It comes in a rind. People used to boil it to get the rind to come off, thinking that the boiling also neutralized toxins. In truth, that’s just an old superstition. You can just peel it instead and it’s quite edible. Most people think this is a modern discovery, but the technique was known for centuries before entering popular use. Scholars have found reference to it as far back as the 13th century’s Carmina Burana:
“Oh, for tuna, peel it’s boon, a plate of very edibles…”
Joyce: “Now, while some would say that adding mushroom soup to the tuna is an intelligent way to design a recipe, my new theory holds that the casserole that was more souplike was naturally more likely to be selected by people, and so all tuna casserole became more mushroomy over time. Don’t you agree that makes sense? I tried to explain it to Dina, and she made funny noises.”
That’s the problem. Most people think of the Campbell’s library-paste version and so, understandably, can’t stand it.
Actual mushroom soup, though … Some people denigrate it; I do not hear their words.
The secret, as it were, is that most dishes of that description do not actually render the named ingredient into cream, but merely suspend and cook it in the latter.
(Now, I happen to love mushrooms, but more for me to each their own.)
I hated eggs as a kid but loved French toast, though I’d get upset at the corner of the toast that always had a bit more egg than the rest. My mom told me she found an egg-free French toast recipe, so I happily ate them for years.
I was in my twenties when I realized there was no egg-free French toast recipe.
I honestly think I’d trigger some people posting all the details here. Feel free to email me at high tech artist, but without the spaces at gmail dot com , if you find your curiosity to be to all-consuming.
TBH, I’m not sure I want to read it now. I was hoping for quick carmic retribution story, but it sounds like I’m wandering into “real shit” territory too much for my current mood. I enjoy hearing about people getting what they deserve (probably more than I should), but I also don’t want to make you drag up trauma or deal with how I’d feel about it.
I hope you are doing well and are surrounded by friends and support. Even though it sounds like it was a long time ago, still real.
And I mean as an autistic with serious food aversions and a deeply fucked-up relationship with religion in my preteen years that required atheism to curb the compulsive anxiety rituals there… Like, I GET it, but she is STILL neurotic and odd in ways I go ‘holy shit, Joyce, I have concerns.’
I think she just has weird neuroses due to her upbringing. I had weird food things like that when I was a kid but I grew out of most of them, except my hatred for most vegetables, still have that. Joyce clearly needs more time to grow out of her weird food neuroses, although I doubt she’ll ever be truly adventurous as an eater.
I personally don’t think it’s either. Kids whose parents present a united front naturally see them as a unit, and iirc, hers do. If it’s the food issue, that’s also a I don’t think so as many ppl are like this that aren’t on the spectrum or have other issues. It’s simply a idiosynchacy
If Joyce was such a fussy eater, how did her parents deal with this? I was and my mom made it very very clear that you either eat what is offered or go hungry. To this day I am uncomfortable with people fussing at me over food.
I think her parents mistake was that they only ever presented her with a narrow selection of food which she’s gotten extremely accustomed to. The only food she recognizes as food is the food she grew up eating exactly the way her mom always prepared it….
I mean, if they’re not fans of stuff touching like Joyce it’s really not that hard. If you want to eat something that involves stuff touching, that’s what ingredients are for. Take, for example, beef soup – I can’t eat it without feeling like I’ll be sick because stuff touching is disgusting. I DO like beef, potatoes, carrots, and peas though, so I take my share from the ingredients and that’s my dinner.
Or apparently by presenting it so that it’s all one thing rather than two things touching. I can see the touching thing with stew, but Joyce apparently also has issues with sauces, except not with mac and cheese or now tuna casserole.
Even without the cream of mushroom soup, tuna casserole is still pasta and tuna touching, right? And often peas or some other vegetable, though that varies.
I’ve had it similar because my mom was of that generation, except I have always resented anything that looked like shellfish (especially crabs and shrimps). My parents were always annoyed at how picky I was about it, but I would absolutely throw a tantrum if there were shellfish of some kind on the plate, and it was touching the rest of my food.
Then in my early 20s, we found out that I was allergic to shellfish. So I don’t know if part of it could be something similar for Joyce (I can’t remember if we’ve learned she’s allergic to something specific), but it’s definitely something I can relate to, as someone who would be considered so picky that they would rather go hungry than touch their plate.
I would make it clear that I would rather go hungry than eat mushrooms. Turned out that I am at least “sensitive” and possibly allergic to them. That is, I react to them on the allergy scratch test, but I haven’t had the antibody test to see if it is a true allergy. So I do not know for sure if they just make me feel bad, or if they can kill me.
My refusing to eat mushrooms was different in my mind than my refusing to eat Liver. Liver just smelled and tasted awful, but it wasn’t the existential threat that mushrooms were to me.
Musroms can kill my girlfriend as can bread, most every thing with gluten, fucking Vitamin B…
I sometimes wonder how she made it to today. good thing I’m a cook so as long as I have a list of things she can and cannot eat I can make tasty food for her,
I honestly believe that there are some neurotypical folks who are picky eaters, though in all fairness Joyce does seem to be on the extreme end of pickiness.
I don’t know about all of that. As they present in my family, autistic traits are hypersensitivity and difficulty with social interactions. That is not what Joyce has, though it does appear that she does have an extreme need to have a great deal of control over the aspects of her life, in this case her food.
She has a hard time with change. She also has a difficult time dealing with learning that any belief that she holds might be incorrect. These are traits that autistic people can have, but there are stronger indicators.
The thing about her food is not that she refuses to eat things because they don’t “feel” right like an autistic person might, but rather because the food is made from many different things mixed together. That seems to be a thing that just upsets her tremendously and I imagine that is because she then cannot control everything she is eating as a result.
In-universe, it’s only been a month and a half since she’s questioned literally *anything* about her parents, so of course there’d still be some childhood misconceptions that would survive to the present day.
Meta-wise, two things to keep in mind
1. It’s useful to take it as a point of faith that anything Joyce does or says is directly informed by Willis’ own experiences coming from a functionally and culturally identical upbringing.
2. The…eccentric way Joyce expresses this belief is the collision between the expectations of realism created in part by 1, and the need for every strip to end on some kind of punchline.
I mean, when talking about whether or not Dina is autistic Willis opened up about how he has traits of ASD and knows he’s neurodivergent (I think, it’s been a while) but never got officially diagnosed. Dina is the main avatar for his neurodivergent tendencies but since she’s autobiographical, some may have found themselves in Joyce.
Willis Tweeted one of the last times the ‘autism or severe religious anxiety’ subject came up being like ‘welcome to my life, I’ve got no clue either’, so honestly? No clue.
That said, even if she’s undiagnosed you don’t really treat autism as a whole (because it’s fundamentally a ‘our brains run a different operating system’ sort of thing, points of it are pretty neutral,) so much as you figure out what gives you difficulties and figure out strategies to handle them. (A good example would be Dina getting overwhelmed at the dorm party by seeing all these people but still wanting to be there, so she put a bag over her head and continued. Quirky but effective!)
I mean, I’ve conducted a few desensitization campaigns to some of the more troublesome sensory aspects and YEARS of sensory integration and core strengthening and fine motor skills therapy, but I’m still autistic at the end of the day. (And hell, all of those are IMPROVED but my muscles are still chronically low-toned and my sound tolerance is still different from allistics.)
Anyway, point being: Not sure. Joyce is really outgoing in ways I don’t really associate with autism, but then there were clear rules for being social growing up she could internalize and her awareness in new situations can be… dodgy. We’ve never seen her struggle with eye contact or sensory issues besides the Food Thing, or really do anything stimmy, but again: weird upbringing. (I could far too easily see stimming being trained out of her, ‘quiet hands’-style.) She’s definitely rules-oriented and rigid to levels I recognize in myself, and the way she went suddenly and INTENSELY into Dexter and Monkey Master reads SO MUCH like a special interest. (As does her Biblical knowledge – a lot of fundamentalists aren’t that good with overall scripture familiarity.) Her knowledge of social norms is lacking in ways that could go either way what with her upbringing, but she clearly has a great sense of empathy and GETTING what people need that could suggest hyperempathy (another trait of ours.) I feel safe saying she’s neurodivergent and has been since before the strip started – the overwhelming anxiety and her thing with food that borders on ARFID are pretty clear – but autistic… I go either way.
I don’t know. I feel like that’s an unhealthy way to view your parents but then again I was raised by a single mother so maybe I don’t have the proper context on this one. I kind of have no choice but to see my father as a separate individual.
Well if there was one thing that could break up a marriage, it would probably be having conflicting opinions on the perpetrator of their child’s kidnapping. We don’t know what Carol thinks yet, but she sided with Ross on Becky’s kidnapping so that’s not really a good sign. Although the optimist in me would like to think this incident while maybe not changing her mind would make her soften on her opinions just a bit.
Sarah makes a strong point here, Hank is by far the more understanding of the two and would be a much needed support for Joyce. Although I feel my Gravatar is my best expression for how Sarah feels about learning Joyce’s food neuroses.
Also for anyone who wanted an update/explanation on me bleeding yesterday: I dropped a knife on my foot and was bleeding profusely from there. I was about to take care of it but wanted to comment first. My foot is now wrapped up and no longer bleeding. Thank you all for your concern.
Finally some resolution to the mystery bleeding cliffhanger! It was worth the wait. Can’t wait for another episode..*Wait actually that sounds bad* Uhh…It only lasted one episode I hope but sometimes that’s for the best.
I deduced from your comment that you injured yourself making the comment on your phone because of how you phrased it. I was very glad to read your phone is not extracting you precious bodily fluids.
I’m a bit worried about Joyce as I can’t see this ending with anything short of a divorce and that might break her mind further. But I am also quite intrigued about this concept of a can of mushroom soup in tuna casserole and kind of want to ask for a recipe.
Sounds great, except for the English peas. Substitute in drained green beans and you’ve got yourself a deal. My theory is that people who love green peas are genetically unable to taste them.
I’ve literally never been able to taste the difference. I buy mayo, but I’m fine with either.I feel like I’m in the minoriy there though, everybody seems to have such strong preference for one or the other.
As much as Sarah has a point, I’m guessing that Joyce only letting Hank up wouldn’t be great, either. Because it’s sending a message to Carol that, no, I’m opposed to you. Which puts Hank in an uncomfortable position.
There is also the chance that if she lets Hank in, Carol will use the opportunity to barge in uninvited. (Since screening out one person from a pair is more difficult than screening out both )
Well, yeah, Joyce, they present any sort of discord as a sign of a broken home and good Christians don’t have those. Besides, Hank’s great now, but he DID help teach you some awful shit.
On that note – “Tied together by law and spite” is an excellent phrase and I shall use it at every opportunity.
And I’ve got a similar neuroses to Joyce – with baked goods. Once the cake/muffin/bagel/whatever is baked, it’s no longer a bunch of stuff touching, it’s one New Thing and therefore okay. It’s permafused, sorry, I don’t make the rules.
I get the impression that this kind of effect in kids is evidence of useful parenting for when they’re very young (gotta present a consistent front and all) but represents a failure of communication if they still think this way as adolescents. It shows an inability to smoothly transition to new ways of relating to them as they get older and become increasingly mature and independent interlocutors. It’s kind of tragic for your own children to know you for you so little.
That’s Tuna Mess, not Tuna Casserole. TM is tuna, elbow macaroni, and cream of mushroom soup, TC is a scratch bechamel sauce in place of the cream of mushroom soup. We usually have the TM because easier, making bechamel from scratch is much more of a pain than opening a can of soup and dumping cooked pasta and a can of tuna over it and mixing thoroughly and maybe placing a few slices of cheese over it before putting it in the oven to heat to a uniform temperature.
Bechamel is easy if you just add the milk a bit at a time so you’re never stirring fluid+lumps but always working with a paste. No frantic stirring – just add a tiny splash of milk, mix it in, another small splash, mix it, another modest splash… never more at one time than the paste can absorb, until the paste gets thinner and thinner, and suddenly you’ve got Bechamel sauce.
It’s not *quite* as easy as opening a can, but it’s a lot of fun (goopy mud pies you can eat!) and I’ve never failed since I realized the trick was to keep the mix pasty as long as possible so there could be no such thing as lumps.
This makes tons of sense to me, as while I don’t cook much, it’s essentially the same way I learned to mix milk into cocoa powder to make (non-lumpy) chocolate milk.
This is an interesting consequence to the whole “unified front” parenting theory. As someone who was taught how to lie to the other parent as early as middle school, I was disabused of this notion post haste. (And yes, of course they doubled down on it when I called them out on it during my rebellious teenager years.)
Joyce is bringing back memories of my mother’s cooking, which always makes me throw up a little in my mouth. Y-y-y-up. There it is. Campbell’s soup: the bane of my youth.
I assumed gramps worked the tuna vein, because the cream of mushroom deposits are more difficult to find. Pasta ore is everywhere, that’s why the stuff’s so cheap at the grocery store.
And the LORD spoke unto them, “Do not suffer one food to be eaten with another, for they are made separate and shall be eaten separate. Just like the horse is separate from the grain, so shall you separate the salami from the pizza. But the tuna casserole you shall not separate, for it is one whole that was separated by force for a time.”
– Joyce 6:23-26
(Not a native English speaker, no clue how good my “Bible English” is :x)
One of the trickier parts of growing up is fully realizing and understanding that your parents… are people. We’re pushed into thinking of them as like demigods, and frequently as all-wise, all-knowing, inherently good people.
Because, yeah, Joyce is still a kid, and while she’s grown a lot more aware about how her mother is a pretty significant asshole, she’s still treating her not as her mother Carol, but rather The Mom, part of the Divine Pantheon called The Parents, look upon their works, ye mighty, and despair…
The trick is to have your parents divorce when you are like five, and then refuse to be in the same room together for the next fifteen. You will never not be reminded that parents are (maladjusted) people!
Or, inversely, realize that your messed up, ‘at that point just toxic to each other’ parents actually have some good in them, and now that they’re separate and/or not feeling like they have to stay together for the kids, can actually be chill people.
More so with her upbringing than average, given Joyce said she wasn’t allowed to see Frozen because it promoted the idea that parents can be wrong about what is good for their children.
That sounds so wrong, Joyce. Parents are their own people, Joyce. A mom isn’t the half of a dad, nor a mom to another mom or dad to another dad if we are inclusive. If a parent is abusive, that parent’s abuse is only theirs. Stacy didn’t physically abuse Amber; Becky’s mom didn’t hunt her down with a fire weapon at hand; Joe’s mom doesn’t flirt with younger girls than her (maybe I am wrong about this one).
I hope Joyce unlearns this big mistake to be able to move on and accept taht her mom is completely responsible for her own evil deeds.
That’s all true, but couples are also couples. That means two people in a pair, who share a lot. And especially if they are your parents, you tend to think of them more as a unit.
At least that’s what I think Joyce kinda refers to.
Yeah, but I don’t give a shit about those cultural perceptions. My mom is my mom and my dad is a dad. Joyce is just putting too much thought into that like with teh casserole. Her neuroses may need years of therapy, and not just expecting a fiendly conversation to fix all her problems.
Also, scientifically speaking you can reduce hydrogen and nitroigen to smaller components, but the consequences are dangerous, just like divorce.
Yes parents are individuals and it isn’t always fair to blame one for the actions of another.
But I think context is important… Did one enable/encourage the other? Were they passive?
For example, it’s hard to blame Amber’s mom for Blaine’s abuse because she was apparently a victim too.
On the other hand, at least some of the “programming” Joyce received when growing up was acceptable to both parents.
Oh, she DESPERATELY needs therapy from that fucked-up upbringing. But the ‘Frozen isn’t allowed because it teaches children their parents can be fallible’ upbringing deeeefinitely encouraged this particular terrible viewpoint, so I can see how she hasn’t broken it yet.
Especially since she hasn’t gotten that therapy and PLEASE GOD SOMEONE CONVINCE HER TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL WHO CAN HELP HER UNPACK THIS SHIT!
Well, i never had that problem. My parents divorced when i was 1 year old. Probably due to my half sister who was half a year old and my parents were married for 2 years by then
Joyce is telling us she knows she is wrong about this, right?
I wonder if she already definitely knows that Carol helped bail Toedad or if this is a general reaction.
So, not to be the token “Italian getting mad at food”, but I have serious problems about people considering some broiled tuna slop birthed from cans of unrelated soup as any less unnatural than one springing up from the ground fully formed.
From a cooking point of view, I’m intrigued by this idea of cream of mushroom soup as an ingredient in Tuna Casserole. While I can understand that a can of condensed soup (or otherwise reduced to thicken) could provide a good sauce, I’d have thought that cream of mushroom would be too subtle a flavour and would be overpowered by the tuna. Personally I’d have gone for a low salt french onion soup (freedom onion soup?) instead (though I do admit that would be lacking in the “creaminess” factor).
The mushroom just adds some umami, but not much of the actual mushroom flavor comes through. I tend to use Cream of Bacon soup when I’m feeling too lazy to make it from scratch with a mornay sauce.
I would say that it’s almost all about the quick, easy (cheap) pre-prepared sauce, with whatever flavor contributed by what’s in the cream as somewhere between “bonus” and “afterthought”.
Or cream of broccoli. Took my dad 16 years to realize the way to get me to eat ALL my tuna casserole was to replace the fucking cream of mushrooms with that.
(I hate mushrooms, he’d known this as a fact for the longest time. It took almost as long for him to stop sticking mushrooms in the spaghetti sauce too.)
Two very good alternatives (and I wasn’t aware that “cream of broccoli” was even a thing until now)! I love mushrooms and grow them on a small scale, in fact producing my own milk and cheese is the only thing that stops me making a self sufficient version of my mothers gourmet scrambled eggs (not that I couldn’t, it just wouldn’t be cost effective on the scale of my property).
Disagree.
About the time that the plague kicked off, my favorite kind of spaghetti sauce (a red with olives and mushrooms mixed in) was discontinued. I don’t know if this was due to a supply shock (disruption) from Italy, or pure coincidence and the obscure workings of product marketing; only that I’ve been auditioning various replacements and found them all wanting. It looks like I may need to start getting a good basic marinara (or making my own) and adding olives and mushrooms myself. :p
Let’s Hope Joyce will soon learn that her parents are not the unit she believe and there are cases where splitting couples is the best choice they can make.
Tuna Noodle Casserole (also referred to as Tuna Hot Dish in Garrison Keillor’s tales of Minnesota) is one of many casseroles that employ canned condensed mushroom soup as binder and flavoring. The notorious Green Bean Casserole touted by the producers of the fried onions that it contains, also contains canned condensed mushroom soup.
It’s really nationwide, if you’re old enough to have endured time-saver meals from the 1950’s and ’60’s. Our family’s version was topped with crumbled potato chips. Some have frozen peas stirred in. Once a person learns how to make a basic white sauce from butter and flour cooked together, with milk stirred in, the idea of the condensed soup loses appeal.
I’m a big fan, have been from childhood. (And I’m west coast.)
The best comparison I can offer is (beef) stroganoff, at least in terms of composition/consistency, or chicken casserole if you’ve ever had that; the flavor profile is closer to the latter, though (of course) slightly more “fishy”.
This…explains part of why Joyce has difficulty with relationships, frankly. A couple always trying to act as a unit rather than two individuals isn’t healthy. My parents never really tried to shelter me from them having disagreements. People don’t agree on everything all the time. It’s just…not a thing, and if they claim they do, it’s usually unhealthy
I think that I get what Joyce is saying here and it probably says a bit about her upbringing. It wasn’t as much ‘mommy’ and ‘daddy’ as it was ‘my parents’. The two were always a monolithic block (with other adult authority figures attached too). The downside of this, in terms of her relationships, is that she’s having trouble differentiating what different people want, think and are doing from others because they were all just ‘the adults’ to her.
I’m reminded of the story of when my Mum was a little girl, and her granny made the mistake of telling her how black pudding was made. On seeing her reaction, she then explained that this wasn’t how it was made any more. And Mum believed this, because she wanted to.
And she continued believing it right up until she told the story to my Dad and, struggling to keep a straight face, he asked “So how do they make it, then?”
Marriage starts with the promise of two people to love each other, and ends when one of them breaks that promise. Carol betrayed the trust of her husband and her family, so she has to carry the weight of being the one that destroyed her own family.
there is probably an awesome german word for a severely screwed-up line of reasoning arriving at an excellent conclusion. hank is going to want to know that word, because being rejected on account of association with whatserc* is… remarkably fair.
Joyce: “See, hydrogen is great, but one day I learned there’s a bunch of particles mixed in there, so I decided that what I thought I’d learned was a lie and that hydrogen is birthed fully-formed out of the stars”
No yucky Cream of Mushroom soup in my Tuna Casserole. Just tuna, good old fashioned Kraft Mac & Cheese, and a layer of cheddar on top, broiled to golden brown perfection.
Okay, I love mushrooms, but I can’t say I’ve ever heard of adding ’em to tuna casserole. Why? Like, what does it add to the flavor profile?
You take some pasta, you take some tuna, you take sour cream, poppy seeds, and shredded cheese, you mix ’em all up in a big bowl, pour it into a dish and top it with oregano and then you bake the sucker. It’s delicious and simple.
And today I’ve learned that Tuna Casserole is actually worse than I imagined. (I have Joyce-level food neurosis)
… now I’m picturing the texture clash between soup-mushrooms and tuna… and baked tuna… oh god
I also feel the need to clarify that in literally every single classic midwestern dish (and casserole) in which Cream of Mushroom is a staple, my family always substituted Cream of Chicken because my mom hates mushrooms somehow more than I do so I wasn’t inoculated to the weirdness young enough.
“my comments section is currently discussing whether joyce is autistic or just had a fucked up childhood, and honestly folks when you figure this out please let me know”
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so, when you harvest tuna casserole from the ground, do you wash it off before eating, how does that work
It grows encased in Tupperware, like a giant plastic nut with a tuna center.
Jesus, this is the most cursed thing I’ve read all week. Thank you??
The week is young yet. There are ample opportunities to go oh so much further.
Indeed,
You summon it from the Plane Of Elemental Tuna.
This is a minor plane of resistance which separated out from the realm of modern discordant music on account of them not being able to carry a tuna.
This totally explains the Willisian theory of Mac and cheese.
Excuse me, it’s mac’n’cheese, one word.
FOR. ONE. THING.
I thought it was mackencheese. Those apostrophes make it look like something is missing. I mean, apart from the ‘ke’ that you gratutitously left out.
It comes in a rind. People used to boil it to get the rind to come off, thinking that the boiling also neutralized toxins. In truth, that’s just an old superstition. You can just peel it instead and it’s quite edible. Most people think this is a modern discovery, but the technique was known for centuries before entering popular use. Scholars have found reference to it as far back as the 13th century’s Carmina Burana:
“Oh, for tuna, peel it’s boon, a plate of very edibles…”
+1
oh
my
god
Congratulations! You won the internet today!
Also, the rind is high in pectin. Tuna farmers have been making tuna marmalade for centuries.
You say that, but marmalade is a great as a cooking sauce for tuna.
I. AM. IN. AWE.
What, and strip away like 90% of the nutrients? You just shake off the dirt and it’s ready to heat up.
You mine it, like treacle.
Joyce: “Now, while some would say that adding mushroom soup to the tuna is an intelligent way to design a recipe, my new theory holds that the casserole that was more souplike was naturally more likely to be selected by people, and so all tuna casserole became more mushroomy over time. Don’t you agree that makes sense? I tried to explain it to Dina, and she made funny noises.”
I love this, thank you.
Joyce describing natural selection by accident would be so ironic.
Seems more like artificial selection, but close enough I suppose…
Perhaps if you think tuna casserole is symbiotic with humans?
Now, now Joyce there’s another solution.
It’s called murder.
*DUN DUN DUN DUN*
To a bad marriage between a crazy terrorist and Hank. Not tuna casserole.
FYI – I had the SAME reaction Joyce did to that discovery about my mom’s tuna casserole.
“MUSHROOMS? HISS!”
I had a similar tuna revelation as a kid.
I hated mayonnaise. But I loved tuna fish sandwiches.
Watching my mom actually prepare one was basically like this.
The amount of mushroom in cream of mushroom soup (especially the condensed kind) is so small it must be measured by spectroscopic analysis.
homeopathic mushroom soup?
That’s the problem. Most people think of the Campbell’s library-paste version and so, understandably, can’t stand it.
Actual mushroom soup, though … Some people denigrate it; I do not hear their words.
I, by contrast, love cream of mushroom soup, but can’t stand anything with tuna in it.
Mushrooms are disgusting; I don’t even want to know how they ‘cream of’ the things.
The secret, as it were, is that most dishes of that description do not actually render the named ingredient into cream, but merely suspend and cook it in the latter.
(Now, I happen to love mushrooms, but
more for meto each their own.)You can have all the
dirt flavored fungusearthy mushrooms you want.For what it’s worth, I agree with XKCD on lobster. Quahogs are also nasty, unless they’re minced and deep fried into clamcakes.
https://xkcd.com/1268/
I hated eggs as a kid but loved French toast, though I’d get upset at the corner of the toast that always had a bit more egg than the rest. My mom told me she found an egg-free French toast recipe, so I happily ate them for years.
I was in my twenties when I realized there was no egg-free French toast recipe.
You simply toast a slice of bread and serve it rudely.
Killin’ me, Smalls.
^
I’m more than twice her age, and still have trouble not thinking of my parents as a single unit.
What really helped me separate the two in my mind was them getting a divorce and then my dad dying from being too much of an asshole.
I don’t want to step on your misfortune, but how does one die from being too much of an asshole?
umm… asking for a friend?
I honestly think I’d trigger some people posting all the details here. Feel free to email me at high tech artist, but without the spaces at gmail dot com , if you find your curiosity to be to all-consuming.
TBH, I’m not sure I want to read it now. I was hoping for quick carmic retribution story, but it sounds like I’m wandering into “real shit” territory too much for my current mood. I enjoy hearing about people getting what they deserve (probably more than I should), but I also don’t want to make you drag up trauma or deal with how I’d feel about it.
I hope you are doing well and are surrounded by friends and support. Even though it sounds like it was a long time ago, still real.
I think I never had that problem because my parents are completely different and fight all the time since I was like 4.
…there’s what now? I’m with Joyce here.
Personally, I’m more adverse to the tuna.
Cream of Mushroom is the fucking best.
Honestly, same.
I would have agreed, until I learned that cream of mushroom contained, well… you know… MUSHROOMS. Couldn’t stand it after that.
So, yeah, I understand Joyce’s mind set.
Oh hey, it’s this arc.
God I love Joyce.
Joyce you’re weird.
I say this as someone on the friggin spectrum.
She’s… DEEPLY neurotic.
And I mean as an autistic with serious food aversions and a deeply fucked-up relationship with religion in my preteen years that required atheism to curb the compulsive anxiety rituals there… Like, I GET it, but she is STILL neurotic and odd in ways I go ‘holy shit, Joyce, I have concerns.’
As a high functioning religious autistic, I wish to give you an internet hug.
*puts it in a box and hands it over*
Oh Joyce. I hope you get to talk to your dad alone.
…does Joyce have untreated autism or is this a result of being questionably socialized? Serious question
Walky’s more likely to be autistic than Joyce. But functioning levels are no indicator.
I think Walky is more likely ADHD, though I guess he could be both.
I think she just has weird neuroses due to her upbringing. I had weird food things like that when I was a kid but I grew out of most of them, except my hatred for most vegetables, still have that. Joyce clearly needs more time to grow out of her weird food neuroses, although I doubt she’ll ever be truly adventurous as an eater.
Becky isn’t really weird with food, it’s really not the upbringing but more just Joyce.
Now, not having a healthy way to process her neuroses, that’s the upbringing.
I personally don’t think it’s either. Kids whose parents present a united front naturally see them as a unit, and iirc, hers do. If it’s the food issue, that’s also a I don’t think so as many ppl are like this that aren’t on the spectrum or have other issues. It’s simply a idiosynchacy
If Joyce was such a fussy eater, how did her parents deal with this? I was and my mom made it very very clear that you either eat what is offered or go hungry. To this day I am uncomfortable with people fussing at me over food.
I think her parents mistake was that they only ever presented her with a narrow selection of food which she’s gotten extremely accustomed to. The only food she recognizes as food is the food she grew up eating exactly the way her mom always prepared it….
I mean, if they’re not fans of stuff touching like Joyce it’s really not that hard. If you want to eat something that involves stuff touching, that’s what ingredients are for. Take, for example, beef soup – I can’t eat it without feeling like I’ll be sick because stuff touching is disgusting. I DO like beef, potatoes, carrots, and peas though, so I take my share from the ingredients and that’s my dinner.
Or apparently by presenting it so that it’s all one thing rather than two things touching. I can see the touching thing with stew, but Joyce apparently also has issues with sauces, except not with mac and cheese or now tuna casserole.
Even without the cream of mushroom soup, tuna casserole is still pasta and tuna touching, right? And often peas or some other vegetable, though that varies.
Yeah, I can’t speak about her exceptions, because I’m allergic to cheese so no Mac and cheese and I think all casseroles are gross.
I’ve had it similar because my mom was of that generation, except I have always resented anything that looked like shellfish (especially crabs and shrimps). My parents were always annoyed at how picky I was about it, but I would absolutely throw a tantrum if there were shellfish of some kind on the plate, and it was touching the rest of my food.
Then in my early 20s, we found out that I was allergic to shellfish. So I don’t know if part of it could be something similar for Joyce (I can’t remember if we’ve learned she’s allergic to something specific), but it’s definitely something I can relate to, as someone who would be considered so picky that they would rather go hungry than touch their plate.
I would make it clear that I would rather go hungry than eat mushrooms. Turned out that I am at least “sensitive” and possibly allergic to them. That is, I react to them on the allergy scratch test, but I haven’t had the antibody test to see if it is a true allergy. So I do not know for sure if they just make me feel bad, or if they can kill me.
My refusing to eat mushrooms was different in my mind than my refusing to eat Liver. Liver just smelled and tasted awful, but it wasn’t the existential threat that mushrooms were to me.
Musroms can kill my girlfriend as can bread, most every thing with gluten, fucking Vitamin B…
I sometimes wonder how she made it to today. good thing I’m a cook so as long as I have a list of things she can and cannot eat I can make tasty food for her,
I honestly believe that there are some neurotypical folks who are picky eaters, though in all fairness Joyce does seem to be on the extreme end of pickiness.
I don’t know about all of that. As they present in my family, autistic traits are hypersensitivity and difficulty with social interactions. That is not what Joyce has, though it does appear that she does have an extreme need to have a great deal of control over the aspects of her life, in this case her food.
She has a hard time with change. She also has a difficult time dealing with learning that any belief that she holds might be incorrect. These are traits that autistic people can have, but there are stronger indicators.
The thing about her food is not that she refuses to eat things because they don’t “feel” right like an autistic person might, but rather because the food is made from many different things mixed together. That seems to be a thing that just upsets her tremendously and I imagine that is because she then cannot control everything she is eating as a result.
I am now a whole lot more worried for Joyce.
I think it’s just a manifestation of her fearing change. New is scary and dangerous. Trying mixed foods is new. Ergo, it’s scary and dangerous.
In-universe, it’s only been a month and a half since she’s questioned literally *anything* about her parents, so of course there’d still be some childhood misconceptions that would survive to the present day.
Meta-wise, two things to keep in mind
1. It’s useful to take it as a point of faith that anything Joyce does or says is directly informed by Willis’ own experiences coming from a functionally and culturally identical upbringing.
2. The…eccentric way Joyce expresses this belief is the collision between the expectations of realism created in part by 1, and the need for every strip to end on some kind of punchline.
Her food neuroses come directly from the author, so you’d have to ask him.
I mean, when talking about whether or not Dina is autistic Willis opened up about how he has traits of ASD and knows he’s neurodivergent (I think, it’s been a while) but never got officially diagnosed. Dina is the main avatar for his neurodivergent tendencies but since she’s autobiographical, some may have found themselves in Joyce.
Willis Tweeted one of the last times the ‘autism or severe religious anxiety’ subject came up being like ‘welcome to my life, I’ve got no clue either’, so honestly? No clue.
That said, even if she’s undiagnosed you don’t really treat autism as a whole (because it’s fundamentally a ‘our brains run a different operating system’ sort of thing, points of it are pretty neutral,) so much as you figure out what gives you difficulties and figure out strategies to handle them. (A good example would be Dina getting overwhelmed at the dorm party by seeing all these people but still wanting to be there, so she put a bag over her head and continued. Quirky but effective!)
I mean, I’ve conducted a few desensitization campaigns to some of the more troublesome sensory aspects and YEARS of sensory integration and core strengthening and fine motor skills therapy, but I’m still autistic at the end of the day. (And hell, all of those are IMPROVED but my muscles are still chronically low-toned and my sound tolerance is still different from allistics.)
Anyway, point being: Not sure. Joyce is really outgoing in ways I don’t really associate with autism, but then there were clear rules for being social growing up she could internalize and her awareness in new situations can be… dodgy. We’ve never seen her struggle with eye contact or sensory issues besides the Food Thing, or really do anything stimmy, but again: weird upbringing. (I could far too easily see stimming being trained out of her, ‘quiet hands’-style.) She’s definitely rules-oriented and rigid to levels I recognize in myself, and the way she went suddenly and INTENSELY into Dexter and Monkey Master reads SO MUCH like a special interest. (As does her Biblical knowledge – a lot of fundamentalists aren’t that good with overall scripture familiarity.) Her knowledge of social norms is lacking in ways that could go either way what with her upbringing, but she clearly has a great sense of empathy and GETTING what people need that could suggest hyperempathy (another trait of ours.) I feel safe saying she’s neurodivergent and has been since before the strip started – the overwhelming anxiety and her thing with food that borders on ARFID are pretty clear – but autistic… I go either way.
I don’t know. I feel like that’s an unhealthy way to view your parents but then again I was raised by a single mother so maybe I don’t have the proper context on this one. I kind of have no choice but to see my father as a separate individual.
The thing is that if Joyce stops thinking of them as a unit, then she’s acknowledging that they can be separate.
I’m guessing that as much as Joyce is not happy with her parents right now, she doesn’t want her parents to break up.
Well if there was one thing that could break up a marriage, it would probably be having conflicting opinions on the perpetrator of their child’s kidnapping. We don’t know what Carol thinks yet, but she sided with Ross on Becky’s kidnapping so that’s not really a good sign. Although the optimist in me would like to think this incident while maybe not changing her mind would make her soften on her opinions just a bit.
It is healthier in the long run for Carol and Hank to split up, but Joyce was already feeling weird that her parents lie to each other.
Having to deal with them breaking up, right now, would be a LOT, even though it would be for the best.
It is very much an unhealthy way to view your parents, but like that’s not exactly news as far as Joyce’s upbringing goes
I’ve seen what you serve yur guests
The turkey and the tuna and the chicken breasts…
Bad Sarah, no fourth wall breaking in this strip!
Sarah makes a strong point here, Hank is by far the more understanding of the two and would be a much needed support for Joyce. Although I feel my Gravatar is my best expression for how Sarah feels about learning Joyce’s food neuroses.
Also for anyone who wanted an update/explanation on me bleeding yesterday: I dropped a knife on my foot and was bleeding profusely from there. I was about to take care of it but wanted to comment first. My foot is now wrapped up and no longer bleeding. Thank you all for your concern.
Glad to hear you’re okay.
Finally some resolution to the mystery bleeding cliffhanger! It was worth the wait. Can’t wait for another episode..*Wait actually that sounds bad* Uhh…It only lasted one episode I hope but sometimes that’s for the best.
I’m glad you’re okay.
True dedication. When your life’s blood is pooling but you must comment first. Glad you’re okay!
Another example of why this comment section needs to have an upvote system.
I deduced from your comment that you injured yourself making the comment on your phone because of how you phrased it. I was very glad to read your phone is not extracting you precious bodily fluids.
DoA readers know how dangerous phones are.
RIP in spaghetti never 4ghetti.
Vampiric phones sounds like a Jeph Jacques thing, honestly.
Gland you’re ok!
*Glad*.
Glad they’re ok, liked your typo better.
Yay, not bleeding!
they’re more like a pair of cheeks
All I can think of in that last panel is “I know, pepperoni is normally a land meat”.
Tuna is for sandwiches, not casseroles.
It can be both!
Cream of Carol Soup™
Comes with unsubtle bigotry.
Is… is today’s comic autobiographical too?
ESPECIALLY today’s.
I’m a bit worried about Joyce as I can’t see this ending with anything short of a divorce and that might break her mind further. But I am also quite intrigued about this concept of a can of mushroom soup in tuna casserole and kind of want to ask for a recipe.
I’ve got the impression that in that region of the country, casseroles are a very important part of culture.
Sure, now, you are talking hot-dish, right?
Salad is jello with cottage cheese and fruit! Amiright?
Salad is a big bowl of assorted vegetables all chopped up or filleted.
What you described is an abomination.
Yes, but in the upper Midwest, they call it salad.
Please do not ask why, because “I don’t wanna know.”
I’m pretty sure “salad” means “cold side dish served in a big bowl” in the Midwest.
Sorry, but this still isn’t as good as the day Joyce dissected a taco.
For best results, add only the contents of the can to the tuna casserole, not the can itself.
You’re welcome.
Sounds great, except for the English peas. Substitute in drained green beans and you’ve got yourself a deal. My theory is that people who love green peas are genetically unable to taste them.
I grew up with tuna casserole with mayonnaise and cheddar cheese.
And when I say ‘mayonnaise’ I mean the real thing. None of this “Miracle Whip” baloney.
Miracle Whip makes baloney too?
I grew up with Miracle Whip and stuck with it into my 50s. But the I bought a jar of mayo by mistake. I never went back.
I’ve literally never been able to taste the difference. I buy mayo, but I’m fine with either.I feel like I’m in the minoriy there though, everybody seems to have such strong preference for one or the other.
They definitely taste different to me, but I don’t know that I have a preference. I don’t use either very often.
I’ve never had miracle whip but if it’s worse/the same as mayo, they’re both gross
This.
As much as Sarah has a point, I’m guessing that Joyce only letting Hank up wouldn’t be great, either. Because it’s sending a message to Carol that, no, I’m opposed to you. Which puts Hank in an uncomfortable position.
There is also the chance that if she lets Hank in, Carol will use the opportunity to barge in uninvited. (Since screening out one person from a pair is more difficult than screening out both )
It’s really hard to get a chance to peel off mostly-ok enabler dad without involving toxic abusive mom. Ask me how I know!
I’ll bite, how do you know?
Well, yeah, Joyce, they present any sort of discord as a sign of a broken home and good Christians don’t have those. Besides, Hank’s great now, but he DID help teach you some awful shit.
On that note – “Tied together by law and spite” is an excellent phrase and I shall use it at every opportunity.
And I’ve got a similar neuroses to Joyce – with baked goods. Once the cake/muffin/bagel/whatever is baked, it’s no longer a bunch of stuff touching, it’s one New Thing and therefore okay. It’s permafused, sorry, I don’t make the rules.
Pastry is just breadsmithing.
See, I can only eat tuna casserole if I remind myself I like all of its individual components. Does that make me Anti-Joyce?
I get the impression that this kind of effect in kids is evidence of useful parenting for when they’re very young (gotta present a consistent front and all) but represents a failure of communication if they still think this way as adolescents. It shows an inability to smoothly transition to new ways of relating to them as they get older and become increasingly mature and independent interlocutors. It’s kind of tragic for your own children to know you for you so little.
That’s Tuna Mess, not Tuna Casserole. TM is tuna, elbow macaroni, and cream of mushroom soup, TC is a scratch bechamel sauce in place of the cream of mushroom soup. We usually have the TM because easier, making bechamel from scratch is much more of a pain than opening a can of soup and dumping cooked pasta and a can of tuna over it and mixing thoroughly and maybe placing a few slices of cheese over it before putting it in the oven to heat to a uniform temperature.
Bechamel is easy if you just add the milk a bit at a time so you’re never stirring fluid+lumps but always working with a paste. No frantic stirring – just add a tiny splash of milk, mix it in, another small splash, mix it, another modest splash… never more at one time than the paste can absorb, until the paste gets thinner and thinner, and suddenly you’ve got Bechamel sauce.
It’s not *quite* as easy as opening a can, but it’s a lot of fun (goopy mud pies you can eat!) and I’ve never failed since I realized the trick was to keep the mix pasty as long as possible so there could be no such thing as lumps.
This makes tons of sense to me, as while I don’t cook much, it’s essentially the same way I learned to mix milk into cocoa powder to make (non-lumpy) chocolate milk.
Ah, I see what Joyce is saying.
About the parents, I mean, I hate tuna
She hasn’t quite reconciled the “knows her parents keep secrets from one another” bit from the past, so this is too much to swallow for her yet.
This is an interesting consequence to the whole “unified front” parenting theory. As someone who was taught how to lie to the other parent as early as middle school, I was disabused of this notion post haste. (And yes, of course they doubled down on it when I called them out on it during my rebellious teenager years.)
Joyce is bringing back memories of my mother’s cooking, which always makes me throw up a little in my mouth. Y-y-y-up. There it is. Campbell’s soup: the bane of my youth.
my grandfather worked the tuna casserole mines til the day it took his life
There’s a reason the cans say “dolphin safe”, not “grandpa safe”.
It says “dolphin safe” on cans of Cream of Mushroom soup? Where are they harvesting those shrooms?
I assumed gramps worked the tuna vein, because the cream of mushroom deposits are more difficult to find. Pasta ore is everywhere, that’s why the stuff’s so cheap at the grocery store.
And the LORD spoke unto them, “Do not suffer one food to be eaten with another, for they are made separate and shall be eaten separate. Just like the horse is separate from the grain, so shall you separate the salami from the pizza. But the tuna casserole you shall not separate, for it is one whole that was separated by force for a time.”
– Joyce 6:23-26
(Not a native English speaker, no clue how good my “Bible English” is :x)
That is pretty damn fine work there, sounds like scripture, just not from any of the chapters I’ve read.
Almost as good as the Book of Armaments.
Narrator: Sarah is about to learn new Joyce food neuroses
There are always more. Always.
That’s what “more” means.
Immaculate Conception, but for food
Immaculate Consumption.
It hurts when you get beaten in your own game.
Well played.
Our Lady of Immaculate Consumption! Praise be!
One of the trickier parts of growing up is fully realizing and understanding that your parents… are people. We’re pushed into thinking of them as like demigods, and frequently as all-wise, all-knowing, inherently good people.
Because, yeah, Joyce is still a kid, and while she’s grown a lot more aware about how her mother is a pretty significant asshole, she’s still treating her not as her mother Carol, but rather The Mom, part of the Divine Pantheon called The Parents, look upon their works, ye mighty, and despair…
The trick is to have your parents divorce when you are like five, and then refuse to be in the same room together for the next fifteen. You will never not be reminded that parents are (maladjusted) people!
Or, inversely, realize that your messed up, ‘at that point just toxic to each other’ parents actually have some good in them, and now that they’re separate and/or not feeling like they have to stay together for the kids, can actually be chill people.
More so with her upbringing than average, given Joyce said she wasn’t allowed to see Frozen because it promoted the idea that parents can be wrong about what is good for their children.
Thank you Sarah. I still think locking out hank is not a good idea.
That sounds so wrong, Joyce. Parents are their own people, Joyce. A mom isn’t the half of a dad, nor a mom to another mom or dad to another dad if we are inclusive. If a parent is abusive, that parent’s abuse is only theirs. Stacy didn’t physically abuse Amber; Becky’s mom didn’t hunt her down with a fire weapon at hand; Joe’s mom doesn’t flirt with younger girls than her (maybe I am wrong about this one).
I hope Joyce unlearns this big mistake to be able to move on and accept taht her mom is completely responsible for her own evil deeds.
That’s all true, but couples are also couples. That means two people in a pair, who share a lot. And especially if they are your parents, you tend to think of them more as a unit.
At least that’s what I think Joyce kinda refers to.
Yeah, but I don’t give a shit about those cultural perceptions. My mom is my mom and my dad is a dad. Joyce is just putting too much thought into that like with teh casserole. Her neuroses may need years of therapy, and not just expecting a fiendly conversation to fix all her problems.
Also, scientifically speaking you can reduce hydrogen and nitroigen to smaller components, but the consequences are dangerous, just like divorce.
my dad*
Yes parents are individuals and it isn’t always fair to blame one for the actions of another.
But I think context is important… Did one enable/encourage the other? Were they passive?
For example, it’s hard to blame Amber’s mom for Blaine’s abuse because she was apparently a victim too.
On the other hand, at least some of the “programming” Joyce received when growing up was acceptable to both parents.
Let’s just agree Joyce’s (and Willis’) upbringing was shitty.
Oh, she DESPERATELY needs therapy from that fucked-up upbringing. But the ‘Frozen isn’t allowed because it teaches children their parents can be fallible’ upbringing deeeefinitely encouraged this particular terrible viewpoint, so I can see how she hasn’t broken it yet.
Especially since she hasn’t gotten that therapy and PLEASE GOD SOMEONE CONVINCE HER TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL WHO CAN HELP HER UNPACK THIS SHIT!
I like tuna casserole and beef stroganoff, but only when there’s no mushrooms in them.
Well, i never had that problem. My parents divorced when i was 1 year old. Probably due to my half sister who was half a year old and my parents were married for 2 years by then
Joyce is telling us she knows she is wrong about this, right?
I wonder if she already definitely knows that Carol helped bail Toedad or if this is a general reaction.
Ohhh yikes Carol is back and this storyline is not gonna be fun for me
So, not to be the token “Italian getting mad at food”, but I have serious problems about people considering some broiled tuna slop birthed from cans of unrelated soup as any less unnatural than one springing up from the ground fully formed.
it’s not supposed to be rational, that’s the
pointjoke.From a cooking point of view, I’m intrigued by this idea of cream of mushroom soup as an ingredient in Tuna Casserole. While I can understand that a can of condensed soup (or otherwise reduced to thicken) could provide a good sauce, I’d have thought that cream of mushroom would be too subtle a flavour and would be overpowered by the tuna. Personally I’d have gone for a low salt french onion soup (freedom onion soup?) instead (though I do admit that would be lacking in the “creaminess” factor).
The mushroom just adds some umami, but not much of the actual mushroom flavor comes through. I tend to use Cream of Bacon soup when I’m feeling too lazy to make it from scratch with a mornay sauce.
I would say that it’s almost all about the quick, easy (cheap) pre-prepared sauce, with whatever flavor contributed by what’s in the cream as somewhere between “bonus” and “afterthought”.
consider: cream of celery instead
Or cream of broccoli. Took my dad 16 years to realize the way to get me to eat ALL my tuna casserole was to replace the fucking cream of mushrooms with that.
(I hate mushrooms, he’d known this as a fact for the longest time. It took almost as long for him to stop sticking mushrooms in the spaghetti sauce too.)
Two very good alternatives (and I wasn’t aware that “cream of broccoli” was even a thing until now)! I love mushrooms and grow them on a small scale, in fact producing my own milk and cheese is the only thing that stops me making a self sufficient version of my mothers gourmet scrambled eggs (not that I couldn’t, it just wouldn’t be cost effective on the scale of my property).
Mushrooms are fucking pointless. If they have any flavor of their own, it’s dirt flavor.
No fungus for us!
Mushrooms do not belong in spaghetti.
Disagree.
About the time that the plague kicked off, my favorite kind of spaghetti sauce (a red with olives and mushrooms mixed in) was discontinued. I don’t know if this was due to a supply shock (disruption) from Italy, or pure coincidence and the obscure workings of product marketing; only that I’ve been auditioning various replacements and found them all wanting. It looks like I may need to start getting a good basic marinara (or making my own) and adding olives and mushrooms myself. :p
As I’ve discovered during the lockdown, Campbell’s makes a condensed Cream of Bacon soup that makes excellent tuna casserole.
Two steps forwards, one step back
So I wonder what would happen to Joyce’s worldview if her parents announced they were getting a divorce…
If or When? Given the similarities between her and the author Willis, aren’t his parents divorced?
And his mom died recently.
Honestly, I didn’t know there are tuna casserole creationists out there.
Someone had to create it.
I thought it had evolved from baked ichthyosaur. I hope some Dina bonus strip will provide us with scientific facts.
But how do they milk the little mushrooms though?
Carefully.
Let’s Hope Joyce will soon learn that her parents are not the unit she believe and there are cases where splitting couples is the best choice they can make.
So yeah, they are DEFINITELY divorcing over this one.
Joyce isn’t neurotic about food, Sarah – she’s particular.
Also I’ve never had tuna casserole, what’s it like?
Not bad as a change of pace. Wouldn’t want it all the time.
Tuna Noodle Casserole (also referred to as Tuna Hot Dish in Garrison Keillor’s tales of Minnesota) is one of many casseroles that employ canned condensed mushroom soup as binder and flavoring. The notorious Green Bean Casserole touted by the producers of the fried onions that it contains, also contains canned condensed mushroom soup.
Oh it’s a Midwestern dish. That explains why I never experienced this meal.
It’s really nationwide, if you’re old enough to have endured time-saver meals from the 1950’s and ’60’s. Our family’s version was topped with crumbled potato chips. Some have frozen peas stirred in. Once a person learns how to make a basic white sauce from butter and flour cooked together, with milk stirred in, the idea of the condensed soup loses appeal.
Salt-and-vinegar chips work really well on top.
I’m a big fan, have been from childhood. (And I’m west coast.)
The best comparison I can offer is (beef) stroganoff, at least in terms of composition/consistency, or chicken casserole if you’ve ever had that; the flavor profile is closer to the latter, though (of course) slightly more “fishy”.
Does Joyce look a little haggard in that last panel?
Maybe it’s her food neuroses acting up.
As long as she doesn’t look like Merle Haggard things will turn out all right.
I predict a divorce, du du du duuu, I predict a divorce
This…explains part of why Joyce has difficulty with relationships, frankly. A couple always trying to act as a unit rather than two individuals isn’t healthy. My parents never really tried to shelter me from them having disagreements. People don’t agree on everything all the time. It’s just…not a thing, and if they claim they do, it’s usually unhealthy
I think that I get what Joyce is saying here and it probably says a bit about her upbringing. It wasn’t as much ‘mommy’ and ‘daddy’ as it was ‘my parents’. The two were always a monolithic block (with other adult authority figures attached too). The downside of this, in terms of her relationships, is that she’s having trouble differentiating what different people want, think and are doing from others because they were all just ‘the adults’ to her.
I suspect Joyce’s parents are heading for a divorce eventually.
I’m reminded of the story of when my Mum was a little girl, and her granny made the mistake of telling her how black pudding was made. On seeing her reaction, she then explained that this wasn’t how it was made any more. And Mum believed this, because she wanted to.
And she continued believing it right up until she told the story to my Dad and, struggling to keep a straight face, he asked “So how do they make it, then?”
You might prefer to think of your parents as a unit, but Hank and his divorce lawyer disagree
Marriage starts with the promise of two people to love each other, and ends when one of them breaks that promise. Carol betrayed the trust of her husband and her family, so she has to carry the weight of being the one that destroyed her own family.
but she won’t. she’ll unload that on the kids and/or Satan, whoever’s most convenient.
there is probably an awesome german word for a severely screwed-up line of reasoning arriving at an excellent conclusion. hank is going to want to know that word, because being rejected on account of association with whatserc* is… remarkably fair.
Of course there is, because if there isn’t a word, the germans will make one.
you won’t call them units once your dad divorces
Unlogischargumentation?
Joyce: “See, hydrogen is great, but one day I learned there’s a bunch of particles mixed in there, so I decided that what I thought I’d learned was a lie and that hydrogen is birthed fully-formed out of the stars”
Dina: “Raaaaaaarrrrrghhhhhh!!!”
But hydrogen is just hydrogen? I’m confused
So five elements? Earth, Air, Fire, Water, and Tuna Casserole?
No yucky Cream of Mushroom soup in my Tuna Casserole. Just tuna, good old fashioned Kraft Mac & Cheese, and a layer of cheddar on top, broiled to golden brown perfection.
hydrogen and nitrogen both form molecules of two atoms
Okay, I love mushrooms, but I can’t say I’ve ever heard of adding ’em to tuna casserole. Why? Like, what does it add to the flavor profile?
You take some pasta, you take some tuna, you take sour cream, poppy seeds, and shredded cheese, you mix ’em all up in a big bowl, pour it into a dish and top it with oregano and then you bake the sucker. It’s delicious and simple.
poppy seeds?
Poppy seeds. They add nice flavor and texture to the mix. It’s my mom’s recipe and I stand by it.
And today I’ve learned that Tuna Casserole is actually worse than I imagined. (I have Joyce-level food neurosis)
… now I’m picturing the texture clash between soup-mushrooms and tuna… and baked tuna… oh god
I also feel the need to clarify that in literally every single classic midwestern dish (and casserole) in which Cream of Mushroom is a staple, my family always substituted Cream of Chicken because my mom hates mushrooms somehow more than I do so I wasn’t inoculated to the weirdness young enough.
and now from Twitter:
“my comments section is currently discussing whether joyce is autistic or just had a fucked up childhood, and honestly folks when you figure this out please let me know”
Tuna casserole is awful, though. Tuna is awful, and casserole does it no favors.