you SUFFOCATE christopher? you shove your tongue down his open mouth like the plumber’s snake? oh! oh! jail for sister! jail for sister for One Thousand Years!!!!
I had to renew my driver’s license in 2020. It took literally two months. And I did the actual renewal online; I didn’t send the form back to the DMV in the mail. I was driving on an expired license for several days because they just hadn’t gotten around to delivering the replacement. If my birthday were a month later and I lived in a state with voter suppression laws, I wouldn’t have been able to vote.
My birthday is regularly, like, a week after the election. It was frustrating in 2012 when I couldn’t vote, even though my 18th birthday was soooo close.
Well you are Ana Chronistic, makes sense that time would get a little weird around you.
Also, Fun Fact: Some of my relatives are friends with De Joy. They say he is being framed by the liberal media. I’m not sure I believe that one way or the other. I just stay quite and let them talk politics with the older folks while I enjoy their dog. She is very fluffy and very friendly and I love her so much.
Honey Bear is large auburn/orange goldendoodle. She is normally a very good girl but as might be expected of a COVID puppy who is half golden retriever, she is very excited whenever we first show up during a visit and runs in circles for a while in the front yard unable to contain her excitement. Also, she has a bad habit of stealing and eating paper.
Right? How in the hell can they charge for a given delivery service they basically have no intention of honoring? Seems like false advertising. (Currently bitterly waiting for a delayed package)
If it’s like everywhere else in the world, they’re staffed for the 90’s (meaning already under- for then) and outsourcing all they can to uberized workers who rent vehicles to deliver mail, when not outsourcing the outsourcing, so it’s a bit like putting mail in Mario Bros II’s pipes (or Brazil’s pipes), and hoping it doesn’t land on lava or quicksand.
Gah, 4 days late and there isn’t even an expected delivery date now, just a “delayed”. Rage rage rage.
Got a new business model for FedEx, they could just charge a whole bunch for impossible delivery times like 1 hour and then just say it’s delayed. I mean, what’s stopping them?
USPS nothing. My dad once showed me an email he had received from a friend in Australia, date-stamped 3 YEARS EARLIER.
He’d assumed they had stopped writing to him, and they probably assumed the same thing. But really their email had just been delayed for 3 years for some bizarre reason. He wrote back apologising for the long delay but “I only just received your email yesterday”… xD
That’s an interesting one. Sounds like a misconfiguration preventing different services servers from talking to each other. SMTP is a plain text protocol, so you can open that email in notepad and should be able to see the send and server delivery timestamps. 3 years is something all right.
SMS has a doubling decay delivery attempt, so if you’ve ever wondered why your messages come in all out of order after your phone has been off/out of service, it’s because the server attempting to deliver messages keep doubling how much time they’ll wait before trying again. So the most recent messages will often come through first, while older ones may get held for nearly as much time as you were disconnected in the first place.
Huh.
Once, while I flew my hang glider off the high mountain for the first time, received several years old SMS on the phone I was carrying with me. It was spooky. I have no explanation.
Any chance it was stolenmisplaced by one of their temporary workers and held as evidence until now? Usually some sort of explanation is attached to packages that old.
Yeah, from memory it’s basically a supersize pipe cleaner (speaking of which, this is why pipe cleaners are called such—they weren’t originally for arts’n’crafts)
A drain snake (also known as a closet auger or a drain auger) is a long spring made out of heavy gauge steel that’s fed down into a drain and spun around to break up or remove a clog that a plunger won’t budge.
I know. Middle-school is just hormone fueled hellscape anyway. Everyone is swore, confused, and crazy – best just to forgive and try to forget that whole sweaty mess.
Sadly, I’m pretty sure that would also make her a cop.
…well, okay, an ex-cop who realized that the police weren’t actually making any long-term change for the better or solving any of the societal problems she’d hoped they would and quit the force to find herself.
Sarah is holding on to a grudge from middle-school? That seems kinda petty. Of course, I’ve never been cheated on (not that I’ve ever had the opportunity to be).
Assuming it was anything resembling a serious relationship, it’s a really shitty thing to do and it absolutely is the sort of thing that you still feel bitter about years down the line.
To be fair, it was Liz who brought it up because she simply is incapable of comprehending all the other reasons Sarah is escorting her back to Ball State. To Sarah it’s probably not much more than an afterthought.
In Nebraska age of sexual consent is 19, unless the two people are less than a year apart in which case it does not qualify as statuatory rape. But 18 year olds are still adults who can vote and all
My guess is that the cold shoulder was part of what Christopher initially found attractive about Sarah, only for it to start causing communication issues he didn’t anticipate once they were actually in a relationship.
Yeah, I wouldn’t be surprised if the guy thought cold = cool and that she’d warm up and ‘be normal’ the more she got to know and trust him. Which is now how Sarah do.
I could see it being that Sarah ramped up her school efforts and got less warm with him as a result, especially if she was still trying to get the scholarship she currently has. We’ve seen that her education is vital to her, so it’s possible her priorities shifted. It happens.
Au contraire, it’s been repeatedly established that Sarah “doesn’t have an origin story.” At the earliest point we’ve seen her in flashbacks, she self-defines as a “bongoy killjoy misanthrope.”
I’m trying to remember if dating was even a thing people did when I was in Junior High.
…come to think of it, what grade range would “Junior High” have been where Sarah and Liz grew up? For me, “Intermediate” or “Middle” was grades 6-8, but I understand that it can vary widely.
My Junior High School was grades 7-9, with 9th grade I think being somewhat optional (some students going to high school for 9th grade, but it was more the exception rather than the rule).
Dating was definitely all the rage in my middle school. By college, though, the majority of people seemed more focused on schoolwork and part-time jobs than anything else.
There was hanging out together and then there was dating. Actual dating required transportation, which in the 1960’s required a car and more than a learners permit, which pretty much restricted it to high school seniors and the occasional junior. For girls, you could subtract as much as three years, since they typically didn’t have to drive to date.
But you can get a lot of relationship drama out of hanging out.
Middle school (what I guess some would call junior high) for me was grades 6-8, around ages 12-14 I think. I don’t know if other kids started dating and stuff at that point, but I know I definitely didn’t until high school. But then, I’ve always been terrible at telling when someone was into me romantically.
I think it’s fair to feel traumatized and hurt by things people did to you in middle school. There’s definitely stuff I carry. I do think, however, it has to be done with the understanding that middle schoolers are all basically monsters, and holding that hurt against the people they grow up to be is maybe a bit silly.
You’re gonna have a hard go convincing me that “people change” in a world where a troglodyte who makes fun of the disabled and dismisses rape accusations with “nah she ugly” finds 60 million people willing to say “yeah! That! That’s what we need in a President!!!”
People don’t change. People mature physically, they age, they tell themselves “I’m not that person anymore,” but they betray themselves with every vote they cast for the mean and the petty; every fleck of spittle they hurl at service workers; every haughty sniff that the poor deserve their plight, and should not be helped by the government, but by individuals who want to use them to earn Brownie Points for heaven, or else simply to have someone to feel superior to.
People don’t change. Or, if anything, age makes them focus MORE on their own self-interest to the exclusion of all else. Not less.
… I think it’s really weird to go from a comment that says “it’s valid for Sarah to be hurt and traumatized by something that happened to her in middle-school, but you shouldn’t necessarily judge Liz forever for it because she was still a kid and what she did as a developing middle-schooler isn’t necessarily an indicator of what she would do as an an adult” and go “well, but Donald Trump exist and so forgiveness for past misdeeds is inherently wrong, everyone is always the same forever”.
Like you DO remember that in this case we’re not discussing forgiveness for being a racist, sexist, capitalist monster, we are discussing a 14-years-old making out with her sister’s boyfriend? Those are kind of different things that deserve to get different framing.
The entire point of the comic is that people can change. Joyce and Becky were fundamentalist Christians and young earth creationists, among other things, now Joyce is an atheist and Becky wants to be a scientist.
Some people are little shits as kids and remain terrible as adults. Other people do change for the better as they grow up. The idea that nobody changes at all from when they were a kid in school is utterly ridiculous.
And I might remind you that in the last election we replaced one president with sexual harassment and assault allegations against him with another.
“holding that hurt against the people they grow up to be is maybe a bit silly.”
Because it is important to give them a chance to fuck you over again.
I don’t buy that people get more moral just because they are older. They get smarter, and have a better idea what they can and can’t get away with, and more inclined to avoid the consequences of their actions. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with admitting they were wrong or not wanting to do it again if they thought it would be a net benefit to them.
Middle Schoolers are monsters because they’re idiots who literally haven’t lived enough life yet to actually fully understand the consequences of their actions, nor have enough perspective to make (what we might consider to be) rational decisions.
It has nothing to do with morality or admitting they were wrong or whatever. It just means that it is literally silly to hold against a grown person the actions and decisions they made when they were literally too young to have the sort of decision-making skills of a grown person. You ought to look at how they behave as an actual adult–yknow, like, recently?– rather than how they behaved as a child, in order to get a decent picture of whether or not they might fuck you over.
Middle school for me sucked because I was bullied quite a lot by some kids for acting different from them, and I’ve realized after being diagnosed recently that it was probably because I’m autistic. I’m not gonna hold that against them now that we’re all adults, because while some of them might still be jerks, I’m assuming some of the kids who bullied me back then became better people as they grew up.
I don’t think it is, depending on the specifics about what happened. Sometimes if you hurt or traumatize someone, one of the consequences is they don’t forgive you, even if you’ve changed.
But then I had a “friend” who was emotionally abusive when I was very young and I wasn’t even the worst case of her fucking with someone, so that might have coloured my perspective on that, but she had people remarking that her level of lying and lack of care about hurting others was not normal since she was like six.
Willis ordered a Transformer, they neglected to deliver it for multiple days in a row, once getting as far as the next door neighbor’s house before turning around, even though the tracking info said it was on the truck.
(My guess is it kept getting scanned as “on the truck” along with a pile of other boxes, but those didn’t actually fit on the truck so they were left at the depot with a bogus scan.)
Ten minutes ago he started to ask if they minded if he turned the radio on during this hour drive and then *this* happened. He’s now wondering if it would be rude to put in headphones or start taking notes for a young adult novel
Sarah dates a guy, this guy thinks she doesn’t actually like him, and then he’s told that actually she really cares deep down and that means she never has to say or act on this.
(Please disregard that for months I was real insistent that Liz never swiped Sarah’s boyfriend)
Well yeah, but then we get the info that Sarah’s usual behaviour made him feel that she didn’t like him and Liz runs defense that he just has to ignore that everything Sarah constantly does to affirm that she can’t stand other people.
She kissed a guy who thought Sarah didn’t like him. That sounds like the kind of thing a 14 year old would do.
I mean, if Liz has never expressed remorse for it-and makes a habit of blaming her for it-why wouldn’t she ‘hold a grudge’? That’s not holding a grudge, that’s just not letting your sister treat you like shit.
Also there is the acting like she would do it again in the present day if the opportunity existed. So it is like. You learned nothing and would do it again. You can’t exactly forgive and forget a past behaviour that is still something they would do again now.
This whole thing reminds me of a certain song:
🎵 Lord help the Mister, that comes between me and my sister,
And Lord help the Sister, that comes between me and my man! 🎵
Never heard of them. The song is from “White Christmas” with Bing Crosby & Danny Kaye. It was sung by the “Haynes Sisters” (Rosemary Clooney & Vera-Ellen). Great movie!
Cool animation on that. Here’s the original from White Christmas. Later in the movie, the girls can’t perform for some reason, so Bing & Danny wear their outfits and lip sync to the song. 😀
Well now. That clears up a lot from yesterday. If this was Junior High-age, then she would’ve been around 12 – 15 years old? Old enough to try and save her sister’s relationship and also old enough to know better than to stick her tongue down his throat after a few days. Me thinks Chris pretty much hedged his bets on the younger sister giving him attention and was right.
Can someone from the USA please explain what Junior High is? Where I’m from we have primary (grades 1-6), secondary (grades 7-9) and tertiary (grades 10-12) schools.
Also if you’re feeling generous please also explain what the heck is a freshman or a sophomore because I keep seeing those words and never understanding them.
I am not familiar with the actual history of the terms, but in the Good Old Days (i.e. before 1950) high school was usually set up as 4 years long. Finishing high school was all that was expected of people who weren’t going to be failures in life.
(And back in the 19th century, a “school-leaving certificate,” basically a diploma for 6th grade (age 11-12) was the standard.)
College was also four years long, but was not a thing expected of most people. College was a luxury only for upper class or upper middle class people, or for those professions which required more education like medical doctors or engineers. So for those relatively small number of people, college was sort of like a second round of high school.
The modern notion that everyone has to go to some kind of college to not be a failure in life only developed in the second half of the 20th century.
Actually, like a lot of things uniquely American, it was actually a bit of British society practice frozen in time into American culture. In this case, the terms apparently came from usage at Cambridge, although the origins go much further back. Freshmen are literally fresh men or newcomers. Sophomore comes from the Greek, sophos meaning wise and morose meaning dull or foolish. Basically a smart fool. Seniors, or 4th years, were originally called sophesters, the wise, and 3rd years were junior sophs. But junior and senior were long considered opposing terms, with senior designating the older person with more responsibility, and so Senior replaced Sophester and Junior replaced Junior Sophs.
When I went to college, they said that “freshman” was used as derogatory sometimes, so we were supposed to say “first-year” instead. Then we started saying “freshlings”, because we were a bunch of dorks.
I got an email from a local supermarket saying their employees were “heroes” and at this point in the ongoing pandemic I think it counts as derogatory.
In my area the public elementary schools covered grades 1 through 6; junior high was grades 7, 8, and 9; and senior high school was grades 10, 11, and 12. One or two of the elementary schools also offered half-day kindergartens. That pattern still holds true today; the only exception is that ‘junior high’ designation has been replaced with ‘middle school’.
We also had a couple of religious schools (Catholic and Lutheran); for them, grade school ran from 1st through 8th grade, and then directly to a four-year high school (grades 9 through 12) — and ditto on the half-day kindergartens.
Generally in the US elementary school is kindergarten through 5th grade (some going through 6th). Middle School is usually 6th through 8th and high school is 9th through 12th. Freshman is a first year high school or college/university student. Sophomore is second year, junior is third year, and senior is 4th year. Sometimes people use “super senior” to refer to someone who is in their 5th year or more of college/university.
The US has thousands of school districts so there’s no uniformity. I went to a 1-8 elementary school, though in 7th grade jumped to a high school (9-12) that had a 7-8 grade program attached, so I guess in a sense I went to middle school. This is the first time I’ve had that thought and I’m in my 40s now, we didn’t use the phrase then.
But in general middle/junior high could be 6-8, 7-8, or 7-9. I would default to the latter but I watch a lot of anime, and Japan does seem to stick to a 1-6, 7-9, 9-12 division.
For US ages, just add 5: you start 1st grade at age 6, start 12th grade (senior year) at 17, etc.
We’re gonna cut back to them in the commons eating lunch and Becky’s just “wow, Dina, that was amazing! I’m so glad I’ve now come to grips with my fear of sex!”
There’s no degree of “cold and standoffish” to justify making demands of someone else’s body, but that’s not really “cold and standoffish” in this context.
With Sarah, the issue is that she rarely makes any effort at showing she cares about people. She only really knows how to care in big, dramatic ways, and that’s tended to work so far in the series for Joyce because she’s had others to do the immediate support.
With this guy, as Liz is conveying it, Sarah didn’t even give this guy any indication she cared about him. It’s exhausting to feel like you’re the only person making any effort to connect with another person, and eventually “I care, I’m just bad at showing” is just indistinguishable from not caring.
People really don’t get how long siblings will bring up stuff you did. Siblings can be like that. If Liz was a stranger it would be weirder, but siblings? There are probably a lot more stories both ways.
OTOH, with a stranger that would likely be all you remembered, so it wouldn’t be at all weird to bring it up – “Hey, I remember you, you’re the one who stole my boyfriend back in junior high.”
Siblings are different as you say and it’s more likely to be brought up more gently as teasing rather than a long term grudge, since you’ve had a whole ton of other experiences with them.
Unless it’s a pattern or seen as one, in which case each instance might reinforce the grudge with one case serving as the go-to example.
If the move worked, it couldn’t have been a very strong relationship. Also they were basically toddlers, which is the biggest reason it shouldn’t matter.
Oh, a pattern would be a different matter. It’d mean Liz routinely did that sort of thing. Of course, Sarah being Sarah, I can’t imagine it would be difficult for Liz to “steal” her boyfriends by presenting herself as a pleasant alternative. Not that I’m saying she’d be justified in doing so, naturally, just that it’s plausible.
Though, to be strictly accurate, we don’t know from this account how Christopher reacted to Liz sticking her tongue down his throat. It’s possible, if not likely, that he rejected her but Sarah found out and ended it anyway.
He is just a jerk that is long gone, Liz and Sarah are sisters and must see each other semi-regularly. Emotions are going to fester and there is only one outlet.
Wait, this happened in junior high? As in age 10-14?
Unless this is part of a pattern, being mad over this is ridiculous. Whats next, Sarah giving Liz grief over Liz stealing the good bucket in the kindergarden sandbox?
That Sarah says, back when we first learned of this “I only didn’t tell you so you wouldn’t want to see him” suggests some kind of pattern. Whether explicitly trying to steal boyfriends or just other stuff Sarah had isn’t clear. Or whether it’s continued since then of course.
It’s also interesting that when we first heard of it, Liz’s defense was that Sarah hadn’t told her she was seeing him, but here it’s clear that she knew.
Crap, for some reason I remembered the conversation differently. Bleh. That’ll teach me to post the next morning based on what I remember from right before I go to bed.
I ordered something from a clothing store that turned out to use them for shipping and they held onto my package for a week before even trying to send it out.
Also, the “Sarah shouldn’t be upset by this” comments are weird considering it was Liz who brought it up. Sarah already told her why she was taking her back to college. Liz is the one who decided that this was “all for revenge” and brought this up.
(Pretend I have a super cut of all the times “all for revenge” got said in Pat & Liam’s LP of The Phantom Pain.)
So, if Liz was in Junior High, when she was caught making out with Sarah’s bf, that would make her, what? 12? 13? A 13 year old girl was tounging a High School boy, and that High Schooler just went with it. I wonder who Sarah was more angry at, Liz, for initiating it, or her bf, for, for making out, with a 13 year old girl.
Sarah’s almost 2 years older, but only one grade ahead. We don’t know how old Christopher was, but it’s likely not that much worse than making out with her.
She could of course have been mad at him for making out with her sister, but she can ditch him and not have to deal with him again. She’s stuck with Liz.
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you SUFFOCATE christopher? you shove your tongue down his open mouth like the plumber’s snake? oh! oh! jail for sister! jail for sister for One Thousand Years!!!!
FedEx nothing, try the USPS and a package sent in SEPTEMBER (2020)
I had to renew my driver’s license in 2020. It took literally two months. And I did the actual renewal online; I didn’t send the form back to the DMV in the mail. I was driving on an expired license for several days because they just hadn’t gotten around to delivering the replacement. If my birthday were a month later and I lived in a state with voter suppression laws, I wouldn’t have been able to vote.
So was I. The people at the BMV told me not to worry about it because everyone was delayed so the police were apparently not fining people for it.
I drove on an expired license (with the BMV’s express instructions to do so) for three months.
My birthday wasn’t anywhere near the election, though, so I didn’t have that issue.
My birthday is regularly, like, a week after the election. It was frustrating in 2012 when I couldn’t vote, even though my 18th birthday was soooo close.
Well you are Ana Chronistic, makes sense that time would get a little weird around you.
Also, Fun Fact: Some of my relatives are friends with De Joy. They say he is being framed by the liberal media. I’m not sure I believe that one way or the other. I just stay quite and let them talk politics with the older folks while I enjoy their dog. She is very fluffy and very friendly and I love her so much.
i would like to hear more about this dog, please.
So would I. Dogs are infinitely better than politics.
Honey Bear is large auburn/orange goldendoodle. She is normally a very good girl but as might be expected of a COVID puppy who is half golden retriever, she is very excited whenever we first show up during a visit and runs in circles for a while in the front yard unable to contain her excitement. Also, she has a bad habit of stealing and eating paper.
oooo I must pet this dog
Can someone explain what is going on with fedex?
Right? How in the hell can they charge for a given delivery service they basically have no intention of honoring? Seems like false advertising. (Currently bitterly waiting for a delayed package)
If it’s like everywhere else in the world, they’re staffed for the 90’s (meaning already under- for then) and outsourcing all they can to uberized workers who rent vehicles to deliver mail, when not outsourcing the outsourcing, so it’s a bit like putting mail in Mario Bros II’s pipes (or Brazil’s pipes), and hoping it doesn’t land on lava or quicksand.
Gah, 4 days late and there isn’t even an expected delivery date now, just a “delayed”. Rage rage rage.
Got a new business model for FedEx, they could just charge a whole bunch for impossible delivery times like 1 hour and then just say it’s delayed. I mean, what’s stopping them?
I have never had an issue with fedex or USPS, but I have had UPS fold a box containing two 40×60 panes of glass in half lengthwise. It was impressive.
United
Parcel
Smashers
USPS nothing. My dad once showed me an email he had received from a friend in Australia, date-stamped 3 YEARS EARLIER.
He’d assumed they had stopped writing to him, and they probably assumed the same thing. But really their email had just been delayed for 3 years for some bizarre reason. He wrote back apologising for the long delay but “I only just received your email yesterday”… xD
That’s an interesting one. Sounds like a misconfiguration preventing different services servers from talking to each other. SMTP is a plain text protocol, so you can open that email in notepad and should be able to see the send and server delivery timestamps. 3 years is something all right.
SMS has a doubling decay delivery attempt, so if you’ve ever wondered why your messages come in all out of order after your phone has been off/out of service, it’s because the server attempting to deliver messages keep doubling how much time they’ll wait before trying again. So the most recent messages will often come through first, while older ones may get held for nearly as much time as you were disconnected in the first place.
Huh.
Once, while I flew my hang glider off the high mountain for the first time, received several years old SMS on the phone I was carrying with me. It was spooky. I have no explanation.
Texting and gliding? That’s bold.
Well, you know, you got to do something to keep from being bored while up there by yourself. Just don’t drop the phone.
2020? And you just got it now?
Any chance it was
stolenmisplaced by one of their temporary workers and held as evidence until now? Usually some sort of explanation is attached to packages that old.… shit. I need to order a plumber’s snake on Amazon.
Thats…an actual tool right? Please tell me thats a tool. I mean for clearing drains not…Okay, Im gonna shut up now.
Yeah, from memory it’s basically a supersize pipe cleaner (speaking of which, this is why pipe cleaners are called such—they weren’t originally for arts’n’crafts)
A drain snake (also known as a closet auger or a drain auger) is a long spring made out of heavy gauge steel that’s fed down into a drain and spun around to break up or remove a clog that a plunger won’t budge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbS6Akn2E4k
This was junior high?! Like middle school. Who even has time to care about that?
I know. Middle-school is just hormone fueled hellscape anyway. Everyone is swore, confused, and crazy – best just to forgive and try to forget that whole sweaty mess.
Ironic post/Gravatar synergy.
Jesus christ Liz
Morose Self-inflicted Accuse-a-saurus Rex Older Sister,
“Guilt and Apologies Aren’t For Girls That Are Fun To Hang Around” Younger Sister…..
Both have different dads….
Any Chance Mama Clinton was born blind and is a world famous Earth and Metal Bender with a killer wit?
Sadly, I’m pretty sure that would also make her a cop.
…well, okay, an ex-cop who realized that the police weren’t actually making any long-term change for the better or solving any of the societal problems she’d hoped they would and quit the force to find herself.
Cannot help but feel I’ve stumbled through a wormhole here.
Ball State is in the Gamma quadrant?
Everyone at Ball State is chillaxian’ like a Talaxian.
P.S. Are you a friend of DeSoto?
D’oh! I mixed up my quadrants. I guess they’re gettin’ bizarre like a Jem’Hadar instead.
3 days is an eternity from the right perspective, a mayfly would kill for 3 days instead of just one.
That being said, not letting Sarah know about it was a dick move. At least let her know that you are interested in Chris when/if he becomes available.
Liz is right, of course. Since this is Dumbing of Age, three days last for six whole months!
Sarah is holding on to a grudge from middle-school? That seems kinda petty. Of course, I’ve never been cheated on (not that I’ve ever had the opportunity to be).
Assuming it was anything resembling a serious relationship, it’s a really shitty thing to do and it absolutely is the sort of thing that you still feel bitter about years down the line.
To be clear, this is middle school, it very easily could not have cleared the bar of resembling a serious relationship.
Take in account, middle school for Liz, not Sarah.
I don’t think Liz and Sarah are that far apart in age. I thought that this was still Sarah’s sophomore year?
At the very least 2 years apart.
Sarah’s 20, and according to her Liz is 18.
nah they’re like, 15 months apart. There’s a bit where Joe is calculating how long their mum spent not-pregnant, and Sarah gives him the timeline.
This one:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-12/01-sister-christian/quickmath/
Maybe Sarah is mad at the wrong person in that case
To be fair, it was Liz who brought it up because she simply is incapable of comprehending all the other reasons Sarah is escorting her back to Ball State. To Sarah it’s probably not much more than an afterthought.
I like your Avatar. Very handsome.
Sarah did bring it up when Liz asked if Joyce had any hot friends a few days ago, however.
I think it’s at the level of “buried it, unless it can be used as ammunition” for the both of them.
Is it too unreasonable to call Horny Jail on Liz?
She was a minor. Horny probation would probably be sufficient.
Horny Juvy?
Depending on the state and her birthday, she’s possibly *still* a minor.
Are there any states where 18 is still a minor?
Not since 1995, iirc.
In Nebraska age of sexual consent is 19, unless the two people are less than a year apart in which case it does not qualify as statuatory rape. But 18 year olds are still adults who can vote and all
Okay, so… how did Christopher end up dating Sarah if cold and standoff-ish wasn’t his thing? Was she in a coma?
My guess is that the cold shoulder was part of what Christopher initially found attractive about Sarah, only for it to start causing communication issues he didn’t anticipate once they were actually in a relationship.
Yeah, I wouldn’t be surprised if the guy thought cold = cool and that she’d warm up and ‘be normal’ the more she got to know and trust him. Which is now how Sarah do.
I could see it being that Sarah ramped up her school efforts and got less warm with him as a result, especially if she was still trying to get the scholarship she currently has. We’ve seen that her education is vital to her, so it’s possible her priorities shifted. It happens.
I believe it’s been established that Sarah has not always been as closed-off as she is these days.
Au contraire, it’s been repeatedly established that Sarah “doesn’t have an origin story.” At the earliest point we’ve seen her in flashbacks, she self-defines as a “bongoy killjoy misanthrope.”
exceptionally funny to find out that this was in junior high school and not any time later
I interpret it as Liz using a phrase.
now that you point it out, that probably is the intention
I’d imagine that this Christopher situation is more of a microcosm of their relationship in general. I’m just enjoying the Sarah backstory.
I LOVE that this is in middle school and not like 8 months ago lol
I’m trying to remember if dating was even a thing people did when I was in Junior High.
…come to think of it, what grade range would “Junior High” have been where Sarah and Liz grew up? For me, “Intermediate” or “Middle” was grades 6-8, but I understand that it can vary widely.
as a french person, i have no idea what age any of those actually mean
Highschool would be 14-18, middle school/junior high is typically about 12-13/14, age-wise.
If anime has taught me anything, 13-14 is practically peak relationship drama time.
But did you not grew up with US shows about high school and college?
Ok, I forget the actors were always 20 whatever age they were supposed to be…
My Junior High School was grades 7-9, with 9th grade I think being somewhat optional (some students going to high school for 9th grade, but it was more the exception rather than the rule).
Dating was definitely all the rage in my middle school. By college, though, the majority of people seemed more focused on schoolwork and part-time jobs than anything else.
There was hanging out together and then there was dating. Actual dating required transportation, which in the 1960’s required a car and more than a learners permit, which pretty much restricted it to high school seniors and the occasional junior. For girls, you could subtract as much as three years, since they typically didn’t have to drive to date.
But you can get a lot of relationship drama out of hanging out.
Depends where you are too. If you’re in an urban area, there are a lot of ways to meet up and go places without a car.
But yeah, in general girls are likely to start dating earlier, car or not. For many reasons, many of them creepy.
Middle school (what I guess some would call junior high) for me was grades 6-8, around ages 12-14 I think. I don’t know if other kids started dating and stuff at that point, but I know I definitely didn’t until high school. But then, I’ve always been terrible at telling when someone was into me romantically.
7th – 8th grade for me; 12 – 13 years old.
I think it’s fair to feel traumatized and hurt by things people did to you in middle school. There’s definitely stuff I carry. I do think, however, it has to be done with the understanding that middle schoolers are all basically monsters, and holding that hurt against the people they grow up to be is maybe a bit silly.
You’re gonna have a hard go convincing me that “people change” in a world where a troglodyte who makes fun of the disabled and dismisses rape accusations with “nah she ugly” finds 60 million people willing to say “yeah! That! That’s what we need in a President!!!”
People don’t change. People mature physically, they age, they tell themselves “I’m not that person anymore,” but they betray themselves with every vote they cast for the mean and the petty; every fleck of spittle they hurl at service workers; every haughty sniff that the poor deserve their plight, and should not be helped by the government, but by individuals who want to use them to earn Brownie Points for heaven, or else simply to have someone to feel superior to.
People don’t change. Or, if anything, age makes them focus MORE on their own self-interest to the exclusion of all else. Not less.
Oh hi Rachel, didn’t know you could access the comments. How are things going at IU so far this semester?
Ouch. You didn’t have to come at ’em with a flamethrower.
This is so much better than any comeback I could have thought of. A+, Five Stars, applause, the works.
Marry me.
Some people change, others not. It really is that simple.
… I think it’s really weird to go from a comment that says “it’s valid for Sarah to be hurt and traumatized by something that happened to her in middle-school, but you shouldn’t necessarily judge Liz forever for it because she was still a kid and what she did as a developing middle-schooler isn’t necessarily an indicator of what she would do as an an adult” and go “well, but Donald Trump exist and so forgiveness for past misdeeds is inherently wrong, everyone is always the same forever”.
Like you DO remember that in this case we’re not discussing forgiveness for being a racist, sexist, capitalist monster, we are discussing a 14-years-old making out with her sister’s boyfriend? Those are kind of different things that deserve to get different framing.
Welcome to the Internet.
Though I don’t disagree.
The entire point of the comic is that people can change. Joyce and Becky were fundamentalist Christians and young earth creationists, among other things, now Joyce is an atheist and Becky wants to be a scientist.
Not to mention Joyce’s arc is based on Willis themself.
Wait. That would indicate that Willis could change. We all know that that’s impossible.
Next thing you’ll be wanting me to believe that reading the comic could help change people.
Some people are little shits as kids and remain terrible as adults. Other people do change for the better as they grow up. The idea that nobody changes at all from when they were a kid in school is utterly ridiculous.
And I might remind you that in the last election we replaced one president with sexual harassment and assault allegations against him with another.
“holding that hurt against the people they grow up to be is maybe a bit silly.”
Because it is important to give them a chance to fuck you over again.
I don’t buy that people get more moral just because they are older. They get smarter, and have a better idea what they can and can’t get away with, and more inclined to avoid the consequences of their actions. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with admitting they were wrong or not wanting to do it again if they thought it would be a net benefit to them.
Now, you know that’s not what was said. I know you do, because you quotes it directly.
Middle Schoolers are monsters because they’re idiots who literally haven’t lived enough life yet to actually fully understand the consequences of their actions, nor have enough perspective to make (what we might consider to be) rational decisions.
It has nothing to do with morality or admitting they were wrong or whatever. It just means that it is literally silly to hold against a grown person the actions and decisions they made when they were literally too young to have the sort of decision-making skills of a grown person. You ought to look at how they behave as an actual adult–yknow, like, recently?– rather than how they behaved as a child, in order to get a decent picture of whether or not they might fuck you over.
Middle school for me sucked because I was bullied quite a lot by some kids for acting different from them, and I’ve realized after being diagnosed recently that it was probably because I’m autistic. I’m not gonna hold that against them now that we’re all adults, because while some of them might still be jerks, I’m assuming some of the kids who bullied me back then became better people as they grew up.
I don’t think it is, depending on the specifics about what happened. Sometimes if you hurt or traumatize someone, one of the consequences is they don’t forgive you, even if you’ve changed.
But then I had a “friend” who was emotionally abusive when I was very young and I wasn’t even the worst case of her fucking with someone, so that might have coloured my perspective on that, but she had people remarking that her level of lying and lack of care about hurting others was not normal since she was like six.
the Fedex trauma is real uh
What is going on with fedex?
Willis ordered a Transformer, they neglected to deliver it for multiple days in a row, once getting as far as the next door neighbor’s house before turning around, even though the tracking info said it was on the truck.
(My guess is it kept getting scanned as “on the truck” along with a pile of other boxes, but those didn’t actually fit on the truck so they were left at the depot with a bogus scan.)
I bet the driver is absolutely fascinated by this grade-A drama going on right behind them with complete disregard for their presence.
Bets on them chiming in at some point before the ride’s over?
Ten minutes ago he started to ask if they minded if he turned the radio on during this hour drive and then *this* happened. He’s now wondering if it would be rude to put in headphones or start taking notes for a young adult novel
Take +5 for yer comment.
Yeah, I really don’t care for Liz and sympathize a lot with Sarah.
I mean, yeah, that seems right.
Sarah dates a guy, this guy thinks she doesn’t actually like him, and then he’s told that actually she really cares deep down and that means she never has to say or act on this.
(Please disregard that for months I was real insistent that Liz never swiped Sarah’s boyfriend)
I took Liz’s side, turns out she knew Sarah was dating him all along.
Well yeah, but then we get the info that Sarah’s usual behaviour made him feel that she didn’t like him and Liz runs defense that he just has to ignore that everything Sarah constantly does to affirm that she can’t stand other people.
She kissed a guy who thought Sarah didn’t like him. That sounds like the kind of thing a 14 year old would do.
LOL that has such a “now that I said it out loud….whoops” energy and I love it
Well, I got my story time
*plays Julie Brown’s “Earth Girls Are Easy” on the radio of a pickup truck overtaking their car*
So, Sarah’s the Dorothy Zbornak, Liz is clearly Rue, Joyce is Rose, so who can be Sophia?
I mean, if Liz has never expressed remorse for it-and makes a habit of blaming her for it-why wouldn’t she ‘hold a grudge’? That’s not holding a grudge, that’s just not letting your sister treat you like shit.
Also there is the acting like she would do it again in the present day if the opportunity existed. So it is like. You learned nothing and would do it again. You can’t exactly forgive and forget a past behaviour that is still something they would do again now.
This whole thing reminds me of a certain song:
🎵 Lord help the Mister, that comes between me and my sister,
And Lord help the Sister, that comes between me and my man! 🎵
Love me some Puppini Sisters
Never heard of them. The song is from “White Christmas” with Bing Crosby & Danny Kaye. It was sung by the “Haynes Sisters” (Rosemary Clooney & Vera-Ellen). Great movie!
They’re a trio that does a lot of old sing tunes, and also does swing covers of new songs and some originals (which I had thought that one was)
Cool animation on that. Here’s the original from White Christmas. Later in the movie, the girls can’t perform for some reason, so Bing & Danny wear their outfits and lip sync to the song. 😀
That song leapt into my head a few weeks ago and I hadn’t heard it in maybe 15 years. Your turn with the brain cell?
This is middle school? Sarah get over it!
She’s gonna carry that grudge a long time.
Well now. That clears up a lot from yesterday. If this was Junior High-age, then she would’ve been around 12 – 15 years old? Old enough to try and save her sister’s relationship and also old enough to know better than to stick her tongue down his throat after a few days. Me thinks Chris pretty much hedged his bets on the younger sister giving him attention and was right.
Can someone from the USA please explain what Junior High is? Where I’m from we have primary (grades 1-6), secondary (grades 7-9) and tertiary (grades 10-12) schools.
Also if you’re feeling generous please also explain what the heck is a freshman or a sophomore because I keep seeing those words and never understanding them.
Elementary is usually (1-5)
Middle/Junior High is usually (6-8)
and High school is (9-12)
Freshman = 9
Sophomore = 10
Junior = 11 (not to be confused with Junior High)
Senior = 12 (not to be confused with senior citizens)
Note that these names are repeated for the first four years of college or university.
WHY?!
Because!
What, you want us to come up with 4 new names?
I am not familiar with the actual history of the terms, but in the Good Old Days (i.e. before 1950) high school was usually set up as 4 years long. Finishing high school was all that was expected of people who weren’t going to be failures in life.
(And back in the 19th century, a “school-leaving certificate,” basically a diploma for 6th grade (age 11-12) was the standard.)
College was also four years long, but was not a thing expected of most people. College was a luxury only for upper class or upper middle class people, or for those professions which required more education like medical doctors or engineers. So for those relatively small number of people, college was sort of like a second round of high school.
The modern notion that everyone has to go to some kind of college to not be a failure in life only developed in the second half of the 20th century.
Tradition.
Actually, like a lot of things uniquely American, it was actually a bit of British society practice frozen in time into American culture. In this case, the terms apparently came from usage at Cambridge, although the origins go much further back. Freshmen are literally fresh men or newcomers. Sophomore comes from the Greek, sophos meaning wise and morose meaning dull or foolish. Basically a smart fool. Seniors, or 4th years, were originally called sophesters, the wise, and 3rd years were junior sophs. But junior and senior were long considered opposing terms, with senior designating the older person with more responsibility, and so Senior replaced Sophester and Junior replaced Junior Sophs.
And that’s why.
When I went to college, they said that “freshman” was used as derogatory sometimes, so we were supposed to say “first-year” instead. Then we started saying “freshlings”, because we were a bunch of dorks.
Makes sense. But literally anything can be used in a derogatory manner. It all depends on context, you “commenter,” you.
I got an email from a local supermarket saying their employees were “heroes” and at this point in the ongoing pandemic I think it counts as derogatory.
In my area the public elementary schools covered grades 1 through 6; junior high was grades 7, 8, and 9; and senior high school was grades 10, 11, and 12. One or two of the elementary schools also offered half-day kindergartens. That pattern still holds true today; the only exception is that ‘junior high’ designation has been replaced with ‘middle school’.
We also had a couple of religious schools (Catholic and Lutheran); for them, grade school ran from 1st through 8th grade, and then directly to a four-year high school (grades 9 through 12) — and ditto on the half-day kindergartens.
Generally in the US elementary school is kindergarten through 5th grade (some going through 6th). Middle School is usually 6th through 8th and high school is 9th through 12th. Freshman is a first year high school or college/university student. Sophomore is second year, junior is third year, and senior is 4th year. Sometimes people use “super senior” to refer to someone who is in their 5th year or more of college/university.
The US has thousands of school districts so there’s no uniformity. I went to a 1-8 elementary school, though in 7th grade jumped to a high school (9-12) that had a 7-8 grade program attached, so I guess in a sense I went to middle school. This is the first time I’ve had that thought and I’m in my 40s now, we didn’t use the phrase then.
But in general middle/junior high could be 6-8, 7-8, or 7-9. I would default to the latter but I watch a lot of anime, and Japan does seem to stick to a 1-6, 7-9, 9-12 division.
For US ages, just add 5: you start 1st grade at age 6, start 12th grade (senior year) at 17, etc.
Since I don’t think anyone’s said the actual ages yet… middle/junior high school would generally be 11-13.
https://i.imgur.com/S6PY1XU.png
More Becky and Dina.
Splendid Yoto! 😆
Feeling inspired, I see! 😉
Ha! That was good!
I love how much Becky’s blushing in panel one, and you manage to get her to blush MORE in the next one!
Initiate Overblush Protocol!
I approve on Amber’s behalf.
haha excellent! i love the teeth =B
(i’ve only now managed to see it, i seem to have an issue with imgur lately for some reason)
this is so beautiful, love it (& v charming/in-character)
Since we’re on the subject of tongues going down in throats, how about we go back to Becky and Dina?
We’re gonna cut back to them in the commons eating lunch and Becky’s just “wow, Dina, that was amazing! I’m so glad I’ve now come to grips with my fear of sex!”
They will be having cereal for lunch.
“You’ve got your tongue down her throat, and her legs up on the mantelpiece…” – Bogus Computer Psychiatrist
Are there non-Bogus Computer Psychiatrists?
I mean, I didn’t even know computers required psychiatrists.
No no, a Bogus Computer Psychiatrist is a psychiatrist who specializes in treating Bogus Computers.
How about we don’t and let them have some privacy
That’s like double-forever in junior high.
Still feels like yesterday to some people.
For reference, as of this particular moment, 3 days ago was 6 months ago.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-11/05-as-long-as-its-free/standing/
I’d forgotten about the door-lecturing douchebag. If only that forgetting had stayed forgotten.
If it really was junior high, it just straight-up doesn’t matter.
USA got a real issue with delivery, isn’t? Like, I’ve seen a lot of news and funny videos, about mailing issues and shit…
Sheesh, can’t “cold and standoffish” people just be allowed to be that way without everyone making a federal case about it? Especially in junior high?
I had an ex-boyfriend in junior high accuse me of being weird and cold because I didn’t feel ready to let him grab my boobs.
There’s no degree of “cold and standoffish” to justify making demands of someone else’s body, but that’s not really “cold and standoffish” in this context.
With Sarah, the issue is that she rarely makes any effort at showing she cares about people. She only really knows how to care in big, dramatic ways, and that’s tended to work so far in the series for Joyce because she’s had others to do the immediate support.
With this guy, as Liz is conveying it, Sarah didn’t even give this guy any indication she cared about him. It’s exhausting to feel like you’re the only person making any effort to connect with another person, and eventually “I care, I’m just bad at showing” is just indistinguishable from not caring.
People really don’t get how long siblings will bring up stuff you did. Siblings can be like that. If Liz was a stranger it would be weirder, but siblings? There are probably a lot more stories both ways.
OTOH, with a stranger that would likely be all you remembered, so it wouldn’t be at all weird to bring it up – “Hey, I remember you, you’re the one who stole my boyfriend back in junior high.”
Siblings are different as you say and it’s more likely to be brought up more gently as teasing rather than a long term grudge, since you’ve had a whole ton of other experiences with them.
Unless it’s a pattern or seen as one, in which case each instance might reinforce the grudge with one case serving as the go-to example.
Shoving the tongue down in someone throat. This must be how young people are dating nowadays *taking notes*
Hey, it looks to me like Liz isn’t the horrible monster so many people in these comments are making her out to be.
Yeah, I mean she waited THREE days before making a move on her sisters boyfriend!
If the move worked, it couldn’t have been a very strong relationship. Also they were basically toddlers, which is the biggest reason it shouldn’t matter.
Yeah, I had to look up the age for junior high and you’re right. Relationship drama during that time doesn’t matter.
Unless its a part of a longer pattern.
Oh, a pattern would be a different matter. It’d mean Liz routinely did that sort of thing. Of course, Sarah being Sarah, I can’t imagine it would be difficult for Liz to “steal” her boyfriends by presenting herself as a pleasant alternative. Not that I’m saying she’d be justified in doing so, naturally, just that it’s plausible.
I never did understand the whole “steal” idea.
What about the boyfriends agency?
Was he just innocent in this whole thing, not making any decisions about the thing?
Nah, he’s a jerk too, but that doesn’t make Liz any less of a jerk for it.
Though, to be strictly accurate, we don’t know from this account how Christopher reacted to Liz sticking her tongue down his throat. It’s possible, if not likely, that he rejected her but Sarah found out and ended it anyway.
He is just a jerk that is long gone, Liz and Sarah are sisters and must see each other semi-regularly. Emotions are going to fester and there is only one outlet.
Christ could have died and risen again by that time!
Wait, this happened in junior high? As in age 10-14?
Unless this is part of a pattern, being mad over this is ridiculous. Whats next, Sarah giving Liz grief over Liz stealing the good bucket in the kindergarden sandbox?
As in like 4-5 years ago and probably Sarah’s first boyfriend.
That Sarah says, back when we first learned of this “I only didn’t tell you so you wouldn’t want to see him” suggests some kind of pattern. Whether explicitly trying to steal boyfriends or just other stuff Sarah had isn’t clear. Or whether it’s continued since then of course.
It’s also interesting that when we first heard of it, Liz’s defense was that Sarah hadn’t told her she was seeing him, but here it’s clear that she knew.
Looking back at the comic you mention ( https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-12/01-sister-christian/pickyeater/ ), it sounds an awful lot like these are two separate events. Perhaps Christopher was the first time and the other more recent. If so, presumably we’ll be hearing more about it tomorrow
You know, the fact this is coming out now instead of years prior puts some things in a different light.
I mean, Sarah never apparently considered Christopher had approached her sister because he was trying to assess some very real relationship issues.
Also telling might be that Sarah assumes in this story that he made the first move.
Where this is heading, I don’t know.
Crap, for some reason I remembered the conversation differently. Bleh. That’ll teach me to post the next morning based on what I remember from right before I go to bed.
Well, Liz was in Junior High. So say 14, with Sarah being 15 or 16 and the boy being 17. And then, of course, five or six years for it to fester.
It’s not necessary that Christopher was older – I don’t think we’ve seen any sign of his age.
So wait
Is Sarah the Raidah in this case for what went down between her, Jacob and Joyce?
On second thought, that comparison doesn’t gel like I thought it did.
…this was in junior high, and they’re just talkin about it now? 😐
It might be Liz’s first time explaining why Christopher approached her but it’s not their first time talking about it at all.
Thinking about how the last three days in this storyline have been going on since August…
I now understand why Liz hates her
Dick move
Freaking FedEx, man!
I ordered something from a clothing store that turned out to use them for shipping and they held onto my package for a week before even trying to send it out.
Also, the “Sarah shouldn’t be upset by this” comments are weird considering it was Liz who brought it up. Sarah already told her why she was taking her back to college. Liz is the one who decided that this was “all for revenge” and brought this up.
(Pretend I have a super cut of all the times “all for revenge” got said in Pat & Liam’s LP of The Phantom Pain.)
So, if Liz was in Junior High, when she was caught making out with Sarah’s bf, that would make her, what? 12? 13? A 13 year old girl was tounging a High School boy, and that High Schooler just went with it. I wonder who Sarah was more angry at, Liz, for initiating it, or her bf, for, for making out, with a 13 year old girl.
Sarah’s almost 2 years older, but only one grade ahead. We don’t know how old Christopher was, but it’s likely not that much worse than making out with her.
She could of course have been mad at him for making out with her sister, but she can ditch him and not have to deal with him again. She’s stuck with Liz.