It’s a bit of an unfortunate misunderstanding here. Joyce is likely feeling betrayed due to her history of people trying to take advantage of her through alcohol. While Joe likely didn’t trust himself not to take advantage of Joyce if he was drunk.
Also her history of her church, family, and broader community lying to her. Girl finally meets people she can be honest with, makes herself vulnerable to Joe, and gets deceived again. Oof. Can’t blame her for being mad here.
Well, my reading is that he didn’t want to be pressured into drinking by a very obviously drunk Joyce. Could have been handled better? Maybe, but certainly not something worth breaking up about.
It also seems like he didn’t take advantage of her while she was drunk, but as Bluesnake pointed above, Joyce has a trauma of specifically being taken advantage of while intoxicated (roofied) and the other guy was not. I still don’t think Joe is entirely wrong there, maybe he should have said beforehand that he didn’t intend or want to drink, but Joyce’s kneejerk reaction makes sense in her context.
It’s basically a terrible misunderstanding from failure to communicate, which is basically what all the characters do.
Forget the others — I think Joe was even just worried about his own behavior if he loosened his inhibitions.
NOT meaning to imply anything malicious, just that Joe has been the one showing more restraint this whole relationship, and is likely worried about scaring Joyce like he scared Liz — too much, too fast and all that.
Lying about being drunk wasn’t the right move either, and I think we’re gonna get a conversation with Joyce about trust here in a sec. Does Joe know about Joyce’s experience getting roofied?
Doubt it. Joyce’s friend group was fairly small at that point – her, Dorothy, Sarah, Walky, Sal. Others were brought “in the know” as was necessary, and Joe was being pretty misogynistic at that point. They just had previously had the date where Mike punched him a lot.
And since when Joyce learned to be OK being alone in large crowded areas, it hasn’t had a reason to be shared with others. Literally the only person who was in the know, knew that Joe was more than just a sleezeball, and would consider sharing something like that, is Joyce herself. And she just wanted to ignore it
Though unless she went into more detail off panel, he doesn’t know that it involved getting roofied by a sober guy at a party. There’s nothing in particular to connect it to last night if all he knows is what she said then.
^ Oh, also, Billie (now Jennifer). Can’t forget her. At that point, Joyce was Billie’s best friend, and Billie was Joyce’s best Christian friend. The horror!!
i don’t think he ever had to be drunk to hookup with girls but i can imagine him saying stuff he might regret or woujld wanna talk about it sober liek “i don’t wanna rush into sex”
We actually don’t know what would have happened if he didn’t drink and was honest about it, we can only assume and so can he because he chose to lie rather than trust Joyce and find out what she’d say/think.
At least in this case, I don’t think she did it to intentionally screw anything up. I don’t think she’d have any reason to think Joyce would be upset at her boyfriend for NOT getting drunk. Because that’d be a weird thing to be upset about. Only the lying part is really upset-worthy. Plus, Sarah being Sarah, I could see her being hyper-aware of if Joe is drunk or not precisely to make sure no drunk touching happens between him and Joyce.
She demonstrates mad superpowers here being able to speak clearly with mouth full of brush and paste. With this ability she could easily attract a better love interest.
I’d like to take this moment to remind everyone that 3 page ago Joe stated that he was 250 pounds and Joyce just threw him off of her like it was nothing
I was just watching an episode of “The Simpsons.” It was one of the ones with the joke where Mr. Burns is comically strong and agile. And also one of the ones with the joke where Mr. Burns is comically weak and immobile. As is common for an episode heavily featuring Mr. Burns, these jokes were placed within seconds of each other. Repeatedly.
He’s so ill and infirm that he pretty much has every known illness, and some unknown ones.
However, the side effects of any one given illness, end up partially treating a different illness, so his body cannot obey the instinct to die, because he is such a well-balanced ecosystem of maladies.
Thus, he is unnaturally spry for a decrepit ghoul, which is still incredibly weak and infirm, overall. But, due to his terrible health, he is unfortunately a functionally immortal creature.
I didn’t just come up with this, this is the in-universe explanation that i’m recalling.
So, the current rules as of 10th edition 40K have a sequence of rolls to see if an attack does its damage. First you roll to see if you hit, then you roll to see if the hits penetrated the target’s armour, then the target rolls a saving throw to see if they shrugged it off. Certain units and abilities will alter targets’ saves, and some units will counter that by having an Invulnerable Save that can’t be tweaked that you can choose to use instead. In this case, that means that if you roll a 5 or 6 on 1d6, no damage for you.
Remember when Hank Hill tried to train Bobby to “explode” out from under a wet carpet? Some people have naturally explosive power, even in relation to their size and bodyweight. Joyce might be cut out for wrestling like Bobby wasn’t.
Are you suggesting Joyce is an alien abductee in Dumbing of Age as well? Is this where we learn the last ten years were all an elaborate prologue to an It’s Walky reboot?
I can see both sides. The only “correct” choice would involve having an honest and up-front conversation about why he wanted to be sober and Joyce understanding his reasoning.
Thanks to Sarah I think we are about to have that conversation. Joe can share how worried he is to maintain 100% respect for Joyce at all times and to be deserving of her attention. It’s time for Sarah to cut him some slack.
On the flip side, coercing someone to drink who doesn’t want to drink is a damned sight more wrong then lying about drinking the drink that was forced on him.
This is true. I feel like the General Concept today is to only observe one character’s (incredibly minor) misbehavior and frame it as somebody being The Bad Guy™, but it’s seriously just a brief and uncomfortable blip that seems like it’s about to get addressed directly anyway. It’s a teenage booze party, y’all. It’s gonna be sloppy and not fit into neat little categories of Good VS Slightly Less Good.
Joe used to say boozeahol is a lubricant what facilitates threesomes, or some words to that effect, in front of Joyce. Even though he has never actually been in a threesome and most of that sex-haver personality he used to have wasn’t real, but a kind of performative masculinity. But, he’s the one of the 20 or so main characters here who’s seriously deliberately earnestly working to change who he is, and it doesn’t even have to do with seducing Joyce, he’s doing it for himself, cause ever since the “Do” list debacle he’s started thinking about how the things he does matter (even if Joyce is the one who told him that).
I’m actually much more interested in the fact that in this situation where Joe was heavily pressured to drink, he didn’t, than I am in the drama of this deceit. It tells us how badly he wants to be a better person than the one he was at the beginning of the year.
Which, all things considered? I’m not saying that Joe was right to be cagey about his concerns, but, I also refuse to believe him trying to have that conversation with Joyce while she was already impaired would have gone well! At best, she pressures him into doing the thing he’s uncomfortable doing, and at worst, she just gets super mad at him because she’s been drunk twice and doesn’t have practice at managing emotions while impaired.
You definitely hear about that happening sometimes, but lofted beds were absolutely the standard at my university. There’s not a ton of space in a dorm room, and a lofted bed gives you a place to have a desk underneath it.
Didn’t hear of a single instance of anyone falling out of their loft bed when I lived in the dorms. Loft beds are pretty common because they free up a lot of floor space.
Also who was saying there’s no loft beds in the comic? We’ve seen them numerous times over the years.
It’s pretty common for people to think they’re bunk beds instead of loft beds though. I think they just see one bed up high and attach the idea of bunk beds to that.
Your entire space is one small room that you share with another person. Elevating the beds means you get to use that floor space twice. I kept my chair and my dresser under my bed.
In my college days, the lofts were generally not part of the official furnishings, there was a small industry of students who were graduating [or leaving the dorm anyway] selling their lofts to incoming students.
You had to pay to get the loft installed before the start of the school year, but it didn’t cost a lot extra. My parents saw the option filling out the forms, and did not begrudge the extra cost–they said they thought it was a good idea and they’d get it if I wanted. I had one all four years.
Yep, which I believe they’re calling lofted beds, which instinctively makes sense as elevated beds.
I’d call them captain beds because that’s what the ones like that, which have often had built in/modular pull-out desks/clothes storage underneath, were called (looks like they’re either that or high sleepers in the UK).
The point of that comment was that a lot of the characters have lofted beds, which means there’s not a bed directly under them. This was about someone being in the bunk right below AG, I believe, when she was in Dorothy’s bed, but there’s not a bunk under Dorothy’s bed. There’s a desk.
Wasn’t there a comic page forever ago where Sarah or someone wakes up to Joyce wide smiling and peering down at her and saying good morning its time to go to church?
The loft beds come free with the room rental. (Insert aside here about USA schools being a real estate scam.) But as we have seen with Dina’s giant plush dinosaur bed, you’re allowed to put in your own furniture, probably as far as your roommate agrees. There could be people who get bunk beds to free up a little more floor space. Just gotta fight over who gets the top bunk.
In my college experience, the dorm beds could be configured in different ways, including as bunk beds. However, I wouldn’t say a bunk bed would free up more floor space, unless you’re talking about having a wider open area. Having two lofted beds with space for things, like a desk, under each of them would give more space.
I agree with the not drinking. It’s the pretending to sip from the empty cup that gets me. For some reason, it feels way worse than if he had just secretly filled his cup with water in the bathroom and let Joyce assume it was liquor.
Maybe it seems worse because feels like more of a direct deception rather than a lie by omission? Though I don’t necessarily understand why that feels better when rationally a lie by omission seems equivalent to a direct one.
Or maybe the idea of filling the cup with water seems better because it seems to respect Joyce more? I mean I know Joyce is much shorter than Joe so if he just holds the cup up she would never be able to see inside, but it still seems like such a weak ploy that it appears almost cruel to pull. Joe doesn’t seem to think Joyce is very observant (though if not for the meddling Sarah he would have gotten away with it, too).
He wouldn’t be the first person to sip from a drink hoping to avoid awkward conversations about why they aren’t drinking and don’t they want just a little etc.
This is apparently very common even among adults in Finland. People who don’t (or no longer) drink alcohol, will get a non-alcoholic drink and let others assume they are partaking. Some will outright lie to avoid the awkward conversations and needing to repeatedly fend off ”just try a little” style remarks.
Trying to use peer pressure on anybody to get them to join in is shitty.
Fun thing – you don’t actually have to take sides. They can both just be upset for good reason and we can watch them work it out without trying to decide who is MORE right.
Sorry what you describe is not possible, every conflict MUST have a concrete wrongdoer for us to rally against and fell catharsis when they receive commenpause. It’s basic storytelling logic.
/S
Do other people just not use the “report comment” button to mark which comments you’ve read? I do it all the time and nothing ever comes of it, you’re fine.
It’s exactly as crummy as eating a piece of Chex Mix slightly louder than you ate the previous piece, allowing the person across the room, who couldn’t hear the previous piece being eaten, to hear the initial crunch of the current piece.
So your convenient act is harmless, unless others do it as well, at which point it stops the report system from working entirely. I stand behind solipsistic.
Yeah, but once everyone realizes the brilliance of using the report feature to track which comments you’ve already seen then it will be a problem.
Dammit Taffy, you should have kept it quiet!
I will not allow you to silence me. As a society, we owe it to each other to spread these little conveniences and make all of our lives that little bit easier. There is so much evil in this world (and on this very website), and we’re all of us so very tired and worn down. I’m only doing my part as a responsible global citizen and providing the public this meager service, and your attempt to censor and imprison me will not prevail.
I’m pretty sure Word of Willis at some point was that he knows that people hit that button by accident frequently so they don’t get checked until they’ve been reported at least… I want to say 3 times? But could be wrong.
Then the only thing that happens is the comment gets thrown into the moderation queue. If Willis approves it, the comment comes back and can’t be flagged again.
No need to apologize for an accidental flag, it’s not like the WordPress shoots either of you into the sun.
There’s something about admitting to the presence of misbehavior, no matter how minor, which seems to cause people to read into that admission and assume malicious intent on the part of the admitter. You can’t just simply state a fact about something imperfect done by somebody, it somehow needs to be a condemnation, slander, an attempt to inconvenience that person, or some other negative connotation. I don’t understand why humans have this reflex, but I’ve definitely observed it.
Just because you’re being honest doesn’t mean you’re doing a good thing. She prevented Joe from coming clean himself, which probably would have been better for both Joe and Joyce.
A deeply offensive/cruel thing to do? I don’t think so, given the circumstances, but it’s definitely a dick move.
She had no part in the conversation. Joyce was talking to Joe. Joe didn’t get a chance to respond before Sarah inserted herself and then doubled down again before Joe could respond to the question that was directed at him.
It’s the same thing as saying shittake mushrooms as a kid, you’re technically not doing anything wrong but you know you’re trying to stir the pot.
I always find the “they were not part of the conversation” comments weird because if you are having a convo in a setting where people you know can freely listen and they understand what you are talking about and have information pertaining it they usually WILL comment about it. I find that completely normal.
It depends a lot on the conversation. If I’m having a conversation about linux and somebody interjects for a moment about how actually it’s GNU+Linux, I’d be annoyed. If I’m quarreling with my lover and somebody interjects for… really any reason I’d be annoyed. If I need to get something off my chest and somebody decides to spill my beans for me I’d be pretty annoyed. Contributing your truthful and honest thoughts any time you can isn’t the best policy.
I might give that more consideration if it was an open conversation like “wow drinking at that party was fun” but Joyce was talking directly to Joe. The next person to respond should’ve been Joe.
He didn’t have a good option. Being openly sober with a drunk woman, after his own previous behavior giving him a greasy reputation, it’s kind of obvious what people would assume he was trying to do. It doesn’t matter how many people witnessed him not being a creep, his reputation is established. That doesn’t mean it’s immovable, but now he has to prove himself repeatedly before people trust him.
Yup, exactly. He feels the need to be extremely respectful. And he has very good reasons to, one of which is his sheer size and strength. But perhaps time and an honest conversation can let him relax a bit.
I figure an honest chat can sort this out easily. Probably won’t be laser-precision perfect and spotless, since they’re teenagers and all, but oh well.
Not only is he trying to repair his reputation, he has good reason to not trust himself with lowered inhibitions. His new leaf only started like…a week ago? Two?
I get that Joyce has a cauldron of issues upstairs (Ryan especially) but she needs to think about how Joe would be viewed and view himself if he got a little tipsy and handsy on their first time together. It’s not just her feelings that matter here, Joyce being his girlfriend doesn’t automatically make him not the guy he was before.
It’s also especially rough, because you KNOW Joyce is, consciously or not, deliberately aiming to speedrun her intimacy problems by introducing alcohol, and hoping she turns into “Joyce who Fucks and is Normal about Secular Sex,” the same way she feels she is now “Joyce who Says Fuck and Gives No Fucks.” And Joe is right to recognize that, and right to know that it’s a potentially dangerous decision he’d be facilitating, even completely ignoring his own stake in it.
People focus so much on the idea that “Joe doesn’t want to act indiscreetly” when it comes to this issue, and I think they honestly forget to analyze from the perspective of “Joe actually really really cares about Joyce, and doesn’t want her to get hurt, and especially doesn’t want to hurt her, himself.”
I’d imagine the scuzzy part is allowing someone you’re interested to get drunk, *thinking* that you’re just as drunk as them, when really you’re completely sober and they’re the only one operating at a deficit.
In a trusting and safe relationship this isn’t that big a deal (obviously you shouldn’t lie to your partner about stuff like this though). However, my suspicion is that Joyce in particular has a hangup about “being intoxicated/impaired in the company of a completely sober man who’s interested in me” after her awful experience at that first college party.
Exactly. I’m glad somebody spelled it out perfectly and succinctly. Obtaining consent from an intoxicated person when you’re equally intoxicated is one thing; obtaining consent from an intoxicated person when you are fully sober, and have full faculties? That’s immensely suspect, to the point that if you see it happening somewhere, and are capable of getting involved, you’d be well within your right to investigate the situation, and even try to put a stop to it.
Eh, that doesn’t seem as neutral as “asking a question.” Maybe between that and insisting, but it seems closer to a demand than not. (Not a truly serious one– one that Joe could have said no to and it’d have probably been fine, but he seemed hesitant on asserting his own boundary there.)
I feel like the reaction to Sarah is getting extremely overblown, like she actually does every act with malicious intent or something. I know we’ve been seeing her dropping the ball lately, but we’ve also seen that before the case with other characters, most notably Dorothy atm. Her saying this doesn’t feel like her usual stress response or “I gotta protect Joyce!” response either.
If people saw me like Sarah maybe I’d act like her too, tbh.
One of my favorite adages in this history of thought and language is, “if you treat somebody like a dog, don’t get surprised when they start to shit on your floor!”
Joyce managing to throw Joe off of her isn’t the impressive part.
The impressive part is that she threw him off the bed in front of him while he was on her back. If all she did was buck him off while pushing herself upright, he’d have fallen backwards, *behind* her.
It’s funnier and more visually obvious this way, so I approve, but it suggests that she did a whole lot more than simply get herself up.
(Or, more likely, she waited until he was partway rolled off of her and then forcibly sat herself up, knocking his ass off the bed.)
tbh if joyce wasn’t being weirdly aggressive about it, joe prolly wouldn’t have lied. “WHY aren’t you being DRUNK with me?! >:(” isn’t how you should ask if you actually want to know why.
Yeah, I get that she has an issue that he lied to her, but she’ll also need to consider (as I imagine will come up) why he felt like he needed to lie about something like that. I imagine he has reasons beyond her behavior for keeping sober secretly, but that does seem like part of it.
This doesn’t seem like an intentional “Let’s throw Joe under the bus.” Move from Sarah. It was just an observation she shared, I don’t think she thought anyone would get distressed over it.
Her bringing it up initially, I would say no, her expression is too flippant to me, and she said it very plain and simple. Depending on how the conversation is going to go from here, she could change her stance. Probably now that she knows that Joe has lied to Joyce, and Joyce is upset about it.
Raidah thinks Sarah is a bongo who intentionally ruins people’s lives with malicious intent.
Sarah herself prides herself on being mean/sarcastic/abrasive , and she didn’t used to be outright malicious with it, but that’s changed in terms of her actions as the comic goes on (trying to break up joyce and joe being the most recent one)
Raidah’s opinion stems from her getting her friend sent home. But the reason many people dislike Raidah isn’t simply bc she hates Sarah. It’s because she’s a two-faced bongo who talks down to people and social climbs.
I can’t personally say I wouldn’t hate my friends roomie if they got them sent home to an unsafe environment, even if I could understand the logic of doing so.
but just because a character sucks (Raidah) doesn’t mean every general thought they have is incorrect (Sarah being kind of an abrasive asshole + doing something awful to her friend + also punching her in the face) even if I get WHY Sarah punched her.
It’s tough to tell with Sarah, but I think that, in general, she is going to side-eye Joe lying to Joyce, so she is probably going to poke holes in that regardless of if she’s trying to cause problems on purpose or what.
Sarah loves Joyce probably more than she’s ever loved another person, and the one way she can express that love is by attacking everyone near her. Especially Joe, who she thinks is playing a long con to get Joyce into bed after which he’ll disappear. Snitching on him for fake drinking is like, the least violent thing she has done to him so far.
Joe wasn’t dishonest though. He did not at any point actively pretend to drink alcohol, and in a peer pressure situation it can be vastly preferable to not draw attention to not wanting alcohol, or you’ll be pressured (which is the truly shitty thing ,btw).
To compare this to the drugging situation is ridiculous – not drinking yourself is in no way related to slipping someone else date rape drugs. Joe did absolutely nothing to endanger Joyce or take advantage of her being drunk. He did nothing wrong.
Eh, spirit of the law, letter of the law. He definitely intentionally allowed Joyce to think he was drinking, which is still a lie of omission.
And as for comparing it to the drugging situation — obviously it’s not as bad. The question isn’t whether they’re comparable. The question is whether or not it elicits the same feelings in Joyce as the drugging experience did. This isn’t cut-and-dry litigation, it’s trauma.
Funny thing about trauma – it’s not super rational in where the triggers are placed. That doesn’t stop them from being triggers or deserving of respect.
I feel we are working against recreational alcohol users who feel it’s an important ritual, and not participating is somehow a betrayal.
I suspect it may have something to do with shared vulnerability. We all tacitly agree to lower our guards and give each other license to be silly / loud / affectionate / horny… because alcohol. The presence of a sober person is seen as violating the shared vulnerable space/state.
Not really, a man not drinking but pretending to do so (even if it was very badly) while the woman he is with does get drunk have some very scummy implications. Obviously that isn’t the case here but Joyce has trauma about being lied to and taken advantage of in a party, and trauma can make us act a bit rashly. Maybe if he was honest about not wanting to drink she would had been fine with it but we can’t know that.
He was pretty clearly not comfortable with the drinking party before it started, and suggested alternatives, but the Joyce train just ran right over that.
He didn’t come out and say it explicitly, to be fair.
I relate to that as an autistic person, that we have problems getting implicit messages from like facial expressions or indirects, needing sometimes to be told things as straightforward as possible.
Someone linked to when he did fake drinking to appease Drunk Joyce’s question of “Why aren’t you getting drunk with me, Joe?”
I just hope she respects his reasons for doing so – combination of “I didn’t want to ruin your fun” and “I didn’t trust Drunk Me to not do something I’d regret.”
My take on this is that he didn’t want drunk Joyce to decide she wanted to get devirginized, and he be drunk enough to go along with it, I suspect he wants their first time to be completely sober.
Joyce has been date drugged before. A date pretending a different intoxication level than accurate while she let herself get vulnerable is probably a trigger issue.
Even if it don’t trigger some trauma in Joyce, I feel it’s strange or not so cool that we are together and someone lies that they are drunk, or intoxicated.
I don’t know if it’s a right thing to think, but I kind of starting to considerate your point.
Joyce also said up front when this idea was first being planned, that she’d been drunk with Dorothy and know she wanted to be drunk with him. She wanted this to be a thing they did together.
Drunkenness entails vulnerability. Partly because people are more honest when they’re drunk, and partly because of the generally lowered inhibitions. It’s also, to Joyce, a case of them doing something “naughty” together, breaking the rules. So some sexual subtext creeps in. Basically, she was vulnerable with someone who wouldn’t be vulnerable with her in return.
On one hand I get Joyce being upset about Joe lying.
On the other hand I kind of understand what happened. He was handling her. It’s like when an adult lies to pacify an upset child. It’s not great, but sometimes it’s better than the alternative. OTOH it’s an underhanded thing to do, especially in a relationship of equals.
OTOH It wasn’t like he was convincing when pretended to drink, a reasonable sober person would have realize immediately.
OTOH Joyce should be able to trust Joe without having to question his every work.
OTOH how many hands do I have, am I like an octopus?
(Also Sarah is justified here. She has no obligation to keeps this secrets or help pull a fast one on Joyce. If this is the only consequence of the party it will be both sad, but also nowhere near as bad as it could have been.)
Well, I hope everyone will recognize how mature and loving he was being. That room full of inexperienced freshmen and a keg of moonshine was a disaster waiting to happen, let’s try to be glad that someone who’s seen what happens when kids drink too much was smart enough to be the designated driver/responsible adult.
I don’t know if the handling her and pacifying an upset child angles are fair… it seems like he didn’t want to drink, but he was nervous to say so and didn’t want to disappoint Joyce. I get Joyce not liking that he lied to her, but I hope she also hears him out about why he didn’t want to drink (and then felt he couldn’t tell her).
Basically, Joe is going to have to work on more clearly establishing his boundaries, which feels like an interesting element for this relationship.
If Sarah was not an asshole, she would have instantly figured out that Joe was not drinking out of concern of Joyce’s safety, and would have charitably at least given him a chance to spill the beans himself to Joyce now that she’s sober.
Instead, yay, Sarah is an asshole again, trying her best to sabotage other people’s relationships again, just as she did with Lucy/Walkyy, because she can’t stand her friends being happy. Such a friend.
I’m the one who’s saying that Joe not drinking was a good thing.
You are the one treating it a horrible betrayal that Sarah was virtuous to disclose to Joyce as a horrible betrayal by Joe.
You love Sarah being an asshole to everyone, you loved her when she mortified Joyce in public, when she bashed Walky to his girlfriend behind Walky’s back, when she reduced Lucy to fucking tears, and you yourself are an asshole to everyone, having recently even gone as far as to SLANDER me that I supposedly advocated real-world violence since you couldn’t counter my arguments about the comic’s characters and you needed some lies for a personal attack.
And yet you somehow accuse me that I think “everything is perpetually its worst possible version”.
Which other thing besides Sarah the asshole misanthrope, She Who Enjoys Hurting Her Friends, and you the asshole slanderer, are you talking about as “everything”? Name two.
I resent that. Slander is spoken. In print, it’s libel.
For real though, I don’t remember ever interacting with you before. Do you have receipts for like, any of this? Because you’re accusing me of a lot of Sarah/asshole-related things and I just don’t remember any of that. Like, I’m not calling you a liar, but is any of that stuff even true?
Not being good at such social games, and not choosing to uphold a white lie on the spot doesn’t make Sarah an arsehole. She seems habitually honest and direct, which is not a malicious trait.
Gonna assume that wasn’t your intention but comparing an autistic person/character to an upset child can come across as pretty shitty. (,I say as an autistic person that though that sounded pretty shitty).
I had assumed they would have migrated back to Joe’s room, for the simple fact that Joe would be at less risk from being on the receiving end of a baseball bat carried by Sarah.
But, maybe Danny and Sal are currently occupying the room and want some privacy for “round 2”.
Joe didn’t want to get drunk and become That Ludicrous Display At Joyce’s Party, because he believes he is an Evil Horndog who’d lose control and hump another girl’s leg if he drinks. Which is fine, but he forgot that Sarah (and through her, Willis) hates happiness.
I think this may be a reference to when Joyce started dating Ethan? She said that homosexuality was about on par with lying, then Mike asked her what she thought about lying and Joyce got red-eyed angry and said she hated it.
As someone who does not drink and has in fact been nagged about it a million times: not cool.
And no, Joe didn’t lie, and doesn’t need to justify not drinking either.
No games are being played here. We all read the same scene, I’m only pointing out that “Joe didn’t lie” is verifiably untrue. The underlying reason isn’t relevant, he literally said something that wasn’t true on purpose. I’m not condemning the action, I’m admitting it occurred.
Looking at that comic again, even with hindsight, that’s so transparently performative “look at me i’m totally this thing i’m not” that only a drunk person would fall for-oh.
She’s upset that she was lied to about a situation where she felt specifically vulnerable. She’s not screaming at him, calling him names, etc. She just said “off, please” and then a comedic thing happened because this is a comic.
That doesn’t seem to be Joe’s situation though. Hopefully this reaction leads to a conversation where we find out Joe’s motivation, but I think we all strongly suspect he is afraid of taking advantage of Joyce and didn’t want to be part of a two-sided drunken mistake. If it didn’t have to do with deep-seated fears that Joe is not comfortable talking about, he doesn’t at all strike me as someone who would mind being asked why he isn’t drinking.
Looking at Joe’s actions through the lens of “it’s annoying to constantly have to defend not drinking” is about as appropriate as looking at it through the lens of “it’s EXTREMELY sketchy behavior for a guy to sit back sober while his girlfriend gets wasted, intentionally leading her to believe that he is also getting drunk.” Frankly, both interpretations are overreactions to/projections onto the situation.
Yeah, I’m kind of struggling to sympathize with Joyce. I sort of get that it’s a “Joyce had a great time getting drunk with Dorothy the other night and wanted to get drunk with Joe to replicate that feeling, and possibly grow closer that way.” But as someone who doesn’t drink, and that has always had to defend myself from the derision of people who do, people getting angry at “why don’t you drink?”, like it’s some kind of personal failing or an insult to them, is one of those things that gets my hackles up.
OTOH, there’s no reason to think that Joe doesn’t drink and some to believe that he does, so it becomes “why won’t you drink with me”, which is a very different issue.
There was a bit of dishonesty and Joe needs to explain himself. But I can understand why he did so though, a certain someone probably still doesn’t trust himself.
Have we ever seen him drink? Dedicated fitness nuts / bodybuilders avoid alcohol because it lowers testosterone even in low quantities. Others just choose not to do drugs. Joe may never have had a drink at all.
We haven’t seen him drink. We’ve also never seen him refuse a drink. It’s just never come up.
Fairly early on, we did see him complaining about a hangover, but that was in the time when he was still bragging about alcohol fueled threesomes, so it could have more of that kind of performative posturing.
People often feel the need for various strategies to evade the usual irritating social pressure to drink. Drunks can make things very uncomfortable and awkward, or even make a big stink, because they feel guilty about drinking or something. But it’s really no one business if I don’t feel like drinking today or any day.
Mostly, but if you’re not drinking today because of specific reasons involving your partner, it kind of is their business.
Like Joe doesn’t just randomly not feel like drinking here, he’s specifically worried about both of them being drunk together. That’s a “them problem”, not a “him problem”.
The number of people who would have been pissed that Sarah helped Joe lie to Joyce is (probably, I’m not going to do math about it) roughly equivalent to the number of people who are now upset that she didn’t.
Maybe everyone could just accept that characters have to make decisions and engage with the story. If they all just sat around minding their business, this would be a BORING comic.
There is a difference between supporting a lie, and keeping one’s mouth shut when speaking would very likely replace a very small issue with a larger one.
I won’t say that Sarah is malicious here, but tactless: yes indeedy.
I also prefer to be equally intoxicated as the people I’m with and have strong negative feelings about being decieved (ie I relate to Joyce’s reaction and have had a similar bad experience as her) but I like that Joe stuck to his decision not to drink regardless of how others feel about it. It can be pretty sucky to have to defend your choice, especially publicly, doublespecially if it stems from some source of shame as the case seems to be for Joe. I look forward to the potentially dramatic, vulnerable discussion that will hopefully bring them closer.
I also don’t know get how they can speak if they have toothpaste all over their mouths. Do they just past a dry toothbrush through their teeth? Is that something people do and I wasn’t informed?
Sarah is a major piece of shit for this. It’s none of her business whether he drank or not, and her only purpose in bringing it up would be to blow up the relationship she didn’t approve of in the first place. And I’m guessing Joyce is pissed because they slept together when he was sober while she was drunk and try to equate it to the guy who wanted to get her drunk to assault her, despite her stated intentions from the start of the party. This comic loves to shit on Joe for being a good person.
Sarah is still bitter over blowing her opportunity, if she had one, with Jacob. C’mon, Sarah, don’t crap on Joe for doing what about 90% of people would say was the right thing just because you messed up
Yes, Joe lied. But FFS, people do the wrong thing for the right reasons all the time.
Yes, Sarah was telling the truth. But this isn’t a goddamn court of law and we’re allowed to just know things. Her rationale is valid but irrelevant; her reason for doing so is because she wants to torpedo Joe.
But why does she want to torpedo Joe?
Could it be because she has good reasons not to trust him, even if we know better?
In addition to her general cynicism of course.
People seem to assume Joe’s reasons for not drinking, and I do agree with the general idea of them, but I also wanna do some wildspec for why Joe might not have drunk at the party:
1. Maybe he’s started taking a medication that he’s not supposed to drink with. Depending on what it is, he might have felt hesitant sharing that he was on it before, and then felt awkward when it was suddenly more relevant.
2. Maybe he’s an alien who loses control over his shapeshifting abilities upon consuming alcohol.
I hope Joe is allowed to speak his side in that he didn’t want to take advantage of Joyce (who might have been using the alcohol as an excuse to be taken advantage of, not sure).
He means well and I think she’d understand – but obviously his lying is upsetting.
I’d guess Joe faked drinking because he was afraid something could happen between them and he’s still trying to be a new, improved man. He doesn’t want to live down to his old reputation or possibly take advantage of Joyce in any way, but she doesn’t want to be treated with kids gloves any more.
Interesting dynamic if that’s what this is.
Also, we all read Joe’s WAAGH in Wario’s voice, right? 😀
on the one hand i can understand why joyce would be feeling betrayed but also on the other joe is trying to be a good person and NOT take advantage of her so i really hope this doesnt become a big argument and also i hope they kiss each other lots
I can understand that Joe was probably trying to be in his best behavior around Joyce, but given how the last time Joyce was alone with a boy while she was drunk and he was sober went… I also get the anger here
I hope they’re able to talk it out cuz I’m rooting for this ship yall
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Joyce: “Not sloshed?! No squash!”
Alternately…
Joyce: “Not pished?! No squish!”
I found this very amusing. Thanks for the smile.
Plot twist. Joe lands on his head and dies.
Joyce has his corpse taxidermied and turned into a weighted blanket.
Or… would it have to be the converted and then taxidermied??
Tee-hee!
Not slopped? No plop!
“Give me a place to lay, and a hangover strong enough, and I will flip my shit.”
Eehhh… Yeah in hindsight that might have been a small misstep…
It’s a bit of an unfortunate misunderstanding here. Joyce is likely feeling betrayed due to her history of people trying to take advantage of her through alcohol. While Joe likely didn’t trust himself not to take advantage of Joyce if he was drunk.
Right on. Poor Joe, trying so hard not be his womanizing dad.
Nailed it, I think. This is gonna be a rough conversation…
Also her history of her church, family, and broader community lying to her. Girl finally meets people she can be honest with, makes herself vulnerable to Joe, and gets deceived again. Oof. Can’t blame her for being mad here.
Given the nature of that party, I think that “small misstep” is still performing better than expected.
No, no, best to get the first fight out of the way as soon as possible. Even better if you can stay clear headed!
Maybe there will be makeup sex!
(well, first sex)
((but probably not since sarah is there.)
Argh. I forgot to close the parenthesis! My syntactical error; it burns!
The next time you write lisp you’re gonna get all kinds of weird problems and wonder what the hell is going on
99 bugs in the code
take one down; solve it
136 bugs in the code
)
Thanks! (this is why team code review is important stuff yes indeed)
((take that, crowdstrike))
Oh, it’s no problem (except that you’re leaving the portal open [figuratively, or “perhaps not
That’s an interesting query. Is it makeup sex if it’s also first-time sex?
All first time sex is made up.
Nobody has ever had sex for the first time. Any suggestion to the contrary is propaganda.
You fool Joe! You completely sober and responsible fool!
I think the real irresponsibility was lying about it.
By omission, or did he literally lie?
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-14/04-for-me-it-was-tuesday/drunkwithme/
Well, my reading is that he didn’t want to be pressured into drinking by a very obviously drunk Joyce. Could have been handled better? Maybe, but certainly not something worth breaking up about.
It also seems like he didn’t take advantage of her while she was drunk, but as Bluesnake pointed above, Joyce has a trauma of specifically being taken advantage of while intoxicated (roofied) and the other guy was not. I still don’t think Joe is entirely wrong there, maybe he should have said beforehand that he didn’t intend or want to drink, but Joyce’s kneejerk reaction makes sense in her context.
It’s basically a terrible misunderstanding from failure to communicate, which is basically what all the characters do.
I feel really bad for Joe here.
If he didn’t drink, he lost with Joyce.
If he drank, he woulda lost with the others.
Forget the others — I think Joe was even just worried about his own behavior if he loosened his inhibitions.
NOT meaning to imply anything malicious, just that Joe has been the one showing more restraint this whole relationship, and is likely worried about scaring Joyce like he scared Liz — too much, too fast and all that.
Lying about being drunk wasn’t the right move either, and I think we’re gonna get a conversation with Joyce about trust here in a sec. Does Joe know about Joyce’s experience getting roofied?
Doubt it. Joyce’s friend group was fairly small at that point – her, Dorothy, Sarah, Walky, Sal. Others were brought “in the know” as was necessary, and Joe was being pretty misogynistic at that point. They just had previously had the date where Mike punched him a lot.
And since when Joyce learned to be OK being alone in large crowded areas, it hasn’t had a reason to be shared with others. Literally the only person who was in the know, knew that Joe was more than just a sleezeball, and would consider sharing something like that, is Joyce herself. And she just wanted to ignore it
Joyce did share it with him. See my links below <3
Oh poop. You’re right. Well, ignore me.
Though unless she went into more detail off panel, he doesn’t know that it involved getting roofied by a sober guy at a party. There’s nothing in particular to connect it to last night if all he knows is what she said then.
He called the guy “druggy mcstabbed” or whatever and she pointed out that several other women had come forward. He knows what it involved.
Hadn’t considered the implication of him knowing “druggo”. Still wouldn’t have about the party necessarily, but yeah, close enough.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-7/03-the-thing-i-was-before/pixely/
Just to refresh what the info about Ryan was that went out to the general public. So Joe had this background info going into Joyce’s confession.
^ Oh, also, Billie (now Jennifer). Can’t forget her. At that point, Joyce was Billie’s best friend, and Billie was Joyce’s best Christian friend. The horror!!
Yeah he knows:
I’m bad at links lmao
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-7/04-the-do-list/object/
and
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-7/04-the-do-list/affirm/
i don’t think he ever had to be drunk to hookup with girls but i can imagine him saying stuff he might regret or woujld wanna talk about it sober liek “i don’t wanna rush into sex”
We actually don’t know what would have happened if he didn’t drink and was honest about it, we can only assume and so can he because he chose to lie rather than trust Joyce and find out what she’d say/think.
In case anyone else can’t recall when Joe lied about this, I eventually found it here.
Sarah lost her only love interest and she’s about to make it everyone’s problem.
At least in this case, I don’t think she did it to intentionally screw anything up. I don’t think she’d have any reason to think Joyce would be upset at her boyfriend for NOT getting drunk. Because that’d be a weird thing to be upset about. Only the lying part is really upset-worthy. Plus, Sarah being Sarah, I could see her being hyper-aware of if Joe is drunk or not precisely to make sure no drunk touching happens between him and Joyce.
Heck, its even possible that Sarah thought she was helping…
Maybe (ok, a slim chance) she respects Joe for going sober at the party and wants to encourage responsible behavior between the 2 of them.
Yeah, for once, I don’t think Sarah was instigating. I think her Mom Friend Instinct just tells her to rebut incorrect things that are said aloud XD
This is Sarah we’re talking about.
Problem is undercutting it.
She’s less grumpy than I expected actually.
Sadly, I think she’s come to expect that she neither deserves nor gets nice things.
Yeah :'(
Second the sad “Yeah. 🙁 “
Also, people will always disappoint her.
YUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUP.
The Happiness Vampire is back, and she’s making Joyce unhappy in order to get a little buzz for herself.
She demonstrates mad superpowers here being able to speak clearly with mouth full of brush and paste. With this ability she could easily attract a better love interest.
Oh, so we’re having this conversation now.
I’d like to take this moment to remind everyone that 3 page ago Joe stated that he was 250 pounds and Joyce just threw him off of her like it was nothing
This is a comic.
Exactly! And since we scale off feats here this means Joyce is now the strongest character in One Piece!….I mean Dumbing of Age!
Joyce is clearly outerversal level whatever that means
Ah, but can she beat Goku?!? Let’s start asking the REAL questions here!
Look, I know it’s just a comic but those just aint the quads of a lean 250 lb man. Joe’s fulla shit, at least 50 lbs worth.
I was just watching an episode of “The Simpsons.” It was one of the ones with the joke where Mr. Burns is comically strong and agile. And also one of the ones with the joke where Mr. Burns is comically weak and immobile. As is common for an episode heavily featuring Mr. Burns, these jokes were placed within seconds of each other. Repeatedly.
So this means he’s indestructible, right?
He’s so ill and infirm that he pretty much has every known illness, and some unknown ones.
However, the side effects of any one given illness, end up partially treating a different illness, so his body cannot obey the instinct to die, because he is such a well-balanced ecosystem of maladies.
Thus, he is unnaturally spry for a decrepit ghoul, which is still incredibly weak and infirm, overall. But, due to his terrible health, he is unfortunately a functionally immortal creature.
I didn’t just come up with this, this is the in-universe explanation that i’m recalling.
That’s the power of WAAAAAAAAAGH
Apparently it also gives a 5+ Invulnerable Save (whatever the heck that means).
IT MEANS DA ORKS IS DA BEST
I note that in a certain light Joyce is wearing red shorts. Make of that what you will.
It means he is faster.
Notoriously male character, Joyce “Chapstick” Brown.
Wait, ‘is shorts is red, I thought dey was purple, you know so he could sneak around all sneaky like.
So, the current rules as of 10th edition 40K have a sequence of rolls to see if an attack does its damage. First you roll to see if you hit, then you roll to see if the hits penetrated the target’s armour, then the target rolls a saving throw to see if they shrugged it off. Certain units and abilities will alter targets’ saves, and some units will counter that by having an Invulnerable Save that can’t be tweaked that you can choose to use instead. In this case, that means that if you roll a 5 or 6 on 1d6, no damage for you.
Waaagh, Mr. Bond.
Tougher than diamonds and stronger than steel.
Remember when Hank Hill tried to train Bobby to “explode” out from under a wet carpet? Some people have naturally explosive power, even in relation to their size and bodyweight. Joyce might be cut out for wrestling like Bobby wasn’t.
Keg a Dynamite!
In Bobby’s defense, “that boy ain’t right”. 😀
Angry Joyce has KO’d Ross with a punch before, and kicked Becky’s window out of the frame. She’s capable of great feats when sufficiently pissed.
First there was The Hulk.
Then there was She-Hulk.
Now meet Triangle-Smile-Hulk.
does this mean that when the mythical square-mouthed joyce arrives in the timeline, we should fear for the multi-verse?
Joyce and Amber have this in common. Though AG usually has some leverage, too.
Are you suggesting Joyce is an alien abductee in Dumbing of Age as well? Is this where we learn the last ten years were all an elaborate prologue to an It’s Walky reboot?
Joyce is also powerful enough to make Joe instantly grow stubble, and yet yeeting Joe off the bunk is what fails to suspend disbelief?
If Joyce ever needs the adrenaline to lift a city bus off a toddler, all she has to remember is this incident.
It’s a small bed. All she needs to do is get his center of gravity off the edge.
I can see both sides. The only “correct” choice would involve having an honest and up-front conversation about why he wanted to be sober and Joyce understanding his reasoning.
Thanks to Sarah I think we are about to have that conversation. Joe can share how worried he is to maintain 100% respect for Joyce at all times and to be deserving of her attention. It’s time for Sarah to cut him some slack.
On the flip side, coercing someone to drink who doesn’t want to drink is a damned sight more wrong then lying about drinking the drink that was forced on him.
Good point.
This is true. I feel like the General Concept today is to only observe one character’s (incredibly minor) misbehavior and frame it as somebody being The Bad Guy™, but it’s seriously just a brief and uncomfortable blip that seems like it’s about to get addressed directly anyway. It’s a teenage booze party, y’all. It’s gonna be sloppy and not fit into neat little categories of Good VS Slightly Less Good.
Joe used to say boozeahol is a lubricant what facilitates threesomes, or some words to that effect, in front of Joyce. Even though he has never actually been in a threesome and most of that sex-haver personality he used to have wasn’t real, but a kind of performative masculinity. But, he’s the one of the 20 or so main characters here who’s seriously deliberately earnestly working to change who he is, and it doesn’t even have to do with seducing Joyce, he’s doing it for himself, cause ever since the “Do” list debacle he’s started thinking about how the things he does matter (even if Joyce is the one who told him that).
I’m actually much more interested in the fact that in this situation where Joe was heavily pressured to drink, he didn’t, than I am in the drama of this deceit. It tells us how badly he wants to be a better person than the one he was at the beginning of the year.
Which, all things considered? I’m not saying that Joe was right to be cagey about his concerns, but, I also refuse to believe him trying to have that conversation with Joyce while she was already impaired would have gone well! At best, she pressures him into doing the thing he’s uncomfortable doing, and at worst, she just gets super mad at him because she’s been drunk twice and doesn’t have practice at managing emotions while impaired.
Proof that the dorms have bunk beds for whoever said they didn’t. The top bunk is above Sarah’s head standing up
They’re all lofted beds.
I am really surprised that a dorm would use lofted beds like that.
I figured the risk to someone “falling out” of bed would have been too great.
You definitely hear about that happening sometimes, but lofted beds were absolutely the standard at my university. There’s not a ton of space in a dorm room, and a lofted bed gives you a place to have a desk underneath it.
Didn’t hear of a single instance of anyone falling out of their loft bed when I lived in the dorms. Loft beds are pretty common because they free up a lot of floor space.
Also who was saying there’s no loft beds in the comic? We’ve seen them numerous times over the years.
No one was saying there’s no loft beds.
It’s pretty common for people to think they’re bunk beds instead of loft beds though. I think they just see one bed up high and attach the idea of bunk beds to that.
I want a full week of strips displaying these beds in their entirety, so people will stop bringing this up all the time.
I mean, literally yesterday’s comic…. https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-15/01-love-dares-you-to-change/hospitality/
(and the day before as well)
Your entire space is one small room that you share with another person. Elevating the beds means you get to use that floor space twice. I kept my chair and my dresser under my bed.
In my college days, the lofts were generally not part of the official furnishings, there was a small industry of students who were graduating [or leaving the dorm anyway] selling their lofts to incoming students.
I think there were safety inspections, though.
You had to pay to get the loft installed before the start of the school year, but it didn’t cost a lot extra. My parents saw the option filling out the forms, and did not begrudge the extra cost–they said they thought it was a good idea and they’d get it if I wanted. I had one all four years.
Don’t they have only top bunks with desks underneath?
Yep, which I believe they’re calling lofted beds, which instinctively makes sense as elevated beds.
I’d call them captain beds because that’s what the ones like that, which have often had built in/modular pull-out desks/clothes storage underneath, were called (looks like they’re either that or high sleepers in the UK).
It’s me, I said they don’t. Because they don’t and you’re wrong.
The point of that comment was that a lot of the characters have lofted beds, which means there’s not a bed directly under them. This was about someone being in the bunk right below AG, I believe, when she was in Dorothy’s bed, but there’s not a bunk under Dorothy’s bed. There’s a desk.
Here’s a strip where you can see under Joyce’s bed, to where there’s not a lower bunk: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2023/comic/book-13/03-joementum/glugglug/
Hehe, Joe just got de-lofted!
…
Yeah, ‘de-bunked’ would have been better, but not bunks, so
Desks claimed all the bottom bunks.
Wasn’t there a comic page forever ago where Sarah or someone wakes up to Joyce wide smiling and peering down at her and saying good morning its time to go to church?
That happened because Joyce kept climbing on top of people. It was hilarious.
The loft beds come free with the room rental. (Insert aside here about USA schools being a real estate scam.) But as we have seen with Dina’s giant plush dinosaur bed, you’re allowed to put in your own furniture, probably as far as your roommate agrees. There could be people who get bunk beds to free up a little more floor space. Just gotta fight over who gets the top bunk.
In my college experience, the dorm beds could be configured in different ways, including as bunk beds. However, I wouldn’t say a bunk bed would free up more floor space, unless you’re talking about having a wider open area. Having two lofted beds with space for things, like a desk, under each of them would give more space.
Joyce feels betrayed, and I understand why, but also I don’t really… approve of drinking, generally? So I’m more on Joe’s side here.
I agree with the not drinking. It’s the pretending to sip from the empty cup that gets me. For some reason, it feels way worse than if he had just secretly filled his cup with water in the bathroom and let Joyce assume it was liquor.
Maybe it seems worse because feels like more of a direct deception rather than a lie by omission? Though I don’t necessarily understand why that feels better when rationally a lie by omission seems equivalent to a direct one.
Or maybe the idea of filling the cup with water seems better because it seems to respect Joyce more? I mean I know Joyce is much shorter than Joe so if he just holds the cup up she would never be able to see inside, but it still seems like such a weak ploy that it appears almost cruel to pull. Joe doesn’t seem to think Joyce is very observant (though if not for the meddling Sarah he would have gotten away with it, too).
He wouldn’t be the first person to sip from a drink hoping to avoid awkward conversations about why they aren’t drinking and don’t they want just a little etc.
This is apparently very common even among adults in Finland. People who don’t (or no longer) drink alcohol, will get a non-alcoholic drink and let others assume they are partaking. Some will outright lie to avoid the awkward conversations and needing to repeatedly fend off ”just try a little” style remarks.
Trying to use peer pressure on anybody to get them to join in is shitty.
Honestly, I thought she cottoned on to his blatant lie and just rolled with it.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/drunkwithme/
Your mention of water immediately sent me to imagining Joe calling “Baldrick! Fetch my incredibly strong ale!”
Fun thing – you don’t actually have to take sides. They can both just be upset for good reason and we can watch them work it out without trying to decide who is MORE right.
Sorry what you describe is not possible, every conflict MUST have a concrete wrongdoer for us to rally against and fell catharsis when they receive commenpause. It’s basic storytelling logic.
/S
and then Joe broke his neck and died
Yeah, that’s the first thought that went through my head.
At least we can assume we should be spared a “hit his neck just wrong enough to live but be a quadriplegic” storyline…
First, I accidentally hit report instead of reply. This was a mistake! Please ignore!
Onto my reply! Yeah I did an audible “woah” when I saw that. I’m hoping very much for cartoon logic and that he’s okay.
Do other people just not use the “report comment” button to mark which comments you’ve read? I do it all the time and nothing ever comes of it, you’re fine.
…you send dozens of false reports every day?
Joke (noun) /dʒəʊk/
1. a brief oral narrative with a climactic humorous twist
2. an instance of jesting
3. something not to be taken seriously
Not every day, no.
Some days, it’s hundreds.
That sounds like a really crummy thing to do. Positively solipsistic.
It’s exactly as crummy as eating a piece of Chex Mix slightly louder than you ate the previous piece, allowing the person across the room, who couldn’t hear the previous piece being eaten, to hear the initial crunch of the current piece.
So your convenient act is harmless, unless others do it as well, at which point it stops the report system from working entirely. I stand behind solipsistic.
Please continue to agonise over the social morality of this absurd claim.
Apparently someone missed the definition given above
Seriously tho it takes multiple people reporting one comment to do anything, accidentally hitting it means jack of all
Or even hitting it on purpose
Yeah, but once everyone realizes the brilliance of using the report feature to track which comments you’ve already seen then it will be a problem.
Dammit Taffy, you should have kept it quiet!
I will not allow you to silence me. As a society, we owe it to each other to spread these little conveniences and make all of our lives that little bit easier. There is so much evil in this world (and on this very website), and we’re all of us so very tired and worn down. I’m only doing my part as a responsible global citizen and providing the public this meager service, and your attempt to censor and imprison me will not prevail.
I’m pretty sure Word of Willis at some point was that he knows that people hit that button by accident frequently so they don’t get checked until they’ve been reported at least… I want to say 3 times? But could be wrong.
Something like that.
Then the only thing that happens is the comment gets thrown into the moderation queue. If Willis approves it, the comment comes back and can’t be flagged again.
No need to apologize for an accidental flag, it’s not like the WordPress shoots either of you into the sun.
Shooting users into the sun is a nonstandard feature you have to add yourself.
Mmm yes, but have you considered… **anxiety**? :p
Well over 3, iirc.
Mm whatcha say?
Mm that you only meant well?
Well of course you did
Mm whatcha say?
donald duck also goes waaaaaagh
Much more consistently, so does Howard the Duck.
And much like Joe, he is trapped in a world he never made.
I mean, Joe’s not really, but work with me here.
Joe’s not trapped and can escape at any time, or Joe created the world. Not sure which direction you’re going here.
So does Waluigi!
Sarah can’t stand being the only miserable one so she’s gonna do what she does best
She literally just… said an honest thing about what she observed. It’s weird how many people are taking that as a bad thing.
There’s something about admitting to the presence of misbehavior, no matter how minor, which seems to cause people to read into that admission and assume malicious intent on the part of the admitter. You can’t just simply state a fact about something imperfect done by somebody, it somehow needs to be a condemnation, slander, an attempt to inconvenience that person, or some other negative connotation. I don’t understand why humans have this reflex, but I’ve definitely observed it.
Just because you’re being honest doesn’t mean you’re doing a good thing. She prevented Joe from coming clean himself, which probably would have been better for both Joe and Joyce.
A deeply offensive/cruel thing to do? I don’t think so, given the circumstances, but it’s definitely a dick move.
*dick move if intentional
This is Sarah we’re talking about here, not known for people skills
She had no part in the conversation. Joyce was talking to Joe. Joe didn’t get a chance to respond before Sarah inserted herself and then doubled down again before Joe could respond to the question that was directed at him.
It’s the same thing as saying shittake mushrooms as a kid, you’re technically not doing anything wrong but you know you’re trying to stir the pot.
If you say so
I always find the “they were not part of the conversation” comments weird because if you are having a convo in a setting where people you know can freely listen and they understand what you are talking about and have information pertaining it they usually WILL comment about it. I find that completely normal.
It depends a lot on the conversation. If I’m having a conversation about linux and somebody interjects for a moment about how actually it’s GNU+Linux, I’d be annoyed. If I’m quarreling with my lover and somebody interjects for… really any reason I’d be annoyed. If I need to get something off my chest and somebody decides to spill my beans for me I’d be pretty annoyed. Contributing your truthful and honest thoughts any time you can isn’t the best policy.
I might give that more consideration if it was an open conversation like “wow drinking at that party was fun” but Joyce was talking directly to Joe. The next person to respond should’ve been Joe.
It’s a human interaction, not a turn-based RPG. You’re being silly.
We’re also not talking some random stranger here, but Joyce’s “Big Sister”.
It’s also not like Joyce has a clean record of never overstepping personal boundaries.
Goddamnit Sarah.
Here comes the shame! Now it’s a proper morning after.
Plus Sarah’s regretting everything, so why not spread the uncheer.
No-one ever gets to insist that someone must drink who doesn’t want to. Never okay.
No, but in fairness lying about your intoxication level also has some scuzzy-ness to it.
He didn’t have a good option. Being openly sober with a drunk woman, after his own previous behavior giving him a greasy reputation, it’s kind of obvious what people would assume he was trying to do. It doesn’t matter how many people witnessed him not being a creep, his reputation is established. That doesn’t mean it’s immovable, but now he has to prove himself repeatedly before people trust him.
Yup, exactly. He feels the need to be extremely respectful. And he has very good reasons to, one of which is his sheer size and strength. But perhaps time and an honest conversation can let him relax a bit.
I figure an honest chat can sort this out easily. Probably won’t be laser-precision perfect and spotless, since they’re teenagers and all, but oh well.
Not only is he trying to repair his reputation, he has good reason to not trust himself with lowered inhibitions. His new leaf only started like…a week ago? Two?
I get that Joyce has a cauldron of issues upstairs (Ryan especially) but she needs to think about how Joe would be viewed and view himself if he got a little tipsy and handsy on their first time together. It’s not just her feelings that matter here, Joyce being his girlfriend doesn’t automatically make him not the guy he was before.
It’s also especially rough, because you KNOW Joyce is, consciously or not, deliberately aiming to speedrun her intimacy problems by introducing alcohol, and hoping she turns into “Joyce who Fucks and is Normal about Secular Sex,” the same way she feels she is now “Joyce who Says Fuck and Gives No Fucks.” And Joe is right to recognize that, and right to know that it’s a potentially dangerous decision he’d be facilitating, even completely ignoring his own stake in it.
People focus so much on the idea that “Joe doesn’t want to act indiscreetly” when it comes to this issue, and I think they honestly forget to analyze from the perspective of “Joe actually really really cares about Joyce, and doesn’t want her to get hurt, and especially doesn’t want to hurt her, himself.”
How is implying that your capacity for giving consent is reduced scuzzy? Does it feel like entrapment to you?
I’d imagine the scuzzy part is allowing someone you’re interested to get drunk, *thinking* that you’re just as drunk as them, when really you’re completely sober and they’re the only one operating at a deficit.
In a trusting and safe relationship this isn’t that big a deal (obviously you shouldn’t lie to your partner about stuff like this though). However, my suspicion is that Joyce in particular has a hangup about “being intoxicated/impaired in the company of a completely sober man who’s interested in me” after her awful experience at that first college party.
Exactly. I’m glad somebody spelled it out perfectly and succinctly. Obtaining consent from an intoxicated person when you’re equally intoxicated is one thing; obtaining consent from an intoxicated person when you are fully sober, and have full faculties? That’s immensely suspect, to the point that if you see it happening somewhere, and are capable of getting involved, you’d be well within your right to investigate the situation, and even try to put a stop to it.
Oh, did Joyce do that?
Kind of!
https://www.dumbingofage.com/drunkwithme/
She absolutely did. Her only defence is that she’s a baby brought up in a barrel and doesn’t really know anything.
Yeah, I just don’t see “asking a question” as “insisting” or (as claimed elsewhere in the comment section “coercive” etc.
Feels like people getting their shirts in a twist over absolutely nothing. Again.
Eh, that doesn’t seem as neutral as “asking a question.” Maybe between that and insisting, but it seems closer to a demand than not. (Not a truly serious one– one that Joe could have said no to and it’d have probably been fine, but he seemed hesitant on asserting his own boundary there.)
I feel like the reaction to Sarah is getting extremely overblown, like she actually does every act with malicious intent or something. I know we’ve been seeing her dropping the ball lately, but we’ve also seen that before the case with other characters, most notably Dorothy atm. Her saying this doesn’t feel like her usual stress response or “I gotta protect Joyce!” response either.
If people saw me like Sarah maybe I’d act like her too, tbh.
One of my favorite adages in this history of thought and language is, “if you treat somebody like a dog, don’t get surprised when they start to shit on your floor!”
I’d call it goading, at a minimum.
Joyce managing to throw Joe off of her isn’t the impressive part.
The impressive part is that she threw him off the bed in front of him while he was on her back. If all she did was buck him off while pushing herself upright, he’d have fallen backwards, *behind* her.
It’s funnier and more visually obvious this way, so I approve, but it suggests that she did a whole lot more than simply get herself up.
(Or, more likely, she waited until he was partway rolled off of her and then forcibly sat herself up, knocking his ass off the bed.)
Then he and plummeted 16 ft through an announcer’s table.
something something Mankind
tbh if joyce wasn’t being weirdly aggressive about it, joe prolly wouldn’t have lied. “WHY aren’t you being DRUNK with me?! >:(” isn’t how you should ask if you actually want to know why.
Yeah, I get that she has an issue that he lied to her, but she’ll also need to consider (as I imagine will come up) why he felt like he needed to lie about something like that. I imagine he has reasons beyond her behavior for keeping sober secretly, but that does seem like part of it.
Jesus, Sarah…Really?
This didn’t need to be mentioned to Joyce, at all.
But hey, you had a shit night, might as well share the wealth.
This doesn’t seem like an intentional “Let’s throw Joe under the bus.” Move from Sarah. It was just an observation she shared, I don’t think she thought anyone would get distressed over it.
Be realistic, it’s sarah. Of course she did.
Her bringing it up initially, I would say no, her expression is too flippant to me, and she said it very plain and simple. Depending on how the conversation is going to go from here, she could change her stance. Probably now that she knows that Joe has lied to Joyce, and Joyce is upset about it.
the longer i scroll down this comment thread
the more i see a shocking number of people
who have the same opinion of Sarah that Raidah does
Raidah thinks Sarah is a bongo who intentionally ruins people’s lives with malicious intent.
Sarah herself prides herself on being mean/sarcastic/abrasive , and she didn’t used to be outright malicious with it, but that’s changed in terms of her actions as the comic goes on (trying to break up joyce and joe being the most recent one)
Raidah’s opinion stems from her getting her friend sent home. But the reason many people dislike Raidah isn’t simply bc she hates Sarah. It’s because she’s a two-faced bongo who talks down to people and social climbs.
I can’t personally say I wouldn’t hate my friends roomie if they got them sent home to an unsafe environment, even if I could understand the logic of doing so.
but just because a character sucks (Raidah) doesn’t mean every general thought they have is incorrect (Sarah being kind of an abrasive asshole + doing something awful to her friend + also punching her in the face) even if I get WHY Sarah punched her.
I hope this makes sense
It’s tough to tell with Sarah, but I think that, in general, she is going to side-eye Joe lying to Joyce, so she is probably going to poke holes in that regardless of if she’s trying to cause problems on purpose or what.
Seems some people think that it’s Sarah’s problem to help Joe continue to lie to Joyce.
It’s cute that she still says “please” while being angry and chucking him.
Joyce should join wrestling.
Oh, boo-hoo.
sarah just can’t mind her damn business
hello raidah
Good. Secrets are stupid.
Yes, but we keep that secret.
Agreed. The conversation that should come from this is going to be way better for everyone involved (I hope)
Of course, that conversation could have happened anyway. Joe wants to be The Good Boyfriend, and confessing this little lie is part of that.
Maybe, but this is the way it’s happening instead.
If they didn’t want this conversation to be her business, they shouldn’t have had it in her room. :p
Sarah loves Joyce probably more than she’s ever loved another person, and the one way she can express that love is by attacking everyone near her. Especially Joe, who she thinks is playing a long con to get Joyce into bed after which he’ll disappear. Snitching on him for fake drinking is like, the least violent thing she has done to him so far.
Sarah once again moving down my ranks away from her once extremely high spot in my fave characters in this comic list.
Jesus
Why would Joe *not* drinking be an issue? I’m obviously missing something here, especially since I read it as him trying to be the responsible one.
It’s the dishonesty. Like, she’s not likely keen on him misrepresenting his status to her, and I’m guessing the concern on his end is self-control.
Joe wasn’t dishonest though. He did not at any point actively pretend to drink alcohol, and in a peer pressure situation it can be vastly preferable to not draw attention to not wanting alcohol, or you’ll be pressured (which is the truly shitty thing ,btw).
To compare this to the drugging situation is ridiculous – not drinking yourself is in no way related to slipping someone else date rape drugs. Joe did absolutely nothing to endanger Joyce or take advantage of her being drunk. He did nothing wrong.
Eh, spirit of the law, letter of the law. He definitely intentionally allowed Joyce to think he was drinking, which is still a lie of omission.
And as for comparing it to the drugging situation — obviously it’s not as bad. The question isn’t whether they’re comparable. The question is whether or not it elicits the same feelings in Joyce as the drugging experience did. This isn’t cut-and-dry litigation, it’s trauma.
I was skeptical, but he did actually say “I’m drunk.” Link above. The lie was comically over-the-top, but apparently Joyce missed that.
Funny thing about trauma – it’s not super rational in where the triggers are placed. That doesn’t stop them from being triggers or deserving of respect.
He pretended to drink in a way that made it blatantly obvious he was pantomiming.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/drunkwithme/
When I read this one, I thought Joyce figured it out and just rolled with it.
I feel we are working against recreational alcohol users who feel it’s an important ritual, and not participating is somehow a betrayal.
I suspect it may have something to do with shared vulnerability. We all tacitly agree to lower our guards and give each other license to be silly / loud / affectionate / horny… because alcohol. The presence of a sober person is seen as violating the shared vulnerable space/state.
Something like that?
+1
Not really, a man not drinking but pretending to do so (even if it was very badly) while the woman he is with does get drunk have some very scummy implications. Obviously that isn’t the case here but Joyce has trauma about being lied to and taken advantage of in a party, and trauma can make us act a bit rashly. Maybe if he was honest about not wanting to drink she would had been fine with it but we can’t know that.
He was pretty clearly not comfortable with the drinking party before it started, and suggested alternatives, but the Joyce train just ran right over that.
He didn’t come out and say it explicitly, to be fair.
I relate to that as an autistic person, that we have problems getting implicit messages from like facial expressions or indirects, needing sometimes to be told things as straightforward as possible.
Someone linked to when he did fake drinking to appease Drunk Joyce’s question of “Why aren’t you getting drunk with me, Joe?”
I just hope she respects his reasons for doing so – combination of “I didn’t want to ruin your fun” and “I didn’t trust Drunk Me to not do something I’d regret.”
My take on this is that he didn’t want drunk Joyce to decide she wanted to get devirginized, and he be drunk enough to go along with it, I suspect he wants their first time to be completely sober.
I think it’s just the lying part that’s getting to her. I understand the sentiment. Lies are just kind of spooky.
Joyce has been date drugged before. A date pretending a different intoxication level than accurate while she let herself get vulnerable is probably a trigger issue.
That’s 100% what I’m reading, yeah
Even if it don’t trigger some trauma in Joyce, I feel it’s strange or not so cool that we are together and someone lies that they are drunk, or intoxicated.
I don’t know if it’s a right thing to think, but I kind of starting to considerate your point.
Joyce also said up front when this idea was first being planned, that she’d been drunk with Dorothy and know she wanted to be drunk with him. She wanted this to be a thing they did together.
Joyce wanted it to be a bonding moment between them. It still was, just not the way she intended. Mostly the lie is what ruined it.
Thanks, all, for the perspective.
Drunkenness entails vulnerability. Partly because people are more honest when they’re drunk, and partly because of the generally lowered inhibitions. It’s also, to Joyce, a case of them doing something “naughty” together, breaking the rules. So some sexual subtext creeps in. Basically, she was vulnerable with someone who wouldn’t be vulnerable with her in return.
Joe’s missed opportunity to be vulnerable without chemical help, by explaining his motivation when she pressed him (at the party).
Joe plays Orks in 40k, confirmed.
JOE IS DA BIGGEST AND DA STRONGEST!
On one hand I get Joyce being upset about Joe lying.
On the other hand I kind of understand what happened. He was handling her. It’s like when an adult lies to pacify an upset child. It’s not great, but sometimes it’s better than the alternative. OTOH it’s an underhanded thing to do, especially in a relationship of equals.
OTOH It wasn’t like he was convincing when pretended to drink, a reasonable sober person would have realize immediately.
OTOH Joyce should be able to trust Joe without having to question his every work.
OTOH how many hands do I have, am I like an octopus?
(Also Sarah is justified here. She has no obligation to keeps this secrets or help pull a fast one on Joyce. If this is the only consequence of the party it will be both sad, but also nowhere near as bad as it could have been.)
I mean, I think Sarah is just bitter about Jacob and also bailing on him bc Jacob also wasn’t drinking.
Well, I hope everyone will recognize how mature and loving he was being. That room full of inexperienced freshmen and a keg of moonshine was a disaster waiting to happen, let’s try to be glad that someone who’s seen what happens when kids drink too much was smart enough to be the designated driver/responsible adult.
I don’t know if the handling her and pacifying an upset child angles are fair… it seems like he didn’t want to drink, but he was nervous to say so and didn’t want to disappoint Joyce. I get Joyce not liking that he lied to her, but I hope she also hears him out about why he didn’t want to drink (and then felt he couldn’t tell her).
Basically, Joe is going to have to work on more clearly establishing his boundaries, which feels like an interesting element for this relationship.
If Sarah was not an asshole, she would have instantly figured out that Joe was not drinking out of concern of Joyce’s safety, and would have charitably at least given him a chance to spill the beans himself to Joyce now that she’s sober.
Instead, yay, Sarah is an asshole again, trying her best to sabotage other people’s relationships again, just as she did with Lucy/Walkyy, because she can’t stand her friends being happy. Such a friend.
I’m glad not to live in your reality, where everything is perpetually its worst possible version and all existence is tainted.
I’m the one who’s saying that Joe not drinking was a good thing.
You are the one treating it a horrible betrayal that Sarah was virtuous to disclose to Joyce as a horrible betrayal by Joe.
You love Sarah being an asshole to everyone, you loved her when she mortified Joyce in public, when she bashed Walky to his girlfriend behind Walky’s back, when she reduced Lucy to fucking tears, and you yourself are an asshole to everyone, having recently even gone as far as to SLANDER me that I supposedly advocated real-world violence since you couldn’t counter my arguments about the comic’s characters and you needed some lies for a personal attack.
And yet you somehow accuse me that I think “everything is perpetually its worst possible version”.
Which other thing besides Sarah the asshole misanthrope, She Who Enjoys Hurting Her Friends, and you the asshole slanderer, are you talking about as “everything”? Name two.
I resent that. Slander is spoken. In print, it’s libel.
For real though, I don’t remember ever interacting with you before. Do you have receipts for like, any of this? Because you’re accusing me of a lot of Sarah/asshole-related things and I just don’t remember any of that. Like, I’m not calling you a liar, but is any of that stuff even true?
You sound really angry at a total stranger about imaginary happenings. Maybe hydrate and take a walk or something.
Brogod who the fuck brought up real world violence
I disagree that Sarah is being an asshole here. I disagree that not keeping up someone else’s lie is something Sarah is doing wrong.
You sound like you’re determined to hate her though, so go off I guess.
Not being good at such social games, and not choosing to uphold a white lie on the spot doesn’t make Sarah an arsehole. She seems habitually honest and direct, which is not a malicious trait.
Gonna assume that wasn’t your intention but comparing an autistic person/character to an upset child can come across as pretty shitty. (,I say as an autistic person that though that sounded pretty shitty).
While I get that, I think in this case, it was more the “drunk person”.
Still.
Ah, they are in Sarah/Joyce’s room.
I had assumed they would have migrated back to Joe’s room, for the simple fact that Joe would be at less risk from being on the receiving end of a baseball bat carried by Sarah.
But, maybe Danny and Sal are currently occupying the room and want some privacy for “round 2”.
Another thing Joe has been worried about, lol.
Another reason why Jacob made the right choice
Yeah, if he’d decided to date Joyce a few months ago (after they kissed), he’d have wound up with a violently abusive alcoholic.
Joe didn’t want to get drunk and become That Ludicrous Display At Joyce’s Party, because he believes he is an Evil Horndog who’d lose control and hump another girl’s leg if he drinks. Which is fine, but he forgot that Sarah (and through her, Willis) hates happiness.
Lies deception
Does Joyce is more angry because Joe lied or because Joe ruined her plan to blame sleeping together as a drunken mistake?
Probably the trauma of the FIRST time she got drunk when someone else wasn’t.
She didn’t get drunk; she was drugged.
It’s been well established that Joyce associates drinking with the roofie.
Maybe that, Joyce want to prove you can drink with male specimen and be safe, Joe dont beliving himself and being sober prove otherwise
and it looks like we’re back to our regularly scheduled Joyce. ~<3
Looks like Joe has that Mr. Incredible-type build.
Yup, there’s Still Deprogramming Joyce.
??? How is this related to her leaving her religion at all?
I think this may be a reference to when Joyce started dating Ethan? She said that homosexuality was about on par with lying, then Mike asked her what she thought about lying and Joyce got red-eyed angry and said she hated it.
As someone who does not drink and has in fact been nagged about it a million times: not cool.
And no, Joe didn’t lie, and doesn’t need to justify not drinking either.
Joyce, back off.
“I’M DRUNK! LOOK AT ME, I HAVE MY DRINK! NUMM NUM NUM NUM! I, UH– IT’S VERY GOOD! MY SINUSES BURN!” – Joe Rosenthal, July 21, 2024
He wasn’t drunk, he didn’t drink, his sinuses didn’t burn. Black and white, he lied.
Black and white, Joe also clearly was not comfortable drinking and Joyce pressured him into it. Anyone can play that game.
No games are being played here. We all read the same scene, I’m only pointing out that “Joe didn’t lie” is verifiably untrue. The underlying reason isn’t relevant, he literally said something that wasn’t true on purpose. I’m not condemning the action, I’m admitting it occurred.
I suppose that’s fair.
Looking at that comic again, even with hindsight, that’s so transparently performative “look at me i’m totally this thing i’m not” that only a drunk person would fall for-oh.
Even Joyce seemed unimpressed by the performance, though she might have still bought he would drink later on.
Back off from… what exactly?
She’s upset that she was lied to about a situation where she felt specifically vulnerable. She’s not screaming at him, calling him names, etc. She just said “off, please” and then a comedic thing happened because this is a comic.
That doesn’t seem to be Joe’s situation though. Hopefully this reaction leads to a conversation where we find out Joe’s motivation, but I think we all strongly suspect he is afraid of taking advantage of Joyce and didn’t want to be part of a two-sided drunken mistake. If it didn’t have to do with deep-seated fears that Joe is not comfortable talking about, he doesn’t at all strike me as someone who would mind being asked why he isn’t drinking.
Looking at Joe’s actions through the lens of “it’s annoying to constantly have to defend not drinking” is about as appropriate as looking at it through the lens of “it’s EXTREMELY sketchy behavior for a guy to sit back sober while his girlfriend gets wasted, intentionally leading her to believe that he is also getting drunk.” Frankly, both interpretations are overreactions to/projections onto the situation.
Yeah, I’m kind of struggling to sympathize with Joyce. I sort of get that it’s a “Joyce had a great time getting drunk with Dorothy the other night and wanted to get drunk with Joe to replicate that feeling, and possibly grow closer that way.” But as someone who doesn’t drink, and that has always had to defend myself from the derision of people who do, people getting angry at “why don’t you drink?”, like it’s some kind of personal failing or an insult to them, is one of those things that gets my hackles up.
OTOH, there’s no reason to think that Joe doesn’t drink and some to believe that he does, so it becomes “why won’t you drink with me”, which is a very different issue.
She wanted to get drunk with her partner, to share an experience with her, of a kind whose opportunities are few and far between.
Welp, this is gonna be complicated.
There was a bit of dishonesty and Joe needs to explain himself. But I can understand why he did so though, a certain someone probably still doesn’t trust himself.
Have we ever seen him drink? Dedicated fitness nuts / bodybuilders avoid alcohol because it lowers testosterone even in low quantities. Others just choose not to do drugs. Joe may never have had a drink at all.
We haven’t seen him drink. We’ve also never seen him refuse a drink. It’s just never come up.
Fairly early on, we did see him complaining about a hangover, but that was in the time when he was still bragging about alcohol fueled threesomes, so it could have more of that kind of performative posturing.
People often feel the need for various strategies to evade the usual irritating social pressure to drink. Drunks can make things very uncomfortable and awkward, or even make a big stink, because they feel guilty about drinking or something. But it’s really no one business if I don’t feel like drinking today or any day.
Mostly, but if you’re not drinking today because of specific reasons involving your partner, it kind of is their business.
Like Joe doesn’t just randomly not feel like drinking here, he’s specifically worried about both of them being drunk together. That’s a “them problem”, not a “him problem”.
The number of people who would have been pissed that Sarah helped Joe lie to Joyce is (probably, I’m not going to do math about it) roughly equivalent to the number of people who are now upset that she didn’t.
Maybe everyone could just accept that characters have to make decisions and engage with the story. If they all just sat around minding their business, this would be a BORING comic.
There is a difference between supporting a lie, and keeping one’s mouth shut when speaking would very likely replace a very small issue with a larger one.
I won’t say that Sarah is malicious here, but tactless: yes indeedy.
I disagree, and I maintain that it would be a borrrrrrrring comic if everyone kept their mouths shut as often as the comment section would like.
Probably.
Wait… yeah, shit, Sarah helped Joe to lie to Joyce. How could people be pissed to her?
Joyce used seismic toss! It was super effective!
I mean, she said “Please”.
Let’s see how this plays out. With a bit of open communication, this could be a complete non issue.
History strongly suggests there will be no open communication.
Joyce and Joe have been pretty good lately.
Narrator: “They are used to forget this is Dumbing of Age.”
I also prefer to be equally intoxicated as the people I’m with and have strong negative feelings about being decieved (ie I relate to Joyce’s reaction and have had a similar bad experience as her) but I like that Joe stuck to his decision not to drink regardless of how others feel about it. It can be pretty sucky to have to defend your choice, especially publicly, doublespecially if it stems from some source of shame as the case seems to be for Joe. I look forward to the potentially dramatic, vulnerable discussion that will hopefully bring them closer.
This wasn’t what i expected but it seems like it could lead to what needs to be addressed anyway…
1. Considering his weight, dang, she’s strong.
2. “Endrunkened”!
3. Aww, their first spat. (hopefully very mild and short)
You know what they say: a high-proof spirit endrunkens the strongest man.
Dammit, who turned the gravity back on?!
What is it with these freaks and brushing their teeth in the middle of their rooms?
Honestly THIS should be the big drama today. 2-for-2 on people brushing their teeth over carpet, next to beds.
I also don’t know get how they can speak if they have toothpaste all over their mouths. Do they just past a dry toothbrush through their teeth? Is that something people do and I wasn’t informed?
Given that Joyce lobbed Joe’s 200lb up and off I think she’s the one doing an Ork “Waaaaagh!” here.
Sarah is a major piece of shit for this. It’s none of her business whether he drank or not, and her only purpose in bringing it up would be to blow up the relationship she didn’t approve of in the first place. And I’m guessing Joyce is pissed because they slept together when he was sober while she was drunk and try to equate it to the guy who wanted to get her drunk to assault her, despite her stated intentions from the start of the party. This comic loves to shit on Joe for being a good person.
Just a reminder everyone, there’s been readers who’ve been banned for misogyny who either have been given a second chance or evade the ban.
Sarah is still bitter over blowing her opportunity, if she had one, with Jacob. C’mon, Sarah, don’t crap on Joe for doing what about 90% of people would say was the right thing just because you messed up
I really wish there was a “block” option, because you’ve honestly never voiced an opinion that was anything but complete dogwater.
So many people I wish I could just not see at all. I make do with just skipping their comments any time I see them.
Shit your pants some more.
Wow, Sarah. Jealous and petty…actually, not that much has changed.
*takes notes*
Being honest with your friend and not helping their boyfriend lie to them is… petty.
Okay I got it now, thanks!
No one asked her to lie, no one asked her to say anything. She chose to speak up.
Yes, Joe lied. But FFS, people do the wrong thing for the right reasons all the time.
Yes, Sarah was telling the truth. But this isn’t a goddamn court of law and we’re allowed to just know things. Her rationale is valid but irrelevant; her reason for doing so is because she wants to torpedo Joe.
Sarah threw Joyce at Jacob to get back at Raidah. Her moral integriy is highly suspect at the best of time.
But why does she want to torpedo Joe?
Could it be because she has good reasons not to trust him, even if we know better?
In addition to her general cynicism of course.
She is bitter and spiteful by default, even more so now when she saw Lucy snatch Jacob away.
Agreed
I don’t think this is jealousy. Don’t put Sarah in a position where you expect her to volunteer to lie for you, including lies of omission. She has a low opinion of that kind of game.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/effin/
https://www.dumbingofage.com/chromosome/ continues in: /manual/
She put herself in the position. She wasn’t asked for information, she volunteered it herself.
eyeroll
“My strength is as the strength of ten, because I found out my boyfriend lied to me!”
People seem to assume Joe’s reasons for not drinking, and I do agree with the general idea of them, but I also wanna do some wildspec for why Joe might not have drunk at the party:
1. Maybe he’s started taking a medication that he’s not supposed to drink with. Depending on what it is, he might have felt hesitant sharing that he was on it before, and then felt awkward when it was suddenly more relevant.
2. Maybe he’s an alien who loses control over his shapeshifting abilities upon consuming alcohol.
Yeah, when I started terbinafine I was embarrassed to tell people why I couldn’t drink because it brought attention to my toenails
I hope Joe is allowed to speak his side in that he didn’t want to take advantage of Joyce (who might have been using the alcohol as an excuse to be taken advantage of, not sure).
He means well and I think she’d understand – but obviously his lying is upsetting.
I’d guess Joe faked drinking because he was afraid something could happen between them and he’s still trying to be a new, improved man. He doesn’t want to live down to his old reputation or possibly take advantage of Joyce in any way, but she doesn’t want to be treated with kids gloves any more.
Interesting dynamic if that’s what this is.
Also, we all read Joe’s WAAGH in Wario’s voice, right? 😀
“HAHAHAHA HURRY UP!!!!!”
on the one hand i can understand why joyce would be feeling betrayed but also on the other joe is trying to be a good person and NOT take advantage of her so i really hope this doesnt become a big argument and also i hope they kiss each other lots
I can understand that Joe was probably trying to be in his best behavior around Joyce, but given how the last time Joyce was alone with a boy while she was drunk and he was sober went… I also get the anger here
I hope they’re able to talk it out cuz I’m rooting for this ship yall
Joe is an Ork?
actually i thought joe didnt drink …..
I don’t like Sarah. That is all.