just so you know, specific commenters, that if in real life someone suddenly bursts out crying because of any kind of sexual trauma, and your immediate reaction is to say, yeah, i don’t believe her, i think she just wants attention — you are actually the worst person on the planet
(doing it online regarding a fictional character, but in the midst of real life people who may have suffered similar, is only a little less worse)
so don’t do that
as a heads up
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Well, at least you didn’t create The Joker, or let Gwen Stacy die, or–Wait, where was I going with this?
Joyce is going to become Harley Quinn. She has the smile for it.
And happy attitude. Now we just need to get her some hyenas.
Babies!
AND the unhealthy obsession with guys who are all wrong for her. Wow, Joyce really DOES make the perfect Harley…
Joyce can’t pull off one of the at least 5 hottest girls in DC
And at the very very least, she didn’t get her worst enemy impregnate Gwen Stacey either.
…yet
There’s still a chance to get her lesbian pregnant, http://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-3/04-just-hangin-out-with-my-family/appearances/
…did you know I’d actually forgotten Howard exists until you linked that?
Now I gotta put him in some kinda slash pairing, ’cause “Galasso” is starting to get overdone as a punchline.
We don’t know where Faz came from.
OMG Gwen Stacy the feels!
Poll: Gwen Stacy or MJ?
Gwen Stacey
Dang it, I knew it had an “e”! Ugh I should have thought about that before posting…
MJ.
Gwen Stacy
MJ.
No offense to Gwen, but she’s dead.
Im with Foxhack
GwenJ
MJ.
I don’t care for blondes.
Answering my own poll…
I honestly haven’t read the Spider-Man comics since I started middle school, seven years ago. I seem to recall Mary Jane being pretty cool, but I can’t remember how much so. I definitely liked Gwen Stacey…
I’ll go for MJ, since Mary Jane is legal now.
Actually I suppose since Gwen was going to college she’s probably legal…
What states Mary Jane is legal? The fact that she got married? I think you can get married as a minor, although I didn’t know that when I was reading them. I only read the copies at my school, so I wasn’t really going in order. And they only had a few.
But since Spider-Man comics were published in the eighties, I suppose she must be 21 now. And necrophilia isn’t legal. So MJ works.
*math since she was 14 before the 80s ended, she’s 35 at the youngest.
Dude Peter and Mary Jane have been exchanging sweet nothings and pointed barbs since the mid ’60s when I was a kid and I’m a grandpa now. If they were living in anything except comic book time they would all be collecting Social Security by now, except Aunt May who would be getting annual birthday cards from Al Roker for being the oldest person on Earth.
Peter and MJ are in there mid 30’s now, in comic book years. During the 1980’s, they were in their late 20’s. (They had each established successful careers before they got married. It was after the wedding when everything went in the dumper. Go figure.) Gwen died in the early 1970’s, and at that time they were in their early 20’s.
It’s worth noting that the characters were an analog of the Archie gang. Peter was Archie, Gwen was Betty, Betty was Veronica (you see what they did, there?), and Mary Jane was Cheryl.
Aha! So it is ~about 35 then, even in comic time! Lucky guess on my part!
I wish I was more up on IRL comics but I tend to put my focus into webcomics. ‘Tis the age of the internet.
You know, I think I remember reading flashbacks of the spider bite and being confused about the girl with him not being MJ. If I’d only kept that memory I might have figured out the girl with him wasn’t called “Gwen” because they decided Mary Jane was too risque.
I assumed that that was a reference to marijuana (“Mary Jane”) legalization.
I also assumed, until I read the hovertext.
In Marvel, 3 years equals one year. I think Peter Parker was 15 in 1961. That was 53 years ago. 53/3+15=31.6667.
Peter is in his early 30s, and MJ probably is, too.
That is assuming Marvel’s consistent, of course. Which of course they aren’t X-Men were going in real time for a while, and I imagine after One More Day, the writers may have started considering them a bit younger.
It’s a pun about doing marijuana; the alt-text explaining this is also a pun about sex. You can interpret it either way because it’s a double pun, punception if you will.
Bingo!
Black Cat/Felicia Hardy. 😛
MJ in the 616 comics. Kitty Pryde for Peter in the Ultimate universe.
But I think Gwen in the Amazing Spider-Man movie is his best love interest in any universe. (Yes, I know what the sequel did…doesn’t change my opinion.)
um if you’re rooting for anyone in the Ultimate universe, you are in for some bad news
I know Pete’s dead over there, but that doesn’t change my opinion any more than Gwen being dead in the Amazingverse.
You were busy killing off one-dimensional female supporting characters. Keep going.
While we’re at it there’s a bunch of one-dimensional dudes that probably need culling too.
Or lose Protoform X or let the Triple Killer get away or… I have a feeling we’re even further off topic now than we were before.
Guess she wasn’t prepared for- huh.
Nevermind. Amazi-Girl really is prepared for anything.
But I wasn’t. *cries*
Yeah, it seems like Joyce we all wanted to just forget that incident.
Am I the only one who had that in the back of my mind this whole time? I was like, “are we ever going to hear about what happened with that guy? I mean he used date rape drugs on a girl and was caught.” I’d have done more to him than what was done.
There can’t be that many pastor’s sons of that description and name. They decided not to report it and probably wouldn’t do well if they brought it to the college, but at least Amazi-girl can scare him straight.
The pastor’s son thing could’ve been a cover story, though
nooo all the cries T_T
Now I just want Joyce to wipe her eyes with a smoke pellet by mistake.
No, it’ll just a splode everywhere and hide the pain [for like a minute]
Or an amazi-condom.
“So, are these wet-wipes, is that’s why the little packages?”
Nope, they’re special easy to blow bubble gum, ribbed for your chewing pleasure. 😀
Smashboards has a trollface smiley. That would be useful here, I think.
Way to stir up bad memories, dumbass!
“Please, And this is important. Please do not mix them up. Nothing makes crying work like some smoke pellets in the eyes”
Don’t keep toothpaste, Preparation H, and Ben-Gay in the same drawer.
And never confuse Nair with your regular hair shampoo….
It says “HAIR”… *lathers*
Oh wait that’s a Cyrillic H! It’s Russian Nair!
Oh wait after “Hair” it says “Removal”. Whoops…
Or you could, ya know, just read the label before applying a paste to one of your orifices or organs. No matter how lazy you are, I think that is something worth double checking.
That would require being awake at a time when I do not want to be awake. Brain does not fully function until after the second cup of coffee at work.
and queue the cries of “damn you willis!” across the globe
Why?
Partly because Bruce Willis agreed to do another Sin City movie, partly because of the above comic strip.
Apparently he’s also on board for Die Hard 6. Damn him indeed.
I thought having a fourth Die Hard was stupid and excessive, but now I’m really curious. What kind of mess could he possibly get himself into now??
Are they even bothering with sequel titles for the Die Hards anymore? You know, like “Die Hard Even Harder Than Ever Before!” or “Die Hardest of All!”
To be fair, “Live Free or Die Hard” is pretty badass. As a title, I mean.
Die Hard Disk, Die!
Live Free or Die Hard was an excellent film. Exactly as advertised, good story, great pacing, crazy action. It’s over the top and some technical details were out there, but that’s par for the course in action films anyway.
A Good Day to Die Hard was mediocre in comparison. The story wasn’t strong at all, and a lot of the scenes were too dark to see anything. It was still ok, just not great, and certainly didn’t stand up to its predecessors.
Here’s hoping Die Hard 6 turns it back around.
Yeah, but the new Sin City has Powers Boothe’s Chin in it, so it can’t be BAD… (Powers is the dude in my gravatar by the way)
Well, it’s not good…
(actually, it’s kinda both in equal measure)
I was about to ask you when he did the first Sim City movie, and then I realized I misread a letter. Good to know there’s not gonna be a gritty Vin Diesel Sim City movie.
This got me right in the feels. As someone who knows EXACTLY how this feels… thank you for treating it correctly and with respect.
AAAAAAAND that was supposed to be a seperate comment at the bottom of the page.
Because, The Feels.
You want people crying “Damn you Willis!” to form a nice neat line because…? Or are you trying to get them to cry “Damn you Willis!” all on cue?
I am the homonym King!
Again with the queueing. Unless I’m very much mistaken or you’re emulating Randall Munroe, the word you want is ‘cue.’
cue=signal
queue=line
A layer of the Joyce/Ethan relationship I hadn’t considered.
Gosh, this is heavy stuff.
“How do women still go out with guys, when you consider that there is no greater threat to women than men? We’re the number one threat to women! Globally and historically, we’re the number one cause of injury and mayhem to women. . . You know what our number one threat is? Heart disease.”
The quickest way to a man’s heart is through his arrhythmia.
Not sure who you’re quoting, but I have to disagree with that person.
The number one threat to men, historically, is also men.
It’s Louis CK. And the biggest killer of both men and women is heart disease. Violence isn’t even in the top five.
No, the biggest killer of men, women, and children of all ages is the motor vehicle. Disease of all kinds doesn’t catch up until age 35 and the motor vehicle is never out of the top ten.
Ahhh, but who DRIVES the vehicles??
the youngest age to drive and the the very oldest age to drive.
gender doesn’t really come into play.
I think she means the other person in the accident? Or maybe that the leading killer of men and women is ourselves.
Cars and men are both dangerous, but heart disease kills way more people. According to the World Health Organization, 17.5 million people died of cardiovascular disease worldwide in 2012, compared with 1.3 million from road accidents and 0.6 million from violence (details). Numbers for the United States are similar.
This graph puts it in perspective. In the US, motor vehicles and firearms are the leading causes of death in people under 35 — but only 4.3% of Americans die that young! Nearly everyone lives past 35, and when they do die it’s most often from heart disease or cancer.
Hence “historically,” which I specified.
My point was that the (apparently) Louis CK quote was misleading since it looked at things that killed women historically but men modern day.
I didn’t bother to fact-check it, but maybe I shoulda pointed out the context of “women needing men to protect them from men” as a weird sociological paradox–abusive men will target women until those women are in the presence of other men.
The trick is finding ones that won’t turn around and kill you for your trouble, and a lot of the reason victims [of any gender] stay is that it’s most dangerous for the victims when they decide to escape. [Less so, not wanting to admit making a bad choice, but hey, better to be alive and wrong, I think.]
That said, it feels weird thinking that [DoA] Walky would be sufficient protection against Ryan. Not to say he couldn’t kick ass Scott Pilgrim-style, but we haven’t really been given any indication of his strengths in that respect in THIS universe.
It might feel weird, but it also seems pretty realistic to me. Strength isn’t the only thing at play; the presence of a man can make other men change their behavior in major ways. Many Walkys in my own life have helped provide that sense of safety, however temporary or messed up it may be.
I understand this is a serious comment, but the idea of Joe needing a multitude of Walkys around to keep away other men is funny to me.
Ah.
Well, weird quote aside, I agree with your assessment.
I will say one thing though – when I used to have to walk alone at night somewhere not entirely safe, I was often very nervous. I often found it comforting to walk with someone – anyone – even if the person couldn’t offer any additional protection. Just having someone with you allows you to put some of those fears aside. I think that’s why Walky works – it doesn’t matter that he wouldn’t be able to take Ryan, he is simply a comfort because it’s easier to not worry when someone is keeping your company.
That’s why I think it’s weird. I went out with dudes I thought were “safe”–most of them were, but one was… deceptive. It changed how I felt about safety, a LOT, and forced me to re-examine what I thought about people.
I feel a little less safe now that I’m not living with several burly [and ARMED] dudes, but I’ve also lowered my profile quite a bit, so maybe I won’t ever have to pull a Shortpacked!-Roz one day.
It’s not about Walky being strong. It’s about Walky being more or less “safe,” even if Joyce hates him enough to break through her usual taboo on swearing.
Walky himself is not protecting her. His presence is, because what matters is that she feels she must’nt go out alone.
Does ‘turd’ count as cussing? It’s not one of The Seven, kinda ranks with ‘poop’ and ‘booger’.
My ex-brother-in-law is currently with a woman who thinks his explosive rage issues/verbal abuse is an upgrade from her ex, who was apparently psychotic. Scary.
Yeah, nothing quite like, “at least he’s not as bad as…” :/
Also currently (rather than historically) the number 1 threat to females in at least the United States in terms of death toll is… actually also heart disease.
Hyperbole and fearmongering solve all societal ills!
death isn’t the only form of violence
Umm…yeah. I’m a survivor of sexual assault as well as several other attacks. Last I checked (*pokes self*) I was still very much alive.
Not all forms of man-on-woman violence are lethal — although on an average day, 13 American women die at the hands of their male partners, for all that. If you want to really understand how real the problem is, get the average number of women in a protective shelter over a month. (For the safety of the women in the shelter, they won’t give you that data, but you can probably get it elsewhere.)
There’s also Donald Glover’s :
“Every guy has a “crazy girlfriend” story. Why don’t women have “crazy men” stories? Because if you have a crazy boyfriend, you gon’ die.”
In other news, everything is horrible forever.
I’m getting all too goddamn much use of that statement this month, and nothing especially bad’s happened TO ME. But lordy almighty, has it sucked for a bunch of others.
I’ve heard that one before too. Clearly Donald Glover doesn’t know many women – I know plenty with crazy boyfriend stories that don’t involve violence. I’m pretty sure “the crazy ex” is universal.
while a lot of times the “crazy ex” is used by guys to put the blame for the relationship solely on the girl… My Latin teacher had an ex who literally wrote her a letter begging her to take him back, asking her to take pity on him and treat him like her deaf dog (she has a deaf dog), and even invoking the spirit of his dead grandmother to get her back. I think he may have also asked for a lock of her hair. Yeah.
Men have “crazy ex” stories about the psycho that made life hell for them during the relationship. Most of the women’s “crazy ex” stories that I hear are about guys who needed a restraining order. My friend who spent the night at the battered women’s shelter doesn’t talk about her crazy ex.
Nice quote… Where is it from?
Took the words right out of my mouth. Jeez, Joyce! I don’t want to have to worry about you 24/7… But how can I not??
Another point: The fact that he is gay makes him “safe”. He won’t rape her, because he’s into guys. What this says about Walky, I will leave for another time. (Joyce might like some caramel.)
Remember, Joyce has had her own ” Dark Past Before The Comic” flashback, that implied that she had been raped.
What comic has a flashback of her? Not remembering this, just that dream sequence.
I will have to look it up when I get home. It happened while she was in the shower.
Ok, that sparked a memory and I think you mean this one
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-4/03-up-all-night-to-get-vengeance/dark-room/
I interpreted that as her being ashamed for having naughty thoughts because it goes against how she was raised.
And, I still go with the interpretation I had at the time. See my comment on that page. She loves her family, yet is in dire fear them taking her home, and never letting her leave again. She didn’t leave home for new experiences, she did it to get away from the old ones.
Lets try that again. For reference.
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/06-yesterday-was-thursday/hospital/
For what it’s worth, the next comic has her explaining that she couldn’t bike out of her neighbourhood until she was sixteen, and she does so without panicking. In that context, it seems like over-protective sex-negative parenting is more likely than sexual abuse within the family.
Well Walky is currently in a relationship with Dorothy, who Joyce looks up to. Maybe she figures that if Dorothy trusts Walky, he counts as ‘safe’ even though he’s straight.
I empathize with joyce so much it hurts.
Smoke pellets? Why didn’t you use that when you were evading Dorothy?
They’ll actually just those multicolored smoke bombs you can get anywhere. Pretty, but not very useful.
Amber intends to use them for her entrances, just as soon as she gets her “I am the terror that flaps in the night” speech down.
I would’ve gone the Rom Stol route for awesome entrance…or the V3 entrance route.
But in future crimefighting years she will no longer need the pellets as her future Amazi-Cycle will easily generate enough smoke for a dramatic entrance.
IT LINKED TO THE WRONG FRIGGIN’ ONE.
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-4/01-the-only-dope-for-me-is-you/invest/
See, now why, with the exact same link text, does it send to the wrong one in the HTML tag but the right one out of it???
Only me…
It puts the right URL in the attribute, or it gets the wrong link again!
They are not the same – the first one links to “…/in”, the second links to “…/invest/”. Inerrant is alphabetically before invest, so …
Because, if they were blinded by smoke, they wouldn’t have been able to see her do awesome parkour.
It was raining. Puddles don’t make good pellet throwing. Or, so I’ve heard. Not from experience, of course. That would be silly. Why would I have first hand knowledge of that sort of thing? Oh, look! Is that swamp gas reflecting off a weather balloon over there?
At least she doesn’t have 90’s style pouches, though I would imagine that’s exactly what those pouches are for.
Bullets, duh.
Deadpool had a teleporter. Cable just made them out of the techno-organic matter infesting his body. No one else with those pouches mattered.
Sure, Deadpool has them. How about other 90’s characters?
Deadpool has also been known to carry around a Deadpool action figure in them. This is 100% canon because of course it is, it’s Deadpool.
And his liver ^_^
He has also been shown to have extra gloves and masks in his pouches, as while he grows back, his clothing doesn’t
Oh, wow. So Ethan isn’t just someone to fantasize about, but it also someone who will protect Joyce and keep her safe.
Hey, Willis, why don’t any of your characters get therapeutic help?
College!
Yeah…that doesn’t help. It just creates new breed of insanity.
The sad thing is, most colleges have full time counseling centers (to say nothing of those colleges with psychology grad students who need practical [supervised] experience) that are probably pretty underutilized. I imagine most college students don’t even realize that free counseling is available, or how incredibly helpful it can be.
“Helpful”?
I attempted to make use of the one on my campus. It was grad students who changed every semester. It really sets you back in your progress when you gotta rehash everything and basically start over on occasion… Not to mention that some of said grad students were helpful but others let’s just say should have picked another career path.
Besides, as soon as it became evident that I needed therapy more than twice a month (it took only 2 years of unhelpful grad-student therapy during which only one of them was ever actually good at the craft), they sent me off-campus anyway, lest their office get overbooked.
And yes, I realize that a. They’re grad students, they’re not necessarily gonna be stellar, and b. They’re grad students, they need the experience. But these guys weren’t being supervised, AND only the final one I got somehow remembered her training that said I should have been sent to the main mental health office a long time ago due to my spiraling anxiety and depression that was clearly beyond their training and experience. Yup, the last one was helpful by wisely realizing she couldn’t help me. How did that fly other the head of the others?
Because college age = I can solve all the world’s problems!! I know EVERYTHING!!! Also, can’t pass up a challenge… Humans are pretty bad so far as that goes, thinking we know it all when we’re teenagers and 20s. I’m glad someone finally figured out you weren’t in their experience range, I’m just sorry it took so long, for your sake.
At my old campus it wasn’t free and I don’t think insurance covered it either. And I’ve heard a lot of the counselors are not that great. /:
Ha! That’s adorable. At my college, a one-month waiting period before you could see a therapist was standard, unless you had suicidal thoughts. After that, you’d be lucky if you could see your therapist twice a month; the demand for private off-campus therapists was incredible because of this. Please note my college has a 5 billion dollar endowment.
(1) College is a very busy time. (2) Teenagers think they are invincible. (3) There really is still a social stigma to it.
(4) If they all went to a competent psychiatrist, what kind of story would we be left with?
(5) Any old port in a storm, and evidently Joyce is still stuck in a hurricane…
(6) Psychiatrists are expensive.
(7) What part of FREE counselling were you having trouble with?
You had to pay for counseling at the college I went to *shrug*
(8) I don’t think that’s how this list works.
(9) Who wants to read a comic where everything goes smoothly and nothing bad ever happens, that’s boring
(10) When you get free counseling, you (usually) get what you paid for.
(11) The cast used to be much larger, but 95% of it got effective counseling.
(10.5) When you get free counseling, you get grad students and psych-major volunteers, who will be the first to admit they aren’t qualified to handle things like lingering sexual trauma. If you’re nervous about a test, on the other hand, they’ve got you sorted.
The kind where a lot of different people with different views interact?
Porn
A variant on (2) : “It’s not THAT big an issue – I don’t want to bother anyone with it.”
I still haven’t broken myself of that one at all.
“If I was a good person, a [i]strong[/i] person, I’d be able to handle this all by myself. That’s what everyone tells me.”
There’s also a strong distrust of psychology and counseling in many conservative Christian groups (at least, unless it comes from an approved preacher-type). Part of this is because, well, a lot of secular counselors will point out that some of the patient’s issues come from their religious indoctrination and the cognitive dissonance that arises from encountering the real world. Even if she’s never been told this directly, I have no doubt Joyce has picked up on the vibe (she’s probably been fed a lot of horror-stories about Freud’s views, actually).
And let’s face it–there’s no way Joyce is going to talk to a preacher-type about this, at all.
Disclaimer: No, not all religious education counts as ‘indoctrination’. But as you get into the more deeply conservative flavors, the more strongly it tends to go that way.
Seconding all this.
To sum us all up here:
Many, but not all, campuses’ counseling is free. If it is free, social stigma/a busy schedule/independence, whatever the source may kick in. And if you somehow manage to overcome those, there’s no guarantee of it being helpful.
Yeahhh.
But really, Joyce was using men to protect her even before the incident. She had Mike chaperone her date with Joe.
That was a specific situation where she WANTED someone else to enforce ground rules in her place. She had no problem coming back to the dorms without Mike, and following Joe.
That is completely different from experiencing fear whenever one exits its dorm and feeling like NEEDING protection from a concrete threat.
Ryan prolly didn’t HELP matters, but I can definitely feel the “I’m more vulnerable when I’m not around people I know/trust” thing. Going away to college is scary enough as it is.
See the name of the comic.
Joyce’s family probably views psychology as evil, because you are suppose to go to your minister for counseling. But, if your minister is the rapey kind…
And some (unlicensed) counselors can just report everything back to the parents, too.
Ruth was supposed to put up the posters for the campus health center’s counseling and psychological services.
They’re still sitting in her closet, under the booze.
I wonder if Amazi-Girl might be about to get on the ol’ Facebook to try to find Ryan (if that is actually his name) and dish out some vigilante justice. Sarah might even be willing to help in the hunt.
No “might” about it, she’d want to fuck him up as much as anyone for what he did, and tried to do, to her “little sister”.
That would be great if it happened, but I don’t think any of the characters ever learned Ryan’s name.
No, apparently not. However, they *do* know the name and address of someone who knows his name: Ron. Who also promised to call the cops.
Ron knew his face (hence the promise to call the cops if he showed at another party), but I don’t think he knows Ryan’s name (or he’d have said it).
I could see Amazi-Girl asking Sarah to go through social media photos of Ron’s past parties to see if they can find Ryan’s face (and eventually name, address, etc.), though. Roz would probably be willing to help with something like that, too.
Joyce…
I still don’t agree with what her and Ethan are doing, but it does give it at least more than her dealing with her sexual desires, her fears and complicated relationship with things.
It also makes it kind of touching that Walky helps her feel secure and safer. He’d probably feel quite awkward if presented with that, but I think he wouldn’t mind helping for a moment with that.
Dang, now he has TWO extra sisters to fuss over =p
Both whiter than his real sister.
AmaziGirl comforting Joyce. Talk about the blind leading the lame…
to be fair, blind people can be pretty damn amazing with navigation
Plus, seeing with my feet is AWESOME!
True and fair.
Would it be considered nit-picking to observe that human echo-location is of limited utility in an environment cluttered with other people?
I could argue it works better, but I don’t have the required sensory perception to say for certain
Well, the lame isn’t blind so maybe the lame can help with the navigation.
I feel more like it would be the other way around with the lame leading the blind – it’s not the best, as they’d both have issues that makes it difficult, but it wouldn’t be impossible to do over all.
[i]daaaaaaaaamn[/i]
Wrong brackets.
She sees Ethan as her protector. Wow, I get it now – and Amber does too.
Oh god, Joyce hates being alone. I feel so blind.
She hates being VULNERABLE, which is lessened by having a dude around… which is a weird contradiction, feeling like only a dude can make her feel safe from that dude in particular. It never occurred to her that a woman could be equally protective.
Yeah, vulnerable’s a better word for how Joyce feels. I think she relies on girls, too, like Dorothy and her roommate, Sarah, for company as well. But it seems she sees having a boyfriend as being a long-term solution for personal safety?
It’s terrible that it had to happen this way, but it’s great that Amber can see Joyce as a person instead of a problem now, and even reconcile with her, if in a one-sided way.
That is true – it could lead to Amber reconciling with Joyce and give her some peace until she learns about Ethan and Danny.
Could also lead to Amazi-girl taking time to teach Joyce some basic self-defense moves. I know it wouldn’t solve everything, but it might help as a confidence-booster, and really, all women should know how to protect themselves (and all men, for that matter).
Hell, imagine Amber starting up an on-campus self-defense course. It might actually help more people than running around like a costumed freak, and help her deal with her own aggression issues.
She actually has smoke pellets wow.
Also she’s not going to find any peace till they find prick is she ?
As long as there is evil in the world, good will never find peace.
Hasn’t she used the smoke pellets before?
Joyce really does crap on Walky whenever she can.
That’s a different fetish…
At every chance they get.
Well to be fair Walky can be a bit of a dickhole.
She may be anguishing over the fact that her assaulter is still out there, that doesn’t stop Walky from being stupid.
The problem isn’t with Walky, it’s with the fact that she only feels safe going out for such necessities as food with him around to protect her.
she meets Joyce and Walky universe Joyce. More freaking out ensues
I bet Joyce would feel safer with an alternate-universe version of herself with a jetpack and a plasma cannon around.
Holy shit. Amber put together pieces about the Joyce/Ethan puzzle I hadn’t even considered.
Good job, Amber.
And Damn, Willis. Not “Damn You”, just… Damn.
Its not really a puzzle its more like adding more to their *sigh* relationship
Ethan protect someone? I could push that guy down with my finger!
There’s a joke in there somewhere…. but, no. Note how solidly built Ethan is. I mean, he’s no Jacob, but I do believe that should he get angry, someone’s getting hurt. And, as we are (I think) talking about that guy Ryan, who was a jerk, but kind of a stick figure…. yeah, I think E can take him.
What makes you think that? Ethan’s pretty built, much more so than the asshole who attacked Joyce.
Hey, to protect from another man’s threats, most of the time being a man is enough. I don’t think Joyce is afraid of being straight up assaulted in the campus street while getting lunch, but she -rightfully- IS terrified of crossing the path of her abuser alone again, or of being verbally abused by this #*%&*, or sneered at or whatever. In this case, merely being accompanied by a man is enough not only to make her feel less vulnerable, but also to make her look less vulnerable to predators like Ryan, and reduce the probability of him marking himself known to almost zero.
Have you seen Ethan? He would break Ryan in half like a toothpick. I mean he’s no Jacob, but then again who is?
Jacob is Jacob.
That said: Don’t make Ethan angry. You wouldn’t like him when he’s angry.
Pity he isn’t strong enough to break out of that closet.
He built it well.
Hey…it’s the thought that counts.
Well, yeah, but you’re a half-vampire superhero. For merely mortal threats such as Joyce is facing, Ethan is a very reassuring presence.
I don’t have something in my eye. I’m just crying.
…Wait…
I’m not crying…I just have somthing in both my eyes!
I’m just sweating from my eyes!
Still, Willis. Why in the feels, man?!
I’m not sweating from my eyes, I’m crying!
Is there anything AmaziGirl DOESN’T have in her utility belt and pockets?
Sanity.
*possibly* a Western Black Rhino… if because they’re extinct now =(
Her Yangtze River Dolphin pocket is also sadly empty, and those things really used to come in handy.
Where does she get those WONderful toys?
Well, go ask her!
I want to hug you both for that.
Wow poor Joyce, and Jess Witt maybe she doens’t have booze.
Amazi-booze. It might be helpful right about now. Booze fixes everything. Look at Ruth and Billie.
Let’s not use them as an example for Joyce and Amazi-girl, just this once. Kay?
Joyce the first step is admitting you’re afraid.
I thought the first step is to admit that you have a problem.
Not in this situation.
Yeah, I’d say admitting you’re NOT the problem is a more crucial step than admitting you have one, in this situation…
Being afraid IS the problem, so admitting you’re afraid is step one and 2 rolled into one.
WILLIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIISSSSSSSSS
/weeps
This page is a good page. People are opening and supporting each other, and the world is a little less terrible. Good stuff.
I like this page as well. I also like that a scowling Mike is your avatar, because imagining Mike saying this is hilarious to me.
Sober Mike would.
I’m sure everyone else is like, “aw, poor Joyce”, and there’s discussions about how deep this plot goes.
My mind is on why a superhero would put tissues next to the smoke pellets. Not even why they HAVE them, that I’m okay with, it’s the “Let’s place these next to the smoke thingies” I take issue with.
Amazi-Girl: Now I shall make my ingenious escape!
*throws packet of tissues on the ground*
*beat panel*
*Amazi-Girl runs away anyway*
Well, that kinda explains why we’ve never seen her actually use the smoke pellets.
Alphabetical?
Cushioning. It’s very embarrassing to have the things go off by accident, so I’ve been told. By someone on the internet. Totally anonymously. Hay, is that a western black rhinoceros over there?
Not nearly as embarrassing as the glop grenades.
Well… shit.
All aboard folks
That was not the link I wanted to post…
There, this should be better
Well, no one can expect tears.
And tomorrow’s strip will be nothing but a smoke-filled lounge.
nonono, there’s a set-up panel: “So, are these jawbreakers?”
*BAMF*
Screw Walky or Ethan, Sarah has a bat and the attitude of someone I’d want to protect me!! But I am digressing (though didn’t the last time she went shopping it was with all girls?)
where do we go from here? hoping AmaziGirl will inspire confidence yet be frank that evil exists and doesn’t go away forever.
Sarah has a much different schedual than Joyce though. She may not like Walky but she can easily arrange to spend a lot of time with him since they share so many classes.
What happens next is Amazigirl trains Joyce how to defend herself, which leads her to become Amazigirl’s sidekick.
Here’s a thought:
The Answer That Satisfied: Joyce was “The Whiteboard Dingdong Bandit,” trying to fit in
The Answer That Was True: Ryan was “The Whiteboard Dingdong Bandit,” telling Joyce that he wasn’t finished with her yet.
Fact is, both possibilities would explain her overreaction to the penises on the boards, and both would explain why the penis on Joyce’s board was WAY over detailed. And as for the permanent marker – I could see Ryan using his own for that purpose, not caring to notice all the other markers had been replaced.
Argument against: Ryan has probably gone on to other pursuits, rapey or otherwise, so his marking up the tablets would be unlikely. Plus, he would likely have just done Joyce’s if he meant to send the message.
Still, it’s a thought – that Amazi-girl in her post-coital glow made a mistake, and that Joyce MAY be in real, long-term danger.
I don’t think Ryan even knew who she was, aside from “easy mark”. Post-event, he knows “Seriously Christian Chick, and FROM OUTTA NOWHERE HER BASEBALL BAT FRIEND”.
I mean, she cut him with broken glass before Sarah hit him with the bat. He’s probably going to be pissed at her even if he deserved it.
I’d be really surprised to find out that Ryan drew the penises. I’m pretty sure he wouldn’t want to get anywhere near Sarah and her bat again.
And he totally deserved to have Joyce punch him with the glass.
Interesting theory, but I really doubt it. He’s a cowardly opportunist- he might be pissed enough to try to take revenge if he happened to find Joyce alone (and without a glass) but I don’t really see someone like him going to this kind of effort, especially for no immediate payoff.
Also I’d kind of expect Joyce’s outburst to include an “and I didn’t even do it” at some point, if Amazi-Girl was wrong.
God.
Damn.
You.
Willis.
(I am emotionally compromised right now and that’s not okay!)
TL;DR: It’s nice to see someone in Comics be Mature about serious subject matter
Something similar happened to my best friend once. She was drugged at a party and raped. It took her years to even cope with the situation. She didn’t trust anyone and didn’t even want to go outside because of this situation. Joyce was lucky, and even though I know she’s not real, that doesn’t mean her feelings aren’t genuine. Most webcomics, hell, most comics in general wouldn’t have something this… Adult in them. What I mean by that is, rape is a serious thing. It’s one of the worst things someone could do to another person. Most comics would either ignore or over simplify the emotions that characters would go through if something like this happened. Being an adult does not mean “SEX, DRUGS, BAD WORDS, RAPE, MURDER! HAHAHAHAHA” that is childish, immature and down right loathsome (Looking at you Chuck Lorre). Being an Adult means taking situations that adults go through and writing them in a realistic way. Giving Genuine and true thoughts, feelings, emotions and character to a situation and showing the characters struggle to cope with the situation. My last comment poked fun at Willis and his writing style, how he usually makes things fun, interesting and then sucker punches you with drama and feels. But, if I can say one thing, it’s that he adds a degree of what it’s like to be an adult in these situations, how to handle realistic subject matter in a mature and very real way without alienating his audience or making the situation seem goofy and childish. So, good job Willis. You’ve just made my list of Favorite comic book writers, Sandwiched between Gail Simon and JMS.
Now I’m wondering who Willis knows that went through the horrer of sexual assault.
Sadly, from a statistical point of view, he probably knows many people (mostly women, but possibly men too) who have gone through sexual assault…. And so do you 🙁
yeahhh… =C
My sister, two cousins, my ex-brother-in-law, all of his siblings(his grandma was evil), one cousin’s three kids…oh and me. Three guys on the list. Most terrifying was the one who was forced to strip at gun point.
Spoke to my sister. Make that six guys on the list. Ex-b-in-l had three male cousins that were sexually assaulted on Granny’s orders.
Careful: ex-b-in-l may not have told sister the whole truth about his motivations. Controlling people almost always blame their crimes on other people.
Wasn’t ex-b-in-l who told my sister about Granny. It was his three sisters who told her why he would have issues BEFORE the wedding. And they talked about the abuse they suffered at her orders, as well.
One in four female college students has been sexually assaulted during college. On in sixteen men has sexually assaulted a woman during college. (On average, every man who has sexually assaulted a woman has sexually assaulted at least four.)
Didn’t he say Joyce is based off him? It’s not just chicks who are assaulted…
Maybe this is weird but I wish we wouldn’t wonder… It just feels like too much, you know?
^This, so much this.^
I meant the Jacob Newburn post of course, not mine
Damn it Willis. Just,..damn. Well done.
Yay. Amazigirl does have some super hero empathy for Joyce.
Also unimportant but does that mean she did draw it? I’m pretty sure not (I assume seeing it is what set her off)
Joyce totally drew the penises. Seeing Amazi-Girl is what set the flashback off.
exactly
I know this SHOULD give me feels, but… eh. It feels rushed, like these emotions are suddenly coming out of nowhere.
ever heard of triggers?
Yes. Because no one ever keeps fears hidden deep inside themselves because they want to keep a brave front, act like nothing ever bothers them, and/or because they were instructed to act and believe in certain things by their family and/or religion.
And that repression of said fears never causes a build up of said emotion to bubble up to a point where something seemingly minor or vaguely related causes it to come out gushing and seemingly out of the blue.
Nope. never ever happens in real life. Nope. Not ever.
(That was sarcasm FYI.)
It’s not like this is a comic, designed in such a way that we can get a look into what the character is actually thinking when no one else is around. Nah. Nothing like that. (This is also sarcasm)
My problem isn’t that she has issues, it’s the pacing of the strip before this one, this one, and the strip after it. You couldn’t see tears beginning to form, she didn’t appear ‘triggered’. She just looked like someone who’d been caught doing something bad. Then suddenly tears everywhere- and then the next second she miraculously isn’t crying anymore?
I have trouble feeling emotionally connected to something when the build up isn’t there.
Nah, it’s not just you. I’ve had a few pacing issues with this chapter in particular, but it might just be the nature of the strip comic format, which I don’t read a lot of.
Definitely pacing issues. That combined with the fact that the event took place days ago in canon but months ago in the real world makes it seem rushed.
They’re not coming out of nowhere. Joyce has been having nightmares that have her wake up screaming for help, her idea of a fun activity is dancving….in her room, with adult supervision, she never goes anywhere alone anymore even clinging to Walky who she doesn’t even like and doesn’t like her either. It’s been a constant display that people haven’t been paying attention to. Fear has been the background radiation of her life ever since that party.
I think it has to do with the slow pacing of the comic. It’s not coming out of nowhere, but you may have to archive binge to really :get: the full feels, just because Joyce hasn’t been focused on much at all lately.
Darn,while I realized that Joyce and Walky would probably never get together in this universe I liked the fact that it seemed that they were at least kind of friends but her comments make it seem like she doesn’t like him at all and just uses him as a security blanket. That’s kind of disappointing.
Not that this is the time for shipping, but a more experienced Joyce who doesn’t have to be so rigid in her beliefs probably wouldn’t be so annoyed by Walky (who mostly picks on the ridiculous things she says, rather than being mean in general).
But yeah… not the time just now.
I don’t think this is the time for shipping either. I’m just saying I’m disappointed because I thought they were friends but apparently they aren’t.
I wouldn’t give up on Joyce and Walky being friends just yet, for two reasons:
1. Walky is dating Dorothy, who is Joyce’s best friend at college. She knows that Dorothy is a smart person, which means that while Joyce may find Walky annoying, he has to have some good qualities. And Joyce innately looks for good qualities in other people, psychological trauma notwithstanding. So there’s hope yet.
2. Joyce has been using Walky for protection, and as we’ve seen, she’s been pretty heavily traumatized by what happened to her, which is a very natural response. This means that Walky is on what is likely a very short list of people that Joyce trusts and feels safe around. For someone in her position, I think that speaks volumes of how she feels about him.
If this isn’t some kind of friendship, then I don’t know what to call it.
Welcome to Alternate Universes, person with appropriately matched name and Gravatar!
They are at least kind of friends. These things aren’t mutually exclusive. This does partly explain why she puts up with some of his more obnoxious aspects.
Why would she like him? He’s an asshole to her all the time. I can remember maybe one conversation they’ve had that didn’t involve him insulting her for something.
Because where else would you keep facial tissue? The boot? Groooooooss.
Thank Damn You Willis? Thank you for being able to write this in such better way than what I am used to and damn you for the feels.
“If you find condoms, you’ve reached too far.”
Please use the smoke pellets joyce. relieve our heavy hearts with comedy
Well, Amber handles this much better than I thought she would. I guess I was just projecting my own social incompetence on her.
To be fair, Amber has had similar experiences dealing with anxiety disorders exacerbated and/or caused by her abusive dad. She could be more competent in that specific situation, because she knows what it’s like to live in fear every day of her life.
Could be, though having experienced something doesn’t necessarily make You competent in dealing with it.
Nevermind, I read my comment again and noticed that basically repeated what You said.
WAIT NO THOSE ARE THE SMOKE KLEENEX!
WAIT NO THAT’S THE FLASH PAPER
WAIT THOSE ARE THE AMAZI-CONDOMS
“Why are they all empty?”
I really hope she kept that card Roz gave her…
What card are you talking about ?
…. looks into the archives ….
Oh
GodWillis, please let her have kept the card !Can someone link to the strip in question?
For the benefit of others, the link is here.
This strip helped me understand why Feminist Self-Defence is a thing.
Err… What is that?
Learning how to disable an attacker long enough to get away, and how to use items in your bag(or your bag) as a offensive defense. i.e. fisting your keys so they become jagged brass knuckles when you punch.
This makes sense on so many levels but its just so so sad.
Great strip, Willis! You hit the nail on the head with this one.
Ohhhhhhh…
How did I not get this. Hiding, being in a party all the time.
Getting with Ethan (also) about his largness(?).
The same way many people missed the incedental familial racism storyline. The Willis can be very subtle.
Damn, Willis. This is some quality content right here
Dang, man.
well guess thats why she has been so needy.
what with the not wanting to get attacked again.
Goddamnit. Now you have me feeling sympathy for the unsympathetic bigot. Damn you Willis.
How is Joyce a bigot? I don’t remember where she was ever acting like a bigot. She honestly believes homosexuality is a sin, but she doesn’t discriminate based on that. (Even when she should, as in the case of her boyfriend choices!)
Unless you’re referring to her condemnation of “pre-marital hanky panky?” Not sure bigot is the best term for that.
Yea.. fairly sure that’s just being a prude… :/ though props for Joyce drawing dicks all over everything. 😀
Believing homosexuality is a sin = is bigoted. It’s not the end all be all of who she is as a person, but right now Joyce believes some really homophobic stuff. Hopefully that will change with time but right now it’s pretty explicit.
You are confusing Joyce with Mary.
Um, not to distract from the poignancy of this moment or anything, but… Where could one purchase these ‘smoke pellets’?
You can buy anything on E-Bay, carpets, TVs, souls…
…TVs that steal your soul, wrap it in a carpet, and sell it on eBay…
Every one inthat floor give Joyce a hug!
not to take away from the seriousness of the strip but
The Amazi Belt; build for stopping crime and comforting victims at the same time
Ok, I’m done, I apologize…
Damn, that second panel was me in college. I was assaulted my first of three years at a community college, in class. I was assured that my attacker would be suspended. When I thought he would be gone, I was just glad to not have any sort of reminder, because I was determined to act like it never happened. But surprise! Nothing ever happened to him, and instead I got to see him almost every day for the following year, turning every day into constant low-level terror and misery (until I inevitably ran into him, then it was high-level panic and despair).
Basically…damn, Joyce, I know that feel, especially since I was still a fundamentalist Christian at the time, and that just complicated feelings even more because I thought my PTSD was ungodly and that I needed to turn the other cheek and forgive him and whatever. This wasn’t helped by friends and mentors who told me that my reaction wasn’t pleasing to the Lord (or even the one asshole who said “praise the Lord!” when I confided in him, because he would give ANYTHING to “suffer for the Lord” like I did :|)
Sigh. Long-winded, but basically thanks Willis because it’s really rare to see a situation so similar to mine, but…actually taken seriously.
Were you also made to feel guilty or at fault, because you were so tempting he couldn’t control himself? Because that happened to me, my sister, and a couple of my roommates.
Yeah. The first question everyone asks is, “What were you wearing? Did you lead him on in any way?” 🙁 It’s the worst. I’m sorry you, your sister, and your roommates have gone through it, too.
Especially when your parents are the ones treating you like its your fault.
The more I hear about religion’s take on sexual assault, the more disturbed I am.
Lots of completely non religious folks think this way as well! Where I come from, the majority of people are atheists (also, scientists), and they STILL believe in the bulshit about biological determinants explaining that males have a hard times controlling their “natural” urges, while females are “naturally” in search of the perfect long term commitment with a mate – and have little sexual needs
Smells like bullshit to me.
Seriously, the only real difference between the genders is differing levels of hormones (IDK why people think estrogen and testosterone are mutually exclusive), genitalia, and the ability to give birth.
Of course, cultural influence has a massive impact on people, but the whole “biological imperative” to act in a culturally prescribed way is bullshit.
Obviously she’s just trying to get out of being punished for being the dong bandit….
Okay, maybe not.
Or maybe the whole Ding-Dong Bandit thing was a ruse to get Amazing Girl to show herself for this confrontation. (Nah, too super-villainy)
I wonder if Amber is going to try to dispense advice… Though given how Amber’s handled trauma in the past, we may be looking at an origin story for Joyce as Amazing Girl’s sidekick.
Nah, you’re not the only one. It’s why I said we all wanted to forget it, not that we could.
Ooooooh. So is THAT part of the reason why Joyce wanted to date Ethan? You know, other than him being a hottie. It would make sense why she kept him after finding out he was gay. Just cause he gay, doesn’t mean he can’t defend someone. At least thats what I think.
Not to mention that she probably reasons that since he’s gay, he won’t sexually assault her.
Hence why when Ethan confesses to him being gay, she just says “You’re perfect.” Goes full circle.
You know, I had the same idea. But I dropped the thought, because a) she became his “girlfriend” before she learned he was gay, b) she is also sorta hanging around with Walky, whom she knows to be straight.
Right. But I think Ethan’s sexuality was reassuring to her that he wouldn’t hurt her. Also I’ve definitely been the person to intuitively grasp that someone is safe for no real logical reason.
God, this is devastating.
A link to the referenced story arc for those of us with shitty memory banks would be helpful.
Here’s where the arc begins: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/06-yesterday-was-thursday/jesus-2/
Start from here.
Prediction: This will be the point at which Amber decides to take off the mask: She will have to in order to testify against Joyce’s attempted rapist because of something ELSE he tries to do. This will be a hugely dramatic moment because of how it is this wonderfully symbolic book-closing against an abuser, healing wounds both for Joyce and Amber.
Danny will react to this badly, because it used to be that Amazi-Girl was just his, and he will Danny real hard about this, making it about him instead of about Joyce and Amber. He will only figure this out after Amber socks him in the jaw after he says something particularly awful.
There, now I’ve said it, so it won’t happen.
I think it is even more short term than that – Amazigirl will take off her mask, because to truly comfort Joyce Amber need to show her own vulnerability and – you now – extend basic trust.
That is of course if Amazigirl doesn’t turn out to be less a hero than I hope she is and take this moment to run away.
I’m hoping Amber takes off the mask to offer Joyce protection in addition to Ethan. Amber gets out more, and Joyce has a bigger support system. Win win.
Can I just say, your gravatar is the best
Doesn’t Joyce hate Amber because Ethan cares more about Amber?
I think you mean it the other way around…
…and no, Amber doesn’t hate Joyce.
You really painted Danny out to be a selfish prick. <_<
Danny is even more clueless than the typical clueless male. Do I think Willis would use him as “the otherwise ‘stereotypical nice guy’ who does something horribly insensitive?” I sure as fuck do.
Joyce, I’m so sorry for all the hard times I’ve given you about your relationship with Ethan. You are coping remarkably well and no one can blame you for choosing the strategies you do.
Amazigirl, if you can handle this part of crimefighting you are truly a hero.
This is NOT the kind of ding-dong bandit I had hoped this chapter would be about.
Oh the feels.
DAMN YOU WILLIS!!!!
God damn it Willis, I wasn’t ready for this!
Anyone who thought that the ding-dong bandit would be a totally comical relief thingie, raise your ding-dong ^^
Ouch, the plot dots are connecting.
There, there. It’s OK. Just cry it out.
Don’t think this gets you out of trouble for dong-drawing, though.
Actually, it’s pretty clear that Joyce isn’t in any trouble anyway. AG points out that the problem is easy to fix.
*True* utility belt.
D8 Oh my god, they broke Joyce! BASTARDS!!
I never thought I’d cry at a webcomic.
Wow… I had totally forgotten about this: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-2/01-pajama-jeans/furthest/
And it took me this to relaize I’ve never seen Joyce by herself since that incident.
This is totally babies. Never noticed she was never alone. Figured she was just trying to be social.
It’s been a while since I’ve heard this many simultaneous cries of “Damn you, Willis!”
Music to my ears.
Does anyone else see Joyce grabbing a few of the smoke pellets for later use? Anyone?
Joyce, “and now that you let your guard down amazing girl I will destroy you. So says the Ding dong Bandit
I wasn’t wrong to blame Mike from the start, I guess. 🙂
Again, I think Mike switching the marker isn’t assholery. He’s trying to teach Joyce a lesson, once again.
He’s a wise man with unconventional methods.
No, this was straight-up assholery. But it lead to her getting to confronting herself and a meeting with Amazi-Girl about her problems, so once again, Mike works in mysterious ways.
How the hell is pranking Joyce by switching her markers meant to teach her a lesson?
It’s meant to teach her that men are controlling jerks.
I need to start saying “next to the smoke pellets” when telling people where things are. I’m not sure how I will manage to make this a relevant thing to say, but now I’m committed.
Oh dang, now Amazi-Girl will take Joyce under her wing and train her to build up her confidence. Then Joyce will someday meet her attacker and go nuts like Amazi-Girl did, and Amazi-Girl will stop her, but also realize she is the exact same and think she is too dangerous to keep going on. Then she’ll try to quit and get Joyce to quit too, but Joyce will have none of that.
Or, you know, something else will happen.
Poor Joyce! 🙁
Tissues are next to the smoke pellets. Don’t get ’em mixed up.
So Joyce is a very smart cookie, right? Has shown she’s good and knowing what to do to get things done.
So she surely would have known drawing the ding-dongs would summon Amazi-Girl.
…
Does that mean a whiteboard ding-dong is now Amazi-Girl’s “Bat Signal”?
*looks to the clouds*
btw, thanks for the valuable PSA up there, Willis =) [being believed is a fucking amazing experience]
“I swear to you”
I see what you did there.
Good thing shes knows which pocket is the smoke pellets and which is the Kleenex because that’s not a mistake you’d want to make in a critical situation.
can I just say, as a regular human being, that the emotion you conveyed here was palpable and real. I’ve never been assaulted–Thank the stars and God that it stays that way–but I’ve been followed or made to feel uncomfortable and just knowing everyday that walking home late could result in a fight is a scary thing. So imagining not being able to continue functioning regularly without fearing being assaulted is something that I see her with Joyce and just.
You are amazing by the way. I’m a college student so I love reading this and feeling the feels or being able to compare the stupidity to my everyday psychotic with my friends.
Girls live with this kind of fear everyday from the moment that they’re old enough to understand what fear is. My mother is still afraid whenever I’m out by myself at night. Some days I really don’t understand how any of us step a foot outside our own doors, never mind function as well as we manage to.
If she hadn’t actually been weeping and it wasn’t JOYCE, I’d say that it’d be a pretty powerful deflection measure, in this specific instance. But yeah, there’s no way someone like her would lie or manipulate with something THAT heavy.
and BOOM! EPIPHANY!