Yes, she did. Dorothy’s made the attempt to get Walky shoes; she now knows that Walky is okay with her advancing her career; and, most of all, she has a lead–she knows that Danny has a relationship with Amazi-Girl. She can now stalk Danny and find Amazi-Girl again. Career? Caramel boyfriend? Done and done.
Seriously, though, I bet that’s gotta really sting for Danny. OUCH, DOROTHY. OUCH. She was doin’ right by Walky but she continues to keep twistin’ the knife in Danny. I think it was the right thing to do, but damn. She really should just should follow through with her earlier declaration that she’s gonna stay away from Danny. Just mail the shoes back!
Shaggy dog story ending: The damn shoes are ALSO too small. 😀
To be fair that world view was completly accurate a few weeks ago. Dorothy very much was driven to get into Yale and avoided social interaction as a result. Walky mellowed her out.
-Oof-, yeah. I’d forgotten about that part. Wow. Dorothy is free to do whatever she pleases with her own life, but wow it’s got to hurt to be Danny right now. X.x
Why is everyone still going on about “Ooooh my god, this happened BEFORE 8 sooo much to take in (like your mom) thaaaaat’s why he’s all grumpy.”
Danny was contemplating bedskirts in a cut-a-way right before all these shenanigans began! I dunno about the rest of you, but I gots to be fully awake to even think about interior decorating so I don’t think this is a “roll out of bed deal with ex” sort of situation. He’s been bright-eyed and bushy tailed this whole time as far as I can tell.
Part of it is that Dorothy wasn’t entirely honest with Danny to start. His clinginess and lack of ambition beyond “marry Dorothy” were kind of big factors of her breaking up with him too. She just didn’t have the heart to tell him.
Or that’s how I felt.
You know, I used to think Willis’ writing was genius but looking at your avatar and comment, I’m starting to think he might just draw amazing expressions on people saying random lines.
It’s cute that you think that that fetish didn’t already exist. It’s been around for at least a year, ever since a bunch of Japanese highschool girls thought it would be funny to take pictures of themselves pretending to give blowjobs to door knobs and post them on the internet.
Dorothy keeps making it easier and easier for me to sympathize with Danny re:their breakup. I’m not quite sure that’s what Willis was aiming at here… >.>
Probably just showing the evolution of the characters. Dorothy’s finally realizing that maybe she should consider Walky in all of this over her blind ambition and is finally doin’ right by her boy. Unfortunately, that comes at the expense of royally fucking over her previous boy that she hasn’t really treated all that well in their interactions since the breakup (which is, to say, interacting with him at ALL, much less scheming to get his shit up to this point).
Hey, we all gotta start somewhere. And, silver lining: makes it that much easier to torch the feelings Danny has for Dorothy and continue the good thing he has going with Amazi-girl and Amber… the stupid, STUPID man. But, hey, as far as rebounds go… it’s a good one!
True. It probably does rather hurt to be Danny right now, but at least he’s taking this better than he would have say a few days ago. Now Dorothy just needs to stick by her word and stay the heck away from him for a good while, and they’ll both be doin’ good.
Or it could just be showing that it wasn’t ‘her ambition’ that made her dump Danny, but rather his complete lack of…anything that wasn’t her, and his disrespect for her ambitions.
He was hollow, and he’s still got some of that hollowness to him…it’s going to be a long while before he turns into a solid chocolate bunny with peanuts, instead of a hollow one full of air, and yet inexplicable yumminess…
Fair point. Danny… needs to suffer just a little. His life has been, in my guesstimation, just an easy enough one that he’s lacked some of the growth that he would have otherwise (hopefully, anyway) had at this point in his life. For that matter, I feel sympathy for them -both- in this situation. She can’t be the least bit comfortable or happy to be there, and this early in the morning I rather doubt he really wants to have to be dealing with anything related to her, either. She should just take the shoes, and -git-. Only fair for all parties concerned by this point.
Also, nice way to say what you’re fiending for right now. XD
This. All the Dorothy!hate is kind of annoying me. Dorothy was literally the only reason Danny came to this college. He had no aspirations beyond their life together. He didn’t even consider the fact that Dorothy might have plans of her own. He thought that all her dreams and aspirations were just a phase she was going through.
I can see why Dorothy would get more than a bit sick of it.
Walky, by comparison, is not only fun to hang out with, he’s also shown he’s comfortable with how seriously Dorothy’s taking her life (bongoing about her making him study aside). Sure, he might not be a long-term prospect, but he’s good enough to make a few sacrifices for.
The fact he’s now just bursting in with a “NOOOOOO, SAVE YOUR CAREEEER!” kind of proves Dorothy right, here. Dunno if Danny would have done that.
Yeah, I can’t fault Dorothy for dumping Danny. She wants to concentrate on her future in a pretty serious way (and good on her for it), and he’s… following her around like a lost puppy. Okay, they were dating, but… Like, she wants to get into a really good university and become a decent journalist. For reelz, not some blogger or doing the community hall meeting report in a local paper somewhere because no one else will take it. And Danny wants–well, he wants to be with Dorothy. And that’s it, which can be really cloying and irritating (to me, at least, and I imagine to someone like Dorothy as well). What does he want to be when he grows up? With Dorothy. Where does he see himself in five years? With Dorothy. What’s he majoring in in college? Doesn’t matter–he’s there because Dorothy is. If she makes it into Yale, his plan was to quit college and follow her to New Haven. And, um… Be with Dorothy?
For gods’ sakes, he’s barely old enough to buy beer. He needs to have a better plan for his life than “Dorothy”.
Meh, I can’t fault either of them. They’re what? 17 years old? Danny doesn’t have any plans for his future and it’s okay that he’s not in a hurry to make them whereas Dorothy does and that’s okay too. They just has what was probably their first major breakup and yeah, at that age and life experience level they’re both going to say and do things that are self-centered and inconsiderate, often without meaning too. Actually they’re handling this a long better than most actual 17-year olds I remember. We haven’t seen any attempts to turn friends against the other person or to badmouth one another.
I guess I’m not anti-either, is what I’m saying. Mistakes are going to be made.
So Dorothy does the decent thing and choses Walky over work, and still Danny is the injured party? WTH?
Danny set her up and she did not do what ‘..If I know you, that’s no contest at all” knew she would do.
Grats Dorothy, you did good.
Danny, grow up.
With this decision she basically said to Danny that she cares more about a guy that she’s been involved with for about 2 weeks than she does someone she was in a relationship with for 3 years. So yeah poor Danny.
Or maybe she was just thought “Well, I came in here for the shoes. it’d be rude of me to leave my boyfriend high and dry because a better deal came along.” Or maybe Danny’s dick-ish little comment made her feel like she couldn’t choose the story over the shoes, even though they could probably find other shoes and picking the story would be the more practical thing to do. Maybe Danny needs to get over himself.
Ugh, this entire comment section is giving me 500 Days of Summer flashbacks. Dorothy is allowed to choose her career over romance and more importantly she’s also allowed to date someone else while still choosing her career. In fact this “love has to triumph career” mentality is addressed in this very comic. (See comic strips: Muppets and Context. Leslie is disappointed in all of you.) Her relationship with Walky isn’t like her relationship with Danny, in which he clearly liked her way more than she did, which – sorry everyone – is a perfectly legitimate reason to break up with someone. Also, is everyone forgetting that Danny’s not some poor guy who hasn’t done anything since being broken up with? In the time since their break-up, he’s flirted with Amber, almost had sex with Billie, and has become Amazi-Girl’s Lois Lane? Why doesn’t Dorothy get to date someone?
Yeah, it sucks having to be around your ex and their new SO and Mike’s little stunt made this whole situation a lot more awkward and horrible than it needed to be, but Danny was being petty and I’m glad it backfired in his face.
No one is denying Dorothy the right to her own decisions. What she isn’t allowed, however, is to dump a guy who clearly loved her a lot, hook up with a -new- guy less than a week later, and then go and do the opposite of what she did with him. That’s just a cruel thing to do. She can date Walky all she wants – she should just leave Danny alone already… and she should have been honest with him about why she really broke up with him. So no, this isn’t anything like 500 Days of Summer. Those two didn’t even date in that movie, so I’m puzzled that you’re having these flashbacks. The situations are not the same at all. Not even similar.
I don’t understand your argument. You say she can date Walky, but she can’t be nice to him or help him because that’s cruel to Danny? I’m not a die-hard Dotty fan by any means (she actually kind of bores me), and I definitely agree she should be a little more honest about things. (For example, Mike wouldn’t have been able to worsen the situation if she had just gone up to Danny and explained what had happened and asked for the shoes.) That being said, I’m a little tired of everyone crying for poor, woobie Danny (who I actually like most of the time) when he isn’t acting any more mature about this than she is.
Also my bad on that one. I should have clarified that I meant the commentary surrounding the movie and this comic are the same not the actual plot. It’s a lot of angry romantics immediately siding with who ever got dumped without really giving a second thought to the person who did the breaking up because they are clearly evil for not loving someone enough.
Ah, okay. No, I meant she -said- one thing to Danny, and here she is and turning around and doing the opposite of it. That’s where the “WTF, Dorothy” is coming from. Because it kind of is being rather inconsistent with the reasons she gave him. =\ Break up with someone all ya want, but at least, y’know, be completely honest with them as to the why. She kind of left some of her reasons out when she dumped Danny, that’s all.
And yeah, I do get what you mean there, that’s why I got confused for a minute. I think Dorothy had every right to break up with him at any point in time – I just think it’s rather bad of her that she waited so long to do it. No evil here, just someone not thinking it through enough that the sooner the cut happens, the sooner it can cleanly heal. And that happens way too much in reality. =(
No yeah, I can definitely agree on all that. Dorothy’s not perfect, and in my opinion, she shouldn’t have even gone there in the first place. (Personally, I’d be walking down the boy’s hall asking everyone but Danny for shoes.) But I don’t think there’s anything specifically wrong with her asking for the shoes instead of the story in this particular strip. Especially when he specifically set her up in a situation where she’ll look bad if she doesn’t pick the shoes and also because, while Danny doesn’t know it (and I’m not faulting him for what he doesn’t know), Dotty has had some character development since their break-up.
(Also looking back, my first post was kind of angry and I didn’t really clarify nearly as much as I should have on my opinion. People immediately vilifying the breaker-upper is one of those buttons with me me for what I imagine are more or less the same reasons that everyone is sympathizing with Danny.)
Truthfully, I don’t entirely see the inconsistency (she, did, after all, largely account the breakup to his following her around with no regard for his own future, and this isn’t contradicted here), and, furthermore, I’ve never quite been able to convey to someone with 100% consistent accuracy why I was breaking up with them. Maybe some people can, but I’ve not seen very many examples of this. The explanations generally come out as “approximations” or “examples” of the reasons why, and whether the other person is cool with that depends on a lot of things. That’s how Dorothy strikes me, and I can’t really hold that against her.
Also, Danny was specifically trying to set her up to “prove” how little she cared about Walky/keeping promises, so, while other parts of this situation suck for him, I don’t really pity him for how this ultimatum turned on him.
I don’t think it’s to “prove” anything to do with Walky. I think it’s that he wants her to prove herself consistent with what she told -him-, that she values her career over anything to do with a relationship right now. In that way, she did prove her earlier words false – and perhaps you -should- pity him for it. Let’s put you in that situation for a minute. Your ex just went and proved one of the reasons they broke up with you was a load of tosh, and they are in fact now doing the opposite of what they said for the sake of a new relationship. Sucks to be there, doesn’t it?
I pity him for being in this awkward situation where she’s trying to get his shoes for her new boyfriend, because that was genuinely kinda enh of her and the situation is pretty awkward for reasons that aren’t his fault. But she DIDN’T misrepresent her reasons for breaking up for him; Danny just misunderstood because that’s how deeply her doesn’t get the importance of her dreams.
Hell, I can even pity him for misunderstanding, cuz I know that breakup must be tough even without realizing that he did something wrong. But her response that that ultimatum? Yeah, he totally had that coming.
She broke up with him because he was clingy – because he was _the kind of person_ who would follow her to her new school. It’s not entirely her fault that what he took away from that was “dumped him to follow her career choice”
How about Danny stops making her responsible for his life? She know what she wants to do with her life and has a solid plan of how to go about doing it; his plan is “be with Dorothy”.
Okay, they dated for a pretty good long time in high school, but that was high school, for crying out loud. Dating someone in high school does not equal spending the rest of your life with them.
One of the things about her relationship with Walky, in contrast to her one with Danny, is that with Walky, she’s hanging out with someone whose company she enjoys. And that’s it. There’s no expectations on either side, so far as I can tell, that this is anything long-term, or anything other than just a fun interlude for each of them.
Danny, however, seems to have wanted to pretty much spend the rest of the foreseeable future with Dorothy, to the exclusion of any other plans. He was really clingy; Walky isn’t. Danny was pretty much making her responsible for his happiness; Walky isn’t.
With this decision all she’s saying is “I came here to see if we can borrow your shoes. Can we?”
Really the shoes? THE SHOES? That’s just…that’s just stupid. Dorothy you can BUY him a pair of shoes! But man this’ll be a bit of a gut punch to the heart for Danny when this sinks in won’t it? It appears that Dorothy always chose her work over him and I guess Dorothy no longer has the luxury of pretending this thing with Walky is casual.
All right I’m not gonna say I don’t sympathize with danny here. Given my romantic history I would be lying.
But seriously? I never got why people hated so much on Danny and I still think hes an overall okay charcter and even yesterday I though: “Ok kinda douchey what he just did there. ” But now seeing WHY he did it…. yeah no more sympathy thats just mean and immature. no matter how bitter I am about past loves and crushes this is just not cool.
The “@” tends to get lost in my case. The one I am using
shows its on the same place as que “q”… but the settings
are different as I have to press 2+Alt Gr to get it -.-
Based on everything we know about the relationship, Dorothy’s mistake wasn’t breaking up with Danny. Dorothy’s mistake was waiting to end a bad thing so long in the first place. She and Danny should have moved on before going to college, simple as that.
Mean and immature? You don’t take my aspirations seriousely, you’re willing to destroy yourself for me, and I just don’t feel the same way anymore are bullshit reasons? those seem like…great reasons to break up with someone. Also…isn’t it kind of Danny’s fault she did that “in front of him”? Should she have basically done what Danny had expected and picked the interview JUST BECAUSE she cares more about her passive agressive ex than her current?I don’t quite get how Dorothy’s the immature one.
The issue that makes her mean and immature is that she A. waited so long, and B. those are still lies. Her real reason for breaking up with him, the one she never bothered to express to him, was that she didn’t feel the same at all and apparently hadn’t for quite some time, and that she really -did- value her career ambitions over anything they had. Ambition is fine. Ambition at the price of other people’s feelings is where the line needs to be drawn, and she waffled and delayed and was a whiny little WUSSY on not drawing it sooner. THAT is the immaturity.
Sorry a teenage girl didn’t just say “Listen man…fuck you. I’m out.” for a relationship she had been in for a while. Do you know what’s hard to do? Break up! Because then people treat you like shit for doing what made you happy.
Exactly. Guys, let’s remember Dorothy is like 18. When you were that age I’m sure in your relationship-ending you would have wanted to spare as many feelings as possible, because no one wants to be the bad guy. I sure as hell know when I was that age I didn’t want to hurt my ex-boyfriend when I dumped him, so I tried to “nice” my way around it. As for the rest of their immaturity- again, they’re 18.
The time is really the big factor. How long exactly had Danny been talking about a shared future? How long exactly did it take Dorothy to fill him in on the fact that her vision of her future didn’t include him?
I don’t know if I’d say that’s mean and immature per se. She certainly seems to be a remarkably poor communicator though, and Danny has definitely been hurt by this.
It’s actually a kind of fun reversal of gender norms. Typically the man’s supposed to be the one who’s all reserved with their feelings while the girl’s an open book.
Frankly, my impression was that she was trying to tell Danny this for a very long time, and he just wasn’t listening in favor of “I’m going to be with Dorothy forever and then we’re going to get married and have a wonderful life!”
I mean, seriously, even Joe picked up that Dorothy wasn’t all that into Danny, and he’s not exactly Captain Cares-a-lot.
Exactly.
I think what Danny (and many commenters)
forget is the fact that Dorothy did not break up with him
becuase of her career. It was because he did not respect her wishes
for a career and did not notice that she was feeling unhappy in the relationship. The one thing that Danny said in the end that triggered the break up was: “Maybe after sometime here you will rethink Yale and stay with me.” As somebody who is constantly accused of eliteism because I apply to Oxford I can really understand how
Dororothy felt in that moment. Because if you want to make a life changing decision I would be nice to have a boyfriend woh actually supports you in it (Walky does make fun about dottys learning and all, but he has never been AGAINST Dottys learning). What caused this is IMO Dany beeing obsessed with “The Plan” (I can’t find the specific strip): Get a girl, study for three years, propose. Yeah sounds a bit like highschool sweatheart dreams. But again I am not gonna judge danny on that because when a relationship falls apart, than there is amlost always somebody, who cannot see the problems and thinks everything is fine. In this case Dotty was the more mature one for ending it. Could she have handled it better? Defenitely. Should she have done it sooner? Totally. But in the end she handled the situation like an adult, trying to make the best of it, trying the remain on goood terms with danny and most importantly, not ripping the social circle apart by still talking with Joe. Danny on the other hand acted exactly like you would expect after having his relationship “thrown in his face”.
For example: he has been sort of an hippocrite with him first hitting on Amber and now “dating” Amazigirl, but still expecting his ex to stay away from dudes. Yes he thinks that its unfair, because she broke up with him becuase she didnt have time for a relationship, but like I said it was more of an issue about not respecting her life decisions.
In the end the break up and the eventual fallout we have seen so far was just the classic post highschool break up which is saidly so common: Both have a plan of where they and/or the relationship should go, but they realise that their plans differ so far, that there is no way to make it work.
My issue with todays strip is that Danny goes here from beeing jelous of Walky and bitter about the break up to downright manipulative and actively trying to torpedo Dottys new relationship. First their was the thing about: “You are not allowed to sleep with him until time X”. Now we have: “Im gonna test wether you love him more than me”. Sriously is there ANY other reason for danny doing this? Like i said being bitter is ok, beeing jelous is ok, for the first month after a break up you are allowed some priviliges. But this goes just a bit to far in ways to be a jerk to your ex.
Wow I think this is my longest comment on the internet ever.
Thank you, this is exactly right. She didn’t choose Yale over him. He just simplifies that as her reasons because he doesn’t really get what her goals mean to her (or that he was being inconsiderate of that).
Joe may not be Captain Cares-a-lot but he was more removed from the situation than either of them and observant enough to notice that Danny was the only one talking about this future of theirs.
Danny’s not a mind reader. Dorothy may have “tried to tell him” but it certainly doesn’t sound as if she ever spelled it out in plain English. When she had the talk with him about what would happen when she moves on to the next school it certainly didn’t sound as if this was a conversation they’d had before.
I’m not really sure where you’re getting the idea that Dorothy never tried to “spell it out in plain English.” When she DID try to spell it out for him, he willfully misinterpreted everything she said. Even if Dorothy had been trying to have these conversations with Danny for the past 3 years, he would have responded EXACTLY the way he did, because that’s just the way he is.
I suppose we can’t “technically” know whether this was a repeating conversation unless Willis provides some backstory, but I identify with Dorothy to some degree, because I’ve also had dudes who were so enthusiastic about keeping up the relationship that they didn’t pay any attention to what I wanted, or developing their own life.
Furthermore, Dorothy was never choosing Yale over her love for Danny. She was choosing her dreams over someone who thought said dreams were SO unimportant that he couldn’t even conceive of taking an interest in them. He simplifies her reasons for breaking up as “she chose Yale over me” because he doesn’t really understand or care about what’s important to her.
Is he the epitome of evil? No, but he’s not nearly as considerate or interested in Dorothy’s life as he thinks.
I do not feel that your third or fourth paragraph are in any way related to anything I’ve said. I suspect there has been a miscommunication. I am neither villifying Dorothy nor am I advocating Danny. They’re both just young people who could stand to learn to be a bit more functional in a relationship.
That being said I do not feel that there is anything to indicate that Danny was being willfully ignorant. I think that if when Danny had first started talking about a future together Dorothy had responded with “Whoa, I don’t know where all this talk is coming from but I’m not with you on that” then he would have been less inclined to proceed as if they were both planning on spending their lives together.
Don’t know why, but it’s not letting me reply to your most recent comment. in any case, the last two paragraphs were partly responding to the idea that Danny had to be a mindreader to figure out why Dorothy was disinterest, and partly a response to the general sorts of accusations Dorothy has been getting.
In the next strip, he suggests that maybe she’ll just get over her desire to go to Yale, and she gives him a hurt, indignant look (which he doesn’t notice) and dumps him. In the following strip, she yells at him that wanting to go to Yale isn’t just a phase. He proceeds to interpret this as her thinking that Yale is more important than he is, rather than her being hurt and bewildered that someone she’s dated for three years could think so little of the things she valued.
Was this in plain English? Maybe not, but I can’t see how she was hiding anything from Danny. She may not have handled the shoes thing all that well, but I don’t think she could have done much better with that breakup. Not all communication is in words, and I think Danny just wasn’t paying attention.
Yeah, certainly she did “Try to tell him”. Oh, Danny, I worry about you and how you’ll have to spend some time without me once I transfer to another school. I think you should have your own dreams and ambitions. So on and so forth. She danced around the issue. She never went and actually touched the core of it.
Yes, not all communication is verbal but it certainly helps to say the words aloud, especially if somebody doesn’t seem to be getting you “subtle cues”. Danny, this committed longterm relationship you think we’re in. It doesn’t exist. I am fond of you but when I picture myself in that oval office you are not there.
Whether or not Danny was paying attention is irrelevant. Yes, the fact that this relationship didn’t work out was contributed to in equal parts by both involved parties. Danny should have made fewer assumptions. Danny should have respected his partner and her aspirations more. Danny should have taken an active interest in discovering his partner’s feelings on important subjects like the very nature of their relationship.
But back to my original point, she’s not meanspirited and I don’t think she’s immature for where she is in life, rather she has hurt Danny through her communicational failings within the context of their relationship. Danny was an open book. She didn’t have to solve any riddles to figure out how he felt about their relationship or how he pictured his future. She could have stood be more open about these things and leave less room for misunderstandings.
I guess I’m just confused by the notion that she’s being a bad communicator. I mean, literally EVERYONE else around Danny was telling him that the relationship would probably be ending pretty soon. She brought up, multiple times, the fact that she was concerned with the fact that he was following her around and shouldn’t he think of his own goals and dreams.
At what point does it stop being Dorothy’s responsibility to MAKE Danny understand? She wasn’t lying when she said she was worried about what Danny was going to do when she started pursuing her own dreams. She loved him, and she wanted him to pursue his own dreams. That was the point she wanted to convey to him, and I think it got across.
The problem was, Danny was only half listening. He only heard the “I love you,” not the “I want you to pursue your own dreams.: That didn’t get railed through his thick skull until he did something that made Dorothy realize that he REALLY didn’t get her.
There are situations in which one person is a bad listener and the other is a bad communicator, but I REALLY don’t think this is one of them. One shouldn’t need to take a hostile tone, or say things they don’t mean in order to get their point across.
Dorothy held no responsibility to Danny ever. However relationship problems are easier to solve if everybody is aware of the problem and a good way to make people aware of the problem is to state the problem explicitly using words.
“I want you to pursue your own dreams” was still itself only a piece of the landscape surrounding the problem. You can keep talking about the surroundings all day hoping that they’ll fill in the blank, but it’s much more helpful to just say what’s wrong.
I don’t even know if it’s accurate to say that Dorothy didn’t see Danny in her future, just that she didn’t see a shiftless puppy dog following her around in her future. She did, as she said, still care deeply for him, and I can see worry/distaste over his lack of ambition being the major issue for her.
I think he wouldn’t seem quite so much the shiftless puppy dog if she was similarly intent on spending her life with him. Dorothy definitely cared for Danny and still does, but she never planned on spending her life with him and that wouldn’t have changed if he’d picked up his own goals and ambitions nor would picking up ambitions have successfully brought him onto her wavelength since he’d still be working as if his ambitions were to be planned and worked around his partner and she’d still be working as if she could drop him like a sack of potatoes at any given moment. They did not view their relationship the same way in this regard.
To say she didn’t plan on spending her life with him is I hope obviously not to say she didn’t and doesn’t care for him. I’d venture to say she loved and still loves him. There are a lot of different kinds of love that can manifest in a lot of different ways, hers didn’t and quite possibly never will involve compromising her life, ambitions, and independence.
I don’t feel NEARLY as confident as you that Dorothy never saw that life of hers involving Danny; I think it’s very likely that this is something that slowly built up when she realized he was intent on following her to college. I can agree that it’s rather unfortunate/arguably wrong of her not to dump him as soon as it became clear he was doing this, but I can also imagine that being difficult, both because the relationship had been going on for a while, and because it’s hard to communicate with someone who isn’t paying attention.
I’m not really blaming Danny for the breakup; breakups are just things that happen through no fault of anyone involved. But I think it’s a stretch to say that this demonstrates Dorothy’s poor communication skills, rather than Danny’s poor listening skills. Dorothy’s communication skills seem pretty average to me, and she’ll be able to function normally if she communicates at the level she did to Danny. Danny will implode if he starts paying as little attention to the rest of the world as he did to Dorothy; he would only be able to communicate with people with INCREDIBLE communication skills.
That’s an interesting way to put it. Average communications skills. Probably pretty accurate within most contexts. Even within the context of a romantic relationship I guess she’s still average. I’m just not so confident that average communication is sufficient for such an endeavour. When you’re dealing with such complex and personal issues I think you probably need a bit better than average to make it work. Everybody has their little blind spots especially when they’re so closely involved with the issue. The average communication that’s sufficient when discussing the latest lecture doesn’t really cut it when you’re trying to explain to your partner why and how what you want out of the relationship is fundamentally different from what they’re offering.
I’m an average mathematician, which is to say that if I wanted to get into physics I’d need to improve. Romance has rather high demands in the communication department.
I maintain that she isn’t lacking anything in communication skills; Danny was just exceptionally hard to communicate with. Romance shouldn’t be reserved for “experts” in communication.
More specifically, you seem to be saying that Danny listened as well as any person would in a relationship, and Dorothy communicated far below what most people do in relationships.
Is she communicating just fine with Walky though? Last time they had a disagreement about what was going on with their relationship she dodged around the issue and moved on to more fun topics. It only even got close to being addressed to to the involvement of a third party. Not exactly ideal.
Okay – that I can agree with. She and Walky specifically agrred on a just-for-fun, short-term relationship, and I think they communicate as well as I would expect in that context.
True enough. Maintenance isn’t so much an issue with a short-term engagement. Communication is also more difficult with somebody you’ve only known for a handful of weeks. Nobody’s getting hurt here. I just wouldn’t use their relationship as an counter-example to how her communication skills were insufficient to the needs of her relationship with Danny.
Fair; my point is more that her skills were insufficient for that relationship, because anyone’s would be with the way Danny was acting, not because she lacks the skills for a serious commitment.
Danny was a little bit dense and wasn’t actively on the lookout for the problem. It was hardly an insurmountable obstacle and hardly an obstacle that you can reasonably expect never to encounter over the course of a long term committed relationship. She did as well as most would have done at her point in life, but to state her problems orally isn’t exactly god-tier communication.
I don’t know where people are getting the idea that Dotty dumped Danny for her career. She dumped him because he was unambitious and decided to follow his girlfriend around to college instead of following something for him. Do you know how unattractive it must seem, for a woman so single-mindedly focused and ambitious, always planning and preparing for her dreams, when she realizes her boyfriend is a spineless, dopey, “Oh, I just want to go where you go honey, being with you is more important then anything else.” That would repulse her. She likes Walky because he’s his own purpose, He doesn’t want to complete her, he wants to be his own person with her, preferably while watching cartoons. And all top of all that he insulted her by saying that if he stayed with her long enough, she would forget about wanting to go to Yale, and want to start a happy family with him. That must of cut her deep. That Danny thinks so little of all her planning and work, that she would just give it up for a relationship. Enough with the “She gave up Danny to focus on her career” “Bullshit. And Danny is not a sympathetic character.
Yeah, I see it that way. I never hated Danny he’s a good guy and a fun character and Dorothy is a decent character too, I don’t think her relationship with Danny should have lasted that long. He was too clingy and serious for her when she wanted fun and low maintanence. They just weren’t right for eachother and she made a mistake staying with him that long and not making it clear he was smothering her and trying to move into serious territory she did not want in a high school/ college relationship.
I can get behind this line of thought. They’re both decent characters, they both made mistakes in the relationship. To try and pin the blame on just one or the other the way I’m seeing some people still do here? Pfeh. Grow up folks, if you can’t have sympathy for both of them (got to suck for Dorothy to even have to be -standing- there, for example), I think you need to re-examine your humanity, because I find it severely lacking. 😛
Cartoons and comics like this are supposed to imitate real life or events, so who knows? Maybe this same kind of scenario might be happening someplace, and you would, by insulting the character, essentially be insulting the person they’re unintentionally portraying.
I think that’s the point. Danny is extremely bright, academically. We’ve been given this information. He is awesome at computer science, but no because he wanted to be good enough to follow Dorothy, we don’t have evidence of that yet. For now the safest assumption is that he is good with computers out of his own love and interest. Dorothy doesn’t think Danny isn’t smart, she thinks he’s wishy-washy. He could have gone to a school, that could have helped him with that career path. But instead, he decided just to give hat up and follow Dorothy along because love. This school does not have the programs and classes he need, but he chose it to be with his friends and his girlfriend. Which is admirable to some. But to Dorothy that would be a highly unattractive trait. He knew he was good at something, he knew he could further himself, he had potential, and he put it on a back burner. We know from the Miss Piggy comic that that is something Dorothy does not believe a partner should do. She would have had way more respect for Danny if he went to pursue more training in his field.
And it’s not that Walky is so ambitious and focused, it’s that he doesn’t want to stop her, distract her or slow her down. And he isn’t so spineless as to be constantly attempting to change his path to fit hers. He’s going to do his own thing, and if Dorothy wants to do it with him that’s cool. She respects that, There’s the difference.
There’s no indication that Dorothy respects Walky’s independence; in the short time she’s known him she’s attempted to change his clothes and his study habits. We also know he isn’t after him for his brains or potential.
There’s some evidence that him throwing the monkey toy at her head made her think fondly of him, god knows why, but as far as I can recall the only reason that she’s actually given for liking him is his caramel abs.
Danny, on the other hand, is sadly deficient in caramel.
Hey, Danny, remember that part in Pride and Prejudice where Miss Bingley basically dogs Mr. Darcy as he suffers in silence, until she forces from him that Elizabeth is the loveliest woman he knows, and she’s the only one that fact hurts?
No, because that would make you a nerd? I hate you Danny.
Anyways, no matter what you think of her actions, Dorothy is over you: you can be a (laughably predictable) moron about it, or you can sever and move on with your new girlfriend who might be a superhero. Don’t strain yourself thinking about this one.
I find it intriguing the contrast between walky and danny in this storyline.
Danny, you see, probably would have LEAPT at Dorothy giving up her career for him. That’s what he wanted her to, and essentially the reason why they broke up.
Walky actually wants her to pursue her dreams and be her own person. He just likes spending time with her, on top of that.
There’s a lot of similarities between walky and danny, they’re both intelligent and have a lot of potential.
The difference is this. Danny is dependent on other people. He wraps himself around other people, and bases his plans to fit his relationship with them.
Walky likes other people, but he’s going to do his own thing. And he wants other people to do THEIR own thing.
It’s an attitude thing. In effect, Danny is an incredibly codependent personality type, while walky is very independent. The latter suits Dorothy more, for the time being.
My ex-girlfriend, who was two years ahead of me in college, decided on her own to stay in town after she’d graduated so we could continue to stay together, and then resented me for her putting her career on hold for our relationship, when I had never asked or wanted her to do that.
These things build up over time. Dorothy made the right decision- and anybody who’s broken up with someone, especially someone so dependent, knows that it can be very hard to do.
Danny sympathy taking a nosedive (though to be fair it started going down earlier this week). Believe it or not, Danny, even if you are letting them borrow your shoes you are still managing to be a jerk AND failing to simulate self-respect.
I’ll laugh when Amber and Amazi-Girl both realize what a tool you are.
This comment section today…egh. I wanted to come down here and make a comment about how interesting it was that this page showed how in young relationships, people don’t often understand each other fully (how Danny never caught on to the real reason he was dumped, despite being so close to her, ect.) but then I read about a lot of people seemingly projecting onto this page and…just egh. Keep in mind these people are still quite young and naive.
Are we to blame Danny because he’s naive and tried to follow his dream girl to college (despite signs she wasn’t interested and while hoping she’d ditch her career plans for him eventually)? Not at all. He’s still learning. Dottie was the first great love of his life (in his opinion). Things like this happen when you’re new to relationships.
Are we to blame Dottie for not telling her boyfriend why she really brow up with him, trying to soften the blow for his sake, and then awkwardly asking her ex for something before enough time had passed? Not at all. She’s young and has yet to have enough long term boyfriends to learn how to properly treat a break up. She thought lying to Danny about why they broke up would be the right thing to do. It’s naive and perfectly what young people do all the time.
These are fictional characters, and they’re not perfect. That doesn’t mean either of them (in this case Dottie) are jerks. They’re just naive, very young kids who haven’t had enough relationship experience to know better.
Your comment is 100% on. It’s frustrating to see all the hate on both sides, although most can back up their arguments well. I see this is a real character building moment for Dorothy, Danny, and Walky all three. I’m glad that things are getting out in the open, and I hope they can all move on from this.
Also – go Walky! Support her ambitions and realize the bigger picture! Go Dorothy! Stay principled and keep your promises! Go Danny! Have self-respect!
Best comment today hands down. Just because I side with Dotty in this case I still believe that the whole conflict is often blown out of proportion in the comment section. Its just two teenagers after the end of their first big romance. They are entitled to doing a lot of things that could be considered jerky.
I don’t blame Danny for being angry at Dorothy, I would be too. This may not necessarily have been the best way to handle his anger, but I think people are way too hard on him. Keep in mind they were together for years, and out of the blue (from his perspective) she dumps him. I don’t know anyone who wouldn’t be at least a little upset.
What many seem to be forgetting here in their “DANNY IS A JERKBUTT” rampage is simply this: He’s still hurt about the whole thing.
Wait, what? People are still allowed to feel hurt after being dumped so spectacularly as he was? GASP! THE HUMANITY! THE SHEER HORROR! How DARE Danny have anything resembling a basic human emotion?! The fact that Dorothy is here asking for his shit for her NEW boyfriend is probably not helping him get over that at all. If anything, it’s probably making bitter feelings resurface.
If you want to read about emotionless automatons always making the right choices, there’s plenty of webcomics out there to suit you. The most awesome thing about this one, in my opinion, is that there is no “right” or “wrong”. All the characters are human. They all make mistakes. They all face moral dilemmas and occasionally act dickish despite being fairly nice people the rest of the time (and believe me, I’ve met people like that. They’re not rare. It’s this little thing called “behavior modulation”, where you can pick how you act to different people. If you act the same way to everybody, you’re an idiot).
I’m not saying Dorothy is in the wrong here. Quite the contrary. You are allowed to live your life as you see fit, and hook up with whoever you damn well please.
Just don’t expect your ex-boyfriend to be completely supportive about it.
Aye, I am reminded of a line that stuck with me from Hemingway’s “The Short, Happy Life of Francis Macomber.” Yes, the wife in that story was a cheating harpy. Yes, the husband in that story was an emotionally spineless ass who needed to do a lot of growing up. But it wasn’t simply just one person sticking the knife in the other–it was both. Therefore, “The way they were now was not any *one* person’s fault.”
It’s the same way here. I understand Danny very well. I don’t have a lot of sympathy for Dorothy since she could’ve avoided all this and really is twisting the knife in Danny, but she’s doing right by Walky. And THAT is really necessary considering how her DEFAULT inclination was already before shown to be to deny him–which Mike exposed her on too. Shows their relationship was pretty fucked up, but, remember, it takes two to tango there during their relationship. And now this.
The way things were between them in their relationship was not any *one* person’s fault. Dorothy’s still a bongo for bringing this to Danny’s doorstep, but… well… we wouldn’t have this storyline if Dorothy actually abided by what she previously said. I see their interaction here as a plot device rather than something I really think Dorothy would do. We needed some spice to happen. That may just be me, though.
Exactly. It takes two to tango, as they say. But on the Internet, apparently only one person can be responsible for what’s going on. The current situation happened because of both their actions (and Mike’s jerkiness. But he’s kind of like a natural disaster, so, you know, no real blame there), yet people insist on blaming one or the other.
“Full of shit” is too strong of a phrase. All of these characters are frustrating in some way or another, but they’re flawed like real human beings are. I just hope that Dorothy understands now that being dishonest with Danny was a mistake, and Danny understands why Dorothy left him and can move on.
The problem is that it’s awfully had to completely move on if your ex won’t go away. Dorothy’s promise to leave him alone lasted exactly as long as it took for him to have something she wanted.
Do you have any idea how many people would stab a complete stranger for that kind of stability and reassurance? Gallons. Gallons of people.
Then let them date her? It doesn’t feel good to know that you’re expected to date someone just because another girl is attracted to them. Especially when the implicit criticism is that you must be weak, in want of reassurance and stability, because you’re female.
Would you give that advice to your daughter? She tells you she doesn’t feel it’s working out, she’s not really having any fun; all he does is copy her and follow along. You tell her, well at least he’s very dedicated? It may be true in that the relationship’s stable, but it’s not going to make her feel any better about the rather vapid nature of it.
I fail to see how Danny’s the bad guy here. He doesn’t owe her anything, except perhaps directions to the door. He certainly doesn’t owe her a leg-up for her career at the expense of his current relationship.
That’s Monday. Gilligan Cut to Danny placing Walky on the railroad tracks and Walky’s petticoats all ruffled and dirty. Tophat Danny twirls his mustache as he tries to getaway with his own shoes. Dorothy-dressed-as-a-Mountie does her best to save Walky from the oncoming train and Amazi-girl thinks she stepped into the wrong genre.
I think if he’d just said that she couldn’t have the shoes, then people’ll’d think more kindly of him. Assuming that it would be at the expense of his current relationship, that he’s prepared to spend his current relationship in order to damage hers, (she can have the shoes or the interview – if she has the interview they both lose,) isn’t a very nice thing to do to Amazi-girl.
Though, I can understand that it probably feels really horrible for him, her having come up and asked him like that. And he’s probably just grabbing at anything to try to salvage some self-esteem. Dorothy shouldn’t have done what she did either.
I’m not very sympathetic towards Danny right now. I was, until he tried this stunt. He deserved to get jerked up short like that, especially seeing as he’s pursuing Amazi-Girl right now.
Poor Danny. You will be forced to realize that Dorothy was simply sick of you, personally. It wasn’t her work or her ambition; it wasn’t that she was leaving; she just thought you were a simpering ass. There will be no escaping the reality.
Reading these comments are frustrating. Everyone’s complaining about Dotty being the “bad guy” or Danny being the “bad guy”. NOONE is the bad guy!
Two people dated
One wanted to break up because the other was being too clingy and disrespectful of her goals, not purposely mind you.
Then she asks a favor of him. I know it may be hard for him but when you know a person for 3 years, funny thing is, they’re still kinda your friend, at some level. You just don’t want to clash genitalia anytime soon.
The guy still feels hurt but is a nice guy so he’s still willing to do one favor for her. It doesn’t make him a doormat. THEY KNEW EACH OTHER FOR A LOOOONG TIME. Sometimes being a big man is not being petty and cutting off someone you’ve known because they broke up with you. She stated her case and he can UNDERSTAND why she did it. I know it hurts but…cutting people out of your life completely will only be inconvenient for you in the long run since they pretty much live a few feet from each other.
I digress, Dotty’s not some mean girl who “doesn’t care about Danny”. She just felt he didn’t respect her goals and was too clingy, unlike Walky.
Danny’s hurt but still nice enough to help her out. Does he have liscense to be snarky? not really, but it’s understandable. he’s only human.
Why must everyone feel it’s necessary to have a “villain”. LIFE ISN’T BLACK AND WHITE, SOMETIMES PEOPLE ARE JUST PEOPLE AND THEY DO PEOPLE THINGS AND THERE’S NO VILLAIN AND THEN THEY MOVE ON WITH THEIR LIVES.
You’re mostly right, except Danny doesn’t understand why she dumped him. He thought, and I quote: “Dorothy says she can’t have a boyfriend because she’s going to be moving soon to another school”. He presumably latched on to this part of the explanation because it was a reason he couldn’t argue against and thus could let it lie.
He hasn’t cottoned onto the fact that she just doesn’t like him anymore. Him, personally. He’s not good enough for her – despite the fact that (as Danny sees it) her standards are evidently quite low.
If Danny understood Dorothy’s real reasons for dumping him, this conversation would have played out quite differently.
She was originally going to try to have her new boyfriend steal the shoes.
She does have a devious streak. This comic shows it is (of course) not absolute, but she does have some very bad attitudes toward respecting others. It’s subtle, and tempered with over all concern, but it is definitely there, and it gets exasperated by what I suspect if a ‘know-it-all’ attitude she has.
Agreed.
This only confirms my earlier feelings from about a week ago. Dorothy needs to STAY AWAY from Danny.
To be fair, he needs to tell her this as well.
Apparently so. Dotty/Walky shippers seem to be missing that Walky doesn’t know or care about the shoes vs interview dilemma. He just thinks they’re having sex in there.
It looked to me like all Mike did was make Walky listen at the door. Walky probably does know what’s going on, although it’ll be awkward if he tries to explain why he was listening.
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She won
Did she now?
SHE PASSED THE FINAL TEST. SHE’S NOW PRESIDENT.
I for one welcome our new Dorothy overlords
All hail Overlord Dorothy! HOORAY!
All hail the overlord
Amazing girl. Is her body guard and amber her body double
IT’S AMAZI-GIRL HOW DARE YOU DEFILE HER NAME
…Then again, there’s also a period after “amazing girl” so your autocorrect probably did that to you.
THAT’S HOW IT WORKS.
how come?
That didn’t work too well at Pandora’s laberynth 🙁
Yes, she did. Dorothy’s made the attempt to get Walky shoes; she now knows that Walky is okay with her advancing her career; and, most of all, she has a lead–she knows that Danny has a relationship with Amazi-Girl. She can now stalk Danny and find Amazi-Girl again. Career? Caramel boyfriend? Done and done.
3rd panel: Don’t look at us, Danny. We’re just watching. We don’t have all the answers!
“But where can I find such a man? Why am I asking you?”
Because I’m handsome, Hedley.
Seriously, though, I bet that’s gotta really sting for Danny. OUCH, DOROTHY. OUCH. She was doin’ right by Walky but she continues to keep twistin’ the knife in Danny. I think it was the right thing to do, but damn. She really should just should follow through with her earlier declaration that she’s gonna stay away from Danny. Just mail the shoes back!
Shaggy dog story ending: The damn shoes are ALSO too small. 😀
Walky does a great Darth Vader impersonation.
DO NOT WANT!
Hey Danny, how bout that world view of yours you’ve been trying to rebuild since you got dumped? Yeah… that was nice.
To be fair that world view was completly accurate a few weeks ago. Dorothy very much was driven to get into Yale and avoided social interaction as a result. Walky mellowed her out.
Personally, I think college life in general mellowed her out, and Walky just happened to be the most direct beneficiary of this change.
Wasn’t even quite a few weeks ago. It’s only been about a week or two at most. No wonder Danny’s kind of pissed off here.
It’s a lot to take in before 8 am.
-Oof-, yeah. I’d forgotten about that part. Wow. Dorothy is free to do whatever she pleases with her own life, but wow it’s got to hurt to be Danny right now. X.x
Mike gave your mom a lot to take in before 8 am for a nickel.
This is why I like you.
Why is everyone still going on about “Ooooh my god, this happened BEFORE 8 sooo much to take in (like your mom) thaaaaat’s why he’s all grumpy.”
Danny was contemplating bedskirts in a cut-a-way right before all these shenanigans began! I dunno about the rest of you, but I gots to be fully awake to even think about interior decorating so I don’t think this is a “roll out of bed deal with ex” sort of situation. He’s been bright-eyed and bushy tailed this whole time as far as I can tell.
The important thing to take away from this is that there is never a good time of day for an ex to show up and start asking for stuff.
Part of it is that Dorothy wasn’t entirely honest with Danny to start. His clinginess and lack of ambition beyond “marry Dorothy” were kind of big factors of her breaking up with him too. She just didn’t have the heart to tell him.
Or that’s how I felt.
Too true, too true. Still, take THAT worldview! In your face!
In your FAAAAAAAAAAAAACE.
You know, I used to think Willis’ writing was genius but looking at your avatar and comment, I’m starting to think he might just draw amazing expressions on people saying random lines.
What are you talking about “Give my tummy all of your thing!” is fantastic writing!
Maybe Willis should have drawn cracks in the panel?
Maybe now he’ll accept that she just wasn’t that into him.
Sooooooo..dany was RIGHT about the possibility of her deciding iu wasn’t sobad, and was not in fact crapping on her dreams?
Well, hopefully she admits that to him (and herself).
Foolish Walky. The stakes are always high enough for a big NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.
I agree. You should never say “no”, always “NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!”
Life’s too short to be reasonable.
I dunno…I don’t think he drew that “no” out enough for maximum dramatic potential. It’s all in the details, kids!
A lot of guys ignore the “NOOOOOOO” and that’s about standards.
True, Walky DOES hit the drama button a lot more effectively than many guys.
could it be that in this universe, HE pulled the drama tag?
Unless it came pre-pulled.
I heard Joe did it.
Well, actually, all I heard was Joe talking about pulling out, I didn’t catch the whole conversation but what else could he be talking about?
You think Vader didn’t practice his “NOOOOOOOOOOO!”? His terrible, death “NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!”?
That was a Horrible thing to say.
Do the wave!
WALKY.
WHAT DID YOU DO WITH THE DOOR.
WALKY, DANNY NEEDS HIS DOOR.
FUCK DAT DOOR!
Thank you. The world needed that fetish to be brought into existence. I hope you’re happy with yourself. 😛
ewwwwww door fetish ….. well better than toilets?? and … socks???? what kind of junk these people on ???
I’ve seen some sock on door action. What kind of times are we living in?
you sir are clearly the best!
More like crystal Claritin clearly!!!!
OH GOD.
I SINCERELY REGRET STARTING THIS THREAD.
It’s cute that you think that that fetish didn’t already exist. It’s been around for at least a year, ever since a bunch of Japanese highschool girls thought it would be funny to take pictures of themselves pretending to give blowjobs to door knobs and post them on the internet.
I googled “door fetish” and literally the first thing to come up was a video about a woman humping a door
One year? I guess this Oglaf strip might be even older, then.
Looks like Mary’s not the only one who needs to be concerned about leaving the door unlocked.
Also, I’m not the only one that reads Walky’s voice in Beast Boy’s voice, right?
And now I have a voice actor for Walky in my head! Woot! Thanks!
…this has just increased my love for this comic more than I thought possible. Kudos to you!
Not anymore.
But you have to imagine the voice actor putting on a bit of a southern accent. He is from Alabama, you know.
Dorothy keeps making it easier and easier for me to sympathize with Danny re:their breakup. I’m not quite sure that’s what Willis was aiming at here… >.>
Probably just showing the evolution of the characters. Dorothy’s finally realizing that maybe she should consider Walky in all of this over her blind ambition and is finally doin’ right by her boy. Unfortunately, that comes at the expense of royally fucking over her previous boy that she hasn’t really treated all that well in their interactions since the breakup (which is, to say, interacting with him at ALL, much less scheming to get his shit up to this point).
Hey, we all gotta start somewhere. And, silver lining: makes it that much easier to torch the feelings Danny has for Dorothy and continue the good thing he has going with Amazi-girl and Amber… the stupid, STUPID man. But, hey, as far as rebounds go… it’s a good one!
True. It probably does rather hurt to be Danny right now, but at least he’s taking this better than he would have say a few days ago. Now Dorothy just needs to stick by her word and stay the heck away from him for a good while, and they’ll both be doin’ good.
Or it could just be showing that it wasn’t ‘her ambition’ that made her dump Danny, but rather his complete lack of…anything that wasn’t her, and his disrespect for her ambitions.
He was hollow, and he’s still got some of that hollowness to him…it’s going to be a long while before he turns into a solid chocolate bunny with peanuts, instead of a hollow one full of air, and yet inexplicable yumminess…
*starts gnawing on Danny’s head*
…
Sorry, got off track, there.
Fair point. Danny… needs to suffer just a little. His life has been, in my guesstimation, just an easy enough one that he’s lacked some of the growth that he would have otherwise (hopefully, anyway) had at this point in his life. For that matter, I feel sympathy for them -both- in this situation. She can’t be the least bit comfortable or happy to be there, and this early in the morning I rather doubt he really wants to have to be dealing with anything related to her, either. She should just take the shoes, and -git-. Only fair for all parties concerned by this point.
Also, nice way to say what you’re fiending for right now. XD
This. All the Dorothy!hate is kind of annoying me. Dorothy was literally the only reason Danny came to this college. He had no aspirations beyond their life together. He didn’t even consider the fact that Dorothy might have plans of her own. He thought that all her dreams and aspirations were just a phase she was going through.
I can see why Dorothy would get more than a bit sick of it.
Walky, by comparison, is not only fun to hang out with, he’s also shown he’s comfortable with how seriously Dorothy’s taking her life (bongoing about her making him study aside). Sure, he might not be a long-term prospect, but he’s good enough to make a few sacrifices for.
The fact he’s now just bursting in with a “NOOOOOO, SAVE YOUR CAREEEER!” kind of proves Dorothy right, here. Dunno if Danny would have done that.
Yeah, I can’t fault Dorothy for dumping Danny. She wants to concentrate on her future in a pretty serious way (and good on her for it), and he’s… following her around like a lost puppy. Okay, they were dating, but… Like, she wants to get into a really good university and become a decent journalist. For reelz, not some blogger or doing the community hall meeting report in a local paper somewhere because no one else will take it. And Danny wants–well, he wants to be with Dorothy. And that’s it, which can be really cloying and irritating (to me, at least, and I imagine to someone like Dorothy as well). What does he want to be when he grows up? With Dorothy. Where does he see himself in five years? With Dorothy. What’s he majoring in in college? Doesn’t matter–he’s there because Dorothy is. If she makes it into Yale, his plan was to quit college and follow her to New Haven. And, um… Be with Dorothy?
For gods’ sakes, he’s barely old enough to buy beer. He needs to have a better plan for his life than “Dorothy”.
I’d have dumped his ass too.
Meh, I can’t fault either of them. They’re what? 17 years old? Danny doesn’t have any plans for his future and it’s okay that he’s not in a hurry to make them whereas Dorothy does and that’s okay too. They just has what was probably their first major breakup and yeah, at that age and life experience level they’re both going to say and do things that are self-centered and inconsiderate, often without meaning too. Actually they’re handling this a long better than most actual 17-year olds I remember. We haven’t seen any attempts to turn friends against the other person or to badmouth one another.
I guess I’m not anti-either, is what I’m saying. Mistakes are going to be made.
“NOOOO!…I mean, look at his feet, he looks like a ballerina, no way we wear the same size.”
No wonder you dumped him.
http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com
http://yeeeeeeeeeeeeeees.com/
Megatron
I get it.
Well played, Willis. Once again, well played. This is one of the reasons that I keep coming back to read this comic.
So Dorothy does the decent thing and choses Walky over work, and still Danny is the injured party? WTH?
Danny set her up and she did not do what ‘..If I know you, that’s no contest at all” knew she would do.
Grats Dorothy, you did good.
Danny, grow up.
With this decision she basically said to Danny that she cares more about a guy that she’s been involved with for about 2 weeks than she does someone she was in a relationship with for 3 years. So yeah poor Danny.
Or maybe she was just thought “Well, I came in here for the shoes. it’d be rude of me to leave my boyfriend high and dry because a better deal came along.” Or maybe Danny’s dick-ish little comment made her feel like she couldn’t choose the story over the shoes, even though they could probably find other shoes and picking the story would be the more practical thing to do. Maybe Danny needs to get over himself.
Ugh, this entire comment section is giving me 500 Days of Summer flashbacks. Dorothy is allowed to choose her career over romance and more importantly she’s also allowed to date someone else while still choosing her career. In fact this “love has to triumph career” mentality is addressed in this very comic. (See comic strips: Muppets and Context. Leslie is disappointed in all of you.) Her relationship with Walky isn’t like her relationship with Danny, in which he clearly liked her way more than she did, which – sorry everyone – is a perfectly legitimate reason to break up with someone. Also, is everyone forgetting that Danny’s not some poor guy who hasn’t done anything since being broken up with? In the time since their break-up, he’s flirted with Amber, almost had sex with Billie, and has become Amazi-Girl’s Lois Lane? Why doesn’t Dorothy get to date someone?
Yeah, it sucks having to be around your ex and their new SO and Mike’s little stunt made this whole situation a lot more awkward and horrible than it needed to be, but Danny was being petty and I’m glad it backfired in his face.
No one is denying Dorothy the right to her own decisions. What she isn’t allowed, however, is to dump a guy who clearly loved her a lot, hook up with a -new- guy less than a week later, and then go and do the opposite of what she did with him. That’s just a cruel thing to do. She can date Walky all she wants – she should just leave Danny alone already… and she should have been honest with him about why she really broke up with him. So no, this isn’t anything like 500 Days of Summer. Those two didn’t even date in that movie, so I’m puzzled that you’re having these flashbacks. The situations are not the same at all. Not even similar.
I don’t understand your argument. You say she can date Walky, but she can’t be nice to him or help him because that’s cruel to Danny? I’m not a die-hard Dotty fan by any means (she actually kind of bores me), and I definitely agree she should be a little more honest about things. (For example, Mike wouldn’t have been able to worsen the situation if she had just gone up to Danny and explained what had happened and asked for the shoes.) That being said, I’m a little tired of everyone crying for poor, woobie Danny (who I actually like most of the time) when he isn’t acting any more mature about this than she is.
Also my bad on that one. I should have clarified that I meant the commentary surrounding the movie and this comic are the same not the actual plot. It’s a lot of angry romantics immediately siding with who ever got dumped without really giving a second thought to the person who did the breaking up because they are clearly evil for not loving someone enough.
Ah, okay. No, I meant she -said- one thing to Danny, and here she is and turning around and doing the opposite of it. That’s where the “WTF, Dorothy” is coming from. Because it kind of is being rather inconsistent with the reasons she gave him. =\ Break up with someone all ya want, but at least, y’know, be completely honest with them as to the why. She kind of left some of her reasons out when she dumped Danny, that’s all.
And yeah, I do get what you mean there, that’s why I got confused for a minute. I think Dorothy had every right to break up with him at any point in time – I just think it’s rather bad of her that she waited so long to do it. No evil here, just someone not thinking it through enough that the sooner the cut happens, the sooner it can cleanly heal. And that happens way too much in reality. =(
No yeah, I can definitely agree on all that. Dorothy’s not perfect, and in my opinion, she shouldn’t have even gone there in the first place. (Personally, I’d be walking down the boy’s hall asking everyone but Danny for shoes.) But I don’t think there’s anything specifically wrong with her asking for the shoes instead of the story in this particular strip. Especially when he specifically set her up in a situation where she’ll look bad if she doesn’t pick the shoes and also because, while Danny doesn’t know it (and I’m not faulting him for what he doesn’t know), Dotty has had some character development since their break-up.
(Also looking back, my first post was kind of angry and I didn’t really clarify nearly as much as I should have on my opinion. People immediately vilifying the breaker-upper is one of those buttons with me me for what I imagine are more or less the same reasons that everyone is sympathizing with Danny.)
Truthfully, I don’t entirely see the inconsistency (she, did, after all, largely account the breakup to his following her around with no regard for his own future, and this isn’t contradicted here), and, furthermore, I’ve never quite been able to convey to someone with 100% consistent accuracy why I was breaking up with them. Maybe some people can, but I’ve not seen very many examples of this. The explanations generally come out as “approximations” or “examples” of the reasons why, and whether the other person is cool with that depends on a lot of things. That’s how Dorothy strikes me, and I can’t really hold that against her.
Also, Danny was specifically trying to set her up to “prove” how little she cared about Walky/keeping promises, so, while other parts of this situation suck for him, I don’t really pity him for how this ultimatum turned on him.
I don’t think it’s to “prove” anything to do with Walky. I think it’s that he wants her to prove herself consistent with what she told -him-, that she values her career over anything to do with a relationship right now. In that way, she did prove her earlier words false – and perhaps you -should- pity him for it. Let’s put you in that situation for a minute. Your ex just went and proved one of the reasons they broke up with you was a load of tosh, and they are in fact now doing the opposite of what they said for the sake of a new relationship. Sucks to be there, doesn’t it?
The reason she gave him wasn’t “I care more about my career.” It was “I’m breaking up with you because you think my desire to go to Yale is just a phase.” (See: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/01-move-in-day/kindness/)
I pity him for being in this awkward situation where she’s trying to get his shoes for her new boyfriend, because that was genuinely kinda enh of her and the situation is pretty awkward for reasons that aren’t his fault. But she DIDN’T misrepresent her reasons for breaking up for him; Danny just misunderstood because that’s how deeply her doesn’t get the importance of her dreams.
Hell, I can even pity him for misunderstanding, cuz I know that breakup must be tough even without realizing that he did something wrong. But her response that that ultimatum? Yeah, he totally had that coming.
She broke up with him because he was clingy – because he was _the kind of person_ who would follow her to her new school. It’s not entirely her fault that what he took away from that was “dumped him to follow her career choice”
Fucking thank you. This needed to be said and its been killing meeeeeee.
How about Danny stops making her responsible for his life? She know what she wants to do with her life and has a solid plan of how to go about doing it; his plan is “be with Dorothy”.
Okay, they dated for a pretty good long time in high school, but that was high school, for crying out loud. Dating someone in high school does not equal spending the rest of your life with them.
One of the things about her relationship with Walky, in contrast to her one with Danny, is that with Walky, she’s hanging out with someone whose company she enjoys. And that’s it. There’s no expectations on either side, so far as I can tell, that this is anything long-term, or anything other than just a fun interlude for each of them.
Danny, however, seems to have wanted to pretty much spend the rest of the foreseeable future with Dorothy, to the exclusion of any other plans. He was really clingy; Walky isn’t. Danny was pretty much making her responsible for his happiness; Walky isn’t.
With this decision all she’s saying is “I came here to see if we can borrow your shoes. Can we?”
Really the shoes? THE SHOES? That’s just…that’s just stupid. Dorothy you can BUY him a pair of shoes! But man this’ll be a bit of a gut punch to the heart for Danny when this sinks in won’t it? It appears that Dorothy always chose her work over him and I guess Dorothy no longer has the luxury of pretending this thing with Walky is casual.
All right I’m not gonna say I don’t sympathize with danny here. Given my romantic history I would be lying.
But seriously? I never got why people hated so much on Danny and I still think hes an overall okay charcter and even yesterday I though: “Ok kinda douchey what he just did there. ” But now seeing WHY he did it…. yeah no more sympathy thats just mean and immature. no matter how bitter I am about past loves and crushes this is just not cool.
And now I see how many typos are in here. Curse you Bolivian keyboards!
On ocassion a computer I am using decides to change the keyboard settings to english (I am from Mexico)… it drives me crazy…
I think my keyboard switches between 3 different settings. I have found the questions at different times in three different places.
Question mark. BRAIN YOU HAVE FAILED ME FOR THE LAST TIME!
The “@” tends to get lost in my case. The one I am using
shows its on the same place as que “q”… but the settings
are different as I have to press 2+Alt Gr to get it -.-
Based on everything we know about the relationship, Dorothy’s mistake wasn’t breaking up with Danny. Dorothy’s mistake was waiting to end a bad thing so long in the first place. She and Danny should have moved on before going to college, simple as that.
Mean and immature? You don’t take my aspirations seriousely, you’re willing to destroy yourself for me, and I just don’t feel the same way anymore are bullshit reasons? those seem like…great reasons to break up with someone. Also…isn’t it kind of Danny’s fault she did that “in front of him”? Should she have basically done what Danny had expected and picked the interview JUST BECAUSE she cares more about her passive agressive ex than her current?I don’t quite get how Dorothy’s the immature one.
The issue that makes her mean and immature is that she A. waited so long, and B. those are still lies. Her real reason for breaking up with him, the one she never bothered to express to him, was that she didn’t feel the same at all and apparently hadn’t for quite some time, and that she really -did- value her career ambitions over anything they had. Ambition is fine. Ambition at the price of other people’s feelings is where the line needs to be drawn, and she waffled and delayed and was a whiny little WUSSY on not drawing it sooner. THAT is the immaturity.
Sorry a teenage girl didn’t just say “Listen man…fuck you. I’m out.” for a relationship she had been in for a while. Do you know what’s hard to do? Break up! Because then people treat you like shit for doing what made you happy.
Exactly. Guys, let’s remember Dorothy is like 18. When you were that age I’m sure in your relationship-ending you would have wanted to spare as many feelings as possible, because no one wants to be the bad guy. I sure as hell know when I was that age I didn’t want to hurt my ex-boyfriend when I dumped him, so I tried to “nice” my way around it. As for the rest of their immaturity- again, they’re 18.
The time is really the big factor. How long exactly had Danny been talking about a shared future? How long exactly did it take Dorothy to fill him in on the fact that her vision of her future didn’t include him?
I don’t know if I’d say that’s mean and immature per se. She certainly seems to be a remarkably poor communicator though, and Danny has definitely been hurt by this.
It’s actually a kind of fun reversal of gender norms. Typically the man’s supposed to be the one who’s all reserved with their feelings while the girl’s an open book.
Frankly, my impression was that she was trying to tell Danny this for a very long time, and he just wasn’t listening in favor of “I’m going to be with Dorothy forever and then we’re going to get married and have a wonderful life!”
I mean, seriously, even Joe picked up that Dorothy wasn’t all that into Danny, and he’s not exactly Captain Cares-a-lot.
That’s because Joe was waitin’ to tap that, so of course he’d care and notice! Just not in the way Danny expected. 😀
Exactly.
I think what Danny (and many commenters)
forget is the fact that Dorothy did not break up with him
becuase of her career. It was because he did not respect her wishes
for a career and did not notice that she was feeling unhappy in the relationship. The one thing that Danny said in the end that triggered the break up was: “Maybe after sometime here you will rethink Yale and stay with me.” As somebody who is constantly accused of eliteism because I apply to Oxford I can really understand how
Dororothy felt in that moment. Because if you want to make a life changing decision I would be nice to have a boyfriend woh actually supports you in it (Walky does make fun about dottys learning and all, but he has never been AGAINST Dottys learning). What caused this is IMO Dany beeing obsessed with “The Plan” (I can’t find the specific strip): Get a girl, study for three years, propose. Yeah sounds a bit like highschool sweatheart dreams. But again I am not gonna judge danny on that because when a relationship falls apart, than there is amlost always somebody, who cannot see the problems and thinks everything is fine. In this case Dotty was the more mature one for ending it. Could she have handled it better? Defenitely. Should she have done it sooner? Totally. But in the end she handled the situation like an adult, trying to make the best of it, trying the remain on goood terms with danny and most importantly, not ripping the social circle apart by still talking with Joe. Danny on the other hand acted exactly like you would expect after having his relationship “thrown in his face”.
For example: he has been sort of an hippocrite with him first hitting on Amber and now “dating” Amazigirl, but still expecting his ex to stay away from dudes. Yes he thinks that its unfair, because she broke up with him becuase she didnt have time for a relationship, but like I said it was more of an issue about not respecting her life decisions.
In the end the break up and the eventual fallout we have seen so far was just the classic post highschool break up which is saidly so common: Both have a plan of where they and/or the relationship should go, but they realise that their plans differ so far, that there is no way to make it work.
My issue with todays strip is that Danny goes here from beeing jelous of Walky and bitter about the break up to downright manipulative and actively trying to torpedo Dottys new relationship. First their was the thing about: “You are not allowed to sleep with him until time X”. Now we have: “Im gonna test wether you love him more than me”. Sriously is there ANY other reason for danny doing this? Like i said being bitter is ok, beeing jelous is ok, for the first month after a break up you are allowed some priviliges. But this goes just a bit to far in ways to be a jerk to your ex.
Wow I think this is my longest comment on the internet ever.
Thank you, this is exactly right. She didn’t choose Yale over him. He just simplifies that as her reasons because he doesn’t really get what her goals mean to her (or that he was being inconsiderate of that).
Joe may not be Captain Cares-a-lot but he was more removed from the situation than either of them and observant enough to notice that Danny was the only one talking about this future of theirs.
Danny’s not a mind reader. Dorothy may have “tried to tell him” but it certainly doesn’t sound as if she ever spelled it out in plain English. When she had the talk with him about what would happen when she moves on to the next school it certainly didn’t sound as if this was a conversation they’d had before.
I’m not really sure where you’re getting the idea that Dorothy never tried to “spell it out in plain English.” When she DID try to spell it out for him, he willfully misinterpreted everything she said. Even if Dorothy had been trying to have these conversations with Danny for the past 3 years, he would have responded EXACTLY the way he did, because that’s just the way he is.
I suppose we can’t “technically” know whether this was a repeating conversation unless Willis provides some backstory, but I identify with Dorothy to some degree, because I’ve also had dudes who were so enthusiastic about keeping up the relationship that they didn’t pay any attention to what I wanted, or developing their own life.
Furthermore, Dorothy was never choosing Yale over her love for Danny. She was choosing her dreams over someone who thought said dreams were SO unimportant that he couldn’t even conceive of taking an interest in them. He simplifies her reasons for breaking up as “she chose Yale over me” because he doesn’t really understand or care about what’s important to her.
Is he the epitome of evil? No, but he’s not nearly as considerate or interested in Dorothy’s life as he thinks.
I do not feel that your third or fourth paragraph are in any way related to anything I’ve said. I suspect there has been a miscommunication. I am neither villifying Dorothy nor am I advocating Danny. They’re both just young people who could stand to learn to be a bit more functional in a relationship.
That being said I do not feel that there is anything to indicate that Danny was being willfully ignorant. I think that if when Danny had first started talking about a future together Dorothy had responded with “Whoa, I don’t know where all this talk is coming from but I’m not with you on that” then he would have been less inclined to proceed as if they were both planning on spending their lives together.
Don’t know why, but it’s not letting me reply to your most recent comment. in any case, the last two paragraphs were partly responding to the idea that Danny had to be a mindreader to figure out why Dorothy was disinterest, and partly a response to the general sorts of accusations Dorothy has been getting.
The way I see it, Dorothy didn’t break up with Danny earlier because she still cared about him a lot and couldn’t specifically find a reason to dump him (http://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/01-move-in-day/answer/). Then she asked to talk to him, bringing up for the second time in the story that she was concerned about him following her around (first time: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/01-move-in-day/together/ ; second time: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/01-move-in-day/worry/)
In the next strip, he suggests that maybe she’ll just get over her desire to go to Yale, and she gives him a hurt, indignant look (which he doesn’t notice) and dumps him. In the following strip, she yells at him that wanting to go to Yale isn’t just a phase. He proceeds to interpret this as her thinking that Yale is more important than he is, rather than her being hurt and bewildered that someone she’s dated for three years could think so little of the things she valued.
Was this in plain English? Maybe not, but I can’t see how she was hiding anything from Danny. She may not have handled the shoes thing all that well, but I don’t think she could have done much better with that breakup. Not all communication is in words, and I think Danny just wasn’t paying attention.
Yeah, certainly she did “Try to tell him”. Oh, Danny, I worry about you and how you’ll have to spend some time without me once I transfer to another school. I think you should have your own dreams and ambitions. So on and so forth. She danced around the issue. She never went and actually touched the core of it.
Yes, not all communication is verbal but it certainly helps to say the words aloud, especially if somebody doesn’t seem to be getting you “subtle cues”. Danny, this committed longterm relationship you think we’re in. It doesn’t exist. I am fond of you but when I picture myself in that oval office you are not there.
Whether or not Danny was paying attention is irrelevant. Yes, the fact that this relationship didn’t work out was contributed to in equal parts by both involved parties. Danny should have made fewer assumptions. Danny should have respected his partner and her aspirations more. Danny should have taken an active interest in discovering his partner’s feelings on important subjects like the very nature of their relationship.
But back to my original point, she’s not meanspirited and I don’t think she’s immature for where she is in life, rather she has hurt Danny through her communicational failings within the context of their relationship. Danny was an open book. She didn’t have to solve any riddles to figure out how he felt about their relationship or how he pictured his future. She could have stood be more open about these things and leave less room for misunderstandings.
I guess I’m just confused by the notion that she’s being a bad communicator. I mean, literally EVERYONE else around Danny was telling him that the relationship would probably be ending pretty soon. She brought up, multiple times, the fact that she was concerned with the fact that he was following her around and shouldn’t he think of his own goals and dreams.
At what point does it stop being Dorothy’s responsibility to MAKE Danny understand? She wasn’t lying when she said she was worried about what Danny was going to do when she started pursuing her own dreams. She loved him, and she wanted him to pursue his own dreams. That was the point she wanted to convey to him, and I think it got across.
The problem was, Danny was only half listening. He only heard the “I love you,” not the “I want you to pursue your own dreams.: That didn’t get railed through his thick skull until he did something that made Dorothy realize that he REALLY didn’t get her.
There are situations in which one person is a bad listener and the other is a bad communicator, but I REALLY don’t think this is one of them. One shouldn’t need to take a hostile tone, or say things they don’t mean in order to get their point across.
Dorothy held no responsibility to Danny ever. However relationship problems are easier to solve if everybody is aware of the problem and a good way to make people aware of the problem is to state the problem explicitly using words.
“I want you to pursue your own dreams” was still itself only a piece of the landscape surrounding the problem. You can keep talking about the surroundings all day hoping that they’ll fill in the blank, but it’s much more helpful to just say what’s wrong.
I don’t even know if it’s accurate to say that Dorothy didn’t see Danny in her future, just that she didn’t see a shiftless puppy dog following her around in her future. She did, as she said, still care deeply for him, and I can see worry/distaste over his lack of ambition being the major issue for her.
I think he wouldn’t seem quite so much the shiftless puppy dog if she was similarly intent on spending her life with him. Dorothy definitely cared for Danny and still does, but she never planned on spending her life with him and that wouldn’t have changed if he’d picked up his own goals and ambitions nor would picking up ambitions have successfully brought him onto her wavelength since he’d still be working as if his ambitions were to be planned and worked around his partner and she’d still be working as if she could drop him like a sack of potatoes at any given moment. They did not view their relationship the same way in this regard.
To say she didn’t plan on spending her life with him is I hope obviously not to say she didn’t and doesn’t care for him. I’d venture to say she loved and still loves him. There are a lot of different kinds of love that can manifest in a lot of different ways, hers didn’t and quite possibly never will involve compromising her life, ambitions, and independence.
I don’t feel NEARLY as confident as you that Dorothy never saw that life of hers involving Danny; I think it’s very likely that this is something that slowly built up when she realized he was intent on following her to college. I can agree that it’s rather unfortunate/arguably wrong of her not to dump him as soon as it became clear he was doing this, but I can also imagine that being difficult, both because the relationship had been going on for a while, and because it’s hard to communicate with someone who isn’t paying attention.
I’m not really blaming Danny for the breakup; breakups are just things that happen through no fault of anyone involved. But I think it’s a stretch to say that this demonstrates Dorothy’s poor communication skills, rather than Danny’s poor listening skills. Dorothy’s communication skills seem pretty average to me, and she’ll be able to function normally if she communicates at the level she did to Danny. Danny will implode if he starts paying as little attention to the rest of the world as he did to Dorothy; he would only be able to communicate with people with INCREDIBLE communication skills.
That’s an interesting way to put it. Average communications skills. Probably pretty accurate within most contexts. Even within the context of a romantic relationship I guess she’s still average. I’m just not so confident that average communication is sufficient for such an endeavour. When you’re dealing with such complex and personal issues I think you probably need a bit better than average to make it work. Everybody has their little blind spots especially when they’re so closely involved with the issue. The average communication that’s sufficient when discussing the latest lecture doesn’t really cut it when you’re trying to explain to your partner why and how what you want out of the relationship is fundamentally different from what they’re offering.
I’m an average mathematician, which is to say that if I wanted to get into physics I’d need to improve. Romance has rather high demands in the communication department.
She’s also communicating just fine with Walky. 😛
I maintain that she isn’t lacking anything in communication skills; Danny was just exceptionally hard to communicate with. Romance shouldn’t be reserved for “experts” in communication.
More specifically, you seem to be saying that Danny listened as well as any person would in a relationship, and Dorothy communicated far below what most people do in relationships.
That, to me, is absurd.
Oh, no. Definitely not that. Patently absurd.
Is she communicating just fine with Walky though? Last time they had a disagreement about what was going on with their relationship she dodged around the issue and moved on to more fun topics. It only even got close to being addressed to to the involvement of a third party. Not exactly ideal.
*due to the involvement
Okay – that I can agree with. She and Walky specifically agrred on a just-for-fun, short-term relationship, and I think they communicate as well as I would expect in that context.
True enough. Maintenance isn’t so much an issue with a short-term engagement. Communication is also more difficult with somebody you’ve only known for a handful of weeks. Nobody’s getting hurt here. I just wouldn’t use their relationship as an counter-example to how her communication skills were insufficient to the needs of her relationship with Danny.
Fair; my point is more that her skills were insufficient for that relationship, because anyone’s would be with the way Danny was acting, not because she lacks the skills for a serious commitment.
Danny was a little bit dense and wasn’t actively on the lookout for the problem. It was hardly an insurmountable obstacle and hardly an obstacle that you can reasonably expect never to encounter over the course of a long term committed relationship. She did as well as most would have done at her point in life, but to state her problems orally isn’t exactly god-tier communication.
I don’t know where people are getting the idea that Dotty dumped Danny for her career. She dumped him because he was unambitious and decided to follow his girlfriend around to college instead of following something for him. Do you know how unattractive it must seem, for a woman so single-mindedly focused and ambitious, always planning and preparing for her dreams, when she realizes her boyfriend is a spineless, dopey, “Oh, I just want to go where you go honey, being with you is more important then anything else.” That would repulse her. She likes Walky because he’s his own purpose, He doesn’t want to complete her, he wants to be his own person with her, preferably while watching cartoons. And all top of all that he insulted her by saying that if he stayed with her long enough, she would forget about wanting to go to Yale, and want to start a happy family with him. That must of cut her deep. That Danny thinks so little of all her planning and work, that she would just give it up for a relationship. Enough with the “She gave up Danny to focus on her career” “Bullshit. And Danny is not a sympathetic character.
^this.
Danny chose Dorothy over everything.
Walky chose pajama jeans over Dorothy.
No, Walky chose to walk away from a girl who delivered a relationship ultimatum over pajama jeans.
Wow, my whole point summarized in about half the amount of words. I salute you sir/maam!
Yeah, I see it that way. I never hated Danny he’s a good guy and a fun character and Dorothy is a decent character too, I don’t think her relationship with Danny should have lasted that long. He was too clingy and serious for her when she wanted fun and low maintanence. They just weren’t right for eachother and she made a mistake staying with him that long and not making it clear he was smothering her and trying to move into serious territory she did not want in a high school/ college relationship.
I can get behind this line of thought. They’re both decent characters, they both made mistakes in the relationship. To try and pin the blame on just one or the other the way I’m seeing some people still do here? Pfeh. Grow up folks, if you can’t have sympathy for both of them (got to suck for Dorothy to even have to be -standing- there, for example), I think you need to re-examine your humanity, because I find it severely lacking. 😛
^this 2: electric boogaloo. I know I’m contradicting my last this…but I’m more this than my last this.
Hierarchy of “this ^”.
I think we need a pie chart.
When you say something that mean spirited about a fictional girl, it kinda makes all your arguments kinda invalid…
Don’t be silly. I don’t white knight anyone. I just try to talk people out of hating characters that are decent people.
What if I say mean-spirited things about Cruella DeVille? Is that okay?
Cartoons and comics like this are supposed to imitate real life or events, so who knows? Maybe this same kind of scenario might be happening someplace, and you would, by insulting the character, essentially be insulting the person they’re unintentionally portraying.
I think that’s the point. Danny is extremely bright, academically. We’ve been given this information. He is awesome at computer science, but no because he wanted to be good enough to follow Dorothy, we don’t have evidence of that yet. For now the safest assumption is that he is good with computers out of his own love and interest. Dorothy doesn’t think Danny isn’t smart, she thinks he’s wishy-washy. He could have gone to a school, that could have helped him with that career path. But instead, he decided just to give hat up and follow Dorothy along because love. This school does not have the programs and classes he need, but he chose it to be with his friends and his girlfriend. Which is admirable to some. But to Dorothy that would be a highly unattractive trait. He knew he was good at something, he knew he could further himself, he had potential, and he put it on a back burner. We know from the Miss Piggy comic that that is something Dorothy does not believe a partner should do. She would have had way more respect for Danny if he went to pursue more training in his field.
And it’s not that Walky is so ambitious and focused, it’s that he doesn’t want to stop her, distract her or slow her down. And he isn’t so spineless as to be constantly attempting to change his path to fit hers. He’s going to do his own thing, and if Dorothy wants to do it with him that’s cool. She respects that, There’s the difference.
There’s no indication that Dorothy respects Walky’s independence; in the short time she’s known him she’s attempted to change his clothes and his study habits. We also know he isn’t after him for his brains or potential.
There’s some evidence that him throwing the monkey toy at her head made her think fondly of him, god knows why, but as far as I can recall the only reason that she’s actually given for liking him is his caramel abs.
Danny, on the other hand, is sadly deficient in caramel.
Hey, Danny, remember that part in Pride and Prejudice where Miss Bingley basically dogs Mr. Darcy as he suffers in silence, until she forces from him that Elizabeth is the loveliest woman he knows, and she’s the only one that fact hurts?
No, because that would make you a nerd? I hate you Danny.
Anyways, no matter what you think of her actions, Dorothy is over you: you can be a (laughably predictable) moron about it, or you can sever and move on with your new girlfriend who might be a superhero. Don’t strain yourself thinking about this one.
I find it intriguing the contrast between walky and danny in this storyline.
Danny, you see, probably would have LEAPT at Dorothy giving up her career for him. That’s what he wanted her to, and essentially the reason why they broke up.
Walky actually wants her to pursue her dreams and be her own person. He just likes spending time with her, on top of that.
Walky is so much cooler than danny.
No no, Walky has a goal. His goal is to goof off.
There’s a lot of similarities between walky and danny, they’re both intelligent and have a lot of potential.
The difference is this. Danny is dependent on other people. He wraps himself around other people, and bases his plans to fit his relationship with them.
Walky likes other people, but he’s going to do his own thing. And he wants other people to do THEIR own thing.
It’s an attitude thing. In effect, Danny is an incredibly codependent personality type, while walky is very independent. The latter suits Dorothy more, for the time being.
My ex-girlfriend, who was two years ahead of me in college, decided on her own to stay in town after she’d graduated so we could continue to stay together, and then resented me for her putting her career on hold for our relationship, when I had never asked or wanted her to do that.
These things build up over time. Dorothy made the right decision- and anybody who’s broken up with someone, especially someone so dependent, knows that it can be very hard to do.
Danny sympathy taking a nosedive (though to be fair it started going down earlier this week). Believe it or not, Danny, even if you are letting them borrow your shoes you are still managing to be a jerk AND failing to simulate self-respect.
I’ll laugh when Amber and Amazi-Girl both realize what a tool you are.
Considering they’re the same person, I take this as an OUCH.
This comment section today…egh. I wanted to come down here and make a comment about how interesting it was that this page showed how in young relationships, people don’t often understand each other fully (how Danny never caught on to the real reason he was dumped, despite being so close to her, ect.) but then I read about a lot of people seemingly projecting onto this page and…just egh. Keep in mind these people are still quite young and naive.
Are we to blame Danny because he’s naive and tried to follow his dream girl to college (despite signs she wasn’t interested and while hoping she’d ditch her career plans for him eventually)? Not at all. He’s still learning. Dottie was the first great love of his life (in his opinion). Things like this happen when you’re new to relationships.
Are we to blame Dottie for not telling her boyfriend why she really brow up with him, trying to soften the blow for his sake, and then awkwardly asking her ex for something before enough time had passed? Not at all. She’s young and has yet to have enough long term boyfriends to learn how to properly treat a break up. She thought lying to Danny about why they broke up would be the right thing to do. It’s naive and perfectly what young people do all the time.
These are fictional characters, and they’re not perfect. That doesn’t mean either of them (in this case Dottie) are jerks. They’re just naive, very young kids who haven’t had enough relationship experience to know better.
Your comment is 100% on. It’s frustrating to see all the hate on both sides, although most can back up their arguments well. I see this is a real character building moment for Dorothy, Danny, and Walky all three. I’m glad that things are getting out in the open, and I hope they can all move on from this.
Also – go Walky! Support her ambitions and realize the bigger picture! Go Dorothy! Stay principled and keep your promises! Go Danny! Have self-respect!
Best comment today hands down. Just because I side with Dotty in this case I still believe that the whole conflict is often blown out of proportion in the comment section. Its just two teenagers after the end of their first big romance. They are entitled to doing a lot of things that could be considered jerky.
Ouch.
That must really hurt for Danny.
She’ll toss him to the curb for her ambitions, but the new dork she’ll take a career detour for.
Ouch.
I don’t blame Danny for being angry at Dorothy, I would be too. This may not necessarily have been the best way to handle his anger, but I think people are way too hard on him. Keep in mind they were together for years, and out of the blue (from his perspective) she dumps him. I don’t know anyone who wouldn’t be at least a little upset.
What many seem to be forgetting here in their “DANNY IS A JERKBUTT” rampage is simply this: He’s still hurt about the whole thing.
Wait, what? People are still allowed to feel hurt after being dumped so spectacularly as he was? GASP! THE HUMANITY! THE SHEER HORROR! How DARE Danny have anything resembling a basic human emotion?! The fact that Dorothy is here asking for his shit for her NEW boyfriend is probably not helping him get over that at all. If anything, it’s probably making bitter feelings resurface.
If you want to read about emotionless automatons always making the right choices, there’s plenty of webcomics out there to suit you. The most awesome thing about this one, in my opinion, is that there is no “right” or “wrong”. All the characters are human. They all make mistakes. They all face moral dilemmas and occasionally act dickish despite being fairly nice people the rest of the time (and believe me, I’ve met people like that. They’re not rare. It’s this little thing called “behavior modulation”, where you can pick how you act to different people. If you act the same way to everybody, you’re an idiot).
I’m not saying Dorothy is in the wrong here. Quite the contrary. You are allowed to live your life as you see fit, and hook up with whoever you damn well please.
Just don’t expect your ex-boyfriend to be completely supportive about it.
“You are allowed to live your life as you see fit, and hook up with whoever you damn well please.
Just don’t expect your ex-boyfriend to be completely supportive about it.”
I wish more people understood this. Granted, it’s a hard lesson to learn on both sides.
Aye, I am reminded of a line that stuck with me from Hemingway’s “The Short, Happy Life of Francis Macomber.” Yes, the wife in that story was a cheating harpy. Yes, the husband in that story was an emotionally spineless ass who needed to do a lot of growing up. But it wasn’t simply just one person sticking the knife in the other–it was both. Therefore, “The way they were now was not any *one* person’s fault.”
It’s the same way here. I understand Danny very well. I don’t have a lot of sympathy for Dorothy since she could’ve avoided all this and really is twisting the knife in Danny, but she’s doing right by Walky. And THAT is really necessary considering how her DEFAULT inclination was already before shown to be to deny him–which Mike exposed her on too. Shows their relationship was pretty fucked up, but, remember, it takes two to tango there during their relationship. And now this.
The way things were between them in their relationship was not any *one* person’s fault. Dorothy’s still a bongo for bringing this to Danny’s doorstep, but… well… we wouldn’t have this storyline if Dorothy actually abided by what she previously said. I see their interaction here as a plot device rather than something I really think Dorothy would do. We needed some spice to happen. That may just be me, though.
Exactly. It takes two to tango, as they say. But on the Internet, apparently only one person can be responsible for what’s going on. The current situation happened because of both their actions (and Mike’s jerkiness. But he’s kind of like a natural disaster, so, you know, no real blame there), yet people insist on blaming one or the other.
Holy crap, I thought this was going to end totally different
You mean with jetpacks or something?
Dumbing of Age directed by Michael Bay
“You mean with jetpacks or something?”
Oh, I like the cut of your jib.
I guess she was full of shit after all.
“Full of shit” is too strong of a phrase. All of these characters are frustrating in some way or another, but they’re flawed like real human beings are. I just hope that Dorothy understands now that being dishonest with Danny was a mistake, and Danny understands why Dorothy left him and can move on.
The problem is that it’s awfully had to completely move on if your ex won’t go away. Dorothy’s promise to leave him alone lasted exactly as long as it took for him to have something she wanted.
Agreed. Breakups are always painful events (for me anyway) and I always put some serious distance between myself and my ex.
…are you arguing with yourself?
Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight!
And I won! Take that me!! 🙂
In all seriousness I was just having second thoughts.
I knew you’d win. You didn’t have a chance.
Then let them date her? It doesn’t feel good to know that you’re expected to date someone just because another girl is attracted to them. Especially when the implicit criticism is that you must be weak, in want of reassurance and stability, because you’re female.
Would you give that advice to your daughter? She tells you she doesn’t feel it’s working out, she’s not really having any fun; all he does is copy her and follow along. You tell her, well at least he’s very dedicated? It may be true in that the relationship’s stable, but it’s not going to make her feel any better about the rather vapid nature of it.
I fail to see how Danny’s the bad guy here. He doesn’t owe her anything, except perhaps directions to the door. He certainly doesn’t owe her a leg-up for her career at the expense of his current relationship.
I fail to see how anyone’s the bad guy. Noone has a bowler hat or Curly-Q moustache and has yet to tie a damsel to the railroad tracks.
That’s Monday. Gilligan Cut to Danny placing Walky on the railroad tracks and Walky’s petticoats all ruffled and dirty. Tophat Danny twirls his mustache as he tries to getaway with his own shoes. Dorothy-dressed-as-a-Mountie does her best to save Walky from the oncoming train and Amazi-girl thinks she stepped into the wrong genre.
THIS NEEDS A STORYLINE. NOW.
Never said anybody was. I was mostly responding to the folks talking about how “horribly” Danny is treating Dorothy right now.
I think if he’d just said that she couldn’t have the shoes, then people’ll’d think more kindly of him. Assuming that it would be at the expense of his current relationship, that he’s prepared to spend his current relationship in order to damage hers, (she can have the shoes or the interview – if she has the interview they both lose,) isn’t a very nice thing to do to Amazi-girl.
Though, I can understand that it probably feels really horrible for him, her having come up and asked him like that. And he’s probably just grabbing at anything to try to salvage some self-esteem. Dorothy shouldn’t have done what she did either.
I’m not very sympathetic towards Danny right now. I was, until he tried this stunt. He deserved to get jerked up short like that, especially seeing as he’s pursuing Amazi-Girl right now.
Welp, I didn’t call this! Well played, Willis.
Poor Danny. You will be forced to realize that Dorothy was simply sick of you, personally. It wasn’t her work or her ambition; it wasn’t that she was leaving; she just thought you were a simpering ass. There will be no escaping the reality.
Reading these comments are frustrating. Everyone’s complaining about Dotty being the “bad guy” or Danny being the “bad guy”. NOONE is the bad guy!
Two people dated
One wanted to break up because the other was being too clingy and disrespectful of her goals, not purposely mind you.
Then she asks a favor of him. I know it may be hard for him but when you know a person for 3 years, funny thing is, they’re still kinda your friend, at some level. You just don’t want to clash genitalia anytime soon.
The guy still feels hurt but is a nice guy so he’s still willing to do one favor for her. It doesn’t make him a doormat. THEY KNEW EACH OTHER FOR A LOOOONG TIME. Sometimes being a big man is not being petty and cutting off someone you’ve known because they broke up with you. She stated her case and he can UNDERSTAND why she did it. I know it hurts but…cutting people out of your life completely will only be inconvenient for you in the long run since they pretty much live a few feet from each other.
I digress, Dotty’s not some mean girl who “doesn’t care about Danny”. She just felt he didn’t respect her goals and was too clingy, unlike Walky.
Danny’s hurt but still nice enough to help her out. Does he have liscense to be snarky? not really, but it’s understandable. he’s only human.
Why must everyone feel it’s necessary to have a “villain”. LIFE ISN’T BLACK AND WHITE, SOMETIMES PEOPLE ARE JUST PEOPLE AND THEY DO PEOPLE THINGS AND THERE’S NO VILLAIN AND THEN THEY MOVE ON WITH THEIR LIVES.
Sometimes I think that Willis writes characters with real emotional depth just so that internet know-it-alls have something to argue about.
I would ask you to marry me for this if I wasn’t absolutely sure we’d end up having a divorce over who ate the last cookie.
JUST CONFESS TO IT ALREADY DAGNABBIT WE BOTH KNOW IT WAS YOU
I thought I was the one who loved Yotomoe.
I don’t care if you like me!
Tsundere
You’re mostly right, except Danny doesn’t understand why she dumped him. He thought, and I quote: “Dorothy says she can’t have a boyfriend because she’s going to be moving soon to another school”. He presumably latched on to this part of the explanation because it was a reason he couldn’t argue against and thus could let it lie.
He hasn’t cottoned onto the fact that she just doesn’t like him anymore. Him, personally. He’s not good enough for her – despite the fact that (as Danny sees it) her standards are evidently quite low.
If Danny understood Dorothy’s real reasons for dumping him, this conversation would have played out quite differently.
“Then she asks a favor of him.”
She was originally going to try to have her new boyfriend steal the shoes.
She does have a devious streak. This comic shows it is (of course) not absolute, but she does have some very bad attitudes toward respecting others. It’s subtle, and tempered with over all concern, but it is definitely there, and it gets exasperated by what I suspect if a ‘know-it-all’ attitude she has.
While I don’t agree with what you’re saying I will fight to the death for your right to say it.
Agreed.
This only confirms my earlier feelings from about a week ago. Dorothy needs to STAY AWAY from Danny.
To be fair, he needs to tell her this as well.
Wow, I’m amazed by all the spiteful bickering in the comments section today. Dave usually moderates that stuff a bit more.
Is everyone missing the joke?
“NOOOOOOOOOOOO”
Apparently so. Dotty/Walky shippers seem to be missing that Walky doesn’t know or care about the shoes vs interview dilemma. He just thinks they’re having sex in there.
Danny just has the most boring pillow talk ever.
It looked to me like all Mike did was make Walky listen at the door. Walky probably does know what’s going on, although it’ll be awkward if he tries to explain why he was listening.
Well, that’s usually a bad combination. Need a shoulder?
Jeez Walky, with a NO like that I thought you killed your pregnant wife or something.
“Now Dorothy, you choose the blue shoe or the red shoe?”
That’s how I enter rooms from now on.
Hah! Eat it Danny, you petty douche. 😀