Actually, it occurs to me that Settlers may become associated with sexual violence in Joyce’s mind. That means it’s a trigger for her, now, so she cannot play it without thinking about what happened that night. That IS a tragedy.
I’ve seen many sarcasm marks. There’s a classic, the irony mark:
Becky is sure doing a lot for Joyce’s mental health؟
The OpenSarc, which is simply an inverted !. Nice and simple:
Becky is my favorite character¡
And there’s the SarcMark, which is both trademarked and relies on proprietary Windows-only software, so it’s sure to catch on quickly¡
My personal favorite was the Aryunuts. Start with a ℞, but instead of the x, extend the leg of the R down into a sort of U shape, and stick a stylized peanut on the end of it. It can be created with unicode tricks (although I can’t get it to work here for some reason) and it means the previous sentence should be responded to as if the speaker is crazy.
Some sites (like IMDb, where I also contribute) use the square brackets instead of the angle brackets for their HTML tags. As I continue to expand my presence on various sites and forums, I’m going to have to start keeping a notebook so I can keep track of which site(s) will allow which sorts of tags….
If you use italics semi-regularly on the sites in question, or share urls, it’s reasonably easy to keep track of: Do the wrong one for inserting italics/links for that site.
I’m bouncing between forums like this and LJ that use the pointy brackets, and forums that use the square ones too; that’s how I personally keep track. 🙂
“Please Sarah don’t make me do it” I mean knowing what she went through of course you’d try to protect her and do what she wants but is this the best option long term?
Really great writing here, not letting anyone have the easy way out
That.. isn’t really blackmailing at all. Thats asking for help.
The more blackmaily (but not either) moment isBecky using “I’m your best friend right?” in a small low voice. If its “you can talk to me i’m your best friend.” it wouldn’t be.. but using that tone and adding in “right” is basically pressure of “if you don’t tell me.. I don’t think you think of me as your best friend”
likely not intentional but….
Actually I think it’s more Becky seeking re-assurance, with that. Because if there is something Joyce is not prepared to tell her, it’s making her question whether or not she really is Joyce’s best friend any more.
This isn’t long term, though. This is Joyce processing something that’s still extremely recent. Sometimes it takes a lot of time, support from friends, and possibly a good therapist to get to a point where you can retell an experience like that and not relive it emotionally in a painful and potentially dangerous way – that’s how it went for me, anyway. It may be a long time, possibly longer than the time frame this comic will ever cover, before Joyce feels safe enough to speak about her experience.
There can also be a sense that verbally admitting it happened to others will somehow make it more real, or reflect badly on you in some way. Joyce’s “I don’t want to even think of saying the words” really followed that theme for me. Sometimes there’s a fear that articulating it yourself will summon bad things back to you, and that if you don’t say it you can pretend everything is still okay.
Now that I know chris was talking about Joyce, not Becky, my train of thought is basically this. I’ve been with people when they’ve shared their story, and they are years or months removed from the incident. Still, it was hard as hell, they were in a super safe place, and they were as vague as they needed to be.
Joyce is a few weeks removed from her trauma. This is her asking Sarah for help because she can’t even emotionally process thinking about talking about it, much less actually doing it.
Exactly. One of the hardest things for people who have experienced trauma (and Joyce clearly has) is to let them know it’s okay to lean on trusted support. Sarah can be gruff, but she’s reliable and strong. I don’t see this as emotional blackmail. I see this as “I trust you. I may not always understand you, but I trust you and, right now, I need your strength.”
The thing is, Sarah strikes me as a young woman who, as she matures, will be that rock for many different people in many different situations. She’s not gentle; she’s tough, solid, and has her feet on the ground. She’s really some of the most perfect support Joyce could have in this situation. And even if she resents being pulled into the situation, I bet that deep down, Sarah understands her own importance to Joyce’s feelings of safety.
Huh. I think Sarah is now becoming one of my favorite characters.
She’s been one of my favorites for a while for the same reason. That, and I feel like if I was in the Dumbiverse, I would have been a male version of her. The grounded character that meets all the random hilarity with “…what.”
I’d just like to point out that in some corners of some churches, women are automatically assumed to be lying, exaggerating, or embellishing the truth when talking about sexual assaults of various flavors. It might be easier for her to hear what went on than to say it out loud.
…Oh, God. What if the little fistula really is a preacher’s son? If she seeks healing at a place of worship, they might run into each other. Ugh. Ugh, ugh, ugh. <<<Is the noise, may heaven help my heart to be more forgiving even of fictional characters, that that would-be rapist makes as Amber, Sal, and Mike's fists connect before Joyce delivers the literal coup de grâce.
I feel like if this was a physical injury you wouldn’t be using that sort of rhetoric.
If she had something like a broken leg you’d understand that it’s perfectly healthy to have somebody else take out the trash for her while she recovers, because that’s difficult for her at the moment and forcing herself to do it anyway would risk exacerbating her condition.
But since the damage isn’t clearly visible you view this as her knowingly manipulating the people around her to coddle her when what she really needs is to pick herself up by her bootstraps and power through the pain until she’s better.
Exactly! This is exactly the same as a soft-tissue injury except for the brain instead of an arm or leg. You can’t really see the actual injury, you have to interpret what the injury is from the effects it has on the person.
And brain injuries are very similar, but harder to see and to separate from the emotional trauma.
And the soft tissue injuries have an annoying tendency to have lingering effects that pop back up to cause problems long after you thought they were fully healed…
It probably sounded harsher then I meant it too be and its perfectly understandable for Joyce to say/do this but (from Sarahs POV) it is quite an emotional request
Ok, I think we just clung onto the use of the word blackmail there, cause it implies stuff like “if you don’t do this you’re a bad roomate/friend/person I like/whatever.” However, I totally get that what Joyce needs/asking for from Sarah is a pretty big thing here. I don’t want to downplay that at all either.
Emotional pressure might be a better phrase than blackmail. Fewer negative connotations. Interesting to note that Joyce is asking for help from Sarah here, where her previous roommate adamantly refused it. Sarah has to be seeing parallels between the two situations, but this time she can do something before everything spirals out of control.
Still, tough thing to ask. We’ll see if she’s up to it. I think she is. Sarah’s a better person than she cares to admit.
Actually Joyce’s perspective on the start of the night is probably is a better way to at least start the story, simply because Sarah came in at the end, so her version is gonna look like, “She was at a party. A guy roofied Joyce. I took him out with a bat right after Joyce clocked him in a face with her glass,” whereas Joyce is more likely to explain how she was invited to a party with underage drinking, way outside her comfort zone, but went along with friends and it was actually okay, she had a pop and had a pretty fun time, playing Settlers of Canaan with a group of people. She also meet up with this cute preacher’s son… At that point Sarah might be able to pick up the narrative, explaining that he kept trying to get her alone. And that he finally lost his temper and tried to grab her and force her into an empty room, which is when Joyce realized he’d drugged the pops he was bringing her. Which is when she fought back by smashing her glass across her face (cutting her hand in the process), which is when Sarah showed up. With her bat.
However, Joyce isn’t likely to want to talk about the beginning of the night even, despite it starting well, because of what it leads to. She certainly won’t want to even think about Ryan. But I do think the circumstances of how she ended up at the party in the first place, as well as how Ryan operated, is as important as the bare-bones facts of what happened, because it helps to portray how Joyce had been uncertain about the whole thing, but it seemed safe, and she even had fun, and this cute boy was interested in her. He was even a preacher’s son! She’d probably already found the husband she’d come to college looking for!
–But then it was Ryan.
–They may want to bring Dorothy along for this conversation, too. Sarah was there for the climax, but not for the build-up, and I think that’s really important to understanding the full impact of the night on Joyce.
Kryss, it’s unclear how much any one else besides Joyce knows about Ryan, or about how much happened at the party. Parties can be pretty chaotic places, and Dorothy was busy with her interview during the buildup to the assault. I don’t think even Billie knew about Ryan until Sarah started swinging her bat, and she (despite her drunken state) is probably the most ‘party-aware’ person there. Heck, Roz never even knew there was an assault, just that there was a fight at the party.
(s)This is, of course, why they’re such great places to assault someone.(/s)
Sarah is Joyce’s big sister. I wonder if Joyce remembers calling Sarah that. I’m sure Sarah does and accepting her as her little sister. That was one of the sweetest strips Willis has drawn, one of the ones that I remember quite specifically.
I mean, if my leg is broken, I ask someone for help me cross a freeway with tons of oncoming cars, they say no, and then I beg, that’s also emotional blackmail. I don’t think it’s downplaying Joyce’s issues, but she is forcing Sarah to do something really difficult for her.
I think calling it blackmail’s being pretty harsh on Joyce. I mean, sure it’s pretty jerk-y to push the burden on Sarah, and ultimately I think Joyce SHOULD be the one to talk about it, but doesn’t she at least get points for giving Becky permission to know?
I don’t even see anything that Joyce should really be faulted for in the first place. Joyce is making it clear that she isn’t ready to talk about what happened, to anybody. And if the victim says they aren’t ready, then they aren’t ready, as far as I’m concerned. Asking Sarah to explain instead seems perfectly reasonable, especially after Joyce explains why she’s asking this of Sarah. I don’t fault Sarah for not liking this, but she’s the only one in the room who knows the story and isn’t suffering from PTSD.
I actually don’t think we’ll get crying right away. Joyce is still shell-shocked, I think. I still can’t cry about any of the times I’ve been harassed, stalked, or assaulted. I wouldn’t be surprised if she didn’t cry at all.
I’m not sure if Becky raging now is what Joyce needs. Sometimes rage is the thing. Sometimes you have to check your rage because the person you care about needs something else from you. Especially, is the rage on their behalf, or is the rage about you being unable to do something or do other emotions.
I will never ever ever let Disqus be on Dumbing of Age. I hated it on Shortpacked!. It was impossible to moderate to my standards, and I got tired of wiping out 4chan raids because any damn person can post on it without prior approval by me. And to open up that kind of dregs-of-the-earth freely to stories like this? Jesus, no, never.
Wait you don’t have to approve every new user do you? It kinda sounds like that.
Or is it like everyone is approved until they do something ban worthy?
I approve every new user on this website. I prefer it. It means if someone shows up to spout a bunch of racial epithets as their first post, it never shows up on the site, while over on DISQUS I’d have to clean up the mess after the fact. Nothing like coming home from a convention and seeing homophobic manifestos everywhere, hm?
Being completely open is the entire point of Disqus, so no surprise that it’s not a feature. It’s just a point which is extremely counter to human decency.
Is there a way to add reply notifications to the current system? Or if there already is, how to enable them? Because that’s about the only thing DISQUS has over this in my books right now, I can never see what people say in response. And if it exists, I am sorry, I am not the most savvy at tech things.
Naw, I check plugins regularly, but all of the stuff for “upvoting” only pertains to the posts from the site itself, never the comments — except for just the one I mentioned, which I link a screencap of below.
Disqus is a horrible, horrible thing from a technical perspective, too. it doesn’t work at all, not even to read comments, in a lot of older browsers, and even where it works it’s way slower and heavier than there is any excuse whatsoever for a comment system to be, and it has a tendency to leak memory like an Alzheimer’s ward.
Actually, I thought the point of Disqus is to track users to aggregate their behaviour and sell the data to marketing firms. 😛
There is an option (I use Disqus on my own sites) that can moderate all comments, so it’s pretty much an all-or-nothing style – probably not something you want with a site as popular as yours.
Wow, I hadn’t realized all what you have to do behind the scenes to have a comments section like DoA’ s where I enjoy hanging out. I’m still pretty naive about the internets. On the one hand, I’ve stumbled into plenty of revolting cesspool comments sections on sites that I value. On the other hand, I’m ridiculously pleased when I come on positive comments/discussions. It never occurred to me that maybe the latter don’t just happen. Seriously, thanks for maintaining this comments section as much as for the strip itself.
I agree with Ryan. An ‘edit’ function to allow for correction of mistakes within, oh, the first five minutes — or a ‘preview’ option, so we could see how it looks before we hit the ‘post comment’ button — would be a welcome addition.
You just made my day saying “No Disqus”. It sucks for site owners (lack of control as you said, plus one day all your content will just vanish when Disqus dies). It’s horrific for end users– it comes with so many privacy invading trackers to begin with, let along the fact that the entire system exists only to build a cross-site profile of each user. It’s selling out a site’s users for the short-term benefit of a crappy comment system that doesn’t meet anyone’s needs. I refuse to use it.
It was a bit heartbreaking dropping out of the Shortpacked! comments, but I totally understood your stance of “the comic’s ending soon, and running the comments on the new site is way more effort than Shortpacked! rewards you with”.
I actually agree. I think people are more likely to hold a conversation and make interesting comments if they don’t have the lazy option of just clicking an upvote button.
True. You get more thought, and more thoughtful comments, when it isn’t possible to just “like” or “dislike” something.
Last summer I got to make a trip I’d deeply wanted to make for decades to an archaeological site, and do some first-hand research into particulars of construction that wasn’t showing up in the available photographs. I also got to compare and contrast two differing takes on details of reconstructions of the buildings.
Took well over a thousand photographs, hours of video; put a bunch of the pictures up on a forum of people who also would be interested in this and who knew I was going, and wrote a detailed, multi-part account of exactly where we went, what we did, and what we saw there, with the boring technical nitty-gritty in one thread, and a chattier, more “How I spent My Vacation”-type thread in another, each being on pages relevant to the topic.
Got tonnes of views; apparently people were very interested in the pictures and my posts about a trip I had always assumed I would have to win the lottery to make.
Not one comment. Not one single one. Several “Likes” on the FaceBook post saying we were going to make the trip, and several more on the link pointing back to the forum. But no comments.
Damn, we are a huge bunch of history nerds actively working on replicating at least one building from the site ourselves, and we’re on the other side of the continent from them all (which is how we were able to go in the first place; only a two-day drive from here), and I so wanted to nerd out with them all! But–nothing. I’m gushing and sharing with a void.
It’s so discouraging that I honestly never finished my account. Too many people seem to think clicking a like button is the same thing as actual feedback; and too many more seem to think that silence is an acceptable substitute if a like button isn’t there.
Fuck Disqus. It takes too long to load and if it doesn’t have the same control over posts then it’s not needed here or appropriate for it. Like buttons are great and I use them on Cracked all the time but I don’t have a need for them, myself. I use them when they’re available; but when they’re not, I talk.
Thanks! And if you ever find yourself wanting to know details about hearths or door hinges and locks at L’anse aux Meadows, the only confirmed Viking settlement in North America (thus far), I am totally your man. 😀
Hey! The wagon at the replica village at Norstead just down the road that is based on the faultily-reconstructed Oseberg wagon has the front axle correctly assembled! It was cool; like fifteen years ago we (my husband and I) drew up exact computer plans to build our own less-decorated reconstruction, and realized what they’d done wrong originally to prevent it from being able to steer. A couple of years later we came across an antique, Gold Rush-era wagon using the exact same set-up for the front axle as the way we had figured it should have gone. Now, a decade later, we were able to meticulously examine the reconstructed wagon in Newfoundland and saw that that one had been constructed the way we had thought it ought to go, and was in fact also perfectly steerable. Cool! 😀
Wow, trying to read that was painful, I see why you refuse to use it. I will say, however, that while I don’t care all that much about a vote button, it would be nice to be able to edit your own posts.
Poor Joyce – I understand. It’s not something you wanna revisit – especially so soon after it happened (in comic time that is). In a lot of ways it’s even harder to discuss these things with people you’ve know all your life. 🙁
Thanks you bastards, now I’m craving cookie dough and ice cream and can’t have any because I’m trying to lose weight and lower my blood pressure, and I can finally fit in my regular pants again. Gah!
If there is cookie dough I will eat AAALLLLLLLL the cookie dough. Guaranteed.
Everything about this is so painful and sad. Poor Joyce, having to think about this traumatic experience again and poor Sarah, too. Becky is really sweet and considerate here too, asking for clarification before she unwittingly says something that’d make it even worse. These ladies are all so fab and strong and I hope they get through this even tougher and stronger and hug it out in the end. Or, y’know, go for ice cream, because Sarah’s not a hugger and ice cream is better anyway 😉
This storyline hurts, but it’s also so beautiful. Love, strength and friendship <3
Yeah, Becky is doing everything I hoped she would, showing her concern, respecting boundaries, and knowing when not to push too hard. And Joyce, oof, I’ve been there when it’s all too hard to talk about.
And Sarah looks like she’s going to be earning her big sister cred once more.
Though, Sarah did physically comfort Joyce at the end of That Night — gave Joyce the most beautiful smile — and admitted openly, because she thought that Joyce wouldn’t remember it, that she cared. This strip makes me wonder if maybe joyce remembers more than she’s let on. Any way, . I think there’s a big potential in this to help Sarah, too, by helping someone who needs her, to crack the self-defensive crust she grew before DoA began.
Becky is pretty clever to connect it to the sweater so quickly. And I’m glad she is making the effort to not push any sensative buttons inadvertantly. Maybe the best to talk about this would be Billie or Dorothy, but Sarah is here, and is….realistic enough to not try and sugar coat it.
Sarah clears her throat and presses PLAY on the boombox no one saw in the room:
“This is a story all about how,
Joyce’s life got flipped- turned upside down.
And I’d like to take a minute, just sit right there,
I’ll tell you how we all became Date Rape Aware.”
(Sorry)
We, walked, up to the houseparty, 7 or 8
as Billie yelled out to us, ‘Woo! see ya later’
looked at our drunk kingdom, we were finally there
but that was before we were Date Rape Aware
She was chillin out, relaxin, acting all cool,
Playing some board games with peeps from the school
Then along came Ryan he was up to no good
Started making trouble in her neighborhood
She stabbed him in the face and he ran away scared
And thats how we all became date rape awarw
Becky really caught on quick this strip. Not really looking forward to what is about to come, though, but I think it needs to happen. However terrible it’s gonna be.
Since you had to say “however terrible it’s gonna be” I have to offer this:
Becky finds out, and in an ill conceived effort to make things right, maybe says the wrong thing to the wrong person. Word gets to Mary, who, because she is a monster, spreads rumors that the whole thing was Joyce’s fault.
Joyce is “slut shamed” by numerous ignorant asses who jump on the bandwagon in some belief that this makes them powerful, or because they decided Joyce is just a hypocrite. The stress of this drives her out of the college, then out of contact with the entire world.
The comic ends with a full page shot of Mary’s smug face, and we all hate ourselves just a little bit more.
Willis would have to invent entirely new characters to do that since Mary’s the only one who would do so out of the extended existing cast. They wouldn’t even believe she’d draw a penis let alone lead a guy on or be a ‘slut’ worth shaming.
Time Monkey, I don’t mean this as a criticism of you, rather a suggestion for everyone. “Lead a guy on” should be in quotes. Women “lead guys on” by merely existing. In lots of situations women can’t even be friendly because too many guys will take it as “being led on” AND are taught to monitor men’s reactions to/ projections onto them, lest they unintentionally “lead them on”. Even if some girl/woman actually does deliberately “cock tease” (the less polite form of “leading guys on”) because they think it’s a good game, it still goes in quotes because it is a shishitty anti-social game AND the guy has to decide which they prefer, walking away with blue balls OR keep on “being led” into rape to “teach her a lesson”. Heck, didn’t Ryan express angry entitlement to drug and rape joyce as if that was why she was at the party.
He doesn’t need to develop fully fleshed out characters. Just emails (for which he can use real world examples as a basis), message board posts, blogs, and background characters making snide remarks. As the real world indicates, they don’t even have to actually know anything about her. All they need is a target.
How does one tell someone they barely know something like this anyway? “Oh your best friend almost got raped at a party thrown by the very person you just mentioned…..Welp time for english class bye!”…See no that doesn’t work.
Joyce gave her permission. That should be good enough. (Though, yes, I can’t easily imagine Sarah speaking candidly to Becky, who she knows for a few days now? It’s… It’ll be hard.)
But Roz did invite Dorothy, who allowed Joyce to tag along (for which, no doubt, she feels guilty). Also, due to, ah, a certain incident, I highly doubt mentioning Roz did Joyce any good.
Are you referring to the incident where Roz criticized Joyce for holding anti-Gay beliefs? Or where Roz was talking about the party and complained about someone creating “an incident” (not knowing that Joyce was involved, or that it involved attempted sexual assault.)
Because both might make Joyce a bit touchy around Roz.
I swear Sarah is the most decent person in the building with regards to understanding the world and not letting it crush you.
Realist with a heart for the niave folks
None of the named characters do as far as we know. Even Ron (who hosted the party) didn’t know him by name. Or at least didn’t admit to it – I suppose he might have been “covering for a bro” that night if he’s secretly an awful person himself.
It’s a huge relief to see Becky say stuff like that. And I’m looking forward to what Sarah has to say (because she’s really been holding back this whole arc, probably because it takes her time to warm up to people).
He said no one. It might be a more powerful/scary/realistic story if Ryan doesn’t get any further punishment, because the world is unjust… I’m torn between my desire for more Old Testament catharsis vs. never having to see him again.
Killing someone over an attempted rape doesn’t really help much. The murderer runs a good chance of being caught, for one. Besides that, the sexual assault victim is now wracked with guilt for having turned their friend into a murderer. And the murderer may wind up with some psychological issues of their own. Finally, the assailant becomes a victim, getting some rather undeserved sympathy (no one’s going to set the story straight now, not without implicating the murderer).
The obvious benefit to killing a rapist (attempted or otherwise) is that you eliminate the possibility of them committing further assaults or escaping justice in court. The Strong Female Protagonist webcomic is currently in the middle of a story arc dealing with the ethical issues involved in vigilante killings of rapists and abusers, although it’s been badly derailed the last few weeks. Looking forward to them getting back to it.
Well, attempted murder doesn’t eliminate the possibility of them committing anything. If they live, all you did is open yourself up to criminal charges.
If they die, odds are you -still- opened yourself up to criminal charges. The penalty for murder is not small, and the chances of getting caught are also not insignificant. So you’re not just removing the rapist and their bad behavior from society, you’re also likely removing yourself, and whatever good things you might do. You’ve also lost a chance to reinforce to people that “rape is bad” because you’ve sacrificed any possible moral high ground, because murder is at least on a similar level of bad.
But that aside, the main reason for the “no one dies” rule is because the resolution period for something like that would effectively last for years, and that would be torture to both read and write. If Becky killed Ryan, well, maybe there’s no -mourning- period, per se, but there would still be the sick worry of getting caught, the fear of the authorities, the fear of retribution by -his- friends and/or family, dealing with the guilt of taking a life…And because those things might take months or years to work out in the real world, we’re talking about years or decades dwelling on those things in the strip.
It would basically make this whole thing awful to read.
I was trying to say “successfully murdering a rapist or attempted rapist” there, apologies if I was unclear. Ryan is an attempted rapist as far as we’ve seen, and we don’t know if he’s made other attempts with other women – and people are still seriously discussing seeing him killed.
Personally, I agree with the “let the law deal with them” approach in principle despite our horribly flawed legal system. Vigilantism is far too close to revenge for my tastes, and the drawbacks outweigh the benefits. OTOH I’ve never had a relative or close friend sexually assaulted, and I’m honest enough to admit my principles might go by the wayside if the circumstances were wrong.
My info may be significantly out of date (it dates from the late Eighties; things may have changed, legally speaking), but one of Spider Robinson’s characters once suggested filing charges of indecent exposure with the cops (assuming this is America), rather than rape. The reasoning:
1) Getting someone charged and convicted of flapping his penis at you takes a lot less evidence than getting them charged with and convicted of rape;
2) The victim’s background/dress is regarded as irrelevant and doesn’t come into it;
3) The sentences (sadly) are longer, even assuming the rapist does go to jail;
4) It’s demeaning–for him. Rapists tend (or did) to have a certain amount of social status in prison; some dude who jumps out and flaps his wiener at someone does not. He’s pretty low on the totem pole, and his stay will be much more unpleasant;
5) It takes away his power. A lot of guys get off on how much they hurt their victims. Having a victim look down on them in court, tell everyone he waggled his penis at them, and then–nothing more, it deflates them. Besides, what is he gonna do? Stand up and tell everyone that actually, he then raped you?
Probably not much help to Joyce since luckily things didn’t go that far, but something to keep in mind if he’s managed to get further with others, and they find that out. Also her parents probably wouldn’t be pulled in for some guy waving his dick at her. They may be able to get him arrested or kicked out as a chronic exposer.
Pretty sad, though, the differences between the way the legal system and society treats the two different types of incidents (and victims).
As far as I understand modern criminal law those are mostly valid points, with the very significant exception of #3. Sexual assault is invariably a felony with all the attendant permanent penalties and longer minimum sentences. Indecent exposure (or lewd conduct, which is the more common charge these days) is a misdemeanor in every jurisdiction I know of, and sentencing is a slap on the wrist compared a felony unless other crimes are involved. A defendant is far more likely to plead out of a misdemeanor with minimal penalty.
But I agree, it’s sad. As I said, the US legal system is horribly flawed – and it’s still one of the better ones on the planet, tragically.
Whoa. Okay, so on one hand I’ve learned not to attempt a joke if I want anyone to pay any attention to my actual point. On the other hand, some interesting conversation came out of it, so I can’t really regret it?
Okay, let me try and push this out like the sap I am… Damn Thank you Willis for how realistically you’ve handled issues like surviving sexual assault and queer homelessness. As a survivor who’s been friend and lover to a lot of survivors and as someone who’s had my struggles getting dangerously close to the latter for much the same reasons as Becky, it is really awesome to see someone really seem to get it and do those painful experiences justice.
Imagine this story from Becky’s point of view – Dumbing of Becky.
First we cried with her as she missed Joyce, laughed at her hijinks at Anderson’s and cheered at her blossoming self discovery and relationship with Kaitlin. Then came the bomb with unlocked doors, Toe-Dad and running away (just imagine the strips at the bus, all alone and desperately clinging to the hope that Joyce will take her in).
Then she came to IU and we could see her fooling around with Walky to try to make Joyce jealous, desperately forcing herself to have a fun day with Joyce despite – because of – the knowledge that it might be the last. We would see her monitor Joyce’s phone, ashamed and afraid but still doing it, we would see her analyse every sign that Joyce might be into girls (and the commentator thread would write post upon post debating that question) until finally, FINALLY the kiss, the coming clean and the hugs. I think we would all be so proud of Joyce at that point.
Then the coming out euphoria, more hijinks but also the growing realization that there were something we didn’t know about Joyce. Just what happened at her gender studies class? What’s up with her boyfriend-who-is-not-her-boyfriend any longer? And then Becky finds the blood stained sweater and the commentator field goes nuts with speculation.
And here comes the bomb. Cue “Damned you Williiiiiiiiis” and feels.
(just imagine the strips at the bus, all alone and desperately clinging to the hope that Joyce will take her in)
Does it make me a horrible person if the first image that popped into my head was Becky standing at the bus stop with Aslan, waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting…?
Perhaps an extra chapter in the printed version? Heard of that happening before, extra background stories not part of the main story line being made into extra pages for book versions. Mind you, it would be nice if Mr Willis also left an online version somewhere for us too…
I’m not saying Mr Willis has done it before, haven’t had the chance to get the books in fact. I’m saying others have done so & Mr Willis may consider it an option for Becky’s story…
So strips that aren’t on here? Interesting. I do know 1 place that might stock them, but it’s in another state so won’t be able to check till my holidays…
I know a place that stocks my books! You can find it by clicking on the “store” link at the top of the page!
(There will not be any bonus Patreon strips collected until book 4, which is not out yet and won’t be until this fall, but each book always has various bonus materials.)
Having a few troubles with online shopping, plus in the process of shuffling money around at the moment, but if you ship to Australia it will make it possible…
Just imagine how psyched up we would be for the Joyce-kiss after the failure with Kaitlin. And after THAT failure it would be a running gag that Becky never gets to second base.
“What’s up with her boyfriend-who-is-not-her-boyfriend any longer? And then Becky finds the blood stained sweater and the commentator field goes nuts with speculation.”
Is it intentional or unintentional that Becky in this scenario would think something happened with Eric if names aren’t mentioned?
You always impress me, but with this arc in particular. Just amazing.
An excellent portrayal of young people trying to come to terms with a terribly painful happening. Your people are so real in so many ways.
I’m so glad Becky is reaching out in a calm caring way to Joyce and that she caught Sarah’s gesture and put it together with the sweater so fast.
Sarah will come thru for Joyce I think, at least she will try.
She was there for her with the dang baseball bat.
That, I think was an easier thing for Sarah to do, she’s direct that way.
And yeah I’m sort of wondering just exactly what Becky will do when she finds out: because I think Joyce and Sarah both know his name – Ryan I think?.
Sarah knows that Joyce can’t go anywhere without seeing Ryan everywhere, so she can’t walk alone. If Becky finds that out, yeah as said earlier, she just may decide to remove the problem, somehow.
Well you don’t have too. Simply hit CTRL+F and you’ll get a little place to type in the text you wanna find on the page.
Even Internet Explorer has it! And that browser was outdated around the time the first caveman figured out fire!
Aw dangit…I havn’t commented in a while and apparently I’m no longer some form of Sal for my gravitar but instead Joe. Now my comment seems real creepy.
And it isn’t just when the b-word is standing alone. If you write something like
“sonuvab-word” or “sumb-word”, it will still show up here as “sonuvabongo” or “sumbongo”.
I was gonna say we should try obituary but then after a quick google I learned that word does not actually contain a ch even though I’ve always heard it pronounced like it does.
Unless it’s like a really old version of it.
Or they may have done it on purpose.
Sometimes dictionaries put in fake words as a copyright trap https://youtu.be/nb0YoRMXIY0?t=6m26s
(Or it could have a been a complete mistake as is also mentioned at the start of the video I’ve linked.)
I’m seeing no reference to M-W having a misspelled entry for ‘obituary’ in there…
And, while it’s not impossible that *itch* was used as a nonce spelling back in the day when spelling wasn’t very standardized, it’s very unlikely, since it’s a Latin euphemism, and thus not likely to have been forced into English orthography, and would have come before the existence of dictionaries, let alone the M-W, so any dictionary likely to include it at all would mark it as a rare variant.
I didn’t mean for the video to point out a specific instance just that this kinda shit happens…also I just really really like Vsauce and try to shoe-horn it in wherever I can.
Certainly it happens, I was responding to the claim that it’s happened in this case. (Actually, I was responding to the probably accidental claim that it’s a standard spelling. I assume No Name missed the fact that the post was about spelling and was talking about the pronunciation guide that M-W uses.)
Also, I love vsauce, too…thanks for reminding me to check if he’s put a new video out.
(Also-also…I wouldn’t say that obituary is pronounced ‘as though there’s a ch in it’ – that’s the most common pronunciation of the ‘tu’ letter sequence in English. Nature, nurture, torture, etc.)
Heh. It happens. (Gods below, I certainly know it happens.) That one is just such a common actual mistake (that I was guilty of for a while, myself) that I felt it deserved correcting, even if it were a typo.
(‘Bowlderize’ is just so much easier to say. I suspect in a couple decades, it may actually become correct.)
A few weeks ago now (wow, that long?), Roz blasted Joyce for having an epiphany. As a result, literally hundreds of comments (the thread broke broke quadruple digits) blasted Roz and referred to her with the proper term for a female dog. As a result, that particular word is now auto-censored to “bongo”, and will probably stay that way. Because no other swear term has been used that heavily to refer to a character (or indeed, anyone else) in this system, they are not censored.
This is the second time in two years that Sarah’s been faced with a roomie who desperately needs help dealing with personal issues. She’s been vilified for her handling of the previous situation despite her best efforts and despite the rest of the floor being unwilling to see the problem. Bit of a redemptive arc for her is she can help Joyce through this, and at least she’s got other people that are in the know this time.
Be interesting to see what happens (probably far in the future) if Sarah’s original roomie made a return appearance to thank her for intervening before she killed herself. Of course, that assumes the she both recovers from her traumas and credits Sarah with forcing her to get help, neither of which are a given. Makes a nice story, though.
Aside from the fact that this is verging on ALL THE FEELZ, it’s also worth noting the impressive handling on the “cinematography” on the last two panels. Maintaining the eyelines while reversing the direction is … whoa. Masterful stuff.
You are just like my old art teacher. 15 kids were watching “Psycho” at the edge of our seats, and in the middle of the buildup to the shower scene she stood up in front of the TV and asked us to pay attention to the use of light. Sure, whatever, nice light, PLEASE GET OUT OF THE WAY AND LET US BE CREEPED OUT IN PEACE HERE.
That said, I agree. Joyce’s expression is very well handled.
Wow, so many serious conversations going on here, I don’t think I’ve ever seen so many. Admittedly, it is a potential major event that’s probably about to happen (it’s still not definite until it happens, I’ve learnt that lesson), but it’s still strange not to have the usual chains of puns, the bad jokes, etc…
Not complaining, it is a serious topic, just saying it’s even turned the comment chains serious…
My good friend was sexually assaulted, and she wasn’t able to tell me for a while. I learned about it much like Becky is–a friend who knew told me while she was in the room. We then told our RA so he could be a support, and this time, I told him, with my good friend present.
For me, I was able to blurt out what happened to me, but since then, I haven’t been able to directly talk about it and use the proper terms. I use the term “physical abuse” because it’s too painful to say what really happened. For those of you saying it’s bad that Sarah is the one who needs to tell…Joyce might not even be able to talk about it.
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“She played Settlers of Catan and became Queen of the Drunks.”
“NOOOOOOO NOT CATAN CURSE YOU SHEEP FOR WOOD”
#sorry
#notsorry
Dammit Jen, playing with my feels like that
I was trying to be all sad, but nooooooo
Actually, it occurs to me that Settlers may become associated with sexual violence in Joyce’s mind. That means it’s a trigger for her, now, so she cannot play it without thinking about what happened that night. That IS a tragedy.
“Wood for sheep”, indeed.
There’s no apologizing for insulting the trauma faced by the Victims of Catan. Bad Jen. Go stand in the corner and think about what you’ve done.
…actually, I don’t think Sarah knows that part.
“Silly Sarah, it’s pronounced Canaan.”
+1
http://www.catan.com/game/settlers-canaan
She only got sheep for five straight turns.
And then… and then someone played the monopoly card…
“I summon Dark Magician Girl?”
“A… secular boardgame?! Well, no wonder.”
Well…….awkward.
Joyce should’ve just pulled out Deuteronomy 22:28-29 for Becky.
Ah, the good ole days when women were commodities instead of people…
(YES IT’S SARCASM!)
We REALLY need a sarcasm indicator for when people are typing sarcastically.
(s) I mean, it’s SO nice when people think I’m taking myself seriously. (/s)
There is a sarcasm mark in existence, actually. It just isn’t on the keyboard.
A normal keyboard, that is.
I thought the mark was “(!)” after the sarcastic phrase. It seems to be on subtitles for films and TV, anyway.
I’ve seen many sarcasm marks. There’s a classic, the irony mark:
Becky is sure doing a lot for Joyce’s mental health؟
The OpenSarc, which is simply an inverted !. Nice and simple:
Becky is my favorite character¡
And there’s the SarcMark, which is both trademarked and relies on proprietary Windows-only software, so it’s sure to catch on quickly¡
My personal favorite was the Aryunuts. Start with a ℞, but instead of the x, extend the leg of the R down into a sort of U shape, and stick a stylized peanut on the end of it. It can be created with unicode tricks (although I can’t get it to work here for some reason) and it means the previous sentence should be responded to as if the speaker is crazy.
I usually go with <span class=”sarcasm”> (text goes here) </span>.
In some boards allowing HTML, the ‘s’ tag will in strikeout lettering —
like this. It’s probably better to go with .I was suggesting putting ‘sarc’ in the brackets, but this board thinks it’s a legit tag and deletes it. Dang it!
Then use square brackets, thusly [/snark].
The reader still understands & the computer does what you see in the first line.
Some sites (like IMDb, where I also contribute) use the square brackets instead of the angle brackets for their HTML tags. As I continue to expand my presence on various sites and forums, I’m going to have to start keeping a notebook so I can keep track of which site(s) will allow which sorts of tags….
If you use italics semi-regularly on the sites in question, or share urls, it’s reasonably easy to keep track of: Do the wrong one for inserting italics/links for that site.
I’m bouncing between forums like this and LJ that use the pointy brackets, and forums that use the square ones too; that’s how I personally keep track. 🙂
–Actually, I realized as I hit “Submit,” these days I often just give up and go
/sarcasm
or
/rant.
The Net ignores slashes that don’t have brackets in front of them, and humans understand the coding fine without them. 😀
What I would hope for is a world where sarcasm like that doesn’t have to be pointed out. I suppose I would settle for a sarcasm tag…
“Dem Bones Dem Bones Dem dry~y bones/Now hear the Word of the Lord”…
Whoa! I did not see the emotional blackmail coming
What emotional blackmail? I’m literally not seeing what you’re talking about.
Panel 6, basically.
“Please Sarah don’t make me do it” I mean knowing what she went through of course you’d try to protect her and do what she wants but is this the best option long term?
Really great writing here, not letting anyone have the easy way out
That.. isn’t really blackmailing at all. Thats asking for help.
The more blackmaily (but not either) moment isBecky using “I’m your best friend right?” in a small low voice. If its “you can talk to me i’m your best friend.” it wouldn’t be.. but using that tone and adding in “right” is basically pressure of “if you don’t tell me.. I don’t think you think of me as your best friend”
likely not intentional but….
I see that more as Becky reminding Joyce that she can trust Becky with emotionally volatile information.
Actually I think it’s more Becky seeking re-assurance, with that. Because if there is something Joyce is not prepared to tell her, it’s making her question whether or not she really is Joyce’s best friend any more.
This isn’t long term, though. This is Joyce processing something that’s still extremely recent. Sometimes it takes a lot of time, support from friends, and possibly a good therapist to get to a point where you can retell an experience like that and not relive it emotionally in a painful and potentially dangerous way – that’s how it went for me, anyway. It may be a long time, possibly longer than the time frame this comic will ever cover, before Joyce feels safe enough to speak about her experience.
There can also be a sense that verbally admitting it happened to others will somehow make it more real, or reflect badly on you in some way. Joyce’s “I don’t want to even think of saying the words” really followed that theme for me. Sometimes there’s a fear that articulating it yourself will summon bad things back to you, and that if you don’t say it you can pretend everything is still okay.
Now that I know chris was talking about Joyce, not Becky, my train of thought is basically this. I’ve been with people when they’ve shared their story, and they are years or months removed from the incident. Still, it was hard as hell, they were in a super safe place, and they were as vague as they needed to be.
Joyce is a few weeks removed from her trauma. This is her asking Sarah for help because she can’t even emotionally process thinking about talking about it, much less actually doing it.
Exactly. One of the hardest things for people who have experienced trauma (and Joyce clearly has) is to let them know it’s okay to lean on trusted support. Sarah can be gruff, but she’s reliable and strong. I don’t see this as emotional blackmail. I see this as “I trust you. I may not always understand you, but I trust you and, right now, I need your strength.”
The thing is, Sarah strikes me as a young woman who, as she matures, will be that rock for many different people in many different situations. She’s not gentle; she’s tough, solid, and has her feet on the ground. She’s really some of the most perfect support Joyce could have in this situation. And even if she resents being pulled into the situation, I bet that deep down, Sarah understands her own importance to Joyce’s feelings of safety.
Huh. I think Sarah is now becoming one of my favorite characters.
She’s been one of my favorites for a while for the same reason. That, and I feel like if I was in the Dumbiverse, I would have been a male version of her. The grounded character that meets all the random hilarity with “…what.”
I’d just like to point out that in some corners of some churches, women are automatically assumed to be lying, exaggerating, or embellishing the truth when talking about sexual assaults of various flavors. It might be easier for her to hear what went on than to say it out loud.
…Oh, God. What if the little fistula really is a preacher’s son? If she seeks healing at a place of worship, they might run into each other. Ugh. Ugh, ugh, ugh. <<<Is the noise, may heaven help my heart to be more forgiving even of fictional characters, that that would-be rapist makes as Amber, Sal, and Mike's fists connect before Joyce delivers the literal coup de grâce.
I feel like if this was a physical injury you wouldn’t be using that sort of rhetoric.
If she had something like a broken leg you’d understand that it’s perfectly healthy to have somebody else take out the trash for her while she recovers, because that’s difficult for her at the moment and forcing herself to do it anyway would risk exacerbating her condition.
But since the damage isn’t clearly visible you view this as her knowingly manipulating the people around her to coddle her when what she really needs is to pick herself up by her bootstraps and power through the pain until she’s better.
Forgive me if I’ve misinterpreted you.
Exactly! This is exactly the same as a soft-tissue injury except for the brain instead of an arm or leg. You can’t really see the actual injury, you have to interpret what the injury is from the effects it has on the person.
And brain injuries are very similar, but harder to see and to separate from the emotional trauma.
And the soft tissue injuries have an annoying tendency to have lingering effects that pop back up to cause problems long after you thought they were fully healed…
It probably sounded harsher then I meant it too be and its perfectly understandable for Joyce to say/do this but (from Sarahs POV) it is quite an emotional request
*This is not a post attacking Joyce
Ok, I think we just clung onto the use of the word blackmail there, cause it implies stuff like “if you don’t do this you’re a bad roomate/friend/person I like/whatever.” However, I totally get that what Joyce needs/asking for from Sarah is a pretty big thing here. I don’t want to downplay that at all either.
You two having the same avatar is hella confusing ._.
Emotional pressure might be a better phrase than blackmail. Fewer negative connotations. Interesting to note that Joyce is asking for help from Sarah here, where her previous roommate adamantly refused it. Sarah has to be seeing parallels between the two situations, but this time she can do something before everything spirals out of control.
Still, tough thing to ask. We’ll see if she’s up to it. I think she is. Sarah’s a better person than she cares to admit.
Actually Joyce’s perspective on the start of the night is probably is a better way to at least start the story, simply because Sarah came in at the end, so her version is gonna look like, “She was at a party. A guy roofied Joyce. I took him out with a bat right after Joyce clocked him in a face with her glass,” whereas Joyce is more likely to explain how she was invited to a party with underage drinking, way outside her comfort zone, but went along with friends and it was actually okay, she had a pop and had a pretty fun time, playing Settlers of Canaan with a group of people. She also meet up with this cute preacher’s son… At that point Sarah might be able to pick up the narrative, explaining that he kept trying to get her alone. And that he finally lost his temper and tried to grab her and force her into an empty room, which is when Joyce realized he’d drugged the pops he was bringing her. Which is when she fought back by smashing her glass across her face (cutting her hand in the process), which is when Sarah showed up. With her bat.
However, Joyce isn’t likely to want to talk about the beginning of the night even, despite it starting well, because of what it leads to. She certainly won’t want to even think about Ryan. But I do think the circumstances of how she ended up at the party in the first place, as well as how Ryan operated, is as important as the bare-bones facts of what happened, because it helps to portray how Joyce had been uncertain about the whole thing, but it seemed safe, and she even had fun, and this cute boy was interested in her. He was even a preacher’s son! She’d probably already found the husband she’d come to college looking for!
–But then it was Ryan.
–They may want to bring Dorothy along for this conversation, too. Sarah was there for the climax, but not for the build-up, and I think that’s really important to understanding the full impact of the night on Joyce.
Kryss, it’s unclear how much any one else besides Joyce knows about Ryan, or about how much happened at the party. Parties can be pretty chaotic places, and Dorothy was busy with her interview during the buildup to the assault. I don’t think even Billie knew about Ryan until Sarah started swinging her bat, and she (despite her drunken state) is probably the most ‘party-aware’ person there. Heck, Roz never even knew there was an assault, just that there was a fight at the party.
(s)This is, of course, why they’re such great places to assault someone.(/s)
Sarah is Joyce’s big sister. I wonder if Joyce remembers calling Sarah that. I’m sure Sarah does and accepting her as her little sister. That was one of the sweetest strips Willis has drawn, one of the ones that I remember quite specifically.
Yes you’re right, emotional pressure would have been a better choice of words
I mean, if my leg is broken, I ask someone for help me cross a freeway with tons of oncoming cars, they say no, and then I beg, that’s also emotional blackmail. I don’t think it’s downplaying Joyce’s issues, but she is forcing Sarah to do something really difficult for her.
I think calling it blackmail’s being pretty harsh on Joyce. I mean, sure it’s pretty jerk-y to push the burden on Sarah, and ultimately I think Joyce SHOULD be the one to talk about it, but doesn’t she at least get points for giving Becky permission to know?
I don’t even see anything that Joyce should really be faulted for in the first place. Joyce is making it clear that she isn’t ready to talk about what happened, to anybody. And if the victim says they aren’t ready, then they aren’t ready, as far as I’m concerned. Asking Sarah to explain instead seems perfectly reasonable, especially after Joyce explains why she’s asking this of Sarah. I don’t fault Sarah for not liking this, but she’s the only one in the room who knows the story and isn’t suffering from PTSD.
Wow can there seriously not be one strip without a victim blaming thread?
Its not a victim blaming thread nor a post attacking Joyce, I used a poor choice of words.
Replace blackmail with pressure
Good Sherlocking Becky to connect it to the bloody sweater so quickly.
(and it took me way too many attempts before my computer stopped auto-correcting that to “shellacking.”)
She’ll think that Joyce is a serial killer soon enough.
Sh! Spoilers.
Shellacking: (informal) to beat someone decisively.
That seems more like Sarah’s role at parties than Becky’s.
Well, Shellacking really was a much better detective than Sherlock. Spellwrecker knows all!!!
“Sarah used her bat.”
“Wow, I didn’t know she played softball”
Depends where she hits..
“It was Super Effective.”
(Oh god I’m horrible.)
Expositionbomb incoming in 5…4…3…
It’ll probably be offscreen
Maybe we’ll get a strip with Becky’s face as she realizes that goes from lost to “Oh, crap”
That would actually be pretty good way of doing it.
Agreed.
Most likely with a crying while hugging Joyce end panel.
I actually don’t think we’ll get crying right away. Joyce is still shell-shocked, I think. I still can’t cry about any of the times I’ve been harassed, stalked, or assaulted. I wouldn’t be surprised if she didn’t cry at all.
Becky will cry. Oh so much. That will probably trigger Joyce too.
I’d think rage would fit somewhere on the transition. Perhaps lost > alarmed > horrified > livid/murderous > worried/comforting?
I’m not sure if Becky raging now is what Joyce needs. Sometimes rage is the thing. Sometimes you have to check your rage because the person you care about needs something else from you. Especially, is the rage on their behalf, or is the rage about you being unable to do something or do other emotions.
I wonder what the continuation of Sarah’s sentence “I’m not–” would be.
“I’m not good at that kind of thing?”
“I’m not the one who should be talking about it?”
“I’m not sure about this sweater. You think I should change?”
‘I’m not really Sarah, I’m her evil twin, and have no idea what actually happened.’?
I’m not advised to tell anyone about the alleged use of force. My lawyer’s orders.
I’m not liable for any flashbacks, in-comic or in Joyce’s mind’s-eye, that may result from my exposition dialogue.
“I’m not a person with a conscience or empathy”
Last panel: “wait, shit, yes I am”
I’m not really your big sister?
I’m not really here. You fell out of the bed and hit your head. Also, you’re snoring.
Please! I’m at work and trying not to laugh!:-)
“She…tried to watch Arrow and Flash and…didn’t really like them.”
I still liked the 1990 live action Flash just that bit more than the modern Flash.
Just had a moment of cognitive dissonance here – you’re actually using DoA art for your grav today! Nice Roz!
Also, this tells me a lot about you, Plas. (Meant to say that, before I got distracted by your grav.)
Eww, Vivyan James? 4channers decide to make a female mascot for their movement so they decide to dress her in a coded 4chan rape joke.
willis why are you doing this to us
Because life is more than wacky hijinks and sometimes exposition and resolutions cannot happen in four panels?
Where’s the dang upvote button? (I already know there is no upvote button with this comment system, cool your jets)
Don’t you know there’s no upvote button! (Didn’t cool her jets)
Willis, why are you doing this to us?
Giving us a comment system with no upvote button. For shame.
A plugin exists, and I downloaded it, but it looks really ugly and breaks the page layout.
Shame, since Disqus worked fine on Shortpacked. Still, I guess I’m used to this by now.
I will never ever ever let Disqus be on Dumbing of Age. I hated it on Shortpacked!. It was impossible to moderate to my standards, and I got tired of wiping out 4chan raids because any damn person can post on it without prior approval by me. And to open up that kind of dregs-of-the-earth freely to stories like this? Jesus, no, never.
Wait you don’t have to approve every new user do you? It kinda sounds like that.
Or is it like everyone is approved until they do something ban worthy?
I approve every new user on this website. I prefer it. It means if someone shows up to spout a bunch of racial epithets as their first post, it never shows up on the site, while over on DISQUS I’d have to clean up the mess after the fact. Nothing like coming home from a convention and seeing homophobic manifestos everywhere, hm?
Whoa, that bad? I guess I’ll never understand all those malicious people.
Also that’s a good point you made; I just checked and yea, Disqus doesn’t have that option you want.
Being completely open is the entire point of Disqus, so no surprise that it’s not a feature. It’s just a point which is extremely counter to human decency.
Is there a way to add reply notifications to the current system? Or if there already is, how to enable them? Because that’s about the only thing DISQUS has over this in my books right now, I can never see what people say in response. And if it exists, I am sorry, I am not the most savvy at tech things.
I am guessing that would be in personal settings, once you get a gravatar account for yourself.
Surely there are enough people doing commenting plugins now that one of them doesn’t suck…?
[I kinda like Disqus as a user, but it’s very obviously far from perfect…]
Naw, I check plugins regularly, but all of the stuff for “upvoting” only pertains to the posts from the site itself, never the comments — except for just the one I mentioned, which I link a screencap of below.
Disqus is a horrible, horrible thing from a technical perspective, too. it doesn’t work at all, not even to read comments, in a lot of older browsers, and even where it works it’s way slower and heavier than there is any excuse whatsoever for a comment system to be, and it has a tendency to leak memory like an Alzheimer’s ward.
Actually, I thought the point of Disqus is to track users to aggregate their behaviour and sell the data to marketing firms. 😛
There is an option (I use Disqus on my own sites) that can moderate all comments, so it’s pretty much an all-or-nothing style – probably not something you want with a site as popular as yours.
Main thing I miss is an edit button. That, and the ability to hide threads. But if the tradeoff means fewer trolls, then it’s worth it.
I would like to state for the record that I love you forever for hating Disqus
Wow, I hadn’t realized all what you have to do behind the scenes to have a comments section like DoA’ s where I enjoy hanging out. I’m still pretty naive about the internets. On the one hand, I’ve stumbled into plenty of revolting cesspool comments sections on sites that I value. On the other hand, I’m ridiculously pleased when I come on positive comments/discussions. It never occurred to me that maybe the latter don’t just happen. Seriously, thanks for maintaining this comments section as much as for the strip itself.
I agree with Ryan. An ‘edit’ function to allow for correction of mistakes within, oh, the first five minutes — or a ‘preview’ option, so we could see how it looks before we hit the ‘post comment’ button — would be a welcome addition.
You just made my day saying “No Disqus”. It sucks for site owners (lack of control as you said, plus one day all your content will just vanish when Disqus dies). It’s horrific for end users– it comes with so many privacy invading trackers to begin with, let along the fact that the entire system exists only to build a cross-site profile of each user. It’s selling out a site’s users for the short-term benefit of a crappy comment system that doesn’t meet anyone’s needs. I refuse to use it.
It was a bit heartbreaking dropping out of the Shortpacked! comments, but I totally understood your stance of “the comic’s ending soon, and running the comments on the new site is way more effort than Shortpacked! rewards you with”.
(here’s what it looks like when I activate the plugin: http://www.dumbingofage.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/commentpopularityplugin.jpg )
I can see why you don’t want the whole comments thread to look that way. Shame there isn’t a better plugin.
Apart from the broken & ugly, please don’t add in a voting system. It just turns it all into a popularity contest.
If you make a comment and can’t figure out if it would be up or down voted, you really need to consider if you should be posting comments.
By the way, fantastic installment to the story today. You’re in some seriously delicate territory and I don’t envy you threading this needle.
I actually agree. I think people are more likely to hold a conversation and make interesting comments if they don’t have the lazy option of just clicking an upvote button.
Personally, I don’t do upvotes. But then, I don’t usually do comments either. Willis is just that good.
True. You get more thought, and more thoughtful comments, when it isn’t possible to just “like” or “dislike” something.
Last summer I got to make a trip I’d deeply wanted to make for decades to an archaeological site, and do some first-hand research into particulars of construction that wasn’t showing up in the available photographs. I also got to compare and contrast two differing takes on details of reconstructions of the buildings.
Took well over a thousand photographs, hours of video; put a bunch of the pictures up on a forum of people who also would be interested in this and who knew I was going, and wrote a detailed, multi-part account of exactly where we went, what we did, and what we saw there, with the boring technical nitty-gritty in one thread, and a chattier, more “How I spent My Vacation”-type thread in another, each being on pages relevant to the topic.
Got tonnes of views; apparently people were very interested in the pictures and my posts about a trip I had always assumed I would have to win the lottery to make.
Not one comment. Not one single one. Several “Likes” on the FaceBook post saying we were going to make the trip, and several more on the link pointing back to the forum. But no comments.
Damn, we are a huge bunch of history nerds actively working on replicating at least one building from the site ourselves, and we’re on the other side of the continent from them all (which is how we were able to go in the first place; only a two-day drive from here), and I so wanted to nerd out with them all! But–nothing. I’m gushing and sharing with a void.
It’s so discouraging that I honestly never finished my account. Too many people seem to think clicking a like button is the same thing as actual feedback; and too many more seem to think that silence is an acceptable substitute if a like button isn’t there.
Fuck Disqus. It takes too long to load and if it doesn’t have the same control over posts then it’s not needed here or appropriate for it. Like buttons are great and I use them on Cracked all the time but I don’t have a need for them, myself. I use them when they’re available; but when they’re not, I talk.
I like these comments better.
I do actually, it rounds it off so much better.
Also, I hope you succeed at your task. The world needs more knowledge.
Thanks! And if you ever find yourself wanting to know details about hearths or door hinges and locks at L’anse aux Meadows, the only confirmed Viking settlement in North America (thus far), I am totally your man. 😀
Hey! The wagon at the replica village at Norstead just down the road that is based on the faultily-reconstructed Oseberg wagon has the front axle correctly assembled! It was cool; like fifteen years ago we (my husband and I) drew up exact computer plans to build our own less-decorated reconstruction, and realized what they’d done wrong originally to prevent it from being able to steer. A couple of years later we came across an antique, Gold Rush-era wagon using the exact same set-up for the front axle as the way we had figured it should have gone. Now, a decade later, we were able to meticulously examine the reconstructed wagon in Newfoundland and saw that that one had been constructed the way we had thought it ought to go, and was in fact also perfectly steerable. Cool! 😀
/nerd.
GAH! That was rather unpleasant, good sir. I commend your decision.
Wow, trying to read that was painful, I see why you refuse to use it. I will say, however, that while I don’t care all that much about a vote button, it would be nice to be able to edit your own posts.
More shizzles
Come on, Catullus, don’t be coy, you’re just like the rest of us here, you love it when Willis makes feels.
Poor Joyce – I understand. It’s not something you wanna revisit – especially so soon after it happened (in comic time that is). In a lot of ways it’s even harder to discuss these things with people you’ve know all your life. 🙁
Yep, its just like they said… there is not enough tissue or soft serve for what is to come.
Soft serve? Uh uh. Stuff this heavy requires raw cookie dough.
I’m pretty sure the amount of cookie dough that this would require is bordering on toxic levels.
Share some of those with Joyce, will ya~
Ben & Jerry’s Half-Baked. A full pint.
Thanks you bastards, now I’m craving cookie dough and ice cream and can’t have any because I’m trying to lose weight and lower my blood pressure, and I can finally fit in my regular pants again. Gah!
If there is cookie dough I will eat AAALLLLLLLL the cookie dough. Guaranteed.
too many feelings……
“Something bad happened, and something much worse could’ve happened.”
Everything about this is so painful and sad. Poor Joyce, having to think about this traumatic experience again and poor Sarah, too. Becky is really sweet and considerate here too, asking for clarification before she unwittingly says something that’d make it even worse. These ladies are all so fab and strong and I hope they get through this even tougher and stronger and hug it out in the end. Or, y’know, go for ice cream, because Sarah’s not a hugger and ice cream is better anyway 😉
This storyline hurts, but it’s also so beautiful. Love, strength and friendship <3
Yeah, Becky is doing everything I hoped she would, showing her concern, respecting boundaries, and knowing when not to push too hard. And Joyce, oof, I’ve been there when it’s all too hard to talk about.
And Sarah looks like she’s going to be earning her big sister cred once more.
Though, Sarah did physically comfort Joyce at the end of That Night — gave Joyce the most beautiful smile — and admitted openly, because she thought that Joyce wouldn’t remember it, that she cared. This strip makes me wonder if maybe joyce remembers more than she’s let on. Any way, . I think there’s a big potential in this to help Sarah, too, by helping someone who needs her, to crack the self-defensive crust she grew before DoA began.
Considering Joyce has been referring to them as Big Sis and Little Sis ever since. So she must remember the conversation.
Step up to plate, big sis for little sis.
“I don’t want to say crappy things without realizing it.”
Funny, I thought that was her sole purpose in this strip. At least she’s finally showing a decent side.
Poor Joyce.
Pardon me, *in this comic- not in this specific strip
To be fair, if anyone had been blatantly traumatized by her previous off-color comments, she probably would have gotten a clue.
AWWWW man!!!
Becky is pretty clever to connect it to the sweater so quickly. And I’m glad she is making the effort to not push any sensative buttons inadvertantly. Maybe the best to talk about this would be Billie or Dorothy, but Sarah is here, and is….realistic enough to not try and sugar coat it.
I know that kind of trauma. It took me almost a year to say anything about what happened to me and that was after a near successful suicide attempt.
I’m glad you didn’t die and I hope you’re feeling way better
=) I am, thank you. It took a lot of work and therapy to get there.
Sarah clears her throat and presses PLAY on the boombox no one saw in the room:
“This is a story all about how,
Joyce’s life got flipped- turned upside down.
And I’d like to take a minute, just sit right there,
I’ll tell you how we all became Date Rape Aware.”
(Sorry)
* Dorothy jumps in
“Not cool, Sarah, NOT COOL.”
We, walked, up to the houseparty, 7 or 8
as Billie yelled out to us, ‘Woo! see ya later’
looked at our drunk kingdom, we were finally there
but that was before we were Date Rape Aware
I feel really bad for laughing, damn you.
She was chillin out, relaxin, acting all cool,
Playing some board games with peeps from the school
Then along came Ryan he was up to no good
Started making trouble in her neighborhood
She stabbed him in the face and he ran away scared
And thats how we all became date rape awarw
I get the feeling these are a riff on a song, but I don’t know it. I’m feeling like it’s rap or hip-hop, though.
The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air theme song.
Thank you for making me feel old.
Now gimmee my cane, kids are playing on my lawn.
Becky really caught on quick this strip. Not really looking forward to what is about to come, though, but I think it needs to happen. However terrible it’s gonna be.
Since you had to say “however terrible it’s gonna be” I have to offer this:
Becky finds out, and in an ill conceived effort to make things right, maybe says the wrong thing to the wrong person. Word gets to Mary, who, because she is a monster, spreads rumors that the whole thing was Joyce’s fault.
Joyce is “slut shamed” by numerous ignorant asses who jump on the bandwagon in some belief that this makes them powerful, or because they decided Joyce is just a hypocrite. The stress of this drives her out of the college, then out of contact with the entire world.
The comic ends with a full page shot of Mary’s smug face, and we all hate ourselves just a little bit more.
I severely dislikes you.
You’re only saying that because you’re both cats. And because Smiling Cat is a horrible, horrible person.
I have a natural talent for coming up with the worst possible outcome to every situation. It’s either a gift or a mental disorder. Not sure which.
Willis would have to invent entirely new characters to do that since Mary’s the only one who would do so out of the extended existing cast. They wouldn’t even believe she’d draw a penis let alone lead a guy on or be a ‘slut’ worth shaming.
Time Monkey, I don’t mean this as a criticism of you, rather a suggestion for everyone. “Lead a guy on” should be in quotes. Women “lead guys on” by merely existing. In lots of situations women can’t even be friendly because too many guys will take it as “being led on” AND are taught to monitor men’s reactions to/ projections onto them, lest they unintentionally “lead them on”. Even if some girl/woman actually does deliberately “cock tease” (the less polite form of “leading guys on”) because they think it’s a good game, it still goes in quotes because it is a shishitty anti-social game AND the guy has to decide which they prefer, walking away with blue balls OR keep on “being led” into rape to “teach her a lesson”. Heck, didn’t Ryan express angry entitlement to drug and rape joyce as if that was why she was at the party.
He doesn’t need to develop fully fleshed out characters. Just emails (for which he can use real world examples as a basis), message board posts, blogs, and background characters making snide remarks. As the real world indicates, they don’t even have to actually know anything about her. All they need is a target.
Why is storytime with Sarah always about something painful?
Sarah just never catches a break. Ever.
Cos Sarah isn’t exactly the happiest of chappies…
Once upon a time it wasn’t storytime and everyone was sad anyway.
Sarah is a magnet, and sad stories are the iron filings.
How does one tell someone they barely know something like this anyway? “Oh your best friend almost got raped at a party thrown by the very person you just mentioned…..Welp time for english class bye!”…See no that doesn’t work.
Joyce gave her permission. That should be good enough. (Though, yes, I can’t easily imagine Sarah speaking candidly to Becky, who she knows for a few days now? It’s… It’ll be hard.)
Roz did not throw the party. Ron did.
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/06-yesterday-was-thursday/ron/
But Roz did invite Dorothy, who allowed Joyce to tag along (for which, no doubt, she feels guilty). Also, due to, ah, a certain incident, I highly doubt mentioning Roz did Joyce any good.
Are you referring to the incident where Roz criticized Joyce for holding anti-Gay beliefs? Or where Roz was talking about the party and complained about someone creating “an incident” (not knowing that Joyce was involved, or that it involved attempted sexual assault.)
Because both might make Joyce a bit touchy around Roz.
Ron? Man I totally forgot about him. He should show up more he seems nice.
🙁
I swear Sarah is the most decent person in the building with regards to understanding the world and not letting it crush you.
Realist with a heart for the niave folks
Oh also.. If Becky gets that guy’s name..
Trouble trouble for everyone.
Joyce doesn’t know his name.
Wait, does anyone in universe know his name? As far as I know, the reason we know is because Willis tagged him “ryan”.
None of the named characters do as far as we know. Even Ron (who hosted the party) didn’t know him by name. Or at least didn’t admit to it – I suppose he might have been “covering for a bro” that night if he’s secretly an awful person himself.
Interesting how the first comment on the comic that Greenygal links to has been altered because of Willis’ ‘bongo’ filter.
That’s what big sisters are for.
When it came down to it Joyce only hesitated for a moment if she wanted to tell Becky. But bringing herself to do it is another matter.
Well, Sarah, you wanted to be there for the hot part and not just the sticky aftermath. Wish granted. Jey…
You have to be there for your friends, Sarah.
Not just her friend. Her little sister. Even if Joyce may not remember.
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/06-yesterday-was-thursday/sisters-2/
But we do!
It’s a huge relief to see Becky say stuff like that. And I’m looking forward to what Sarah has to say (because she’s really been holding back this whole arc, probably because it takes her time to warm up to people).
Tryin’ to predict whether Becky is going to freak out or try to suppress it. Don’t know which she thinks would cause Joyce more pain…
Or just, “and that was the story of how an enraged Becky hunted down and straight up murdered a dude.”
Haha and I got a Becky gravatar to go with that post, how serendipitous!
The idea of Becky killing him makes me really sad that word of God says no one dies in this comic.
To quote Jafar in an ill-advised Aladdin sequel, “you’d be surprised what you can live through.”
But that was a good sequel. The animation wasn’t great but the story and characterization was fine.
Did he say “no one dies” or “no one (of the significant characters) dies”?
He said no one. It might be a more powerful/scary/realistic story if Ryan doesn’t get any further punishment, because the world is unjust… I’m torn between my desire for more Old Testament catharsis vs. never having to see him again.
Killing someone over an attempted rape doesn’t really help much. The murderer runs a good chance of being caught, for one. Besides that, the sexual assault victim is now wracked with guilt for having turned their friend into a murderer. And the murderer may wind up with some psychological issues of their own. Finally, the assailant becomes a victim, getting some rather undeserved sympathy (no one’s going to set the story straight now, not without implicating the murderer).
The obvious benefit to killing a rapist (attempted or otherwise) is that you eliminate the possibility of them committing further assaults or escaping justice in court. The Strong Female Protagonist webcomic is currently in the middle of a story arc dealing with the ethical issues involved in vigilante killings of rapists and abusers, although it’s been badly derailed the last few weeks. Looking forward to them getting back to it.
Well, attempted murder doesn’t eliminate the possibility of them committing anything. If they live, all you did is open yourself up to criminal charges.
If they die, odds are you -still- opened yourself up to criminal charges. The penalty for murder is not small, and the chances of getting caught are also not insignificant. So you’re not just removing the rapist and their bad behavior from society, you’re also likely removing yourself, and whatever good things you might do. You’ve also lost a chance to reinforce to people that “rape is bad” because you’ve sacrificed any possible moral high ground, because murder is at least on a similar level of bad.
But that aside, the main reason for the “no one dies” rule is because the resolution period for something like that would effectively last for years, and that would be torture to both read and write. If Becky killed Ryan, well, maybe there’s no -mourning- period, per se, but there would still be the sick worry of getting caught, the fear of the authorities, the fear of retribution by -his- friends and/or family, dealing with the guilt of taking a life…And because those things might take months or years to work out in the real world, we’re talking about years or decades dwelling on those things in the strip.
It would basically make this whole thing awful to read.
I was trying to say “successfully murdering a rapist or attempted rapist” there, apologies if I was unclear. Ryan is an attempted rapist as far as we’ve seen, and we don’t know if he’s made other attempts with other women – and people are still seriously discussing seeing him killed.
Personally, I agree with the “let the law deal with them” approach in principle despite our horribly flawed legal system. Vigilantism is far too close to revenge for my tastes, and the drawbacks outweigh the benefits. OTOH I’ve never had a relative or close friend sexually assaulted, and I’m honest enough to admit my principles might go by the wayside if the circumstances were wrong.
My info may be significantly out of date (it dates from the late Eighties; things may have changed, legally speaking), but one of Spider Robinson’s characters once suggested filing charges of indecent exposure with the cops (assuming this is America), rather than rape. The reasoning:
1) Getting someone charged and convicted of flapping his penis at you takes a lot less evidence than getting them charged with and convicted of rape;
2) The victim’s background/dress is regarded as irrelevant and doesn’t come into it;
3) The sentences (sadly) are longer, even assuming the rapist does go to jail;
4) It’s demeaning–for him. Rapists tend (or did) to have a certain amount of social status in prison; some dude who jumps out and flaps his wiener at someone does not. He’s pretty low on the totem pole, and his stay will be much more unpleasant;
5) It takes away his power. A lot of guys get off on how much they hurt their victims. Having a victim look down on them in court, tell everyone he waggled his penis at them, and then–nothing more, it deflates them. Besides, what is he gonna do? Stand up and tell everyone that actually, he then raped you?
Probably not much help to Joyce since luckily things didn’t go that far, but something to keep in mind if he’s managed to get further with others, and they find that out. Also her parents probably wouldn’t be pulled in for some guy waving his dick at her. They may be able to get him arrested or kicked out as a chronic exposer.
Pretty sad, though, the differences between the way the legal system and society treats the two different types of incidents (and victims).
As far as I understand modern criminal law those are mostly valid points, with the very significant exception of #3. Sexual assault is invariably a felony with all the attendant permanent penalties and longer minimum sentences. Indecent exposure (or lewd conduct, which is the more common charge these days) is a misdemeanor in every jurisdiction I know of, and sentencing is a slap on the wrist compared a felony unless other crimes are involved. A defendant is far more likely to plead out of a misdemeanor with minimal penalty.
But I agree, it’s sad. As I said, the US legal system is horribly flawed – and it’s still one of the better ones on the planet, tragically.
Whoa. Okay, so on one hand I’ve learned not to attempt a joke if I want anyone to pay any attention to my actual point. On the other hand, some interesting conversation came out of it, so I can’t really regret it?
Hmm.
Okay, let me try and push this out like the sap I am…
DamnThank you Willis for how realistically you’ve handled issues like surviving sexual assault and queer homelessness. As a survivor who’s been friend and lover to a lot of survivors and as someone who’s had my struggles getting dangerously close to the latter for much the same reasons as Becky, it is really awesome to see someone really seem to get it and do those painful experiences justice.I can think of few praises of a creator that are as high as someone who has lived the reality saying that the story got it right.
Absolutely. Hear, hear.
All the sads. 🙁
*Cue slow, dramatic musical theme*
Imagine this story from Becky’s point of view – Dumbing of Becky.
First we cried with her as she missed Joyce, laughed at her hijinks at Anderson’s and cheered at her blossoming self discovery and relationship with Kaitlin. Then came the bomb with unlocked doors, Toe-Dad and running away (just imagine the strips at the bus, all alone and desperately clinging to the hope that Joyce will take her in).
Then she came to IU and we could see her fooling around with Walky to try to make Joyce jealous, desperately forcing herself to have a fun day with Joyce despite – because of – the knowledge that it might be the last. We would see her monitor Joyce’s phone, ashamed and afraid but still doing it, we would see her analyse every sign that Joyce might be into girls (and the commentator thread would write post upon post debating that question) until finally, FINALLY the kiss, the coming clean and the hugs. I think we would all be so proud of Joyce at that point.
Then the coming out euphoria, more hijinks but also the growing realization that there were something we didn’t know about Joyce. Just what happened at her gender studies class? What’s up with her boyfriend-who-is-not-her-boyfriend any longer? And then Becky finds the blood stained sweater and the commentator field goes nuts with speculation.
And here comes the bomb. Cue “Damned you Williiiiiiiiis” and feels.
That would be a great story too.
*applause*
Just… nothing but applause for that post.
Does it make me a horrible person if the first image that popped into my head was Becky standing at the bus stop with Aslan, waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting…?
And Aslan stoically sits there as Becky uses his mane as a giant handkerchief.
“No, daughter of Eve. You are not doomed to a life void of love.”
*Becky whispers something*
“Yes, daughter of Eve, there will be giblets.”
Great, now I can’t unsee the Arslan bus stop.
If I throw money at Willis can this be a thing that happens?
Please?
Whattaya say, Willis?
This needs to be a flashback scene or a spin off or something!
Perhaps an extra chapter in the printed version? Heard of that happening before, extra background stories not part of the main story line being made into extra pages for book versions. Mind you, it would be nice if Mr Willis also left an online version somewhere for us too…
Wait what! I didn’t know that there were extra strips in the books! Shit I might need to save my pennies now!
I’m not saying Mr Willis has done it before, haven’t had the chance to get the books in fact. I’m saying others have done so & Mr Willis may consider it an option for Becky’s story…
guess I should have chosen better wording the first time. My bad…
There will be the Patreon strips in the book collections going forward.
Awesome!
So strips that aren’t on here? Interesting. I do know 1 place that might stock them, but it’s in another state so won’t be able to check till my holidays…
I know a place that stocks my books! You can find it by clicking on the “store” link at the top of the page!
(There will not be any bonus Patreon strips collected until book 4, which is not out yet and won’t be until this fall, but each book always has various bonus materials.)
Having a few troubles with online shopping, plus in the process of shuffling money around at the moment, but if you ship to Australia it will make it possible…
Man, as if today’s strip wasn’t depressing enough already…
Ohhh, ouch, I’d like that.
Just imagine how psyched up we would be for the Joyce-kiss after the failure with Kaitlin. And after THAT failure it would be a running gag that Becky never gets to second base.
“What’s up with her boyfriend-who-is-not-her-boyfriend any longer? And then Becky finds the blood stained sweater and the commentator field goes nuts with speculation.”
Is it intentional or unintentional that Becky in this scenario would think something happened with Eric if names aren’t mentioned?
What? No, I was talking about Ethan. That breakup must have looked weird to Becky
You always impress me, but with this arc in particular. Just amazing.
An excellent portrayal of young people trying to come to terms with a terribly painful happening. Your people are so real in so many ways.
I’m so glad Becky is reaching out in a calm caring way to Joyce and that she caught Sarah’s gesture and put it together with the sweater so fast.
Sarah will come thru for Joyce I think, at least she will try.
She was there for her with the dang baseball bat.
That, I think was an easier thing for Sarah to do, she’s direct that way.
And yeah I’m sort of wondering just exactly what Becky will do when she finds out: because I think Joyce and Sarah both know his name – Ryan I think?.
Sarah knows that Joyce can’t go anywhere without seeing Ryan everywhere, so she can’t walk alone. If Becky finds that out, yeah as said earlier, she just may decide to remove the problem, somehow.
And thanks all that be, you never use Discus.
Real piece of crap that particular piece of software.
I really like Disqus – as someone who runs a number of sites, any reason why you don’t like it?
I find it pratical not to have to reparse the whole page by hand when looking for answer to my messages ^^;
Well you don’t have too. Simply hit CTRL+F and you’ll get a little place to type in the text you wanna find on the page.
Even Internet Explorer has it! And that browser was outdated around the time the first caveman figured out fire!
–Unless your comment is in the bit that hasn’t loaded up yet.
Well then you wouldn’t find it by hand either…
This one has been asked and answered above, please scroll up.
…I like Disqus…
Those eyes ;_;
Right? Freaked Out Joyce Face is the best.
Is that a new Sarah face to add to the collection?!
Aw dangit…I havn’t commented in a while and apparently I’m no longer some form of Sal for my gravitar but instead Joe. Now my comment seems real creepy.
You can customize it~
Sarah dropped her default bongo face… Shit’s about to get real.
Bongo? Srsly? wow… I need to pay more attention to how comments work around here…
But “shit” was allowed?
It’s not a blanket ban on cussing, just the one word.
The b-word defaults to bongo these days. There were some issues with it a while back, hence the bowlderization.
And it isn’t just when the b-word is standing alone. If you write something like
“sonuvab-word” or “sumb-word”, it will still show up here as “sonuvabongo” or “sumbongo”.
I was gonna say we should try obituary but then after a quick google I learned that word does not actually contain a ch even though I’ve always heard it pronounced like it does.
Merriam-Webster says it does. Which dictionary did you use?
The one ending in .com
There’s no ‘ch’ in obituary. The ‘tu’ is pronounced t͡ʃ (as it usually is), but the spelling never contains ‘ch’. (Nor does M-W claim it does.)
Unless it’s like a really old version of it.
Or they may have done it on purpose.
Sometimes dictionaries put in fake words as a copyright trap
https://youtu.be/nb0YoRMXIY0?t=6m26s
(Or it could have a been a complete mistake as is also mentioned at the start of the video I’ve linked.)
I’m seeing no reference to M-W having a misspelled entry for ‘obituary’ in there…
And, while it’s not impossible that *itch* was used as a nonce spelling back in the day when spelling wasn’t very standardized, it’s very unlikely, since it’s a Latin euphemism, and thus not likely to have been forced into English orthography, and would have come before the existence of dictionaries, let alone the M-W, so any dictionary likely to include it at all would mark it as a rare variant.
I didn’t mean for the video to point out a specific instance just that this kinda shit happens…also I just really really like Vsauce and try to shoe-horn it in wherever I can.
Certainly it happens, I was responding to the claim that it’s happened in this case. (Actually, I was responding to the probably accidental claim that it’s a standard spelling. I assume No Name missed the fact that the post was about spelling and was talking about the pronunciation guide that M-W uses.)
Also, I love vsauce, too…thanks for reminding me to check if he’s put a new video out.
(Also-also…I wouldn’t say that obituary is pronounced ‘as though there’s a ch in it’ – that’s the most common pronunciation of the ‘tu’ letter sequence in English. Nature, nurture, torture, etc.)
Obongouary. 😛
Nitpick – bowdlerization. Taken from Thomas Bowdler, who published an edited edition of Shakespeare.
Arrgh. Knew that, just can’t type. Big fat fingers.
Heh. It happens. (Gods below, I certainly know it happens.) That one is just such a common actual mistake (that I was guilty of for a while, myself) that I felt it deserved correcting, even if it were a typo.
(‘Bowlderize’ is just so much easier to say. I suspect in a couple decades, it may actually become correct.)
Hmm, I wonder…
bongo
beeyongo
bizzongo
b-to-the-ongo
b___o
Wow, that’s comprehensive.
A few weeks ago now (wow, that long?), Roz blasted Joyce for having an epiphany. As a result, literally hundreds of comments (the thread broke broke quadruple digits) blasted Roz and referred to her with the proper term for a female dog. As a result, that particular word is now auto-censored to “bongo”, and will probably stay that way. Because no other swear term has been used that heavily to refer to a character (or indeed, anyone else) in this system, they are not censored.
And it’s been pretty consistently thrown out for other female characters too, hasn’t it?
Bongo it is now. … Well, there is that stereotype drummers are angry, right?
I’ve got 99 drums, but a bongo ain’t one.
I approve of this version… 😛
She was literally the catalyst for preventing people from saying ‘the B word’ – but no the Roz hate is completely justified.
I’m expecting some sort of Fourth Wall joke where Sarah hands Becky a copy of Book One, and Willis tells us where we can buy it
This is the second time in two years that Sarah’s been faced with a roomie who desperately needs help dealing with personal issues. She’s been vilified for her handling of the previous situation despite her best efforts and despite the rest of the floor being unwilling to see the problem. Bit of a redemptive arc for her is she can help Joyce through this, and at least she’s got other people that are in the know this time.
On the bright side if things get bad enough she has to get Joyce sent home their social circle will actually understand and won’t harass her for it.
Be interesting to see what happens (probably far in the future) if Sarah’s original roomie made a return appearance to thank her for intervening before she killed herself. Of course, that assumes the she both recovers from her traumas and credits Sarah with forcing her to get help, neither of which are a given. Makes a nice story, though.
I’ve been wondering about that part, too.
I…don’t have much hope about her being thanksful tho.
Muzak to this is Comfort by Bergmuller, a piecec of piano music I’m learning.
Awww… Sarah you big secret sweetie.Your rep as a hardcase is gonna fall away…
Incoming Feels in 3…2…1.
Aside from the fact that this is verging on ALL THE FEELZ, it’s also worth noting the impressive handling on the “cinematography” on the last two panels. Maintaining the eyelines while reversing the direction is … whoa. Masterful stuff.
You are just like my old art teacher. 15 kids were watching “Psycho” at the edge of our seats, and in the middle of the buildup to the shower scene she stood up in front of the TV and asked us to pay attention to the use of light. Sure, whatever, nice light, PLEASE GET OUT OF THE WAY AND LET US BE CREEPED OUT IN PEACE HERE.
That said, I agree. Joyce’s expression is very well handled.
Becky probably could have handled this better, but she has an understandable reason for wanting to know.
By the way, this is JacHunter. I finally got a Gravatar 😀
Wow, so many serious conversations going on here, I don’t think I’ve ever seen so many. Admittedly, it is a potential major event that’s probably about to happen (it’s still not definite until it happens, I’ve learnt that lesson), but it’s still strange not to have the usual chains of puns, the bad jokes, etc…
Not complaining, it is a serious topic, just saying it’s even turned the comment chains serious…
My good friend was sexually assaulted, and she wasn’t able to tell me for a while. I learned about it much like Becky is–a friend who knew told me while she was in the room. We then told our RA so he could be a support, and this time, I told him, with my good friend present.
For me, I was able to blurt out what happened to me, but since then, I haven’t been able to directly talk about it and use the proper terms. I use the term “physical abuse” because it’s too painful to say what really happened. For those of you saying it’s bad that Sarah is the one who needs to tell…Joyce might not even be able to talk about it.