I don’t think it’ll go anywhere romantically, I like their weird friendship. Joe is not right for Joyce, but he’s at least painfully transparant about what he wants :p
They’re better as friends. I know the old song, opposites attract, but…. really? There’s too many differences between them for me to really see it as a Thing.
well… that, and at some point binge reading literally everything Davis ever left online, im pretty certain he mentioned he was going to have everyone end up in the same relationships as Shortpacked. It could have been a fever dream….he has a habit of making….terrifying April Fools updates. So at best the see each other naked and argue about it.
Huh, I thought it was ‘no one will end up in the same relationships as on Shortpacked’. But my memory of that is pretty foggy, so…fever dream could be believable. Although, Mike and Amber is kinda a long shot if we are running on 100% accurate info in here?
I don’t think it was a hard and fast rule, so much as not wanting to retread the relationship dynamics already explored in Roomies/It’s Walky/Shortpacked.
Yeah, note that Ruth and Billie have been together for some time now and they were an item in (essentially) flashback back in Roomies. Dorothy/Walky was also a thing in an alternate universe to the mainline Walkyverse, and then things got Complicated, and Sal/Jason was a dysfunctional but still present Thing there as well. Pretty sure we’re done exploring the latter, but the former got a LOT of screentime here. I think Sal/Jason’s the only time a relationship was seriously explored (even via hatesex) that had gotten actual screentime back in the Walkyverse. Robin/Leslie, I guess, but I hesitate to call that a relationship (and DoA!Robin actually seriously being a politician, and a Republican at that because of the setting change, does SERIOUSLY change the dynamics.)
As for Joyce/Joe, it was definitely teased throughout the Walkyverse, but apart from an alternate universe that I’m pretty sure ended in their Head Alien killing everyone, it wasn’t ever canonized. Meanwhile, Willis has talked a lot in the commentary about how much they love writing Joe-Joyce interactions. Which is why I can see it happening, even if not permanently. (Given the ‘my intent is to have a strip I can write pretty much forever’ aspect, I wouldn’t consider any relationship a shoo-in for permanence.)
Though one of the differences, of religion, is probably gone or smaller now: instead of a “save the Jews” fundamentalist Christian, she’s an atheist, and he’s a Jew with opinions about proper Christmas, so not exactly strongly practicing.
Headcanon: Joyce and Becky went back home again over a holiday break, and stayed at Jocelyne’s place with Hank because they all needed distance from Carol and John. Joyce remarks to Becky that she’s the closest thing to a sister she’ll ever have. Jocelyne bites her lip, and starts sweating bullets and trembling, in a callback to this scene in the diner:
That’s probably part of it, although there’s also a lot of ambiguous feelings between Joyce and Joe, anyway, that both of them seem neither equipped to recognize or to tackle at this point.
No, Joyce, this is DEFINITELY not on Joe. AmbG cannot get support unless they ask for it. Currently, Amber is not. And even if Amber did ask for that support, Joe really is not equipped for helping his new stepsister(s, depending on whether it’s Amber or Amber and AG asking) through the degree of trauma and survivor’s guilt and self-loathing they’re going through, not on his own. He can help, I’m sure, and so can you if they reach out, but this is not a burden that should be put on a single friend or family member. (Seriously. Online peer support for systems. Please, seek that out girls.)
That said, my shipper heart is quite pleased with the ending there.
Oh, it makes sense. It was only a few months ago Joyce thought prayer and getting a new ‘boyfriend’ would be sufficient to help Billie out of her depression. (Though I suspect having more information about Bonnie’s death combined with watching Ruth’s experience with antidepressants has helped with that approach.) But even then, there’s a difference between ‘Don’t murder your sibling’ or ‘know where your sibling is when it’s important’ and ‘be a primary support for your heavily-traumatized new stepsister whose mental health has been in decline even before a series of extremely traumatic murders and a kidnapping, which may have prompted her to seek a campus therapist who may have actually made things WORSE.’ (The last part is speculative, but kind of hinted. Either way, Blaine’s fuckery combined with Mike’s fuckery combined with Mike’s heroic sacrifice combined with the negative feedback loop of self-and-alter-loathing Amber and AG had going on for a while is a cocktail of trouble NO ONE in the cast is equipped to handle alone, Amber and AG included.)
A thing can be perfectly in-character and I can understand it while still going ‘oh, Joyce, I do not have anywhere near enough words for how wrong you are.’
Plus the idea that just because their parents got married there’s some inherent connection that makes her his responsibility. Amber’s got no reason to rely on Joe. Outside of Joyce’s head there’s no magical bond created with a marriage.
Joyce is closer to Amber, knows more about her problems and would likely be trusted more than Joe. Why isn’t it her responsibility?
On top of none of them being qualified to handle it, of course.
Hi, uh, can I still buy a ticket for the Joeyce ship? I have supplies in case it only remains a friendship because I find you can still be practical while being a romantic.
Does it have a better name, cause one that my phone doesn’t hate due to not being a word would be great.
Aww yes, this ship will sail! Such a rough beginning to their relationship, but it’s developed enough that it could work in the future. I just hope we didn’t miss something important for them in the time skip.
Well okay, but I kind of think the perviness is the point of choosing to use that particular term. I mean, it’s not like there is an absence of alternatives.
I choose to believe Becky is confused because she is actually incapable of understanding the idea of being attracted to a man, let alone Joe. She can accept Joyce crushing on Dorothy but….Joe, why? He’s so WEIRD looking.
Maybe she’s confused because Joyce is famous for not caring about other people’s problems/business. Especially when they relate to her social circle or people who have helped her.
I gotta say, I’m digging almost all of these new designs. I actually also like Amber’s look, but it bothers me that it represents a deterioration in her mental health.
Addiction starts before it interferes with daily life in a manner you cannot explain away.
And I’d say, right now it already interferes with Joe actually having friendly relations with most females he meets.
Sex addiction requires it to interfere with the individual’s life. Joe passes his classes, has other hobbies, and maintains friendships with Danny, Joyce, and Jacob.
It doesn’t work like that though. High-functioning addicts are a thing after all. Addiction is when you can’t live your life normally Without the substance or activity. When dropping it is causing you pain and distress.
I suspect the majority of people would have difficulty living their lives normally without any sexual release. Sex addiction doesn’t work like regular addiction because sex is regarded as a natural and healthy behavior. It’s unlike other addictions enough that psychologists even disagree on whether it’s an addiction or a compulsion or just slut shaming.
I mean, sex-repulsed aces exist. Not all of us have a libido.
I tend to think Joe’s Thing About Sex isn’t totally sincere – he’s admitted to Danny he’s never had a threesome despite bragging otherwise, and given everyone’s reaction to Joe, I think he has a lot less sex than he lets on. It seems pretty tied to his issues with Richard (the lack of acknowledged middle ground between ‘don’t be a sex creep’ and ‘no sex ever, ever again,’ his interactions with Richard, his entire speech to Joyce before her own about no one getting hurt,) and the issues with vulnerability and his own sexuality accompanying that. Still obnoxious as hell and highly unhealthy, but more akin to Faz I suspect.
We’ve seen enough of Joe to know that’s not really what’s going on with him. He uses the facade to keep from letting any women get emotionally attached to him, since he thinks he’ll emulate his father by cheating and hurting them if he does.
The thing is like, outside of surface level they’re VERY compatible, they get along REALLY well when Joe isn’t acting like…..well Joe. The moment Joe breaks his fucking horndog habit I STG this ship will sail
What, you think a relationship that went from meeting to marriage within four and a half to five months might NOT be on solid ground once the honeymoon phase ends? Which, given the phase only even STARTS wearing off around six months in and we don’t know exactly when it went from hookup to dating, it almost certainly hasn’t yet? Preposterous.
Seriously, they were seriously contemplating marriage – hell, I think even planning it – by mid-late October at latest after meeting in early September or so. And Richard was showing some serious magical thinking when he discussed it with Joe. That they’re married now is not REMOTELY a sign he’s not going to cheat, because they’re very much still in that new relationship stage.
Oh, yeah! I’d forgotten that Joyce and Joe have grown a lot closer. It seems that they have got close enough that, at some level, Joyce is feeling the ‘prospective boyfriend fixer-upper project’ thing towards him!
Meanwhile, Becky has reason to be worried: Is Joyce an unanchored tsundere?
I was just looking at the converse, (inverse?). Joyce being so keyed-up from emotionally prepping for the Tsunder of up-coming Turkey-Day occurring, that when she went to the Holliday Inn For Thanksgiving to be with her Sibs, (Since Dad is living there? Maybe?) and Not home to the Crazy-Mom™️, so, maybe she is still keyed up?
It is less about Joe, and more about how eff’ed up Amber’s family life used to be. Despite her mom’s best efforts, Amber never really had a loving, supportive, family, and Joyce just wants Joe to be that. Unfortunately, Joe’s brain is still in his pants.
Also, Amber isn’t interested in being “brothered” by this guy she hardly knows who’s got a lousy reputation and comes along with her mother’s remarriage to a guy with another lousy reputation and no reason to trust.
I have an adoptive sibling and I love her like I love my other siblings, and honestly more than my half-siblings…but you can’t force someone to love someone just cause you to share blood, cause your parents married, cause they adopted a child…or in this case cause your parents are dating…Joe really has no responsibility for Amber…she is an adult an a Mess who should be having Therapeutic help like honestly everyone in the cast after what they went thru.
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Oh Joyce, your confused feelings about Joe do not go unnoticed, except maybe by Joe himself.
Is anything going to come of this?
Also, first time I’ve ever gotten first comment, hooray?
Congratulations do seem to be in order.
As well as some hopefully misplaced concern for Jen.
Jen IS allowed to have other things going on.
Have some imaginary cake to celebrate! …unless you have actual sweets, then go eat those to celebrate instead.
Hooray!!
I don’t think it’ll go anywhere romantically, I like their weird friendship. Joe is not right for Joyce, but he’s at least painfully transparant about what he wants :p
FYI, there’s a story line on Slipshine that strongly hints that Joe is not fully transparent about what he wants, specifically regarding Joyce.
Despite that, I agree that they’re not right for each other. I think they could be a fantastic learning experience for each other though.
They’re better as friends. I know the old song, opposites attract, but…. really? There’s too many differences between them for me to really see it as a Thing.
well… that, and at some point binge reading literally everything Davis ever left online, im pretty certain he mentioned he was going to have everyone end up in the same relationships as Shortpacked. It could have been a fever dream….he has a habit of making….terrifying April Fools updates. So at best the see each other naked and argue about it.
Huh, I thought it was ‘no one will end up in the same relationships as on Shortpacked’. But my memory of that is pretty foggy, so…fever dream could be believable. Although, Mike and Amber is kinda a long shot if we are running on 100% accurate info in here?
I don’t think it was a hard and fast rule, so much as not wanting to retread the relationship dynamics already explored in Roomies/It’s Walky/Shortpacked.
Yeah, note that Ruth and Billie have been together for some time now and they were an item in (essentially) flashback back in Roomies. Dorothy/Walky was also a thing in an alternate universe to the mainline Walkyverse, and then things got Complicated, and Sal/Jason was a dysfunctional but still present Thing there as well. Pretty sure we’re done exploring the latter, but the former got a LOT of screentime here. I think Sal/Jason’s the only time a relationship was seriously explored (even via hatesex) that had gotten actual screentime back in the Walkyverse. Robin/Leslie, I guess, but I hesitate to call that a relationship (and DoA!Robin actually seriously being a politician, and a Republican at that because of the setting change, does SERIOUSLY change the dynamics.)
As for Joyce/Joe, it was definitely teased throughout the Walkyverse, but apart from an alternate universe that I’m pretty sure ended in their Head Alien killing everyone, it wasn’t ever canonized. Meanwhile, Willis has talked a lot in the commentary about how much they love writing Joe-Joyce interactions. Which is why I can see it happening, even if not permanently. (Given the ‘my intent is to have a strip I can write pretty much forever’ aspect, I wouldn’t consider any relationship a shoo-in for permanence.)
old song…?
*turns into dust and blows away*
Though one of the differences, of religion, is probably gone or smaller now: instead of a “save the Jews” fundamentalist Christian, she’s an atheist, and he’s a Jew with opinions about proper Christmas, so not exactly strongly practicing.
I think it’s the long game being played here.
The very long game, given the trip home/texting arc was back in 2016.
Longer- Joe was the first guy Joyce considered for a potential husband.
Oh, absolutely. I just consider the texting a bit of a turning point in their relationship.
Meanwhile, Sarah definitely doesn’t care if Joyce cares if Joe cares.
But Becky at least cares about why Joyce cares if Joe cares enough to ask.
Of course she does. Anytime Joyce is denial, Sarah can have fun poking her with it.
…Baka?
Maybe Joyce wants to be Amber’s sis- ohhhhh.
Joyce has always wanted a sister.
On the one hand she could marry Joe and get a superhero as a sister.
On the other hand she could marry Walky and get Sal as a sister.
The downside in either scenario is being married to Joe or Walky.
Either way, she’s gonna be pretty surprised to learn she already has a sister.
Secret option: she marries one of the DeSantoses and gets all the excessively numerous sisters.
Joyce already has a sister. She’s just not out to Joyce yet.
Headcanon: Joyce and Becky went back home again over a holiday break, and stayed at Jocelyne’s place with Hank because they all needed distance from Carol and John. Joyce remarks to Becky that she’s the closest thing to a sister she’ll ever have. Jocelyne bites her lip, and starts sweating bullets and trembling, in a callback to this scene in the diner:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/comic/book-6/03-when-god-closes-the-door/india/
That’s probably part of it, although there’s also a lot of ambiguous feelings between Joyce and Joe, anyway, that both of them seem neither equipped to recognize or to tackle at this point.
I’m hoping Joyce will find out that she already has a sister sometime soon.
Becky has noooo idea of how much Joyce is invested on caring about this XD
No, Joyce, this is DEFINITELY not on Joe. AmbG cannot get support unless they ask for it. Currently, Amber is not. And even if Amber did ask for that support, Joe really is not equipped for helping his new stepsister(s, depending on whether it’s Amber or Amber and AG asking) through the degree of trauma and survivor’s guilt and self-loathing they’re going through, not on his own. He can help, I’m sure, and so can you if they reach out, but this is not a burden that should be put on a single friend or family member. (Seriously. Online peer support for systems. Please, seek that out girls.)
That said, my shipper heart is quite pleased with the ending there.
“Am I my brother’s keeper?”
The Bible makes it pretty clear that yes, you are. And that’s still the moral paradigm that Joyce is operating from.
Given the context not that clear.
Oh, it makes sense. It was only a few months ago Joyce thought prayer and getting a new ‘boyfriend’ would be sufficient to help Billie out of her depression. (Though I suspect having more information about Bonnie’s death combined with watching Ruth’s experience with antidepressants has helped with that approach.) But even then, there’s a difference between ‘Don’t murder your sibling’ or ‘know where your sibling is when it’s important’ and ‘be a primary support for your heavily-traumatized new stepsister whose mental health has been in decline even before a series of extremely traumatic murders and a kidnapping, which may have prompted her to seek a campus therapist who may have actually made things WORSE.’ (The last part is speculative, but kind of hinted. Either way, Blaine’s fuckery combined with Mike’s fuckery combined with Mike’s heroic sacrifice combined with the negative feedback loop of self-and-alter-loathing Amber and AG had going on for a while is a cocktail of trouble NO ONE in the cast is equipped to handle alone, Amber and AG included.)
A thing can be perfectly in-character and I can understand it while still going ‘oh, Joyce, I do not have anywhere near enough words for how wrong you are.’
Plus the idea that just because their parents got married there’s some inherent connection that makes her his responsibility. Amber’s got no reason to rely on Joe. Outside of Joyce’s head there’s no magical bond created with a marriage.
Joyce is closer to Amber, knows more about her problems and would likely be trusted more than Joe. Why isn’t it her responsibility?
On top of none of them being qualified to handle it, of course.
(She cares immensely)
Hi, uh, can I still buy a ticket for the Joeyce ship? I have supplies in case it only remains a friendship because I find you can still be practical while being a romantic.
Does it have a better name, cause one that my phone doesn’t hate due to not being a word would be great.
I think JoeJo is one alternative!
SONO CHI NO SADAME!
Brownsenthal, maybe? Still not great, but it’s that or Jojo and then you bring in the Bizarre Adventures people and things get weird and memey.
JoJo
NoNo.
JoyJo has a bit of a ring to it.
Joeyce is always accepting new crew mates.
The standing name for this ship is ‘Joece’. It’s a solid, old battleship that’s taken its share of hard hits, but is still going strong.
Aww yes, this ship will sail! Such a rough beginning to their relationship, but it’s developed enough that it could work in the future. I just hope we didn’t miss something important for them in the time skip.
Joyce is projecting so much there should be a white screen showing the movie somewhere.
Didn’t Willis already make that reference in a previous alt-text?
Sure, sweetie. Whatever you say.
*plays Phil Collins’ “I Don’t Care Anymore” on the hacked Muzak*
… *ships*
Tsundere atheist Joyce.
I… I don’t love God! I don’t love Anybody!! BAKA!!!
Welcome… to the Tsundere Dome!
When did The Internet start convincing everyone it was OK to spell “titties” with 2 D’s?
Damn you audocorrecd.
I rather like the word though, the d’s takes the edge off somehow, replacing some of the perviness with just a hint of a soft and cuddly teddy bear.
Well okay, but I kind of think the perviness is the point of choosing to use that particular term. I mean, it’s not like there is an absence of alternatives.
“Titty” – harsh consonant, “show us your,” “or gtfo,” “check out those.”
“Tiddy” – casual, friendly, soft and relaxed sound.
I choose to believe Becky is confused because she is actually incapable of understanding the idea of being attracted to a man, let alone Joe. She can accept Joyce crushing on Dorothy but….Joe, why? He’s so WEIRD looking.
🙂
Maybe she’s confused because Joyce is famous for not caring about other people’s problems/business. Especially when they relate to her social circle or people who have helped her.
I mean… make his legs shorter, and give him a bushy moustache, and Joe would look a lot like Ross. So, yeah, she’d have issues.
I gotta say, I’m digging almost all of these new designs. I actually also like Amber’s look, but it bothers me that it represents a deterioration in her mental health.
Her neuroses and bangs will consume her, until she looks like Cousin Itt.
I…..ship it?????
Why am I only just now wondering if Joe legitimately suffers from sex addiction? Because, like. It’s starting to seem more and more like he does.
Even if not full-blown sex addiction, it’s always been a coping mechanism for him.
Addiction starts before it interferes with daily life in a manner you cannot explain away.
And I’d say, right now it already interferes with Joe actually having friendly relations with most females he meets.
Sex addiction requires it to interfere with the individual’s life. Joe passes his classes, has other hobbies, and maintains friendships with Danny, Joyce, and Jacob.
It doesn’t work like that though. High-functioning addicts are a thing after all. Addiction is when you can’t live your life normally Without the substance or activity. When dropping it is causing you pain and distress.
I suspect the majority of people would have difficulty living their lives normally without any sexual release. Sex addiction doesn’t work like regular addiction because sex is regarded as a natural and healthy behavior. It’s unlike other addictions enough that psychologists even disagree on whether it’s an addiction or a compulsion or just slut shaming.
That is true…
I mean, sex-repulsed aces exist. Not all of us have a libido.
I tend to think Joe’s Thing About Sex isn’t totally sincere – he’s admitted to Danny he’s never had a threesome despite bragging otherwise, and given everyone’s reaction to Joe, I think he has a lot less sex than he lets on. It seems pretty tied to his issues with Richard (the lack of acknowledged middle ground between ‘don’t be a sex creep’ and ‘no sex ever, ever again,’ his interactions with Richard, his entire speech to Joyce before her own about no one getting hurt,) and the issues with vulnerability and his own sexuality accompanying that. Still obnoxious as hell and highly unhealthy, but more akin to Faz I suspect.
We’ve seen enough of Joe to know that’s not really what’s going on with him. He uses the facade to keep from letting any women get emotionally attached to him, since he thinks he’ll emulate his father by cheating and hurting them if he does.
Huh. Shipping the fuck out of JoeXJoyce now
Just now?
All aboard the PCS Joece!!
The difference between Sarah’s eyebrow at Joe vs. Sarah’s eyebrow at Joyce is *chef kiss*
Joyce/Joe are really what keep me coming back to this comic, if I’m being completely honest.
I feel like I should not ship them because they could not be more incompatible on the surface but somehow I still do.
They’re both characters who have a looooot to learn, in sort of opposite directions, so maybe that’s what makes me root for them.
The thing is like, outside of surface level they’re VERY compatible, they get along REALLY well when Joe isn’t acting like…..well Joe. The moment Joe breaks his fucking horndog habit I STG this ship will sail
And maybe he will, if he sees his father keeping it together for the sake of his new marriage to Amber’s mom.
Yeah, that’s a ticking bomb that’ll blow up eventually.
As far as we know his father isn’t “keeping it together for the sake of his new marriage”, but just isn’t feeling the urge to cheat yet.
What, you think a relationship that went from meeting to marriage within four and a half to five months might NOT be on solid ground once the honeymoon phase ends? Which, given the phase only even STARTS wearing off around six months in and we don’t know exactly when it went from hookup to dating, it almost certainly hasn’t yet? Preposterous.
Seriously, they were seriously contemplating marriage – hell, I think even planning it – by mid-late October at latest after meeting in early September or so. And Richard was showing some serious magical thinking when he discussed it with Joe. That they’re married now is not REMOTELY a sign he’s not going to cheat, because they’re very much still in that new relationship stage.
I see few parallels between Joe and Shinji.
Joyce and Asuka, sure.
Soon, dairy…
I mean, Joe’s not wrong?
He isn’t really equipped to help Amber out, what Amber needs is therapy.
Also just admit you wanna sleep with him, dammit Joyce *gets flag ready to sail*
Whole lot of Not Caring going on in this strip.
Oh, yeah! I’d forgotten that Joyce and Joe have grown a lot closer. It seems that they have got close enough that, at some level, Joyce is feeling the ‘prospective boyfriend fixer-upper project’ thing towards him!
Meanwhile, Becky has reason to be worried: Is Joyce an unanchored tsundere?
and then Becky repeat what Joyce said in panel 3
I’m getting some tsundere vibes from Joyce and possibly Joe as well here.
Brother huh? I feel like some serious drama went down in the Brown household…
I was just looking at the converse, (inverse?). Joyce being so keyed-up from emotionally prepping for the Tsunder of up-coming Turkey-Day occurring, that when she went to the Holliday Inn For Thanksgiving to be with her Sibs, (Since Dad is living there? Maybe?) and Not home to the Crazy-Mom™️, so, maybe she is still keyed up?
From unreleased emotional barricading,..” idunno, it’s how it looks from where I stand (or sit).
Sarah just knows she is going to get dragged into some bullshit. She just waits for the other shoe to drop.
I think Sarah is starting to get a weird feeling about why Joyce’s care so much of Joe.
Joyce: “I don’t care!”
Ron Howard’s disembodied voice: “She did.”
But why does Joe care that Joyce cares that Joe cares.
It is less about Joe, and more about how eff’ed up Amber’s family life used to be. Despite her mom’s best efforts, Amber never really had a loving, supportive, family, and Joyce just wants Joe to be that. Unfortunately, Joe’s brain is still in his pants.
Also, Amber isn’t interested in being “brothered” by this guy she hardly knows who’s got a lousy reputation and comes along with her mother’s remarriage to a guy with another lousy reputation and no reason to trust.
Sorta admire Joe saying out loud “I am not equipped to do that well!”, trying to fend off Joyce’s instructions.
After looking at the alt-text I’m wondering what Joyce would look like with pigtails.
Sarah has an idea of what Joyce looks like with pigtails.
I still ship Joe and Joyce.
Curse my shipping mind cause god dammit I love this.
Joe does care but won’t admit it.
Joyce knows that Joe cares.
Joyce also cares that Joe cares.
Joe knows that Joyce cares that Joe cares.
GAH! WHY WAS I CURSED WITH THIS?!
Over a hundred comments and Jen still hasn’t commented? Strange
The temporal disruption field she uses to always post first must have collapsed. Where in time is
Carmen SandiegoJen Aside?I have an adoptive sibling and I love her like I love my other siblings, and honestly more than my half-siblings…but you can’t force someone to love someone just cause you to share blood, cause your parents married, cause they adopted a child…or in this case cause your parents are dating…Joe really has no responsibility for Amber…she is an adult an a Mess who should be having Therapeutic help like honestly everyone in the cast after what they went thru.
“I’m not equipped to do that well” is a line I’m going to have to use more in my everyday conversations.
I dislike the whole “She’s your responsibility” bit sooo much dude.