, with no change needed, and with machines that actually get my clothes clean and dry instead of cleanish and damp (though they fixed the dryer recently).
Same here. The thing is, though, she just glows while she’s putting it in the washer because she’s “doing something to help you”! So I reached a point several years ago where I just bring everything dirty so she can enjoy herself bustling around and folding my socks.
If I am reading the preview panels on the tumblr right, this chapter “The Perfect Girl” ends on february 23, 2016. But Joyce won’t be back at IU then, she goes out to a restaurant with Jocelyne and her father.
I predict a nasty scene with her mom at home, followed by an attempt at damage control at the restaurant. But the next chapter is named “When God Closes The Door”, which does not bode well for the damage control working.
The problem is that Joyce is bad at lying. This doesn’t mean that half truths designed to not technically be lies are something she’s much better at though. She’s not magically compelled against lying. Shes just terrible at it.
I was wondering who else would notice that the sweater seems to have gone into the bag. It doesn’t bode well if Joyce’s parents discover it and confront her.
“Good news, Joyce, we got Mr. McIntyre out on bail and he’ll be joining us for Thanksgiving dinner as we pray for the tainted soul of your harlot friend!”
Amazing that Joyce has gone thru several ‘growing’ experiences and still won’t let her ‘atheist’ friend walk her down to greet her parents. Hasn’t shaken off the home influence yet.
I understand being nervous but…
What I do wonder about is the fact that there was a campus shooting, kidnapping, and police involved in the whole thing. And yet it didn’t make the news? None of the students parents were informed? Or learned of it?
So after the amount of passed time, her parents really don’t know about it, in this age of instant communication?
That I find hard to believe.
As for why Joyce doesn’t want Dorothy to come down and see her off, it’s because she wants to avoid another possible incident. She might have been able to talk her dad into calming down about Dorothy’s atheist beliefs before, but the Browns may be more concerned about their daughter now. Her dad might see Dorothy as more of a corrupting influence.
She’s trying to present as still that perfect girl who doesn’t doubt the Lord’s plan for her and thinks all the morality she was raised with was awesome and she’s terrified that they’ll see how much she’s changed, so she’s trying to limit her variables (not bringing Dorothy downstairs, rejecting Becky’s offer of moral support) so she can hold her mask on long enough.
I mean how much clothes does Becky HAVE right now? If anything she may want to head home with Joyce to retrieve some of her belongings assuming they made it back from Anderson. And it seemed to be implied that Becky is coming and Joyce was just reaffirming that she was okay doing so.
Supposedly she just went back and got all her clothes from Anderson, so she’s no longer just relying on that one biohazard outfit anymore. Hmm, yeah, not sure. I’m simultaneously in two minds on whether it looks like she’s coming along or not.
I mean the wording in that strip pretty clearly implies that Joyce had agreed to her coming and was simply double-checking that she was okay with it. Unless I rolled a one on my Reading Comprehension check that is.
Its hard to tell. When Becky brought it up, Joyce’s response was a hesitant “Are you sure?” Which suggests that Joyce is okay with it if Becky is okay with it.
Agreed; the last thing that Joyce wants right now is another argument with her family. Something tells me that it’s going to happen anyway, just because her parents aren’t going to be able to hold in their fundamental admiration of Ross’s values and what they perceive to be moral courage.
I ended up doing that laundry thing by accident today, got snowed in back home and couldn’t make it to the laundrymat before my trip. now i’m in texas and staying with my cousin, i brought a bag full of dirty clothes and did laundry today at her house ^^
Coming home with dirty laundry is one of the best things Joyce can do to relieve tension. Her parents can tut about kids be kids, remember when they did the same and still feel useful.
Even though rationally I know the two comics have basically nothing to do with each other, panel 3 Joyce reminds me of the Kiwi Blitz style and I don’t know why.
Joyce and Steffi are both small, cute human females with similar haircuts. On top of that, since Joyce joined Blitz in the ‘punching bad guys’ club, she’s been cursing near as much as the kid.
True, but that doesn’t really explain why this particular Joyce reminds me of the cubewatermelon style more than any other Joyce-face, including the other Joyce-faces in the same day’s comic.
No, I see it too. I think it’s a peculiarity of the angle and expreasion of her face that makes it look a little softer, which pushes it into resembling Cagle’s art. I didn’t see it until you mentioned it, but the similarities are there.
Sorry, still stuck a bit back, and wondering when you decided this Mary wouldn’t just be a horrible, nasty, judgemental hypocrite like the Walkyverse one, and you decided she needed to be literally Satan.
To be fair, she has only taken advantage of people’s problems and thrown verbal abuse very casually. Not only is this pretty standard fare for assholes, but she’s fairly tame for real life standards of “bad person”.
She’s still evil, mind you. But she doesn’t make top ranking – she’s just in the right place and the right time to play evil. She’s not a skillful player, she’s a lucky one.
Given that she ranks as 4th worst character we’ve seen at the worst, I’m curious where you’d put Ross, Blaine and Ryan.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Carol makes a strong play to pass her in this next storyline as well.
I said this on another page, but I’ve literally read the past few days, a few of the beginning strips, and some others with Mary. I only know Ryan because he was linked in discussion of the “original” version. I’m finally getting around to reading Roomies! and may reread It’s Walky! and/or reread and finish (or at least get closer to this comic’s launch date in) Shortpacked! before going with this one.
Ryan is worse, but on the other hand, he’s not specifically after trans girls (among others), so he’s a little less of a personal issue on.
I know I’m a little late on the complaining about the misuse of literally train but ummmm… (Checks to see if Mary has a pitchfork and horns. Realizes that she doesn’t, and is actually just a bigot, like many others that exist in the world)
In all honesty I don’t think Dumbiverse Mary is doing anything that I wouldn’t expect Walkyverse Mary to do. The only difference seems to be the author knows she’s not a good person right from the start.
She seems to have a dirty internet search history, as Carla almost found out.
Honestly, I’m really hoping now that we don’t see a repeat of “Mary has an abortion”, even in her backstory, as some way to prove that she’s just such an evil skank and deserved to be punished in such an operatically evil woman fashion. The more I think about it, I realize it was one of the cringiest aspects of Roomies, which is already a massive cringefest.
I missed the “dirty internet search history” bit. When was that?
I agree on the rest though. I doubt we’ll see it. Willis is both a much better storyteller and less generally cringeworthy than he was back then. He was still working through his own prejudices. Though I did like the revelation that Mary was intended to be the good Christian girl replacement and he just couldn’t stomach that from the get go, so she became evil.
I would like to see some further insight into her that makes her more understandable or even sympathetic, without making her any less of a villain.
I already greatly dislike how the confrontation between Mary, Carla and Ruth played out, but at this point it feels kind of wrong attempting to understand Mary when the most significant thing she’s done in the history of the comic is be a horrible, bigoted asshole. I don’t care enough to want to learn anything.
That’s not a particularly good place for any character, even an antagonist, to be in, but I’d rather Mary forever be a cardboard villain who eventually gets defeated and humiliated than use Carla’s misgendering as a beginning to Mary’s story arc.
Personally, I’m all for using Carla’s misgendering as the beginning of Mary’s story arc. Given said story arc is about her falling into a wood chipper, or getting crushed by a hippo, or getting teleported into the Walkyverse! Martian Invasion and becoming a casualty, or… (Yes, I’m trans. Can you tell?)
While that sounds delightful, I meant that I don’t want Mary to become developed if the starting point is going to be her saying transphobic garbage to Carla. Like, before Ross suddenly became violent and monstrous, we got that brief sequence with him trying to come off as the concerned father to Dina, just out to save his daughter. I don’t want that for Mary anymore, not after saying something as gross as what she said to Carla, and I actually think it’s a shame how things played out, even beyond how much I hate how Carla was victimized in service of Ruth’s story. Instead of any actual, legit reasons for Mary to oppose Ruth (like say, being an abusive shithead), letting us develop Mary as an antagonist for Ruth, someone who definitely deserves what’s coming to her, it’s just because Mary’s a bigot and hates Ruth for being a queer lady. It felt like she had to say something completely fucking atrocious to Carla so that Ruth could look good, and then move onto the real meat of the story, Mary blackmailing Ruth. Carla was incidental, a puppy that Mary kicked, and I hate when that happens to queer characters.
Anyway, the TLDR of it is that we need more Carla. DoA is now the Carla show and it’s just going to be about her throwing pies in lesser characters’ faces and then flipping double birds and skating off.
Yeah, I’m expecting more Carla focus later, since she’s so prominent in future preview strips. I hate what happened now, but I’m hoping that it’ll be used a jumping off point for more Carla.
I wonder if that’s more true from reading Shortpacked! We didn’t learn anything because we’re still getting her core character down in DoA, but that hasn’t really changed (Since, well, nobody’s has). We saw her /say/ she’s a sweet prankster, but we finally SAW it with the hoppable force bit and the like.
Though that’s apparently a really hard lesson to convey when it’s from a trans woman, given how many people found her to be Mao 2: The Sequel.
Honestly, I think not immediately dispersing when Mary went “could you not” was maybe the “worst” thing Carla has ever done in comic. Otherwise she’s maybe just been kind of curt with Sal and Malaya.
I mentioned this a few days ago, but I see Carla as someone who takes power in the label of being an asshole, but never actually does or says anything towards that. She was completely uncomfortable with the idea of actually hurting Amazi-Girl when for all she knew she was there to actually harm her and her friends, and took it upon herself to clean up Amber’s head injury because she knows how annoying it is to do so by herself, without any kind of snide or sarcastic remark you’d expect from somebody who apparently makes a big deal of deliberately being hated.
She’s been fucking hilarious with Sal, without a single doubt. Like, not ‘most excellent’, but definitely hilarious. Sal was kinda earnin’ a bit of sass too, so it’s not like she can (Or would, or did) complain either. Seriously, of the various character pairs, ‘more Sal and Carla’ has been like, near the top of the list for me, if not at the top.
If she’s willing to dig out other people’s laundry to attack them… a response in kind is appropriate. Let’s see how far she’ll pull the brinkmanship after what we’ve found.
What I meant was that I don’t want something like Mary having an abortion being used to show how much of an Evil Woman she is again. Roomies had Mary get pregnant as an ironic comeuppance, and I know she was a shithead there too but that’s fucking gross. She was punished in a specifically female way.
Eh, I’m still finally reading through Roomies!, but from what I’ve seen and/or can remember if she appeared during It’s Walky! in any meaningful capacity, Walkyverse!Mary is less genuinely gleeful about making others suffer for their “sins” and throwing around her power. She’s very obviously enjoying herself while she tries to shame Billie, for starters, while Walkyverse!Mary still has herself totally convinced she’s doing the “right thing” rather than acting out of outright sadism. Other than that, pretty similar.
Oh, I know she’s a terrible manipulative hypocrite who tries to ruin other people’s lives. It’s just that, from what little I saw when I skipped ahead to check up on that more, she still seems to earnestly believe she’s doing the “righteous” thing, while it’s becoming increasingly clear that for DoA!Mary, that’s a thin rationalization for just being a power-hungry sadist who enjoys hurting people and wielding power over them.
*Spoilers for later down the line for It’s Walky!, heads up for people who are only checking out the redux*
*Seriously I warned you*
There’s a point later on where Mary meets Sal again for the first time in years, and while she initially comes off as sympathetic an remorseful to how she’s treated her previously, she then drops a charming line about how Sal’s parents dying was her fault, and must be retribution for some mistake she made.
Head Alien will blow your parents up and laugh about it, but at least he’s honest!
Oh, wow, I forgot that part, and it’s from a section of the comics I’ve actually read. (I read It’s Walky! in full, though my understanding of when I started reading it seriously is a tad bit fuzzy. Sometime before it ended, but after it had been running a bit. Earlier attempts were turned off by the potty humor in the Nachitos storyline)
Can we PLEASE stop pretending that Mary’s actions are unrealistic and cartoonishly evil? People are transphobic lesbophobic powergrubbing moralizing mega-bongos with superiority complexes in the real world. The way you’re saying it, you make it sound like it’s bad writing, instead of an accurate portrayal of what LGBT people have to deal with every single day.
Every single time someone says “Mary is being written to be unrealistically evil,” I nearly begin to cry.
Dude, I am LBGT. I’m not saying she’s unrealistic, I’m saying she’s evil to an incredible degree. I’ve had to deal with more than a few Marys already, although most of mine were purportedly feminist rather than Christian.
I tend not to curse, though I don’t have any objections to it. It always sounds forced and fake.
The funny thing, though, is my 14 year old son. We’ve never had rules against cursing. He watches the most foul-mouthed youtubers, and has frequent exposure to my inappropriate friends, who frequently forget there are kids in the room when they start telling stories.
And he doesn’t curse. Even when he’s playing online shooters with headphones on, thinking he’s alone. He’ll get ganked and yell out “darn it!” with genuine venom.
I curse a lot in English but I can’t curse in my own native language without it sounding forced and fake… because I picked up conversational English in homestuck fandom and conversational Russian at home, where my parents don’t swear at all either.
Today, Joyce learns a valuable lesson from Sensei Becky-sama!
Seriously, given how strong Joyce’s parents reacted to Dorothy, she’s wise not to force any more confrontations. It would probably be better to intermittently send them pictures of “Me and My Friends” including Dorothy so they become inoculated to her presence in Joyce’s circle with time.
This is probably my pessimist side showing but something tells me Joyce’s dad is going to choose all the wrong conversational tacks and all the wrong things to say to make Joyce feel better. I’m sure that, by the time she gets home, she’ll be ready to bite her mother’s head off when she makes some crack about “aren’t you glad to be away from all those filthy sinners?”
Interesting thing about Joyce’s swearing is that she’s always done the censored swearing thing a lot. Fudge & b-hole & poopieface and all that. Seems like she uses those more than the other characters actually swear.
Now that she’s broken the damn, will she keep up the frequency and just shift to the real words? It doesn’t seem like she’s going to keep censoring them.
Yup. That’s why her friends were so eager to make her use ‘real swears’ but not, say, Dina, who also doesn’t use those – because Dina just doesn’t swear, period, that’s her speech pattern and it sounds natural.
Joyce tho… Can she still make use of her internal censor during this trip home? Or has it been broken irretrievably?
Back when Joe offered Joyce money to swear he noted something along those lines. Someone in the comments at the time said that Joyce had the mind of a sailor but with the mouth of a Care Bear.
The Brown’s are about to meet Joyce v2.0, things could be a tad tense when they find out the total control they’ve been able to maintain is slipping away.
I hope they advance to Joyce 3.1 instead of trying to downgrade back to Joyce 1. In addition to having more freedom and more intelligent understanding of her morals and beliefs, Joyce 3.1 has the potential for networking, and also has an enhanced file manager window and the ability to play midis.
… I think I may have confused her with something else halfway through that sentence.
Joyce 2.0 has been installed and only incremental upgrades may be accomplished from this point forward. Any attempt to downgrade could result in a catastrophic system error. Becky would prefer an upgrade to accept a wider range of interfaces, but that would require an extensive system overhaul and is highly unlikely given the current system parameters.
I don’t THINK it’ll happen, as Mr. Brown seems more accepting than that, but am I the only one picturing them getting downstairs and him not allowing Becky into the car? Or the house, when they get home?
Joyce’s dad was right there with his wife in “don’t hang out with the atheist she’s semi hitler” at first. It took Joyce flipping out on them, probably for the first ever and using the bible as justification at that, to get him to relent.
Becky is still a Christian so that shouldn’t be an issue. They would probably get upset if she says she believes in evolution now but there’s no reason to bring that up
There’s no reason to bring that up either. Unless Joyce explained why she was running away over the phone, don’t remember. But I can see them ignoring it as a “phase” since we’ve known Necky since she forever and she was totally straight when we last saw her and at least she’s still a christian unlike that other friend of yours.
I will never forget my first week of college and overhearing the guy sitting behind me in class bragging about his learning how to college: “I just realized that I don’t even have to wash my underwear that much ’cause I can just turn ’em inside out and wear them TWICE as long!”
He probably thinks that changing socks means from one foot to the other, and sufficient quantities of ‘AXE’ or ‘Old Spice’ will substitute for bathing.
I do not understand this concept at all, no matter how many times I hear it. It’s just completely screwing up the POINT of underwear. You might as well go commando the second day…
I am super looking forward to this arc. Maybe her sister will come out! Maybe she’ll out her and everything will go insane! I’m so excited! I can’t wait! 😀 😀 😀
It’s true. The first time my dad picked me up from college he was surprised to see that I only had my laptop, a few text books, and ALL of my dirt cloths.
Right? Maybe? I doubt Willis is just going to have one good and one bad parent for Joyce, but her Dad seems at least a bit more mellow from what we’ve seen thus far. So getting his take on recent events might be interesting, if nothing else.
And on top of everything that’s happened, Joyce has to relearn her internal filter. I identify quite a bit with that. The first time I said “shit” in front of my mother was terrifying, and my mom is pretty chill.
You know, I have a lot of respect and sympathy for what Joyce is going through and has been going through, but essentially disowning one of your best friends, who has been a constant and unflinching support is slowly making me begin to lose a bit of sympathy for her.
I will not disagree with that it could be like this, Spencer. We both know how her last week’s been, and I think we both will allow Joyce the opportunity to not add more stress into the upcoming weekend; it is going to be hard enough as it is.
However, the way it happened was, I think, somewhat less than effective at conveying this. The lines Joyce just said are great for humorous web-comic effect, but from a non-comedy perspective, she conveys a very “brushing off my best friend just like that” attitude with that particular rhethorical question-and-answer. It’s sarcastic to the point where it can be seen as downright rude.
And the pre-Toedad Incident Joyce would, I think, have been more likely to say something more like “I really wish you could come… But I can’t let you.”
Now, I personally still have sympathy for Joyce, though. We’re all humans, and this is a stressful situation for her, much more than has so far been conveyed. In such times, it’s incredibly easy (especially at that age) to say something hurtful before your brain’s even registered what your mouth is doing. And personally, learning when to shut up and when to ease back on sarcasm was a lesson I most definitely had to learn
She’s not disowning her. It’s a matter of picking your battles. This is one that Dorothy knows she’s willing to fight and has fought before, but there’s nothing to be gained right now. It would just add one more thing to the pile that Joyce and her folks are going to have to deal with.
Joyce knows she has a lot to deal with. Her best friend, now an out of the closet lesbian, is traveling with her. Her parents are, at best, going to be cold to the idea, and at worst, hostile. Joyce has to pick her battles and she knows that being in the lobby with an atheist, and bringing her lesbian best friend on her visit home, will generate too many battles to handle at one time. Dorothy understands this and wants to be supportive, but she doesn’t want to cause more problems.
Well, there’s this article (I probably can’t post the link) that implies the world is going to rain hell on Indiana for its religious objections law. Then it sort of goes on to say that maybe nothing of that nature is actually happening. And if it is, those pesky transgender folks, they’re not going to be protected. Give us a couple of days to calculate the numbers.
Seriously, the world, on the average, is getting better. Just not right now, in Indiana.
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Baby’s First Lifehack
(…actually, no, that would be “be a minor and have parents do everything for you”)
“Crying gets you things”
Soiling yourself gets you new clothes.
“it’s okay to pee on your parents, they won’t be mad”
And they certainly won’t bite your ear open for it. Nope.
I need the story that led to this one-liner.
My mother has some temper issues. There isn’t a scar, but I’ve been told more than a few times of an occasion where baby-me was bitten on the ear hard enough to draw blood in retaliation for being peed on.
“Biting and chewing stuff within your reach gets you attention. Pen, bugs, power bar, your older brother’s homework.”
“Get milk from your mother breast anytime you want with this one weird trick”
And, to be completely frank, doing laundry at home is the last refuge of the “have parents do everything for you”.
Vegas odds that Joyce is going to let a curse slip out in front of her parents?
100% chance.
Honestly, those odds are so even, no bookie would ever take that bet.
reno evens that she finds a way to play it off!
I still don’t quite understand how someone can go until their freshman year in college without uttering a single swear.
But that might just be me being too used to how many young people DO swear nowadays.
First one I remember is when I was NINE. We were driving home from a theme park, I was tired from a long day of having fun, and dozing in the back seat. A wreckless driver nearly ran us off the road, and I muttered “Bastard” because I was half asleep.
I swear my mom’s head rotated 180 degrees to glare at me.
Isn’t wreckless driving a worthy goal?
Yeah, but he nearly wasn’t.
I made it to twelve, but my sister’s debut was at eight… that was disconcerting for me, seeing as I’d barely started myself. And no, she didn’t learn from me, she cursed in front of me before I cursed in front of her.
Oh, nice.
Mine was when I was, ooh, 10 or 11. Someone was threatening to spread a humiliating (at the time, it’s actually pretty petty now) rumor, so I chased them around outside yelling, and I quote:
“I’m going to fucking kill you! I swear, I’ll send you to Hell! Fuck you, I’m gonna kill you! Get back here, I’ll beat the shit out of you! Do you hear me? I’ll fucking kill you!”
That’s the exact quote. I almost strangled the kid before a teacher lifted me off ‘im.
Those were troubled years.
Well, at least your avatar is appropriate.
“Bastard” was possibly my first swear word. And the first instance a teacher had no counter-argument for me, but still insisted they were right. I pointed out that technically I was a bastard, so it wasn’t really a bad word. That may have been 1st grade…
When I was four…My cousin was born and me being the selfish brat I was, I wouldn’t go unless they promised me McDonalds french fries. As soon as we saw her in the window, I turned to my parents and went ” We saw her, now where’s my fucking french fries?”
My three year old has learned that, when something doesn’t go right, the appropriate thing to say is “Shit!” It is both hilarious and adorable. And also something we really need to stop laughing at and start saying not to do, but damn it, it’s just so cute!
Haha, when I was about four my mom had some guests over and my baby sister’s crying started up on the baby monitor. Four year old Chris exclaims, “Oh SHIT, the baby’s crying!”
They watched what they said around me a little more closely after that.
I think it was second year at college, my parents came for a visit and we were talking as they were about ready to head home. They were in the car, I was standing. For some reason I said a curse word and my Mom reached out from the car window and slapped me across the face.
I kid you not…and my family was never all that religious.
We recently forced my thirteen-year-old niece to say “fuck” in front of us. (“We” consisted of her mother and stepfather and myself.) She’s Lawful Good and needs permission for everything – cursing included. I fully believe she could have made it to Joyce’s age without cursing if allowed. We’re a family who believes that words are words and as long as she’s not cussing out her grandma (her paternal one, at least, my mom has a mouth like a sailor), she should be allowed to say whatever she wants.
“We recently forced my thirteen-year-old niece to say “fuck” in front of us.”
“We’re a family who believes that … she should be allowed to say whatever she wants.”
Irony?
Totally.
Making someone who’s uncomfortable swearing swear is not decent, especially a thirteen year old being pressured to swear by people older than them. Personal linguistic choices can be an important part of identity, and taking away those choices take away an important part of an individual’s autonomy. I didn’t swear as a teen and I had people do that to me and it’s really uncomfortable and I wished afterwards that I hadn’t let them do it to me.
I swear quite a lot, and once I was getting a ride home from college with a friend and her parents. She asked me in advance not to swear in front of them. Thing is, we were in a play and decided we could use the ride to rehearse our lines. The play was set among incompetent lowlife criminals whose every second word was “fuck.”
So there we are, in the bak seat of the car with the parents in front I’ve been told not to swear in front of, as we go through these lines where “fuck” and “shit” are used as punctuation…
Her mother did actually ask at one point what we were doing.
Your friend knew exactly what she was doing.
Well, _technically_ you weren’t swearing in front of them, you were in the backseat.
Pfft my daughter wasn’t even six when she uttered her first swearword. I was up late one night playing League of legends, and from behind me comes “Kill the bastards!” I popped her butt for being out of bed, and told here not to use that word in public.
Good for you. “Kill” is a terrible word.
My nephew drops f-bombs when things go wrong on occasion.
He is three.
We have all stopped even thinking about fighting it.
My other nephew used to be unable to correctly pronounce “bridge,” dropping the “r” and causing raised eyebrows and schoolgirl tittering when he called bridges… well, he wasn’t calling them drums.
My friends’ eighteen month old has already picked up the f-word from her mother.
I managed to avoid swearing in public until high school. Mainly because my parents kept telling me that swearing was a sign of being unable to express yourself. I did know the words, I just avoided using them in front of my family.
I’ve always hated that saying. You’d be hard pressed to find anyone that would say George Carlin had a limited vocabulary.
Actually, that’s a very good thing to teach your kids. Yes, just because you use swear words doesn’t mean you can’t not, but trying to avoid them DOES enrich and expand your expressive language.
For me, it was mostly picking up fictional swears. Still worth it though.
That’s what I tell my kids: “It demonstrates a paucity of vocabulary.” But I also tell them that they aren’t allowed to use those words until they’re adults themselves, because (a) kids will get into trouble for using those words even if we, their parents, say it’s okay; and (b) adults have the experience to judge when it is and is not appropriate to use such language; kids don’t necessarily.
We did try to not swear around them, but gave up about three months in. We couldn’t both avoid it, not completely; and we couldn’t completely curb our friends’ vocabulary (not successfully). So we gave up, and teach them when it is and isn’t appropriate, instead (inappropriate in a business situation; in these and these social situations; and for a kid, always).
^ This. I pretended for about thirteen seconds that we weren’t going to swear in front of my daughter once she was born.
Her dad is a truck driver. Her paternal granddad is a truck driver. Her maternal great uncles are all truck drivers. Her maternal uncle is an Afghanistan and Iraq veteran. I am a former college lifer with the mouth of a sailor.
My parents were openly racist around me and successfully taught me “we don’t say these words in public” to keep us from being publicly racist. (Yes, this is terrible. I get the fun job of teaching my daughter that her grandparents’ beliefs are both wrong and antiquated and that she needs to ignore what they have to say because trying to counter it with logic and correct ideas has never worked.) I think I can manage to teach my daughter that GODSFUCKINGDAMMIT is fine when you fuck up your drawing in your bedroom but not when you’re in the middle of a crowded aisle at Walmart. :p
I always found that argument ridiculous. You don’t expand your vocabulary in any real sense by avoiding words as though they were lepers. It’s just a comfortable, and mercifully, harmless, lie we tell kids to get them to try not to swear. You don’t want to overrely on them, but you shouldn’t make anything short of an article or ‘said’ a cornerstone of your speech.
Plus, having said that, you /really/ don’t prove your vocabulary with your interjections. Those are kinda the things you don’t think about by definition.
I was up there with Joyce, not really cursing until college, for similar reasons. I was raised in a weird semi-religious bubble, Catholic school and ‘Catholic’ family, but in a loose, vague sort of way. Like both parents considered themselves religious because that’s how they were raised, and that’s ‘just the way it was’.
They didn’t really push any issues or scripture, and church attendance was sporadic and done out of obligation (I got the feeling it was chore-like routine for them, like banking on redeemable ‘god-points’, or again, just doing it because that’s what people do). I think young me found more value in it than they did, and I think I took a sort of personal pride in avoiding profanity – especially when people tried to force it out of me.
The tipping point came late in high school, when reading aloud for English classes. Some of the characters would swear, and it would cause me to stumble, attempt to avoid it.
I realized that was stupid – a word shouldn’t have power over you like that, shouldn’t limit you. So I stopped worrying about it. And honestly, not a lot has changed. It’s not like I was constantly holding back a torrent of swears – Joyce seems to have been more ‘pent up’ in that respect. But taking away the ‘forbidden-ness’ of it, that lack of restriction -it’s nice. Like taking off a scratchy stuffy coat you never knew you were wearing.
I think I started using “damn” occasionally when I was in my teens. Very rarely, though. Mostly I still say “flip” and “sugar”. I’m British, and I’m still a bit wary about “bugger”, which most British people don’t even consider a swear. (I get my tendency not to swear from my mum, and she says it.)
(Actually, now I think about it, there was one time when I was 15 when I was very annoyed about something and used the f-word. Only it was under my breath and there was no-one else there, which is barely a step from thinking it.)
Oh, man, used “bugger” in front of my British mum as a teen once and did she flip out! Apparently, while it’s one step removed from “aw, cheese!” to North Americans, to old-school Brits it’s actually pretty rude. “It’s a reference to bestiality,” she said. (I could go further with particular connotations, these days, myself, but I won’t).
These days I use it and things like “wanker” when I want to express vehemence without actually offending anyone, because we are in Canada, not England, and no one here actually gives a damn about them.
Your mum has that wrong. It’s a reference to sodomy, not bestiality. I guess to a certain mindset there’s not much of a difference.
I was about…now wait, it would’ve been while I was on Scout camp, ironically enough (given that they’re all about being upstanding members of the community and all), and I learnt that it was okay to swear from a couple of the girls who were the GSL’s granddaughters. Yeah really.
So I was a 13yo boy, learning to swear from two 11yo girls who I had crushes on. xD
I can also remember that my first swearword was “shit”.
It was a couple more years before I even dared to swear in front of an adult (so, about 15). Nowadays, I use swearwords mostly as colourful language and just dotted liberally through my bloody speech. 😉
Dude, my Scout group swears more than sailors. Swearing is part of the Scouting movement, here.
Most of my troop were pretty innocent at that age, oddly enough.
A couple of years later, however, it was all change, and I was frequently the only sober member of the troop too. I don’t know how things changed that much in like 2 years. xD
i’m Australian, so it’s basically part of my culture that swearing is in everything.
we can get away with it see as how many things want to kill us.
I live in Alaska, so you can–SHITE–imagine what–FUCK–that’s like.
Joyce swears like a sailor, she just uses other words for it. “Gosh darn it” was basically her catchphrase until she switched to real swears.
It’s not actually hard to condition yourself to only use certain words as swears. Much easier than go without the words you’ve gotten used to as swears at all…
Joyce is in for a bad time.
My first swear was in 3rd grade, it was jackass. My parents had told me I could say any word in the dictionary so when I found out that one was in there I had a FIELD DAY.
My sister’s first swear word was when she was in second grade and she didn’t say it out loud. She wrote it. In a paper for class. I can tell you my mom was not happy when she got a call from the school saying “your daughter wrote ‘George Bush is a dumbass’ in her school paper”. My dad and I, however, found it hilarious.
Good thing you didn’t find “fuck” in the dictionary. Or maybe you decided that would be flying too close to the sun.
I DONT FUCKING SWEAR TO MUCH! FUCKY YOU!
the accidental extra Y makes me sound like a 3 year old attempting to swear
Fuck the fucking Y. It’s a fucker. :p
My first real swear was around 14. I was playing a video game and lost a boss battle, so I said ‘shit’. My dad laughed.
I didn’t feel comfortable swearing openly until 16, but now I’m 18 and foul-mouthed as fuck in certain contexts.
My first swear was me talking to my sister
I was like, 12, and I said “No, you conga” instead of “No you can’t”.
I thought it’d be funny. It wasn’t.
I made it to junior year in college.
Young people have been cursing since time immemorial. What /is/ considered a curse changes. Let me put this into a little perspective, and the quote is simple enough that even my crappy memory should get it more or less right:
“Gol’dangit,” Almonzo /swore/.
I remember reading Farmer Boy as a little kid and thinking “Oh, my mom was right, Darn /is/ a swear word”. And in our house, it was, at least for me and younger sister.
Also the graffiti at pompei is fucking filthy, but I doubt it’s all kids.
Almost certain but only after they drive her to the breaking point and beyond with continual moral hypocrisy and attempted erasure of her friendship with Becky. Then Joscelyne turns up with an announcements and things get really stressful.
My concern right now is that this may be the last time Joyce and Joss are welcome at their parents home (although their siblings may not be so dogmatic about it).
Truly, Becky is a better college student than Joyce.
Despite not actually currently being enrolled.
Being a college student is a mindset, not an education… which explains a lot.
See also: the entire careers of Linday Lohan and Lil’ Wayne.
Collage is a great experience, spoiled only by the fact they try to tech you stuff
Joyce agrees http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-5/01-when-somebody-loved-me/classes/
Those college survival instincts are so important
Who’s your gravatar, if you don’t mind my asking? The art style seems familiar.
It’s from Awkward Zombie, don’t recognize the character itself.
Who needs colleging when you have Becky?
Show of hands: who else thought Willis was going to have today’s strip be four or five panels of internal screaming?
hands
who’s to say that it is not?
If it is, she is truly gifted at multitasking.
She’s had a lot of practice at wearing the happy face.
Also, hands.
becky’s speech pattern has taken over the alt-text! first dina, now this! soon, she may rule!!!
Only Soggies may rule.
Dina may have caught up that clue.
“Help! I’m being held captive in a Chinese laundry!”
No Musak today? Dissapoint.
How dare you disrespect the hacked Muzak? It needs to play a song at least once per day.
Hacked Muzak : Parents just don’t understand by Will Smith.
*Plays “They’re Coming to Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa!” by Jerry Samuels on the hacked Muzak*
Okay that will do for now. We need a plan to rescue Stephen from the Chinese laundry. Anyone have any ideas?
We’ll need more Calgon!
I don’t have Calgon, but I have Calzones!
(That explode.)
“Ancient Chinese secret, huh?”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzixL7Ef-bI
“Help! I’m being held hostage in a fortune-cookie factory!”
…for the first time, I arrived at the comments section with only Ana Chronistic there. Hm.
Anyway, being someone who doesn’t swear, I always thought it was cool Joyce had a similar thing. It’s a little weird seeing her swear, still, and sometimes I think that’s what people think when I start swearing on rare occasion (rather than, as she and I once hoped, that it would promote seriousness)
I used to Very Rarely swear, as well.
It depends how you say it. Apparently, when a naturally-adorable person swears casually, it’s weird, but when the same person swears in anger, it’s more shocking.
(Pet peeve of mine, that people think I can’t get angry — like, yes, I do still have a full range of human emotion.)
Becky resets her happy-go-lucky persona crazy fast.
It’s both relieving and worrying:
Relieving because it could possibly mean that she’s started to get used to the idea of an unrequited crush on Joyce. And it’s plain adorable.
Worrying because it could also mean she’s gotten so used to this kind of heartbreak that she can just reboot nigh-instantaneously. And Heaven help us if she’s faking it.
Sadly, I think it’s part of growing up under Toedad. Oftentimes, you have to be very quick to bury your negative feelings and play-act like nothing’s wrong on a dime to stay safe. As someone who’s learned to turn on a dime with emotional states (albeit due to different reasons), I can definitely see it as a crucial survival method.
I agree.
I lived under folks who were rather like Joyce’s/Toedad. You’re happy because you’re not allowed to be anything but happy and if you’re not happy, you hide away until you are or you put on a mask of happy because they don’t actually give a damn about what you’re feeling, they give a damn about how what you’re feeling makes them look, and if you’re feeling anything other than happy, you’re obviously just “having an attitude” to embarrass them or “turning on the waterworks” to “manipulate” them. Not because you’re legitimately hurting over anything.
Nothing you feel is ever seen as genuine. It’s all an act or manipulation to get something out of them. Unless you act happy. Happy is safe. Happy protects you. So you put on the happy mask. Because it’s the only way to eke out any security at all.
It’s some Stepford Wives type crap.
I think it’s part that part her being hella emotionally resilient and quick to bounce back.
It’s her default state, and her default mask! I know it very well.
Becky is fun and loud! ^-^
She feels she has to be:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/04-walking-with-dina/downer/
The way you phrased that made me think of “Amazi-Girl is […]; not Amber.”
*shudder*
As you’ve pointed out more than once, Becky is good at covering over her emotions.
Oh college, with the nouns and the verbing.
With the verbs and the nouning.
Ah, but can you verb your nouns adjectively?
(A masterful case of adverbing your adjectived nouns)
Is “Learn Howta College, Yo” the next book’s title?
I have a hard time picturing anything beating it.
I support this.
Verbing weirds language.
Oh God, someone finally made that reference.
I think I love you.
I was a fan of the source back in the day, but I still had to look it up to figure out what was being referenced.
The Internet: remembering things so I don’t have to since… ::wanders off to look up a date::
Same here. “Why is that quote so familiar and why did it make me so instantly happy?”
…. Touche.
21 years and counting… 🙁
anyone else notice that dina and becky are no longer holding hands after the last strip and dina seems to be hovering out of shot?
It’s definitely a visual metaphor.
Soon Dina will be back in the minor character box, only popping out to say a cute line for all eternity.
Hey, hands get sweaty, and people don’t want to be glued to each other 24/7, romantic as that may sound.
Heh… I almost believe myself…
we’d all like to believe you, but this is one relationship that can definitely not be described as “being based on faith“
Verbing weirds language.
Another one makes that reference! I am so happy right now.
And a pronoun is a noun that’s lost its amateur status.
So what’s an adverb?
(I still can’t put into words how happy I am that so many Calvin and Hobbes fans read DoA.)
It doesn’t help that one of my classes is currently covering verbs and we just went over nouns. Ah, college writing courses! I laughed so hard I scared my boyfriend.
Oy, enough with the verbing already! xD
Well here it is the first new strip I read after going though all the archives. Now I have to wait for new ones.
Welcome to… the comments.
Awesome username. 👍
I’m not sure whether I want to actually see Joyce’s whole visit home or skip most of it.
*A week later, we cut to Joyce’s house burning*
WHAT DID YOU DO
soooo joyce is meeting with her parents literally after a shooting at school that was cause by her keeping becky around….*grabs popcorn*
And she might be bringing Becky along:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/02-that-perfect-girl/elsewhere/
Oh thank god. Like no that’s gonna be lots of no fun for Becky but Joyce is definitely going to need some kind of support.
Yeah, no, neither of them caused fuck-all. That’s all on her dad.
You assume rational reactions.
Especially since Joyce’s mom has already decided to victim-blame Becky, and by proxy, Joyce: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/sweetie/
If I were Joyce’s dad/mom I’d be worried. We saw Becky’s dad disowning her so it’s unlikely he’ll ever appear again, but as far as they’re concerned he could be planning for a repeat performance as soon as he’s out of police custody.
curse you becky making me think of the sponge bob theme song…..
I think that last panel is the most realest comic panel I have ever read.
Also, Becky and Dina have definitely been shown to be the best of the crew at crisis management on the fly (see Dina’s initial deflection of Toedad or Becky’s fast thinking to get him recorded on a 911 call threatening her friends’ lives).
They’re such great problem solvers when all the chips are down.
Agreed. Billie has been, too, with the fire alarm for Ruth, and at the Ryan-party. (Come to think of it, crises are the only time that Billie feels competent. I wonder whether she subconsciously contributes to crises, in order to solve them and feel competent.)
AAAAAAAAAALLLLLLPPHHHHAAAAAAAA BONGO!!!
FAAAAAAAAAAAAACE!!!
Stop the Faces!
Sarah’s pretty solid in a crisis too.
Actually, I wonder how Joyce’s parents would react to actually seeing Becky in-the-flesh, now that Joyce told them (or her mom, at least) that she’s a lesbian.
On an unrelated note, Becky is now tied for ‘Most Adorable Person’ with Sierra, Carla, and
MikeDina.They probably already know and reacted negatively, given how Joyce said “and yeah, she’s a lesbian. So what?” at the end of last chapter.
“Poor girl, how are you holding up? Do you still think you are a lesbian? Don’t worry, you will find a nice young man in time.”
“Oh, look the Pastor decided to stop by special for dinner tonight. Now, let us all join in prayer circle that God may save the soul of those who have strayed from His path.”
That might actually be good if they don’t get too pushy about it, considering that Becky’s already decided that God’s path is wider than her Church said.
…Not likely they’ll be so decent, but I can hope.
That’s my former friend. He was very involved with his church in high school and was friends with his youth pastor. He was outed by someone after graduation.
In college, his parents wouldn’t visit him (they’d drive halfway across Texas to visit their daughter, but not 45 minutes to see their gay son), but every once in awhile the youth pastor would come to see him. Evidently at his parents’ request. He liked these visits at first
But after a couple years of these visits, he tells me, “I just wish someone would visit me because they want to see me. Not because they want to see if I’ve “changed my mind”
Unpleasantly plausible.
No, it was “big honkin’ deal”.
/me honks.
“Silent Red wanted by the police…”
I’m sure Becky’s been the talk of the church (or cult, I’m still waffling on that definition) since Fundie’s arrest. Her reception downstairs, and at the Brown’s home, will be most enlightening. Both to us, and to Joyce.
I ONLY pack dirty clothes when I go home for breaks.
It’s always completely dirty or completely clean for me. I don’t like dirty clothes mixing with clean clothes and confusing me.
Same here… and I’m not in college anymore.
Frequently swearing Joyce makes me sad.
dammit – oh shit, i’m sorry, that was a swear. crap. fuuu- I’M GOING TO STOP TALKING NOW.
it’s a tragic cycle.
That just makes me wonder if she’s going to let one slip out while she’s talking to her parents or she’s just going to hold it in for most of the day until one of them brings up the gun incident and she just explodes in a major rant and uses every swear word in the book.
I’m kind of waiting for the possibility that Jocelyn is also there, Joyce finds out, and when Joyce’s parents trip her out over the gun incident (or Becky, or Jocelyn, or whatever), Joyce totally table flips and is all, “FUCK THIS SHIT. Come on, Jocelyn, Becky, we’re out of here,” and leaves like a BAWS with one arm around Becky and one around Jocelyn. :3
Because I believe in implausible “perfect reaction” scenarios. ^^;
“Dammit” is not a swear, it’s a punctuation mark.
Somewhere between a full damned stop and a f****** exclamation.
There was a Doonesbury strip, back around the time of the (first) Gulf War, where the soldier character had been called up again; he admitted to his new squadmates that he’d been out so long, he’d even forgotten the proper use of “the f-word”.
“Oh, that’s easy. Just like you would a comma.”
The great thing about the f-word is that it works as all parts of speech. You hardly need any other words.
“Fuck! The fucking fucker’s fucked. Fuck it.”
I think her parents will get a shock as well when something damnit slips out,
Joyce was always a heavy swearing person, she just used different words.
Hey, I totally get this. It was like a dollar fifty per load. That’s a lot of quarters to shake out of vending machines!
Did any modern college students here get an electronic laundry card like students at my school did?
I had one of those way back in’ 99 at Mizzou.
For me, it’s the same student ID that we use for meals and getting into our dorms. It would be decidedly more efficient if the laundry room card readers were consistent, but if they have to mess up on one of the three…
Yep. And it’s expensive. Mind you, it’s Vancouver, so stuff tends to be more expensive here anyways. We have to buy our laundry cards at the centralized hub between all the dorm houses, and reload said cards at the same place. We can even use debit cards to add money. The wonders of technology, Ladies and Gentlemen.
I’ve got one. 2 bucks a load, to wash or dry.
10 years out of college and I still find myself subconsciously hoarding quarters.
The alt-text isn’t wrong. We college kids verb our nouns all the time Cuz we don’t English at top form unless it’s worth points, yo
Englishing is hard work.
Man I really need to collect some of these for my English-as-a-foreign-language kids. There is test grammar, and then there is how people actually talk
And speaking from experience as someone who used to talk with “test grammar” people react to you about how they react to Dina if you speak with proper grammar and enunciation all the time and don’t use contractions.
Also verbing nouns is a wonderful part of slang which explains how being an adult, being adult, and adulting are all different things with different implications.
(Also, adulting is one of my favorite noun-verbs ever! Nothing else I’ve ever found has adequately put words to the sense of, “Yes, I know this is really petty and most other people my age do it without trouble, but shut up I just got the hang of something that’s really hard for me! Whoo!” that adulting encapsulates in a single word)
I learned English as a foreign language, and we were definitely taught contractions as test grammar… would be just weird without them indeed o.o
That’s always confused me, as someone who learned the “rules” “straight.” “Top form” English is my default, though I won’t pretend I don’t probably slip a bit here and there without noticing.
It actually takes me extra time and deliberate mental effort to write ungrammatically – including, yes, when I have to present dialogue as it is literally spoken, complete with hesitations, filler words, and fragments. Or l33t or txt-spk, etc etc.
Practice bloody practice. After a month or two of frequent exposure, even l3375p34|< can be read smoothly.
…though I don't see much benefit to it. Conversational English can be harder to write, though. Not sure practice can help with formulating ideas more loosely.
Well, you can use 1337speak for passwords. Foil dictionary attacks, and easily meet the “one number and one special symbol” security requirements!
“Agrammatically,” surely.
Or nongrammatically? Hrrm.
Don’t pick language nits, seriously. It never helps unless you’re an honest-to-god copy editor and you are currently receiving ducats for the effort.
that was the joooooke
Verbing nouns is absolutely Englishing in top form. If it was good enough for P.G. Wodehouse it’s good enough for anybody.
Someone else who made up a lot of words (including verbing nouns): William Shakespeare.
Elizabethans did amazing/awful things with their language. Frex, you could foot an enemy.
And since it’s at the point that every moment with Joyce’s parents is completely and utterly awkward and also paint them out to be completely ignorant A-holes. I’m just going to take a stab in the Dark and say the next few pages is going to be about Becky being shunned by Joyce’s parents and giving her crap for putting her in danger.
Or an ambush party will be waiting at Brown Central to “pray the gay away.”
Her mom has proven herself to be an extremist fundie, but her father may be more moderate and open to ideas that don’t 100% fall in line with doctrine. After all, he was the one who supported Joyce’s decision-making when she stood up for her friendship with Dorothy.
This might be the first time we see Joyce and Hank together without Carol around. Hopefully they have a good long talk on the ride back home.
It would be interesting to see a flashback to the parents’ younger days. I suspect one or both of them were born again as adults, and might have come from a less religious background.
I have to admit even today I still prefer to wash some clothes at my parents home when I travel to see them, the weather tends to be nicer and the clothes dry faster there. I just pack them in a bag so they don’t combine with the clean clothes.
Becky makes a VERY good point. Anything to avoid slugging your laundry all the way down to the dorm basement and back up, free or not.
Yep. Slugging it a hundred miles makes a lot more sense.
She needs to slug a hundred miles with clothes regardless though. Might as well multitask.
Slugging it a hundred miles.
In a car.
Where she’d be carrying clothes anyway.
About 60 percent of my fellow undergrads were from the metro area about 2.5 hours drive from campus. It was expressed as, “Far enough the parents don’t just drop in, close enough to get the laundry home.”
Tbh I still take dirty laundry with me whenever I go home to my mom’s and I’m in my 30s…. xD (I mean, I go there maybe 5 times a year and she lives 11 hours away, so it’s not like she does all my laundry :p)
For me (similar age) it hits that point 2 days before where it’s like:
I could do laundry now, but I need to go to the bank to get quarters, hope the apartment washer/dryer isn’t in use, approximate how long the cycles are for time planning (not marked on machine).
Or I could do laundry there after my flight, while we’re off hiking, with no change needed, and with machines that actually get my clothes clean and dry instead of cleanish and damp (though they fixed the dryer recently).
Same here. The thing is, though, she just glows while she’s putting it in the washer because she’s “doing something to help you”! So I reached a point several years ago where I just bring everything dirty so she can enjoy herself bustling around and folding my socks.
Good to see that Becky is still on top of things.
The question is, does Becky have broke homelessing down? The test is how much of that heap of clothing she just handed Joyce to wash for free is hers.
I see at least one stripey sweater-vest in there. 🙂
It might be free to do the laundry at home but she shouldn’t get her mum to do it.
Yeah, I’ve got two brothers, and my mom taught us all to do our own laundry as preteens. Probably saved her a lot of awkward sheets and tubesocks.
…which come to think of it doesn’t apply to Joyce. Huh. Different families are different.
But that would make her parents feel useful, which is possibly the greatest gift she can give them right now.
What if her mom is doing the laundry, and see’s the blood sweater?
What happens then?
Yeah, Joyce should do the laundry herself.
So in comic time the countdown to the Brown Familypocalyse (the Brownmaggedon?) is in minutes. Does that mean we the readers get to see it next month?
February: Browning of Age
Aging of Brown
Dumbing of Browns
If I am reading the preview panels on the tumblr right, this chapter “The Perfect Girl” ends on february 23, 2016. But Joyce won’t be back at IU then, she goes out to a restaurant with Jocelyne and her father.
I predict a nasty scene with her mom at home, followed by an attempt at damage control at the restaurant. But the next chapter is named “When God Closes The Door”, which does not bode well for the damage control working.
I think the full saying was something along the lines of “when God closes the door, He opens a window for you.”
Might be able to put a hopeful spin on those expectations.
Trying to make that into a dirty joke, but I got nothing.
damn right thats how you college hahaha. Becky is a fast learner
I’m still expecting she’ll end up moving in with teach
Possible complication – Mary learns about it and attempts to use it to destroy the career of a lesbian teacher.
Thus overplaying her hand and thus actually losing leverage.
That’d be funny, seeing as it’d be a private activity of a public servant. Believe it or not they’re not obligated not to take boarders!
Is that orange bit the orange sweater? I suppose that wouldn’t make sense if Becky just grabbed stuff out of the laundry hamper, though, so maybe not.
If Joyce or Joyce’s mom finds it, bloodstains and all, then you’ve called it.
Daaaaaaang
D= Joyce better learn to lie better if she wants to explain that away.
“I accidentally cut my hand on a broken glass”
Both technically true and untruthful
The problem is that Joyce is bad at lying. This doesn’t mean that half truths designed to not technically be lies are something she’s much better at though. She’s not magically compelled against lying. Shes just terrible at it.
“Somebody horrible pretended to be religious so he could try and hurt me. Like Becky’s dad. And now you.”
Seems simple enough. c.c I can see no way for this to go badly.
I’m thinking it’s the orange shirt Joyce wore on monday, aka the shirt she wore when she punched Toedad’s face in.
I was wondering who else would notice that the sweater seems to have gone into the bag. It doesn’t bode well if Joyce’s parents discover it and confront her.
…..
Or maybe it’s just an orange herring.
You just posted that to say “orange herring”, didn’t you?
Please don’t judge me I was weak >_>
At least we aren’t getting more toedad.
And I like how take-charge Joyce is right now.
“Good news, Joyce, we got Mr. McIntyre out on bail and he’ll be joining us for Thanksgiving dinner as we pray for the tainted soul of your harlot friend!”
* Becky secretly calls 911.
* Joyce is filled with… determination.
Oh God no! That is like the worst nightmare ever.
I’d say stop giving Willis ideas but I *know* (based on previous experience) that he’s thought of a worse one to rock her cradle.
“Also, we met this nice boy named Ryan, who will be joining us tonight”
“And look! Mr. Blaine O’Malley wants to talk to you about his daughter Amber. You live on the same floor, right?”
At that point, I would 100% seriously start wondering where the hell the Head Alien is hiding.
And here’s this nice business man…Dargon!
“But we don’t know who this young man is.”
“Mike Warner. I’m just here for the carnage.”
“Well, that’s nice!”
I cannot imagine the Gunman getting out on bail.
…I can imagine the community trying.
More like disorganized and ordering her friends to help her out.
Delegating counts as taking charge.
Amazing that Joyce has gone thru several ‘growing’ experiences and still won’t let her ‘atheist’ friend walk her down to greet her parents. Hasn’t shaken off the home influence yet.
I understand being nervous but…
What I do wonder about is the fact that there was a campus shooting, kidnapping, and police involved in the whole thing. And yet it didn’t make the news? None of the students parents were informed? Or learned of it?
So after the amount of passed time, her parents really don’t know about it, in this age of instant communication?
That I find hard to believe.
Her parents do know about Ross bringing a gun to campus. The day it happened to!
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/sweetie/
It also probably made the news, because Dorothy showed up to the hospital as a reporter.
As for why Joyce doesn’t want Dorothy to come down and see her off, it’s because she wants to avoid another possible incident. She might have been able to talk her dad into calming down about Dorothy’s atheist beliefs before, but the Browns may be more concerned about their daughter now. Her dad might see Dorothy as more of a corrupting influence.
She’s trying to present as still that perfect girl who doesn’t doubt the Lord’s plan for her and thinks all the morality she was raised with was awesome and she’s terrified that they’ll see how much she’s changed, so she’s trying to limit her variables (not bringing Dorothy downstairs, rejecting Becky’s offer of moral support) so she can hold her mask on long enough.
Or maybe not rejecting Becky’s offer of moral support. Though that really does look like too small a bag for two people’s worth of clothes.
I mean how much clothes does Becky HAVE right now? If anything she may want to head home with Joyce to retrieve some of her belongings assuming they made it back from Anderson. And it seemed to be implied that Becky is coming and Joyce was just reaffirming that she was okay doing so.
She’d picked up her stuff from Anderson before, Dina was seen wearing her hoodie, remember?
Supposedly she just went back and got all her clothes from Anderson, so she’s no longer just relying on that one biohazard outfit anymore. Hmm, yeah, not sure. I’m simultaneously in two minds on whether it looks like she’s coming along or not.
I mean the wording in that strip pretty clearly implies that Joyce had agreed to her coming and was simply double-checking that she was okay with it. Unless I rolled a one on my Reading Comprehension check that is.
This. Joyce is choosing her battles.
Speaking of battles, has it been established whether Becky is coming, too?
Its hard to tell. When Becky brought it up, Joyce’s response was a hesitant “Are you sure?” Which suggests that Joyce is okay with it if Becky is okay with it.
Agreed; the last thing that Joyce wants right now is another argument with her family. Something tells me that it’s going to happen anyway, just because her parents aren’t going to be able to hold in their fundamental admiration of Ross’s values and what they perceive to be moral courage.
Hopeful that she is just sparing Dorothy a scene (a cold shouldering by dad)
I ended up doing that laundry thing by accident today, got snowed in back home and couldn’t make it to the laundrymat before my trip. now i’m in texas and staying with my cousin, i brought a bag full of dirty clothes and did laundry today at her house ^^
Coming home with dirty laundry is one of the best things Joyce can do to relieve tension. Her parents can tut about kids be kids, remember when they did the same and still feel useful.
It seems so fraught with metaphor when you say it like that…
Probably delaying the inevitable.
Good thinking, Becky.
Even though rationally I know the two comics have basically nothing to do with each other, panel 3 Joyce reminds me of the Kiwi Blitz style and I don’t know why.
Joyce and Steffi are both small, cute human females with similar haircuts. On top of that, since Joyce joined Blitz in the ‘punching bad guys’ club, she’s been cursing near as much as the kid.
True, but that doesn’t really explain why this particular Joyce reminds me of the cubewatermelon style more than any other Joyce-face, including the other Joyce-faces in the same day’s comic.
Oh well. Maybe I’m just weird. -shrug-
No, I see it too. I think it’s a peculiarity of the angle and expreasion of her face that makes it look a little softer, which pushes it into resembling Cagle’s art. I didn’t see it until you mentioned it, but the similarities are there.
Sorry, still stuck a bit back, and wondering when you decided this Mary wouldn’t just be a horrible, nasty, judgemental hypocrite like the Walkyverse one, and you decided she needed to be literally Satan.
To be fair, she has only taken advantage of people’s problems and thrown verbal abuse very casually. Not only is this pretty standard fare for assholes, but she’s fairly tame for real life standards of “bad person”.
She’s still evil, mind you. But she doesn’t make top ranking – she’s just in the right place and the right time to play evil. She’s not a skillful player, she’s a lucky one.
So what you are saying is “To be fair she’s not HITLER” ? XD
She hasn’t initiated a pogrom but give it time.
She’s an abusive transphobe and homophobe who takes obvious pleasure in making people suffer by throwing their “sinful” behavior in their faces.
Given that she ranks as 4th worst character we’ve seen at the worst, I’m curious where you’d put Ross, Blaine and Ryan.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Carol makes a strong play to pass her in this next storyline as well.
I said this on another page, but I’ve literally read the past few days, a few of the beginning strips, and some others with Mary. I only know Ryan because he was linked in discussion of the “original” version. I’m finally getting around to reading Roomies! and may reread It’s Walky! and/or reread and finish (or at least get closer to this comic’s launch date in) Shortpacked! before going with this one.
Ryan is worse, but on the other hand, he’s not specifically after trans girls (among others), so he’s a little less of a personal issue on.
I know I’m a little late on the complaining about the misuse of literally train but ummmm… (Checks to see if Mary has a pitchfork and horns. Realizes that she doesn’t, and is actually just a bigot, like many others that exist in the world)
In all honesty I don’t think Dumbiverse Mary is doing anything that I wouldn’t expect Walkyverse Mary to do. The only difference seems to be the author knows she’s not a good person right from the start.
It also hasn’t yet been revealed that she’s a hypocrite about it and has been having casual sex while attacking others for the same thing.
She seems to have a dirty internet search history, as Carla almost found out.
Honestly, I’m really hoping now that we don’t see a repeat of “Mary has an abortion”, even in her backstory, as some way to prove that she’s just such an evil skank and deserved to be punished in such an operatically evil woman fashion. The more I think about it, I realize it was one of the cringiest aspects of Roomies, which is already a massive cringefest.
I missed the “dirty internet search history” bit. When was that?
I agree on the rest though. I doubt we’ll see it. Willis is both a much better storyteller and less generally cringeworthy than he was back then. He was still working through his own prejudices. Though I did like the revelation that Mary was intended to be the good Christian girl replacement and he just couldn’t stomach that from the get go, so she became evil.
I would like to see some further insight into her that makes her more understandable or even sympathetic, without making her any less of a villain.
It was in a patreon strip.
I already greatly dislike how the confrontation between Mary, Carla and Ruth played out, but at this point it feels kind of wrong attempting to understand Mary when the most significant thing she’s done in the history of the comic is be a horrible, bigoted asshole. I don’t care enough to want to learn anything.
That’s not a particularly good place for any character, even an antagonist, to be in, but I’d rather Mary forever be a cardboard villain who eventually gets defeated and humiliated than use Carla’s misgendering as a beginning to Mary’s story arc.
Personally, I’m all for using Carla’s misgendering as the beginning of Mary’s story arc. Given said story arc is about her falling into a wood chipper, or getting crushed by a hippo, or getting teleported into the Walkyverse! Martian Invasion and becoming a casualty, or… (Yes, I’m trans. Can you tell?)
While that sounds delightful, I meant that I don’t want Mary to become developed if the starting point is going to be her saying transphobic garbage to Carla. Like, before Ross suddenly became violent and monstrous, we got that brief sequence with him trying to come off as the concerned father to Dina, just out to save his daughter. I don’t want that for Mary anymore, not after saying something as gross as what she said to Carla, and I actually think it’s a shame how things played out, even beyond how much I hate how Carla was victimized in service of Ruth’s story. Instead of any actual, legit reasons for Mary to oppose Ruth (like say, being an abusive shithead), letting us develop Mary as an antagonist for Ruth, someone who definitely deserves what’s coming to her, it’s just because Mary’s a bigot and hates Ruth for being a queer lady. It felt like she had to say something completely fucking atrocious to Carla so that Ruth could look good, and then move onto the real meat of the story, Mary blackmailing Ruth. Carla was incidental, a puppy that Mary kicked, and I hate when that happens to queer characters.
Anyway, the TLDR of it is that we need more Carla. DoA is now the Carla show and it’s just going to be about her throwing pies in lesser characters’ faces and then flipping double birds and skating off.
Eh, at this point, there’s still time for what happened with Carla to be more about Carla, but I see where you’re worried.
Yeah, I’m expecting more Carla focus later, since she’s so prominent in future preview strips. I hate what happened now, but I’m hoping that it’ll be used a jumping off point for more Carla.
I wonder if that’s more true from reading Shortpacked! We didn’t learn anything because we’re still getting her core character down in DoA, but that hasn’t really changed (Since, well, nobody’s has). We saw her /say/ she’s a sweet prankster, but we finally SAW it with the hoppable force bit and the like.
Though that’s apparently a really hard lesson to convey when it’s from a trans woman, given how many people found her to be Mao 2: The Sequel.
Honestly, I think not immediately dispersing when Mary went “could you not” was maybe the “worst” thing Carla has ever done in comic. Otherwise she’s maybe just been kind of curt with Sal and Malaya.
I mentioned this a few days ago, but I see Carla as someone who takes power in the label of being an asshole, but never actually does or says anything towards that. She was completely uncomfortable with the idea of actually hurting Amazi-Girl when for all she knew she was there to actually harm her and her friends, and took it upon herself to clean up Amber’s head injury because she knows how annoying it is to do so by herself, without any kind of snide or sarcastic remark you’d expect from somebody who apparently makes a big deal of deliberately being hated.
She’s been fucking hilarious with Sal, without a single doubt. Like, not ‘most excellent’, but definitely hilarious. Sal was kinda earnin’ a bit of sass too, so it’s not like she can (Or would, or did) complain either. Seriously, of the various character pairs, ‘more Sal and Carla’ has been like, near the top of the list for me, if not at the top.
Yeah, I kind of see Carla as someone who expects and wants a bit of ribbing in her relationships. She likes sassing and getting some sass back.
If she’s willing to dig out other people’s laundry to attack them… a response in kind is appropriate. Let’s see how far she’ll pull the brinkmanship after what we’ve found.
What I meant was that I don’t want something like Mary having an abortion being used to show how much of an Evil Woman she is again. Roomies had Mary get pregnant as an ironic comeuppance, and I know she was a shithead there too but that’s fucking gross. She was punished in a specifically female way.
Fair point, Spencer.
Eh, I’m still finally reading through Roomies!, but from what I’ve seen and/or can remember if she appeared during It’s Walky! in any meaningful capacity, Walkyverse!Mary is less genuinely gleeful about making others suffer for their “sins” and throwing around her power. She’s very obviously enjoying herself while she tries to shame Billie, for starters, while Walkyverse!Mary still has herself totally convinced she’s doing the “right thing” rather than acting out of outright sadism. Other than that, pretty similar.
There is a point in the future where Mary does, in fact, show herself to be the actual worst person ever.
Oh, I know she’s a terrible manipulative hypocrite who tries to ruin other people’s lives. It’s just that, from what little I saw when I skipped ahead to check up on that more, she still seems to earnestly believe she’s doing the “righteous” thing, while it’s becoming increasingly clear that for DoA!Mary, that’s a thin rationalization for just being a power-hungry sadist who enjoys hurting people and wielding power over them.
…worse than Head Alien? or is he not a person? I don’t know his rules.
*Spoilers for later down the line for It’s Walky!, heads up for people who are only checking out the redux*
*Seriously I warned you*
There’s a point later on where Mary meets Sal again for the first time in years, and while she initially comes off as sympathetic an remorseful to how she’s treated her previously, she then drops a charming line about how Sal’s parents dying was her fault, and must be retribution for some mistake she made.
Head Alien will blow your parents up and laugh about it, but at least he’s honest!
Oh, wow, I forgot that part, and it’s from a section of the comics I’ve actually read. (I read It’s Walky! in full, though my understanding of when I started reading it seriously is a tad bit fuzzy. Sometime before it ended, but after it had been running a bit. Earlier attempts were turned off by the potty humor in the Nachitos storyline)
Sooo.. Mary is an angel?
Can we PLEASE stop pretending that Mary’s actions are unrealistic and cartoonishly evil? People are transphobic lesbophobic powergrubbing moralizing mega-bongos with superiority complexes in the real world. The way you’re saying it, you make it sound like it’s bad writing, instead of an accurate portrayal of what LGBT people have to deal with every single day.
Every single time someone says “Mary is being written to be unrealistically evil,” I nearly begin to cry.
Dude, I am LBGT. I’m not saying she’s unrealistic, I’m saying she’s evil to an incredible degree. I’ve had to deal with more than a few Marys already, although most of mine were purportedly feminist rather than Christian.
This strip is refreshingly a light hearted change of pace and a the most collegey comic I’ve seen in a while. Ah, variety.
I tend not to curse, though I don’t have any objections to it. It always sounds forced and fake.
The funny thing, though, is my 14 year old son. We’ve never had rules against cursing. He watches the most foul-mouthed youtubers, and has frequent exposure to my inappropriate friends, who frequently forget there are kids in the room when they start telling stories.
And he doesn’t curse. Even when he’s playing online shooters with headphones on, thinking he’s alone. He’ll get ganked and yell out “darn it!” with genuine venom.
Learning from your example!
I curse a lot in English but I can’t curse in my own native language without it sounding forced and fake… because I picked up conversational English in homestuck fandom and conversational Russian at home, where my parents don’t swear at all either.
I had to get a book to teach me how to swear in Russian.
eh, “darn” is a curse word. its used *exactly* as damn is. so someone who says these babyfied cursewords cant say “i dont curse” in my opinion
My mother didn’t want me to say “crud”.
My mom wouldn’t let us say “oh my gosh” because “gosh” sounded too much like “God.”
Verbing weirds words.
I don’t care if someone already said that, Calvin and Hobbes quotes are always right.
Nouning verbs, however, is worse! Example:
Microsoft excel not only weirds language, it also weirds the data!
Avoid using it if that’s in your could!
Today, Joyce learns a valuable lesson from Sensei Becky-sama!
Seriously, given how strong Joyce’s parents reacted to Dorothy, she’s wise not to force any more confrontations. It would probably be better to intermittently send them pictures of “Me and My Friends” including Dorothy so they become inoculated to her presence in Joyce’s circle with time.
This is probably my pessimist side showing but something tells me Joyce’s dad is going to choose all the wrong conversational tacks and all the wrong things to say to make Joyce feel better. I’m sure that, by the time she gets home, she’ll be ready to bite her mother’s head off when she makes some crack about “aren’t you glad to be away from all those filthy sinners?”
That seems more like something Joyce’s mom would do more than the dad.
Colleging is good forya
Interesting thing about Joyce’s swearing is that she’s always done the censored swearing thing a lot. Fudge & b-hole & poopieface and all that. Seems like she uses those more than the other characters actually swear.
Now that she’s broken the damn, will she keep up the frequency and just shift to the real words? It doesn’t seem like she’s going to keep censoring them.
You’re saying that she’s actually always been foul-mouthed but that she’s got a incredibly good internal censor? Sounds legit…
It’s not wrong though.
Seeing as that’s a thing that actually happens? Yes.
I think it’ll take a while for the internal censor to become inactive, though. If it ever does.
We now need AU fics where foul-mouthed Joyce gets split from nice Joyce in a transporter accident.
Or where a magic rosary keeps foul-mouth Joyce in check, which only Ethan can remove.
(Yes I know Joyce’s version of Christianity doesn’t do rosaries. Just a source of more angst.)
Yup. That’s why her friends were so eager to make her use ‘real swears’ but not, say, Dina, who also doesn’t use those – because Dina just doesn’t swear, period, that’s her speech pattern and it sounds natural.
Joyce tho… Can she still make use of her internal censor during this trip home? Or has it been broken irretrievably?
Back when Joe offered Joyce money to swear he noted something along those lines. Someone in the comments at the time said that Joyce had the mind of a sailor but with the mouth of a Care Bear.
For a minute I thought the dirty panties were some sort of subliminal territory marking thing.
Ah yes, the non-cursing transition of meeting up with the parents. Have fun.
This incredibly lighthearted, fun strip can only mean one thing:
Bad things are coming.
The Brown’s are about to meet Joyce v2.0, things could be a tad tense when they find out the total control they’ve been able to maintain is slipping away.
I hope they advance to Joyce 3.1 instead of trying to downgrade back to Joyce 1. In addition to having more freedom and more intelligent understanding of her morals and beliefs, Joyce 3.1 has the potential for networking, and also has an enhanced file manager window and the ability to play midis.
… I think I may have confused her with something else halfway through that sentence.
Joyce 3.1 is interface compatible with a wider range of systems.
Joyce 2.0 has been installed and only incremental upgrades may be accomplished from this point forward. Any attempt to downgrade could result in a catastrophic system error. Becky would prefer an upgrade to accept a wider range of interfaces, but that would require an extensive system overhaul and is highly unlikely given the current system parameters.
Becky and Joyce grew up together, right? So why does Becky have an accent like Sal’s, while Joyce doesn’t seem to have any distinctive accent at all?
Becky doesn’t have an accent, her dialogue is just a little fast and sloppy.
Why am I imagining the Benny Hill theme here?
Imagine this scene with that being played
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/astray/
I don’t THINK it’ll happen, as Mr. Brown seems more accepting than that, but am I the only one picturing them getting downstairs and him not allowing Becky into the car? Or the house, when they get home?
Joyce’s dad was right there with his wife in “don’t hang out with the atheist she’s semi hitler” at first. It took Joyce flipping out on them, probably for the first ever and using the bible as justification at that, to get him to relent.
Becky is still a Christian so that shouldn’t be an issue. They would probably get upset if she says she believes in evolution now but there’s no reason to bring that up
Becky’s gay, so it is actually going to be a massive issue.
There’s no reason to bring that up either. Unless Joyce explained why she was running away over the phone, don’t remember. But I can see them ignoring it as a “phase” since we’ve known Necky since she forever and she was totally straight when we last saw her and at least she’s still a christian unlike that other friend of yours.
They know Becky’s gay. Joyce told them, and the way that conversation played out they knew beforehand, presumably from Ross.
Becky knows college better than Joyce does! Jeez.
I will never forget my first week of college and overhearing the guy sitting behind me in class bragging about his learning how to college: “I just realized that I don’t even have to wash my underwear that much ’cause I can just turn ’em inside out and wear them TWICE as long!”
oh nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
EEEEEEWWWWwwwwwwwww!!!!
He probably thinks that changing socks means from one foot to the other, and sufficient quantities of ‘AXE’ or ‘Old Spice’ will substitute for bathing.
It’s called recycling!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGYkNuZCnpY
I do not understand this concept at all, no matter how many times I hear it. It’s just completely screwing up the POINT of underwear. You might as well go commando the second day…
I am super looking forward to this arc. Maybe her sister will come out! Maybe she’ll out her and everything will go insane! I’m so excited! I can’t wait! 😀 😀 😀
Well, I hope she doesn’t out her. That could cause serious problems for Jocelyne.
The only person who knows that Jocelyn is a transwoman is Ethan.
I think Phildog’s suggestion is that Jocelyne comes out to Joyce (and Joyce alone), and then Joyce screws things up and causes drama.
Doesn’t seem like something to 😀 😀 😀 about, though.
Well I mostly read this comic for the drama so I second the motion but yeah maybe not something to get all happy about
Once the drama tag has been pulled, we get drama. Might as well be cheery about it.
I don’t know what it was but I really disliked Robin in that comic
Somebody who moves in without asking permission? How could anybody possibly dislike her?
Mr. Willis is very good at creating characters who arouse conflicting emotions in people. Witness the many reactions to Becky over time.
This is true
Nope. I tottally didn’t realize she didn’t know yet. This is gonna be good.
Im not sure if good is the word you’re looking for here.
This house is built on tears and pain.
Title for Book 6 confirmed.
Or perhaps the hardcover omnibus edition.
I feel like that would just be
Dumbing of Age: Complete collection, or something.
It’s true. The first time my dad picked me up from college he was surprised to see that I only had my laptop, a few text books, and ALL of my dirt cloths.
JUST her Dad? No Mom? IN-teresting. Could there be realtalk incoming?
I would hope Joyce talks to him first. He seems much more reasonable than her mom, and may be halfway sane when out of her presence.
Right? Maybe? I doubt Willis is just going to have one good and one bad parent for Joyce, but her Dad seems at least a bit more mellow from what we’ve seen thus far. So getting his take on recent events might be interesting, if nothing else.
doesn’t mean a lot, she could be parking the car
(could)
… I forgot how long ago I made my earlier comments. Wonder if anyone will actually see my responses.
And on top of everything that’s happened, Joyce has to relearn her internal filter. I identify quite a bit with that. The first time I said “shit” in front of my mother was terrifying, and my mom is pretty chill.
Joyce’s weekend looks great already.
You know, I have a lot of respect and sympathy for what Joyce is going through and has been going through, but essentially disowning one of your best friends, who has been a constant and unflinching support is slowly making me begin to lose a bit of sympathy for her.
She probably thinks she’s doing her a favor, not having her put up with more about how she’s a corrupting atheist.
I will not disagree with that it could be like this, Spencer. We both know how her last week’s been, and I think we both will allow Joyce the opportunity to not add more stress into the upcoming weekend; it is going to be hard enough as it is.
However, the way it happened was, I think, somewhat less than effective at conveying this. The lines Joyce just said are great for humorous web-comic effect, but from a non-comedy perspective, she conveys a very “brushing off my best friend just like that” attitude with that particular rhethorical question-and-answer. It’s sarcastic to the point where it can be seen as downright rude.
And the pre-Toedad Incident Joyce would, I think, have been more likely to say something more like “I really wish you could come… But I can’t let you.”
Now, I personally still have sympathy for Joyce, though. We’re all humans, and this is a stressful situation for her, much more than has so far been conveyed. In such times, it’s incredibly easy (especially at that age) to say something hurtful before your brain’s even registered what your mouth is doing. And personally, learning when to shut up and when to ease back on sarcasm was a lesson I most definitely had to learn
She’s not disowning her. It’s a matter of picking your battles. This is one that Dorothy knows she’s willing to fight and has fought before, but there’s nothing to be gained right now. It would just add one more thing to the pile that Joyce and her folks are going to have to deal with.
Joyce knows she has a lot to deal with. Her best friend, now an out of the closet lesbian, is traveling with her. Her parents are, at best, going to be cold to the idea, and at worst, hostile. Joyce has to pick her battles and she knows that being in the lobby with an atheist, and bringing her lesbian best friend on her visit home, will generate too many battles to handle at one time. Dorothy understands this and wants to be supportive, but she doesn’t want to cause more problems.
Is Becky going with Joyce?
If so, she can pick up some clothes and things from her house, as long as she endures the shitstorm that is her community.
Well, there’s this article (I probably can’t post the link) that implies the world is going to rain hell on Indiana for its religious objections law. Then it sort of goes on to say that maybe nothing of that nature is actually happening. And if it is, those pesky transgender folks, they’re not going to be protected. Give us a couple of days to calculate the numbers.
Seriously, the world, on the average, is getting better. Just not right now, in Indiana.
All the panels in today’s strip have their own titles. 1) Darnit. 2) Aye-aye. 3) Atheist. 4) Dirty. 5) College.
Is Joyce afraid of catching atheism?