I am right there with you. Billie is making some HUGE mistakes right now and is to stubborn to see it. Right now I think Ruth is better off without her and it would be smart to just let Billie walk away and ruin her own life however she wanted and not drag Ruth down with her. Still doesn’t mean it isn’t going to hurt like hell.
I find it hard to do a complete 180 on how I disliked Ruth for her bullying, judgemental, and abusive nature to Billie. Its still there, it’s just in service of her best interests now.
They’re both terrible. It’s just that Ruth was always self-aware about it and was justifying it until she stopped, and Billie has never been. See how they both interacted with Carla as an exhibit.
Billie sounds like someone who is unlikely to live long enough to see age 25. Even worse, she’ll probably end up taking an innocent along with her. :'(
BTW. Alcoholism and denial aside, you know what I find grating in Billie right now? That she talks to her girlfriend *with her nose glued to the phone*. Seriously, I hate people who do that. Put that damn thing away, if somebody tries talking to you!
The main things that require refrigeration are eggs*, milk products, and meat. Meat is kinda’ germy and should be kept away from the other things, and (at least traditionally) may need last-minute processing.
* I hear in lots of countries, eggs don’t require refrigeration because they’re not washed. In the U.S. eggs are washed so we can’t see what condition the hens’ nesting boxes are in, but washing removes a protective coating so then the eggs will spoil if unrefrigerated.
there isn’t actually a difference in terms of safety or shelf life, it’s just a different presentation. theoretically a North American egg is going to take longer to cook, I guess, but not by a huge margin.
we also don’t really have the ultra pasteurized non-refrigerated milk that a lot of other countries do either
though I should add! refrigerated eggs need to stay refrigerated, non refrigerated should not be refrigerated! the temp change can cause the shell to crack slightly. not a problem if the outside has been sterilized, HUGE problem otherwise
It’s less an issue of nesting box conditions, practically a non-issue in 1970 when the USDA legally mandated washing and refrigeration of all eggs for sale, than it is to prevent cross contamination risks in the kitchen. Note that this enforcement started just at the end of the decade in which the US population passed the critical threshold from majority rural to majority urban, and thereby was loosing the background that would best lead to understanding safe handling of unwashed eggs.
Safe handling of unwashed eggs? Germans don’t learn any about that and buy unrefridgerated eggs. Nothing ever happens because of that.he only time you wash an egg in Germany is shortly before Easter if you intend to color it. Where’s the problem? We learn loads of stuff about getting eggs well done enough to kill off any remaining salmonella inside the egg, but bwu?
The platypus and echinda lay eggs, and also produce milk for their babies. As far as I know they’re the only mammals which do so. Not that we have platypus and echidna eggs or milk for sale in Australia, but there you go.
This is accurate. They have their own order because of this, the monotremates. Note that there are 4 different echidnae species, so there’s 5 egg-laying mammal species.
Eggs, milk, and cheese all fall into the category of “things vegetarians can eat but vegans can’t.” For some reason, there’s no word for this, so we just call it “dairy.”
This’s a little off-topic (Billie is indeed being some sort of percussion instrument in her phone-staring), but many people struggle with eye-contact. This may be something to do with the fact that neurotypical people tend to assume it’s obvious what “eye contact” means; it was literally decades before anyone told me it didn’t require staring fixedly into the other person’s eyes like a wolf challenging the pack alpha for leadership.
(Well, how was I to know? Humans bare their teeth at each other to indicate happiness and friendship, after all.)
Eye contact is excruciating for for many people, myself included. I wish people would not attach moral judgement to avoiding eye conact. That said, you won’t find me stsring at a screen while you’re talking to me.
Same here. I want her and Ruth to stay together, but not if it means Ruth has to do all the emotional growth while Billie just keeps in her cycle of neuroses and self-destructive behavior.
I’m not infatuated with it, but I have come to realize its an inevitablity. I mean I always have but I guess only recently have I been crushed under the weight of that idea…When I die I’ll be gone forever. I don’t get a second chance (as far as I know) and I can never experience the world outside of my own perspective. I’m now in my mid 20s and I feel like I haven’t done anything. I’ve got a degree in art but I can’t get a job, I work at a Wendy’s still live at home, am a virgin and my last girlfriend was in high school. I’m so terrified because I could theoretically die at any moment and I haven’t lived at all. I’ve never even left my country.
Don’t feel so down. If it makes you feel better I’m honestly not that good either. Rather I just stay in my comfort zone. I can’t really draw anatomy or like…men at all. We all have our strengths and weaknesses and my strength is a curvy somewhat thicc girl with one hip sticking out and maybe a hand on it because what the fuck do I do with hands?
Haha, no, see, I was trying to cheer you up by talking myself down!
… Okay, lemme stop being weird. Honestly, yeah those thoughts have come and gone for a long time, but less so lately. It’s maybe not a solution or anything, but I’m just starting to find that kind of thinking to be really unproductive, y’know? It feels like those kind of thoughts should motivate me to get my shit in order, but no matter what they just leave me feeling more paralyzed and helpless than before. Maybe I haven’t gotten anywhere noteworthy in life, but I definitely won’t if I add “agonizing existential dread” (or w/e you call this) to the list of things that I waste time on!
I mean I’m definitely still working on things, and I don’t mean to preach at you, but I didn’t want you to think I was trying to start a pissing contest or anything. I’m doin’ alright. Hope you are, too.
…Wow man um, I didn’t know all that stuff was saying heavy on your mind you know I can relate to some of that too. If you ever want to talk about I can lend you an ear.
Hell, one of the few differences between you and me is I’m 23 and and I don’t even have a bachelor’s yet.
It’s never too late to enact positive change in your life! Mid-twenties is awfully early to have everything figured out anyhow! Death comes for everyone but what you do beforehand is (at least partially) up to you! I believe in you all!!
Oh, I’ve been constantly obsessed with the concept of my innevitable death since I was like…13 or 14. Whenever I read Death Note and realized that “everyone will eventually die”. Like it’s pretty obvious in retrospect but as a kid reading that passage really made it hit home. I’ve been worried about dying for almost half of my life and it still permeates my thoughts.
On one hand I do sorta get why Billie wouldn’t wanna go to therapy. I certainly have SOME sorta problem but it’s not severe enough that I need any kind of medication and I really don’t want some therapist picking around in my brain. Especially not for 100s of my cash monies. I’d rather try to fix myself through deep introspection than rely on a professional. It’s kinda frustrating and embarrassing.
A good therapist actually guides you through said introspection process. That’s his job. Doing that alone is a whole lot harder. And I don’t know whether it’s possible to do that without any help. It wasn’t for me. I needed to give up on some convictions I previously considered so fundamentally right that I’d have never thought of even doubting them without help. Whereas help refers to therapists, self-help groups and books.
🙂 It is possible, but like you said: harder. Therapists are trained to ask the right kinds of questions and to hep you feel comfortable opening up. I like to think of us as the mental health version of physical therapists. We help you stretch muscles while minimizing the risk of further damage so that you can heal faster and with less lingering pain. And we can guide you through exercises that will help teach you how to not injure yourself more in the future and to work through the pain better if you do.
I probably need therapy, but when I tried going through the mental health system near me, I ended up with one who was . . . not great.
The first session, I was filling out some paperwork and asked her what the date was. She responded “What date do you think it is?” and just. Refused to answer. I started getting upset about it because she couldn’t answer a simple question and she asked me if I was upset with *myself* for not knowing. And — no? Not even a little? It’s not a static fact, it changes daily. It’s good to confirm for stuff like forms.
Another time, she tried to get me to take a mindfulness course she was giving but framed it . . . really weirdly. She started by outlining how any other approach you took to managing your anxiety would only make it worse. Like, the example given, you’re anxious going grocery shopping and your hands start to shake, you don’t want people to see so you grab the handle of your cart, and that causes them to shake *more*. And that does not make any sense to me? For one, I’m not actually anxious when in a crowd of strangers because I can accept that everyone else is busy with their own shit and unless I do something to seriously draw attention, I only exist as much to them as my shopping cart does. For another, wouldn’t grabbing the cart handle be grounding and help you calm down, rather than making the shaking worse?
You’re right, just gently holding the handle would likely reduce the tremors, especially if you find it grounding.
The therapist was probably thinking about what happens if you seize it in a death grip like a drowning person clutching a stick. That would make your muscles tighter and likely create a tremor amplifying feedback loop.
That doesn’t mean she was a good therapist. That date thing sounds really annoying. Way to not read a room, therapist. Way to do a power play on the person you’re supposed to be establishing rapport with. Ugh.
I get that mindfulness can be legit (Steven Universe presented it WAY better than she did) but it just felt like she was saying “You’re relaxing wrong”
Relaxation has its place and can be very useful. Problem is when you use it like a shield against your own experience. Sometimes shields fail and we’re back to running away from our own anxiety. Mindfulness lets you get used to yourself and stop seeing your own emotions as enemies. Connection and trust with a therapist is more important than what methodology they use.
Sorry, phrased it wrong — it’s just. Starting out by telling you that anything you did other than mindfulness in response to anxiety was only making it worse, and then telling me to come back in two weeks to start learning mindfulness . . . that just severely increased my anxiety.
Yeah, and it’s really easy to do a bad job of explaining mindfulness, too. I doubt that therapist would have taught it in a way that could help you – she’d probably just give you an aversion to it, at best :p
That’s a misconception. As a therapist, I can say that I don’t “pick at people’s brains.” Honestly, most of my job is just listening to people talk about the things that are bothering them. I listen without offering judgement. Most people are pretty surprised to find out how useful that actually is. Sometimes I help clarify some things and help people look at things in a more realistic way or assess their options, but no digging. Actually one of the techniques that I use actually discourages the person from going into too much detail about what they are working through. It’s more about helping them process it internally in a safe space. And most insurance will provide at least some coverage depending on your age. If you are under the age of 18, you can probably get as much time with a therapist as you want with no cost to you or your parents. If you are in college, you might be able to get a therapist that works for the school for free (the tuition covered it at the school I went to for post grad). Otherwise, if you don’t have good insurance and can’t afford to pay for it yourself, there are programs out there to connect you with services at free or reduced cost. Our ethics actually have a whole section that requires help for people who can’t pay if the need exists. And if you are worried about what other people may think, we have VERY strict confidentiality guidelines. I’m not even allowed to say hi to clients past or present if I see them outside of appointments unless they say hi first. I won’t say you need a therapist, but it might not be as bad as you think. Give it a try if you think it will help.
Eh, I feel like I’m comfortable with it conceptually but the process of seeking one out makes me uncomfortable. My mom really wants me to get a black therapist as he’d have a better handle on my situation but even that gives me some anxiety over the expectations impressed upon me. Just like my issues with love, I hate the idea of seeking it out. I just want it to happen in a way that doesn’t make me uncomfortable. And I know that makes me sort of a weak willed wishy-washy kinda guy but I’m more comfortable with that then getting out of my comfort zone.
A good therapist won’t put expectations on you or make you feel pressured. You can get a black therapist if it would make you feel more comfortable, but it’s not really necessary for a therapist to truly understand your situation on a personal level to help you. If you want, check out psychologytoday.com (there are links to other countries if you aren’t in the US). You can read the bios of therapists in your area and pick one that seems to be right for you. The bios include their specialties, experience, credentials, and pictures of he therapists. It would allow you to check some people out without needing to put yourself out there until you are ready. I wish you the best of luck and hope things work out for you, whatever you choose to do.
Making the appointment and going feels like taking yourself seriously. It’s frustrating when the person doesn’t work for you, which happens, and it’s tuff when just making the dang appointment is so much brain-work. But it does still feel like taking care of yourself.
Just as a question – how can I *avoid* therapists like you?
Honestly everything you’ve described matches well with my experience with therapists, and it’s a big part of why I despise them so much. They’re just so… bloody useless. And goddamn expensive, even with top tier insurance. (Honestly they’d be too expensive for what they offer even if they were free, since they only work during normal working hours which means having to take like two hours off work every session)
How do I find a therapist that will actually, you know, *help*? I don’t really need an expensive rubber duck. Is there some specific type I should ask after?
First of all, find a therapist whose working hours match your work schedule so you are less annoyed to begin with. From the list of those, try to find someone with experience with your problem or a method than makes sense to you. I personally achieve more with body centered therapy methods, but which method works best for you is something only you can know.
Use the first session with a therapist to interview them, and if they’re willing, don’t even pay for it. Be explicit that that’s what you’re doing, and talk to them about their philosophy and their approach. Bring up your concerns and let them respond.
I resisted therapy for a long, long time until a close friend of mine pushed me, and I don’t regret going at all. (It helps that my insurance covered it, so I can definitely see it not being worth the money for you.) It’s not that the therapist fixed me; it’s that I got a sounding board where there were things I could talk about without needing to worry about what they thought about me. I didn’t have to deal with as many social anxieties as I would chatting up a coworker or even long-time friends. My sessions ended when the therapist changed locations and I haven’t heard from her since; it was a clean break.
I probably need therapy and/or medication for… some combo flavor of depression/adhd plus some flavor of anxiety, especially around making phone calls to complete strangers.
It took me 4 times to get with a therapist who’s been right enough for me. I found him through my Primary Care Physician, who is tuned in to specialists in our Single-A league sized city. He said therapy can be very helpful if you find a therapist who you mesh with. I was lucky that he knows me well enough & the local therapists to hook me up with someone who I can work well with.
2. He’s totally about Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy. And so am I. Now. IF introspection doesn’t get you where you want to be — and it didn’t me — you might consider it. Turns out the introspection was keeping me in the place I wanted to escape from. A big part of CBT is learning NOT to dwell & rerun the same non-productive & painful loops AND how to not do it, to escape. EYES ON THE PRIZE.
3. Meds didnt cure, but the right combo of the right ones reduced the pain & turmoil so I could start to accomplish what I wanted.
4. It feels really, really, really good to neutralize the old wounds & stop pouring salt in them. Seriously.
5. YMMV, of course. I wanted to share my experience because I spent a lot of time where you are but I’m finally … well, I’m feeling MUCH better now.
6. Full disclosure: notwitstanding the wounds i suffered, I have also been very fortunate/privileged in my access to health care, (as well as lucky in my PCP). I dont take that for granted & I hope that sharing my experience doesn’t amount to describing my comfortable house to a homeless person. I can only hope that you can find access to the resources you need for whichever method/s you might want to try, until we can fix America’s health care nightmare.
Be kind to yourself & be well
Ruth is *far* from out of the woods right now, so for all of her looking like she’s got her stuff together compared to Billie, that’s how it looks at this moment. I want it to last, but it’s probably not going to.
Ruth is also an alcoholic, but (at the moment) is doing much better than Billie, so it’s not just that – it’s also that Billie is a narcissist. Actually working on her flaws would be admitting to herself that she has any, and that’s something she just can’t do. At least not for extended periods of time.
I’m not sure alcoholic is the right word for slowly and willfully killing yourself and a need to kill your emotions. I was never clear how addiction figured into it for her, unless you’d consider self harm her addiction.
Billie has many problems. She attempted to make herself feel better with alcohol. Alcohol is now one of Billie’s problems. She doesn’t want to admit to any of them because once she opens those doors it’s not going to stop at drinking, her entire life is one big pile of damage and coping mechanisms drowned in booze.
In a lot of addiction cases, the root problem is that there is some underlying emotional need or challenge, and the addictive substance or behavior is substituted for an actual solution.
Too nervous to socialize with people? Have a few drinks to take the edge off first! Having trouble coping with loss or trauma? Drink your troubles away! Stressed the hell out by your high pressure job? Nothing a martini lunch can’t fix! The addiction can interfere with your ability to function, but it is also part of what helped you (sort of) function in the first place, so giving it up seems impossible.
So, yes, drinking to kill your emotions is a very frequent (if not universal) aspect of alcoholism.
Billie is a textbook case of blantant alcoholism. Right now, getting a drink is more important than anything else in her life. She usually drinks in public. Part of her can realize this and knows she should stop, but she cannot say she has stopped drinking and will keep this up because she doesn’t believe it.
How she ended up with the actual addiction is kind of moot at this point, because any root causes are as much drowned in the craving as everything else is.
Ruth is a different kind of textbook case, the hidden drinker. With Ruth, treating he depression has a good chance to keep her out of the bottle because it is clearly the root cause.
Billie’s drowned in the bottle for so long that any possible root causes drowned in it with the rest of her life. I’d say you need to dry her out first to be able to find and treat anything else. We know enough about her life to know that alcoholism wasn’t her first problem, but it’s the most crippling and dangerous right now.
i don’t have a professional opinion but two of the five closest people to me in my life were unmistakably alcoholic and zach’s definition applied to neither of them.
I’ve said what I’m going to say about this topic, and I’m not going to say any more unless I have something new to say.
Final recap: Billie has a felt need for alcohol that overrides pretty much anything else in her life, including relationships. That’s extremely unhealthy and it’s not necessarily permanent, but for at least the next couple of in-comic months, anyone who chooses to be around her is going to have to deal with that.
One hesitates to tempt DYW, but my sense is that if her wrapping her car around a tree didn’t cause Billie to re-evaluate her relationship with alcohol, something much worse would have to occur for that to happen.
If I recall correctly, DYW has already stated that no one will die in this series (in part just because, given the stretched out time scales, characters would be in mourning for IRL *YEARS* and that would just be torturous to *write*.)
Honestly, there are very few situations where dying for someone works for me even as a trope and the ones that it does work for me aren’t ones that are extraordinarily likely IRL (like, for example, jumping in front of a bullet to keep someone else from being murdered).
Because mentally ill people can all too easily focus on how they are willing to die for others. This can also intersect with religion (as we saw with Joyce’s mum saying she would die for her). It is easy to die for someone. It is harder to live for them. It is harder to accept that living can mean changing and taking steps to do better.
I mean, I’m mainly pissed because Billie’s denial is harming Ruth. Would I like to see her get better, of course. But I’m mainly concerned for the people around her
Billie and Ruth are fascinating as an anti-ship. A relationship that really did make them both worse and the comic realized this–without making either the bad guy.
Except for the fact that in many ways, Billie’s been at her best (and most adorable) when taking care of Ruth. I think that’s what makes it hard to entirely condemn the ship — in some ways, it seems to be good for her. I mean, if they ended up together in the long run, Billie would definitely be the housewife, and she’d be really good and really happy at it. I’m honestly not sure that the relationship made her worse — the problem is that because in many ways it made things better, it made it a lot easier for her to ignore her genuine problems.
Yeah, that’s kind of my take on it too.
The relationship hasn’t been bad. For either of them.
Their problems are real and serious, but up to now they’ve been better off together than alone.
Seriously Billie, what the hell? You were just telling Lucy that you were going to have to stop, so why drop that so completely.
You know what? From this moment forward I am going to use the word “cloaca” instead of “asshole” when describing appropriate personages. And I am going to relish doing so.
Billie is immensely frustrating. Good. Means he’s writing addiction correctly.
I want Billie to get her shit together. She’s already had one car wreck, and she’s a drama hurricane, as Alice dubbed her, and every time she gets tanatalizingly close to a breakthrough, it gets pulled back away, which… is honestly very true to life.
This is more a problem of a thing they have in common – alcohol – is causing problems and is a bad coping mechanism and only one of them is willing to commit to the idea that it is bad.
Votes
1st: Ruth – I am loving how she’s been taking charge of her therapy and understanding that while she may lose stuff that was once important, that’s pales in comparison to her life. When Billie is finally gone I hope she stays on the up and up.
2nd Sal – Still with the big ups for standing up to Amber and the big ups for trying to mend fences I think she would’ve been justified in letting be broken (Marcie/Amber). I still personally think Marcie is trash for just dangling friendship like it’s thing to be earned and threatened to be lost as opposed to trying to work together to strengthen but I’m happy for where Sal is now
3rd: Lucy- Dammit I just want her to be happy. She’s crushing on Walky hard but recognizes his life isn’t ready for that rn. She’s perceptive as all get out too and I hope we keep seeing more of her.
Honorable Mention
Walky – I think he’s done a great bit of growing up and even though he’s still a goof, he’s been slowly recognizing and adjusting to the world around him and I don’t think we give him enough credit in the comments.
“I still personally think Marcie is trash for just dangling friendship like it’s thing to be earned and threatened to be lost as opposed to trying to work together to strengthen but I’m happy for where Sal is now”
I get why you feel this way, but personally I think it was less ‘you need to earn friendship or lose it by going through these goal posts’ and more ‘You have a problem with doing things that screw me over and since you’ve done this before, I’m not willing to forgive you until I’m actually sure you’re working on that’.
As to be fair though, Throughout their friendship, Marcie has been part of the collateral damage for Sal’s major life mistakes(which only now Sal, is taking steps to correct). I don’t blame her at all wanting to make terms on their friendship.
1) Dina. This is pure narcissism on my part, as Dina is pretty much a rule 63 me, only more socially competent.
2) Becky. This might be a trope, but in Becky’s case it’s a good trope: she’s plucky, and I admire the heck out of that. (I do wish she would cut it out with the cutesy nicknames.)
It seems like shes worried Ruth is going to not go do anything fun with her anymore, like they have to stay in her room where it’s safe and there’s no alcohol. It also seems like Billie isn’t considering that not everything requires alcohol to be fun. She really is kinda sucking right now.
Billie doesn’t think she can stop drinking. Part of her has always assumed she is not good enough for her gilrfriend, and now she knows it to be true. She can’t be the one thing Ruth needs her to be
(I don’t think Billie is right any more than I thought that Ruth was right that she had no option left except dying, but that’s what I think she thinks)
Walky because I really like his character arc as of late
Amber cuz she’s finally getting through some of her bullshit and her and Walky are cute.
Malaya because I absolutely LOVE trash.
Amber, Joyce, & Walky. My 3rd choice would usually be Billie but I’m having a hard time feeling her right now, I mean as of now she’s stroken a count of 3 times in one day.
Though I wonder now if I should have picked Jacob instead of Walky.
They’d work in a visceral animalistic kinda way. And outside of the mindblowing wall slaming back clawing sex they’d always be at odds and that could be fun.
I never liked the way Ruth and Billie got started but it’s fascinating that all of their problems at the beginning aren’t what’s caused their breakup. Instead, it’s the fact they’ve been resolved which is breaking them up.
Billie hates that Ruth is no longer a wreck because it makes her look bad by comparison.
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. When they started, Billie saw Ruth (in part) as a problem she could fix. Now Billie is the problem that needs fixing, and that’s not something she can even acknowledge to herself.
I love how the third and fourth panels are set up. Thoroughly Done with Billie for the foreseeable future, though, so I guess it’s a good thing it’s the end of the story line (dangit!)
Ruth has me feeling so proud of her for keeping her vision of recovery clear and standing up for her needs, but it’s sad to watch her deal with Billie, someone she’d been so vulnerable with, just….not seeming to care about what Ruth needs. To be fair, Billie doesn’t seem to really care about what Billie needs either. It feels like this relationship is just getting even less healthy as time goes on.
First pick is Joyce because it has always been and will always be Joyce. The whole comic is about her overcoming her bigoted upbringing, despite all the fear and hard work, by just being like… an inherently good person and I love that. (Maybe this is the year she can start working on personal boundaries.)
Billie is a piece of shit. But she’s still my #ProblematicFave. Second pick.
And then a surprise newcomer, Sal. I always kinda liked her but my opinion of her has just shot up recently with everything that happened. Not coincidentally, my opinion of Amber has gone down a fair bit.
Dear Ruth: okay, you’re depressive, so probably self-sabotaging, but if you’re not trying to drive Billie away, possibly mention why you like her at some point. Admittedly, your last-panel expression makes me suspect you just thought this.
(Yes, I know, unpopular opinion, but I still think that if they can get over their ginormous issues, these two really work together.)
I think it’s totally healthy to be with someone who has no interest in supporting you trying to overcome your addiction. Ruth is definitely sabotaging herself by calling out toxic behavior from her girlfriend
Constantly inviting your recovering alcoholic girlfriend to place that serve alcohol with the intent to drink said alcohol is not supportive and kinda fucked up!
I guess I haven’t been paying attention cause it’s been a while (before this new brief story arc started up) since Billie asked Ruth to come drink with her.
I probably haven’t been paying attention, I guess.
Hey, somebody I agree with. Took a while. Not that the unending disdain for Billie isn’t deserved, but given the situation, it’s like Ruth doesn’t want the relationship to work. Sure, Billie is being stubborn and refusing to see the issue for what it is versus just waving it off like nothing, and maybe it’s just Ruth’s nature and as she is, but I’m not seeing any sign that Ruth is trying to help mend beyond getting her to stop.
I feel that what makes it harder to get through to Billie is that she can pretty much afford to brush off complicated issues with her parents’ money to not worry about it realistically or have full impact on her.
My top 3 would have to day
1) Danny – he’s got problems with family that I really relate to and also I just love him.
2) Sal – she’s awesome and I find her journey of slowly learning and understanding the people around wonderful.
3) Amber – she is the most explicit mental health storyline and as someone with numerous mental health problems I am very protective of her fate.
But the sun still shines in the summertime
I’ll be yours if you’ll be mine
I tried to change, but I changed my mind
Think I’ll have another glass of Mexican wine
Sal – I’m sure this is brand new information after last arc, but Sal’s my favourite character and has been since shortly after I started reading Dumbing of Age a few years ago. I know this is shocking, I’ve been very subtle about it. 😛
Marcie – I think she’s adorable and I respect that she’s willing to stick to her boundaries – that’s hard when it’s your best friend, even if you’ve been seriously burned by them. Plus, y’know, awesome skater chick. What’s not to like?
Carla – I mean. C’mon. It’s Carla. She’s an asshole but for the most part she’s a funny one and she has her moments.
As for who I voted for, this was tough, as I really like the cast for the most part.
1. Danny. He’s really come into his own, I feel like. I think he’s still probably got plenty of problems he needs to sort out, but of the cast, he feels like he’s one of the ones who is showing some of the most growth. The rest could only hope to “danny it up” now, given how he’s flourishing.
2. Lucy. I’ve really enjoyed getting to know her better after hardly being around a lot. I loved the gag of Joyce thinking that Lucy’s chipper attitude was lampooning her at first. With a cast like this, we could use a ray of sunshine. She has me intrigued to learn more about her.
3. Joe. This is a weird choice, I know, but there is a lot to unpack with this guy. It makes me fascinated to know where he’s going to end up, especially since with respect to Joyce. He’s currently looking like he’s defeated and lost all faith in himself, and is just in full-on trash mode, which… I want to know what the heck’s going to happen there.
Honestly, it was tough to pick. Some of my all-time favorites haven’t really been around very much, or have been around a lot to where I am prepared for a break from them. Like, I have grown to like Sal a ton, but I feel like we have had quite a lot of her lately, so I am ready to see what some of the others have been up to, for example.
1) Walky. I mean he’s not a great person, he’s not a good person, he gets a C+ at best for effort in general, he’s an irresponsible privileged goofball because he’s afraid to take things seriously… and he’s ME, dammit.
2) Sal. I mean, Sal’s awesome. She’s mature, she’s responsible, she’s sufficiently introspective to recognize her problems and overcome them, she has fight and drive…. oh, and cancer sticks. Eh, no one’s perfect.
3) Dina. Because in a cast full of emotional trainwrecks, SOMEONE needs to be calm, collected, and logical.
I have to go with Dina as my #1 pick. She’s one of the only characters I can think of without immediately remembering something crummy or obnoxious she’s done. Also I can relate to a lot of her mannerisms, and her hat is green.
Pride, denial and addiction are bosom buddies. Billie is in the wrong here. But the ways in which her perspective is wrong mirror the ways anyone who finds themselves in court on a drug or mental health related charge is wrong. I can’t hate Billie. She’s a sheltered kid who’s finally having to deal with bad habits she’s never had to face down. I’d judge a middle-aged person a lot differently from someone Billie’s age.
Classic doubling down. If Billie changed, just who would she be? She is the sum of her mistakes and is therefore proud of them. Mistakes were made, but not by me – https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132 . Your irregular librarian’s recommendation.
Oh, Ruth. I’m sorry that this happened to you but something tells me that it was inevitable because, in the end, the relationship was all about what Billie wanted. The moment when she needed to give ground, even if for your sake, she wasn’t willing or able to do so.
That is one of Willis’s bugbears, isn’t it and I can’t blame him. If you’re not willing to live for someone, only do easy stuff like die for them, then you have to question your commitment.
On a slightly humorous note, something tells me that Ruth doesn’t quite understand why Billie turned the light out in the room.
To me the issue was that what Billie was willing to do for Ruth was easy because she didn’t have to do anything, it took zero effort on Billies part (either lay there and do nothing or keep drinking) but now she has to actually do something and it’s too much for her
Billie was perfectly willing to do things that took effort so long as it didn’t involve changing herself in any shape or form: she made sure Ruth took her medication, that she did a meeting she was supposed to, that she got dressed and actually did things. She was willing to problem-solve and help as long as she wasn’t the part to be solved.
1. Sarah, because of low tolerance for drama and people’s stupid bullshit, yet is loving and compassionate when the situation calls for it.
2. Mike, for his contempt for the lies people tell others and especially the lies they tell themselves(even himself).
3. Ethan, because more than anyone else he seems to be making the most effort on improving and coming to terms with himself.
4. Danny, because every story needs an earnest boring Everyman.
5. Leslie, because someone needs to be an adult where there are none and all the other adults fail them.
6. Ruth, because now her story towards growth and self-help is growing on me.
7. Joyce, is the heart of everything and she has the best outfits
I don’t like Mary, but not for the reasons most dislike her. I just don’t like characters who exist solely for the purpose of readers hating them to the point they’re nothing but a joke-delivery device. I’d like to have a chance to have some empathy for Mary(which is not necessarily the same as liking them).
I was going to write a small book but what it breaks down to is this. I feel Billie does love Ruth. I believe she was genuine about wanting to stop drinking. That’s totally different from ACTUALLY stopping drinking, she’s an alcoholic after all. But when she mentioned it to Ruth, rather than being supportive she was attacked. I’m not surprised at all that Billie simply threw the whole idea in the too hard basket and walked out.
Except that she couldn’t even say to Ruth, when asked, “I’m stopping drinking.” Keep in mind she said she would stop drinking before, and DIDN’T. It is no surprise that, without Billie being able to commit to actually SAYING it, that Ruth isn’t going to believe it. Why would she be supportive when Billie hasn’t shown to be able to practice what she preaches in the past? And now she can’t even “preach”. She deserves NO benefit of the doubt here.
Billie brought this all on herself and I feel 0 sympathy for her. Ruth is better off without Billie, regardless of how much they might love each other. You can love someone and still be the worst person for them, and Billie is currently the worst person for Ruth (aside from her grandfather, obviously).
I think that panel 2 pretty much sums it up. She wants to be in a drunken lesbian suicide pact; she hasn’t got her mind or heart beyond that point and I think it will take a big shock to do so.
All I know is if, when I was considering therapy, the people who said they loved me had been totally negative and attacked me, accused me of having no intention of changing and brought up past instances where I’d tried to change and failed, I’d probably still be the same messed up ball of anxiety, self loathing and perversity I was then.
I don’t mean to dis Ruth for being skeptical, it’s hardly fair on her to dis her for reacting the way she did considering her personal situation. But it does seem like the best way to rub Billie up the wrong way is to react exactly the way Ruth did.
Also, if you understand the nature of alcoholism and you still have zero sympathy for Billie then I find that incredibly sad.
This is different though, since Ruth is the one who wants Billie in therapy. To seek help and actually start to live. Billie is not attacked for thinking about therapy but for refusing to even consider it.
I do know a lot about alcoholism. Still, every alcoholic decides at each day, each drink that drinking is more important than basically everything else. No, no sympathy at all. Would you feel sympathy for someone who has a broken leg, doesn’t want to get it fixed at the doctor but always complains about the pain in his leg and all the things he cannot do because of it?
Billie didn’t fail to change, she never tried in the first place. She refuses to do anything TO change and instead pretends everything is fine when though everyone around her is telling her the opposite.
She’ll get my sympathy if and when she stops shoving her head in the sand and admits she had a problem and *actually tries to change* instead of making non-promises. As it is she’s just hurting herself AND others, and that’s all on her and it find her of any sympathy and might otherwise get.
I feel like both Ruth and Billie think their respective relationships to alcoholism are a lot more… symmetrical than they are? Ruth hated herself for drinking because of her history, drinking wasn’t fun for her, it was almost definitely not helping what seems to be a pretty obvious case of clinical depression… she didn’t really want to be doing this, she just didn’t really feel like she had any other way to cope. Billie is also using drinking to cope with being unhappy, but it does seem to be genuinely fun for her, and the consequences of her drinking problem are mostly external – she does something bad and gets in trouble, and people judge her and leave (this is not to say that they are wrong to do so, just that this hurt her and she’s clearly still afraid of it happening again now). And now Ruth doesn’t understand why Billie wants them both to stay miserable when there’s a potential way out of this right there, and Billie doesn’t understand why Ruth is giving up having fun to be another judgmental person who thinks she’s too good for her.
Billie is definitely being the worse person here, and I’m not at all saying she should keep drinking if it makes her happy to do so. Also, I do think that at this point, they’d probably be better broken up (Billie seems like she’s currently in a place where Drinking = Fun and Not Drinking = No Fun, and I think she needs to be around people who want to have fun but don’t drink in order to reduce that association – meanwhile, Ruth needs to be around people who understand that she’s trying to get away from things that didn’t make her happy.) It’s just kinda sad that their difficulty discussing their problems is almost definitely coming from them seeing each other as more similar than they are, and if they really understood their differences and felt safe communicating them, things would probably be going a little better.
Quite true but that would require Billie to use words instead of pretending her life is perfect and amazing and involves feelings that aren’t joy and confidence while Ruth is trying to communicate and getting walled denial and minimising nonsense in return for every attempt.
First, The Leafs are currently sitting third (eight teams make the playoffs from the East). They’re a good bet to make the playoffs but I have no idea if they’re in form to go far.
I wonder if this will become a “Fever Pitch” (where the ending of that movie had to be rewritten because the Boston Red Sox won their first championship in 86 years, during filming).
From his Twitter posts, I understand that he continued to hear them up until comparatively recently when he finally blocked all communications between himself and his mother.
I was tempted to find out what happens if you vote for four. Maybe next year.
My biggest surprise on seeing the results: not only did some people vote for Faz, but as I type this, he has more votes than Rachel or Roz. What is up with that.
It’s almost like Ruth is a year older and a year smarter than Billie.
And she has to keep it together for Howard’s sake. For all the Walky and Sal were like siblings, Billie doesn’t care much for them. Not at all like Ruth cares for Howard.
I understood where Billie was coming from, even if I thought she was flaming wrong, until this strip. My sympathy is gone, even if I still understand the reaction, because I don’t even get where she think’s she’s doing “incredible” as in “extraordinary” with any of her other day to day struggles and comments. She can’t find the awesome college parties to, which is what she thought college was about. She lost cheerleading and friends. She isn’t popular, except in one dorm, where the cost is not having space to do her own thing and she has a roommate that grates on her to the point of escaping to her girlfriends’ room. She actually did try to quit drinking – she was hung over when she ran into Alice after the guilty confrontation with Ruth from when she previously lied about it. She doesn’t like her relationship with her parents and views Walky as her family even if she doesn’t treat him great. Heck, her premise on being with Ruth was about being toxic together and so they won’t do more external damage. The new bartender (Jason) won’t give her alcohol at the pizza place. Where has anything been what she’d consider great? Her highlights are having a real date, one party where she had to figure out how Joyce had been drugged, being the more passing white daughter to get her favorite cookies, and her girlfriend busting up a fake Joyce party so they could hold hands in the dark… that is… incredible. As in extraordinarily depressing. She is also incredible- as in impossible to believe.
Which after all that and her love of word play… is this some self awareness and further wordplay that it would be impossible to believe her if she said those words? Is it impossible to believe in herself? Can she not believe that this is her life? Just… boooo. Bad depression brain monkeys! Don’t make people think change is impossible, even if hard and maybe improbable.
Ruth is going to have to take a long, hard look at whether or not it is worth having Billie, in her life. Ruth might indeed truly lover her, but right now, Billie is also super toxic, and that is something a person, trying to get themselves out of a hold of depression, and substance abuse, needs.
Billie has managed to be good for Ruth at times but she has to be wiling to accept that this is no longer a relationship solely on her terms. She’s going to need to accept that she needs to start thinking more about what Ruth needs to heal and what she can do to help that process, no matter how unwelcome that would be in her life. If Billie honestly isn’t willing to change herself for Ruth then, no, there’s probably no future there.
My votes: Sal (because she’s awesome), Carla (because she’s awesomely crazy) and Robin (she’s a side character, but I kind of feel intrigued by misadventures of this weirdo politicians).
Other characters I considered voting for: Joyce and Dina.
I know you don’t know me or know of the fact that it’s the middle of the night right now where I am.. But thank you for this AMAZINGirl comic, Sir DM Williams. Thank you so much.
I’m in good hands, maybe even the best hands there ever were(wolf?).. And I’m legally free to go because it’s my choice and no one else’s. I’m kind of somewhat like Billie, though. Just not enough, because people are people (so why should it (bumble)bee.. 🎶
Tldr: thanks!
And give my regards to Kerberos, the Emperor of THE Interwebs, and someone who knows what the heck 1 muzak is. Please with 2 cherries on top? 🍒
And for those saying Billie was toxic, remember Ruth abused power and was kinda really shitty to get IN this relationship to begin with. Yeah Ruth is trying to improve. but. I still see a LOT of projection of Ruth needs on to Billie atm, which. Is NOT helping Ruth to help Billie confront their OWN shit so they BOTH can improve. It’s not JUST on Billie, here. Ruth knows Billie, and when she get’s dismissive like that. This way of doing things does NOT really work in either of their favours.
It REALLY seems like Ruth is not willing to admit how bad she is, and is trying to drop shit via HINTS by getting BILLIE to change her behaviour.
That isn’t going to work. She’ll get more dismissive, and more reliant on her other crutches (popularity and alcohol), which is the exact OPPOSITE of what Ruth wants. That’s going to make BOTH of them worse.
I am REALLY scared that, if Ruth needs to go back to the hospital, she may be in worse shape.
If you know this handle you know that I love this disaster ship, because I’ve been broken like both of them and the drama is still in(toxic)ating.
This probably isn’t what is happening, but I also relate to this in another way: I’ve been in relationships a large chunk of me didn’t want, with people who’s habits or views didn’t feel aligned with who I was, and while the part of me invested in the relationship was SUPER invested. I wouldn’t intentionally sabotage things, but I would do what both billie and ruth are doing here – pushing a source of conflict, acting cold to the other person’s feelings, demanding conformity to my way of doing things and dropping a person cold if they didn’t.
The people I love and respect I am good to and generally push past my own shit-tastic way of being to try and help. The people I clash with are like train wrecks where no one makes it out intact. This storyline has felt quite familiar for that reason – it is not about who is right or not, these guys are already exploding and they know it, when you’re bound together by drama, the absence of it means the absence of your main bond.
Loading ...
“IT’S NOT LITTLE”
…
“your sweet booty just makes it look that way”
March comes in like a bongo
Does it leave like a conga?
I choose to believe there are a lot of maracas in between.
I originally typoed bonobo somehow but that felt like a non-sequitur
My sweet bonoboo!
*cue passive aggressive porn music*
And here I had my Tom Jones collection at the ready. :/
I was thinking classic trek full orchestral fight music.
Do you think when you fill out the form to be assigned a room, “thicc” is an option you can check?
“Ruth, you’re not any fun. You try to change my behavior. You yell at me. You judge me. What right do you have taking this attitude?”
“You’re going to die! You want me to die!”
“Yeah, yeah. Details details.”
I don’t like Billie right now. I don’t think I’m going to like Billie for a very long time.
I am right there with you. Billie is making some HUGE mistakes right now and is to stubborn to see it. Right now I think Ruth is better off without her and it would be smart to just let Billie walk away and ruin her own life however she wanted and not drag Ruth down with her. Still doesn’t mean it isn’t going to hurt like hell.
I don’t think we’re supposed to. She’s not doing anything healthy for her or her partner.
I find it hard to do a complete 180 on how I disliked Ruth for her bullying, judgemental, and abusive nature to Billie. Its still there, it’s just in service of her best interests now.
They’re both terrible. It’s just that Ruth was always self-aware about it and was justifying it until she stopped, and Billie has never been. See how they both interacted with Carla as an exhibit.
Except Ruth is actually trying to improve while Billie refuses to believe she has a problem in the first place
I respect Ruth for the attempt to change. I like her better than both Amber and Billy for that. Still not one of my favorites.
I don’t think Billie likes Billie, either. She just doesn’t know how to be different without changing, which is a terrifying prospect.
I never liked Billie. She’s the absolute worst
Oof ouch owie
Yeah, I just had almost this exact argument with my partner last night. Thanks lot Willis
There’s only one Rachel in the favorite character poll.
Which one is Rachel again?
The Rachel-y one.
The one who’s not a 3 in Joe’s Do List. Alternately, the one who Joe suggested to her face might be an 11.
I will always be grateful to Cerberus for introducing me to the term “unsolicited boner update.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Green
Just give Other Rachel Billie’s slot. It’s not like she’s gonna be needing it this time around.
More importantly, why is there even *one* Mary?
As of this moment there are three votes for Mary. Who are you people and who hurt you like this?
Maybe they like her as a villain?
There is only one Rachel. You must be thinking of Other Rachel.
UGH BILLIE COME ON
Billie is hitting the Denial stage of recovery really hard. Hope she comes through it okay
Billie sounds like someone who is unlikely to live long enough to see age 25. Even worse, she’ll probably end up taking an innocent along with her. :'(
So whats-her-name from high school is right?
Alice.
What’s her name was almost the person Billie took with her.
Wasn’t that her plan until recently?
Oh, Ruth. Just drop her. She’s way too immature.
BTW. Alcoholism and denial aside, you know what I find grating in Billie right now? That she talks to her girlfriend *with her nose glued to the phone*. Seriously, I hate people who do that. Put that damn thing away, if somebody tries talking to you!
Yeah, there are other fish in the sea. And some of them aren’t even percussion instruments. Find one that’s strings or woodwinds or something.
Are there any people in the dairy section, or is that just Danny?
I’ve always wondered: why are eggs in the dairy section? Dairy comes from mammals; eggs, not so much.
The main things that require refrigeration are eggs*, milk products, and meat. Meat is kinda’ germy and should be kept away from the other things, and (at least traditionally) may need last-minute processing.
* I hear in lots of countries, eggs don’t require refrigeration because they’re not washed. In the U.S. eggs are washed so we can’t see what condition the hens’ nesting boxes are in, but washing removes a protective coating so then the eggs will spoil if unrefrigerated.
Wait, do Americans have their eggs refrigerated at the supermarket? In New Zealand we just keep them by the bread.
Canadian here, and yeah, us too!
there isn’t actually a difference in terms of safety or shelf life, it’s just a different presentation. theoretically a North American egg is going to take longer to cook, I guess, but not by a huge margin.
we also don’t really have the ultra pasteurized non-refrigerated milk that a lot of other countries do either
though I should add! refrigerated eggs need to stay refrigerated, non refrigerated should not be refrigerated! the temp change can cause the shell to crack slightly. not a problem if the outside has been sterilized, HUGE problem otherwise
You keep dirty eggs by the bread?
Or salting for long term storage though that is usually for fish eggs.
Lizard and amphibian eggs I am not as familiar with.
It’s less an issue of nesting box conditions, practically a non-issue in 1970 when the USDA legally mandated washing and refrigeration of all eggs for sale, than it is to prevent cross contamination risks in the kitchen. Note that this enforcement started just at the end of the decade in which the US population passed the critical threshold from majority rural to majority urban, and thereby was loosing the background that would best lead to understanding safe handling of unwashed eggs.
Safe handling of unwashed eggs? Germans don’t learn any about that and buy unrefridgerated eggs. Nothing ever happens because of that.he only time you wash an egg in Germany is shortly before Easter if you intend to color it. Where’s the problem? We learn loads of stuff about getting eggs well done enough to kill off any remaining salmonella inside the egg, but bwu?
The platypus and echinda lay eggs, and also produce milk for their babies. As far as I know they’re the only mammals which do so. Not that we have platypus and echidna eggs or milk for sale in Australia, but there you go.
This is accurate. They have their own order because of this, the monotremates. Note that there are 4 different echidnae species, so there’s 5 egg-laying mammal species.
Appropriate avatar is appropriate.
Eggs, milk, and cheese all fall into the category of “things vegetarians can eat but vegans can’t.” For some reason, there’s no word for this, so we just call it “dairy.”
Not woodwinds. Too easy to end up with someone who’s too damn kavalier. Dealing with someone like that can be such a choor.
Keep away from any keyboards too – there’e none more cavalier than a klavier.
Nothing worse than an ill-tempered klavier!
And the brass instruments are likely to be Conn men.
Nose glued to the phone INSTEAD OF MAKING EYE CONTACT.
Which brings us, full circle, back to denial.
This’s a little off-topic (Billie is indeed being some sort of percussion instrument in her phone-staring), but many people struggle with eye-contact. This may be something to do with the fact that neurotypical people tend to assume it’s obvious what “eye contact” means; it was literally decades before anyone told me it didn’t require staring fixedly into the other person’s eyes like a wolf challenging the pack alpha for leadership.
(Well, how was I to know? Humans bare their teeth at each other to indicate happiness and friendship, after all.)
Eye contact is excruciating for for many people, myself included. I wish people would not attach moral judgement to avoiding eye conact. That said, you won’t find me stsring at a screen while you’re talking to me.
What Ruth really needs is a regular friend she can just hang out with, without alcoholism or relationship drama or suicide pacts.
Just, like, “Hey do you wanna get ice cream and hang out?”
I’m so proud of Ruth in ways that I can’t articulate. Just… so happy.
Wish I could say the same for Billie.
Same here. I want her and Ruth to stay together, but not if it means Ruth has to do all the emotional growth while Billie just keeps in her cycle of neuroses and self-destructive behavior.
why is every ship so tense come on you two just kiss don’t be dinguses
Dying is easy Living is hard… hat aside I still don’t get why everybody is infatuated with death lately.
I’m not infatuated with it, but I have come to realize its an inevitablity. I mean I always have but I guess only recently have I been crushed under the weight of that idea…When I die I’ll be gone forever. I don’t get a second chance (as far as I know) and I can never experience the world outside of my own perspective. I’m now in my mid 20s and I feel like I haven’t done anything. I’ve got a degree in art but I can’t get a job, I work at a Wendy’s still live at home, am a virgin and my last girlfriend was in high school. I’m so terrified because I could theoretically die at any moment and I haven’t lived at all. I’ve never even left my country.
Darn it, Yoto, that’s me to a T, except that I know for a fact you can draw better!
And prolly a lotta other details but I don’t wanna nitpick
Don’t feel so down. If it makes you feel better I’m honestly not that good either. Rather I just stay in my comfort zone. I can’t really draw anatomy or like…men at all. We all have our strengths and weaknesses and my strength is a curvy somewhat thicc girl with one hip sticking out and maybe a hand on it because what the fuck do I do with hands?
Haha, no, see, I was trying to cheer you up by talking myself down!
… Okay, lemme stop being weird. Honestly, yeah those thoughts have come and gone for a long time, but less so lately. It’s maybe not a solution or anything, but I’m just starting to find that kind of thinking to be really unproductive, y’know? It feels like those kind of thoughts should motivate me to get my shit in order, but no matter what they just leave me feeling more paralyzed and helpless than before. Maybe I haven’t gotten anywhere noteworthy in life, but I definitely won’t if I add “agonizing existential dread” (or w/e you call this) to the list of things that I waste time on!
I mean I’m definitely still working on things, and I don’t mean to preach at you, but I didn’t want you to think I was trying to start a pissing contest or anything. I’m doin’ alright. Hope you are, too.
…Wow man um, I didn’t know all that stuff was saying heavy on your mind you know I can relate to some of that too. If you ever want to talk about I can lend you an ear.
Hell, one of the few differences between you and me is I’m 23 and and I don’t even have a bachelor’s yet.
It’s never too late to enact positive change in your life! Mid-twenties is awfully early to have everything figured out anyhow! Death comes for everyone but what you do beforehand is (at least partially) up to you! I believe in you all!!
Oh, I’ve been constantly obsessed with the concept of my innevitable death since I was like…13 or 14. Whenever I read Death Note and realized that “everyone will eventually die”. Like it’s pretty obvious in retrospect but as a kid reading that passage really made it hit home. I’ve been worried about dying for almost half of my life and it still permeates my thoughts.
You know about Caitlin Doughty, right?
If not, she has books and she has all the social medias, but she’s best known for her Ask a Mortician videos.
Don’t think of it as being obsessed with death, think of it as being death-positive.
Damn, you’re like me except I’m 30, my degree is in history, and my job is in retail instead of fast food.
Yotomoe, what were you wanting to do before you die?
“Why are you telling me this?”
It kind of made sense, back when she was drawn by Dringenberg or Bachalo.
Oh, Billie, no. This is DEFINITELY not good.
On one hand I do sorta get why Billie wouldn’t wanna go to therapy. I certainly have SOME sorta problem but it’s not severe enough that I need any kind of medication and I really don’t want some therapist picking around in my brain. Especially not for 100s of my cash monies. I’d rather try to fix myself through deep introspection than rely on a professional. It’s kinda frustrating and embarrassing.
A good therapist actually guides you through said introspection process. That’s his job. Doing that alone is a whole lot harder. And I don’t know whether it’s possible to do that without any help. It wasn’t for me. I needed to give up on some convictions I previously considered so fundamentally right that I’d have never thought of even doubting them without help. Whereas help refers to therapists, self-help groups and books.
🙂 It is possible, but like you said: harder. Therapists are trained to ask the right kinds of questions and to hep you feel comfortable opening up. I like to think of us as the mental health version of physical therapists. We help you stretch muscles while minimizing the risk of further damage so that you can heal faster and with less lingering pain. And we can guide you through exercises that will help teach you how to not injure yourself more in the future and to work through the pain better if you do.
I probably need therapy, but when I tried going through the mental health system near me, I ended up with one who was . . . not great.
The first session, I was filling out some paperwork and asked her what the date was. She responded “What date do you think it is?” and just. Refused to answer. I started getting upset about it because she couldn’t answer a simple question and she asked me if I was upset with *myself* for not knowing. And — no? Not even a little? It’s not a static fact, it changes daily. It’s good to confirm for stuff like forms.
Another time, she tried to get me to take a mindfulness course she was giving but framed it . . . really weirdly. She started by outlining how any other approach you took to managing your anxiety would only make it worse. Like, the example given, you’re anxious going grocery shopping and your hands start to shake, you don’t want people to see so you grab the handle of your cart, and that causes them to shake *more*. And that does not make any sense to me? For one, I’m not actually anxious when in a crowd of strangers because I can accept that everyone else is busy with their own shit and unless I do something to seriously draw attention, I only exist as much to them as my shopping cart does. For another, wouldn’t grabbing the cart handle be grounding and help you calm down, rather than making the shaking worse?
You’re right, just gently holding the handle would likely reduce the tremors, especially if you find it grounding.
The therapist was probably thinking about what happens if you seize it in a death grip like a drowning person clutching a stick. That would make your muscles tighter and likely create a tremor amplifying feedback loop.
That doesn’t mean she was a good therapist. That date thing sounds really annoying. Way to not read a room, therapist. Way to do a power play on the person you’re supposed to be establishing rapport with. Ugh.
I get that mindfulness can be legit (Steven Universe presented it WAY better than she did) but it just felt like she was saying “You’re relaxing wrong”
Relaxation has its place and can be very useful. Problem is when you use it like a shield against your own experience. Sometimes shields fail and we’re back to running away from our own anxiety. Mindfulness lets you get used to yourself and stop seeing your own emotions as enemies. Connection and trust with a therapist is more important than what methodology they use.
Sorry, phrased it wrong — it’s just. Starting out by telling you that anything you did other than mindfulness in response to anxiety was only making it worse, and then telling me to come back in two weeks to start learning mindfulness . . . that just severely increased my anxiety.
Yeah, and it’s really easy to do a bad job of explaining mindfulness, too. I doubt that therapist would have taught it in a way that could help you – she’d probably just give you an aversion to it, at best :p
That’s a misconception. As a therapist, I can say that I don’t “pick at people’s brains.” Honestly, most of my job is just listening to people talk about the things that are bothering them. I listen without offering judgement. Most people are pretty surprised to find out how useful that actually is. Sometimes I help clarify some things and help people look at things in a more realistic way or assess their options, but no digging. Actually one of the techniques that I use actually discourages the person from going into too much detail about what they are working through. It’s more about helping them process it internally in a safe space. And most insurance will provide at least some coverage depending on your age. If you are under the age of 18, you can probably get as much time with a therapist as you want with no cost to you or your parents. If you are in college, you might be able to get a therapist that works for the school for free (the tuition covered it at the school I went to for post grad). Otherwise, if you don’t have good insurance and can’t afford to pay for it yourself, there are programs out there to connect you with services at free or reduced cost. Our ethics actually have a whole section that requires help for people who can’t pay if the need exists. And if you are worried about what other people may think, we have VERY strict confidentiality guidelines. I’m not even allowed to say hi to clients past or present if I see them outside of appointments unless they say hi first. I won’t say you need a therapist, but it might not be as bad as you think. Give it a try if you think it will help.
Eh, I feel like I’m comfortable with it conceptually but the process of seeking one out makes me uncomfortable. My mom really wants me to get a black therapist as he’d have a better handle on my situation but even that gives me some anxiety over the expectations impressed upon me. Just like my issues with love, I hate the idea of seeking it out. I just want it to happen in a way that doesn’t make me uncomfortable. And I know that makes me sort of a weak willed wishy-washy kinda guy but I’m more comfortable with that then getting out of my comfort zone.
A good therapist won’t put expectations on you or make you feel pressured. You can get a black therapist if it would make you feel more comfortable, but it’s not really necessary for a therapist to truly understand your situation on a personal level to help you. If you want, check out psychologytoday.com (there are links to other countries if you aren’t in the US). You can read the bios of therapists in your area and pick one that seems to be right for you. The bios include their specialties, experience, credentials, and pictures of he therapists. It would allow you to check some people out without needing to put yourself out there until you are ready. I wish you the best of luck and hope things work out for you, whatever you choose to do.
Therapy isn’t just for “messed up” people. I go to therapy every week, and it’s for simple stuff like dealing with family, my autism, etc.
Making the appointment and going feels like taking yourself seriously. It’s frustrating when the person doesn’t work for you, which happens, and it’s tuff when just making the dang appointment is so much brain-work. But it does still feel like taking care of yourself.
Just as a question – how can I *avoid* therapists like you?
Honestly everything you’ve described matches well with my experience with therapists, and it’s a big part of why I despise them so much. They’re just so… bloody useless. And goddamn expensive, even with top tier insurance. (Honestly they’d be too expensive for what they offer even if they were free, since they only work during normal working hours which means having to take like two hours off work every session)
How do I find a therapist that will actually, you know, *help*? I don’t really need an expensive rubber duck. Is there some specific type I should ask after?
First of all, find a therapist whose working hours match your work schedule so you are less annoyed to begin with. From the list of those, try to find someone with experience with your problem or a method than makes sense to you. I personally achieve more with body centered therapy methods, but which method works best for you is something only you can know.
Use the first session with a therapist to interview them, and if they’re willing, don’t even pay for it. Be explicit that that’s what you’re doing, and talk to them about their philosophy and their approach. Bring up your concerns and let them respond.
I resisted therapy for a long, long time until a close friend of mine pushed me, and I don’t regret going at all. (It helps that my insurance covered it, so I can definitely see it not being worth the money for you.) It’s not that the therapist fixed me; it’s that I got a sounding board where there were things I could talk about without needing to worry about what they thought about me. I didn’t have to deal with as many social anxieties as I would chatting up a coworker or even long-time friends. My sessions ended when the therapist changed locations and I haven’t heard from her since; it was a clean break.
I probably need therapy and/or medication for… some combo flavor of depression/adhd plus some flavor of anxiety, especially around making phone calls to complete strangers.
Maybe I should call and make an appointment.
…..
……
…. any year now.
I think there exist some online things these days?
It took me 4 times to get with a therapist who’s been right enough for me. I found him through my Primary Care Physician, who is tuned in to specialists in our Single-A league sized city. He said therapy can be very helpful if you find a therapist who you mesh with. I was lucky that he knows me well enough & the local therapists to hook me up with someone who I can work well with.
2. He’s totally about Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy. And so am I. Now. IF introspection doesn’t get you where you want to be — and it didn’t me — you might consider it. Turns out the introspection was keeping me in the place I wanted to escape from. A big part of CBT is learning NOT to dwell & rerun the same non-productive & painful loops AND how to not do it, to escape. EYES ON THE PRIZE.
3. Meds didnt cure, but the right combo of the right ones reduced the pain & turmoil so I could start to accomplish what I wanted.
4. It feels really, really, really good to neutralize the old wounds & stop pouring salt in them. Seriously.
5. YMMV, of course. I wanted to share my experience because I spent a lot of time where you are but I’m finally … well, I’m feeling MUCH better now.
6. Full disclosure: notwitstanding the wounds i suffered, I have also been very fortunate/privileged in my access to health care, (as well as lucky in my PCP). I dont take that for granted & I hope that sharing my experience doesn’t amount to describing my comfortable house to a homeless person. I can only hope that you can find access to the resources you need for whichever method/s you might want to try, until we can fix America’s health care nightmare.
Be kind to yourself & be well
“I lock out all worries and fears/In my room”
I don’t know why I didn’t lead with this:
“In my own little corner
In my own little chair
I can be whatever I want to be”
I Am a Rock by Simon and Garfunkel seems kinda fitting as well.
Ruth won’t’ note Billie living in her little room but she’ll note her leaving allright.
I don’t get why Billie is being not only obstinate but fully toxic about this
She’s in full violent denial stage: “I don’t have a problem, YOU have a problem!”
No one likes being told they’re wrong. Your ego gets all wrapped up in it.
She is an alcoholic.
Ruth is *far* from out of the woods right now, so for all of her looking like she’s got her stuff together compared to Billie, that’s how it looks at this moment. I want it to last, but it’s probably not going to.
Ruth is also an alcoholic, but (at the moment) is doing much better than Billie, so it’s not just that – it’s also that Billie is a narcissist. Actually working on her flaws would be admitting to herself that she has any, and that’s something she just can’t do. At least not for extended periods of time.
I’m not sure alcoholic is the right word for slowly and willfully killing yourself and a need to kill your emotions. I was never clear how addiction figured into it for her, unless you’d consider self harm her addiction.
I feel like that’s pretty much the textbook definition of Alcoholism.
Billie has many problems. She attempted to make herself feel better with alcohol. Alcohol is now one of Billie’s problems. She doesn’t want to admit to any of them because once she opens those doors it’s not going to stop at drinking, her entire life is one big pile of damage and coping mechanisms drowned in booze.
In a lot of addiction cases, the root problem is that there is some underlying emotional need or challenge, and the addictive substance or behavior is substituted for an actual solution.
Too nervous to socialize with people? Have a few drinks to take the edge off first! Having trouble coping with loss or trauma? Drink your troubles away! Stressed the hell out by your high pressure job? Nothing a martini lunch can’t fix! The addiction can interfere with your ability to function, but it is also part of what helped you (sort of) function in the first place, so giving it up seems impossible.
So, yes, drinking to kill your emotions is a very frequent (if not universal) aspect of alcoholism.
Billie is a textbook case of blantant alcoholism. Right now, getting a drink is more important than anything else in her life. She usually drinks in public. Part of her can realize this and knows she should stop, but she cannot say she has stopped drinking and will keep this up because she doesn’t believe it.
How she ended up with the actual addiction is kind of moot at this point, because any root causes are as much drowned in the craving as everything else is.
Ruth is a different kind of textbook case, the hidden drinker. With Ruth, treating he depression has a good chance to keep her out of the bottle because it is clearly the root cause.
Billie’s drowned in the bottle for so long that any possible root causes drowned in it with the rest of her life. I’d say you need to dry her out first to be able to find and treat anything else. We know enough about her life to know that alcoholism wasn’t her first problem, but it’s the most crippling and dangerous right now.
Now I’m curious what you think alcoholism is, Zach. Because, you pretty much just defined it
i don’t have a professional opinion but two of the five closest people to me in my life were unmistakably alcoholic and zach’s definition applied to neither of them.
I’ve said what I’m going to say about this topic, and I’m not going to say any more unless I have something new to say.
Final recap: Billie has a felt need for alcohol that overrides pretty much anything else in her life, including relationships. That’s extremely unhealthy and it’s not necessarily permanent, but for at least the next couple of in-comic months, anyone who chooses to be around her is going to have to deal with that.
One hesitates to tempt DYW, but my sense is that if her wrapping her car around a tree didn’t cause Billie to re-evaluate her relationship with alcohol, something much worse would have to occur for that to happen.
If I recall correctly, DYW has already stated that no one will die in this series (in part just because, given the stretched out time scales, characters would be in mourning for IRL *YEARS* and that would just be torturous to *write*.)
If I’m any indication, Billie’s bumped some other folks up in the favorite character poll. Man, my choices are so safe this year.
How’d that one alt-text go? Oh yeah.
Well if that’s love it comes at much too high a cost
Worth Dying for. . But not worth living for.
Why is that such a good STRONG line?
Because anyone can die, but living for a promise is harder. Damn.
It works out.
Because there’s so much truth in it. Everyone can die. Dying is easy. Living can be the most difficult thing in the world.
On the other hand, you should neither die nor live for someone else. That should be something you do for yourself.
Honestly, there are very few situations where dying for someone works for me even as a trope and the ones that it does work for me aren’t ones that are extraordinarily likely IRL (like, for example, jumping in front of a bullet to keep someone else from being murdered).
Dying is easy, young man. Living is harder.
Backpacking through Europe and getting manicures, that would be enough…
A-plus use of Hamilton lyrics, both of you!
Somehow this reminds me of an early Wayne Wang film called Life is Cheap…But Toilet Paper is Expensive
Living requires the constant decision to do so. Especially if you are addicted to deadly substances.
Because mentally ill people can all too easily focus on how they are willing to die for others. This can also intersect with religion (as we saw with Joyce’s mum saying she would die for her). It is easy to die for someone. It is harder to live for them. It is harder to accept that living can mean changing and taking steps to do better.
This is one of the rare times where I want a ship to break because the relationship really isn’t working. Ruth deserves to be alive.
They both do, or we wouldn’t be this pissed at her.
Like, if Blaine was doing Drano shots, I don’t think any of us would be terrible upset with him.
I would. Someone else is going to have to clean that shot glass when he’s done. It’s just inconsiderate.
I mean, I’m mainly pissed because Billie’s denial is harming Ruth. Would I like to see her get better, of course. But I’m mainly concerned for the people around her
Billie and Ruth are fascinating as an anti-ship. A relationship that really did make them both worse and the comic realized this–without making either the bad guy.
Except for the fact that in many ways, Billie’s been at her best (and most adorable) when taking care of Ruth. I think that’s what makes it hard to entirely condemn the ship — in some ways, it seems to be good for her. I mean, if they ended up together in the long run, Billie would definitely be the housewife, and she’d be really good and really happy at it. I’m honestly not sure that the relationship made her worse — the problem is that because in many ways it made things better, it made it a lot easier for her to ignore her genuine problems.
Yeah, that’s kind of my take on it too.
The relationship hasn’t been bad. For either of them.
Their problems are real and serious, but up to now they’ve been better off together than alone.
Seriously Billie, what the hell? You were just telling Lucy that you were going to have to stop, so why drop that so completely.
I bet Billie flipped the light switch on the way out.
… 🙁
And the bird.
That bird was a butthole anyway
The bird is not a butthole, Bagge. I believe you’ll find that the bird is, in fact, the word.
I stand corrected.
And the word is “cloaca-hole”
Redundant. A cloaca is by definition a hole.
You know what? From this moment forward I am going to use the word “cloaca” instead of “asshole” when describing appropriate personages. And I am going to relish doing so.
It implies that they are a multi-functional asshole. Really an orifice of all trades.
Great, a renaissance asshole! 🙂
Renaissance -> born-again
An asshole giving birth?
Well, to a shit, I guess, right?
(actually I was calling back to this strip)
I read this as “Coca-cola” for a second.
Yelling Bird callback! (warning: birdse)
Flipped off Ruth, then the lights, in one fluid motion with the same finger.
Nope. It’s just that Billie is the light of Ruth’s life…and that light just went out.
*sobs*
And there we go
Dying is mainstream #money
Happy late Valentines~
goddammit, jennifer
Billie is immensely frustrating. Good. Means he’s writing addiction correctly.
I want Billie to get her shit together. She’s already had one car wreck, and she’s a drama hurricane, as Alice dubbed her, and every time she gets tanatalizingly close to a breakthrough, it gets pulled back away, which… is honestly very true to life.
So without a suicide pact and alcohol they have nothing in common… 🙁
It seems not, no.
This is more a problem of a thing they have in common – alcohol – is causing problems and is a bad coping mechanism and only one of them is willing to commit to the idea that it is bad.
Votes
1st: Ruth – I am loving how she’s been taking charge of her therapy and understanding that while she may lose stuff that was once important, that’s pales in comparison to her life. When Billie is finally gone I hope she stays on the up and up.
2nd Sal – Still with the big ups for standing up to Amber and the big ups for trying to mend fences I think she would’ve been justified in letting be broken (Marcie/Amber). I still personally think Marcie is trash for just dangling friendship like it’s thing to be earned and threatened to be lost as opposed to trying to work together to strengthen but I’m happy for where Sal is now
3rd: Lucy- Dammit I just want her to be happy. She’s crushing on Walky hard but recognizes his life isn’t ready for that rn. She’s perceptive as all get out too and I hope we keep seeing more of her.
Honorable Mention
Walky – I think he’s done a great bit of growing up and even though he’s still a goof, he’s been slowly recognizing and adjusting to the world around him and I don’t think we give him enough credit in the comments.
Anti-picks: Billie, Marcie, Malaya
Out of curiosity: why Marcie?
“I still personally think Marcie is trash for just dangling friendship like it’s thing to be earned and threatened to be lost as opposed to trying to work together to strengthen but I’m happy for where Sal is now”
I get why you feel this way, but personally I think it was less ‘you need to earn friendship or lose it by going through these goal posts’ and more ‘You have a problem with doing things that screw me over and since you’ve done this before, I’m not willing to forgive you until I’m actually sure you’re working on that’.
As to be fair though, Throughout their friendship, Marcie has been part of the collateral damage for Sal’s major life mistakes(which only now Sal, is taking steps to correct). I don’t blame her at all wanting to make terms on their friendship.
I ship Ruth/Carla and Ruth/Amber just about Ruth anyone really but Billie.
1) Dina. This is pure narcissism on my part, as Dina is pretty much a rule 63 me, only more socially competent.
2) Becky. This might be a trope, but in Becky’s case it’s a good trope: she’s plucky, and I admire the heck out of that. (I do wish she would cut it out with the cutesy nicknames.)
3) Undecided. Go ahead and lobby me. 🙂
I’m always bummed that my favorite characters aren’t choosable. I want to pick Ryan as #1, Blaine as #2, and David Willis as #3.
It seems like shes worried Ruth is going to not go do anything fun with her anymore, like they have to stay in her room where it’s safe and there’s no alcohol. It also seems like Billie isn’t considering that not everything requires alcohol to be fun. She really is kinda sucking right now.
I’m sorry, but I have nothing but disdain for Maple Leaf fans tonight. F John Taveres.
Billie doesn’t think she can stop drinking. Part of her has always assumed she is not good enough for her gilrfriend, and now she knows it to be true. She can’t be the one thing Ruth needs her to be
(I don’t think Billie is right any more than I thought that Ruth was right that she had no option left except dying, but that’s what I think she thinks)
Ouch. Doesn’t help that I had “Getaway Car” from Audioslave stuck in my head.
“You’re so hell-bent on self-destruction you want to take me with you.”
“Well, self-destruction is the BEST LIFE and you are just AFRAID to die of alcohol poisoning or suicidal depression.”
…and Billie’s “But I am cool, no really, I am, totally on top of things here, Cool Girl” schtick metastasizes horribly.
Also she’s terrible at come-backs. Like just really bad.
Walky because I really like his character arc as of late
Amber cuz she’s finally getting through some of her bullshit and her and Walky are cute.
Malaya because I absolutely LOVE trash.
Hah, switch out Malaya for Mike and that’s my exact list and reasonings.
Amber, Joyce, & Walky. My 3rd choice would usually be Billie but I’m having a hard time feeling her right now, I mean as of now she’s stroken a count of 3 times in one day.
Though I wonder now if I should have picked Jacob instead of Walky.
*Stroke out
I suddenly ship Malaya and Mike. I may have regrets about this.
They’d work in a visceral animalistic kinda way. And outside of the mindblowing wall slaming back clawing sex they’d always be at odds and that could be fun.
They’d both stick together forever because how bad it hurts the other one
I never liked the way Ruth and Billie got started but it’s fascinating that all of their problems at the beginning aren’t what’s caused their breakup. Instead, it’s the fact they’ve been resolved which is breaking them up.
Billie hates that Ruth is no longer a wreck because it makes her look bad by comparison.
Alpha bongo!
Problem solver!
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. When they started, Billie saw Ruth (in part) as a problem she could fix. Now Billie is the problem that needs fixing, and that’s not something she can even acknowledge to herself.
I love how the third and fourth panels are set up. Thoroughly Done with Billie for the foreseeable future, though, so I guess it’s a good thing it’s the end of the story line (dangit!)
Looks like things are still coming up Sal.
Ruth has me feeling so proud of her for keeping her vision of recovery clear and standing up for her needs, but it’s sad to watch her deal with Billie, someone she’d been so vulnerable with, just….not seeming to care about what Ruth needs. To be fair, Billie doesn’t seem to really care about what Billie needs either. It feels like this relationship is just getting even less healthy as time goes on.
First pick is Joyce because it has always been and will always be Joyce. The whole comic is about her overcoming her bigoted upbringing, despite all the fear and hard work, by just being like… an inherently good person and I love that. (Maybe this is the year she can start working on personal boundaries.)
Billie is a piece of shit. But she’s still my #ProblematicFave. Second pick.
And then a surprise newcomer, Sal. I always kinda liked her but my opinion of her has just shot up recently with everything that happened. Not coincidentally, my opinion of Amber has gone down a fair bit.
Speaking of opinions on Sal… at the time of writing, she’s at the top of the poll with 15%! Good for her!
I’m so proud of her! <3
Dear Ruth: okay, you’re depressive, so probably self-sabotaging, but if you’re not trying to drive Billie away, possibly mention why you like her at some point. Admittedly, your last-panel expression makes me suspect you just thought this.
(Yes, I know, unpopular opinion, but I still think that if they can get over their ginormous issues, these two really work together.)
I think it’s totally healthy to be with someone who has no interest in supporting you trying to overcome your addiction. Ruth is definitely sabotaging herself by calling out toxic behavior from her girlfriend
I guess I’m not seeing where Billie isn’t supporting Ruth, so much as she does’t think she has a problem personally.
Constantly inviting your recovering alcoholic girlfriend to place that serve alcohol with the intent to drink said alcohol is not supportive and kinda fucked up!
I guess I haven’t been paying attention cause it’s been a while (before this new brief story arc started up) since Billie asked Ruth to come drink with her.
I probably haven’t been paying attention, I guess.
“A while” being…earlier this day. Remember, comic book time.
Hey, somebody I agree with. Took a while. Not that the unending disdain for Billie isn’t deserved, but given the situation, it’s like Ruth doesn’t want the relationship to work. Sure, Billie is being stubborn and refusing to see the issue for what it is versus just waving it off like nothing, and maybe it’s just Ruth’s nature and as she is, but I’m not seeing any sign that Ruth is trying to help mend beyond getting her to stop.
Which is fine, but add a bit more.
What can Ruth do besides point out Billie’s addiction? She’s trying to be supportive, but each time she tries, Billie pushes her away.
Seriously, what is Ruth doing wrong in this situation? Billie needs an intervention.
Maybe Ruth is clueing in that the relationship is actually bad for her and so has less desire to maintain it the more Billie acts like this.
Ruth is way too unstable herself to help someone else. Besides that, trying to help an alcoholic who doesn’t want help is a waste of time.
Glad Dina is still in the top 3!
I wished I could give an honorable mention to Joe forthe character poll. He’s not the best, but he had depths and potential to grow.
I feel that what makes it harder to get through to Billie is that she can pretty much afford to brush off complicated issues with her parents’ money to not worry about it realistically or have full impact on her.
My top 3 would have to day
1) Danny – he’s got problems with family that I really relate to and also I just love him.
2) Sal – she’s awesome and I find her journey of slowly learning and understanding the people around wonderful.
3) Amber – she is the most explicit mental health storyline and as someone with numerous mental health problems I am very protective of her fate.
They are also all NERDS!!!!!!!!! (Especially Sal)
But the sun still shines in the summertime
I’ll be yours if you’ll be mine
I tried to change, but I changed my mind
Think I’ll have another glass of Mexican wine
1) Jocelyne. Obviously. She’s a fucking cinnamon roll.
2) Sarah, because she’s the only asshole character in this comic I’ve managed to really sympathize with.
3) Ehhh Ethan? Kind of a toss-up between him, Sal, and Jacob.
Jocelyne high five!
Also vote-#3-being-fraught-with-indecision high five!
So, top three picks
Sal – I’m sure this is brand new information after last arc, but Sal’s my favourite character and has been since shortly after I started reading Dumbing of Age a few years ago. I know this is shocking, I’ve been very subtle about it. 😛
Marcie – I think she’s adorable and I respect that she’s willing to stick to her boundaries – that’s hard when it’s your best friend, even if you’ve been seriously burned by them. Plus, y’know, awesome skater chick. What’s not to like?
Carla – I mean. C’mon. It’s Carla. She’s an asshole but for the most part she’s a funny one and she has her moments.
Pick three favorit characters? Easy peasy – Joyce and her two ladies. I would have a much harder time to pick two or four.
And I’m SHOCKED, SHOCKED I tell you to hear you say that Sal is a favorit character of yours. After last arc I would NEVER have guessed.
WHO COULD HAVE FORESEEN THIS TURN OF EVENTS???
As for who I voted for, this was tough, as I really like the cast for the most part.
1. Danny. He’s really come into his own, I feel like. I think he’s still probably got plenty of problems he needs to sort out, but of the cast, he feels like he’s one of the ones who is showing some of the most growth. The rest could only hope to “danny it up” now, given how he’s flourishing.
2. Lucy. I’ve really enjoyed getting to know her better after hardly being around a lot. I loved the gag of Joyce thinking that Lucy’s chipper attitude was lampooning her at first. With a cast like this, we could use a ray of sunshine. She has me intrigued to learn more about her.
3. Joe. This is a weird choice, I know, but there is a lot to unpack with this guy. It makes me fascinated to know where he’s going to end up, especially since with respect to Joyce. He’s currently looking like he’s defeated and lost all faith in himself, and is just in full-on trash mode, which… I want to know what the heck’s going to happen there.
Honestly, it was tough to pick. Some of my all-time favorites haven’t really been around very much, or have been around a lot to where I am prepared for a break from them. Like, I have grown to like Sal a ton, but I feel like we have had quite a lot of her lately, so I am ready to see what some of the others have been up to, for example.
My votes:
1) Walky. I mean he’s not a great person, he’s not a good person, he gets a C+ at best for effort in general, he’s an irresponsible privileged goofball because he’s afraid to take things seriously… and he’s ME, dammit.
2) Sal. I mean, Sal’s awesome. She’s mature, she’s responsible, she’s sufficiently introspective to recognize her problems and overcome them, she has fight and drive…. oh, and cancer sticks. Eh, no one’s perfect.
3) Dina. Because in a cast full of emotional trainwrecks, SOMEONE needs to be calm, collected, and logical.
Up until now I’d hardly call Sal responsible.
I have to go with Dina as my #1 pick. She’s one of the only characters I can think of without immediately remembering something crummy or obnoxious she’s done. Also I can relate to a lot of her mannerisms, and her hat is green.
Pride, denial and addiction are bosom buddies. Billie is in the wrong here. But the ways in which her perspective is wrong mirror the ways anyone who finds themselves in court on a drug or mental health related charge is wrong. I can’t hate Billie. She’s a sheltered kid who’s finally having to deal with bad habits she’s never had to face down. I’d judge a middle-aged person a lot differently from someone Billie’s age.
Willis has done his homework here.
Classic doubling down. If Billie changed, just who would she be? She is the sum of her mistakes and is therefore proud of them. Mistakes were made, but not by me – https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132 . Your irregular librarian’s recommendation.
Wow, no wonder that cheerleader doesn’t want to talk to her.
So bad at listening to her partner’s needs.
Oh, Ruth. I’m sorry that this happened to you but something tells me that it was inevitable because, in the end, the relationship was all about what Billie wanted. The moment when she needed to give ground, even if for your sake, she wasn’t willing or able to do so.
That is one of Willis’s bugbears, isn’t it and I can’t blame him. If you’re not willing to live for someone, only do easy stuff like die for them, then you have to question your commitment.
On a slightly humorous note, something tells me that Ruth doesn’t quite understand why Billie turned the light out in the room.
To me the issue was that what Billie was willing to do for Ruth was easy because she didn’t have to do anything, it took zero effort on Billies part (either lay there and do nothing or keep drinking) but now she has to actually do something and it’s too much for her
Billie was perfectly willing to do things that took effort so long as it didn’t involve changing herself in any shape or form: she made sure Ruth took her medication, that she did a meeting she was supposed to, that she got dressed and actually did things. She was willing to problem-solve and help as long as she wasn’t the part to be solved.
Indeed
It’s called the Murder Cave, Billie.
Alexa, play Garbage – #1 Crush
OK,running Candy Crush.
[i]Looks critically at poll results[/i]
Alright, which one of you voted for Mary?
Not only that, but who votes Faz or Roz? We haven’t seen them in ages. (Also, props for your QC choice! 😀
Your Claire avatar is way too happy for your post.
1. Sarah, because of low tolerance for drama and people’s stupid bullshit, yet is loving and compassionate when the situation calls for it.
2. Mike, for his contempt for the lies people tell others and especially the lies they tell themselves(even himself).
3. Ethan, because more than anyone else he seems to be making the most effort on improving and coming to terms with himself.
4. Danny, because every story needs an earnest boring Everyman.
5. Leslie, because someone needs to be an adult where there are none and all the other adults fail them.
6. Ruth, because now her story towards growth and self-help is growing on me.
7. Joyce, is the heart of everything and she has the best outfits
I don’t like Mary, but not for the reasons most dislike her. I just don’t like characters who exist solely for the purpose of readers hating them to the point they’re nothing but a joke-delivery device. I’d like to have a chance to have some empathy for Mary(which is not necessarily the same as liking them).
I was going to write a small book but what it breaks down to is this. I feel Billie does love Ruth. I believe she was genuine about wanting to stop drinking. That’s totally different from ACTUALLY stopping drinking, she’s an alcoholic after all. But when she mentioned it to Ruth, rather than being supportive she was attacked. I’m not surprised at all that Billie simply threw the whole idea in the too hard basket and walked out.
Except that she couldn’t even say to Ruth, when asked, “I’m stopping drinking.” Keep in mind she said she would stop drinking before, and DIDN’T. It is no surprise that, without Billie being able to commit to actually SAYING it, that Ruth isn’t going to believe it. Why would she be supportive when Billie hasn’t shown to be able to practice what she preaches in the past? And now she can’t even “preach”. She deserves NO benefit of the doubt here.
Billie brought this all on herself and I feel 0 sympathy for her. Ruth is better off without Billie, regardless of how much they might love each other. You can love someone and still be the worst person for them, and Billie is currently the worst person for Ruth (aside from her grandfather, obviously).
I think that panel 2 pretty much sums it up. She wants to be in a drunken lesbian suicide pact; she hasn’t got her mind or heart beyond that point and I think it will take a big shock to do so.
All I know is if, when I was considering therapy, the people who said they loved me had been totally negative and attacked me, accused me of having no intention of changing and brought up past instances where I’d tried to change and failed, I’d probably still be the same messed up ball of anxiety, self loathing and perversity I was then.
I don’t mean to dis Ruth for being skeptical, it’s hardly fair on her to dis her for reacting the way she did considering her personal situation. But it does seem like the best way to rub Billie up the wrong way is to react exactly the way Ruth did.
Also, if you understand the nature of alcoholism and you still have zero sympathy for Billie then I find that incredibly sad.
This is different though, since Ruth is the one who wants Billie in therapy. To seek help and actually start to live. Billie is not attacked for thinking about therapy but for refusing to even consider it.
I do know a lot about alcoholism. Still, every alcoholic decides at each day, each drink that drinking is more important than basically everything else. No, no sympathy at all. Would you feel sympathy for someone who has a broken leg, doesn’t want to get it fixed at the doctor but always complains about the pain in his leg and all the things he cannot do because of it?
Billie didn’t fail to change, she never tried in the first place. She refuses to do anything TO change and instead pretends everything is fine when though everyone around her is telling her the opposite.
She’ll get my sympathy if and when she stops shoving her head in the sand and admits she had a problem and *actually tries to change* instead of making non-promises. As it is she’s just hurting herself AND others, and that’s all on her and it find her of any sympathy and might otherwise get.
I feel that everything you feel is the opposite of what has been going on in this strip.
Lol, ironic avatar.
Yup.
Damn you, Willis!
Sums it up nicely.
Amen to that. And I mean that in the nicest possible way.
Can I hug Ruth? I think she deserves a hug and a healthy relationship/friendship/whatever
When a storyline ends with Walky being the reasonable one and Billie the opposite, I question this reality.
Voted for Dina, Lucy, and Carla. Bummed Fuckface isn’t on the poll – the poll is speciest.
I feel like both Ruth and Billie think their respective relationships to alcoholism are a lot more… symmetrical than they are? Ruth hated herself for drinking because of her history, drinking wasn’t fun for her, it was almost definitely not helping what seems to be a pretty obvious case of clinical depression… she didn’t really want to be doing this, she just didn’t really feel like she had any other way to cope. Billie is also using drinking to cope with being unhappy, but it does seem to be genuinely fun for her, and the consequences of her drinking problem are mostly external – she does something bad and gets in trouble, and people judge her and leave (this is not to say that they are wrong to do so, just that this hurt her and she’s clearly still afraid of it happening again now). And now Ruth doesn’t understand why Billie wants them both to stay miserable when there’s a potential way out of this right there, and Billie doesn’t understand why Ruth is giving up having fun to be another judgmental person who thinks she’s too good for her.
Billie is definitely being the worse person here, and I’m not at all saying she should keep drinking if it makes her happy to do so. Also, I do think that at this point, they’d probably be better broken up (Billie seems like she’s currently in a place where Drinking = Fun and Not Drinking = No Fun, and I think she needs to be around people who want to have fun but don’t drink in order to reduce that association – meanwhile, Ruth needs to be around people who understand that she’s trying to get away from things that didn’t make her happy.) It’s just kinda sad that their difficulty discussing their problems is almost definitely coming from them seeing each other as more similar than they are, and if they really understood their differences and felt safe communicating them, things would probably be going a little better.
Quite true but that would require Billie to use words instead of pretending her life is perfect and amazing and involves feelings that aren’t joy and confidence while Ruth is trying to communicate and getting walled denial and minimising nonsense in return for every attempt.
Ruth is doing a good job of defending herself from the crab bucket effect
The moral of this story: Don’t be a Leafs supporter. It never ends well.
Actually, I’m calling it. This is the most painful moment for the other shoe to drop from THIS strip
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/03-the-butterflies-fly-away/favoritesportsteam/
That would be so incredibly rude, and yet I can imagine things sinking a little lower and making the timing even more impeccably painful.
Like, it would be incredibly quality DYW, but is it peak DYW?
First, The Leafs are currently sitting third (eight teams make the playoffs from the East). They’re a good bet to make the playoffs but I have no idea if they’re in form to go far.
I wonder if this will become a “Fever Pitch” (where the ending of that movie had to be rewritten because the Boston Red Sox won their first championship in 86 years, during filming).
Ugh, copyedit error:
“First, great callback. Second…”
“I would die for you” and its variations show up A LOT in DoA. I wonder how many ties youngWillis heard them.
From his Twitter posts, I understand that he continued to hear them up until comparatively recently when he finally blocked all communications between himself and his mother.
MAN does that explain a lot
Look, the character poll is too cruel! Even with three picks, there’s too many good characters to choose from!
I mean, yeah, I did it (Joyce! Dorothy! Jocelyne!) but I have regrets, dang it
I was tempted to find out what happens if you vote for four. Maybe next year.
My biggest surprise on seeing the results: not only did some people vote for Faz, but as I type this, he has more votes than Rachel or Roz. What is up with that.
They are inspired by the greatness of Faz’s erection.
I love Jocelyne, I am just not a patron yet, so I haven’t seen all of her appearances, so there’s still plenty I don’t know about her.
It’s almost like Ruth is a year older and a year smarter than Billie.
And she has to keep it together for Howard’s sake. For all the Walky and Sal were like siblings, Billie doesn’t care much for them. Not at all like Ruth cares for Howard.
2 years. She’s 20.
I understood where Billie was coming from, even if I thought she was flaming wrong, until this strip. My sympathy is gone, even if I still understand the reaction, because I don’t even get where she think’s she’s doing “incredible” as in “extraordinary” with any of her other day to day struggles and comments. She can’t find the awesome college parties to, which is what she thought college was about. She lost cheerleading and friends. She isn’t popular, except in one dorm, where the cost is not having space to do her own thing and she has a roommate that grates on her to the point of escaping to her girlfriends’ room. She actually did try to quit drinking – she was hung over when she ran into Alice after the guilty confrontation with Ruth from when she previously lied about it. She doesn’t like her relationship with her parents and views Walky as her family even if she doesn’t treat him great. Heck, her premise on being with Ruth was about being toxic together and so they won’t do more external damage. The new bartender (Jason) won’t give her alcohol at the pizza place. Where has anything been what she’d consider great? Her highlights are having a real date, one party where she had to figure out how Joyce had been drugged, being the more passing white daughter to get her favorite cookies, and her girlfriend busting up a fake Joyce party so they could hold hands in the dark… that is… incredible. As in extraordinarily depressing. She is also incredible- as in impossible to believe.
Which after all that and her love of word play… is this some self awareness and further wordplay that it would be impossible to believe her if she said those words? Is it impossible to believe in herself? Can she not believe that this is her life? Just… boooo. Bad depression brain monkeys! Don’t make people think change is impossible, even if hard and maybe improbable.
Ruth is going to have to take a long, hard look at whether or not it is worth having Billie, in her life. Ruth might indeed truly lover her, but right now, Billie is also super toxic, and that is something a person, trying to get themselves out of a hold of depression, and substance abuse, needs.
Billie has managed to be good for Ruth at times but she has to be wiling to accept that this is no longer a relationship solely on her terms. She’s going to need to accept that she needs to start thinking more about what Ruth needs to heal and what she can do to help that process, no matter how unwelcome that would be in her life. If Billie honestly isn’t willing to change herself for Ruth then, no, there’s probably no future there.
This breakup is going to take a while, isn’t it. And it won’t be pretty.
Bagge’s choices in the poll: Mary, Mike, Jason.
I mean, I like Jason as a character. He just was a crap teacher.
Mary… draws nicely.
She draw ann-i-mey, you know?
More meaningful use of light switches. I wonder if it’s gonna be a thing from now on?
Yeah, take THAT Ruth, ya room-haver.
My votes: Sal (because she’s awesome), Carla (because she’s awesomely crazy) and Robin (she’s a side character, but I kind of feel intrigued by misadventures of this weirdo politicians).
Other characters I considered voting for: Joyce and Dina.
“I’m doing just fine, I don’t need therapy.”
Oof.
Just…
OOOF.
What a strip to end a storyline on.
Damnit I didn’t see Carla on the poll. My Ethan vote actually goes to her. (I also voted for Dina and Sal.)
I’m pretty sure that Carla’s gonna hack the poll to make herself the winner anyway.
I know you don’t know me or know of the fact that it’s the middle of the night right now where I am.. But thank you for this AMAZINGirl comic, Sir DM Williams. Thank you so much.
I’m in good hands, maybe even the best hands there ever were(wolf?).. And I’m legally free to go because it’s my choice and no one else’s. I’m kind of somewhat like Billie, though. Just not enough, because people are people (so why should it (bumble)bee.. 🎶
Tldr: thanks!
And give my regards to Kerberos, the Emperor of THE Interwebs, and someone who knows what the heck 1 muzak is. Please with 2 cherries on top? 🍒
I forgot a closing Para-thesis which – excuse my German! – describes me better than any words ever could. 😂
Just for this post, We award you with today’s best article about horses in video games: https://www.polygon.com/2019/2/28/18244135/red-dead-rdr2-online-horse
Billie’s always been toxic. This will be good for Ruth.
Man, I am sick of Billie
I’m. VERY Scared.
And for those saying Billie was toxic, remember Ruth abused power and was kinda really shitty to get IN this relationship to begin with. Yeah Ruth is trying to improve. but. I still see a LOT of projection of Ruth needs on to Billie atm, which. Is NOT helping Ruth to help Billie confront their OWN shit so they BOTH can improve. It’s not JUST on Billie, here. Ruth knows Billie, and when she get’s dismissive like that. This way of doing things does NOT really work in either of their favours.
It REALLY seems like Ruth is not willing to admit how bad she is, and is trying to drop shit via HINTS by getting BILLIE to change her behaviour.
That isn’t going to work. She’ll get more dismissive, and more reliant on her other crutches (popularity and alcohol), which is the exact OPPOSITE of what Ruth wants. That’s going to make BOTH of them worse.
I am REALLY scared that, if Ruth needs to go back to the hospital, she may be in worse shape.
If you know this handle you know that I love this disaster ship, because I’ve been broken like both of them and the drama is still in(toxic)ating.
This probably isn’t what is happening, but I also relate to this in another way: I’ve been in relationships a large chunk of me didn’t want, with people who’s habits or views didn’t feel aligned with who I was, and while the part of me invested in the relationship was SUPER invested. I wouldn’t intentionally sabotage things, but I would do what both billie and ruth are doing here – pushing a source of conflict, acting cold to the other person’s feelings, demanding conformity to my way of doing things and dropping a person cold if they didn’t.
The people I love and respect I am good to and generally push past my own shit-tastic way of being to try and help. The people I clash with are like train wrecks where no one makes it out intact. This storyline has felt quite familiar for that reason – it is not about who is right or not, these guys are already exploding and they know it, when you’re bound together by drama, the absence of it means the absence of your main bond.