I commuted and was the first one up and home around when everyone was going to bed – evening and night classes – Thank the deities of scheduling I didn’t have to interact with family back then.
I finished early enough on Fridays to get into The Blind Duck – Quonset Hut lunch counter cum pub between the two campus buildings – before they did door charges for the band – never got kicked – still ended up home sometime on a Saturday. I think I got a BSc …..
Dina strongly references the support for feathered/fluffy dinosaurs. (not all were, but some definitely were). So if he’s not a scaley, might he still be feathery? Feathered boa’s would seem to establish a precident for that.
I have a vague recollection that he hit on her, the subtext went over her head, and he didn’t push it. I can’t recall specifics, though; I might be thinking of something else entirely.
Well, she did get a donut, so she probably was on the list. I think it happened off-panel, and then Dina was clearly in a relationship with Becky. And given his experiences I really doubt Joe is the type to make a move on someone he knows is in a relationship.
I don’t think that’s enough evidence to assume he actually made a move. Those donuts seemed more like a general apologetic gesture to the female dorm population, and Dina probably went for it because it was a free donut. It’s not like there was any strict ‘only donuts if you’re on the list’ verification policy.
She approached the table from behind him. There is a good chance he wasn’t even aware of her being there. There is also a good chance he wasn’t ever aware of her being around.
Hell, even our main characters said something similar (not as judgy and rude, but still infantilizing) about how odd the concept of Dina dating was at the room party, right before she and Becky actually became a thing. Dina then pointed out that she found it insulting and offensive, and everyone’s laid off it since. (Sarah still had the occasional strip about how odd it was Dina doesn’t use contractions or the like, and I think they all expressed surprise Dina was one of the oldest in the cast, but Dina doesn’t express offense about either of those. I suspect the latter was also focused on her LOOKING young, not acting young, where Raidah and the room party both included focus on her behavior.)
To be fair to all of them, both Dina’s looks and behavior were coded as very young, especially early on. That’s changed as she’s become better at socializing.
Think especially of her bit with Riley, where she was surprised Riley was 12 and Riley was surprised she wasn’t.
Sure, but she hasn’t actually changed the core of her interests or tastes since. Hell, she will still infodump about dinosaurs given an opportunity/during a fight sequence, and Dorothy and Joyce did just throw cereal at her for the extended Jurassic Park joke so it is still her favorite food. Sarah was one of the ones agreeing that Becky ‘putting the moves on Dina’ was weird, and she’s the one who saw Dina awkwardly infodump at Raidah and Raidah immediately ask if she was in middle school, before pivoting to ‘mentally challenged’ and the infantilizing. Which Dina clearly found insulting, and expressed to Sarah. She’s a bit better with social situations, but her social awkwardness wasn’t what you’d really expect from a neurotypical 12-year-old.
I don’t hold it against any of the main cast – they are a bunch of 18-year-olds, after all, and Joyce apologized for the ‘looks and acts like she’s twelve’ line immediately after Dina explained it while Dorothy had her ‘Huzzah!’ (Sarah didn’t onscreen, to my knowledge, but I’m pretty sure there was something offscreen given how often the two of them interact one-on-one.) It wasn’t done without malice. But it was infantilizing, and it was infantilization explicitly based in Dina’s social discomfort… and the fact that she’s not neurotypical, and makes no effort to mask that. That attitude happens in real life, a lot, and is kind of a hot button issue for me because even my (compassionate, generally with-it and respectful of me) family have fallen into it before. Hell, in the comments of that sequence, there was someone hoping Dina wouldn’t date because she reminded them of their autistic child, and said something about ‘innocence’ or the like. It was EXTREMELY uncomfortable! That it was done without malice doesn’t make it not ableist.
It’s definitely infantilizing and I’d say it’s especially bad when it comes from people who know her well enough to know how old she is and that she’s in college on her own – which is all the other girls on the floor and wasn’t Raidah and her cronies.
Their statements were worse, but the context around them was better.
The first moment of Raidah asking if she was a middle-schooler was better, yeah. At a mall, it was semi-plausible for Sarah to have someone she introduced as a friend who was more a mentor-mentee relationship or something. (I forgot how bad Joyce’s comment was before checking for that second, but I’m glad she was the one who gave the full apology and hasn’t made comments since.) Every other comment in the Raidah and posse exchange? Went from ‘honest mistake’ or ‘screwed up, but immediate and sincere apology’ to ‘very revealing of your opinions about the neurodivergent, because you are still doubling down on this.’
There’s a reason I bring up the party scene – it sucks, and it’s a conscious point of that scene that even our protagonists (including DOROTHY) aren’t immune to ableism regarding Dina. But the difference between Char using the R-word and she and Chan laughing, and the way Raidah treats her? Is mostly one of tone. Dina sums it up when she volunteers to spy at the start of the Jacob Matter by saying ‘She was not kind to me, though I imagine she thought that she was.’ Raidah calls out the blatant insults, but she still insults Dina with the ‘mentally challenged’ line right in front of her (in a way where she isn’t concerned Dina is right there and can hear her,) and then kneels down and talks to her like she’s a small child. (‘Do you understand?’) Sarah had already called Dina a friend who was their age, which means it’s way more likely she’s a fellow college student. The line at the party aside, Joyce consistently treats Dina like a peer. Raidah didn’t intend it as an insult, but she doesn’t respect Dina or consider her competent enough to be insulted. (Consider how she treats Joyce, who she has very little respect for but still acknowledges as a peer on some level. The pizza lunch is full of subtle insults, but never anything to her face.)
To be honest the whole “step” thing is weird to me. Is that really a specific thing for people or just a label to slap on it so the creators can pretend it’s not really an incest fantasy?
Sometimes. Other times it’s used in order to allow the work to explore the relationship between two people who’ve grown up together. Similar to, but also with some major differences from, the “childhood friends” theme.
I mean, they apparently spent some portion of winter break in the same place for an extended period of time. With their newlywed parents, at least one of whom has a serious boundaries and appropriateness issue.
I too would be a bit… preoccupied with things other than the reality of that house at that time.
(Joe’s hair actually changed pre-timeskip to the tousled look. Evidently post-Malaya Slipshine he decided he liked the look? And Willis liked changing out characters’ hairstyles since a lot of them had been so close to the head and perfectly round/rectangular. Joe, Danny, and Walky on the rectangle side, Ethan, Leslie, Dorothy and Amber over on the round one. Finally, it’s free from its confines! Danny might still have a pretty flat hairdo judging from silhouettes, but that’s okay because he’s Wonderbread.)
Yeah, it’d be awkward if she became his stepdaughter later.
(I still haven’t settled if in my headcanon where Joe’s dad is actually Joe from the future is he literally his own father or did he simply assume his father’s identity.)
So Amber has a mix of Amber and AmaziGirl hair, with a dash of crazed cavewoman to top it all off. That bodes well. No craziness in that head waiting to escape and stab another person (again).
Okay that implication about craziness is just… so deeply ableist, I probably don’t have the cycles or spoons to get into it, but I’ll just focus on a main point.
Both times we’ve ever seen Amber stab someone, EVER, were in actively traumatic, ongoing situations. (She obviously shouldn’t have blamed Sal, who was a distant second in the traumatizing people in that moment, but Blaine was continuing to berate her over witnessing an attempted holdup, so I consider that situation ongoing!) The first was after being goaded into it and having a momentary breakdown. She was horrified by her potential for violence afterwards, justified it to herself for some time by painting Sal as her personal supervillain, and made peace with Sal (as did AG, separately) after realizing she was wrong. The second was in response to a very real threat to herself, her friends, and frankly everyone in that dorm. She evidently stabbed Ryan far more times than necessary, but was still considered acting in self-defense. In the aftermath she was, again, horrified by her potential for violence afterwards, and justified it by painting HERSELF as the monster AG was made to and failed to keep in check.
Amber has never stabbed someone outside a deeply traumatic situation. Amber does not WANT to stab another person again if it is even remotely avoidable. Amber is, at the moment, showing body language and grunts of ‘not really paying much attention, focusing on phone and resigned to All This.’ That’s not even how she or AG act when they need to fight something. It comes off more as ‘exhausted introvert ready to have a conscientious roommate again.’
Furthermore, the belief that mentally ill and neurodivergent people (especially those with DID) are inherently violent and have craziness ‘waiting to escape’ is both demonstrably false – we’re statistically far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators – and deeply harmful to us, as it justifies a lot of that fear and violence and perpetuates an idea that the Scary Violent Craziness is immutable, stigmatizing people with the condition and making them less likely to seek or find competent mental health support.
This may or may not be coherent in the morning, it’s 1 AM, but that is just… REALLY gross, in its implications.
Started on the basic character bit and went ‘no actually, I DO have the brain energy to do the Perpetuating Dangerous Stereotypes part tonight so someone else doesn’t have to.’ Glad to be helpful there.
Speaking as someone whose job can, at times, require physical force against other people (bouncer), Amber/Amazi-Girl’s use of violence was extremely gratuitous in most cases (i.e., trying to jackknife someone by doing a flying double kick off a lamppost to the base of their spine). Sorry, but I cannot agree with your addition to Regalli’s statement.
Wait wait. Are you complaining that the degree of harm delivered was gratuitous, or that the techniques AG uses to deliver it are gratuitous?
At first I heard the former, but now I can only hear the latter. Like someone complaining about movie realism: “No no, that’s NOT how you hold a knife Amber!”
At a guess, ‘the techniques used tend to cause a degree of harm that is gratuitous.’ And, probably fair. I can buy AG never doing permanent damage because the same comic book physics that protected her in the car chases also protect the people she’s fighting, but realistically they’re dangerous as fuck. There’s a reason Sal was uncomfortable with AG seeking out fights during the Dox Bros fight, and that’s to remind everyone it IS an uncomfortable flaw of AG’s that she enjoys fighting (but only against people who ‘deserve’ it, and not doing any permanent damage, which is how she justifies it to herself.)
When the cast needs a superhero, they really need her – even Sal agrees with this, and while we didn’t see Marcie in the aftermath of the kidnapping I think she’d also agree stopping Blaine in that situation was entirely necessary – but a lot of AG’s crimefighting isn’t that degree of necessary. (And I’ve gotta wonder what she’s thinking in the fallout of the last three arcs. Mike ran to the woods in part because he knew she’d be there, and we already know they had survivor’s guilt already. I so hope they’ve gotten competent mental health support. It seems so easy for that to have evolved into ‘if I hadn’t done this, maybe he’d still be alive.’ Poor girls.)
There’s definitely stuff to criticize about Amazi-Girl, but I don’t think it’s fair to criticize her techniques as if they were realistic when they clearly aren’t intended that way.
Regalli’s got the right of it. Amber/Amazi-Girl tended to go for maximum damage no matter what, which always bothered me (a person who has to try like hell not to hurt people, just because of my size and strength). There’s also Kella’s outright wrongness about them using violence to protect and save other people, which . . . that’s not at all why they were doing that.
There’s a reason why the “Three Stooges ward” in the Simpson’s fictional hospital became the “WWE ward”. Most of those wrestling moves are dangerous as fvck if not blocked out and rehearsed.
First, let’s recall we are talking about a fictional character. I would never be so glib about an actual person. Perhaps the fact that Amber has so many aspects of her character you do not see outside of comic books was an issue here. If you took a personal affront to this glib comment, know that offense was not intended.
… I love how the J&W rerun today involves the line ‘I don’t want to be party to a possible doomed marriage’, and the character saying it is being very blunt but entirely reasonable, thinking they’re rushing into it to cover for underlying insecurities in the relationship… and then over here, we have this.
No reason to bring up these two in relation. No reason whatsoever.
(I mean, I hope it works for Stacy. God knows they need that sweet sweet doctor money. And Joe’s not a terrible stepsibling to have, all told. But.
While I have no objections in principle to open marriages, polyamory, etc, that’s less a right-or-wrong thing and more of a right-or-wrong-for-these-people thing. It requires a degree of emotional confidence and sureness — knowing this person loves me and will be there for me when I need him, even if right this second he’s 8-inches deep in someone half my age — that Stacy doesn’t possess right now. She doesn’t need to live a little by getting out and having sex with other people. She needs to live a little by having an emotional secure home with people she can trust love her.
And there is absolutely no indications in the comic that it’s an open relationship. That either of them has suggested it, talked about it or would be open to it. There’s no indication that Richard wants an open relationship, just that he’ll eventually cheat.
There’s an annoying tendency when cheating comes up in a story to suggest some form of poly as the fix. The two aren’t particularly related and cheaters aren’t likely to be good at being open.
Problem is that an uncommitted partner in a monogamous relationship isn’t gonna become committed once you open the relationship up. A cheater isn’t lying and concealing their affairs because they are afraid of hurting their partners, they’re lying and concealing it because they don’t want to face the consequences of their actions. They want the affair but they want to keep the spouse too. And that sort of selfish behaviour where you can’t be up front with your actions and desires and accept that they might bring fourth consequences you didn’t want (like a partner leaving you) will be just as harmful in a poly relationship, but they might do it in another aspect, like gaslighting their partners or practice financial abuse
I understand you tried to keep a light tone. I think I’ve spent too much time in poly-groups telling people to stop treating the relationship form as the solution to everything wrong with relationships. I was one of those that tried to open up my relationship with a douche of a fiancé and it just didn’t work. Now I’m in a triad with two wonderful guys
That would be precisely the joke! Richard and Stacy have known each other approximately four months by now. That’s pretty well within range of honeymoon phase for a relationship, and given Richard’s defense to Joe’s ‘You will cheat on her and hurt her’ was a very dismissive ‘I’m a changed man! I’m barely noticing all the hot women (my son’s age) on this college campus!’ line. That inspires about as much confidence in me as it did in Joe.
We have no indication whatsoever Richard cheating on Joe’s mom was an isolated incident, or that he’s done anything whatsoever to meaningfully change that behavior beyond ‘love fixes everything!’ Stacy, meanwhile, almost certainly has some DISTINCT mental scars from an ex-husband cheating on her. Given that, I kind of suspect she doesn’t know. Either way, she is now significantly financially dependent on this man for the foreseeable future (between the Ryan lawsuit and the tuition,) so BOY HOWDY will that be a fun situation when if Richard does cheat on her and she finds out! Certainly won’t be anything to remind her of there!
I mean, I doubt it’s going to implode onscreen, not any time soon (I’d expect it no sooner than Joe getting another significant arc,) but I do NOT give that marriage five years.
I’m going with the safer bet of comic time – We’ll almost certainly never see that far ahead in normal strips.
In real time, I could see about a month and be only mildly surprised. Another week or two in and I won’t even be surprised. (Or clear indication Richard is already considering cheating. Basically I’m building in time between ‘noticing other women,’ ‘considering cheating,’ and ‘cheating,’ and then a bit more time before Stacy actually finds out, so a month is possible but stretching it if he isn’t thinking about it already.)
I dunno, I’m a little optimistic. That Dr. Rosenthal explicitly begged Amber to try and be kinder to her mom, I think that displays, at the least, a level of investment in Stacy that he’d feel compelled to act on.
Plus damn, Stacy and Amber need a friggin’ break from jerkass dads.
That’s a relationship we saw nothing of, with only anecdotes from Joe that his dad was a cheating scumbag. He might legitimately be trying to turn over a new leaf with Stacy.
We saw him and Joe talking about the relationship with Stacy. He’s clearly not “trying” anything.
He seems to have been assuming that because he’s not feeling any urge to cheat right then, that he’s never going to have any problem with it and thus no need to do anything to try to improve.
It is possible that he’s right and Stacy is the perfect woman who will satisfy him and he’ll just stay happy enough with her that he’ll never wander again, no effort needed. It’s just not very likely.
Realistically, it might last longer than the comic covers. Narratively, it’s going to come to a head in story at some point, likely tied into Joe’s own character arc.
I think he is sincere in trying to turn over a new leaf, but given that conversation with Joe didn’t discuss anything concrete he did after his last breakup or what he’s learned (say, honest communication, or acknowledging he can find other people attractive but not actually act on that attraction,) my odds of success from what we’ve seen so far are… not promising. I’m inclined to think Joe’s seen him with a new partner more than once.
That still doesn’t guarantee failure, though – the way Joe’s arc seems set up, realizing his father can change and acknowledge his previous flaws to be a better partner could be a big point. But I also find it interesting, now that I think about it, that both Joe and Amber (and Faz, for that matter, but we don’t know how much contact either of them’s had with him since) have similar ‘fear I’ll become like my scummy dad’ things going on, and Amber just recently hit a turning point with hers. Richard wouldn’t need to cheat on Stacy for Amber and Joe to have that bonding time, but it could well be an impetus for that development.
My read on Richard at the moment isn’t ‘irredeemably terrible’ so much as ‘buying into some of the same Life As A RomCom concepts Joyce did re: Jacob, but having already faced worse consequences.’ (In this case it’s more like ‘Romance novel rake whose womanizing ways end as soon as he finds The Love Of A Good Woman,’ but same concept.) I can totally see him figuring it out offscreen!… But we need some indication he has, yet, probably through frank conversation with Joe.
My read on Joedad (I am going to force this until it sticks) is that he did get some off-screen character development. He had a fling with Stacy, things worked out, and he’s all in on trying to be a good partner to her. If he gets further developed the way Hank did as he showed up here and there we totally could see what you talked about, where he’s just decided he’s reformed without putting in the work, and how that’ll play out.
Plus thinking at it from a mechanical storytelling point where does that leave Amber? Court bills pile up from Ryan, who knows what’s up with her dad’s estate, Linda pulling strings, and she has no one in her corner to help her out. From that perspective I think he serves a role in anchoring Amber to IU financially.
I dunno, I like to think he and Stacy are working out just to give the latter a break.
It’s possible, but there’s no evidence for it at this point. We know from when he first talked about this with Joe that he hadn’t done any work or consideration of it then and saw no need to do so.
Maybe something happened in the time skip, but I wouldn’t count on it.
Amber had a horrible semester thanks to her abusive dad and her mental illness.I hope Willis doens’t-Who am I kidding? Willis will do something darker probably.
Mike, her friend, died. That’s going to weigh on her mind and conscience for a while. The presence of further traumatizing problems for Amber would just be cruel.
I’m hoping she at least has a couple weeks before the next round of Drama starts. If only because Amber being in a relatively more stable headspace will free up some storyline space for other stuff. (I love Amber and want her to be healthy and not self-loathing. Her storylines being more downward sloping than not is STRESSFUL. Let her have a nice, relaxing roller derby night or something. Her thoughts on Fire Emblem, maybe, or the new IDW Transformers verse.)
(Thinking on it, I actually do want to know the cast’s thoughts on Horny Anime Chess, it’d be hilarious.)
Yep! ‘Anime Chess’ is occasionally a way to describe Fire Emblem, because… well, it’s a very anime turn-based tactical game series. Recent games have added a player insert character in addition to the previous focus on relationships among your units, and well… The most recent game (and the previous one, which was a remake of an older one and lacks the Player Insert) have stepped back the ‘oh my god why are you like this’ character designs, mostly… but it also involves most of the cast being your students and still treating you as a mentor after a five-year timeskip. (I think a non-zero number of players choose to just ignore this as best they can and pretend your PC was a fellow student.) I still consider this a step up from Fates, which had multiple characters on each route who had the ‘I know we treat each other as siblings, and were raised together thinking we were blood-related/you have spent your lives thinking I was related, and considered my biological mother your mother, but since we’re actually adoptive/step-siblings, let’s get married!’ uh… trope going on. For lack of better phrase. God that game was terrible.
I love this series. I really do. Sacred Stones was amazing. Path of Radiance? Great. I’m even quite fond of Awakening and that’s when the dating sim elements really started showing up. Three Houses is a significant return to form in actually caring about the geopolitics and worldbuilding, and the writing actually makes all the main factions sympathetic based off what information they know in their routes instead of the nonsense that was Fates’ writing. But god, why is it like this.
Pretty sure if he’s eyeballing anyone it’s Sarah, who he’s expressed an interest in before. Then again, I swear they dated in Roomies! So Willis probably wouldn’t go down that route as they like exploring new grounds.
I get that it’s an odd name and they’re a sudden intrusive push into the established cast, but can we not intentionally get the nonbinary coded character’s name wrong, even if it’s for a joke?
In response to your actual question, idk, seems like Booster is probably upstairs still
Fair, no worries, but even if I could remove my comment I’d leave it up, part so your reply would stay and part so anyone actually doing on purpose knows they’re in for a yelling
Also I only just realized you meant in the cast image (which his eyes look really ambiguous to me, like he could be looking all the way to Lucy or someone, or could be looking straight down at Joyce)
It looks a lot less ambiguous to me – not, like, entirely unambiguous, it could also totes be Sarah. But I have a fair degree of shipovision so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sarah seems like the most likely one (proximity meaning his eyeline hits her before it would hit Booster or Lucy,) but that side of the cast page does seem to have more potentially-interested people in general. (The other side contains both confirmed lesbians,* one of whom is also asexual; Dina who’s a gray ace in a relationship with a woman; Ruth who is likely also in a relationship; and Dorothy, who I assume from knowing Joe for years could NEVER be convinced to mess around with him and he knows it.) I’m pretty sure most of the people on that side of the cast page would turn him down, but we only know Danny and Amber are indisputably off the options and do have three other definitely single, straight women there, so they’re at least more plausible than Becky or Carla. (This is not a high bar, but.) He also has hooked up with Malaya before – so even if Malaya wasn’t gonna give him the time of day this time, which I find plausible, he might not have propositioned and been rejected yet. Booster is a complete unknown in sexuality and relationship status.
* Over in Shortpacked, Carla’s counterpart described herself as a homoromantic asexual trans-chassis woman (said counterpart was also an AI who used to be in a car,) in those exact words, and the only part of that that wouldn’t transfer in the Sexuality and Gender as Willisversal Constants is being an AI.
By which I mean, Booster may be compatible and available or may not, we don’t have enough info yet to say, but that does at least temporarily put them in the ‘maybe’ category.
Hm, I wonder about the cast photo. there seems to be Billie, Malaya (poor Sal is still rooming with Malaya?), Danny and the last one might be Marcie. But no Carla (or the shadow to Joe’s left is Carla and Billie is out of the main cast?)
I really hope that Joe can pull himself together and be a good step-bro if she needs him to be. She would probably kick a few asses for him if she had a good reason to (if she isnt scared by that whole incident and amaz-girl is gone forever), so I hope he can get his head on straight and be there for her, even if its the annoying brother who sometimes does something really nice and genuine.
I highly doubt that Amazi-Girl is gone forever. As some of our systems have commented, full integration/personality absorption is not often a good idea, treatment-wise.
I mean, it’s not the reason she was hoping for (since she seemed to get her hopes up a little), but it’s not the worst reason. Like, I can imagine how it would be a relief. He’s probably seen Cruel Intentions.
I guess Joe:
– Doesn’t know about Amber being Amazi-girl,
and or:
– Doesn’t remember talking to Danny about how great Amazi-girl would be in bed, because she obviously has “issues”
Off topic of the page…. Does anyone know at the top of their head if anyone had worn heels or wedges at all during the comic? Bare feet? (I wanna say yes to the latter but I can’t remember) I’m doing a “draw a characters in 6 styles and I can think of any references I could use for Willis-style (and of course my character dons open toed heels)
Joe looks like the only student who might have actually gotten a haircut during the timeskip, or at least his hair doesn’t appear to have grown longer.
It seems that Amber has learned that the cosy hypothetical of having Joe as a stepbrother has been neatly smothered by the cold hard nature of reality! She’d probably have done better if, as seems the case, Walky hadn’t dumped her. Combined with Mike’s death, I’m pretty sure it’s her instinct to curl up in an antisocial ball and ignore the world around her.
Just letting ya know that’s not actually what antisocial means. I think Mike is far more likely to be antisocial in general than Amber shutting people out. It is a belief that the rules of society do not apply to you, not just a one time thing, either, it’s ongoing. You’re likely going for isolation.
Hopefully Joe’s self loathing is addressed, I really don’t like how that was left hanging after it was brought up and then he was told to get over it and the plot changed.
I believe it’s in reference to when his Do List came out, and Joe lashed out at Joyce that he deliberately disconnects from everyone and makes himself act like a shallow, clueless douchebag because risking actual emotional connection is magnitudes worse than being a wacky sex frat bro.
“Do you realize how much worse it would be if anyone actually cared about me? If I let anything I do matter?”
Joyce didn’t tell him to get over it, though, she just explained why Joe’s list was immensely hurtful to her given what she went through and how normalized it was that any guy, even one she considers to be a friend, could reduce her to an object.
Joe then started trying to make steps to be different, because he did find this horrifying when Joyce explained precisely why and how this was hurtful (his Wacky Sex Frat Bro persona also seems to be a ‘people won’t get hurt the way my mom was when my dad cheated on her’ thing, which given the implications there… OW, but also is clearly based on the idea his behavior is gross but harmless.) And then he backslid pretty soon after, and hasn’t really been in focus since the Faz Is Great storyline (his exact phrase before hooking up with Malaya was ‘lasted longer than I expected to’, probably because he tried immediately going to the other extreme of No Sex Or Flirting Whatsoever.) In hindsight that was probably because the plot was starting to build up to the Blaine/Ross conflict so Amber, Sal, Joyce, and Becky in particular needed to be in specific places arcwise, so the priority was getting them in place. Still, means the last time Joe’s arc was meaningfully touched on was two full books ago.
Nah, I’m holding out for that as the grand finale of the series. Sure, the last time Willis ended a strip with a big wedding they bit off more than they could chew and it took years to finish, but all the more reason for a do-over! Nothing could go wrong!
There were a few hints after the Malaya bit – showing that he seems to have reverted in many ways, though I don’t think we’ve seen him actually hitting on anyone since then.
Those who read the Malaya Slipshine may have some other clues.
Stacy might have been wearing heels in that picture – it’s not super-clear in that picture, so that might not be the case, but those shoes do look like they’d increase height a little compared to what she’s wearing in today’s comic.
That or it’s a mistake and we shouldn’t be looking ooooOOOoooo
Amber’s been stuck with two people-she-doesn’t-know-well-enough-to-think-of-as-family for a month, it may have drained her reserves of sociability. She’s probably looking forward to barricading herself in her room and studying for the next couple of months.
And people who aren’t likely to respect her boundaries and need for copious amounts of time to herself.
Not in an intentionally bad way, but I can definitely see Richard making a big effort to draw her out and get her involved and doing things as a family.
I was legit worried Walky’s mom was gonna follow through on her threat regarding amber either through subtle/shitty means. I kinda figured joe’s dad was gonna step up and pay for ambers tuition at some point so I was worried that Linda would hop back onto the “get amber kicked out” train once she realized she wouldnt get what she wanted by doing nothing. She’s shitty enough as a person to try it.
I’m wondering if Richard and Stacy had a commitment ceremony or a civil marriage over the break and that’s why Joe feels able to call Amber is step-sister.
Weddings are traditionally very expensive and time-consuming. While it’s not impossible that they had a wedding during the time skip, with only a couple months it would likely be pretty half-assed, and at that point might as well just do a civil thing and save a lot of money and headache.
Sure, traditionally, but you can do a fun, cheap wedding. Obviously Richard would have to foot the bill because Stacey’s flat broke but it can be done.
Indiana’s incest laws, checking Wikipedia, only appear to cover biological relations, not ‘by affinity’ ones like step-parent/sibling. So, in Indiana, it is legal. Whether or not step- and adoptive relationships count is generally a state by state basis, yeah. (And if the relationship involves consenting adults, they’re generally not going to advertise that fact so it would be illegal but not enforceably so. Which is a sentence I sure did just write.)
I’m pretty sure it’s more the fact that Joe and Amber would find the concept offputting than whether or not it’s legal. Even with them so recently step-siblings, it’s weird.
It’s hard to strictly ban such relationships. Especially in a case like this – if Joe and Amber had hooked up before their parents did, what would that do legally?
Would they have to break up to avoid a crime? What if they’d married first? Retroactively annulled?
There is an entire subgenre of kink on the pornotube sites about “stepsibling sex”. Not sure if it’s precisely illegal, but definitely not something you’d advertise at a family reunion.
Most people will find it very creepy, or will say they will. Anything that whiffs of incest is considered creepy. This is observational data which does not go away if you disagree.
There are non-genetic reasons for objecting to incest in the real world. Power imabalance, especially between people of different age or generation. Excessive entanglement: if the romance with a family member goes sour, you’re still stuck with them as family, or living with them if you’re both underage and/or broke; also crossing emotional streams of sex and family (yes, this is part of what makes it hot too). The fact that you’ll have to hide it from most people or be considered creepy and maybe have the cops/public prosecutors sniffing around looking for something they can get you on.
As recently acquainted adults who probably have the marketable skills to survive on their own, Joe and Amber dating and blowing up is on the low end of disaster potential. It would be awkward but a lot better than a 17yo and a 13yo, say. Still not great.
HOORAY! Congrats to the newlyweds! What a lovely couple♡♡♡. Joe seems to be happy for them♡. Amber seems to really make an effort to ignore them. I’m more with Joe.
Joe dad will be a newlywed for the remainder of the comic. Let the two of them enjoy time dilation.
Amber is dealing with the death of a friend that she had a role in. How will AG react.
I expect this to continue to be a reset. Cast can ignore previous storylines. Becky is basically a new character and the old Becky is just a bad memory.
Actually, if Dorothy’s been single and horny for months of timeskip, I could see her turning to Joe for a fling. She’d know he’s good at it and won’t make a fuss. Perfect for the Yalebound future president!
I couldn’t. She’s never shown any sign of interest in flings. You can argue it was just being horny that drove her to Walky, but she expressed it as romantic interest.
I can’t say I was too worried tbh, I was pretty confident that that silhouette was Amber. I was also pretty sure about Joe, which makes me very sad that we seem to have lost Ethan in one way or another. So many feels!
During the highly rigourous selection process it was considered. But between a poorly translated grunt, several other words and “Guarantees”, the russian judge felt there was only one guaranteed safe vote for the tie breaker. Hence, “hrngh” was a close second, but couldn’t overcome the politics of international translation. Given the root of the problem and frustration at the loss, “hrngh” is going to give up on Tokyo or Paris, and is instead going to study linguistics, languages and translation. “hrngh” strongly feels that no other onomatopoeic words ought to be wronged due to failures of translation.
Sadly, this won’t work. “hrngh” is destined to fail in this later endeavor. After years of lobbying, studies, appeals and public support and mountains of descriptivist evidence, “hrngh” continues to be shunned by the translatory dictionaries committee. Finally after years of effort, loss, personal tragedy and opposition, “hrngh” ultimately retires into obscurity, lost to the world and alone. In the end, in bed alone they pass away lips curled in irony as their death rattle escapes with their last exhalation, “hrngh.”
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not awkward, no
at least Joe has a leg up on Saiba Asahi hurr hurr
actually, alt-text, Mike meant I forgot to be worried
Something something… Geoff Thew… something… rule D…
When my parents sent me off to college, my dad just told me, “Have fun, don’t get caught.”
Beautiful
Mine just said “Don’t do anything we wouldn’t do”. So I have a pretty wide wiggle area.
heehee “wiggle”
I commuted and was the first one up and home around when everyone was going to bed – evening and night classes – Thank the deities of scheduling I didn’t have to interact with family back then.
I finished early enough on Fridays to get into The Blind Duck – Quonset Hut lunch counter cum pub between the two campus buildings – before they did door charges for the band – never got kicked – still ended up home sometime on a Saturday. I think I got a BSc …..
Hrngh indeed.
But congrats on being step siblings now, you two!
Hey now, I’m reasonably sure Joe has never tried to bang Dina.
“Wait, you’re telling me that’s a chick?”
Dina will eventually evolve into a chick in about 65 million years.
Joe isn’t a scaly.
pffft
Dina strongly references the support for feathered/fluffy dinosaurs. (not all were, but some definitely were). So if he’s not a scaley, might he still be feathery? Feathered boa’s would seem to establish a precident for that.
What happens in the time skip stays in the time skip
I have a vague recollection that he hit on her, the subtext went over her head, and he didn’t push it. I can’t recall specifics, though; I might be thinking of something else entirely.
They have all of six strips together and I don’t see it. https://www.dumbingofage.com/tag/joe+dina/
Well, she did get a donut, so she probably was on the list. I think it happened off-panel, and then Dina was clearly in a relationship with Becky. And given his experiences I really doubt Joe is the type to make a move on someone he knows is in a relationship.
I don’t think that’s enough evidence to assume he actually made a move. Those donuts seemed more like a general apologetic gesture to the female dorm population, and Dina probably went for it because it was a free donut. It’s not like there was any strict ‘only donuts if you’re on the list’ verification policy.
She approached the table from behind him. There is a good chance he wasn’t even aware of her being there. There is also a good chance he wasn’t ever aware of her being around.
My entry for horrible Joeism:
“Don’t be disgusting, I don’t bang KIDS.”
oof. reminds me of Raidah and her posse
Hell, even our main characters said something similar (not as judgy and rude, but still infantilizing) about how odd the concept of Dina dating was at the room party, right before she and Becky actually became a thing. Dina then pointed out that she found it insulting and offensive, and everyone’s laid off it since. (Sarah still had the occasional strip about how odd it was Dina doesn’t use contractions or the like, and I think they all expressed surprise Dina was one of the oldest in the cast, but Dina doesn’t express offense about either of those. I suspect the latter was also focused on her LOOKING young, not acting young, where Raidah and the room party both included focus on her behavior.)
To be fair to all of them, both Dina’s looks and behavior were coded as very young, especially early on. That’s changed as she’s become better at socializing.
Think especially of her bit with Riley, where she was surprised Riley was 12 and Riley was surprised she wasn’t.
Sure, but she hasn’t actually changed the core of her interests or tastes since. Hell, she will still infodump about dinosaurs given an opportunity/during a fight sequence, and Dorothy and Joyce did just throw cereal at her for the extended Jurassic Park joke so it is still her favorite food. Sarah was one of the ones agreeing that Becky ‘putting the moves on Dina’ was weird, and she’s the one who saw Dina awkwardly infodump at Raidah and Raidah immediately ask if she was in middle school, before pivoting to ‘mentally challenged’ and the infantilizing. Which Dina clearly found insulting, and expressed to Sarah. She’s a bit better with social situations, but her social awkwardness wasn’t what you’d really expect from a neurotypical 12-year-old.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/03-the-butterflies-fly-away/safe-2/ And the strip following, I’m not linking the Raidah one or I will scream forever.
I don’t hold it against any of the main cast – they are a bunch of 18-year-olds, after all, and Joyce apologized for the ‘looks and acts like she’s twelve’ line immediately after Dina explained it while Dorothy had her ‘Huzzah!’ (Sarah didn’t onscreen, to my knowledge, but I’m pretty sure there was something offscreen given how often the two of them interact one-on-one.) It wasn’t done without malice. But it was infantilizing, and it was infantilization explicitly based in Dina’s social discomfort… and the fact that she’s not neurotypical, and makes no effort to mask that. That attitude happens in real life, a lot, and is kind of a hot button issue for me because even my (compassionate, generally with-it and respectful of me) family have fallen into it before. Hell, in the comments of that sequence, there was someone hoping Dina wouldn’t date because she reminded them of their autistic child, and said something about ‘innocence’ or the like. It was EXTREMELY uncomfortable! That it was done without malice doesn’t make it not ableist.
It’s definitely infantilizing and I’d say it’s especially bad when it comes from people who know her well enough to know how old she is and that she’s in college on her own – which is all the other girls on the floor and wasn’t Raidah and her cronies.
Their statements were worse, but the context around them was better.
The first moment of Raidah asking if she was a middle-schooler was better, yeah. At a mall, it was semi-plausible for Sarah to have someone she introduced as a friend who was more a mentor-mentee relationship or something. (I forgot how bad Joyce’s comment was before checking for that second, but I’m glad she was the one who gave the full apology and hasn’t made comments since.) Every other comment in the Raidah and posse exchange? Went from ‘honest mistake’ or ‘screwed up, but immediate and sincere apology’ to ‘very revealing of your opinions about the neurodivergent, because you are still doubling down on this.’
There’s a reason I bring up the party scene – it sucks, and it’s a conscious point of that scene that even our protagonists (including DOROTHY) aren’t immune to ableism regarding Dina. But the difference between Char using the R-word and she and Chan laughing, and the way Raidah treats her? Is mostly one of tone. Dina sums it up when she volunteers to spy at the start of the Jacob Matter by saying ‘She was not kind to me, though I imagine she thought that she was.’ Raidah calls out the blatant insults, but she still insults Dina with the ‘mentally challenged’ line right in front of her (in a way where she isn’t concerned Dina is right there and can hear her,) and then kneels down and talks to her like she’s a small child. (‘Do you understand?’) Sarah had already called Dina a friend who was their age, which means it’s way more likely she’s a fellow college student. The line at the party aside, Joyce consistently treats Dina like a peer. Raidah didn’t intend it as an insult, but she doesn’t respect Dina or consider her competent enough to be insulted. (Consider how she treats Joyce, who she has very little respect for but still acknowledges as a peer on some level. The pizza lunch is full of subtle insults, but never anything to her face.)
That was fast.
But now he’ll never be able to…do much for a completion run of the dorms
So
Although there’s still a certain amount of “ickkk” factor involved, banging a step-sister is not the same as banging your true sister.
There’s a whole genre of “movies” about it even.
And so many sexy comics from Japan.
Those comics have no “step” in it, believe you me.
To be honest the whole “step” thing is weird to me. Is that really a specific thing for people or just a label to slap on it so the creators can pretend it’s not really an incest fantasy?
Pretty sure it’s the latter, mostly. Also why you get series with ‘we’re adopted siblings, so it’s fine!’ Barf, so much barf.
Definitely the latter, 99% of the time.
Sometimes. Other times it’s used in order to allow the work to explore the relationship between two people who’ve grown up together. Similar to, but also with some major differences from, the “childhood friends” theme.
Just look for the “gay cooking” tag on Yuri-ism.
Especially if you want some interesting new recipes. Provided you have metric measuring tools.
They’re not biologically related, but I’m still kinda glad Joe never tried to get with Amber.
He would have met his demise.
By snu-snu.
Cpt_America_I_understood_that_reference.gif
Hey, a sister is automatically excluded.
He’ll never get all the achievement trophies for his steam wall!
He wont be a Completionist
So over the skip Joe forgot how to condition his hair and Amber has learned a new language consisting of annoyed grunts.
D’oh!
I mean, they apparently spent some portion of winter break in the same place for an extended period of time. With their newlywed parents, at least one of whom has a serious boundaries and appropriateness issue.
I too would be a bit… preoccupied with things other than the reality of that house at that time.
(Joe’s hair actually changed pre-timeskip to the tousled look. Evidently post-Malaya Slipshine he decided he liked the look? And Willis liked changing out characters’ hairstyles since a lot of them had been so close to the head and perfectly round/rectangular. Joe, Danny, and Walky on the rectangle side, Ethan, Leslie, Dorothy and Amber over on the round one. Finally, it’s free from its confines! Danny might still have a pretty flat hairdo judging from silhouettes, but that’s okay because he’s Wonderbread.)
What if she was hanging out with Beef a whole lot.
Yeah, it’d be awkward if she became his stepdaughter later.
(I still haven’t settled if in my headcanon where Joe’s dad is actually Joe from the future is he literally his own father or did he simply assume his father’s identity.)
so he did the nasty in the pasty?!
A Cornish re-make of American Pie?
They were all pretty corn-ish.
Now I’m picturing Joe and his dad going on drunken time travel adventures.
“Dad… I am your father.”
“Nooo… wait, sweet! Good job, son!”
Oooh, someone watched Red Dwarf.
Maybe Shortpacked Joe having escaped the soggies came to the DoA universe and raised that Joe.
Yay Amber!! This makes me feel unreasonably happy. Enh, it’s just the anxiety.
Like being stepsiblings has stopped people flooding the front page of A Certain Website.
[Text starts scrolling from right to left very slowly near the top of the screen:]
THIS COMIC WAS UPLOADED TO http://WWW.DUMBINGOFAGE.COM
I’m glad to see that Amber is indeed returning and she has a new brother, who might be equally as annoying as her first brother.
All that said, Joe did you really need to add that?
He’s Joe so… I’m gonna go with yes he most certainly did
Joe continues to illustrate the difference between the family you choose and the family you’re stuck with.
even if you’re loose
not family you fuck with.
Stay good Amber! No Step-Fratricide. This isn’t “justifiable”. Yet.
I guess that means they officially tied the knot?
I wonder how long it will take Ms. Walkerton to find out Amber hasn’t dropped out.
Dammit, Joe.
So Amber has a mix of Amber and AmaziGirl hair, with a dash of crazed cavewoman to top it all off. That bodes well. No craziness in that head waiting to escape and stab another person (again).
Okay that implication about craziness is just… so deeply ableist, I probably don’t have the cycles or spoons to get into it, but I’ll just focus on a main point.
Both times we’ve ever seen Amber stab someone, EVER, were in actively traumatic, ongoing situations. (She obviously shouldn’t have blamed Sal, who was a distant second in the traumatizing people in that moment, but Blaine was continuing to berate her over witnessing an attempted holdup, so I consider that situation ongoing!) The first was after being goaded into it and having a momentary breakdown. She was horrified by her potential for violence afterwards, justified it to herself for some time by painting Sal as her personal supervillain, and made peace with Sal (as did AG, separately) after realizing she was wrong. The second was in response to a very real threat to herself, her friends, and frankly everyone in that dorm. She evidently stabbed Ryan far more times than necessary, but was still considered acting in self-defense. In the aftermath she was, again, horrified by her potential for violence afterwards, and justified it by painting HERSELF as the monster AG was made to and failed to keep in check.
Amber has never stabbed someone outside a deeply traumatic situation. Amber does not WANT to stab another person again if it is even remotely avoidable. Amber is, at the moment, showing body language and grunts of ‘not really paying much attention, focusing on phone and resigned to All This.’ That’s not even how she or AG act when they need to fight something. It comes off more as ‘exhausted introvert ready to have a conscientious roommate again.’
Furthermore, the belief that mentally ill and neurodivergent people (especially those with DID) are inherently violent and have craziness ‘waiting to escape’ is both demonstrably false – we’re statistically far more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators – and deeply harmful to us, as it justifies a lot of that fear and violence and perpetuates an idea that the Scary Violent Craziness is immutable, stigmatizing people with the condition and making them less likely to seek or find competent mental health support.
This may or may not be coherent in the morning, it’s 1 AM, but that is just… REALLY gross, in its implications.
Thank you, Regalli
Started on the basic character bit and went ‘no actually, I DO have the brain energy to do the Perpetuating Dangerous Stereotypes part tonight so someone else doesn’t have to.’ Glad to be helpful there.
Thank you Regalli!
+1 pretend upvote (because real ones are unavailable here)
Thank you! Very nicely put.
All of this! I’ll also add that both Amber and Amazigirl have also used violence *to protect and save other people*.
Speaking as someone whose job can, at times, require physical force against other people (bouncer), Amber/Amazi-Girl’s use of violence was extremely gratuitous in most cases (i.e., trying to jackknife someone by doing a flying double kick off a lamppost to the base of their spine). Sorry, but I cannot agree with your addition to Regalli’s statement.
OTOH, it’s comic book violence, it doesn’t really make sense whether it’s too much force when half of it is practically impossible anyway.
Wait wait. Are you complaining that the degree of harm delivered was gratuitous, or that the techniques AG uses to deliver it are gratuitous?
At first I heard the former, but now I can only hear the latter. Like someone complaining about movie realism: “No no, that’s NOT how you hold a knife Amber!”
At a guess, ‘the techniques used tend to cause a degree of harm that is gratuitous.’ And, probably fair. I can buy AG never doing permanent damage because the same comic book physics that protected her in the car chases also protect the people she’s fighting, but realistically they’re dangerous as fuck. There’s a reason Sal was uncomfortable with AG seeking out fights during the Dox Bros fight, and that’s to remind everyone it IS an uncomfortable flaw of AG’s that she enjoys fighting (but only against people who ‘deserve’ it, and not doing any permanent damage, which is how she justifies it to herself.)
When the cast needs a superhero, they really need her – even Sal agrees with this, and while we didn’t see Marcie in the aftermath of the kidnapping I think she’d also agree stopping Blaine in that situation was entirely necessary – but a lot of AG’s crimefighting isn’t that degree of necessary. (And I’ve gotta wonder what she’s thinking in the fallout of the last three arcs. Mike ran to the woods in part because he knew she’d be there, and we already know they had survivor’s guilt already. I so hope they’ve gotten competent mental health support. It seems so easy for that to have evolved into ‘if I hadn’t done this, maybe he’d still be alive.’ Poor girls.)
There’s definitely stuff to criticize about Amazi-Girl, but I don’t think it’s fair to criticize her techniques as if they were realistic when they clearly aren’t intended that way.
Regalli’s got the right of it. Amber/Amazi-Girl tended to go for maximum damage no matter what, which always bothered me (a person who has to try like hell not to hurt people, just because of my size and strength). There’s also Kella’s outright wrongness about them using violence to protect and save other people, which . . . that’s not at all why they were doing that.
There’s a reason why the “Three Stooges ward” in the Simpson’s fictional hospital became the “WWE ward”. Most of those wrestling moves are dangerous as fvck if not blocked out and rehearsed.
Bless you.
+99999999999999. So many people seriously need to hear this.
“exhausted introvert” – yeah Richard and Joe wouldn’t have backed off to give Amber enough space would they have.
With all the best intentions: drawing her out, getting to know her, etc.
Wow. That went places I did intend.
First, let’s recall we are talking about a fictional character. I would never be so glib about an actual person. Perhaps the fact that Amber has so many aspects of her character you do not see outside of comic books was an issue here. If you took a personal affront to this glib comment, know that offense was not intended.
Coming soon: the encounter with Joyce. Irresistible cheerfulness meets immovable grumpiness.
… I love how the J&W rerun today involves the line ‘I don’t want to be party to a possible doomed marriage’, and the character saying it is being very blunt but entirely reasonable, thinking they’re rushing into it to cover for underlying insecurities in the relationship… and then over here, we have this.
No reason to bring up these two in relation. No reason whatsoever.
(I mean, I hope it works for Stacy. God knows they need that sweet sweet doctor money. And Joe’s not a terrible stepsibling to have, all told. But.
GOD this marriage is doomed.)
I mean, Joe was upset with his dad at first about it because he didn’t trust him not to cheat. Probably still doesn’t.
Hey, maybe they got an open relationship? They could be swingers. Let Stacy live a little. I bet they can make it work with communication.
We know explicitly it was not, at least going into the ‘getting serious’ phase.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-8/01-face-the-strange/doing/
While I have no objections in principle to open marriages, polyamory, etc, that’s less a right-or-wrong thing and more of a right-or-wrong-for-these-people thing. It requires a degree of emotional confidence and sureness — knowing this person loves me and will be there for me when I need him, even if right this second he’s 8-inches deep in someone half my age — that Stacy doesn’t possess right now. She doesn’t need to live a little by getting out and having sex with other people. She needs to live a little by having an emotional secure home with people she can trust love her.
At least, that’s my read of her.
And there is absolutely no indications in the comic that it’s an open relationship. That either of them has suggested it, talked about it or would be open to it. There’s no indication that Richard wants an open relationship, just that he’ll eventually cheat.
There’s an annoying tendency when cheating comes up in a story to suggest some form of poly as the fix. The two aren’t particularly related and cheaters aren’t likely to be good at being open.
Problem is that an uncommitted partner in a monogamous relationship isn’t gonna become committed once you open the relationship up. A cheater isn’t lying and concealing their affairs because they are afraid of hurting their partners, they’re lying and concealing it because they don’t want to face the consequences of their actions. They want the affair but they want to keep the spouse too. And that sort of selfish behaviour where you can’t be up front with your actions and desires and accept that they might bring fourth consequences you didn’t want (like a partner leaving you) will be just as harmful in a poly relationship, but they might do it in another aspect, like gaslighting their partners or practice financial abuse
I understand you tried to keep a light tone. I think I’ve spent too much time in poly-groups telling people to stop treating the relationship form as the solution to everything wrong with relationships. I was one of those that tried to open up my relationship with a douche of a fiancé and it just didn’t work. Now I’m in a triad with two wonderful guys
It’s also common for cheaters to want freedom to sleep around for themselves, but not to extend the same to their partners.
That would be precisely the joke! Richard and Stacy have known each other approximately four months by now. That’s pretty well within range of honeymoon phase for a relationship, and given Richard’s defense to Joe’s ‘You will cheat on her and hurt her’ was a very dismissive ‘I’m a changed man! I’m barely noticing all the hot women (my son’s age) on this college campus!’ line. That inspires about as much confidence in me as it did in Joe.
We have no indication whatsoever Richard cheating on Joe’s mom was an isolated incident, or that he’s done anything whatsoever to meaningfully change that behavior beyond ‘love fixes everything!’ Stacy, meanwhile, almost certainly has some DISTINCT mental scars from an ex-husband cheating on her. Given that, I kind of suspect she doesn’t know. Either way, she is now significantly financially dependent on this man for the foreseeable future (between the Ryan lawsuit and the tuition,) so BOY HOWDY will that be a fun situation
whenif Richard does cheat on her and she finds out! Certainly won’t be anything to remind her of there!I mean, I doubt it’s going to implode onscreen, not any time soon (I’d expect it no sooner than Joe getting another significant arc,) but I do NOT give that marriage five years.
Is that five years in comic time of five years our time? (ie about a month)
I’m going with the safer bet of comic time – We’ll almost certainly never see that far ahead in normal strips.
In real time, I could see about a month and be only mildly surprised. Another week or two in and I won’t even be surprised. (Or clear indication Richard is already considering cheating. Basically I’m building in time between ‘noticing other women,’ ‘considering cheating,’ and ‘cheating,’ and then a bit more time before Stacy actually finds out, so a month is possible but stretching it if he isn’t thinking about it already.)
I dunno, I’m a little optimistic. That Dr. Rosenthal explicitly begged Amber to try and be kinder to her mom, I think that displays, at the least, a level of investment in Stacy that he’d feel compelled to act on.
Plus damn, Stacy and Amber need a friggin’ break from jerkass dads.
Like the level of investment he had in Joe’s mom?
That’s a relationship we saw nothing of, with only anecdotes from Joe that his dad was a cheating scumbag. He might legitimately be trying to turn over a new leaf with Stacy.
We saw him and Joe talking about the relationship with Stacy. He’s clearly not “trying” anything.
He seems to have been assuming that because he’s not feeling any urge to cheat right then, that he’s never going to have any problem with it and thus no need to do anything to try to improve.
It is possible that he’s right and Stacy is the perfect woman who will satisfy him and he’ll just stay happy enough with her that he’ll never wander again, no effort needed. It’s just not very likely.
Realistically, it might last longer than the comic covers. Narratively, it’s going to come to a head in story at some point, likely tied into Joe’s own character arc.
I think he is sincere in trying to turn over a new leaf, but given that conversation with Joe didn’t discuss anything concrete he did after his last breakup or what he’s learned (say, honest communication, or acknowledging he can find other people attractive but not actually act on that attraction,) my odds of success from what we’ve seen so far are… not promising. I’m inclined to think Joe’s seen him with a new partner more than once.
That still doesn’t guarantee failure, though – the way Joe’s arc seems set up, realizing his father can change and acknowledge his previous flaws to be a better partner could be a big point. But I also find it interesting, now that I think about it, that both Joe and Amber (and Faz, for that matter, but we don’t know how much contact either of them’s had with him since) have similar ‘fear I’ll become like my scummy dad’ things going on, and Amber just recently hit a turning point with hers. Richard wouldn’t need to cheat on Stacy for Amber and Joe to have that bonding time, but it could well be an impetus for that development.
My read on Richard at the moment isn’t ‘irredeemably terrible’ so much as ‘buying into some of the same Life As A RomCom concepts Joyce did re: Jacob, but having already faced worse consequences.’ (In this case it’s more like ‘Romance novel rake whose womanizing ways end as soon as he finds The Love Of A Good Woman,’ but same concept.) I can totally see him figuring it out offscreen!… But we need some indication he has, yet, probably through frank conversation with Joe.
My read on Joedad (I am going to force this until it sticks) is that he did get some off-screen character development. He had a fling with Stacy, things worked out, and he’s all in on trying to be a good partner to her. If he gets further developed the way Hank did as he showed up here and there we totally could see what you talked about, where he’s just decided he’s reformed without putting in the work, and how that’ll play out.
Plus thinking at it from a mechanical storytelling point where does that leave Amber? Court bills pile up from Ryan, who knows what’s up with her dad’s estate, Linda pulling strings, and she has no one in her corner to help her out. From that perspective I think he serves a role in anchoring Amber to IU financially.
I dunno, I like to think he and Stacy are working out just to give the latter a break.
It’s possible, but there’s no evidence for it at this point. We know from when he first talked about this with Joe that he hadn’t done any work or consideration of it then and saw no need to do so.
Maybe something happened in the time skip, but I wouldn’t count on it.
Stacy is an enabler and an irresponsible mother, and Richard will probably cheat on her. WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIS!
Yeah, these two give me a whole host of bad feelings.
Stacy’s an abuse victim herself.
She also seems to have a terrible taste in men, she should take that into consideration…
“What’re you doing, step-bro?”
No.
Can we not do this? It’s bad enough seeing this comment on every single thread on certain other sites.
Amber had a horrible semester thanks to her abusive dad and her mental illness.I hope Willis doens’t-Who am I kidding? Willis will do something darker probably.
Mike, her friend, died. That’s going to weigh on her mind and conscience for a while. The presence of further traumatizing problems for Amber would just be cruel.
I’m hoping she at least has a couple weeks before the next round of Drama starts. If only because Amber being in a relatively more stable headspace will free up some storyline space for other stuff. (I love Amber and want her to be healthy and not self-loathing. Her storylines being more downward sloping than not is STRESSFUL. Let her have a nice, relaxing roller derby night or something. Her thoughts on Fire Emblem, maybe, or the new IDW Transformers verse.)
(Thinking on it, I actually do want to know the cast’s thoughts on Horny Anime Chess, it’d be hilarious.)
Is that something I want to google?
Fear not, I did… I believe it is in reference to this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHZ_6QwMx2U
(If that doesn’t show as a link, it’s cause i didn’t do anything to make it)
Yep! ‘Anime Chess’ is occasionally a way to describe Fire Emblem, because… well, it’s a very anime turn-based tactical game series. Recent games have added a player insert character in addition to the previous focus on relationships among your units, and well… The most recent game (and the previous one, which was a remake of an older one and lacks the Player Insert) have stepped back the ‘oh my god why are you like this’ character designs, mostly… but it also involves most of the cast being your students and still treating you as a mentor after a five-year timeskip. (I think a non-zero number of players choose to just ignore this as best they can and pretend your PC was a fellow student.) I still consider this a step up from Fates, which had multiple characters on each route who had the ‘I know we treat each other as siblings, and were raised together thinking we were blood-related/you have spent your lives thinking I was related, and considered my biological mother your mother, but since we’re actually adoptive/step-siblings, let’s get married!’ uh… trope going on. For lack of better phrase. God that game was terrible.
I love this series. I really do. Sacred Stones was amazing. Path of Radiance? Great. I’m even quite fond of Awakening and that’s when the dating sim elements really started showing up. Three Houses is a significant return to form in actually caring about the geopolitics and worldbuilding, and the writing actually makes all the main factions sympathetic based off what information they know in their routes instead of the nonsense that was Fates’ writing. But god, why is it like this.
…is Joe eyeing Scooter or Scrappy or Booster or whatever the hell their name is kinda like Dina is eyeing Becky, only Joe-ier? Because I think he is.
Pretty sure if he’s eyeballing anyone it’s Sarah, who he’s expressed an interest in before. Then again, I swear they dated in Roomies! So Willis probably wouldn’t go down that route as they like exploring new grounds.
I thought maybe? And maybe he is. But looks from the angle more like Booster. To me anyway. We’ll find out either way.
I wouldn’t really wish Joe’s attentions on anybody. xD
They did. And, it could be inferred that Joe’s feelings for Joyce impacted their relationship. And, that lead to Sarah taking down Joyce and the gang.
I get that it’s an odd name and they’re a sudden intrusive push into the established cast, but can we not intentionally get the nonbinary coded character’s name wrong, even if it’s for a joke?
In response to your actual question, idk, seems like Booster is probably upstairs still
I legit (mis)remembered their name as Scooter first and couldn’t come up with it until I searched for it. 100% straight up.
Fair, no worries, but even if I could remove my comment I’d leave it up, part so your reply would stay and part so anyone actually doing on purpose knows they’re in for a yelling
Also I only just realized you meant in the cast image (which his eyes look really ambiguous to me, like he could be looking all the way to Lucy or someone, or could be looking straight down at Joyce)
Oh, yeah, in the updated cast photo, sorry.
It looks a lot less ambiguous to me – not, like, entirely unambiguous, it could also totes be Sarah. But I have a fair degree of shipovision so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sarah seems like the most likely one (proximity meaning his eyeline hits her before it would hit Booster or Lucy,) but that side of the cast page does seem to have more potentially-interested people in general. (The other side contains both confirmed lesbians,* one of whom is also asexual; Dina who’s a gray ace in a relationship with a woman; Ruth who is likely also in a relationship; and Dorothy, who I assume from knowing Joe for years could NEVER be convinced to mess around with him and he knows it.) I’m pretty sure most of the people on that side of the cast page would turn him down, but we only know Danny and Amber are indisputably off the options and do have three other definitely single, straight women there, so they’re at least more plausible than Becky or Carla. (This is not a high bar, but.) He also has hooked up with Malaya before – so even if Malaya wasn’t gonna give him the time of day this time, which I find plausible, he might not have propositioned and been rejected yet. Booster is a complete unknown in sexuality and relationship status.
* Over in Shortpacked, Carla’s counterpart described herself as a homoromantic asexual trans-chassis woman (said counterpart was also an AI who used to be in a car,) in those exact words, and the only part of that that wouldn’t transfer in the Sexuality and Gender as Willisversal Constants is being an AI.
By which I mean, Booster may be compatible and available or may not, we don’t have enough info yet to say, but that does at least temporarily put them in the ‘maybe’ category.
Oh sure, we absolutely don’t have enough info. I’m just fishing for clues because it’s fun.
Oh, absolutely it is. Get out the relationship conspiracy pinboard!
Hm, I wonder about the cast photo. there seems to be Billie, Malaya (poor Sal is still rooming with Malaya?), Danny and the last one might be Marcie. But no Carla (or the shadow to Joe’s left is Carla and Billie is out of the main cast?)
The shadow is for sure Carla, we can see the skates on the shadow’s feet. 😀
Right, now you tell me I see it, too.
I’ve been assuming that’s Billie next to Amber.
I think he’s looking at Sarah, not Booster.
They were all drawn individually and assembled later so he isn’t looking at anyone.
I really hope that Joe can pull himself together and be a good step-bro if she needs him to be. She would probably kick a few asses for him if she had a good reason to (if she isnt scared by that whole incident and amaz-girl is gone forever), so I hope he can get his head on straight and be there for her, even if its the annoying brother who sometimes does something really nice and genuine.
I highly doubt that Amazi-Girl is gone forever. As some of our systems have commented, full integration/personality absorption is not often a good idea, treatment-wise.
If Amazigirl was a fully developed personality, then I doubt she is gone forever.
I mean, it’s not the reason she was hoping for (since she seemed to get her hopes up a little), but it’s not the worst reason. Like, I can imagine how it would be a relief. He’s probably seen Cruel Intentions.
I guess Joe:
– Doesn’t know about Amber being Amazi-girl,
and or:
– Doesn’t remember talking to Danny about how great Amazi-girl would be in bed, because she obviously has “issues”
So does this mean he tried to bang MARY? Ewwww.
Joe has made a point to say he really likes getting with nice wholesome christian girls so I can totally see her being on his radar.
Nice and wholesome?
Honestly Joe may not consider Mary a woman so much as a malevolent nature spirit
“He tried and failed?”
“He tried and died.”
I understood that reference.
I feel like there’s probably a couple others he didn’t try to bang but I’m sure Amber is in the minority in that aspect.
He might be using ‘tried’ loosely, too, like ‘was gonna approach her but turns out she’s gay/taken/etc’
There are worse reasons, I guess.
Joe and Dina? Dorothy? This is a hint of timeskip activities?
Well, Dina’s taken… but he knew Dorothy in High School
that said he certainly does appreciate the bro code??? Maybe if she was with Danny by then???
I totally forgot they went back that way. Seems like they barely interact in college.
She did call herself his friend, though https://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/05-media-rumble/know/
He put Dorothy on the Do List as soon as she and Danny broke up, and inflated her rating to be nice to his best bro.
Did Joe ever try to bang Ruth? or Sierra?
JOE 💗
Off topic of the page…. Does anyone know at the top of their head if anyone had worn heels or wedges at all during the comic? Bare feet? (I wanna say yes to the latter but I can’t remember) I’m doing a “draw a characters in 6 styles and I can think of any references I could use for Willis-style (and of course my character dons open toed heels)
Sierra doesn’t wear shoes.
Besides Sierra, people are generally showing their toes in the showers (…this sounds wrong. I’m sorry. I’m trying to be helpful.) https://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-5/01-when-somebody-loved-me/detritus/
Pretty sure either Billie or Joyce wore shoes with a heel during the mall storyline. (Or possibly Joyce on her disastrous ‘date’ with Joe.)
Oh, here is a good reference for top-view
(again, I am trying to be helpful)
And I forgot the link. https://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-3/01-if-the-shoes-split/safe/
Ughh Joe. Well, at least he’s not into stepcest.
Well that was quick, but at least Amber won’t have to worry about tuition.
Unless and until Richard cheats on Stacy and the marriage falls apart.
PRETTY sure stacy doesn’t wind up broke in that scenario.
Yeah, Joe gets the look in the last panel a lot.
Good ol’ Joe
Quick, Amber. Throw a snowball at Joe.
I feel like Amber will actively resent her mother more if she’s happy and their marriage is stable.
I dunno about “actively.”
Look, Joe, all you have to do is say “No Chromo” and it doesn’t count.
Doin it in black n’ white/greyscale?
Joe looks like the only student who might have actually gotten a haircut during the timeskip, or at least his hair doesn’t appear to have grown longer.
Well, he’s kind of right. That would’ve been awkward 😉
It seems that Amber has learned that the cosy hypothetical of having Joe as a stepbrother has been neatly smothered by the cold hard nature of reality! She’d probably have done better if, as seems the case, Walky hadn’t dumped her. Combined with Mike’s death, I’m pretty sure it’s her instinct to curl up in an antisocial ball and ignore the world around her.
Just letting ya know that’s not actually what antisocial means. I think Mike is far more likely to be antisocial in general than Amber shutting people out. It is a belief that the rules of society do not apply to you, not just a one time thing, either, it’s ongoing. You’re likely going for isolation.
Hopefully Joe’s self loathing is addressed, I really don’t like how that was left hanging after it was brought up and then he was told to get over it and the plot changed.
That’s not really what happened. To the point I’m not even sure what bit you’re talking about.
There is definitely a hanging plot with Joe. It’ll come round again.
I believe it’s in reference to when his Do List came out, and Joe lashed out at Joyce that he deliberately disconnects from everyone and makes himself act like a shallow, clueless douchebag because risking actual emotional connection is magnitudes worse than being a wacky sex frat bro.
“Do you realize how much worse it would be if anyone actually cared about me? If I let anything I do matter?”
Joyce didn’t tell him to get over it, though, she just explained why Joe’s list was immensely hurtful to her given what she went through and how normalized it was that any guy, even one she considers to be a friend, could reduce her to an object.
Joe then started trying to make steps to be different, because he did find this horrifying when Joyce explained precisely why and how this was hurtful (his Wacky Sex Frat Bro persona also seems to be a ‘people won’t get hurt the way my mom was when my dad cheated on her’ thing, which given the implications there… OW, but also is clearly based on the idea his behavior is gross but harmless.) And then he backslid pretty soon after, and hasn’t really been in focus since the Faz Is Great storyline (his exact phrase before hooking up with Malaya was ‘lasted longer than I expected to’, probably because he tried immediately going to the other extreme of No Sex Or Flirting Whatsoever.) In hindsight that was probably because the plot was starting to build up to the Blaine/Ross conflict so Amber, Sal, Joyce, and Becky in particular needed to be in specific places arcwise, so the priority was getting them in place. Still, means the last time Joe’s arc was meaningfully touched on was two full books ago.
I definitely expect that to change, though.
I think so too.
After all, we need to find out how Joyce and Joe’s wedding happened over the timeskip!
Nah, I’m holding out for that as the grand finale of the series. Sure, the last time Willis ended a strip with a big wedding they bit off more than they could chew and it took years to finish, but all the more reason for a do-over! Nothing could go wrong!
There were a few hints after the Malaya bit – showing that he seems to have reverted in many ways, though I don’t think we’ve seen him actually hitting on anyone since then.
Those who read the Malaya Slipshine may have some other clues.
Also Joe’s silhouette was the last one that could have been Ethan. so, Ethan put on a bus confirmed. That might be another thing Amber is upset about.
Ethan is still listed on the cast page.
Joe’s Dad stayed longer together with Amber’s Mom than I expected he would. I hope that is a good sign.
Everyone’s hair is fantastic now.
Stray observations:
The height difference between Stacy and Joe’s dad has increased: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-8/01-face-the-strange/check-2/
Looks like perhaps Amber stopped talking entirely? Too early to say of course, she might talk in later strips.
Stacy might have been wearing heels in that picture – it’s not super-clear in that picture, so that might not be the case, but those shoes do look like they’d increase height a little compared to what she’s wearing in today’s comic.
That or it’s a mistake and we shouldn’t be looking ooooOOOoooo
Amber’s been stuck with two people-she-doesn’t-know-well-enough-to-think-of-as-family for a month, it may have drained her reserves of sociability. She’s probably looking forward to barricading herself in her room and studying for the next couple of months.
And by ‘studying’, I mean ‘writing fanfics’.
And people who aren’t likely to respect her boundaries and need for copious amounts of time to herself.
Not in an intentionally bad way, but I can definitely see Richard making a big effort to draw her out and get her involved and doing things as a family.
I was legit worried Walky’s mom was gonna follow through on her threat regarding amber either through subtle/shitty means. I kinda figured joe’s dad was gonna step up and pay for ambers tuition at some point so I was worried that Linda would hop back onto the “get amber kicked out” train once she realized she wouldnt get what she wanted by doing nothing. She’s shitty enough as a person to try it.
I’m wondering if Richard and Stacy had a commitment ceremony or a civil marriage over the break and that’s why Joe feels able to call Amber is step-sister.
Why not a conventional wedding? Are they members of a church that won’t allow re-marriage after divorce?
Weddings are traditionally very expensive and time-consuming. While it’s not impossible that they had a wedding during the time skip, with only a couple months it would likely be pretty half-assed, and at that point might as well just do a civil thing and save a lot of money and headache.
Maybe they got married by an Elvis impersonator in Las Vegas.
Sure, traditionally, but you can do a fun, cheap wedding. Obviously Richard would have to foot the bill because Stacey’s flat broke but it can be done.
The Rosenthals are Jewish if they have any active religion.
Think this is one of the only times we’ve seen Joe with his dad were he’s not been actively annoyed by him, or concerned about his behavior.
So is Ethan not in the new cast image?
Doesn’t look like it, but I think we’ll see him in a storyline or two.
Joe has a point. XD Although… Given that they’re not actually blood siblings, WOULD it actually be illegal if Joe and Amber were to hook up?
I think that varies from state to state. I could check with one of my lawyer friends.
Indiana’s incest laws, checking Wikipedia, only appear to cover biological relations, not ‘by affinity’ ones like step-parent/sibling. So, in Indiana, it is legal. Whether or not step- and adoptive relationships count is generally a state by state basis, yeah. (And if the relationship involves consenting adults, they’re generally not going to advertise that fact so it would be illegal but not enforceably so. Which is a sentence I sure did just write.)
I’m pretty sure it’s more the fact that Joe and Amber would find the concept offputting than whether or not it’s legal. Even with them so recently step-siblings, it’s weird.
It’s hard to strictly ban such relationships. Especially in a case like this – if Joe and Amber had hooked up before their parents did, what would that do legally?
Would they have to break up to avoid a crime? What if they’d married first? Retroactively annulled?
I have never heard of step siblings being illegal to hook up before. There’s no reason for them to be.
There is an entire subgenre of kink on the pornotube sites about “stepsibling sex”. Not sure if it’s precisely illegal, but definitely not something you’d advertise at a family reunion.
Why? There’s no actual relation, especially in a situation like this, when the parents hooked up after the kids were already adults.
Most people will find it very creepy, or will say they will. Anything that whiffs of incest is considered creepy. This is observational data which does not go away if you disagree.
There are non-genetic reasons for objecting to incest in the real world. Power imabalance, especially between people of different age or generation. Excessive entanglement: if the romance with a family member goes sour, you’re still stuck with them as family, or living with them if you’re both underage and/or broke; also crossing emotional streams of sex and family (yes, this is part of what makes it hot too). The fact that you’ll have to hide it from most people or be considered creepy and maybe have the cops/public prosecutors sniffing around looking for something they can get you on.
As recently acquainted adults who probably have the marketable skills to survive on their own, Joe and Amber dating and blowing up is on the low end of disaster potential. It would be awkward but a lot better than a 17yo and a 13yo, say. Still not great.
Aaaand there’s the answer to my comment yesterday.
With Ross pushing up daisies can we start calling Dr. Rosenthal Joedad?
I think of them as Joebro, son of Dickbro.
Yes!
Headcanon: Amber has been dating Biff during the skip.
HOORAY! Congrats to the newlyweds! What a lovely couple♡♡♡. Joe seems to be happy for them♡. Amber seems to really make an effort to ignore them. I’m more with Joe.
Marcie and Malaya next to appear.
Joe dad will be a newlywed for the remainder of the comic. Let the two of them enjoy time dilation.
Amber is dealing with the death of a friend that she had a role in. How will AG react.
I expect this to continue to be a reset. Cast can ignore previous storylines. Becky is basically a new character and the old Becky is just a bad memory.
The tiniest of steps forward.
Lol Amber and I both have the same hairstyle: unkempt and uncut college student lmao
HOW was this strip not titled “hrngh”
See below. … /sigh/
Actually, if Dorothy’s been single and horny for months of timeskip, I could see her turning to Joe for a fling. She’d know he’s good at it and won’t make a fuss. Perfect for the Yalebound future president!
I couldn’t. She’s never shown any sign of interest in flings. You can argue it was just being horny that drove her to Walky, but she expressed it as romantic interest.
I can’t say I was too worried tbh, I was pretty confident that that silhouette was Amber. I was also pretty sure about Joe, which makes me very sad that we seem to have lost Ethan in one way or another. So many feels!
During the highly rigourous selection process it was considered. But between a poorly translated grunt, several other words and “Guarantees”, the russian judge felt there was only one guaranteed safe vote for the tie breaker. Hence, “hrngh” was a close second, but couldn’t overcome the politics of international translation. Given the root of the problem and frustration at the loss, “hrngh” is going to give up on Tokyo or Paris, and is instead going to study linguistics, languages and translation. “hrngh” strongly feels that no other onomatopoeic words ought to be wronged due to failures of translation.
Sadly, this won’t work. “hrngh” is destined to fail in this later endeavor. After years of lobbying, studies, appeals and public support and mountains of descriptivist evidence, “hrngh” continues to be shunned by the translatory dictionaries committee. Finally after years of effort, loss, personal tragedy and opposition, “hrngh” ultimately retires into obscurity, lost to the world and alone. In the end, in bed alone they pass away lips curled in irony as their death rattle escapes with their last exhalation, “hrngh.”
/sigh/. This was supposed to be a reply to ego’s query why “hrngh” wasn’t the title.
Now I want that to happen more than ever. Damn you, Rule 34, and internet porn!
dude. Also yay, Amber. Apparently I missed a few updates somehow ?_?
Aww. That is actually cute how a) Stacy says something really empowering to her daughter and b) Joe’s dad admits it’s a great thing 🙂