I don’t have Joyce’s exact aversion to food, but I do prefer my hot sauce smooth, and not chunky. I don’t mind the ingredients if they’re all liquified in an even manner, but chunky salsa or hot sauce with pieces floating in it makes me lose my appetite.
I don’t know; the crispiness of the cheese mixed with the softness of the pancake, and the heat and flavor of the hot sauce make for a delicious breakfast. You could do it with a tortilla instead, but the pancake is superior in my opinion.
It’s weird to me that so many people in the world feel confident and totally justified offering up opinions on other people’s food choices. They didn’t say “Hey I eat this on pancakes and it feels not as good as it could be, what else should I try?”
It’s weird to me that so many people in the world feel like the internet is a place specially for them to post their own opinions on things but nobody is allowed to respond to them.
That’s a really hard balance to reach. I once had blueberry ghost pepper sauce that tasted absolutely awful. It was so overpowering it ruined the flavor of anything you put it on. A lot of hot sauce confuse heat with taste.
exactly! for a long time anything above dave’s insanity sauce was just “how hot can we make it nothing else matters” to my taste buds, and it stayed that way until SeaFire’s Reaper Sauce, which is again too hot for me directly but yummy despite that and mixes into other things really well.
‘grilled cheese pancakes’ does sound like a good concept, i suppose a hot sauce would def wake you up if you eat it early/a sa breakfast food and not a snack lol
I imagine it doesn’t hit her mind as a sauce.
I know it doesn’t for me.
Ketchup, mustard, mayo, gravy:I just don’t think of them as sauces despite that being what they are.
Though, if it is the same deal with her as it is with me, it’s almost certainly for different reasons.
I’m working out my thought process as I write this, but it’s probably the degree of thickness that has my mind label something as sauce; they need to be thinner than the previously named items (I like my gravy thick).
So spaghetti sauce, hot sauce, soy sauce, tobascoe (sp) sauce, and au ju all count as sauces to me.
Of course, I could just be overthinking it and the reason some strike me as sauces and some don’t is because they were called sauces when they were first introduced to me and the others were not.
i mean hot sauce is pretty red but a packet hot sauce might still be a lot for joyce unless it’s on a dish that would mellow out the heat as well. Is chipotle red sauce based on a specific thing? i’ve never been directly, only had like, a side from the takeout m ybro would bring home
there is sweet chili sauce/sriraracha and the like/asian hot sauces but idk if that’d be overwhelming, even if some asian countries (outside of like korea) aren’t as known for super spicy foods compared to like india or mexico, it might be a level or two too much for joyce
Also textural consistency. Kraft cheese powder is highly processed; most store-bought mustards are, too. Joyce doesn’t like the lumpy sauces. Probably not the gritty stuff, either.
According to Mirriam-Webster, a condiment is something (such as a seasoning, sauce, garnish, or topping) that is added to food usually after the food is prepared and that enhances or adds to its flavor
Alright, so I’m mostly wrong on the first part, but totally nailed the second! They can absolutely be multiple things. Sauces can be condiments, veggies can be condiments, all sorts of things can be condiments, and still be themselves.
Which means sauces are condiments if they are added to the food later, but not condiments if they’re added during cooking.
Red sauce on top of pasta – condiment
Pasta with red sauce mixed in – not condiment
I think pasta mixed with its sauce would still be a condiment here, because you still add the red sauce after the pasta is fully done cooking? As opposed to stir-fried pasta. Or like, the red sauce in lasagna.
And still I wouldn’t think of pasta sauce as a condiment? Fair enough if it meets the definition, just not how it registers to me.
Barbecue sauce is one where it can be added near the end of cooking, when I wouldn’t think of it as a condiment, or as a topping or dip after, when I would.
other than like stew or like marinated chicken, i imagine theres other dishes with spices/heat mixed into it where it’s not an outside texture of a sauce vs like bbq ribs or so, but we don’t know what spicy foods she has had in the past. (wonder if she’d freak out at sloppy joes [ther’es an innuendo somewhere in there lol])
She had a (very) sloppy Joe a few weeks ago. In the dorm kitchenette, even. Made a mess. Sarah was, er, displeased to discover that she had not yet washed her hands.
As a pepperhead, Diablo sauce is definitely in the “wow, this is actually supposed to be spicy” category, which is more than I can say about most fast food “spicy” items. Like, I literally can’t tell the difference between Wendy’s spicy chicken and regular chicken, and Taco Bell’s Mild and Fire sauces have the same amount of perceived spice to me.
Too bad Diablo sauce tastes wretched.
In fairness, 99% of the time I put my own hot sauce on my Taco Bell order. I’ve literally brought a bottle of Valentina into the restaurant, generally the bottle I keep in the driver’s door cupholder of my car (because it’s not really accessible while driving most of the time).
Screw “Fire,” the best sauce is “Diablo.” I would put that on basically all my food(not counting sweet foods which I rarely eat,) if I could buy it at the store.
If I had to describe the flavor(keep in mind I’m bad at explaining things) I’d say it’s a little smoky, a small bit bitter, and complex in spiciness from the multiple peppers used. When added to burritos, or quesadillas it really works well, and is great when used alongside their nacho cheese.
I wonder what people with sensory issues do if they weren’t exposed to ketchup and other squeezy sauces as a kid. Is ketchup as an adult a revelation, or is it “new thing! Bad!”?
I know someone with sensory issues who despises tomatoes and only barely tolerates ketchup, and he’s from the Midwest. His sauce of choice is mustard, and hot mustard if he can find it.
I had honey mustard ruined for me by a roommate, a few years ago. The freak would put so much of it on her chicken nuggets at once, it resembled a goddamn stew or curry, and stunk up the entire house.
Actually you’re not off, ketchup for me can be a BAD thing i distinctly Do Not want on food sometimes, and it was rare for me growing up to have in the house. for me the ‘safest’ condiment is actually soy sauce or ume plum vinegar bc we always had it in the house.
I found out recently that the reason that they didn’t like ketchup on hot dogs was because people would use ketchup to cover up the scent of spoiled meat that they were selling, so if you’re meat came with ketchup, it became a tell that they might be serving you bad meat.
Does refusing to eat it as a child count as not being exposed to it?
Because I still refuse to eat anything* with a sauce on it. Solids and liquids should not be mixed! Yes this does mean I don’t eat soups or pastas.
* – Tomato sauce on pizzas in normal amounts is tolerated because I am used to it and it has a different mouth feel due to being tightly sandwiched between the cheese and bread, but when I’m ordering a pizza just for myself I prefer no sauce.
I may have the answer since Nana has been dropping Tism family lore. Poppy Ellis (born end WW2) would ONLY eat vegetables if they were boiled until flavourless and of one consistency. Carrot? Potato? Bean? Lettuce? Must be boiled until all taste and feel the same. No sauce, no spice, just a fucktonne of salt.
I had the blankest childhood in existence. Nana hated every moment of it until he died and now revels in making every kind of vegetable dish imaginable for our Friday family dinners.
(Note: lettuce is somewhat hyperbolic since salads/burgers were okay but then that was strictly lettuce, tomato, cheese)
Booster Sauce™ uses a closely guarded secret blend of freshly ground cinnamon, apple puree, smoked chili powder, barley flour, honey, and espresso powder. Their family hates it.
Underwood Ranch (the former supplier of peppers to Huy Fong) now makes their own sriracha. Supposedly it’s the closest thing to the old school rooster sauce, but I can’t confirm that because I haven’t tried it myself.
I’ve had good luck with Flying Goose brand sriracha.
I’d say more this… PE class you only really needed to do one semester of at my high school (two semesters, but one could be waived for, like, so many things). Took it the summer before freshman year. College meant getting a lot more physical activity just walking everywhere all the time.
Physical activity is right. The way my classes are set up, I have to carry 50lbs (22.7ish kg) of equipment to and from school. I weighed it and everything. A motherfucker could get injured hauling all that.
Americans are fat because our culture incentivizes sitting around on your ass eating carbs and drinking sugar all day and mocks any suggestion of portion control. Towns are unwalkable and bike-hostile, we have entire swathes of residential land where there’s barely any fresh or healthy food (food deserts, basically), it’s a lot more than just “durr hurr u didn have PE”
At least from my college experience, what actually stops you eating Ice Cream for lunch is sleeping through breakfast and losing most of your lactose tolerance because you’re no longer having a bowl of milk with your cereal every morning.
I mean if theyr’e gonna eat lunch together for an indefinite amount of time til alice takes the ‘bait’ or whatever, she might change it up after a couple weeks
is it a weekend tho? otherwise, i don’t think ice cream for lunch and having class after would be that great, lactose intolerance aside
@john : at that point your own health stops you ,at elast not for doing it too often
As a slight tangent, it’s interesting that so many specific things got designated as the First Meal Food by absolute freaks. Like the corn flakes guy being obsessed with how often schoolboys were jacking off, to the point he decided to dictate from on high what an appropriate breakfast food was. And why’s it always breakfast they go after? Is it because people are often groggy when they first wake up, so they’re a little more suggestible and likely to say “Huh? Uh, sure, I’ll eat that first, seems reasonable.”??
It’s a random gravatar, but I “chose” it in so far as I changed the capitalization in my email until I got one I decided I’d liked, and Fuckface is a vibe.
My wife is this level of picky eater. We got her out of ‘chicken fingers only’ territory a long time ago but it takes a desire for change from the person and a huge respect that texture really really matters to some people a lot more than taste in many regards. But man I am getting flashbacks from this convo lmao.
Also I’ve seen a lot of talk in the comments yesterday and today about how this is related to autism. While many in the community who are have voiced that it is a shared experience and I definitely respect that I’d also like to point out that it isn’t just that. My wife definitely isn’t. Some people are just built different.
I’d even go as far as to call it normal, just not shared as a common thing in American culture. I’ve found that texture sensitivity comes up a lot more in the people I know from East Asian food cultures. It differs from culture to culture, but I’ve definitely experienced ‘texture as the main focus’ more there. It’s helped me help my wife a lot honestly.
bang on correct. P much anything that CAN be a symptom of A Specific Named Issue, is also something probably everyone experiences. Someone doesn’t need a diagnosable anxiety issue to experience a panic attack, neither.
in this way, we can all relate to one another, which I think is beautiful, even if I wish i could maybe eat something besides one very specific sandwich soon.
This is a little bit why I made a point yesterday of saying that I stand in solidarity with all picky eaters and in whatever the opposite of solidarity is with the type of person who insists on surprising people with unannounced food substitutions, or waitstaff who mess with people’s orders.
Maybe it’s an ND brain thing (which includes more than just autistic people), maybe it’s an allergy thing, maybe it’s an autoimmune disease thing (celiac disease is not an allergy!), maybe it’s a blood sugar thing, maybe it’s a religious thing — maybe it’s just their preference! But whatever it is, it isn’t hurting you, and you should leave other people’s food alone unless they specifically ask for help getting past an “I don’t eat that” rule.
This should be a basic bodily autonomy thing and it should be respected, full stop.
It’s not clear that Joyce’s is as simple as a texture issue.
Her big thing is different foods mixing, where “different foods” seems to be a matter of perception. Sauces might be partly a texture thing, but it’s also whether she’s thinking of them as a separate sauce on top of a different food.
Like mac+cheese is her favorite. That’s really pasta in a cheese sauce (obviously not red, like she states here), but it’s okay because she thinks of it as one thing “mac+cheese”.
I don’t like this “if you don’t eat spicy food at all times you are boring” thing the internet has developed, but I guess it’s a symptom of the larger “pick a hill and die on it” thing social media has inculcated in people.
I particularly hate it because I have an actual medical issue where spicy food REALLY doesn’t like me. I’ll push it a little here and there, because I do like the taste, but any serious heat and I’m at risk of my stomach deciding that everything needs to leave via the input port ASAP.
But because I’m white as hell, well, just another white guy who can’t handle any spice lol. *seethe*
if I understand correctly its kinda the evolution of “British people colonized half the world for spices, and yet their food is still bland and shitty” combined with pushback against “spicy food is ~exotic~ and *foreign* and therefore Bad in comparison to a good wholesome All American tub of mayonnaise”
somewhere along the line people starting equating eating spiced food to being progressive or having a more evolved palate, which is uh, very much not true
That’s very silly indeed, exoticism over spices and the claim only an evolved palate can enjoy them isn’t a recent thing, it’s been going on in Europe for over 2000 years and it was never an ethnicity thing, it was a rich vs poor thing!
Medieval recipes for nobility in particular are super jacked up on spices and amusing also a texture thing, they smushed and squished and pureed food a LOT.
It’s hardly been consistent over that time, though… yes, Medieval times in Europe were like that with spices, but then there were a few hundred years when spices started becoming more affordable and so using spices became a poor person thing as the rich redefined what made food elite.
But then it became an ethnicity thing after colonialism as, rather than importing spices to use on your native foods, Europeans interacted with foreign cuisines directly. Either abroad in the colonial empires or later with immigrants.
In the US extending as far as exotic cuisines like those of the garlic eating Italians.
Some people really don’t like people they consider “picky eaters”, even if there are actually very good reasons why some people might have trouble eating certain foods, like autistic food issues. I don’t understand why it bothers them so much what other people eat.
Yes. People with food sensitivities? Incurious. Allergies? Incurious. Stomach issues? Autism? Texture issues? Medicine interactions? Trauma? Cultural reasons? Religious restrictions? Poverty? You get the point, I hope.
Eating the same foods over and over is not necessarily a result of never having tried anything else or never wanting to try new things. By contrast, never bothering to figure out or understand why someone might be averse to eating certain foods IS incurious. And unempathetic, because like… who asked for your (the person in the story, not you personally) opinion on someone’s lunch/dinner/etc?
It’s so very okay to just keep that shit to yourself.
I SOOO feel this, I hate putting up with this kind of ableist bullshit towards my music and media and other preferences from relatives who just wouldn’t get off my fucking back about it :/
try to get affluent allistic white folk to stop conflating allyship with unsolicited “””helping”””” Challenge Level: IMPOSSIBLE
If you’re giving yourself a legal obligation to say that, then sure, but it’s beside the point. Being upset or bothered by somebody’s food preferences is incurious because you don’t care why they’re not eating what you want them to eat. It’s insecure because you’re treating that as a problem you need to solve instead of something that will never affect your life. The frequent anger and mockery from “omfg ur so picky” types is nothing short of a control issue, and I’d go as far as saying it’s a fear response.
You put it so well. This is exactly why I have zero patience for this type of arguments. Plus the point a friend of mine made, that these are also often used in order to “concern troll” fat people, acting like they are just worried for their health when that is none of their damn business.
I dunno if Willis was thinking of this as they wrote Jennifer’s dialogue here, but she’s half-Chinese, and a lot of folks with Asian heritage (South Asian or East Asian) do grow up being forced to deal with white people telling them the lunches they bring from home stink, which is a negative reaction to unfamiliar spices.
Again: not sure if that was Willis’s intent, but. While I fully agree that no one should be looked down on for having a lower spice tolerance, there are definitely also reasons why some folks have become kinda determinedly proud of spicy food, too.
I actually have something of a funny story related to this; so I’m a very white person, and tend to be sensitive to hot spices. I made chicken tikka masala for my dad and I and my friend, knowing my sensitivity to spiciness, warned me ahead of time that 1) the kitchen was going to smell of spices for a while and 2) that the dish could be too spicy for me. And in the end I actually both loved the spice smell and adored the chicken tikka masala taste! I need to remake that sometime, it was great.
Also I think good on your friend for warning you. It’s not a bad smell, just a very distinct strong smell, and I can imagine it being a sensory issue when it’s your own kitchen
It was a very fun cooking experience! <3 the only downside is I tried to make homemade naan and it did not… work out well. Came out more like extra thick pancakes. Alas, when you need a tandoor oven and only have a skillet…!
They say cooking is an art but baking is a science. V v precise measurements of ingredients and very specific tools and very specific timings on all of it.
I mean, the parent in question doesn’t have to have personally cooked the meal for it to still be the type of food she grew up with and took to school.
If no, I would think more likely because the Billingsworths are more assimilationist, than because they’re uninvolved parents.
I have some food sensitivity issues (mainly nut-related, not allergic or anything, just really don’t like surprise crunchy stuff in generally soft things, like nuts in a brownie), but the extent of Joyce’s deal here is… baffling to me, honestly.
Okay, so she wants uniformly smooth and thick sauces. That I get, some texture isn’t a terrible thing but to each their own, texture is a kinda important aspect of taste…….. but why red? How does the color of sauce at all matter when its in your dang mouth?
I’m just not sure how much of this is “Joyce has unavoidable issues with regards to a bunch of different foods” and how much is “Joyce refuses to be pushed out of this comfort zone for a wide variety of potential reasons, and no one’s really willing to give her a push on it anymore”.
I have not tried chicken Alfredo in 40+ years and I probably won’t for another 40 simply because I felt all pasta should have red sauce.
I HAVE tried Alfredo sauce on pizza before: it was ok.
So, for me, it’s not the sauce itself, but just making no effort/having no desire to break the food rules I formed as a child (some of the rules, anyway).
Some people have aversions to different colored food. My youngest kid visually can’t tolerate purple vegetables and will gag if trying to eat them. It’s not something that can be helped.
i’ve never been fond of nuts too often either, my parents by peanuts but i find them too dry, i like pistachios and cashews if a bit dry but i suppose pistachios are a bit better mixed in ice cream or like as a macaron flavor
Red sauce is what her brain decided it likes, and trying to eat something else probably makes her brain think shes trying to eat poison. Food aversion is tied up in our brain meats with like. Instinctual aversion to Food You Should Never Eat. And sometimes that gets tied up in some specific food being ‘safe’.
It’s not da same thing as ‘just Not Wanting to Try new Things’; the brain aint separate from the body. It’s like how some folks can’t eat something again if it ever gave them food poisoning even Once.
For me I have times where i can’t eat almost Anything, and times when I can decide to go ‘ok i dont like X thing for Y reason but I wanna give it a shot’. So long as folks can eat Something it’s fine.
I experienced a (thankfully short-term) version of your middle paragraph after I had some foods (bagels in one case, sliced deli meat in another) that went bad unexpectedly fast. Both came back up within an hour, and I found myself very skittish about having either again for a couple of months, even though I’d had both many times before (and since) without incident.
This. I’m a decidedly not-picky eater and enjoy (or at least can eat) pretty much everything, except lychee – ever since I got drunk – and sick – on lychee liquor 25 years ago. The mere smell of lychee disguts me even today.
And why exactly does it matter if she is in her confort zone when it comes to freaking food? Eating is supposed to be comforting! Why would she need to e pushed out of it? Just because it is “baffling” to you doesn’t mean it is a problem that need to be fixed.
I would say I agree with Joyce except for the red thing, but I’m genuinely struggling to think of many sauces that don’t have a uniform texture. I guess there’s salsa, which would make sense with one of the places Joyce passed over being (seemingly) a Mexican place. But I think of Asian food as mostly having smooth sauces (albeit typically over fairly textured contents.)
i mean idk if it’s possible but surely some kinda ‘clear’ sauce exists out there but at that point it might be olive oil/salad dressing or so?
or soy sauce, i know that’s not rly spicy or ketchup-y but i know that’s part of what makes fried rice slightly brown, unless joyce is also a white-rice only kinda person, i like rice too tho even as an asian i dont’ think i’d ever have it on its own/wo meat. even in onigiri and triangle kimbap (korean equivalent but seaweed instead of plum filling) i’d also p refer it heated up versus room temp but i guess as a snack it’s meant to be eaten at room temp/on a picnic or so versus too freshly made
or like melted butter in noodles , can’t rly go wrong with butter, artery clog aside (have we ever seen joyce eat cup ramen? surprised we wouldn’t have at least seen amber/walky have it versus them actually getting proper meals in the cafeteria as well)
@yumi : maybe she can be blind folded and have joe spoon feed her something as a couple bonding thing 8D; (insert dirty joke about her being less picky about sauces after she’s been exposed/ has the taste of sperm as a reference /brick’d)
She already knows what sperm tastes like, we’ve been told this before. Did you forget the strips where she talks about taking communion, with the grape juice and all?
I did think about how it’d go if she tried to eat different sauces when she couldn’t see them, but then, she might get freaked out about eating things she couldn’t see… which, fair.
we know she can make mac at least, tho other than growing up with the taste i’d expect the ‘artificial’ taste of the melted cheese to taste weird to her
nice name by the way, is it a ref to the utaite/singer or more “much ado about nothing’ lol
I’m not a fan of most sauces either. For some, it’s taste (I’m not fond of tomatoes, let alone tomato sauces, and I find bbq sauce to be an unpleasant and overpowering taste), for others, texture. In general, if the sauce is applied after cooking, I won’t touch it (save for heated sauces like cheese sauce, gravies, etc). If the food is cooked in it, I’ll give it a go unless I really dislike the taste (i can tolerate most tomato based pasta sauces, but i prefer creamy. Preferably with garlic)
Fun fact: a lot of autistic folks will seek out very stimulating food! Hotness, vinegar, or lactic sugars (milk) are all very common things for folks to lean on a bit. Me I drink milk every literal day, have drunk a raw shot of vinegar, and am the babiest person about spice you’ll ever meet.
Part of why I’m not an especially picky eater is a love of textures. If I can get a big variety of them in a meal, I’ll aim for that every single time. A plate with poultry, seafood, vegetables, rice, and cheese is one of the best things in the world, intestinal consequences be damned.
That texture thing extends to all of my senses, honestly. Having multiple things going on at once actually helps me focus, because I can still understand more or less any circumstances.
I like cider vinegar on fries, but getting over the smell took some doing. (I hate the smell of distilled white vinegar, so I rarely – if ever – use it for cleaning. It gets relegated to “rust removal outside” duty so it doesn’t stink up the house.)
ADHD, ASD, and AuDHD run rampant on both sides of my family (plus some other diagnoses beyond the#usualsuspects for flair and panache.) So!
One of my ASD cousins is exactly like Joyce here. Kiddo is a supertester and on his case this means he stays close to the safety of chicken and rice, smothered in ketchup for every meal he can get away with it. Everything is SO MUCH, see. But he also enjoys spice, always (again) as long as color and texture requirements are met.
For fun, though! Consider my AuDHD combo: Supertaster too but my brain sensoryseeks, and my tastebuds yearn for the new, the surprising, the pairings that shouldn’t work and yet. Variety is such an integral part of my relationship with food, knowing my cousin’s style is far more common feels odd sometimes. But hey! Diversity (neural, human, societal) is beautiful! We’ve got space to spare for him and the family-sized ketchup package that lives in our fridge for when he visits.
Anyway this comment was 100% about Autistic peeps having sometimes counterintuitive traits; on how there’s trends of symptoms within the community rather than “here’s your package, we all have the same thing”; and also on how saying “if they’re autistic why do they do xyz?” is answered by “well, they do because it brings them autistic joy.”
Brought to you by Booster, whom I’ll read as autistic until the end of times, even if they learned to “read” people (in a manual – no preinstalled Socialization Skills); as much as by Joyce, whose issues with food are texture-based, and has been exploring her own taste boundaries in the latest storylines. After all, “ASD” stands for “Assorted Symptoms Deluxe” (the “autism is a sundae buffet” model ;3)
My sister is a chicken schnitzel and Caesar salad (or chips or on a wrap but always chicken) devotee. I used to have a similarly closed diet until I went vegan and had to experiment out of necessity (I only went vegan because I couldn’t buy groceries without an ethics-related panic attack and ate nothing but smooth peanut butter sandwiches for a month first). Now I lean towards sensory seeking. If I’m preparing it tends to be having either many colours in one dish (like a stir-fry) or as many separate textures/flavours that can be mixed and matched or eaten in rotation. It brings me immense joy to add a new food or flavour combo to the safe food roster. (I do still go through periods where I need to reinforce the metaphorical walls of my comfort zone and need to call back on safe foods).
(you shall not die on autistic booster hill alone, comrade)
It honestly weirds me out that I chose the hot salsa at Chipotle for the same reason as Joyce. I consciously went through the same reasoning. I also go for “restaurant style” salsa at the grocery store because it’s most likely to have that smooth consistency.
And here I didn’t think it was possible for me to love Joyce more than I already did haha
(It’s a texture thing for me too that turns me off a lot of food. That’s why peanut butter and jam sandwiches are the perfect food for me – it”s impossible for that to have the wrong texture! Unless you get fatty chunks in the smooth peanut butter. Or bits of coagulated strawberry in the jam. Then it becomes gross and inedible. Okay so maybe it’s not perfect but it’s pretty dang close in this world of chaos and hellfire and slimy foods)
She’s the one being insanely rude to her friend who agreed to help her in her entirely selfish goals for no reason. Joyce is literally just sitting there.
I find eating and learning about a variety of foods, especially those from different cultural backgrounds, to be enriching to my life. But that’s because I like them, you know? If eating new food was an unpleasant experience, then I wouldn’t mind missing it. And maybe there’d be stuff I’d miss out on, but if I got joy from consistency and familiarity with my food, then I’d be good.
We hear “let people like things” a lot, but I feel very strongly we should also let people not like things.
I’m sure there are things I’m missing out on by not drinking, by not eating meat, by not liking spicy food or the texture of mushrooms, by not being the sort of person who goes to parties or, really, socialises at all. And I guess I’m just going to miss out on them. I’ll live.
I assure you, you’re missing nothing by not drinking*, and everything you can get from somebody’s pwecious widdle cocktail can be got without the booze. And this is from somebody who does occasionally like to drink and adores a pwecious widdle cocktail on those occasions.
A lot of people that never leave their comfort zone are doing it out of fear of the unknown, not because they know what they like. I think that’s why people are always encouraging others to leave their comfort zone.
You’re definitely not missing out on much by not drinking or eating meat, I can tell you that confidently as a drinker and a meat eater.
On some level it’s just “Here’s this thing that I really like, you should try it because it’s really good.”
But it can cross over into “What’s wrong with you that you don’t like these good things?”
And further complicating things, even if any individual person only once suggests something you’ve already tried and rejected, if that’s a common thing you can wind up having to refuse it over and over again.
Hot sauce hot take: I’ll do any pepper sauce (Cholula is top tier, I put it on everything, Tabasco is a bit overhyped, IMO), and love soy sauce, but anything with tomato in it, I’m right the hell out. Ketchup, BBQ sauce, A-1/Heinz 57 steak sauce, Taco Bell and the like “hot sauce”, &c. — IDK why, but just the smell makes me sick.
It’s the opposite for me regarding those two brands.
I was disappointed when I tried Cholula, expecting a taste more reminiscent of, if I’m being honest, Taco Bell’s hot sauce, but it tasted like regular hot sauce, which is great as all regular hot sauce is tasty and interchangeable to me, but not what I tried them for (this was before I found out Taco Bell sold its own hot sauce since my local Food Lion kept the TB on the international aisle separate from, yet next to, the condiment aisle).
Tabasco, on the other hand, has felt legally distinct (in my head) from hot sauce since the very first taste, though, admittedly, after 20 years, it has begun to feel less special.
Cholula original is my sauce of choice. I buy the big bottle, got one in January and I”m almost out and there’s a week left in March. Same with my jar of cayenne pepper.
Cholula: Good stuff!
Louisiana Hot Sauce: good stuff, but a wee bit too salty.
Sriracha: The old stuff is great; the newer substitute is inferior.
Tabasco: Too thin and vinegary.
No, but that’s what I tell people to avoid the whole “How do you not like pizza?” discussion. I don’t, like, swell up and die if I get too near a tomato, I just REALLY dislike the taste.
Love me some Cholula (when I’m wanting the Spice of the Americas) and Sriracha (the original, thank you, not the travesty that is the more recent recipe change).
I never really liked condiments, give me toppings like diced pickle or tomato, but sauces and stuff never appealed to me. Some condiments work as ingredients, such as mayonnaise or mustard, but I reject Ketchup in ALL forms, anything ketchup touches is tainted and inedible to me.
Reminded of a good gag in Joan of Arcadia where the title character complained that something was “anticlimatic” and got corrected: “Anticlimactic, anticlimatic means you’re… against the weather.”
(inb4 weather and climate aren’t the same thing, I know)
You can tell he genuinely is crazy about her. It’s really nice that Willis spends so much time establishing these characters, because a lot of media would have two scenes of a Joe type character going “I love you!” and that would be the entirety of a romantic arc, instead these kinds of scenes really make you understand why people fall in love, and what that looks like. He’s just nuts about her.
Some plants go to great trouble to make toxins so they won’t be eaten. Then we come along and call them ‘spices’. And wonder why some people are spice intolerant.
I personally don’t care for hot/spicy food unless it also has flavor.
I hate eating things that are just hot and that’s all it can offer.
Like this one store that was near where I used to live sold buckets of chicken wings, and they were relatively hot to me. But the chicken wings themselves were always so tender and juicy, and had such good flavor, that it was worth dealing with the heat.
Same with General Tso’s chicken; I endured the heat. That is, until I learned you can ask to have it made not spicy.
Soups and salsas I’m fine with either chunky or smooth.
I do have a strong aversion to mayonnaise and most things that look like it (sour cream, cream cheese, most white/cream colored sauces). I will not eat cake if it was made with mayonnaise, even though I know it doesn’t tast like mayonnaise (I don’t care if it makes it more moist, I want to shoot the person who thought of that into the sun). It’s like a mental thing, so things that resemble it make me nauseous.
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I like my food spicy to the point I put hot sauce and cheese on my pancakes instead of maple syrup, or fruit.
I’m more medium… which is probably mild in most other countries. I’m still building my tolerance though.
I don’t have Joyce’s exact aversion to food, but I do prefer my hot sauce smooth, and not chunky. I don’t mind the ingredients if they’re all liquified in an even manner, but chunky salsa or hot sauce with pieces floating in it makes me lose my appetite.
You just gave me something to try. Hot sauce mixed with syrup on pancakes sounds yummy.
Hot Honey!
mmm
More spice, better. (Until bathroom time 🥲)
I feel like there’s probably a flour-based thing you could be using as a base that would complement the cheese and hot sauce better.
A tortilla, as one example.
I don’t know; the crispiness of the cheese mixed with the softness of the pancake, and the heat and flavor of the hot sauce make for a delicious breakfast. You could do it with a tortilla instead, but the pancake is superior in my opinion.
Crisp cheese? That’s a new one on me. I thought “crisp” meant “makes a noise when you bite it.”
Oh, I assure you, cheese can absolutely reach that point of crispiness. Most people just don’t heat it to that point.
Got it.
Fried cheese is real. Had a friend who did that with brussel sprouts. And I hate brussel sprouts. But would devour that every time.
It’s weird to me that so many people in the world feel confident and totally justified offering up opinions on other people’s food choices. They didn’t say “Hey I eat this on pancakes and it feels not as good as it could be, what else should I try?”
Just let people eat.
It’s weird to me that so many people in the world feel like the internet is a place specially for them to post their own opinions on things but nobody is allowed to respond to them.
“Allowed”?? Lmao who is stopping them? I think it’s shitty, but let’s not be dramatic.
Burritos. Enchiladas. Tortas.
Hey Joyce, let’s try it!”
It’s a little browner in person than ketchup but it mixes well with things because it’s very smooth. And it’s way too hot for me straight but it’s super good mixed into things. This isn’t even a joke recommendation it’s a straight up “hey try this.”
uh guess i broke the formatting lol
anyway it’s crazy hot but still has actually really good flavour, not just hotness.
That’s a really hard balance to reach. I once had blueberry ghost pepper sauce that tasted absolutely awful. It was so overpowering it ruined the flavor of anything you put it on. A lot of hot sauce confuse heat with taste.
exactly! for a long time anything above dave’s insanity sauce was just “how hot can we make it nothing else matters” to my taste buds, and it stayed that way until SeaFire’s Reaper Sauce, which is again too hot for me directly but yummy despite that and mixes into other things really well.
(uh, to be clear I am not affiliated with the maker in any way, i just found it at the farmer’s market one day and like it)
Farmers Markets are great places to get unique hot salsas and sauces.
‘grilled cheese pancakes’ does sound like a good concept, i suppose a hot sauce would def wake you up if you eat it early/a sa breakfast food and not a snack lol
In the netherlands it’s fairly common to have cheese on/in your pancakes (note that they are somewhere between an american pancake and a crepe)
Hot Honey. THATS all I’ll say.
Joyce has odd principles, but she sticks to them.
Not so much a ethical / moral principle, as much as it’s a disgust / revulsion response.
Well that’s dedication.
re: “it should always be red”
heh does mustard just not count as a sauce to her? :o
I think she’s mentioned not liking mustard at some point before, but not sure when this would’ve been so I can’t really find a reference
um….
dammit it ate the link, here
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2023/comic/book-13/04-but-dont-give-yourself-away/unwind/
I stand corrected!
I imagine it doesn’t hit her mind as a sauce.
I know it doesn’t for me.
Ketchup, mustard, mayo, gravy:I just don’t think of them as sauces despite that being what they are.
Though, if it is the same deal with her as it is with me, it’s almost certainly for different reasons.
I’m working out my thought process as I write this, but it’s probably the degree of thickness that has my mind label something as sauce; they need to be thinner than the previously named items (I like my gravy thick).
So spaghetti sauce, hot sauce, soy sauce, tobascoe (sp) sauce, and au ju all count as sauces to me.
Of course, I could just be overthinking it and the reason some strike me as sauces and some don’t is because they were called sauces when they were first introduced to me and the others were not.
Agreed. If it’s able to flow off a spoon without whipping it around, it’s a sauce.
Thus, mustard is not a sauce, while honey *almost* is.
Yes!
You explained it much better.
i mean hot sauce is pretty red but a packet hot sauce might still be a lot for joyce unless it’s on a dish that would mellow out the heat as well. Is chipotle red sauce based on a specific thing? i’ve never been directly, only had like, a side from the takeout m ybro would bring home
there is sweet chili sauce/sriraracha and the like/asian hot sauces but idk if that’d be overwhelming, even if some asian countries (outside of like korea) aren’t as known for super spicy foods compared to like india or mexico, it might be a level or two too much for joyce
Balduk is a black sludge that changes once it hits your hot food into a bright angry red
Maybe “bright yellow, look as much like mustard as possible” is also an acceptable color
Actually, the cheese sauce in Kraft brand mac and cheese is pretty dang yellow too, so this theory might hold up.
Also textural consistency. Kraft cheese powder is highly processed; most store-bought mustards are, too. Joyce doesn’t like the lumpy sauces. Probably not the gritty stuff, either.
Joyce only truly accepts Ketchup, Mustard, and the as-yet-theorical blue condiment that completes the primary color trifecta.
there’s a good chance you’re right, and I’m not sure what to think/feel about that.
Blueberry jam or syrup.
Probably blueberry syrup. Blueberry jam tends to be chunky.
For a while, Kraft was making a blue ketchup. Dunno if it’s still around.
Only if you put in a lot of red food coloring, maybe?
I’ve never seen mustard called a sauce before. Does “sauce” mean “condiment” to you?
Actually, there’s mustard sauce, a sauce that contains mustard but isn’t just mustard.
Condiments are just ‘stuff you add to sandwiches’ aren’t they? Some are sauces, some are diced or sliced vegetables, they can be multiple things.
According to Mirriam-Webster, a condiment is something (such as a seasoning, sauce, garnish, or topping) that is added to food usually after the food is prepared and that enhances or adds to its flavor
Alright, so I’m mostly wrong on the first part, but totally nailed the second! They can absolutely be multiple things. Sauces can be condiments, veggies can be condiments, all sorts of things can be condiments, and still be themselves.
Which means sauces are condiments if they are added to the food later, but not condiments if they’re added during cooking.
Red sauce on top of pasta – condiment
Pasta with red sauce mixed in – not condiment
I think pasta mixed with its sauce would still be a condiment here, because you still add the red sauce after the pasta is fully done cooking?
As opposed to stir-fried pasta. Or like, the red sauce in lasagna.
And still I wouldn’t think of pasta sauce as a condiment? Fair enough if it meets the definition, just not how it registers to me.
Barbecue sauce is one where it can be added near the end of cooking, when I wouldn’t think of it as a condiment, or as a topping or dip after, when I would.
Oh, I agree with you! I think this is a “tomatoes are technically a fruit” thing. It feels wrong emotionally even though it’s technically true haha.
Depends on the definition of prepared. I was thinking more of presentation.
And wouldn’t really think of pasta sauce as a condiment anyway. Maybe disparagingly, if they didn’t give enough?
You actually shouldn’t add it after its fully done cooking because then it becomes overcooked. It should finish cooking in the sauce.
Joyce likes spicy food!
other than like stew or like marinated chicken, i imagine theres other dishes with spices/heat mixed into it where it’s not an outside texture of a sauce vs like bbq ribs or so, but we don’t know what spicy foods she has had in the past. (wonder if she’d freak out at sloppy joes [ther’es an innuendo somewhere in there lol])
Liking spicy food doesn’t mean liking all food if you make it spicy.
It’s not the spiciness that she has a problem with, it’s other things.
And it’s funny because we knew about her food issues and still jumped straight down the “Joyce couldn’t possibly eat hot food” yesterday.
She had a (very) sloppy Joe a few weeks ago. In the dorm kitchenette, even. Made a mess. Sarah was, er, displeased to discover that she had not yet washed her hands.
One the one hand, I love seeing Joe really engage thoughtfully with the things Joyce says. And on the other hand…
Joyce: “I’m not bothered by hotness.”
Joe: “Of course not, you’re dating me!”
… I’m a bit disappointed not to see this too. AITA?
Sounds too narcissistic for my taste.
Then don’t eat it.
Joyce TOLERATES spicy food. She’s just judging it by a different standard.
I mean, at Taco Bell you can totally squeeze “Fire” out of a packet.
Unless they got rid of it or something since the last time I went to a Taco Bell
Taco Bell’s “Fire” sauce is kinda weak honestly.
I mean, what Taco Bell sauce isn’t
I find the new(-ish) Diablo sauce to be actually pretty strong for my personal spice tolerance and I love Fire sauce.
Then again I haven’t tried diablo in a while, they might have tweaked the recipe in the past couple of years.
As a pepperhead, Diablo sauce is definitely in the “wow, this is actually supposed to be spicy” category, which is more than I can say about most fast food “spicy” items. Like, I literally can’t tell the difference between Wendy’s spicy chicken and regular chicken, and Taco Bell’s Mild and Fire sauces have the same amount of perceived spice to me.
Too bad Diablo sauce tastes wretched.
In fairness, 99% of the time I put my own hot sauce on my Taco Bell order. I’ve literally brought a bottle of Valentina into the restaurant, generally the bottle I keep in the driver’s door cupholder of my car (because it’s not really accessible while driving most of the time).
Screw “Fire,” the best sauce is “Diablo.” I would put that on basically all my food(not counting sweet foods which I rarely eat,) if I could buy it at the store.
Does it have real flavor, or does it just burn?
It has real flavor; it is my favorite taco bell sauce because it is spicy, but it still has a good flavor that compliments the burritos.
Interesting. And how would you describe this flavor? I personally tend to gravitate to the smoky or sweetish ones.
If I had to describe the flavor(keep in mind I’m bad at explaining things) I’d say it’s a little smoky, a small bit bitter, and complex in spiciness from the multiple peppers used. When added to burritos, or quesadillas it really works well, and is great when used alongside their nacho cheese.
well now I’m actually tempted to try it. thanks for the notes.
Diablo is definitely the best Taco Bell sauce, yeah.
For when I’m eating Taco Bell, and virtually no other time.
De gustibus non est disputandum.
Frankly, I think Diablo tastes like rancid butthole. If you like it, you can have mine.
I feel like there was a short panel where joyce gave becky an arby’s sauce packet or so
Oddly, I can eat the fire sauce, but I can’t eat their mildest hot sauce. There’s some barely-hot pepper that’s hell on my innards.
Invest in a Vitamix, Joyce. That’ll make any sauce completely uniform.
I wonder what people with sensory issues do if they weren’t exposed to ketchup and other squeezy sauces as a kid. Is ketchup as an adult a revelation, or is it “new thing! Bad!”?
I know someone with sensory issues who despises tomatoes and only barely tolerates ketchup, and he’s from the Midwest. His sauce of choice is mustard, and hot mustard if he can find it.
honey mustard is sooooooo good
which is not really relevant but it’s really good and i’m sad it was kind of a fad and stopped being common
I had honey mustard ruined for me by a roommate, a few years ago. The freak would put so much of it on her chicken nuggets at once, it resembled a goddamn stew or curry, and stunk up the entire house.
hehehhe i can get it, i love mustard a lot more than ketchup lol :9
Actually you’re not off, ketchup for me can be a BAD thing i distinctly Do Not want on food sometimes, and it was rare for me growing up to have in the house. for me the ‘safest’ condiment is actually soy sauce or ume plum vinegar bc we always had it in the house.
Tomatoes are disgusting, so that solves that.
Mustard contains vinegar, which is also disgusting, so that solves that.
I mean, if you are from Chicago, and an adult, then ketchup is definitely bad.
Only on Chicago hot dogs – that’s blasphemy. Of course, you can put just about anything else on them and that’s fine.
I found out recently that the reason that they didn’t like ketchup on hot dogs was because people would use ketchup to cover up the scent of spoiled meat that they were selling, so if you’re meat came with ketchup, it became a tell that they might be serving you bad meat.
Does refusing to eat it as a child count as not being exposed to it?
Because I still refuse to eat anything* with a sauce on it. Solids and liquids should not be mixed! Yes this does mean I don’t eat soups or pastas.
* – Tomato sauce on pizzas in normal amounts is tolerated because I am used to it and it has a different mouth feel due to being tightly sandwiched between the cheese and bread, but when I’m ordering a pizza just for myself I prefer no sauce.
I may have the answer since Nana has been dropping Tism family lore. Poppy Ellis (born end WW2) would ONLY eat vegetables if they were boiled until flavourless and of one consistency. Carrot? Potato? Bean? Lettuce? Must be boiled until all taste and feel the same. No sauce, no spice, just a fucktonne of salt.
I had the blankest childhood in existence. Nana hated every moment of it until he died and now revels in making every kind of vegetable dish imaginable for our Friday family dinners.
(Note: lettuce is somewhat hyperbolic since salads/burgers were okay but then that was strictly lettuce, tomato, cheese)
Rooster Sauce
Read that as “Booster Sauce”, but I don’t want to go there…
Booster Sauce™ uses a closely guarded secret blend of freshly ground cinnamon, apple puree, smoked chili powder, barley flour, honey, and espresso powder. Their family hates it.
Dont buy the Rooster branded (Huy Fong) Siracha, they are scum who tried to screw over the farmers who grew their chilies.
Sadly, yeah. I miss the original stuff.
Underwood Ranch (the former supplier of peppers to Huy Fong) now makes their own sriracha. Supposedly it’s the closest thing to the old school rooster sauce, but I can’t confirm that because I haven’t tried it myself.
I’ve had good luck with Flying Goose brand sriracha.
Yes, Jennifer, the only important criteria of a human being’s value is how closely they conform to your food prejudices.
This but without sarcasm.
And we still don’t know her views of pizza pineapple.
To give boring people heart attacks, put all the pizza ingredients inside the pineapple. Just a whole fruit, with sauce and pepperoni and cheese
Pizza-stuffed pineapple?
…
… Dammit there’s a part of my head that things that would actually be good. I know it wouldn’t be, but my brain isn’t listening.
It’d be a novelty experience at best, I think. Pizza’s a hand food, and having to eat it from a damp fruit seems like it’d just be messy.
Not a bad idea. And flour batter and deep fry that puppy. Slice up and serve with ranch.
you’re taking her pretty literally and seriously
If you squeeze someone face enough, it can drip a solid red.
But not too hard, or you’ll get white and grey as well.
but if you squeeze it a bit less than that, it can regrow hair!
So is she just eating ice cream for lunch, is that whats happening?
It’s not like anyone is going to stop her.
Carol pops out from behind a CFA counter)
Yes, because she’s been extra good today.
This is how the Freshman 15 happens.
… well, this and no PE class.
I’d say more this… PE class you only really needed to do one semester of at my high school (two semesters, but one could be waived for, like, so many things). Took it the summer before freshman year. College meant getting a lot more physical activity just walking everywhere all the time.
Physical activity is right. The way my classes are set up, I have to carry 50lbs (22.7ish kg) of equipment to and from school. I weighed it and everything. A motherfucker could get injured hauling all that.
*blink*
*blink*
what
did you just explain America
PE & sports (not distinguished) compulsory the whole 12 years where I’m from.
Did I just… explain America? No. Did I bring up aas aspect of American education that’s different than what you’re familiar with? Sure.
It ssssounds like eh whatever is asking if this is why Americans are fat.
That is what I thought, but that’d be pretty ridiculous, tbh.
Americans are fat because our culture incentivizes sitting around on your ass eating carbs and drinking sugar all day and mocks any suggestion of portion control. Towns are unwalkable and bike-hostile, we have entire swathes of residential land where there’s barely any fresh or healthy food (food deserts, basically), it’s a lot more than just “durr hurr u didn have PE”
Chicago public schools mandated daily PE all the way through high school. Don’t know if they still do: mass testing displaced a lot of stuff.
The threshold for adulthood is when you realize that you can just eat ice cream for lunch, and no one can stop you.
At least from my college experience, what actually stops you eating Ice Cream for lunch is sleeping through breakfast and losing most of your lactose tolerance because you’re no longer having a bowl of milk with your cereal every morning.
I mean if theyr’e gonna eat lunch together for an indefinite amount of time til alice takes the ‘bait’ or whatever, she might change it up after a couple weeks
is it a weekend tho? otherwise, i don’t think ice cream for lunch and having class after would be that great, lactose intolerance aside
@john : at that point your own health stops you ,at elast not for doing it too often
She has the vigor of youth. Real youth.
If that’s a problem, you are lactose-intolerant.
When you’re an adult you can do that. Eat ice cream for lunch, cold pizza for breakfast, breakfast food for dinner. If you want to, of course.
And always remember, folks: “Breakfast food” is a myth perpetuated by the pork industry!
Tell me more about Big Pork.
It doesn’t smell very good, tbh.
As a slight tangent, it’s interesting that so many specific things got designated as the First Meal Food by absolute freaks. Like the corn flakes guy being obsessed with how often schoolboys were jacking off, to the point he decided to dictate from on high what an appropriate breakfast food was. And why’s it always breakfast they go after? Is it because people are often groggy when they first wake up, so they’re a little more suggestible and likely to say “Huh? Uh, sure, I’ll eat that first, seems reasonable.”??
Big Coffee, Big Egg, and Big Pork colluding in secret boardroom meetings.
Kyulen, ice cream for lunch sounds a bit much, but nothing wrong with the rest of it.
That’s the thing about being an “adult”. Usually no one to stop you from eating whateverthehell you want.
In awe of her tism
Not going to lie, I hope we get a lot more of these folks as a trio, I’m really enjoying it.
Did you choose your avatar or is our iguana friend (not sure if his name is censored like “bongo”) one of the random options?
The latter! His name is Fuckface.
It’s a random gravatar, but I “chose” it in so far as I changed the capitalization in my email until I got one I decided I’d liked, and Fuckface is a vibe.
My wife is this level of picky eater. We got her out of ‘chicken fingers only’ territory a long time ago but it takes a desire for change from the person and a huge respect that texture really really matters to some people a lot more than taste in many regards. But man I am getting flashbacks from this convo lmao.
Also I’ve seen a lot of talk in the comments yesterday and today about how this is related to autism. While many in the community who are have voiced that it is a shared experience and I definitely respect that I’d also like to point out that it isn’t just that. My wife definitely isn’t. Some people are just built different.
I’d even go as far as to call it normal, just not shared as a common thing in American culture. I’ve found that texture sensitivity comes up a lot more in the people I know from East Asian food cultures. It differs from culture to culture, but I’ve definitely experienced ‘texture as the main focus’ more there. It’s helped me help my wife a lot honestly.
My friend’s son had an unusually sensitive gag reflex that made texture a big issue. I’m sure that’s just one reason.
I relate to your son’s friend.
*friend’s son. GDI
This is cool to know. I didn’t know it materially expanded beyond autism this way
bang on correct. P much anything that CAN be a symptom of A Specific Named Issue, is also something probably everyone experiences. Someone doesn’t need a diagnosable anxiety issue to experience a panic attack, neither.
in this way, we can all relate to one another, which I think is beautiful, even if I wish i could maybe eat something besides one very specific sandwich soon.
Must be a pretty big sandwich, a-hyuck
This is a little bit why I made a point yesterday of saying that I stand in solidarity with all picky eaters and in whatever the opposite of solidarity is with the type of person who insists on surprising people with unannounced food substitutions, or waitstaff who mess with people’s orders.
Maybe it’s an ND brain thing (which includes more than just autistic people), maybe it’s an allergy thing, maybe it’s an autoimmune disease thing (celiac disease is not an allergy!), maybe it’s a blood sugar thing, maybe it’s a religious thing — maybe it’s just their preference! But whatever it is, it isn’t hurting you, and you should leave other people’s food alone unless they specifically ask for help getting past an “I don’t eat that” rule.
This should be a basic bodily autonomy thing and it should be respected, full stop.
Why do I always catch you spitting ACTUAL FACTS omg <3
It’s not clear that Joyce’s is as simple as a texture issue.
Her big thing is different foods mixing, where “different foods” seems to be a matter of perception. Sauces might be partly a texture thing, but it’s also whether she’s thinking of them as a separate sauce on top of a different food.
Like mac+cheese is her favorite. That’s really pasta in a cheese sauce (obviously not red, like she states here), but it’s okay because she thinks of it as one thing “mac+cheese”.
Sure. But I wasn’t really talking about Joyce other than that ‘today’s comic gave me flashbacks’.
I don’t like this “if you don’t eat spicy food at all times you are boring” thing the internet has developed, but I guess it’s a symptom of the larger “pick a hill and die on it” thing social media has inculcated in people.
It’s definitely a worthless hill to die on, but at least they’re dying.
I’m prepared to die on the hill that there is no hill someone should be prepared to die on!
We thank you for your sacrifice.
There doesn’t exist a hill I wouldn’t die on. I long for death and I love hills. I will die on even the slightest incline if you ask me to.
(Note: “long for death” part isn’t technically true; this is a text post that has lived rent-free in my head for years.)
You should have definitely charged it rent.
I’m not a landlord.
Same.
I particularly hate it because I have an actual medical issue where spicy food REALLY doesn’t like me. I’ll push it a little here and there, because I do like the taste, but any serious heat and I’m at risk of my stomach deciding that everything needs to leave via the input port ASAP.
But because I’m white as hell, well, just another white guy who can’t handle any spice lol. *seethe*
if I understand correctly its kinda the evolution of “British people colonized half the world for spices, and yet their food is still bland and shitty” combined with pushback against “spicy food is ~exotic~ and *foreign* and therefore Bad in comparison to a good wholesome All American tub of mayonnaise”
somewhere along the line people starting equating eating spiced food to being progressive or having a more evolved palate, which is uh, very much not true
That’s very silly indeed, exoticism over spices and the claim only an evolved palate can enjoy them isn’t a recent thing, it’s been going on in Europe for over 2000 years and it was never an ethnicity thing, it was a rich vs poor thing!
Medieval recipes for nobility in particular are super jacked up on spices and amusing also a texture thing, they smushed and squished and pureed food a LOT.
It’s hardly been consistent over that time, though… yes, Medieval times in Europe were like that with spices, but then there were a few hundred years when spices started becoming more affordable and so using spices became a poor person thing as the rich redefined what made food elite.
But then it became an ethnicity thing after colonialism as, rather than importing spices to use on your native foods, Europeans interacted with foreign cuisines directly. Either abroad in the colonial empires or later with immigrants.
In the US extending as far as exotic cuisines like those of the garlic eating Italians.
I hate it too – let people eat the foods they enjoy.
And on a more jokey level, it’s GOOD you don’t like spicy food because that means there’s more spicy food for ME.
Some people really don’t like people they consider “picky eaters”, even if there are actually very good reasons why some people might have trouble eating certain foods, like autistic food issues. I don’t understand why it bothers them so much what other people eat.
It bothers them because they’re incurious and insecure.
Huh? Surely the person eating the same thing over and over is the incurious one.
Yes. People with food sensitivities? Incurious. Allergies? Incurious. Stomach issues? Autism? Texture issues? Medicine interactions? Trauma? Cultural reasons? Religious restrictions? Poverty? You get the point, I hope.
Eating the same foods over and over is not necessarily a result of never having tried anything else or never wanting to try new things. By contrast, never bothering to figure out or understand why someone might be averse to eating certain foods IS incurious. And unempathetic, because like… who asked for your (the person in the story, not you personally) opinion on someone’s lunch/dinner/etc?
It’s so very okay to just keep that shit to yourself.
I SOOO feel this, I hate putting up with this kind of ableist bullshit towards my music and media and other preferences from relatives who just wouldn’t get off my fucking back about it :/
try to get affluent allistic white folk to stop conflating allyship with unsolicited “””helping”””” Challenge Level: IMPOSSIBLEIf you’re giving yourself a legal obligation to say that, then sure, but it’s beside the point. Being upset or bothered by somebody’s food preferences is incurious because you don’t care why they’re not eating what you want them to eat. It’s insecure because you’re treating that as a problem you need to solve instead of something that will never affect your life. The frequent anger and mockery from “omfg ur so picky” types is nothing short of a control issue, and I’d go as far as saying it’s a fear response.
You put it so well. This is exactly why I have zero patience for this type of arguments. Plus the point a friend of mine made, that these are also often used in order to “concern troll” fat people, acting like they are just worried for their health when that is none of their damn business.
I will say:
I dunno if Willis was thinking of this as they wrote Jennifer’s dialogue here, but she’s half-Chinese, and a lot of folks with Asian heritage (South Asian or East Asian) do grow up being forced to deal with white people telling them the lunches they bring from home stink, which is a negative reaction to unfamiliar spices.
Again: not sure if that was Willis’s intent, but. While I fully agree that no one should be looked down on for having a lower spice tolerance, there are definitely also reasons why some folks have become kinda determinedly proud of spicy food, too.
I actually have something of a funny story related to this; so I’m a very white person, and tend to be sensitive to hot spices. I made chicken tikka masala for my dad and I and my friend, knowing my sensitivity to spiciness, warned me ahead of time that 1) the kitchen was going to smell of spices for a while and 2) that the dish could be too spicy for me. And in the end I actually both loved the spice smell and adored the chicken tikka masala taste! I need to remake that sometime, it was great.
Wholesome!
Also I think good on your friend for warning you. It’s not a bad smell, just a very distinct strong smell, and I can imagine it being a sensory issue when it’s your own kitchen
I agree though, the smell is good
It was a very fun cooking experience! <3 the only downside is I tried to make homemade naan and it did not… work out well. Came out more like extra thick pancakes. Alas, when you need a tandoor oven and only have a skillet…!
Breads are hard… I know how to make a couple Ethiopian dishes, but the attempts I’ve made at injera have been… not good.
They say cooking is an art but baking is a science. V v precise measurements of ingredients and very specific tools and very specific timings on all of it.
My guess would be no, given what we know of Jennifer’s home life and how little her parents were a part of it.
I mean, the parent in question doesn’t have to have personally cooked the meal for it to still be the type of food she grew up with and took to school.
If no, I would think more likely because the Billingsworths are more assimilationist, than because they’re uninvolved parents.
I guess they could have hired an Asian cook?
I’ve got no idea what rich kids with neglectful parents grow up eating.
eyeroll.
THERE’S the ketchup girl
I have some food sensitivity issues (mainly nut-related, not allergic or anything, just really don’t like surprise crunchy stuff in generally soft things, like nuts in a brownie), but the extent of Joyce’s deal here is… baffling to me, honestly.
Okay, so she wants uniformly smooth and thick sauces. That I get, some texture isn’t a terrible thing but to each their own, texture is a kinda important aspect of taste…….. but why red? How does the color of sauce at all matter when its in your dang mouth?
I’m just not sure how much of this is “Joyce has unavoidable issues with regards to a bunch of different foods” and how much is “Joyce refuses to be pushed out of this comfort zone for a wide variety of potential reasons, and no one’s really willing to give her a push on it anymore”.
The color matters before it’s in her mouth, if life experience is any indicator. It’s fine and normal.
Color tells her brain it’s a safe sauce, I’d guess.
Yeah this one i think
Unless she’s a vampire that eats the color red.
I have not tried chicken Alfredo in 40+ years and I probably won’t for another 40 simply because I felt all pasta should have red sauce.
I HAVE tried Alfredo sauce on pizza before: it was ok.
So, for me, it’s not the sauce itself, but just making no effort/having no desire to break the food rules I formed as a child (some of the rules, anyway).
Does mac and cheese count here?
Or does it fall into a different category where it’s not pasta with sauce, but its own separate thing? Which I think is what happens for Joyce.
Mac and cheese is, in fact, its own separate thing.
Some people have aversions to different colored food. My youngest kid visually can’t tolerate purple vegetables and will gag if trying to eat them. It’s not something that can be helped.
i’ve never been fond of nuts too often either, my parents by peanuts but i find them too dry, i like pistachios and cashews if a bit dry but i suppose pistachios are a bit better mixed in ice cream or like as a macaron flavor
Red sauce is what her brain decided it likes, and trying to eat something else probably makes her brain think shes trying to eat poison. Food aversion is tied up in our brain meats with like. Instinctual aversion to Food You Should Never Eat. And sometimes that gets tied up in some specific food being ‘safe’.
It’s not da same thing as ‘just Not Wanting to Try new Things’; the brain aint separate from the body. It’s like how some folks can’t eat something again if it ever gave them food poisoning even Once.
For me I have times where i can’t eat almost Anything, and times when I can decide to go ‘ok i dont like X thing for Y reason but I wanna give it a shot’. So long as folks can eat Something it’s fine.
I experienced a (thankfully short-term) version of your middle paragraph after I had some foods (bagels in one case, sliced deli meat in another) that went bad unexpectedly fast. Both came back up within an hour, and I found myself very skittish about having either again for a couple of months, even though I’d had both many times before (and since) without incident.
This. I’m a decidedly not-picky eater and enjoy (or at least can eat) pretty much everything, except lychee – ever since I got drunk – and sick – on lychee liquor 25 years ago. The mere smell of lychee disguts me even today.
And why exactly does it matter if she is in her confort zone when it comes to freaking food? Eating is supposed to be comforting! Why would she need to e pushed out of it? Just because it is “baffling” to you doesn’t mean it is a problem that need to be fixed.
I would eat fire if I could squeeze it out of a packet. — Joyce
dammmn that’s quotable
Dumbing of Age Book 15: I Would Eat Fire If I Could Squeeze It Out Of A Packet
I would say I agree with Joyce except for the red thing, but I’m genuinely struggling to think of many sauces that don’t have a uniform texture. I guess there’s salsa, which would make sense with one of the places Joyce passed over being (seemingly) a Mexican place. But I think of Asian food as mostly having smooth sauces (albeit typically over fairly textured contents.)
Maybe Joyce could try a serving of just sauce– like, tikka masala (often orange, but I’ve had it pretty close to red) with chicken on the side.
i mean idk if it’s possible but surely some kinda ‘clear’ sauce exists out there but at that point it might be olive oil/salad dressing or so?
or soy sauce, i know that’s not rly spicy or ketchup-y but i know that’s part of what makes fried rice slightly brown, unless joyce is also a white-rice only kinda person, i like rice too tho even as an asian i dont’ think i’d ever have it on its own/wo meat. even in onigiri and triangle kimbap (korean equivalent but seaweed instead of plum filling) i’d also p refer it heated up versus room temp but i guess as a snack it’s meant to be eaten at room temp/on a picnic or so versus too freshly made
or like melted butter in noodles , can’t rly go wrong with butter, artery clog aside (have we ever seen joyce eat cup ramen? surprised we wouldn’t have at least seen amber/walky have it versus them actually getting proper meals in the cafeteria as well)
@yumi : maybe she can be blind folded and have joe spoon feed her something as a couple bonding thing 8D; (insert dirty joke about her being less picky about sauces after she’s been exposed/ has the taste of sperm as a reference /brick’d)
She already knows what sperm tastes like, we’ve been told this before. Did you forget the strips where she talks about taking communion, with the grape juice and all?
The texture is acceptable, but if it’s red then something else is very, very wrong.
*The texture matches her criteria
Yeah, it should be purple. 🤭
I did think about how it’d go if she tried to eat different sauces when she couldn’t see them, but then, she might get freaked out about eating things she couldn’t see… which, fair.
let our girl cook
metaphorically? literally? you decide
we know she can make mac at least, tho other than growing up with the taste i’d expect the ‘artificial’ taste of the melted cheese to taste weird to her
nice name by the way, is it a ref to the utaite/singer or more “much ado about nothing’ lol
the secret hidden third option
https://wikirby.com/wiki/Ado
it is fun to haunt places to where there are three possibilities
I’m not a fan of most sauces either. For some, it’s taste (I’m not fond of tomatoes, let alone tomato sauces, and I find bbq sauce to be an unpleasant and overpowering taste), for others, texture. In general, if the sauce is applied after cooking, I won’t touch it (save for heated sauces like cheese sauce, gravies, etc). If the food is cooked in it, I’ll give it a go unless I really dislike the taste (i can tolerate most tomato based pasta sauces, but i prefer creamy. Preferably with garlic)
I have a hsck you might like. Tzatiki sauce Greek yogurt+garlic, cucumber…) blended with a honey bbq sauce. The result is a lot milder and creamier
The “I don’t know what to say” GIF is probably what Jennifer is feeling right now.
Was trying to link the GIF using the HTML, but I think it just gets eaten by the filter.
I don’t do sauces either unless it’s so ‘in’ the meat that it’s texturally indistinguishable. Much prefer spice rubs.
get her an immersion blender for her birthday
This is pretty much gojuchang, down to the texture and color
I would eat spicy food more often, but I prefer to be able to taste my food without most of the taste being horrible burning.
Fun fact: a lot of autistic folks will seek out very stimulating food! Hotness, vinegar, or lactic sugars (milk) are all very common things for folks to lean on a bit. Me I drink milk every literal day, have drunk a raw shot of vinegar, and am the babiest person about spice you’ll ever meet.
Sensory seeking ’tism in general puts color in my life, istf. Hi5 for the milk and dairy, too!
How was your experience with vinegar?
Part of why I’m not an especially picky eater is a love of textures. If I can get a big variety of them in a meal, I’ll aim for that every single time. A plate with poultry, seafood, vegetables, rice, and cheese is one of the best things in the world, intestinal consequences be damned.
That texture thing extends to all of my senses, honestly. Having multiple things going on at once actually helps me focus, because I can still understand more or less any circumstances.
Stim under*, not “still understand”, wtaf
I like cider vinegar on fries, but getting over the smell took some doing. (I hate the smell of distilled white vinegar, so I rarely – if ever – use it for cleaning. It gets relegated to “rust removal outside” duty so it doesn’t stink up the house.)
Yessssss milk with a little bit of coffee in it!
It took me 44 years to eat my first Mexican food after grade school.
Back then I only ate the taco shell and meat.
Now I am trying CHEESE with my taco shell and meat.
I know!
Adventure!
Also, turns out original Mexican cooking didn’t use cheese. That’s a recent addition.
https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/20190529-where-theres-no-queso-in-quesadilla
Not as if you haven’t given/gotten respect whiplash to anyone else, too.
Panel 4 is Food Theory goldmine
ADHD, ASD, and AuDHD run rampant on both sides of my family (plus some other diagnoses beyond the#usualsuspects for flair and panache.) So!
One of my ASD cousins is exactly like Joyce here. Kiddo is a supertester and on his case this means he stays close to the safety of chicken and rice, smothered in ketchup for every meal he can get away with it. Everything is SO MUCH, see. But he also enjoys spice, always (again) as long as color and texture requirements are met.
For fun, though! Consider my AuDHD combo: Supertaster too but my brain sensoryseeks, and my tastebuds yearn for the new, the surprising, the pairings that shouldn’t work and yet. Variety is such an integral part of my relationship with food, knowing my cousin’s style is far more common feels odd sometimes. But hey! Diversity (neural, human, societal) is beautiful! We’ve got space to spare for him and the family-sized ketchup package that lives in our fridge for when he visits.
Anyway this comment was 100% about Autistic peeps having sometimes counterintuitive traits; on how there’s trends of symptoms within the community rather than “here’s your package, we all have the same thing”; and also on how saying “if they’re autistic why do they do xyz?” is answered by “well, they do because it brings them autistic joy.”
Brought to you by Booster, whom I’ll read as autistic until the end of times, even if they learned to “read” people (in a manual – no preinstalled Socialization Skills); as much as by Joyce, whose issues with food are texture-based, and has been exploring her own taste boundaries in the latest storylines. After all, “ASD” stands for “Assorted Symptoms Deluxe” (the “autism is a sundae buffet” model ;3)My sister is a chicken schnitzel and Caesar salad (or chips or on a wrap but always chicken) devotee. I used to have a similarly closed diet until I went vegan and had to experiment out of necessity (I only went vegan because I couldn’t buy groceries without an ethics-related panic attack and ate nothing but smooth peanut butter sandwiches for a month first). Now I lean towards sensory seeking. If I’m preparing it tends to be having either many colours in one dish (like a stir-fry) or as many separate textures/flavours that can be mixed and matched or eaten in rotation. It brings me immense joy to add a new food or flavour combo to the safe food roster. (I do still go through periods where I need to reinforce the metaphorical walls of my comfort zone and need to call back on safe foods).
(you shall not die on autistic booster hill alone, comrade)This is really sad.
In what way?
Do you know how many hots died to make that sauce?
Many hots died. Also Bothans, but that’s unrelated I promise.
Poor Many Bothans. His sacrifice will be remembered.
Poor Jennifer getting whiplash not knowing if she respects Joyce or not, I assume.
Joyce, sweetie, what the actual fuck are you talking about.
Her food preferences. Hope this helps!
Joyce needs sriracha in her life.
YES! 100%.
She needs one of those “I didn’t know the Scoville scale went that high” hot sauce subscriptions.
The original stuff, not the crappy substitute that came about from their union-busting attempts.
I’ve heard like three stories as to why the recipe/label changed, from “woke” to “union busting”, but as far as I can tell it’s because a business deal with their pepper supplier broke down. https://thebusinessmanual-onemega.com/business-101/case-studies/why-taste-popular-sriracha-sauce-changed-huy-fong-foods-underwood-ranches/
It honestly weirds me out that I chose the hot salsa at Chipotle for the same reason as Joyce. I consciously went through the same reasoning. I also go for “restaurant style” salsa at the grocery store because it’s most likely to have that smooth consistency.
How about putting it through a blender?
And here I didn’t think it was possible for me to love Joyce more than I already did haha
(It’s a texture thing for me too that turns me off a lot of food. That’s why peanut butter and jam sandwiches are the perfect food for me – it”s impossible for that to have the wrong texture! Unless you get fatty chunks in the smooth peanut butter. Or bits of coagulated strawberry in the jam. Then it becomes gross and inedible. Okay so maybe it’s not perfect but it’s pretty dang close in this world of chaos and hellfire and slimy foods)
Weird how not insane Billie seems when just standing next to Joyce
She’s the one being insanely rude to her friend who agreed to help her in her entirely selfish goals for no reason. Joyce is literally just sitting there.
So Joyce avoids alfredo sauce, ranch dressing, mayo, mustard, and aioli because they’re not red, and salsa because it’s not smooth?
You don’t know what you’re missing, kiddo! Learning to push your food boundaries will open up a world of flavor.
You only need all that flavor if the food itself isn’t any good.
We did see a strip where Joyce was examining a hamburger and indicated ketchup and mustard both were acceptable.
I find eating and learning about a variety of foods, especially those from different cultural backgrounds, to be enriching to my life. But that’s because I like them, you know? If eating new food was an unpleasant experience, then I wouldn’t mind missing it. And maybe there’d be stuff I’d miss out on, but if I got joy from consistency and familiarity with my food, then I’d be good.
We hear “let people like things” a lot, but I feel very strongly we should also let people not like things.
I’m sure there are things I’m missing out on by not drinking, by not eating meat, by not liking spicy food or the texture of mushrooms, by not being the sort of person who goes to parties or, really, socialises at all. And I guess I’m just going to miss out on them. I’ll live.
I likemy comfort zone. It’s comfortable.
I assure you, you’re missing nothing by not drinking*, and everything you can get from somebody’s pwecious widdle cocktail can be got without the booze. And this is from somebody who does occasionally like to drink and adores a pwecious widdle cocktail on those occasions.
*I assume alcohol
If you’re not drinking any liquids, that’s a problem, but it’s also remarkable that you’ve made it this far, so good on you.
One could always compensate by eating large amounts of juicy food, like fruit and such. Two might have a harder time.
lol. you don’t have to lie, people can not drink if they don’t want to. No need to go the DARE route.
A lot of people that never leave their comfort zone are doing it out of fear of the unknown, not because they know what they like. I think that’s why people are always encouraging others to leave their comfort zone.
You’re definitely not missing out on much by not drinking or eating meat, I can tell you that confidently as a drinker and a meat eater.
On some level it’s just “Here’s this thing that I really like, you should try it because it’s really good.”
But it can cross over into “What’s wrong with you that you don’t like these good things?”
And further complicating things, even if any individual person only once suggests something you’ve already tried and rejected, if that’s a common thing you can wind up having to refuse it over and over again.
yeah, gets very annoying even when people arent pushy about it.
Hot sauce hot take: I’ll do any pepper sauce (Cholula is top tier, I put it on everything, Tabasco is a bit overhyped, IMO), and love soy sauce, but anything with tomato in it, I’m right the hell out. Ketchup, BBQ sauce, A-1/Heinz 57 steak sauce, Taco Bell and the like “hot sauce”, &c. — IDK why, but just the smell makes me sick.
PERFECT random gravatar there, lol.
It’s the opposite for me regarding those two brands.
I was disappointed when I tried Cholula, expecting a taste more reminiscent of, if I’m being honest, Taco Bell’s hot sauce, but it tasted like regular hot sauce, which is great as all regular hot sauce is tasty and interchangeable to me, but not what I tried them for (this was before I found out Taco Bell sold its own hot sauce since my local Food Lion kept the TB on the international aisle separate from, yet next to, the condiment aisle).
Tabasco, on the other hand, has felt legally distinct (in my head) from hot sauce since the very first taste, though, admittedly, after 20 years, it has begun to feel less special.
Cholula original is my sauce of choice. I buy the big bottle, got one in January and I”m almost out and there’s a week left in March. Same with my jar of cayenne pepper.
Cholula: Good stuff!
Louisiana Hot Sauce: good stuff, but a wee bit too salty.
Sriracha: The old stuff is great; the newer substitute is inferior.
Tabasco: Too thin and vinegary.
Are you just straight up allergic to tomatoes…?
No, but that’s what I tell people to avoid the whole “How do you not like pizza?” discussion. I don’t, like, swell up and die if I get too near a tomato, I just REALLY dislike the taste.
I would sooner ride a unicycle down a ski jump in Oslo than dwell on whether or not I had Jennifer’s respect.
That would probably do it, tbh.
idk, unicycles are for nerd. She might just get whiplash again.
Respect Whiplash – my eponymous debut album
Love me some Cholula (when I’m wanting the Spice of the Americas) and Sriracha (the original, thank you, not the travesty that is the more recent recipe change).
She is the voice of a generation.
The greatest betrayal is going to use tomato sauce and the bottle pissing a clear watery puddle
Thanks this made me gag.
I never really liked condiments, give me toppings like diced pickle or tomato, but sauces and stuff never appealed to me. Some condiments work as ingredients, such as mayonnaise or mustard, but I reject Ketchup in ALL forms, anything ketchup touches is tainted and inedible to me.
this may be the first time Joyce’s neurosis has made me laugh so hard that I got a headache. ~<3
Had to wait for this revelation until after the “Caliente / Spice Road” joke yesterday, so it didn’t undercut it.
Averse, not adverse. These words are commonly mixed up. https://www.vocabulary.com/articles/commonly-confused-words/adverse-averse/
(Or it could be that the joke is that journalist Jennifer is getting this word wrong.)
Reminded of a good gag in Joan of Arcadia where the title character complained that something was “anticlimatic” and got corrected: “Anticlimactic, anticlimatic means you’re… against the weather.”
(inb4 weather and climate aren’t the same thing, I know)
It’s helped lodge the enunciation in my brain!
Hand-waving misspellings is a benefit of all the text being character’s speech/thoughts.
Joyce likes flavor.
She just likes flavors one at a time.
Once again, loving Joe just here to spend more time with and learn about his girl.
You can tell he genuinely is crazy about her. It’s really nice that Willis spends so much time establishing these characters, because a lot of media would have two scenes of a Joe type character going “I love you!” and that would be the entirety of a romantic arc, instead these kinds of scenes really make you understand why people fall in love, and what that looks like. He’s just nuts about her.
Yes! He’s clearly not just humoring her, he’s genuinely interested and engaged, Joyce is his favorite thing and it’s adorable.
Some plants go to great trouble to make toxins so they won’t be eaten. Then we come along and call them ‘spices’. And wonder why some people are spice intolerant.
Why don’t you want to eat this poison designed to keep you from eating it?
Its delicious!
She’s such an odd little critter. I love her.
I personally don’t care for hot/spicy food unless it also has flavor.
I hate eating things that are just hot and that’s all it can offer.
Like this one store that was near where I used to live sold buckets of chicken wings, and they were relatively hot to me. But the chicken wings themselves were always so tender and juicy, and had such good flavor, that it was worth dealing with the heat.
Same with General Tso’s chicken; I endured the heat. That is, until I learned you can ask to have it made not spicy.
Soups and salsas I’m fine with either chunky or smooth.
I do have a strong aversion to mayonnaise and most things that look like it (sour cream, cream cheese, most white/cream colored sauces). I will not eat cake if it was made with mayonnaise, even though I know it doesn’t tast like mayonnaise (I don’t care if it makes it more moist, I want to shoot the person who thought of that into the sun). It’s like a mental thing, so things that resemble it make me nauseous.