Gotta agree with Ray here. Ruth is an adult, literally of age, and is not under any sort of authority of Daisy. Hell, if she were, this would be inappropriate. But even were Daisy present, Ruth’s drinking is not Daisy’s responsibility and it would start an unhealthy dynamic were it so.
It’s really worrying that she’s drinking not because she’s depressed but because she doesn’t know how to positively interact with a person. It feels more like alcohol as a coping mechanism to any stress and less a side effect of depression.
I mean, we already knew she was an alcoholic. Part of her depression-alcoholism hellspiral was that she hated the fact that she was drinking, because her parents were killed by a drunk driver, but then she kept drinking and that further fueled the self-loathing. That wasn’t going to go away with antidepressants, because it’s a behavior pattern as well, and it was worrying coming out of the timeskip that her takeaway on why she shouldn’t drink was ‘bad with the old meds’ and ‘underage,’ not ‘this would have been seriously concerning for someone in their thirties.’ Since alcohol is also a chemically addictive substance, her drinking again at all is a serious flag that Nothing Good Can Come Of This. (I’d been hoping they were jokes, damn it.)
But also, I wouldn’t be shocked if part of her is unconsciously trying to wreck the date with Daisy (as a comparison, consider Jennifer’s pre-skip hall meeting and how it went from ‘I’m not a perfect cheerleading goddess’ to ‘my current relationship was originally founded in mutual self-loathing and I have a drinking problem and holy shit I’m only now connecting that it almost killed me and my best friend, no wonder she doesn’t want to talk to me anymore’. Same Brain Trying To Sink Other Relationships So People Don’t Waste Their Time On Garbage Like You impulse, slightly different manifestations.) Which is very much a depression thing, born out of low self-worth. Just because Ruth isn’t currently suicidal doesn’t mean she’s not slipping. Probably in part due to her isolation – waking up alone seemed to remind her how she screwed up with Jennifer, and despite hall sweethearts like Sierra and Agatha trying to include her, the fact that she’s RA definitionally sets her apart. Also from experience, singles can make it very easy for you to isolate yourself if your brain’s already being troublesome. Especially since symptoms of depression often include physical fatigue and exhaustion, so you might just think ‘oh, I’m a bit more tired than usual’ and not notice you’re taking four-hour afternoon naps and going to bed at 8 PM to sleep until 10 AM. Easier for a roommate to tell the door’s not just closed to study. (Not that that’s definitely going on with Ruth yet, but an example that someone who hasn’t trained their brain to recognize their early signs might miss.)
I know it’s humor, possibly self-depreciating, but I can’t help but be bothered by Ruth’s notion that it’s traditional for her to bully and insult her partners. Like I get it’s not so simple and she’s an overall good person, but describing it that way…
I think she is at heart a good person struggling with an unhealthy mental mindset she was lashing out due to her self loathing but felt bad about it and got much better quickly when helped but we see here she’s not recovered yet and it will be hard she definitely is worried about how she treats people
It depends on your definition of a good person, ’cause like, the nicest thing you can say about pre-character development Ruth is that she did her job sometimes in between focusing her abuse on Billie to the extent that the rest of the dorm never really dealt with it, to the point where Rachel apparently feels guilty she never stood up to Ruth for it.
I don’t know what makes a truly good person, but to me a truly bad person who knowingly and systematically breaks down your safety and comfort for their own gain. That’s Blaine, that’s Clint, that’s Ross no matter what he told himself, and, well, that used to be Ruth.
Th a ts fair but she also was pretty early on obviously felt bad about her worst tendencies and started improving quickly once she got some help which makes her seem less malicious and more sympathetic. She seems to have turned her abusive streak inward even more which is not a good thing. No one in this series is okay exactly accept Dinah and Sarah
In my country there is a belief that prisoners are “good people who’ve done bad things”, this idea is noble but extremely flawed
You may have good intentions but if your actions are bad (or harmful or whatever) then you are a bad person, it doesn’t mean you can’t change but, for now, you are a bad person because you do bad things to people (mental illness aside)
It sounds like your country has it right more than you do. Prison exists to rehabilitate, not punish, and if a prison exists only for punishment, if it continues to punish you after you’ve left, then it doesn’t deserve to exist.
You are incorrect. Prisons are, in effect, time out.
Saying prisons (or society) can force a criminals behaviour to change is like saying an addict can be forced to go clean
It isn’t going to work, in most cases, because change only happens when the prisoner (or addict, in most cases both at the same time) wants to and chooses to change
Also I work in my countries prisons as a Corrections Officer so this isn’t theory for me
It’s probably a good thing I didn’t say they can be forced to change, and if you don’t believe in rehabilitation you probably shouldn’t work in a prison.
You probably shouldn’t tell someone that has been involved in riots, staff assualts and suicide attempts (and remained relatively unscathed) where they should or shouldn’t be working because I’ve earned the right, through time on the floor, to have the opinions I have
I didn’t say I don’t believe in rehabilitation. I said that without the prisoner wanting to and choosing to rehabilitate then rehabilitation won’t work
You can lead a horse to water maybe a cliche but it only became a cliche because of the element of truth to it
Yes you didn’t say they can be forced to change but the point I’m making is without the prisoners buy in rehabilitation, virtually, never happens
You have the right to your own opinions and your experiences, but the data available says that Spencer is right and that rehabilitative approaches are more successful and that they lower reoffending rates. That’s why prison reform and prison abolition have both been picking up steam lately.
“rehabilitative approaches are more successful and that they lower reoffending rates.”
Of course rehabilitative approaches are more successful than not rehabilitating.
That is not in dispute.
The point I’m trying to make is you can’t make someone rehabilitate that doesn’t want to.
You can make them sit in the chair, you can coerce them, you can use any number of inducements but you can’t make them learn it once they’re in the room
So yes if someone wants to rehabilitate and use the courses available then they’re less likely to reoffend but how do you make someone want to rehabilitate in the first place
You seem to be under the impression I’m talking about rehab being voluntarily undertaken. I’m referring to rehabilitative approaches given as part of a sentence, whether the person wants to do them or not. Those still have higher rates of success and cutting on re-offending than prison.
“How’s life treating you, Norm?”
“Like a baby treats a diaper.”
If you want more of the Cheers universe, try Wings. (Yeah, Frasier is also in the same universe, but it’s more of its own thing.) Fun fact: Cape Air still owns and operates the plane used to shoot the intro.
I think Booster was definitely on the nose about Ruth trying to play the part of herself and act like she did at the beginning of the year. She seems torn between acting like a version of herself she’s “comfortable” with, and trying to move on. Panel 5 gives me hope, but Panel 6 has me uncertain.
Hmmm.. I wasn’t really expecting an analysis, butt.. It’s presumably a bit tidier if you do (clean up first), but really it boils down to what’s desired and consented to between partners. And presumably the heat of the moment.
Ruth, you don’t need to drink in order to be around Daisy. Even if this is just a one time thing, you can celebrate with her and not have to feel guilty.
Also, she didn’t expect Daisy to still be down for business. Ruth very clearly stated that she’d be awful for Daisy (both because she believes it and because she doesn’t want things to work out with her) and yet, Daisy is still there.
It’s the second time that a woman is willing to give her a chance, while being forewarned of her shittiness. As Ruth said, “things are just different enough”. Last time had… mixed results, from what we’ve seen. Would it be the same with Daisy ?
Ruth has said that she and Jennifer found out together that Ruth is into girls, which would preclude a scenario of Ruth being attracted to Rachel two years previously.
“And by ‘Tab’ I mean the vile-tasting stuff in this vaguely magenta can that looks like it’s been sitting here behind the bar since the Carter Administration.”
Maybe this is a good sign. Maybe Ruth is really starting to feel something for Daisy. Maybe this will be a whole new type of relationship for her♡. Let’s hope Daisy is not just horny and they would be happy together.
I predict the date will go beautifully. But Ruth won’t remember any of it.
The second date will be Daisy telling her all the best parts. (because journalism major)
I am concerned we see that Ruth is better than she was *positive* she’s taking her meds and trying to move on even if poorly and clumsily but not doing super well *still using alcohol to cope* and some very worrying self-destructive talk im sad
Yes, Ruth is not nearly as “in recovery” as she claimed to be. I think Halloween will show that Ruth bullied and intimidated Billie a lot before the latter found out she was still drinking and thus a complete hypocrite.
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If I’ve learned anything from Saiki K., it’s that nice people can definitely think terrible things, so maybe consider that and save your kidneys
(idk for absolute certain tho, I’ve had limited “nice vs. not nice” sexual experience)
I hope nice people can think terrible things because it they can’t then I’ve been fooling myself by ever thinking I was nice…
I’m a little worried now but also weirdly optimistic about the Ruth x Daisy ship?
It’s probably doomed, but hopefully it’ll ultimately be a positive thing
Hey, Jennifer specifically told Daisy not to let Ruth drink. https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-11/04-hompk/hooking/
Whatever happens now is definitely Daisy’s fault.
Hard to blame her for things Ruth does while she is literally not even in the same room
Gotta agree with Ray here. Ruth is an adult, literally of age, and is not under any sort of authority of Daisy. Hell, if she were, this would be inappropriate. But even were Daisy present, Ruth’s drinking is not Daisy’s responsibility and it would start an unhealthy dynamic were it so.
Daisy’s in the bathroom. She doesn’t know this is happening.
Is she supposed to Spidey-Sense it and come running out of the bathroom?
Look at all these people who don’t get Clif.
I know, right?
Everyone knows it’s Danny’s fault, he woke up today.
At least Daisy might finally get laid, but I’m not sure if they’ll actually become a couple.
Yeeeeep. Definitely self-loathing and self-destruction going on. Definitely something that alcohol won’t aggravate further!
Hoo boy.
It’s really worrying that she’s drinking not because she’s depressed but because she doesn’t know how to positively interact with a person. It feels more like alcohol as a coping mechanism to any stress and less a side effect of depression.
probably, yeah. 🙁
I mean, we already knew she was an alcoholic. Part of her depression-alcoholism hellspiral was that she hated the fact that she was drinking, because her parents were killed by a drunk driver, but then she kept drinking and that further fueled the self-loathing. That wasn’t going to go away with antidepressants, because it’s a behavior pattern as well, and it was worrying coming out of the timeskip that her takeaway on why she shouldn’t drink was ‘bad with the old meds’ and ‘underage,’ not ‘this would have been seriously concerning for someone in their thirties.’ Since alcohol is also a chemically addictive substance, her drinking again at all is a serious flag that Nothing Good Can Come Of This. (I’d been hoping they were jokes, damn it.)
But also, I wouldn’t be shocked if part of her is unconsciously trying to wreck the date with Daisy (as a comparison, consider Jennifer’s pre-skip hall meeting and how it went from ‘I’m not a perfect cheerleading goddess’ to ‘my current relationship was originally founded in mutual self-loathing and I have a drinking problem and holy shit I’m only now connecting that it almost killed me and my best friend, no wonder she doesn’t want to talk to me anymore’. Same Brain Trying To Sink Other Relationships So People Don’t Waste Their Time On Garbage Like You impulse, slightly different manifestations.) Which is very much a depression thing, born out of low self-worth. Just because Ruth isn’t currently suicidal doesn’t mean she’s not slipping. Probably in part due to her isolation – waking up alone seemed to remind her how she screwed up with Jennifer, and despite hall sweethearts like Sierra and Agatha trying to include her, the fact that she’s RA definitionally sets her apart. Also from experience, singles can make it very easy for you to isolate yourself if your brain’s already being troublesome. Especially since symptoms of depression often include physical fatigue and exhaustion, so you might just think ‘oh, I’m a bit more tired than usual’ and not notice you’re taking four-hour afternoon naps and going to bed at 8 PM to sleep until 10 AM. Easier for a roommate to tell the door’s not just closed to study. (Not that that’s definitely going on with Ruth yet, but an example that someone who hasn’t trained their brain to recognize their early signs might miss.)
“Also from experience, singles can make it very easy for you to isolate yourself if your brain’s already being troublesome”
This. Seconded to hell and back.
Just came here to second that as soon as I read it. So… thirded?
That is what alcohol is for an alcoholic. It can be difficult to deal with basically anything if you’re used do drown everything in alcohol.
Going for the Walkyverse Mike approach I see
I know it’s humor, possibly self-depreciating, but I can’t help but be bothered by Ruth’s notion that it’s traditional for her to bully and insult her partners. Like I get it’s not so simple and she’s an overall good person, but describing it that way…
….I feel like my icon is ironic given my post.
Juries still out whether she is, overall, a good person
I think she is at heart a good person struggling with an unhealthy mental mindset she was lashing out due to her self loathing but felt bad about it and got much better quickly when helped but we see here she’s not recovered yet and it will be hard she definitely is worried about how she treats people
It depends on your definition of a good person, ’cause like, the nicest thing you can say about pre-character development Ruth is that she did her job sometimes in between focusing her abuse on Billie to the extent that the rest of the dorm never really dealt with it, to the point where Rachel apparently feels guilty she never stood up to Ruth for it.
I don’t know what makes a truly good person, but to me a truly bad person who knowingly and systematically breaks down your safety and comfort for their own gain. That’s Blaine, that’s Clint, that’s Ross no matter what he told himself, and, well, that used to be Ruth.
Th a ts fair but she also was pretty early on obviously felt bad about her worst tendencies and started improving quickly once she got some help which makes her seem less malicious and more sympathetic. She seems to have turned her abusive streak inward even more which is not a good thing. No one in this series is okay exactly accept Dinah and Sarah
In my country there is a belief that prisoners are “good people who’ve done bad things”, this idea is noble but extremely flawed
You may have good intentions but if your actions are bad (or harmful or whatever) then you are a bad person, it doesn’t mean you can’t change but, for now, you are a bad person because you do bad things to people (mental illness aside)
It sounds like your country has it right more than you do. Prison exists to rehabilitate, not punish, and if a prison exists only for punishment, if it continues to punish you after you’ve left, then it doesn’t deserve to exist.
Life ain’t so binary.
You are incorrect. Prisons are, in effect, time out.
Saying prisons (or society) can force a criminals behaviour to change is like saying an addict can be forced to go clean
It isn’t going to work, in most cases, because change only happens when the prisoner (or addict, in most cases both at the same time) wants to and chooses to change
Also I work in my countries prisons as a Corrections Officer so this isn’t theory for me
It’s probably a good thing I didn’t say they can be forced to change, and if you don’t believe in rehabilitation you probably shouldn’t work in a prison.
You probably shouldn’t tell someone that has been involved in riots, staff assualts and suicide attempts (and remained relatively unscathed) where they should or shouldn’t be working because I’ve earned the right, through time on the floor, to have the opinions I have
I didn’t say I don’t believe in rehabilitation. I said that without the prisoner wanting to and choosing to rehabilitate then rehabilitation won’t work
You can lead a horse to water maybe a cliche but it only became a cliche because of the element of truth to it
Yes you didn’t say they can be forced to change but the point I’m making is without the prisoners buy in rehabilitation, virtually, never happens
You have the right to your own opinions and your experiences, but the data available says that Spencer is right and that rehabilitative approaches are more successful and that they lower reoffending rates. That’s why prison reform and prison abolition have both been picking up steam lately.
“rehabilitative approaches are more successful and that they lower reoffending rates.”
Of course rehabilitative approaches are more successful than not rehabilitating.
That is not in dispute.
The point I’m trying to make is you can’t make someone rehabilitate that doesn’t want to.
You can make them sit in the chair, you can coerce them, you can use any number of inducements but you can’t make them learn it once they’re in the room
So yes if someone wants to rehabilitate and use the courses available then they’re less likely to reoffend but how do you make someone want to rehabilitate in the first place
You seem to be under the impression I’m talking about rehab being voluntarily undertaken. I’m referring to rehabilitative approaches given as part of a sentence, whether the person wants to do them or not. Those still have higher rates of success and cutting on re-offending than prison.
Hm, this is pretty yikes.
Anyway, prisons are a mess. Here, at least, and it certainly sounds like it in your country too.
They certainly are and its actually worse than people think
I think its actually quite clear Ruth is a terrible girlfriend. That was never not canon.
I mean, it seemed like she was getting better, before Willis took Halloween away from us.
I watched all of Cheers last year (because 2020), so I’m just gonna assume Jason is cutting up lemons or limes that will never get used in panel 3.
It’s the go-to bartender stage business.
That, or he’s polishing a glass that’s already clean
NORM!
Good afternoon Mister Peterson.
“How’s life treating you, Norm?”
“Like a baby treats a diaper.”
If you want more of the Cheers universe, try Wings. (Yeah, Frasier is also in the same universe, but it’s more of its own thing.) Fun fact: Cape Air still owns and operates the plane used to shoot the intro.
Things are going… I don’t know what the right word is.
Inexorably forward through time?
To hell in a handbasket?
Parallel to entropy.
Wibbly wobbly.
blargh?
That’s the one!
They were going okay-ish enough, but Ruth’s self-sabotaging inner voice of doubt won’t shut up.
I think Booster was definitely on the nose about Ruth trying to play the part of herself and act like she did at the beginning of the year. She seems torn between acting like a version of herself she’s “comfortable” with, and trying to move on. Panel 5 gives me hope, but Panel 6 has me uncertain.
Booster tends to be on the nose, like generally
Well, since Willis uses Booster as a Greek chorus, yeah…
The old Greek chorus is dead (maybe), long live the new Greek chorus!
I don’t wanna fuck a nice person. I wanna fuck a real piece of shit.
(cue Lenny and Squiggy) — “Hello!”
oh lord, it’s been I-don’t-wanna-think-how-many decades and I can still hear that line.
Ruth asks Daisy to roleplay a mean person.
Daisy: “Grrr, I hate puppies. Watch me do littering. Is this working?”
Ruth: “No, sorry.”
Daisy: “Rats. Hey, you have a Maple Leafs poster, cool. Aren’t they actually kinda bad though?”
Ruth: “TAKE ME NOW!”
“….Wear the Dave Keon jersey, though.”
So… anal?
No, scatophilia.
Ruth’s foreplay involves her in a Leafs jersey and her partner in a jersey from whichever team that’s currently leading their division.
2girls1stanleycup
I thought you were supposed to clean up first, before you do that. Not that I would know.
Hmmm.. I wasn’t really expecting an analysis, butt.. It’s presumably a bit tidier if you do (clean up first), but really it boils down to what’s desired and consented to between partners. And presumably the heat of the moment.
Go and get it…With Your Good Credit
No limits…With Your Good Credit
(Don’t Leave Home Withou~out It!)
You don’t need no green to make your scene!
You can get anything you seek,
For a dollar down, and a dollar a week.
There’s maybe four ways that this can go where everything works out nicely, tops – and something like 2¹² ways this is going to go completely to shit.
So which Avenger has to die this time? Because I’m willing to sacrifice Hawkeye and maybe even a couple of Guardians if it’ll help Ruth out.
Let’s be real Strange was completely full of shit when he said there was one timeline where they won
Is it really winning if he still has to put up with Tony Stark at the end of it?
Yeah, he checked like twenty timelines, tops, and got bored right away.
Yeah, he never considered the Ant-Man solution.
I’m willing to sacrifice the entirety of the DC Murderverse, except Shazam!. And I don’t want anything in return.
Better odds than trying to win against Thanos then.
Ruth is drinking. This has already gone to the bad place.
Ruth, you don’t need to drink in order to be around Daisy. Even if this is just a one time thing, you can celebrate with her and not have to feel guilty.
Ruth is apparently displeased this isn’t a train wreck that she can go yell at Billie about. She clearly didn’t come here expecting to like Daisy.
Also, she didn’t expect Daisy to still be down for business. Ruth very clearly stated that she’d be awful for Daisy (both because she believes it and because she doesn’t want things to work out with her) and yet, Daisy is still there.
It’s the second time that a woman is willing to give her a chance, while being forewarned of her shittiness. As Ruth said, “things are just different enough”. Last time had… mixed results, from what we’ve seen. Would it be the same with Daisy ?
I wonder if she had a crush on Rachael at some point.
And did something fucked up in the prequel year.
I would like to see Rachaels experiences with Ruth but also concurrently from Ruths pov (if that makes sense)
Maybe? Might even have been reciprocated a little
It was *two* years previously. https://www.dumbingofage.com/2019/comic/book-10/01-birthday-pursuit/blankslate/
Ruth has said that she and Jennifer found out together that Ruth is into girls, which would preclude a scenario of Ruth being attracted to Rachel two years previously.
Eh. Just because Ruth has some self-awareness doesn’t mean it’s complete.
We also know that Ruth doesn’t remember her freshman year with Rachel due to memory loss.
Not sure if there’s been any indication of Rachel being bi, but it’s not like there’s been anything flat-out saying she isn’t.
I’d honestly be down for both of them just doing shots and talking.
I say again – RUTH NO.
I’m betting $5 that she ends up having sex with Jason instead.
Well, based on Penny, he definitely doesn’t object to redheads.
I love Daisy but this is a way more interesting scenario to me.
and we are now firmly in “Ruth no” territory. 🙁
I recognise this. This is the ol’ “one is too many, two is not enough” as previously demonstrated by Vimes in the Discworld books.
Ruth! Noooooooooooooooooooo!
But the only nice person in the whole campus is freakin’ Dina and she is otherwise “unavailable”.
Agatha’s pretty nice too, I hear.
So are Sierra, Mandy, and Grace. And Lucy.
The pod people over in Forest seem okay too, just ignore Rose’s petty knife larceny.
This is Lucy erasure.
“And by ‘Tab’ I mean the vile-tasting stuff in this vaguely magenta can that looks like it’s been sitting here behind the bar since the Carter Administration.”
It must have been, that stuff was discontinued way back in… *checks* DECEMBER?!
Dammit I forgot I was skipping todays post
PEE QUICKLY DAISY
Not the first time her bladder’s gotten in her way. (Remember her bonus strip that takes place during the Desanto rally?)
Did Ruth ‘bully’ her boyfriend in Canada, too?
Things are slightly different in Canada, usually nicer.
It’s cool. They just played hockey together.
And it’s ok here, but we still have our fair share of assholes, criminals, rapists, murderers, business people, lawyers and politicians too.
Why yes, that is an ordered list. And yes it goes from bad to worse.
That list is not funny.
Why the repetition? You could’ve just said “politicians”.
Damn it Ruth you don’t need to drink to be with someone nice.
Maybe this is a good sign. Maybe Ruth is really starting to feel something for Daisy. Maybe this will be a whole new type of relationship for her♡. Let’s hope Daisy is not just horny and they would be happy together.
Alchoolism is a hell of a addiction…
“It’s like a hatedf–k, but I don’t hate her! Is there even a word for that?”
I predict the date will go beautifully. But Ruth won’t remember any of it.
The second date will be Daisy telling her all the best parts. (because journalism major)
I am concerned we see that Ruth is better than she was *positive* she’s taking her meds and trying to move on even if poorly and clumsily but not doing super well *still using alcohol to cope* and some very worrying self-destructive talk im sad
Yes, Ruth is not nearly as “in recovery” as she claimed to be. I think Halloween will show that Ruth bullied and intimidated Billie a lot before the latter found out she was still drinking and thus a complete hypocrite.
Can someone please explain to me the references to Halloween? I am confused!!! tia
There was a time skip and Billie broke up with Ruth over something that happened on Halloween.
Technically “cheapest” is a superlative