I’m pretty sure Danny likes girls (Dorothy, Billie, Amber), so I doubt finding out he’s bi would make him dump her. Unless he overreacts… or she overreacts… either of which is possible…
Yeah, it can be pretty consuming, easy to vanish into. I’m not sure about Plasma Mongoose (quite possible tho), but I know I post pics with certain coloured borders to make them easier to find. Coloured borders are easier to see at higher speed scrolling than names…
Does make things easier, but it takes away part of the fun of checking out everybody’s icons. There are some funny ones on here… *points to Richard directly under this post…*
Screwball, as you are likely aware, I have been using loads of different gravatars all with the Radioactive Absinthe Green backgrounds and more recently, the same green borders.
I guessed the constant use of the same green would be to help locate your posts, but I didn’t want to post it as if it was written in stone, that’s why i added the “I’m not sure” part. I gotta admit, seeing your icons in colour gave me the idea to do the border for mine. Sorry if it sounded rude… :$
I feel bad, as I’m kinda with Malaya, but I’m knowledgeable enough to understand what she means, and realize it might be more complicated to give an android lady parts than it is to hand her a strap on and tell her to go to town.
Well, that’s a phrase I never thought would be uttered in the comments.
I think that’s where things might be headed, though. When Danny starts wrapping his head around bisexuality, it’ll help for him to get some clarification on it from a trustworthy source.
I’m kind of annoyed at “Danny is bi! That means he’s a good character now despite years of comments out for his blood!” but I’m probably being too pedantic and assuming that people like him now just because he’s bi, and not for the storylines it promises, which I detailed a little below.
I’d rather people not treat his sexuality as a novelty, but then I see so many comments that completely ignore that, hey, Danny already has a girlfriend. He’s not going to immediately blow Ethan just because he realized he likes dudes. And, I mean, I ship Danny/Ethan; I want them together because M/M relationships are woefully underrepresented in such a diverse comic as DoA, and because I think Ethan would make a better partner for Danny than Amber does, and how that relationship is inevitably going to crash.
Like I said, I think I’m just being too pedantic, but I’d rather people like Danny for who he is and not who he wants to bone.
I want more Danny because he’s providing an interesting perspective on bisexuality. Usually most webcomics deal with characters already established in their identity (like Dora and Tai from QC), but DoA is the first webcomic I’ve read with a pre-established character realizing new aspects about their sexuality, and the extremely real, clumsy fumbling we go through trying to figure it out. As much as I’ve complained about people only being interested in Danny because of his sexuality, my desire to have him feature more often has increased exponentially since we learned he was bi, if only because I love his flailing exploration of his sexuality.
I dunno, Billie seems to be fairly comfortable with her bisexuality (closet doors notwithstanding), she has other reasons for keeping her thing with Ruth a secret. Plus if it’s made widely known that she’s bi, there’s a bigger chance that people will put two and two together about her and Ruth based on their interactions…maybe…though she hasn’t been completely subtle about it anyway, let’s be fair.
Billie’s repeatedly insisted that she thinks most girls are interested in other girls at some point and that it’s no big deal, so there’s a degree of denial there about the social implications.
Eh, kinda. I like to hear specifics, cause everybody’s got their own line. Don’t wanna find out until its too late that she wants to stick my weenus in a wall socket or something.
I ONLY DID THAT ONCE!! I tried ground bridging away from the damn animals chasing me to ANYWHERE ELSE, & guess where I end up? And guess who decided to follow me? Least I had more room to deal with them & get them where I needed them to go. Last time I do a herding job…
Apropos of nothing, I wonder if the Marvel Comics character Bi-Beast ever gets flirtatious messages from people who see his name and think Hank McCoy has decided to expand his horizons.
As funny as Joyce being completely out of touch is, I feel bad for Ethan here. He shouldn’t have to stand here and listen to this little fundie girl talk about gay-types and sex weirdos, even if she’s doing it with the best of intentions.
If his family weren’t a pack of utter dickholes who made him ashamed of his sexuality, I doubt he’d tolerate it nearly as much.
I can understand that sentiment – surely not everyone would enjoy her fumbling. It doesn’t look like Ethan minds, though. Maybe because he deeply enjoys taking care of kindhearted people who like him. And lord knows he could use the support.
Yeah, he shouldn’t have to stand with this kind person whose company he enjoys! What a jerk she is, with her lifetime of miseducation that she’s trying to overcome in an afternoon. Perhaps they will come upon a crevasse and he can cast her down into it.
(Neither character is perfect, stop picking on just the one.)
Treating someone’s sexuality is homophobia. She is outright wondering if continuing to refer to gay people as sex weirdos is now a taboo.
Joyce is a good person but for god’s sake, she is totally homophobic. Not out of active malice, but it’s not like the Walkertons are aware of their racism towards their daughter either.
-phobia refers to fear, not ignorance. This insistence of lumping people under one category is one of the reason these problems persist. The lines get drawn, the sides picked, and nobody cares about the nuances of the situation, only shouting down the other side. A person honestly trying to accept people for who they are but stumbling over the languuage is fundamentally different from someone actively preaching hate or fear.
Just because Joyce isn’t actively trying to be malicious doesn’t mean I have to be okay with her ignorance. All bigotry is born from ignorance; Joyce was just fortunate enough to be surrounded by people who showed her the truth.
Yes, Joyce is fortunate to have had those experiences. And then she reacted to those experiences by trying to do better than she had been, which is just as important. Not everybody who had a gay best friend who ran away from home would have said “I won’t tell your dad and you can stay in my room until we figure something out,” and not everyone with a gay boyfriend who didn’t want to be gay would have said “We shouldn’t date anymore because it’s not fair to you, but I still want to be friends and would like to help you come to terms with your sexuality.” Joyce still has a distance to go, but she’s come pretty far already, and that’s as much due to her own choices as to the people around her.
Not calling it a phobia is not the same thing as being okay with it. That’s what I mean by boxes and lines. You don’t treat someone who needs to learn, is willing to learn, but still has a long way to go the same as someone actively spouting hate and fear. You shouldn’t label them the same way.
The “homophobia” label is one of scorn. It is inherently dismissive. It should be reserved for those who deserve to be dismissed. NOTHING WILL CHANGE if all we do is put everybody who fails to immediately align with our way of thinking in a box labeled “THE ENEMY” whether or not they are actively trying to change.
This is where I think a good approach is not to refer to people but to actions.
Joyce has had a homophobic upbringing and will likely make homophobic blunders for the foreseeable future, but describing her person as homophobic doesn’t give us the whole picture, just like not calling her actions out as homophobic because of her good intentions doesn’t give us the whole picture, since inadvertent homophobia can still affect people.
I dunno, rambling off on a tangent regarding the use of language to describe active vs passive stuff that contributes to a toxic environment for a minority group, I think there is value in not only citing the Klan-level hate, but also the small little attitudes that lead to people taking the most vile haters’ concerns seriously as addressing all are necessary for undoing bigotry.
In other words, there is value in calling out the sexism of say, an MRA douchebag, and also say the casual attitudes regarding women who have casual sex or the homophobia of say the types of idiots who passed the RFRA as well as the casual way that queer people are viewed as being wrong or off-putting if they are seen as “too queer”.
Which looping it back on topic, means it may be worth noting the deeply homophobic background Joyce is working through and the casual homophobia that still occasionally passes her lips while also cheering the massive amount of progress she has made in an incredibly short amount of time and the sheer effort she is putting into trying to move through said ignorance and absorbed cultural casual bigotry.
Yeah, that’s true. Ironically enough, she’s a form of homophobia we don’t encounter much in fiction. The casual homophobia of ignorance from a lifetime of terrible messages (messages that would lead a lot of her churchfolk to fully side with Toedad’s plan to “fix” Becky) in a person actively, desperately trying to work around it. Trying her bestest to do right and treat the people she cares about as best she can, but still struggling with all that messed up worldview and the casually hurtful things it can lead her to say despite that effort (the bit that hurt Becky’s feelings about needing to double check that the Bible had her back on Becky’s humanity).
And that’s what’s really compelling about her character in this arc, because that’s a situation that is not often explored. The person who is genuinely trying. Not trying to look respectable, not doing the least amount to be “supportive” and expecting the people in their lives to be happy with the crumbs, but really genuinely pulling out all the stops, working her damndest to do what is right against all her training.
But who nonetheless comes from a deeply homophobic place and has a lot of growth to complete to truly work through it all and be as great an ally as she so desperately wants to be.
And looping it back around to the beginning of this thread, what was said was basically ‘no one should tolerate or be around this homophobe and her wrong-spewing until she figures everything out’. Which… I don’t think so.
Only further exposure while she’s trying so hard to do that growing is going to really help. Specifically, exposure to people who want her to do that growing and are willing to correct her when she missteps – which she obviously wants, as witness her asking Ethan whether something’s right or not, even if it’s a strip punchline.
Everyone (or nearly so, I think?) allows that growth like that doesn’t happen instantly, even if Joyce is making massive headway in a very short period of strip-time, but it also doesn’t happen in a vacuum. No doubt it’ll be irritating for a lot of people, but… well, friends do irritate each other, it’s part of being friends. (As is apologizing to your friends when you do irritate or wrong them, which Joyce has shown herself to be entirely willing to do on many occasions.)
Well, if I’m just speaking for myself, I’m often willing to go an extra mile for friends that genuinely are trying and I’ll do the softly softly education thing with them, but I fully respect others who are like “I don’t need even the well-meaning form of this in my life”.
Honestly, I find Joyce very interesting and compelling in this role as she has so far to climb out of her ignorance on everything, but is so willing to throw herself into it with all her heart. It reminds me a lot of a number of very loyal friends I’ve had over the years who came from similarly ignorant initial beginnings.
But I can definitely see the argument of how that type of person can be toxic as it can really suck to absorb a lot of casual dismissal of one’s humanity even from well-meaning sources and that’s also unfortunately a circumstance I’ve more than had my share of.
I don’t think casual racism and casual homophobia are used properly nowadays. Casual homophobia isn’t “slight prejudicial attitudes towards a sexuality” or ” it’s full 100% homophobia that is passed off casually, like your grandma muttering “fuckin queers” under her breath when she sees 2 dudes holdin hands. People use the term to mean homophobia-lite, which is totally inaccurate. Casual homophobia is actually so far removed from most of our daily experiences that we search for it to find it.
Regular, store-brand homophobia is WBC style attitudes and entrenched morals – people who have very strong opinions about homosexuality.
A major problem with the LGBT community is that we shout down people who disagree, even people with legitimate questions. Brandon Eich is a great example of someone who lost the job he loved (he wasn’t just the CEO of Mozilla, he was its co-founder) because it came to light that he had once made a small donation towards supporting an anti-gay marriage law in California about 10 years ago. We’re a toxic community with a whole bunch of highly opinionated vocal assholes, and saying that progressive attitudes somehow make up for it is naive and silly.
We all have a long way to go. Joyce’s worldview didn’t form overnight, and to be honest she changed her opinions on homosexuality quicker than most people would.
I don’t really have anything to add to this conversation overall. I would just like to say how wonderful it is to be a part of the DOA community. This is a subject that is not easy to talk about on the internet without things breaking down into hostility or flame wars (least in my experience). So to see so many intelligent opinions, especially ones are in disagreement, presented such a respectful and fair manner is the best kind of feeling. This is one place I know its safe to go if I have questions and want an honest opinion devoid of open hostility.
[sigh] i feel like Joyce is trying way to hard… it seems like she’s forcing herself, to me… its good that shes trying to improve herself but… i dunno… seems fake.
She is forcing herself, but that’s not a bad thing, nor is it “fake”. She’s realizing she’s messed up and taking steps to fix it. And that requires a certain amount of force.
You kind of have to start by forcing yourself, though. True chillness comes from experience, and how else is someone with her background going to get that?
Remember, this is Joyce – she probably knows what moderation is, but not how it applies to her. Trying too hard does not qualify as faking it when it comes to this girl.
I think it’s more about Joyce not knowing the PC term for things more than her upbringing at this point. She’s even actively trying to get feedback from Ethan. And flawed terminology or not, she’s being a very great friend to Ethan right now. You can see it in his face.
Man, if the flier said “meet and greet for folks considering coming out of the closet” it would kinda kill the entire point, wouldn’t it? Just showing up is basically outing yourself in a way showing up to, as Joyce described it, a “meet and greet for ‘questioning’ individuals” wouldn’t be.
Is questioning really the same thing as closeted though? “Questioning” seems to imply folks who are still feeling out what they want and what they like.
Yeah, I’d assumed that Ethan is well past the point of questioning. He’s just closeted in order to shield himself against his homophobic parents (and because he wishes the whole mess would just go away).
“Gay-type” people…
I wonder, is Ethan a dual-type Pokemon, and if so what’s his secondary typing?
Mike is clearly Dark / Fighting or Dark / Psychic, for example.
I used to hang out with a self-described furvert. Said furvert was coming up with a series of product names for a hypothetical sex shop in the Pokémon universe.
Well now what would Joyce be? Normal-Fairy?
Amber is Normal-Fighting. Ruth is just pure Fighting.
Dina’s gotta be Ground/Rock-Dragon.
Oh, and Billie’s Poison, obviously. Huh, maybe Ruth has Poison as a second type, actually.
Danny is Bug-Flying.
Further gonna circulate the rumor that Joyce loves the ladies.
Seriously though, I am touched by Joyce’s support of her friends. She’s going somewhere that would normally make her really uncomfortable, where she pretty much knows she’s doing it all wrong, all for the sake of her beloved gay buddies. I am so charmed right now.
Aww, Joyce. <3 I've been finding her recent arc so heartwarming to read! I really would prefer to believe that good people taught bad lessons can overcome those teachings with life experience. I'm so happy to see real and fictional examples of that!
I continue to be amazed at how suddenly the trainwreck we all thought Joyce/Ethan was inevitably headed for has metamorphosed into this adorable bromance. (Sibmance?)
Those being critical of Joyce, keep in mind that this is a LOT for her to learn. Her parents had her cloistered the fuck up and sheltered. Odds are, she’s looking up as much as she is comfortable looking up and trying to be there for Becky and Ethan, two people who are among those she cares the most about, and now, two people she wants to look out for.
Secondly, Joyce isn’t trying too hard. This is Joyce being Joyce. When have we ever seen her do ANYTHING half way? Monkey Master, anyone? She throws her all into everything that she gets passionate about, and right now, she’s passionate about doing the right thing and being there for someone who she recognizes she was enabling to do great harm to himself.
Heh, she reminds me a lot of a friend of mine who also grew up with the fundiest of parents and who I spent a lot of high school and college helping him move through a lot of that baggage and ignorance largely owing to him being a good friend of me as I discovered all the things I ended up being. Just as eager to do right and move away from all the brainwashing but just as prone to making “oh I can’t believe you said that” statements on occasion.
Yeah, that…wasn’t at all what I was implying. Though if he is a student or a local here and looking for new marks, a gathering of potentially confused and/or vulnerable (fellow?) students would be a good potential hunting ground for a manipulative guy like him, particularly if he’s bi himself.
But really where I think this storyline is going is “oh hi Danny, what brings you here?”
Eee, I’ve been curious for forever to see who will be at various queer resources on the campus. Probably wouldn’t be at a queer center, but I’ve got a little hope for a Carla appearance hiding out in the corner at Becky, Danny, Billie, or so on’s first appearance at the Queer Center. And Bob knows Danny, Ethan, Billie, or Ruth could use a “questioning” group… which is probably why none of them will be seen at one for awhile, owing to the first rule of drama.
Also, it’s adorable to watch Joyce still stumble face first into her uneasy attempt to be Super Ally even though she’s still so terrible at it.
I’m not sure she’s trying to be Super Ally as much as she’s trying to be Super Friend specifically to Ethan and Becky. (For contrast, Roz is the one trying to be Super Ally in general. How much she actually succeeds has not been shown onscreen. Which is why I’d love to see a more civil meeting of Roz and Joyce. They have a lot to teach each other.)
I think that would be amazing. To have Roz and Joyce meet in an environment where Joyce wasn’t just another Mary to Roz and Roz wasn’t just that premarital hanky panky lady who threw the one party to Joyce and they could genuinely talk, because Roz has the head of a great ally and Joyce has the heart and together in an environment where they weren’t rubbing each other buttons, they could really drive each other to be even better.
Oh Bob, I just realized that the most likely person to be putting together a questioning group probably will end up being Roz given her penchant for activism… This will be interesting to say the least.
Billie’s out. ‘Bi’ or ‘not really bothered with labels, but totally open about their (non-ethically-questionable) relationships’ aren’t the same as ‘questioning’ (certainly not in the ‘baby steps out of the closet’ sense).
Danny could use it, yes, due to real questioning, and Ethan for the ‘baby steps’… Ruth…I don’t think we’ve been shown just how out she is in general…we know she’s hiding her relationship with Billie, but everything we’ve seen has shown it to be about the fact that as RA, she’s not supposed to be banging one of her charges. Howard didn’t know, but she made no effort to hide it from him, so…probably not exactly closeted, but not wholly out, either.
Yup. Personally I think that Ethans resolve to stay in the closet will only last as long as it take him to find a cute boy who may be into boys who shows an interest in him.
Ethan’s closet is already a bit transparent, or at least one-way. He doesn’t want the world knowing, but he seems OK with close friends when they talk about it. Also, some of his speech sounds like HE accepts his sexuality, at least in private and around close friends. He sometimes refers to elements of LGBT culture as ‘our’. his closet door is more open than others I’ve heard about, at least.
Wow, this is a great, palpable step on Joyce’s behalf to show Ethan that not only is she no longer wanting to “fix” him, but she wants him to accept himself. Go, Joyce!
“Welcome, everyone. Since studies have shown that working on scatological studies can be a therapeutic activity, today we are going to learn some shit!“
I’ve got to say, Ethan has to be one of my favorite people in this comic. He seems like such a bro about so much. The day he snaps is gonna be a real scary one.
Wow, Joyce – you HAVE been doing your research – and not only on bible translation. You are not only giving Ethan an option forward if he wants to leave the closet – you take steps to become a good ally yourself.
Dammit Willis! Do you have any conception just how many awesome Transformers have been released this year? Of course you do. So much moneys! Oh well, looks like DOA4 is taking another present from the wife.
I actually feel bad for anybody reading this strip and not getting a warm fuzzy feeling but thinking mean things of Joyce.
I love her so much. She’s trying so hard and she’s so kind, and I love, love, LOVE that her and Ethan are gonna stay friends. Their relationship is sweet and supportive in a way it can only be when you’ve been really fucked up together. If that makes sense.
Well Daniel the Human’s Uncle proved Fairies can’t fly – that was the first comment they said to him when he fell off a ladder & made sure he was OK. “Well, least we know Fairies can’t fly…”
It’s always a heavy dose of irony, reading these discussions and seeing how judgmental certain people can be in their condemnation of “the judgmental”.
I don’t see any mention of O.S.C. other than your post.
One of the real-life examples I was thinking of was when a lesbian friend of mine “came out” as bi to her lesbian friends, and half of them more or less turned on her.
The gay community hasn’t been as supportive of the bisexual community as we should have been. And lesbians tend to get really touchy about sex with dudes given how much they’ve been fetishized by straight men.
Apparently they started making some progress, they were half-dressed in a flash back of it a while ago if I remember right. Can’t find the strip now, but I’m pretty sure I saw it during a binge…
I remember that panel too, but I wonder if that was ‘extra’ art that Willis drew and tossed out there. I just did a tag search of all the strips to date (using “ethan+amber” as the search term) and came up empty-handed.
added — found a single panel during a flashback episode, but I seem to recall someone — either Ethan or Amber — filling in more details to a third party; just can’t remember who the third party might have been.
I will never ‘love’ Joyce. But I truly admire the way she keeps trying. She is not trying to hurt or be rude to Ethan here, she is trying to help him because she knows he is not happy right now. She cares about him. And he knows it.
Maybe he dosen’t have to come out of the closet, and she should leave him alone. But the way it is now, he is not happy having to hide who he really is and he should not have to be unhappy to be himself, whoever he wants to be. As backward in many things as Joyce is, she knows that.
And she’s trying, she wants to help.
That in and of itself, is a good thing. Ethan is looking like he knows this.
So go already, to the meeting.
I agree that most of the time pushing someone is not a good idea and usually Joyce can be quite pushy but in this case it does appear that Ethan needs a push so well done Joyce
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No! Bad Plasma!
-smacks with rolled up newspaper-
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At least nobody’s pulling a Bobby Drop Tables in the NAME field.
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calling it now, he’s gonna find a crush there, I can feel it in my gut
and it’s going to be Danny.
Well, Danny has been questioning lately. Here’s hoping he actually decides to go.
oooooooooooooooo
yes yes to this!
I was SO hoping that “Three’s A Crowd” would go there. But my fingers are still crossed tight.
Or Jacob…
Or Danny AND Jacob! Then all three start making out! Then comes sex!
And then Joyce finds it hot and becomes more confused!
No, Mikey – not ‘confused’, ‘questioning’. Joyce finds it hot and becomes more questioning!
Well, I don’t think that’s —
“Don’t care until it’s three dudes” (from the poll)
Oh. Oh my. Touche’, Willis.
I wanna see Joyce get sugar-drunk on too much soda and then have a Slipshine kinda night with Dorothy. 😛
NO PLEASE! Danny and Amber/Amazigirl is my favorite pairing. THIS SHIP HAS A HUGE CANON AND I WILL NOT LET IT SINK!
That’d be pretty horrible.
Amber already had one boyfriend dumping her because he’s gay. That’d make 2. AND, as a sick twist of the knife, her 2 exes would end up together ? x_x
I’m pretty sure Danny likes girls (Dorothy, Billie, Amber), so I doubt finding out he’s bi would make him dump her. Unless he overreacts… or she overreacts… either of which is possible…
And then we see what Manny’s like in this universe.
Whew! You’re safe! I thought User18 had kidnapped you. All is right with the world again.
(other than, you know, all the money-grubbing, backstabbing, oppression, and killing stuff)
And all those things you guys did to User 18 when they wouldn’t tell you what had happened to Jen.
I’m scarred for life now. Well and truly so.
Well, if you weren’t guilty, maybe you should’ve made your pleas of innocence more convincing. Don’t blame us; blame yourself, or God.
Hey, you’re back. We were worried.
Do I become invisible if I don’t post first =|
*looks at size of comments section*
Oh.
Yeah, it can be pretty consuming, easy to vanish into. I’m not sure about Plasma Mongoose (quite possible tho), but I know I post pics with certain coloured borders to make them easier to find. Coloured borders are easier to see at higher speed scrolling than names…
[Ctrl] F…
Eh? *Tries {Ctrl} F, finds search box* hmmm, interesting…
Does make things easier, but it takes away part of the fun of checking out everybody’s icons. There are some funny ones on here… *points to Richard directly under this post…*
That’s part of the reason I picked my gravitar, is easy to find during a quick scroll. Well, that and the fact that Richard is awesome.
Screwball, as you are likely aware, I have been using loads of different gravatars all with the Radioactive Absinthe Green backgrounds and more recently, the same green borders.
Probably a bit late & won’t be seen, but oh well…
I guessed the constant use of the same green would be to help locate your posts, but I didn’t want to post it as if it was written in stone, that’s why i added the “I’m not sure” part. I gotta admit, seeing your icons in colour gave me the idea to do the border for mine. Sorry if it sounded rude… :$
Aww, she’s trying. So adorable
Yes. Somehow, Joyce trying at being ok with diversity in sexual preference is the most adorable thing ever.
Joyce can be very trying.
sex weirdos BELONG in the closet
specifically
http://www.shortpacked.com/index.php?id=1994
I was only going to read one…I WAS ONLY GOING TO READ ONE
I feel bad, as I’m kinda with Malaya, but I’m knowledgeable enough to understand what she means, and realize it might be more complicated to give an android lady parts than it is to hand her a strap on and tell her to go to town.
Hmm…
Homoromantic.
Aww…
Just so long as there’s a swing, some bullwhips, a poster of Ernest Borgnine, and 80 gallons of tapioca, they’ll be happy in there.
What if they only have butterscotch pudding? Tapioca sells fast by the bulk.
*plays Cameo’s “Word Up” on the Muzak*
Complete with Human-blood red codpiece over blue body suit thing?
Have you seen the video for “Back And Forth”?
I haven’t heard this song in so many years.
“Questioning” individuals….could he potentially run into Danny there or would that be too much too soon for Danny?
we all could use a good danny appearance right now
I feel like it’s been awhile.
Well, that’s a phrase I never thought would be uttered in the comments.
I think that’s where things might be headed, though. When Danny starts wrapping his head around bisexuality, it’ll help for him to get some clarification on it from a trustworthy source.
Danny seemed to get a whole lot more acceptable to the people who comment here when he discovered he is/might-be bisexual.
Wouldn’t be the first time that someone’s opinion of someone else changed once they learned their sexuality.
I’m kind of annoyed at “Danny is bi! That means he’s a good character now despite years of comments out for his blood!” but I’m probably being too pedantic and assuming that people like him now just because he’s bi, and not for the storylines it promises, which I detailed a little below.
I’d rather people not treat his sexuality as a novelty, but then I see so many comments that completely ignore that, hey, Danny already has a girlfriend. He’s not going to immediately blow Ethan just because he realized he likes dudes. And, I mean, I ship Danny/Ethan; I want them together because M/M relationships are woefully underrepresented in such a diverse comic as DoA, and because I think Ethan would make a better partner for Danny than Amber does, and how that relationship is inevitably going to crash.
Like I said, I think I’m just being too pedantic, but I’d rather people like Danny for who he is and not who he wants to bone.
Congratulations on being the first person ever to express this sentiment.
This is lies.
I’ve been asking for more Danny for ages now.
as has ethan
I actually find myself desiring a Danny appearance. I don’t know how to feel about that.
I want more Danny because he’s providing an interesting perspective on bisexuality. Usually most webcomics deal with characters already established in their identity (like Dora and Tai from QC), but DoA is the first webcomic I’ve read with a pre-established character realizing new aspects about their sexuality, and the extremely real, clumsy fumbling we go through trying to figure it out. As much as I’ve complained about people only being interested in Danny because of his sexuality, my desire to have him feature more often has increased exponentially since we learned he was bi, if only because I love his flailing exploration of his sexuality.
We recently found out that Ted from the comic El Goonish Shive is/may be gender fluid. Though he was comfortable being a chick.
There is also the discontinued Quiltbag.
I thought this too.
Maybe Billie, also, now that Becky’s forcing her to consider that being into girls might effect whatever label she’s using for herself.
I dunno, Billie seems to be fairly comfortable with her bisexuality (closet doors notwithstanding), she has other reasons for keeping her thing with Ruth a secret. Plus if it’s made widely known that she’s bi, there’s a bigger chance that people will put two and two together about her and Ruth based on their interactions…maybe…though she hasn’t been completely subtle about it anyway, let’s be fair.
Billie’s repeatedly insisted that she thinks most girls are interested in other girls at some point and that it’s no big deal, so there’s a degree of denial there about the social implications.
sex weirdos definitely in this season
Sex Weirdos, this fall on Fox!
oh god I read that in the Fox announcer guy’s voice what is wrong with me
Look, between Bob’s Burgers, Brooklyn Nine-Nine, and The Last Man on Earth, I think watching Fox is socially acceptable now.
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“Is into weird sex things” is often a selling point rather than a detriment, isn’t it?
It is if you’re on Craig’s List.
It’s only helped me! 😀
Eh, kinda. I like to hear specifics, cause everybody’s got their own line. Don’t wanna find out until its too late that she wants to stick my weenus in a wall socket or something.
That’s one way to grill a wiener.
“We do the weird stuff.”
Sex wierdos is totally in.
Can the title of the next book be Joyce and the Sex Weirdos?
Also loving Joyce for this, this is what I was hoping she’d do when he first outted himself to her.
Is that a rip-off of Josie and The Pussycats?
No but probably they cover most of those songs.
It’s got to be a quote, doesn’t it? So perhaps Is Sex Weirdos In or Out?.
Sex Weirdo may not be my word, but Kinky Bastard certainly is.
I’m using this as my descriptive from now on.
“Kinky”? You’ve been stampeding cattle through the Vatican, again, haven’t you?
shhh! 😛
Stampedes are notoriously difficult to keep quiet. Maybe you should try shushing them with a bullhorn?
I ONLY DID THAT ONCE!! I tried ground bridging away from the damn animals chasing me to ANYWHERE ELSE, & guess where I end up? And guess who decided to follow me? Least I had more room to deal with them & get them where I needed them to go. Last time I do a herding job…
That last panal is just full of d’aww. And potential. Gonna be good.
I wonder who else is at that meeting
Drew? Manny? Fisher and Lawrence?
So is it a support group or speed dating? Maybe Joyce can hook up with a nice Bi dude.
“Dude”
That’s a funny way of spelling chick.
“I’m just going to be over here with dudes, talking to my dude friends, about dudey stuff. What do you mean, you think we may just be lesbians?”
Apropos of nothing, I wonder if the Marvel Comics character Bi-Beast ever gets flirtatious messages from people who see his name and think Hank McCoy has decided to expand his horizons.
Hank did declair himself gay, which was the printed in the news. He was lieing, but he still said it and didn’t take it back.
When I read your comment, I assumed you were referring to Hank from King of the Hill.
I was SO disappointed the first time I saw a story featuring him, I tell you what.
Most of them would be from Deadpool.
XD I can just imagine it…
“Hey, wanna blow this place & get a drink? I got plenty of C4…”
I feel like I’ve actually heard of a band called “Sex Weirdos” >.>
I mean, it has to exist somewhere, right? It just has to.
If it doesn’t, I intend to make one.
Can i sing back up?
^ Euphemism?
Only the best kind: accidental!
I found The Weirdos on wikipedia…
It really is a damn awesome band name.
Can I just say that I love Joyce? Because I love Joyce.
Joyce has just been getting cuter with each panel since yesterday. It’s too much, we can’t handle it!
Joyce should be careful. Any cuter and critical mass might be achieved and create a cute singularity.
Didn’t that happen at some point in Joyce & Walky?
As funny as Joyce being completely out of touch is, I feel bad for Ethan here. He shouldn’t have to stand here and listen to this little fundie girl talk about gay-types and sex weirdos, even if she’s doing it with the best of intentions.
If his family weren’t a pack of utter dickholes who made him ashamed of his sexuality, I doubt he’d tolerate it nearly as much.
I can understand that sentiment – surely not everyone would enjoy her fumbling. It doesn’t look like Ethan minds, though. Maybe because he deeply enjoys taking care of kindhearted people who like him. And lord knows he could use the support.
Yeah, he shouldn’t have to stand with this kind person whose company he enjoys! What a jerk she is, with her lifetime of miseducation that she’s trying to overcome in an afternoon. Perhaps they will come upon a crevasse and he can cast her down into it.
(Neither character is perfect, stop picking on just the one.)
Just because I’m disappointed in her casual homophobia doesn’t mean I think she’s a terrible person. Chill out.
It’s not actually homophobia. She’s not showing fear or disgust. She’s treating him like a novelty.
I expect she would be expecting it to be like that time she was Queen of the Drunk People.
This time she’ll be queen of the queens!
Treating someone’s sexuality is homophobia. She is outright wondering if continuing to refer to gay people as sex weirdos is now a taboo.
Joyce is a good person but for god’s sake, she is totally homophobic. Not out of active malice, but it’s not like the Walkertons are aware of their racism towards their daughter either.
Treating someone’s sexuality as a novelty is homophobia.*
-phobia refers to fear, not ignorance. This insistence of lumping people under one category is one of the reason these problems persist. The lines get drawn, the sides picked, and nobody cares about the nuances of the situation, only shouting down the other side. A person honestly trying to accept people for who they are but stumbling over the languuage is fundamentally different from someone actively preaching hate or fear.
Just because Joyce isn’t actively trying to be malicious doesn’t mean I have to be okay with her ignorance. All bigotry is born from ignorance; Joyce was just fortunate enough to be surrounded by people who showed her the truth.
Yes, Joyce is fortunate to have had those experiences. And then she reacted to those experiences by trying to do better than she had been, which is just as important. Not everybody who had a gay best friend who ran away from home would have said “I won’t tell your dad and you can stay in my room until we figure something out,” and not everyone with a gay boyfriend who didn’t want to be gay would have said “We shouldn’t date anymore because it’s not fair to you, but I still want to be friends and would like to help you come to terms with your sexuality.” Joyce still has a distance to go, but she’s come pretty far already, and that’s as much due to her own choices as to the people around her.
Not calling it a phobia is not the same thing as being okay with it. That’s what I mean by boxes and lines. You don’t treat someone who needs to learn, is willing to learn, but still has a long way to go the same as someone actively spouting hate and fear. You shouldn’t label them the same way.
The “homophobia” label is one of scorn. It is inherently dismissive. It should be reserved for those who deserve to be dismissed. NOTHING WILL CHANGE if all we do is put everybody who fails to immediately align with our way of thinking in a box labeled “THE ENEMY” whether or not they are actively trying to change.
This is where I think a good approach is not to refer to people but to actions.
Joyce has had a homophobic upbringing and will likely make homophobic blunders for the foreseeable future, but describing her person as homophobic doesn’t give us the whole picture, just like not calling her actions out as homophobic because of her good intentions doesn’t give us the whole picture, since inadvertent homophobia can still affect people.
Slow claps
Very well said Smiling Cat.
I really meant this @ “Not calling it a phobia…” but either way
I dunno, rambling off on a tangent regarding the use of language to describe active vs passive stuff that contributes to a toxic environment for a minority group, I think there is value in not only citing the Klan-level hate, but also the small little attitudes that lead to people taking the most vile haters’ concerns seriously as addressing all are necessary for undoing bigotry.
In other words, there is value in calling out the sexism of say, an MRA douchebag, and also say the casual attitudes regarding women who have casual sex or the homophobia of say the types of idiots who passed the RFRA as well as the casual way that queer people are viewed as being wrong or off-putting if they are seen as “too queer”.
Which looping it back on topic, means it may be worth noting the deeply homophobic background Joyce is working through and the casual homophobia that still occasionally passes her lips while also cheering the massive amount of progress she has made in an incredibly short amount of time and the sheer effort she is putting into trying to move through said ignorance and absorbed cultural casual bigotry.
As usual, Cerberus gets it.
Yeah, that’s true. Ironically enough, she’s a form of homophobia we don’t encounter much in fiction. The casual homophobia of ignorance from a lifetime of terrible messages (messages that would lead a lot of her churchfolk to fully side with Toedad’s plan to “fix” Becky) in a person actively, desperately trying to work around it. Trying her bestest to do right and treat the people she cares about as best she can, but still struggling with all that messed up worldview and the casually hurtful things it can lead her to say despite that effort (the bit that hurt Becky’s feelings about needing to double check that the Bible had her back on Becky’s humanity).
And that’s what’s really compelling about her character in this arc, because that’s a situation that is not often explored. The person who is genuinely trying. Not trying to look respectable, not doing the least amount to be “supportive” and expecting the people in their lives to be happy with the crumbs, but really genuinely pulling out all the stops, working her damndest to do what is right against all her training.
But who nonetheless comes from a deeply homophobic place and has a lot of growth to complete to truly work through it all and be as great an ally as she so desperately wants to be.
So yeah, I can see where you are coming on that.
And looping it back around to the beginning of this thread, what was said was basically ‘no one should tolerate or be around this homophobe and her wrong-spewing until she figures everything out’. Which… I don’t think so.
Only further exposure while she’s trying so hard to do that growing is going to really help. Specifically, exposure to people who want her to do that growing and are willing to correct her when she missteps – which she obviously wants, as witness her asking Ethan whether something’s right or not, even if it’s a strip punchline.
Everyone (or nearly so, I think?) allows that growth like that doesn’t happen instantly, even if Joyce is making massive headway in a very short period of strip-time, but it also doesn’t happen in a vacuum. No doubt it’ll be irritating for a lot of people, but… well, friends do irritate each other, it’s part of being friends. (As is apologizing to your friends when you do irritate or wrong them, which Joyce has shown herself to be entirely willing to do on many occasions.)
Well, if I’m just speaking for myself, I’m often willing to go an extra mile for friends that genuinely are trying and I’ll do the softly softly education thing with them, but I fully respect others who are like “I don’t need even the well-meaning form of this in my life”.
Honestly, I find Joyce very interesting and compelling in this role as she has so far to climb out of her ignorance on everything, but is so willing to throw herself into it with all her heart. It reminds me a lot of a number of very loyal friends I’ve had over the years who came from similarly ignorant initial beginnings.
But I can definitely see the argument of how that type of person can be toxic as it can really suck to absorb a lot of casual dismissal of one’s humanity even from well-meaning sources and that’s also unfortunately a circumstance I’ve more than had my share of.
I don’t think casual racism and casual homophobia are used properly nowadays. Casual homophobia isn’t “slight prejudicial attitudes towards a sexuality” or ” it’s full 100% homophobia that is passed off casually, like your grandma muttering “fuckin queers” under her breath when she sees 2 dudes holdin hands. People use the term to mean homophobia-lite, which is totally inaccurate. Casual homophobia is actually so far removed from most of our daily experiences that we search for it to find it.
Regular, store-brand homophobia is WBC style attitudes and entrenched morals – people who have very strong opinions about homosexuality.
A major problem with the LGBT community is that we shout down people who disagree, even people with legitimate questions. Brandon Eich is a great example of someone who lost the job he loved (he wasn’t just the CEO of Mozilla, he was its co-founder) because it came to light that he had once made a small donation towards supporting an anti-gay marriage law in California about 10 years ago. We’re a toxic community with a whole bunch of highly opinionated vocal assholes, and saying that progressive attitudes somehow make up for it is naive and silly.
We all have a long way to go. Joyce’s worldview didn’t form overnight, and to be honest she changed her opinions on homosexuality quicker than most people would.
I don’t really have anything to add to this conversation overall. I would just like to say how wonderful it is to be a part of the DOA community. This is a subject that is not easy to talk about on the internet without things breaking down into hostility or flame wars (least in my experience). So to see so many intelligent opinions, especially ones are in disagreement, presented such a respectful and fair manner is the best kind of feeling. This is one place I know its safe to go if I have questions and want an honest opinion devoid of open hostility.
I’d agree if Joyce’s latest faux pas wasn’t actually improving Ethan’s mood.
You missed the Punchline.
She’s fumbling for the word “queer” , which is/was, also a synonym for “weirdo” .
This is confirmed by Ethans response.
Given Joyce’s expression in the last panel, I had assumed her “sex weirdos” comment was her mocking her own fumblings with gay terminology.
Joyce is gonna be the best ally! And by best I mean most heartfelt. But still! <3
Serving as an embarrassing red herring counts as helping, no?
[sigh] i feel like Joyce is trying way to hard… it seems like she’s forcing herself, to me… its good that shes trying to improve herself but… i dunno… seems fake.
I don’t think it’s that she’s forcing herself but rather that she’s not totally sure how she’s supposed to act in this situation.
She is forcing herself, but that’s not a bad thing, nor is it “fake”. She’s realizing she’s messed up and taking steps to fix it. And that requires a certain amount of force.
It’s not that Joyce is trying too hard. It’s that she’s trying (arguably) failing.
I think she could be doing better, but given her background, this is definite progress.
You kind of have to start by forcing yourself, though. True chillness comes from experience, and how else is someone with her background going to get that?
Remember, this is Joyce – she probably knows what moderation is, but not how it applies to her. Trying too hard does not qualify as faking it when it comes to this girl.
I smell Goofy adventures ahead.
Gawrsh.
Hyuk.
YAAAAAAHOOHOOHOOEY!
This ^ thread is perfect.
But do they get a designated closet?
Nope, Becky already blew it up remember? 😀
Well with Ruth and Billie banging on the door, it’d only be a matter of time till someone comes out!
Or they come crashing in.
Becky blew it to Hell, & Billie & Ruth are banging on it’s remains…
Gay types…. i could make the obvious pokemon joke here, but it just isn’t worth it.
It’s super effective against Christians.
I love the internet.
I’d say against Homophobe types personally, tho the 2 are combined quite often…
I think it’s more about Joyce not knowing the PC term for things more than her upbringing at this point. She’s even actively trying to get feedback from Ethan. And flawed terminology or not, she’s being a very great friend to Ethan right now. You can see it in his face.
Man, for someone so new to this whole “queer” thing Joyce caught on to the idea of using “questioning” to tip-toe out of the closet really quickly.
That was probably what the flyer said.
Man, if the flier said “meet and greet for folks considering coming out of the closet” it would kinda kill the entire point, wouldn’t it? Just showing up is basically outing yourself in a way showing up to, as Joyce described it, a “meet and greet for ‘questioning’ individuals” wouldn’t be.
Is questioning really the same thing as closeted though? “Questioning” seems to imply folks who are still feeling out what they want and what they like.
Yeah, I’d assumed that Ethan is well past the point of questioning. He’s just closeted in order to shield himself against his homophobic parents (and because he wishes the whole mess would just go away).
I’m not entirely sure if it’s the same but while coming to discover my Bisexuality I did literally Question myself on it a lot.
Like “Do I also like dudes?” “I’m pretty sure I’m straight.” “That dude’s kinda hot.” “Maybe I am.”
Not sure if Questioning is that literal but that’s my experience anyway.
Amber’s gonna have many feels about this. Many.
“Gay-type” people…
I wonder, is Ethan a dual-type Pokemon, and if so what’s his secondary typing?
Mike is clearly Dark / Fighting or Dark / Psychic, for example.
See? I knew someone else was gonna do it. Friggin called it.
*insert dual-type Gay/Fairy Pokémon comment here*
Can i insert it here instead?
Just as long as you use lube first. 😀
That’s what my Goomy is for! But don’t tell Ethan, Dragon-types are scared of fairy-types
I used to hang out with a self-described furvert. Said furvert was coming up with a series of product names for a hypothetical sex shop in the Pokémon universe.
We (yes, I helped) named the lube “Ditto Grease.”
You’d think that if Ethan had a second type, his relationship with Amber would have worked out fine.
Well now what would Joyce be? Normal-Fairy?
Amber is Normal-Fighting. Ruth is just pure Fighting.
Dina’s gotta be Ground/Rock-Dragon.
Oh, and Billie’s Poison, obviously. Huh, maybe Ruth has Poison as a second type, actually.
Danny is Bug-Flying.
Dorothy is Psychic
Jason is Normal
Sal is probably Fighting/Dark
Becky feels like Fire/Fairy would be appropriate
Walky is Smug type.
So would that make him dark like his sister or grass?
Ruth and Billie’s secondary typing has got to be
vodkawater.Ruth is Ice type. You all know why.
Awww, the friendship smiles are adorable. Even with awkward-Joyce.
Further gonna circulate the rumor that Joyce loves the ladies.
Seriously though, I am touched by Joyce’s support of her friends. She’s going somewhere that would normally make her really uncomfortable, where she pretty much knows she’s doing it all wrong, all for the sake of her beloved gay buddies. I am so charmed right now.
Will they cancel the previous rumours about Joyce engaging in foursomes? http://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-3/03-answers-in-hennessy/other-guys/
Like anyone would believe that.
Aww, Joyce. <3 I've been finding her recent arc so heartwarming to read! I really would prefer to believe that good people taught bad lessons can overcome those teachings with life experience. I'm so happy to see real and fictional examples of that!
I can totally see them becoming close friends for this.
Will Leslie be heading this meet and greet? That would be the swellest.
Is Danny going to be there? I know there has been Danny and Ethan together again in the preview panels for the strips coming up.
And if he saw the poster, and it specifically says ‘Questioning’ there’s a good chance he’d decide to go.
This could be interesting…
Joyce is beyond adorable right now.
I’m loving how Joyce is 100% on board with the Gay-Train
Now I have the song in my head by Conway Twitty.
“I can tell you’ve never been this far before.”
I continue to be amazed at how suddenly the trainwreck we all thought Joyce/Ethan was inevitably headed for has metamorphosed into this adorable bromance. (Sibmance?)
…Friendship?
is magic.
Those being critical of Joyce, keep in mind that this is a LOT for her to learn. Her parents had her cloistered the fuck up and sheltered. Odds are, she’s looking up as much as she is comfortable looking up and trying to be there for Becky and Ethan, two people who are among those she cares the most about, and now, two people she wants to look out for.
Secondly, Joyce isn’t trying too hard. This is Joyce being Joyce. When have we ever seen her do ANYTHING half way? Monkey Master, anyone? She throws her all into everything that she gets passionate about, and right now, she’s passionate about doing the right thing and being there for someone who she recognizes she was enabling to do great harm to himself.
Heh, she reminds me a lot of a friend of mine who also grew up with the fundiest of parents and who I spent a lot of high school and college helping him move through a lot of that baggage and ignorance largely owing to him being a good friend of me as I discovered all the things I ended up being. Just as eager to do right and move away from all the brainwashing but just as prone to making “oh I can’t believe you said that” statements on occasion.
Was your friend by any chance Dave Willis?
Heh, I wish.
Daw, lookit that eye twitch in the fourth panel. Joyce is going to be supportive come hell or high water!
Ugh, had a thought, what if Ryan shows up?
Then hopefully they serve refreshments in proper glasses.
Perhaps the results will be similar to THIS particular event…
…why would he? Does he even go to this school? It was never confirmed how he knew the host.
I’m pretty sure “rapist” isn’t a sexuality.
Yeah, that…wasn’t at all what I was implying. Though if he is a student or a local here and looking for new marks, a gathering of potentially confused and/or vulnerable (fellow?) students would be a good potential hunting ground for a manipulative guy like him, particularly if he’s bi himself.
But really where I think this storyline is going is “oh hi Danny, what brings you here?”
Eee, I’ve been curious for forever to see who will be at various queer resources on the campus. Probably wouldn’t be at a queer center, but I’ve got a little hope for a Carla appearance hiding out in the corner at Becky, Danny, Billie, or so on’s first appearance at the Queer Center. And Bob knows Danny, Ethan, Billie, or Ruth could use a “questioning” group… which is probably why none of them will be seen at one for awhile, owing to the first rule of drama.
Also, it’s adorable to watch Joyce still stumble face first into her uneasy attempt to be Super Ally even though she’s still so terrible at it.
I’m not sure she’s trying to be Super Ally as much as she’s trying to be Super Friend specifically to Ethan and Becky. (For contrast, Roz is the one trying to be Super Ally in general. How much she actually succeeds has not been shown onscreen. Which is why I’d love to see a more civil meeting of Roz and Joyce. They have a lot to teach each other.)
I think that would be amazing. To have Roz and Joyce meet in an environment where Joyce wasn’t just another Mary to Roz and Roz wasn’t just that premarital hanky panky lady who threw the one party to Joyce and they could genuinely talk, because Roz has the head of a great ally and Joyce has the heart and together in an environment where they weren’t rubbing each other buttons, they could really drive each other to be even better.
Oh Bob, I just realized that the most likely person to be putting together a questioning group probably will end up being Roz given her penchant for activism… This will be interesting to say the least.
I really hope that is where this is going.
Super Friend?
Walky: “Wonder Twin powers, acti–”
Sal: “Nope.”
+1
*Walky looks at Billie*
“Not even in your dreams, dork”
Billie and Ruth need help for a lot of things, but sexuality isn’t one of them.
Billie’s out. ‘Bi’ or ‘not really bothered with labels, but totally open about their (non-ethically-questionable) relationships’ aren’t the same as ‘questioning’ (certainly not in the ‘baby steps out of the closet’ sense).
Danny could use it, yes, due to real questioning, and Ethan for the ‘baby steps’… Ruth…I don’t think we’ve been shown just how out she is in general…we know she’s hiding her relationship with Billie, but everything we’ve seen has shown it to be about the fact that as RA, she’s not supposed to be banging one of her charges. Howard didn’t know, but she made no effort to hide it from him, so…probably not exactly closeted, but not wholly out, either.
Ethan’s gonna find a boyfriend, Ethan’s gonna find a booooyfriend!
Read that in an annoying sing song voice.
Ahhhh yay! I love that Joyce is being so supportive about this. It shows she actually cares about him. 🙂
Yup. Personally I think that Ethans resolve to stay in the closet will only last as long as it take him to find a cute boy who may be into boys who shows an interest in him.
Ethan’s closet is already a bit transparent, or at least one-way. He doesn’t want the world knowing, but he seems OK with close friends when they talk about it. Also, some of his speech sounds like HE accepts his sexuality, at least in private and around close friends. He sometimes refers to elements of LGBT culture as ‘our’. his closet door is more open than others I’ve heard about, at least.
“In or Out?”
The hot new music video by Sex Weirdos!
Wow, this is a great, palpable step on Joyce’s behalf to show Ethan that not only is she no longer wanting to “fix” him, but she wants him to accept himself. Go, Joyce!
Hey, Sex Weirdos is my Thrill Kill Kult cover band!
joyce is about to learn some shit!!!!
(also i wonder who will be there???)
“Welcome, everyone. Since studies have shown that working on scatological studies can be a therapeutic activity, today we are going to learn some shit!“
Walky would totally major in scatology if he could.
I’ve got to say, Ethan has to be one of my favorite people in this comic. He seems like such a bro about so much. The day he snaps is gonna be a real scary one.
Wow, Joyce – you HAVE been doing your research – and not only on bible translation. You are not only giving Ethan an option forward if he wants to leave the closet – you take steps to become a good ally yourself.
Dammit Willis! Do you have any conception just how many awesome Transformers have been released this year? Of course you do. So much moneys! Oh well, looks like DOA4 is taking another present from the wife.
Chapeau, Joyce.
I totes understand this comment, and unanimously concur.
I actually feel bad for anybody reading this strip and not getting a warm fuzzy feeling but thinking mean things of Joyce.
I love her so much. She’s trying so hard and she’s so kind, and I love, love, LOVE that her and Ethan are gonna stay friends. Their relationship is sweet and supportive in a way it can only be when you’ve been really fucked up together. If that makes sense.
If people are determined to take things the wrong way, let them. Can’t make someone happy if they’re determined to be angry and miserable.
“We’re the Sex Weirdos, and we’re to make you think about death and get sad and stuff!”
“One, two, three, four!!”
I love everything about this comment.
I keep picturing the Way Outs from the Flintstones.
Joyce too good for this world, too pure TwT
Panel 4 is a Billie smile, but on Joyce. Weird.
Cant pledge, damn creditcards!
At the meeting, Daisy will be hiding quietly in the back of the room, nervously playing with two pairs of scissors. Calling it now.
WE ARE SEX WEIRDOS! One-two-three-four!
*nods* Yup. That works.
that sounds like a scott pilgrim reference my dear sir
WE ARE SEX WEIRDOES AND WE’RE GOING TO PLAY A SONG FOR SCOTT TO KICK YOUR ASS TO!
WOOOOO, SEX WEIRDOS, I LOVE YOU!!!!
who would be in sex wierdos?
I feel like Joe would be eager to join, only to decline after realizing they were talking about a band.
Remember, it’s pronounced ‘wire-doss’, not ‘weer-dose’
its like joyce is talking about pokemon when she says gay-type people.
Hey – Gay-Type is my Pokemon Type! 🙂
Not fairy type?
Scrolls up.. hmmm not even a little surprised that that has been said.
Well Daniel the Human’s Uncle proved Fairies can’t fly – that was the first comment they said to him when he fell off a ladder & made sure he was OK. “Well, least we know Fairies can’t fly…”
dammit i thought i was gonna be the first to make that joke
No matter how fast you are, somebody always beats you to the joke.
It’s always a heavy dose of irony, reading these discussions and seeing how judgmental certain people can be in their condemnation of “the judgmental”.
And the Dutch?
“There’s only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other people’s cultures and the Dutch.”
I know right. Orson Scott Card totally gets a bad rap. So what if he’s actively stated genuinely horrifying things in regards to LGBT people!
wait are we equating joyce’s actions here in this strip to orson scott card now
Okay, yeah, that was unfair of me.
Indeed. I have seen no evidence that Joyce would even know where to begin putting together a science fiction series.
I don’t see any mention of O.S.C. other than your post.
One of the real-life examples I was thinking of was when a lesbian friend of mine “came out” as bi to her lesbian friends, and half of them more or less turned on her.
No, you’re not reading that wrong.
The gay community hasn’t been as supportive of the bisexual community as we should have been. And lesbians tend to get really touchy about sex with dudes given how much they’ve been fetishized by straight men.
so would gay-type pokemon be weak to or strong against straight-type pokemon?
Neautral?
I assume it would be like Ghost and Normal. Neither has any effect against the other.
But what if you’re a homophobe type?
For the next slipshine, I want Ethan/Amber in the hotel room on prom night.
Ouch – aren’t those things supposed to be titillating?
A ‘Slipshine’ in no acts. Nothing happened, remember?
Apparently they started making some progress, they were half-dressed in a flash back of it a while ago if I remember right. Can’t find the strip now, but I’m pretty sure I saw it during a binge…
I remember that panel too, but I wonder if that was ‘extra’ art that Willis drew and tossed out there. I just did a tag search of all the strips to date (using “ethan+amber” as the search term) and came up empty-handed.
added — found a single panel during a flashback episode, but I seem to recall someone — either Ethan or Amber — filling in more details to a third party; just can’t remember who the third party might have been.
Mike has made a few asshole comments about their prom night.
Annnd the swing back to loving Joyce is complete…
So, if Joyce does go to this meeting with Ethan, would she be providing immoral support?
I will never ‘love’ Joyce. But I truly admire the way she keeps trying. She is not trying to hurt or be rude to Ethan here, she is trying to help him because she knows he is not happy right now. She cares about him. And he knows it.
Maybe he dosen’t have to come out of the closet, and she should leave him alone. But the way it is now, he is not happy having to hide who he really is and he should not have to be unhappy to be himself, whoever he wants to be. As backward in many things as Joyce is, she knows that.
And she’s trying, she wants to help.
That in and of itself, is a good thing. Ethan is looking like he knows this.
So go already, to the meeting.
I agree that most of the time pushing someone is not a good idea and usually Joyce can be quite pushy but in this case it does appear that Ethan needs a push so well done Joyce
You are all weirdos.
Thanks.
They have a closet.
Also good band names:
Zombie Armpits
Strawberry Lumps
….
My creativity has been exhausted.