I was thinking maybe the originally planned model doesn’t show up and the professor presses Joe into service. Who is so non-plussed he ends up going along with it. Joyce’s head might explode however.
She had to do a quick glance around the room and brace herself in case her grandmother jumped out from somewhere and went “A-HA!” the moment she said sex.
Yes, that’s a little extreme even for Joyce, but she was half expecting Chris Hansen last strip.
Which one – Joyce saying “I’ve taken gender studies – I’m liberal now” or Joe’s remark about “a smoking crater of second-hand embarrassment”? Either one would be great!
i don’t want to start listing genders because if we start listing them then we’re gonna be here all day talking about them, drawing diagrams with straws
They weren’t listing genders, they were listing sexes, you can have a male form, a female form, or both, the currently acceptable term for having both is intersex, it used to be hermaphrodite, if you’re familiar with that, but apparently that’s offensive now? I don’t know why, since when I found out the individual who took it upon themselves to explain decided to be condescending instead of helpful.
There are also rare people with no sex at all. No repro organs, no interest, no evident gender. People seem to oscillate at random between male and female pronouns when speaking of them. I don’t know what they’re called.
As far as I’ve currently seen studying medicine, I don’t think complete absence of sex characteristics is possible. when I searched through the NIH database for conditions associated with the absence of sex characteristics, I couldn’t find whatever condition you are referencing. Any idea what it’s called?
There was a person interviewed on TV some years ago who had no sex characteristics. The person was named Toby. They said they had folds like a woman but no vagina and no internal generative organs. That’s all I know.
Hell of a quote here: “I did not choose to exist. Finding that I exist, I determined it’s a good thing that I exist. I like being who I am. Why should I try to be anybody else?”
Ah cool…. sounds like MRKH syndrome. Granted I don’t watch talkshows… but tonally that sounded more like an interview. Was that really just a daytime talk show?
“sex” is a combination of what genitals you got between your legs, what chromosomes you got, and what your hormones are doing. many people with penises get one set of chromosomes and hormones and are generally regarded as having a “male” sex. many people with vaginas get one set of chromosomes and hormones and are generally regarded as having a “female” sex. if you’re intersex, you don’t have both, you have some sort of combination of hormones, chromosomes, and genitals that are considered atypical, and there are dozens upon hundreds of ways that can manifest. a lotta times you end up with a between-the-legs genital that doesn’t quite conform to what a penis or a vagina typically looks like. we don’t use “hermaphrodite” anymore because that means you have a functioning penis and a functioning vagina, which–last i checked–medical consensus says isn’t a thing that happens to human beings, even intersex ones
what all this means is “sex” is kind of an incoherent way to talk about people. folks you might presume are male might have some slight factor off from the norm, same with folks you might presume are female. bodies can look lots of different ways, and you can’t actually tell just by looking the sum total of a person’s anatomy. so, like, why use it?
and i guess the answer is, as per my joke: there are a fuckton of genders. (gender might actually be biological! everything you think and feel about yourself is a sum total of hormones and chemicals and your brain meats, why should gender be any different?) it’s hard to list all of them. it’s easy to fall back to “sex”, which at a glance seems much easier to reduce to a neat little pile, but is actually, as i’ve explained, messy and complicated
It’s probably rude to say but I feel like this is moreso an issue depending on how charitable the listener is willing to be to the speaker. Like if you’re using the terminology for simplicity’s sake you can usually say “ok I get what they mean by this without requiring them to be incredibly specific about what they’re talking about” Because Sex is nebulous, Gender is literally impossible to understand without asking someone and they might not even know. And then you run the risk of spending whatever time you were gonna spend saying what you were gonna say to now trying to define what EXACTLY you mean and it just sorta makes the conversation switch subjects.
I dunno. I’m receptive but at the same time I do find it a little frustrating to have to broach any topic of the human body super carefully because my ape brain is designed to want to categorize things while socially we want to make so many categories to refer to being that it’s impossible to do the former easily.
To add to this: the current strip depicts Hyde, Joe and Joyce. Just by looking, most people would assume Joyce is female while the other two are male. But… we can’t see their hormones, their chromosomes or their genitals (without looking on Slipshine, at least). Granted, there are some aspects we can see which are usually indicative, but they’re not always reliable.
Two of them have beards, so that tells us something about their current hormone levels – whether self-produced or taken as medicine. That’s probably all, though.
Not necessarily! As a recent (as in sub 1 yr) hrt patient, I can confirm that despite having low t and a nice high intake of e, not only could I still eventually grow a beard but if I had gone without shaving since beginning hormones the facial hair I had beforehand would not have thinned much. You can have female hormone levels and a beard. Most cis women shave their faces as well, btw.
So, do most cis women just also lie about not shaving their faces, then? Because I’ve never met one who’s brought it up even once, even during conversations where it would be relevant. Usually they’ll just say something to the tune of “I’m glad I don’t need to do that”. I just wanna know where you’re getting “most” from.
AFAIK, there are a few ways cis women deal with facial hair, usually by plucking, shaving, or bleaching. Kinda depends on how dark and thick the hair is. Hormone levels (think menopause) can alter this as well over a lifetime.
Oh, I know about all those things (I’m not completely ignorant and oblivious to life, after all), I’m just raising an eyebrow at the use of “most”, when that goes against my own lived experience of cis women basically bragging that they don’t need to worry about face fuzz aside from the occasional eyebrow plucking. Not saying it never happens.
Like, I guess? But I try to steer clear of that whole “women are constantly lying” misogyny trope, so I’ll usually default to just believing what I’m told and assuming the person talking is being truthful. That said, I do understand that there’s about a billion societal bullshitteries that would maybe motivate that sort of lie.
Well, I suppose to say that most shave is not provably correct- but an amount of very light/fine hair on the upper lip to chin region is something you can probably find if you are simply close up enough to a woman to see. It is something that some ladies will conceal due to social pressure, and tbh I would say is rude to ask about or mention in the same way it is rude to ask about or mention a trans woman’s facial hairs. I first noticed it on my mother as a child and have consistently noticed it on cisfem sexual and romantic partners throughout my life. Not universally, but often enough to make my trans ass feel way less dysphoric about having hair in general.
I started on HRT almost 20 years ago, socially transitioned almost 15 years ago, surgically transitioned almost 7 years ago, and tried both laser and electrolysis hair removal for my beard area over a two year period with very little success. I gave up on that a long time ago, and so still just shave. Ironically, considering I was unsuccessful in permanent hair removal, the hair of my beard area has always been light and slow growing, so I only have to shave every 2 or 3 days, and that’s always been true. I tried to grow a beard once very long ago when I was trying to prove to myself and everyone else that I was a man, and failed miserably. So frustrating that permanently removing it has proved impossible.
That was helpful, thank you. I was unaware that hermaphrodite carried the connotation of both genitalia functioning, since I knew that was impossible, but I am not super surprised at that, considering the mythological etymology (when I tried googling it to find out why it’s defunct I instead found references to an incredibly minor deity that’s the child of Hermes and Aphrodite who was just named after both of them and had both of their sexual characteristics, I am uncertain whether this is actually an ancient Greek myth or something made up in modern time since that happens a shocking amount, try looking up the story of Capricorn sometime).
I was *vaguely* aware that intersex is a catchall term for all of the various ways you can have male and female features (I’m including hormones and chromosomes under “features” along with genitals and secondary sexual characteristics) in combination, I’m don’t think my usage of both is necessarily incorrect, but it’s definitely a gross oversimplification, which is something I would have agreed to even before your post. I do think my choice to use “form” wasn’t the best word, but I just couldn’t quite come up with a better one.
I do wonder why we *don’t* have terms for all of the different kinds of intersex, though? Like, I feel like that would be much easier to define and/or categorize all of the various combinations and/or examples since it’s a relatively objective thing we can measure, whereas it kinda makes sense that there wouldn’t be a full taxonomy for gender given how much of that seems to be based upon feeling and introspection and thus potentially infinite (or at least indefinite) in how many possible “genders” there might be. Maybe it’s one of those things where there are so many possible combinations and they are all so rare that each one is like unique so giving names to all of them is pointless?
I feel like I’m about to go on another rant about the inadequacies of category theory again, so I’m gonna cut off my rambling here.
you shouldn’t include hormones in that, especially since we can alter that externally. My hormones don’t match my chromosomes, but I am not intersex, I’m simply trans and on HRT
I’d assume it’s down to something similar to the ‘churn’ you see with stuff like Psychiatric disorders through history. Medical community come up with a name for something, society picks up on it and starts misusing it, typically as an insult. Medical community is forced to come up with a new term so they can continue to discuss the issue in a respectful fashion.
Meanwhile, the people who hold negative opinions of the subjects continue fighting to wrestle currently respectful verbiage away from the common discourse so they can weaponize it to disparage “the other”. And because the wording used to discuss such things constantly changes, the negative types use the effect they’ve caused as “evidence” that “nOnE oF iT iS rEaL bEcAuSe ThEy KeEp ChAnGiNg ThE wOrDs!!1!”. That way they can continue to control the narrative as the world moves on beyond their 19th century comprehension.
Reminds me of the south park bit where Chef discusses the evolution of black slang and how anytime something caught on and white people started using it they had to change it to keep their own version of it, basically going from “I’m in the house.” to “Flibbidy floobidy floop”
Yeah, this is why I’m personally against changing the words because the bigots turned the previously accepted terms into a slur, to me it feels like letting the bigots win, especially in cases where the previous term is more accurately descriptive of the disorder and the new term is inherently insulting, like the mental retardation to intellectual deficiency change. Like, I get that the connotation of the word had changed, but deficient was *already* an insult targeted at that category of people, and retardation means slowed, whereas deficient means lacking, and they aren’t *lacking*, they are just *slower* than most people, if given sufficient resources and time they could eventually learn anything the same as anyone else, the issue is that often those sufficient resources don’t exist and a sufficient amount of time is far beyond a single human lifespan, but that’s a practical limitation, not a personal one. Perhaps they could have done something with “bardus”, which a google search tells me is the ancient Greek word for slow the same way “tardus” is the Latin, I still wouldn’t have liked the change but I would have accepted it.
It is somewhat, but as already mentioned, “hermaphrodite” has a specific meaning that most/all intersex humans are not.
No humans have both sets of fully functioning reproductive systems, however some (few) humans have a fully developed penis and vagina. In which case it wouldn’t be inappropriate to call yourself a hermaphrodite, and some people may do so.
But hermaphrodite =/= all possible intersex combinations, and obviously that intersects immediately with gender. For example, if you are XY, have a vagina, and are androgen insensitive, you will most likely be perceived as and see yourself as a woman. You are indistinguishable from a cis woman unless tested, or, unfortunately, wanting to be pregnant. But she would also be entirely correct to describe herself as intersex: a situation that has no bearing on if they actually turned out to be non-binary or male, except in that he’d get to own the transphobes with the fun fact of being XY. 😛
It’s complicated, man. We don’t need to understand it all, just respect what people want to be called.
It’s particularly amusing when you get organizations named after the current polite term that retain it long after it’s no longer acceptable.
See the UNCF and the NAACP.
I remember an old comic, maybe in Bloom County, highlighting how “people of color” was now preferred and “colored people” was completely unacceptable – despite being semantically equivalent. But words or phrases get used negatively and pick up bad connotations.
I made a similar observation to myself last night in my car, while recalling conversations with my uncle who is from Tanzania. For reference, I am mostly white (I have a touch of Native American lineage on my dad’s side, but not enough to matter in any meaningful way outside of just being interesting), but my mom’s sister married this guy from Tanzania so now he’s my uncle, and was in the category of some of the darkest skin tones I’ve seen until he got old, he’s lightened up a few shades now. Or my memory is wrong, I was little and have only seen him a few times throughout my life since they all lived on the other side of the country.
Anyway, from his perspective as a man from Africa, and particularly as one who maintains dual citizenship in both Tanzania and America, he’s always been weirded out by “African-American” as the term for black people who were born and raised here, many of whom have never even *been* to Africa. He told me that if pressed he would actually pick “colored” as the most accurate descriptor, since they aren’t really “black”, as in the color, but rather various shades of brown, but he understands that there is a lot of negative history there so he mostly just uses black when referring to anyone with that skin tone, but reserves African and it’s derivatives for people like himself who are actually *from* Africa. Unfortunately I have not had the opportunity to speak with him since “people of color” became a thing (afaik that’s a relatively recent term, from the last half-decade or so, at least that’s when I started hearing it), but I imagine he’d both approve of it and be thoroughly amused by it, given my recollections of his attitude.
i mean other than getting feedback, i think it’s a good first step for joyce to observe and self study lol (though i don’t see anything from this panel that’d imply he’s a bad/uncaring teacher/prof brock level of unpleasantness lol)
He’s not mean I just strongly disagree with his teaching approach, especially for beginners or people who need more practice with fundamental anatomy. He just stands around saying “good work” instead inn of instructing on how you could improve. I have yet to see him teach. He’s just praised Malaya an already well developed artist and happily let Mary stagnate.
well i’m sure she’ll probably get feedback from everyone she shows her drawings to, if she’s able to be unflustered if she does draw a nude model as opposed to just a regular classmate, i don’t think this is a super artsy focused school so idk how much budget they’d have to hire a nude model specifically as opposed to someone being chill enough to volunteer
Yeah but that’s super easy to ignore as “well obviously that isn’t applied to *me*”, especially for someone as young (and full of themselves) as Mary. You need to actually speak directly to the student – that’s the only way they’ll learn.
Sure, that’s a good way to get a student to learn. If the student isn’t Mary, who already knows she’s doing everything correctly in every aspect of her life.
He’ll see in her next drawing that she didn’t catch the subtle critique. He might give it in different ways as the semester progresses.
In the very beginning of the most beginner class, it might be important to him that people get a little practice using the materials and having their work seen at all, even if that means hanging out in a comfort zone for a few weeks.
Don’t worry. They can always shred her confidence in group critiques.
I don’t mean to go on a tirade but I really want to know if this guy actually knows anything about drawing or if he’s just some guy hired to babysit the art students. Cause I haven’t seen anything substantial yet.
It’s also a first year class, classes tend to be really big in that year. Good chance you actively can’t give a lot of comprehensive feedback to everyone. I don’t know how art classes are structured but it’s the reason that a lot of math and science classes have TAs to even help with the amount of grading they have to do.
We’ve also only seen him in 3 strips now. This one is basically just “welcome” – nothing about actual teaching. The other two were far more focused on characterization for Mary and Malaya than his teaching style.
Totally. I am partially teasing, it’s genuinely sweet, and I know he has stood up for her before about that, how he’s seen her improve quite a bit, and has faith she’s only going to get better and better.
And that’s why I love them and it’s true love, y’all. He’s in love with her capacity for change, and maybe she can believe in him and convince him of his OWN capacity for change, too.
Is it just me or is Carla the perfect candidate for modeling in this class? Like it would be a magnificent display of her excellence where she is sure to cause discomfort and shame in others while remaining emotionally unscathed, and an actively anti-horny academic space is honestly a good place for an ace person like Carla to feel seen as an organic person, unsexualized and real. Not to mention the trans rep street cred, cause getting a bunch of students to draw a real trans body would do a lot to normalize it … And it would also mean people are seeing pictoral tributes to the glory of her, Carla, the greatest girl ever. She’d be wearing only her roller skates, too.
Plus if Mary is in the class (likely) then not only would it potentially cause Joe and Joyce both some serious awkward identity questioning moments together on their seemingly about to come to a head romantic arc, but it would also potentially cause Mary to have a fucking meltdown so bad that she is expelled and permanently banned from the campus or at least the class for hateful bigotry (hooray!) And for Carla, a Mary meltdown can basically only be hilarious. So… Yeah, that’s my guessarooski slash fanfic lol 😂 but probably things won’t get that complicated. Hell maybe it’ll turn out that nobody but Joe, Joyce, the teacher and the model who should honestly probably not be a student or faculty member shows up, and it’s just full of very obvious sexual tension. It’d be hot if they decide to (completely not hornily) draw each other afterward… And like. Let’s be real, nothing they ensues should even be depicted off of slipshine 😏
Good point, back in the 90s, while I was in grad school, I did a little modeling for university drawing classes. The muscle cramps after a 90 minute class were MURDER, but at least the profs were good about keeping the room warm (tough to do in Austin in the summer—a/c is ubiquitous).
Carla would be interesting, but given her discomfort about the idea of doing roller derby when Sal suggested it, I think that she might have certain hangups still she’s working on. I’d love if she did it, I’m a big fan of hers and would like to see her handle this situation, I just have my doubts.
I am still thinking it’s going to be Jacob, that’d be the biggest grenade to drop in the lap of Joe and Joyce potentially discussing their feelings.
Agreed. Also, while art can be about danger, Carla isn’t particularly dedicated to art, and getting naked (except skates) in a room full of strangers as a transwoman seems legit dangerous. I’d be afraid of getting heckled, or worse, getting hatecrimed after class. Carla would be able to engineer complex revenge, but still, she just doesn’t need the stress.
I did know a transwoman who does naked standup comedy! Talk about radical vulnerability. She’s an amazing person, but even she was probably not doing this while we were in college.
Maybe not yet at this point. I mean, especially since Malaya and Mary are both also in the class? But, it could be something we could see later on if this class continues to be attended by Joyce and Joe, as Carla goes through character development, perhaps?
If Joyce has any lingering feelings towards Jacob, and vice-versa, that’ll likely postpone Joe and Joyce talking, or even just out of shock. I do think Jacob meant it when he felt him and Joyce can’t happen, but time heals wounds. I do think it’ll be interesting in that he is a devout Christian, and Joyce no longer is, and I suspect that while he’d be interested, he also might step aside if/when he realizes what he seemed to likely suspect before, that Joe has fallen for Joyce.
Or else, maybe Joyce would find Jacob attractive still, naturally, but maybe her interest in him is going to be different. We saw her biting her lip after she and Joe touched hands, and I do think part of the draw of Jacob was when she was looking for a Christian partner*. That’s no longer really a factor so much.
*-We’ve seen that it has been something she’s taken into account. I do not recall if she knew Joe was Jewish before the date, but I think even sheltered Joyce would know “Rosenthal” is a Jewish surname, and Joe does make references to his background, so it’s not like he’s hiding it or anything. I think maybe she went because he outright asked her, along with us kind of seeing by now she likes tall, broad-shouldered men like Joe, Jacob, and Ethan, and beyond that, no idea. Maybe she would have thought at that time he’d convert, ironically one of the less likely Joe moves to get laid, given he’s shown disdain for fundamentalist Christian beliefs on multiple occasions.
Back before Joyce was trying to “seduce” Jacob they were talking about relationships. Jacob seemed to express dislike over being treated as a “sex symbol”. That mind-set might keep him from being a nude model.
This is true, though it is worth noting that nude live modeling is honestly not that erotic in practice. It’s for an art class, not an Onlyfans.
Of course, it could be just about anyone else, and maybe not even a known character at all. Sorta just glad it’s not Joe, just since that would have felt too obvious.
Malaya I guess would be another possibility for someone whose presence could be an issue, or maybe Rachel if she assumed Joe was up to something, though those two haven’t really had any interaction in ages, and she seems more hung up on Ruth than Joe in terms of people she has beef with, anyway.
Why would Malaya’s presence be an issue? Her and Joe fucked once, no strings attached and no intent to take it further than that, and then she booted him out of her room before he could even get dressed. Hell, she was barely paying attention to him while he had his dick in her, so I really doubt there’s any sort of adversity if she shows up.
Still think the most likely person is Joe – the model doesn’t show and he gets volunteered.
More likely to be somebody else, but all the other individual choices are less likely.
I know nude modeling for artistic purposes isn’t erotic (and Jacob probably doesn’t have the same fundamentalist hangups that Joyce was stuck with). But I still think him being a nude model would be a bit too far.
I doubt it would be Rachel, but that might make for an interesting plot twist… she’s there to model, sees Joe in class, accuses him of being there for nefarious purposes, and tries to get Joe thrown out. (Which causes Joyce to defend Joe.)
Hahaha he likes her so much.
Y’ever do that thing to your friends where they express exasperation or whatever at your antics, so you drape yourself over them loudly exclaiming YOU KNOOOOOW MEEEEEE!
the best. The. Best.
Oh hey, it’s the guy who didn’t dedicate a long moment to breaking down Mary’s artistic shortcomings when she once again refused to draw anything but an anime boy in a life drawing class, and is therefore a bad teacher from whom nothing can be learned by anybody. Or that’s the prevailing attitude I noticed last time he appeared, at least.
More importantly, Joyce is being adorably awkward in front of her boyfriend, and he’s not abandoning her and cutting all ties like some commenters probably would totally do if they were in that scenario, they swear, so these kooky kids are basically married now.
I’m curious what Joe’s play is, here. He has neither art supplies nor interest in taking this class. Does he say he was walking Joyce to class and then leave? Does he try to actually sit in on the class despite everything? It sounds like Joyce’s “convince the professor I’m not a pervert” goal is achieved, and it is better achieved without this obviously-not-here-for-the-class person associated with her.
he could probably stay if he really wanted to. if he tells the prof he’s there for moral support and as long as he doesn’t cause any disturbances in the class, i think most art profs are cool about it (as long as the models okay with it too of course)
You know, if Joyce was trying to convince the professor she wasn’t some sort of sex weirdo, why doesn’t she just mention the comic she now draws? It would be a pretty decent excuse. “I just started drawing a comic and want to improve the artwork on them” sounds pretty reasonable.
(But then yeah, then the comic wouldn’t be called “DUMBing of age”)
Oh hey finally acknowledgement of the word intersex!!!! I’m glad, now there’s going to be people who know about it.
(Our main human rights concern is ending the intersex genital mutilation that’s performed on babies and small children. (Doctors try to “correct” us into looking standard male/female. This can include sterilization, and can also lead to negative health outcomes and PTSD.)
That whole mutilation problem is extra twisted, because don’t they a lot of the time not even bring it up with the parents, which frequently leads to problems and/or confusion later in life? Y’all need a lot more awareness, understanding, and justice.
Not to undermine this important point, because of course intersex people have my full support, but infant genital mutilation does not stop with them either. In the US, the vast majority of young boy-designated infants are circumcised, in many cases without consulting the parents. It may not be considered nearly as invasive as the more elaborate and horrific surgeries done on intersex newborns, but it is still a horrifyingly broken and violent medical system that impacts their adult sexual functioning but will generally just be seen as the norm or the default, due to the far reaching impact of propaganda spread long ago by abstinence-fetish influencers such as the corn flakes guy, and the graham cracker guy.
IMO, we ought to keep doctors’ hands off our children’s genitals. Full stop. If a religious group such as the one I was born into wants to do their little infant dick surgery for the sake of their belief in some divine covenant, by all means let the mohel keep the tip, but that kind of Alternative Belief-based Medicine should be kept out of our real actual hospitals, where the only reason to slice off foreskin is in the event that there is a real health danger posed by constriction or infection.
The teacher has already understood that Joyce, Mary and Malaya will become the infamous trio of his class. Can’t wait for see their dynamic and how Joe will be involved with them.
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Joyce: “I’m WOKE now”
Prof: “Hi Woke, hi Smoking Crater of Second-Hand Embarrassment, I’m Dad”
And since this is bring-me-to-life drawing, the model we’ll be bringing to life is …
[DRUM ROLL]
MiKE!
Just kidding, it’s really
MaryJacob.I was putting money on the model being Dorothy. To really blow Joyce’s mind about her sexuality. xD
Well, she’s been helping Joyce with everything else about this life drawing class, so why not this too?
I was thinking maybe the originally planned model doesn’t show up and the professor presses Joe into service. Who is so non-plussed he ends up going along with it. Joyce’s head might explode however.
That is…an extremely plausible plot “twist”. 🙂
joyce wanted to call them interhankypanky, didn’t she
She had to do a quick glance around the room and brace herself in case her grandmother jumped out from somewhere and went “A-HA!” the moment she said sex.
Yes, that’s a little extreme even for Joyce, but she was half expecting Chris Hansen last strip.
She’s trying!!! Hooray!!! 😆
Also, devilishly delightful choice for the 13th book title, thank you Willis!!! ✌️😈
Which one – Joyce saying “I’ve taken gender studies – I’m liberal now” or Joe’s remark about “a smoking crater of second-hand embarrassment”? Either one would be great!
Check the alt text
The effects of getting old… I keep forgetting about that.
Dumbing of Age Book 13: I’m a Second-Hand Cra–oh
Biggest clue that Joyce is nervous: the never-ending flood of words.
Joe, you have my respect for not just walking away and standing in a corner Blair Witch style.
Professor: You know this class isn’t all about painting nude forms, right?
Joyce: …what?
*leaves*
I’ve got Nothing To Hyde…
Oddly Appropriate AND Inappropriate at the same time! Same backup singers as Steve Martin’s in Little Shop of Horrors if you can believe it.
But plenty to Jekyll…
Wait, what? xD
i don’t want to start listing genders because if we start listing them then we’re gonna be here all day talking about them, drawing diagrams with straws
They weren’t listing genders, they were listing sexes, you can have a male form, a female form, or both, the currently acceptable term for having both is intersex, it used to be hermaphrodite, if you’re familiar with that, but apparently that’s offensive now? I don’t know why, since when I found out the individual who took it upon themselves to explain decided to be condescending instead of helpful.
There are also rare people with no sex at all. No repro organs, no interest, no evident gender. People seem to oscillate at random between male and female pronouns when speaking of them. I don’t know what they’re called.
Asexu– wait no
(This isn’t intended to be poking fun at ace people, I’m ace; it’s just poking fun at the English language I guess)
I would guess “sexless.”
As far as I’ve currently seen studying medicine, I don’t think complete absence of sex characteristics is possible. when I searched through the NIH database for conditions associated with the absence of sex characteristics, I couldn’t find whatever condition you are referencing. Any idea what it’s called?
There was a person interviewed on TV some years ago who had no sex characteristics. The person was named Toby. They said they had folds like a woman but no vagina and no internal generative organs. That’s all I know.
Got curious and looked that up. (I’m assuming this is it.)
Hell of a quote here: “I did not choose to exist. Finding that I exist, I determined it’s a good thing that I exist. I like being who I am. Why should I try to be anybody else?”
Ah cool…. sounds like MRKH syndrome. Granted I don’t watch talkshows… but tonally that sounded more like an interview. Was that really just a daytime talk show?
alright so let me break it down for you
“sex” is a combination of what genitals you got between your legs, what chromosomes you got, and what your hormones are doing. many people with penises get one set of chromosomes and hormones and are generally regarded as having a “male” sex. many people with vaginas get one set of chromosomes and hormones and are generally regarded as having a “female” sex. if you’re intersex, you don’t have both, you have some sort of combination of hormones, chromosomes, and genitals that are considered atypical, and there are dozens upon hundreds of ways that can manifest. a lotta times you end up with a between-the-legs genital that doesn’t quite conform to what a penis or a vagina typically looks like. we don’t use “hermaphrodite” anymore because that means you have a functioning penis and a functioning vagina, which–last i checked–medical consensus says isn’t a thing that happens to human beings, even intersex ones
what all this means is “sex” is kind of an incoherent way to talk about people. folks you might presume are male might have some slight factor off from the norm, same with folks you might presume are female. bodies can look lots of different ways, and you can’t actually tell just by looking the sum total of a person’s anatomy. so, like, why use it?
and i guess the answer is, as per my joke: there are a fuckton of genders. (gender might actually be biological! everything you think and feel about yourself is a sum total of hormones and chemicals and your brain meats, why should gender be any different?) it’s hard to list all of them. it’s easy to fall back to “sex”, which at a glance seems much easier to reduce to a neat little pile, but is actually, as i’ve explained, messy and complicated
i hope this helped
It’s probably rude to say but I feel like this is moreso an issue depending on how charitable the listener is willing to be to the speaker. Like if you’re using the terminology for simplicity’s sake you can usually say “ok I get what they mean by this without requiring them to be incredibly specific about what they’re talking about” Because Sex is nebulous, Gender is literally impossible to understand without asking someone and they might not even know. And then you run the risk of spending whatever time you were gonna spend saying what you were gonna say to now trying to define what EXACTLY you mean and it just sorta makes the conversation switch subjects.
I dunno. I’m receptive but at the same time I do find it a little frustrating to have to broach any topic of the human body super carefully because my ape brain is designed to want to categorize things while socially we want to make so many categories to refer to being that it’s impossible to do the former easily.
To add to this: the current strip depicts Hyde, Joe and Joyce. Just by looking, most people would assume Joyce is female while the other two are male. But… we can’t see their hormones, their chromosomes or their genitals (without looking on Slipshine, at least). Granted, there are some aspects we can see which are usually indicative, but they’re not always reliable.
Two of them have beards, so that tells us something about their current hormone levels – whether self-produced or taken as medicine. That’s probably all, though.
Not necessarily! As a recent (as in sub 1 yr) hrt patient, I can confirm that despite having low t and a nice high intake of e, not only could I still eventually grow a beard but if I had gone without shaving since beginning hormones the facial hair I had beforehand would not have thinned much. You can have female hormone levels and a beard. Most cis women shave their faces as well, btw.
So, do most cis women just also lie about not shaving their faces, then? Because I’ve never met one who’s brought it up even once, even during conversations where it would be relevant. Usually they’ll just say something to the tune of “I’m glad I don’t need to do that”. I just wanna know where you’re getting “most” from.
It’s not DAILY, but sometimes my peach fuzz is just thick enough I have to get rid of it
People with light hair may be able to have exactly the same amount and not have it be visible except up close
AFAIK, there are a few ways cis women deal with facial hair, usually by plucking, shaving, or bleaching. Kinda depends on how dark and thick the hair is. Hormone levels (think menopause) can alter this as well over a lifetime.
Oh, I know about all those things (I’m not completely ignorant and oblivious to life, after all), I’m just raising an eyebrow at the use of “most”, when that goes against my own lived experience of cis women basically bragging that they don’t need to worry about face fuzz aside from the occasional eyebrow plucking. Not saying it never happens.
I think it’s more common with age. It’s also very much dependent on ethnicity.
Might be very common in some areas and rare in others due to that.
It’s possible that they’re… Lying…?
Like, I guess? But I try to steer clear of that whole “women are constantly lying” misogyny trope, so I’ll usually default to just believing what I’m told and assuming the person talking is being truthful. That said, I do understand that there’s about a billion societal bullshitteries that would maybe motivate that sort of lie.
Well, I suppose to say that most shave is not provably correct- but an amount of very light/fine hair on the upper lip to chin region is something you can probably find if you are simply close up enough to a woman to see. It is something that some ladies will conceal due to social pressure, and tbh I would say is rude to ask about or mention in the same way it is rude to ask about or mention a trans woman’s facial hairs. I first noticed it on my mother as a child and have consistently noticed it on cisfem sexual and romantic partners throughout my life. Not universally, but often enough to make my trans ass feel way less dysphoric about having hair in general.
My sister gets lip hairs that she needs to pluck. I get chin hairs.
I started on HRT almost 20 years ago, socially transitioned almost 15 years ago, surgically transitioned almost 7 years ago, and tried both laser and electrolysis hair removal for my beard area over a two year period with very little success. I gave up on that a long time ago, and so still just shave. Ironically, considering I was unsuccessful in permanent hair removal, the hair of my beard area has always been light and slow growing, so I only have to shave every 2 or 3 days, and that’s always been true. I tried to grow a beard once very long ago when I was trying to prove to myself and everyone else that I was a man, and failed miserably. So frustrating that permanently removing it has proved impossible.
This was very interesting Wack’d, thank you for sharing.
That was helpful, thank you. I was unaware that hermaphrodite carried the connotation of both genitalia functioning, since I knew that was impossible, but I am not super surprised at that, considering the mythological etymology (when I tried googling it to find out why it’s defunct I instead found references to an incredibly minor deity that’s the child of Hermes and Aphrodite who was just named after both of them and had both of their sexual characteristics, I am uncertain whether this is actually an ancient Greek myth or something made up in modern time since that happens a shocking amount, try looking up the story of Capricorn sometime).
I was *vaguely* aware that intersex is a catchall term for all of the various ways you can have male and female features (I’m including hormones and chromosomes under “features” along with genitals and secondary sexual characteristics) in combination, I’m don’t think my usage of both is necessarily incorrect, but it’s definitely a gross oversimplification, which is something I would have agreed to even before your post. I do think my choice to use “form” wasn’t the best word, but I just couldn’t quite come up with a better one.
I do wonder why we *don’t* have terms for all of the different kinds of intersex, though? Like, I feel like that would be much easier to define and/or categorize all of the various combinations and/or examples since it’s a relatively objective thing we can measure, whereas it kinda makes sense that there wouldn’t be a full taxonomy for gender given how much of that seems to be based upon feeling and introspection and thus potentially infinite (or at least indefinite) in how many possible “genders” there might be. Maybe it’s one of those things where there are so many possible combinations and they are all so rare that each one is like unique so giving names to all of them is pointless?
I feel like I’m about to go on another rant about the inadequacies of category theory again, so I’m gonna cut off my rambling here.
you shouldn’t include hormones in that, especially since we can alter that externally. My hormones don’t match my chromosomes, but I am not intersex, I’m simply trans and on HRT
I’d assume it’s down to something similar to the ‘churn’ you see with stuff like Psychiatric disorders through history. Medical community come up with a name for something, society picks up on it and starts misusing it, typically as an insult. Medical community is forced to come up with a new term so they can continue to discuss the issue in a respectful fashion.
Meanwhile, the people who hold negative opinions of the subjects continue fighting to wrestle currently respectful verbiage away from the common discourse so they can weaponize it to disparage “the other”. And because the wording used to discuss such things constantly changes, the negative types use the effect they’ve caused as “evidence” that “nOnE oF iT iS rEaL bEcAuSe ThEy KeEp ChAnGiNg ThE wOrDs!!1!”. That way they can continue to control the narrative as the world moves on beyond their 19th century comprehension.
Aren’t people great? /s
Reminds me of the south park bit where Chef discusses the evolution of black slang and how anytime something caught on and white people started using it they had to change it to keep their own version of it, basically going from “I’m in the house.” to “Flibbidy floobidy floop”
Yeah, this is why I’m personally against changing the words because the bigots turned the previously accepted terms into a slur, to me it feels like letting the bigots win, especially in cases where the previous term is more accurately descriptive of the disorder and the new term is inherently insulting, like the mental retardation to intellectual deficiency change. Like, I get that the connotation of the word had changed, but deficient was *already* an insult targeted at that category of people, and retardation means slowed, whereas deficient means lacking, and they aren’t *lacking*, they are just *slower* than most people, if given sufficient resources and time they could eventually learn anything the same as anyone else, the issue is that often those sufficient resources don’t exist and a sufficient amount of time is far beyond a single human lifespan, but that’s a practical limitation, not a personal one. Perhaps they could have done something with “bardus”, which a google search tells me is the ancient Greek word for slow the same way “tardus” is the Latin, I still wouldn’t have liked the change but I would have accepted it.
It is somewhat, but as already mentioned, “hermaphrodite” has a specific meaning that most/all intersex humans are not.
No humans have both sets of fully functioning reproductive systems, however some (few) humans have a fully developed penis and vagina. In which case it wouldn’t be inappropriate to call yourself a hermaphrodite, and some people may do so.
But hermaphrodite =/= all possible intersex combinations, and obviously that intersects immediately with gender. For example, if you are XY, have a vagina, and are androgen insensitive, you will most likely be perceived as and see yourself as a woman. You are indistinguishable from a cis woman unless tested, or, unfortunately, wanting to be pregnant. But she would also be entirely correct to describe herself as intersex: a situation that has no bearing on if they actually turned out to be non-binary or male, except in that he’d get to own the transphobes with the fun fact of being XY. 😛
It’s complicated, man. We don’t need to understand it all, just respect what people want to be called.
The usual term I see for this is “euphemism treadmill”.
(this was meant as a reply to Greebs et al, above)
It’s particularly amusing when you get organizations named after the current polite term that retain it long after it’s no longer acceptable.
See the UNCF and the NAACP.
I remember an old comic, maybe in Bloom County, highlighting how “people of color” was now preferred and “colored people” was completely unacceptable – despite being semantically equivalent. But words or phrases get used negatively and pick up bad connotations.
I made a similar observation to myself last night in my car, while recalling conversations with my uncle who is from Tanzania. For reference, I am mostly white (I have a touch of Native American lineage on my dad’s side, but not enough to matter in any meaningful way outside of just being interesting), but my mom’s sister married this guy from Tanzania so now he’s my uncle, and was in the category of some of the darkest skin tones I’ve seen until he got old, he’s lightened up a few shades now. Or my memory is wrong, I was little and have only seen him a few times throughout my life since they all lived on the other side of the country.
Anyway, from his perspective as a man from Africa, and particularly as one who maintains dual citizenship in both Tanzania and America, he’s always been weirded out by “African-American” as the term for black people who were born and raised here, many of whom have never even *been* to Africa. He told me that if pressed he would actually pick “colored” as the most accurate descriptor, since they aren’t really “black”, as in the color, but rather various shades of brown, but he understands that there is a lot of negative history there so he mostly just uses black when referring to anyone with that skin tone, but reserves African and it’s derivatives for people like himself who are actually *from* Africa. Unfortunately I have not had the opportunity to speak with him since “people of color” became a thing (afaik that’s a relatively recent term, from the last half-decade or so, at least that’s when I started hearing it), but I imagine he’d both approve of it and be thoroughly amused by it, given my recollections of his attitude.
Dr. Jekyll? Get the barrel.
Joyce has finger guns now.
I should make a twin-stick shooter with Joyce’s finger guns!!!! 🤣
Liberals favor finger-gun control, though
As a proud Liberal I can state emphatically that I have no interest in controlling finger guns.
He’s one of those informal professors that goes by “Dr. Firstname”. His real name is Hyde O’Hare.
Not Hyde Ensikh?
Joyce: “Hello fellow Liberals! All my friends are Heathens!”
Joe: “Take it slow.”
Reference gotten.
Joe’s smoking, alright.
I am totally stealing Joe’s line in the final panel. I too have been a smoking crater of second-hand embarrassment.
relating to joe so much right now
good god joyce how do you do anything without dying of anxiety
She had Becky to be distraction from her anxieties.
She should play more video games! They’re really good for distraction!! ☺️
Especially if she plays the Totally Evil Satanic kind. 😈
Makes Me wonder how she’d react to The Binding of Isaac, pre or post Athiest
I think Joyce would totally fall in love with a game like Animal Crossing.
…Right up until one of the villagers decided to leave or asked her to get rid of another villager.
Stardew Valley then? You can play for years (literally) and not learn jack shit about your neighbors.
Yammering to distract / vent the anxiety.
“I am Joyce’s complete lack of social interaction knowledge and skills, but you can call me Joe.”
“I’m her Emotional Support Pervert”.
Everybody needs one of those, seriously
Is that the new term for “significant other?”
Joyce has ESP?
Aw. Too bad. Joyce ain’t gonna learn shit about drawing from this clown.
Hey does anyone else imagine Professor Hyde sounding like Bob Ross? 😆
No way. Bob Ross actually knows how to teach people.
i mean other than getting feedback, i think it’s a good first step for joyce to observe and self study lol (though i don’t see anything from this panel that’d imply he’s a bad/uncaring teacher/prof brock level of unpleasantness lol)
He’s not mean I just strongly disagree with his teaching approach, especially for beginners or people who need more practice with fundamental anatomy. He just stands around saying “good work” instead inn of instructing on how you could improve. I have yet to see him teach. He’s just praised Malaya an already well developed artist and happily let Mary stagnate.
now to be fair we saw him say about two sentences in a single strip
well i’m sure she’ll probably get feedback from everyone she shows her drawings to, if she’s able to be unflustered if she does draw a nude model as opposed to just a regular classmate, i don’t think this is a super artsy focused school so idk how much budget they’d have to hire a nude model specifically as opposed to someone being chill enough to volunteer
He did give Mary advice. He addressed it to the class entire.
Yeah but that’s super easy to ignore as “well obviously that isn’t applied to *me*”, especially for someone as young (and full of themselves) as Mary. You need to actually speak directly to the student – that’s the only way they’ll learn.
Sure, that’s a good way to get a student to learn. If the student isn’t Mary, who already knows she’s doing everything correctly in every aspect of her life.
He’ll see in her next drawing that she didn’t catch the subtle critique. He might give it in different ways as the semester progresses.
In the very beginning of the most beginner class, it might be important to him that people get a little practice using the materials and having their work seen at all, even if that means hanging out in a comfort zone for a few weeks.
Don’t worry. They can always shred her confidence in group critiques.
You’re right! How dare he tell Joyce to sit anywhere? Who does he think he is?!
Yeah, I am missing something, I guess, nothing has happened yet.
I think they meant that he hasn’t told Mary that her drawing is kinda terrible.
I don’t mean to go on a tirade but I really want to know if this guy actually knows anything about drawing or if he’s just some guy hired to babysit the art students. Cause I haven’t seen anything substantial yet.
It’s also a first year class, classes tend to be really big in that year. Good chance you actively can’t give a lot of comprehensive feedback to everyone. I don’t know how art classes are structured but it’s the reason that a lot of math and science classes have TAs to even help with the amount of grading they have to do.
We’ve also only seen him in 3 strips now. This one is basically just “welcome” – nothing about actual teaching. The other two were far more focused on characterization for Mary and Malaya than his teaching style.
Rude.
“I’m a smoking crater of second hand embarrassment.” Is a golden line.
joe omg same!
That is actually an amazing book title.
It’s also from a panel which would make a pretty decent book cover, with fingerguns Joyce
So many comments deserving of upvotes with no way to upvote.
*upvote*
You know Joe’s really into Joyce in that he’s seen her in the equivalent of this situation multiple times, an he still wants to kiss her.
It’s not just that, it’s that every time he sees it, he wants to kiss her a lil more.
Totally. I am partially teasing, it’s genuinely sweet, and I know he has stood up for her before about that, how he’s seen her improve quite a bit, and has faith she’s only going to get better and better.
And that’s why I love them and it’s true love, y’all. He’s in love with her capacity for change, and maybe she can believe in him and convince him of his OWN capacity for change, too.
Hey, don’t you discourage her! Ka-pew noises are fun as fuck.
Is it just me or is Carla the perfect candidate for modeling in this class? Like it would be a magnificent display of her excellence where she is sure to cause discomfort and shame in others while remaining emotionally unscathed, and an actively anti-horny academic space is honestly a good place for an ace person like Carla to feel seen as an organic person, unsexualized and real. Not to mention the trans rep street cred, cause getting a bunch of students to draw a real trans body would do a lot to normalize it … And it would also mean people are seeing pictoral tributes to the glory of her, Carla, the greatest girl ever. She’d be wearing only her roller skates, too.
Plus if Mary is in the class (likely) then not only would it potentially cause Joe and Joyce both some serious awkward identity questioning moments together on their seemingly about to come to a head romantic arc, but it would also potentially cause Mary to have a fucking meltdown so bad that she is expelled and permanently banned from the campus or at least the class for hateful bigotry (hooray!) And for Carla, a Mary meltdown can basically only be hilarious. So… Yeah, that’s my guessarooski slash fanfic lol 😂 but probably things won’t get that complicated. Hell maybe it’ll turn out that nobody but Joe, Joyce, the teacher and the model who should honestly probably not be a student or faculty member shows up, and it’s just full of very obvious sexual tension. It’d be hot if they decide to (completely not hornily) draw each other afterward… And like. Let’s be real, nothing they ensues should even be depicted off of slipshine 😏
I don’t think Carla has the capacity to sit still for an hour, EVEN IF everyone is paying attention to her.
I would pay to watch that with Carla and Mary (if I had any money)
What did you draw?
-A vision of a self-satisfied blur with cranberry red hair?
-You get an A.
Good point, back in the 90s, while I was in grad school, I did a little modeling for university drawing classes. The muscle cramps after a 90 minute class were MURDER, but at least the profs were good about keeping the room warm (tough to do in Austin in the summer—a/c is ubiquitous).
Carla would be interesting, but given her discomfort about the idea of doing roller derby when Sal suggested it, I think that she might have certain hangups still she’s working on. I’d love if she did it, I’m a big fan of hers and would like to see her handle this situation, I just have my doubts.
I am still thinking it’s going to be Jacob, that’d be the biggest grenade to drop in the lap of Joe and Joyce potentially discussing their feelings.
I don’t think Carla is nearly comfortable/confident enough to do that, despite her pretenses.
Agreed. Also, while art can be about danger, Carla isn’t particularly dedicated to art, and getting naked (except skates) in a room full of strangers as a transwoman seems legit dangerous. I’d be afraid of getting heckled, or worse, getting hatecrimed after class. Carla would be able to engineer complex revenge, but still, she just doesn’t need the stress.
I did know a transwoman who does naked standup comedy! Talk about radical vulnerability. She’s an amazing person, but even she was probably not doing this while we were in college.
Maybe not yet at this point. I mean, especially since Malaya and Mary are both also in the class? But, it could be something we could see later on if this class continues to be attended by Joyce and Joe, as Carla goes through character development, perhaps?
“I’m l-liberal now. … So I shoot finger-guns instead of real guns??”?!?
Woo!! We have a title!!
Joyce, if you’re going to put your foot in your mouth, make it literal. That would at least stop you from saying more words.
I never thought I’d relate to Joe, but BOY do I relate to Joe right now.
Dr. Hyde and Mr. Jekyll.
Dr. Heckyll and Mr. Jive.
die Fremdscham
So far a straight sail from captain Joe, I give it 20 panels before something is figuratively on fire.
Still thinking the model may be Jacob.
If Joyce has any lingering feelings towards Jacob, and vice-versa, that’ll likely postpone Joe and Joyce talking, or even just out of shock. I do think Jacob meant it when he felt him and Joyce can’t happen, but time heals wounds. I do think it’ll be interesting in that he is a devout Christian, and Joyce no longer is, and I suspect that while he’d be interested, he also might step aside if/when he realizes what he seemed to likely suspect before, that Joe has fallen for Joyce.
Or else, maybe Joyce would find Jacob attractive still, naturally, but maybe her interest in him is going to be different. We saw her biting her lip after she and Joe touched hands, and I do think part of the draw of Jacob was when she was looking for a Christian partner*. That’s no longer really a factor so much.
*-We’ve seen that it has been something she’s taken into account. I do not recall if she knew Joe was Jewish before the date, but I think even sheltered Joyce would know “Rosenthal” is a Jewish surname, and Joe does make references to his background, so it’s not like he’s hiding it or anything. I think maybe she went because he outright asked her, along with us kind of seeing by now she likes tall, broad-shouldered men like Joe, Jacob, and Ethan, and beyond that, no idea. Maybe she would have thought at that time he’d convert, ironically one of the less likely Joe moves to get laid, given he’s shown disdain for fundamentalist Christian beliefs on multiple occasions.
Joyce didn’t realise Siegal was Jewish either til Sarah pointed it out to her.
This is true, good point.
Countpoint to Jacob being the model…
Back before Joyce was trying to “seduce” Jacob they were talking about relationships. Jacob seemed to express dislike over being treated as a “sex symbol”. That mind-set might keep him from being a nude model.
This is true, though it is worth noting that nude live modeling is honestly not that erotic in practice. It’s for an art class, not an Onlyfans.
Of course, it could be just about anyone else, and maybe not even a known character at all. Sorta just glad it’s not Joe, just since that would have felt too obvious.
Malaya I guess would be another possibility for someone whose presence could be an issue, or maybe Rachel if she assumed Joe was up to something, though those two haven’t really had any interaction in ages, and she seems more hung up on Ruth than Joe in terms of people she has beef with, anyway.
Why would Malaya’s presence be an issue? Her and Joe fucked once, no strings attached and no intent to take it further than that, and then she booted him out of her room before he could even get dressed. Hell, she was barely paying attention to him while he had his dick in her, so I really doubt there’s any sort of adversity if she shows up.
I don’t know how she would cause a problem but I just have a feeling that she would. Intentionally or unintentionally.
‘Spose Malaya could make a crass remark about Joe’s wang to Joyce, I could see ’em doin’ that.
Still think the most likely person is Joe – the model doesn’t show and he gets volunteered.
More likely to be somebody else, but all the other individual choices are less likely.
I know nude modeling for artistic purposes isn’t erotic (and Jacob probably doesn’t have the same fundamentalist hangups that Joyce was stuck with). But I still think him being a nude model would be a bit too far.
I doubt it would be Rachel, but that might make for an interesting plot twist… she’s there to model, sees Joe in class, accuses him of being there for nefarious purposes, and tries to get Joe thrown out. (Which causes Joyce to defend Joe.)
Oh i thought it was going to be peter. It could just be some random though
Joyce knows Joe is Jewish due to having been specifically told: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/03-men-are-from-beck-women-are-from-clark/clipboard/
Kinda late for Halloween
Hahaha he likes her so much.
Y’ever do that thing to your friends where they express exasperation or whatever at your antics, so you drape yourself over them loudly exclaiming YOU KNOOOOOW MEEEEEE!
the best. The. Best.
The title (is perfect) is all of us. 😛
Is Eric a liberal, then?
I think Eric is a pervert, but the two aren’t necessarily exclusive.
Oh hey, it’s the guy who didn’t dedicate a long moment to breaking down Mary’s artistic shortcomings when she once again refused to draw anything but an anime boy in a life drawing class, and is therefore a bad teacher from whom nothing can be learned by anybody. Or that’s the prevailing attitude I noticed last time he appeared, at least.
More importantly, Joyce is being adorably awkward in front of her boyfriend, and he’s not abandoning her and cutting all ties like some commenters probably would totally do if they were in that scenario, they swear, so these kooky kids are basically married now.
Right there with ya, Joe.
Joe and I are niw one and the same.
NOW WITH AN O DAMMIT STUPID SAUSAGE FINGERS STUPID TINY PHONE.
Hello Hazel. Fancy running into you here.
Cha-Cha? That you?
The state of JoJo: two people in a room full of other people, trying desperately to conceal their inherent horniness for VERY DIFFERENT REASONS
But one who’s still here, Joe!
I’m curious what Joe’s play is, here. He has neither art supplies nor interest in taking this class. Does he say he was walking Joyce to class and then leave? Does he try to actually sit in on the class despite everything? It sounds like Joyce’s “convince the professor I’m not a pervert” goal is achieved, and it is better achieved without this obviously-not-here-for-the-class person associated with her.
he could probably stay if he really wanted to. if he tells the prof he’s there for moral support and as long as he doesn’t cause any disturbances in the class, i think most art profs are cool about it (as long as the models okay with it too of course)
He’s here and available with out the intent to actually draw anything.
He’s absolutely going to get asked to model when the expected model doesn’t show.
man if joe’s still interested after this then you KNOW its real lmao
Just don’t show up at 5pm for Mr. Jekyll’s figure drawing class. Those poses are unsavory.
You know, if Joyce was trying to convince the professor she wasn’t some sort of sex weirdo, why doesn’t she just mention the comic she now draws? It would be a pretty decent excuse. “I just started drawing a comic and want to improve the artwork on them” sounds pretty reasonable.
(But then yeah, then the comic wouldn’t be called “DUMBing of age”)
Same here Joe, same here.
those are liberal finger-guns
Oh hey finally acknowledgement of the word intersex!!!! I’m glad, now there’s going to be people who know about it.
(Our main human rights concern is ending the intersex genital mutilation that’s performed on babies and small children. (Doctors try to “correct” us into looking standard male/female. This can include sterilization, and can also lead to negative health outcomes and PTSD.)
Yesss!
always glad to see intersex acknowledged!!!
There are more than 4000 “biological sexes“, time to spread the word 🙂
That whole mutilation problem is extra twisted, because don’t they a lot of the time not even bring it up with the parents, which frequently leads to problems and/or confusion later in life? Y’all need a lot more awareness, understanding, and justice.
I really wish there was an upvote feature, because this comment deserves to be at the top. 💯 👏👏👏
Thanks! Hopefully it’ll be a thing of the past when I’m old.
Not to undermine this important point, because of course intersex people have my full support, but infant genital mutilation does not stop with them either. In the US, the vast majority of young boy-designated infants are circumcised, in many cases without consulting the parents. It may not be considered nearly as invasive as the more elaborate and horrific surgeries done on intersex newborns, but it is still a horrifyingly broken and violent medical system that impacts their adult sexual functioning but will generally just be seen as the norm or the default, due to the far reaching impact of propaganda spread long ago by abstinence-fetish influencers such as the corn flakes guy, and the graham cracker guy.
IMO, we ought to keep doctors’ hands off our children’s genitals. Full stop. If a religious group such as the one I was born into wants to do their little infant dick surgery for the sake of their belief in some divine covenant, by all means let the mohel keep the tip, but that kind of Alternative Belief-based Medicine should be kept out of our real actual hospitals, where the only reason to slice off foreskin is in the event that there is a real health danger posed by constriction or infection.
She’s l-lesbian now. (Bi, I mean, of course, since no one but her thinks otherwise.)
The teacher has already understood that Joyce, Mary and Malaya will become the infamous trio of his class. Can’t wait for see their dynamic and how Joe will be involved with them.
Is this how JoJo sinks? By Joe just kinda slowly losing his crush?
Remember that he likes her because she keeps trying and someday she’ll be perfect.
Calling it now… model doesn’t show up. Joyce is disappointed, Joe steps up to the plate?
So are we, Joe. So are we.
Urgh woke Joyce is the 2nd most cringe thing in this comic series… 1st place goes to Carla’s narcissism.
Go woke or go broke 😎
I’m not too much practiced at human meme things, tell me, did I do it right?
I think it’s “go woke, go broke” not or.