It’s not a conspiracy theory. Conspiracy theories have a lot more structure to them. This is simply the observation that dozens, if not hundreds, of rich powerful people had the means, motive(!), and opportunity to kill Epstein, and that there were some funny things about the way he died.
I normally don’t put a lot of stock in conspiracy theories, but I have to agree that Epstein’s death seems VERY suspicious. Leaving aside the fact that the two guards who were supposed to check on him didn’t, this simply isn’t the typical M.O. of these rich white-collar types. What people like Epstein usually do is drag out the case through the courts so long that their accusers have to drop out due to lack of funding (and Epstein certainly had the financial means to do this).
Like maybe start out with a littler subject, maybe like a little warden, …yeah, a Mini-warden. I’ll bet even a mini-warden could take Toe-Dad. Take him out with one hand tied behind his back.
Joyce, honey, I understand and sympathize, but Becky needs to know or this could end up a really unpleasant surprise really quickly, especially since you can’t be with Becky 24/7. She works full time and you’re a student. If you’re with her all the time, she’ll realize SOMETHING is up.
She does, and I think the last panel is frustration that yeah, she knows Dorothy is right. Doesn’t mean she’s any happier to subject Becky to that knowledge, though.
She said that yesterday, comic time. Specifically, she said she was ignoring her dad because 1) She didn’t feel like answering and 2) (and these are connected) part of her will always live in mortal fear of her father’s judgement.
Sarah, this where you excuse yourself and/or insist you don’t want to hear any details, so you can maintain plausible deniability! This is like lawyering 101 stuff, you should know it already!
Joyce is only venting. She has neither the ability nor the intention to actually arrange for Toedad to be killed. Though part of her would for a moment enjoy the idea.
When someone goes from venting to actually planning, that’s a different kind of story.
I honestly wonder if Toedad cellmate didn’t consider shiving him just to be rid of his insuferable self… because unless he got roomed with another “born again” type as equally hipocritical I would feel for the cellmate.
Joyce has the problem of thinking of other people her age as teens. She thought Dina looked like a child, implying Becky kissing Dina would be problematic, and Dina rightfully said she isn’t a child.
Joyce is basically doing the same sin as her brother John: thinking young people can’t be responsible of their own actions.
There’s a difference between ‘Oh, they CAN’T deal with this, I have to protect them’ and ‘They shouldn’t have to deal with this bullshit anymore’. Joyce definitely needs to talk to Becky because this could get really bad if she doesn’t, but her reasons have nothing to do with thinking Becky can’t take care of herself.
Dina’s a separate case. That’s a thing many people have shared with Joyce and was paralleled early on by Dina identifying with Roz’s little sister.
What Joyce is doing here is a parallel to Dorothy not wanting to hurt Joyce by telling her about Ryan when AG had found him – which what Dorothy is referencing. Joyce is doing it more dramatically, but that’s just who she is. Doesn’t change the basic intent, which is good, but still misguided.
And why shouldn’t she be thinking of people her age as teens? They are teens. Like her. Not that that has anything to do with what she’s doing as I understand it, but it seems a weird way to put it.
If Ross was back in jail, it would have been news. People would have heard about it. If Mikes body had been found, it would have been news. Some possibilities we can eliminate.
Just in case anyone forgot: The revelation of Ross’s real nature (and the uncritical approval that nature receives from the former authority figures in her life) impacted Joyce far more strongly than it did Becky.
I love how Dorothy immediately see the parallel to her and Becky’s discussion and draws the hard conclusion. Stuff like that is why Dorothy is the best.
I know this is fiction and everything but I feel a little bummed out by how jail, etc is getting represented. Obviously it’s complicated because in this case someone being released is a Bad Situation, but in general, cash bail is awful precisely because people with money get out while people without money are jailed for weeks or even months awaiting trial. Bail for misdemeanors (like disobeying a traffic order) can be in the hundreds or low thousands, and the majority of Americans cannot afford a $500 emergency without going into debt. Bail for felonies (like assaulting an officer, with which people are charged for something as petty as going limp during arrest) is usually in the thousands. (I think the most recent data showed that the average bail is around $55,000, while the median HOUSEHOLD income in the US in 2017 was $59,000.
The situation here portrays essentially a perpetrator of domestic violence being released, who is likely to reoffend. That’s a real danger. But it’s also worth noting that often police arrest victims of domestic violence rather than perpetrators because the kinds of injuries victims leave in resisting violence (bites, scratches, etc) are more immediately visible than the kinds of injuries perpetrators (especially experienced perpetrators) do. (This is much more true in states with mandatory arrest laws for DV calls, which Indiana does not have.) Also, victims may be afraid to tell police they are being abused, whereas perpetrators have no qualms doing something that will create a record of arrest for their partner, giving them more power. Here’s where the pretrial detention thing becomes even worse: person being held for pretrial detention risks losing their job. On top of this, many jails charge people for being held there (like the The Clinton County Jail in Indiana, which charges $30/night). So a DV victim who is arrested will end up with a debt and may lose their job, giving the perpetrator even more control.
And all of this is for people who have been CHARGED with something, not convicted. Which means that you can do nothing at all — you can be in the wrong place at the wrong time, or driving while black — and end up behind bars for weeks or months, losing your job.
So like… seeing this kind of “oh no! they post bail for anything?! that’s so ridiculous!” plotline is a little frustrating because this isn’t a comic that regularly deals with the justice system so this one-time representation feels like it holds more weight.
This wasn’t domestic violence, this was just a straight up kidnapping. I think a lot of people can both agree that 1) it is messed up the way bail is handled but also 2) that if your crime was witnessed by multiple people and it was a crime you could try to commit again that is of a very serious nature such as say… kidnapping someone with a gun, you shouldn’t be allowed bail.
These are not mutually exclusive ideas – you can accept bail as a concept is ruined by not accounting for wages of the accused properly and tends to be too high for the poor but not high enough for the rich and also accept that bail shouldn’t be offered for certain types of offences at all even if they weren’t literal murder and that it is kind of ridiculous that someone who did what Ross did could be allowed to walk around unhindered.
It’s kind of domestic violence though – he was kidnapping his daughter, not some random target. Not legally in the sense that’s what he’s charged with, but the motivation is control of a family member. The point of “perpetrator of domestic violence” here is that’s a kind of violent crime where the perpetrator is very likely to reoffend.
In some states, yes. Generally put into place back in the 80s after a long history of police basically ignoring domestic violence complaints. Thurman vs Torrington was the landmark case that led to a lot of the changes.
okay, marginally better b.c i can’t remember this one but i keep getting the sinking feeli- oh shit it’s that practically sociopathic dude with mary isn’t it?
Can someone advise the conversation Dorothy seems to be implying? Is it the whole “should I tell Joyce we have this grainy picture or not” convo?
Also, I may have missed it, but is there anything that by law, if someone who tried to hurt you is released on bail, is it required to notify the person who is victim to that person be notified they’ve been released? You’d think it necessary, but I could see it not being a thing. Especially since Becky didn’t have a phone at that point.
Also Joyce needs to stop babying Becky like she’s a fragile birdy and treat her like a semi-adult at minimum.
I think Joyce is projecting on Becky. Becky is working through her own problems in her own sarcastic and black humor way. Joyce is the one that needs help, but doesn’t want to admit, so she passes all her insecurities to other people because her assholishness is a way to cope with being “weak”.
Not sure on the projecting, and I wouldn’t say it’s assholishness. Joyce has been hurt by so many people she once trusted with all her heart. Including her own mother. It’s painful to be so betrayed. But she does need help, she needs to speak with a professional with all the trauma she’s been put through (being roofied, having a gun pointed at her by a family friend, being oust by her community/church). Unfortunately, her advise with speaking with any professional has been from someone she doesn’t entirely trust or approve of (Roz) or was advised they’re worth jack shit and shouldn’t be trusted (Sal). I can only hope Dorothy encourages her to talk the right person.
Roz is right, but sounds cruel. Sal is wrong, but she looks cool. Dorothy is the voice of reason, but Joyce barely pays attention to her when she talks about something important.
It’s still something that’s possible and Becky needs to be aware, whether she should have to or not. Life’s about dealing with a lot of things you don’t want to deal with, whether we want to or not. And right now, they all, including Becky and Dina, need to deal with the real possibility that Ross is going to get out of jail and they need to be safe. Because Becky and Dina are very large targets, both for kidnapping and someone to be murdered, because I wouldn’t put it pass Ross to kill her to remove temptation from his daughter.
Joyce, you idiot. If a serial killer or rapist wanted to attack you you would want to know to be prepared, contact non corrupt authorities and get allies that can deal with the assholes. You are just a selfish edgelord that is distrustful of authorities like Sal in her most jaded day. Have a godo day dumbass.
That’s not what she said at all. This has jackshit to do with trusting authorities and everything to do with feeling like Becky’s been through enough and shouldn’t have to lift a finger to deal with Toedad again.
Even if she were distrustful of authorities, that’s not an edge lord thing. That’s a ‘recognizing how often they don’t have your back’ thing.
Seriously, you’re just determined to call Joyce an edge lord aren’t you?
Yes, because I know what it is to be a raging jerk to other people. I have been there and I know what it is to think you are always right. Then you make a mistake and rage against the heaven because you can’t change your own negative traits. I am still a jerk, but I am trying to change.
I am sure that by the end of the year Joyce will realize religion isn’t the only problem in her life, but also the awful things she did, like trying to break a couple, slut shaming people, her attempt at a relationship with Ethan, hiring Mike to punch Joe, trying to separate Dorothy and Walky.
I rage against must of the bullshit of Joyce because she is relatable. She is human. She is like each of us when we fuck up and learn to stop fucking up.
Joyce is ALREADY aware that those were crappy things to do. She was upset her community sold her bullshit about the way the world works. Again, the things she specifically mentioned at the party (that atheism is some ‘get out of morality’ card and sexual purity) ARE bullshit and she’s right to be angry her community pushed it on her. Saying sexual purity is bullshit upset Becky but she isn’t a jerk for saying it. She isn’t being a jerk here either.
“Thinking she’s always right” is the opposite of Joyce’s problem.She thinks she can’t do anything right. She tried to do the thing that her community told her would mean she can do what she wants without consequence and discovered that wasn’t true – because people still have feelings and she still cares. She’s angry her community gave her MORE bullshit, not that she still cares about other people.
Becky was rightfully angry at Joyce, because even if sexuaal purity is bullshit, Becky thought Dina was someone special and didn’t want to mess up their first time being intimate. Just because sexual purity is bullshit doesn’t mean you have to mock people that want to wait for marriage or just have sex with their loved ones.
Joyce did all the breaking Jacob and Radiah apart after that atheist epiphany. Even if oyce broke free from fundie beliefs, she still can do awful things and doesn’t seem to try to change besides her “woe me I am evil and ca’t change!” mentality.
Once Joyce cuts ties with her church and toxic family member, the only devil to hate would be herself unless she learns to stop trying to control everything and take a hold of herself.
She didn’t do that after that atheist epiphany, that was the cause of her epiphany. She did that in the crux of her crisis of faith, because she believed what her faith said about atheists – that without the fear of God they could do anything with remorse. It was afterwards at the party that she talked about realizing that wasn’t true because people still have feelings and she still cares.
Doesn’t mean it wasn’t a shitty thing to do – I’ve long criticized her for the whole Jacob affair – but it does help explain why she did it and that she’s learned from it.
Becky was asking Joyce for reassurance on sexual purity. Waiting until marriage is important to Becky and that’s fine but Joyce is right that the sexual purity she’s basing it on is bullshit.
Joyce’s apparently managed to watch some bad prison movies. See also her bit about scooping eyeballs out with a rusty spoon back when they were breaking into Becky’s house.
Well, “shiv“ was not in my vocabulary until now and therefore not in the bible version i read like 5 times when i was a teen.
There is, however, the story of Jael:
“But Jael, Heber’s wife, picked up a tent peg and a hammer and went quietly to him while he lay fast asleep, exhausted. She drove the peg through his temple into the ground, and he died.“ (Judges 4:21, NIV)
Can’t say that there aren’t good biblical female role models if you aspire to be a murderer for a good cause.
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I’d say bail on this discussion, that escalated quickly
I’ll be the judge of that.
I don’t know, Jury is still out on that one…
Joyce certainly raised the bar.
Just take a brief recess.
I can’t release those documents without a sub-peener.
‘sa peener! ‘sa peener!
Nah, see, ROSS brought a gun.
Joyce essentially threatening to shiv him is her DE-escalating by bringing a knife to a gun-fight.
But the constitution doesn’t say anything about knives so
The US Constitution doesn’t mention hands, either. Presumably Congress can make gloves compulsory, but not sleeves.
Nah yeah, you should tell.
Dumbing of Age Book 10: This Is Indiana, So…
DoA Book 10: Somebody Doesn’t Want To Be Eligible For Bail
Does this mean that Ross is yesterday’s noose?
His relevancy is really hanging by a thread.
… huh?
The alt text and this (and another similar) discussion have me very confused. Did I miss a thing?
They’re murder puns.
The alt text references a popular conspiracy theory. The thread is just puns, and no noose is good noose.
So you’re saying if you get the reference, you’re killing it, but if you’re like me and don’t, you’re basically left to drown?
Eh, it’s a dead letter.
Epstein can’t melt steel beams
It’s not a conspiracy theory. Conspiracy theories have a lot more structure to them. This is simply the observation that dozens, if not hundreds, of rich powerful people had the means, motive(!), and opportunity to kill Epstein, and that there were some funny things about the way he died.
So… it’s a conspiracy hypothesis?
More like a conspiracy fact. I’m pretty sure it’s an open secret at this point.
The real question is which of the many candidates was behind it.
A conspiracy. Full stop.
I normally don’t put a lot of stock in conspiracy theories, but I have to agree that Epstein’s death seems VERY suspicious. Leaving aside the fact that the two guards who were supposed to check on him didn’t, this simply isn’t the typical M.O. of these rich white-collar types. What people like Epstein usually do is drag out the case through the courts so long that their accusers have to drop out due to lack of funding (and Epstein certainly had the financial means to do this).
I think it’s a reference to suspicious deaths while in police custody. Jeffrey Epstein would be a recent high profile example.
Joyce wants to throw Ross a party…
A necktie party.
She wants to see how well he does the Hemp Fandango.
Another term is the “Spandau ballet”.
If anything could make Joyce finally drop an F-Bomb, it’s probably Ross.
The fact that she still calls him Mr. McIntyre in that context amuses me for some reason.
A lifetime of “Mr./Ms. Surname” inertia doesn’t go away overnight. Hell, I’m in my thirties and I still refer to longtime family friends as such.
One of my teachers in high school had been teaching there for like 20+ years. One of the other teachers went to that high school 10 years previous.
He still referred that teacher as “Mr. ___” despite calling every other teacher by their first name.
When it’s not just “so and so’s dad”.
Joyce I’m liking your enthusiasm but start smaller than a warden.
Like maybe start out with a littler subject, maybe like a little warden, …yeah, a Mini-warden. I’ll bet even a mini-warden could take Toe-Dad. Take him out with one hand tied behind his back.
Dorothy is all ‘ugh I bet I wouldn’t have to deal with this kind of stuff if I was in Yale right now.’.
Yeah. She could just tell someone with a rich parent who had a discreet employee who could fix the problem.
Yale graduates get three free murders a year, it’s in the Constitution.
Jeez that escalated quickly. Going from not wanting to tell Becky to thinking about bribing a warden to shiv Toedad.
So wait … if he didn’t kill himself, then who did? This gets potentially even more twisted.
It was a really well known political family, obviously. And we don’t know too many of those in this reality.
Wait is Ross dead? How did I miss that?
He was dead all along.
Schrodingers cat anyone?
McIntyre was dead, to begin with. There is no doubt whatever about that.
The register of his burial was signed by the clergyman, the clerk and the undertaker, but not the chief mourner because there were none.
Carol, surely, would be there.
He was replaced by a doppelganger back in the 60s.
There never was a Ross McIntyre. It was always a cheap Alien robot infiltrator.
He died when he pulled the trigger on the gun when he was trying to kidnap Becky the first time, he’s just too stupid to fall down right.
It’s a bluff. Ross is being held in durance at the bottom of a dry well in an abandonded house. Mike is making him put lotion on his skin.
It’s a joke about Epstein and the way the phrase got memed
Joyce, honey, I understand and sympathize, but Becky needs to know or this could end up a really unpleasant surprise really quickly, especially since you can’t be with Becky 24/7. She works full time and you’re a student. If you’re with her all the time, she’ll realize SOMETHING is up.
Nah, if you want it to be a shiv you bribe the cellmate. If the warden’s bribed, there are other murder options.
Failure to communicate, frinstance.
Are you saying that Ross – here won’t need a third sat of chains?
He’s gonna get his mind right.
Then again, if the guy gets shived, no one suspects the warden.
There are two ‘V’s in “shivved”.
He’s gonna get chived. Its gonna be delicious.
He’s going to get sour creamed.
Getting shived wouldn’t be bad as a punishment, though.
Getting Shived, on the other hand, would be awesome beyond belief, and thus should not be used on him.
You’ve had that as an avatar for all this time just so you could make that joke when the opportunity finally arrived, haven’t you?
Heh heh heh.
I dunno. That was one cartoonist who always struck me as something of a goon. Well, kinda a goon. Goonish.
NVM, not a flashback, just a dumb decision…
Jeezus Joyce she DESERVES TO PROTECT HERSELF.
She does, and I think the last panel is frustration that yeah, she knows Dorothy is right. Doesn’t mean she’s any happier to subject Becky to that knowledge, though.
NOT telling her subjects her to even MORE danger, what’s worse? The Danger you can know is coming, or the danger nobody wanted to tell you about? X.X
if Joyce answered the phone a few days ago she could have told Robin
If Hank had called her a few days ago, that would be a viable option. He didn’t call her until yesterday.
Joyce said she’s been IGNORING her phone though.
She said that yesterday, comic time. Specifically, she said she was ignoring her dad because 1) She didn’t feel like answering and 2) (and these are connected) part of her will always live in mortal fear of her father’s judgement.
I wonder whether Amazi-Girl did it, or Blaine. Is Mike in jail facing arraignment for double murder? Is he the fall guy for Asher?
Oh, Mike’s the fall guy alright.
One story after another.
Alt text is best use of this meme.
…I feel uncomfortable with the idea of trying to google this meme. Help?
The uh… “Epstein didn’t kill himself” meme.
Sarah, this where you excuse yourself and/or insist you don’t want to hear any details, so you can maintain plausible deniability! This is like lawyering 101 stuff, you should know it already!
Joyce is only venting. She has neither the ability nor the intention to actually arrange for Toedad to be killed. Though part of her would for a moment enjoy the idea.
When someone goes from venting to actually planning, that’s a different kind of story.
“I should be advising you to not commit murder for hire. But I’m not allowed to give legal advice. So…?”
Zero to sixty in six panels. The new 2020 model Joyce can really get you where you need to go.
Are we talking Murderville or Maximum Security Town?
No. To Burger King.
Now picturing “Julia Gray: Fury Road.”
Oh.
My.
God.
YES!
I honestly wonder if Toedad cellmate didn’t consider shiving him just to be rid of his insuferable self… because unless he got roomed with another “born again” type as equally hipocritical I would feel for the cellmate.
I think she is picturing Becky seeing everyone as Ross anytime she goes out, like her and whats-his-scar in that comic I am too lazy to dig up.
This one?
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/02-threes-a-crowd/trauma/
What’s-his-scar’s name is Ryan, may he rot in
HellTartarus after Amber stabbed him with his own knife.Yeah that’s who/which I meant. Thanks, both of you.
damn, joyce
…. well, the alt text’s not wrong…
OMG Text Becky Immediately so Robin can intervene
( is the right answer )
The whole “if someone doesn’t know about a problem, that problem doesn’t exist” mentality feels weirdly like toddler object impermanence.
More bugblatter beast of Traal (I think I spelled the name of the planet right, but with Adams you can never be sure)
Joyce has the problem of thinking of other people her age as teens. She thought Dina looked like a child, implying Becky kissing Dina would be problematic, and Dina rightfully said she isn’t a child.
Joyce is basically doing the same sin as her brother John: thinking young people can’t be responsible of their own actions.
There’s a difference between ‘Oh, they CAN’T deal with this, I have to protect them’ and ‘They shouldn’t have to deal with this bullshit anymore’. Joyce definitely needs to talk to Becky because this could get really bad if she doesn’t, but her reasons have nothing to do with thinking Becky can’t take care of herself.
Dina’s a separate case. That’s a thing many people have shared with Joyce and was paralleled early on by Dina identifying with Roz’s little sister.
What Joyce is doing here is a parallel to Dorothy not wanting to hurt Joyce by telling her about Ryan when AG had found him – which what Dorothy is referencing. Joyce is doing it more dramatically, but that’s just who she is. Doesn’t change the basic intent, which is good, but still misguided.
And why shouldn’t she be thinking of people her age as teens? They are teens. Like her. Not that that has anything to do with what she’s doing as I understand it, but it seems a weird way to put it.
Not to worry, Joyce. When they catch Ross again, he won’t be eligible for bail! Because of Mike. RIP Mike.
Maybe Ross is already back in jail, but we still don’t know what happened to him yet. And Blaine. And if Mike’s alive or dead.
If Ross was back in jail, it would have been news. People would have heard about it. If Mikes body had been found, it would have been news. Some possibilities we can eliminate.
But that would mean we miss out on the Protagonists vs. Toedad and the Blaine showdown the recent round of character models is hinting at…
Just in case anyone forgot: The revelation of Ross’s real nature (and the uncritical approval that nature receives from the former authority figures in her life) impacted Joyce far more strongly than it did Becky.
Yup. He was an Adult she was meant to Trust by the decree of God.
…and he turned out to be not trustyworthy at all.
(Becky knew since she was little that all that stuff about honoring your father was handled best by not letting him find out about stuff)
*shitty new jersey accent* So, what you’re sayin’ is…you want me to clip the toe. Maybe even stub it.
Let the goddamn Dingdong bandit anywhere near the building and she will scope out Ross’ eye with a rusty spoon.
I also love the fact that Joyce doesn’t neglect to call him Mr as she discusses knifing him. There is no need to be rude
I love how Dorothy immediately see the parallel to her and Becky’s discussion and draws the hard conclusion. Stuff like that is why Dorothy is the best.
In last panel Joyce’s homicidal maniac personality start her journey into the world. But I love how protective she is with Becky.
Well, she is an atheist now and thus not constrained by Fear of God, so why not be a homicidal maniac.
But really, Joyce has sort of a warped idea of prison, so this is just sort of how she expects it to work.
Joyce is gonna get the Darkness.
*didn’t stub himself
Panel 6 Joyce: The Wrath of God
More like wrath of a psycho. Joyce’s faith is dubious.
God’s faith in God is also dubious.
I know this is fiction and everything but I feel a little bummed out by how jail, etc is getting represented. Obviously it’s complicated because in this case someone being released is a Bad Situation, but in general, cash bail is awful precisely because people with money get out while people without money are jailed for weeks or even months awaiting trial. Bail for misdemeanors (like disobeying a traffic order) can be in the hundreds or low thousands, and the majority of Americans cannot afford a $500 emergency without going into debt. Bail for felonies (like assaulting an officer, with which people are charged for something as petty as going limp during arrest) is usually in the thousands. (I think the most recent data showed that the average bail is around $55,000, while the median HOUSEHOLD income in the US in 2017 was $59,000.
The situation here portrays essentially a perpetrator of domestic violence being released, who is likely to reoffend. That’s a real danger. But it’s also worth noting that often police arrest victims of domestic violence rather than perpetrators because the kinds of injuries victims leave in resisting violence (bites, scratches, etc) are more immediately visible than the kinds of injuries perpetrators (especially experienced perpetrators) do. (This is much more true in states with mandatory arrest laws for DV calls, which Indiana does not have.) Also, victims may be afraid to tell police they are being abused, whereas perpetrators have no qualms doing something that will create a record of arrest for their partner, giving them more power. Here’s where the pretrial detention thing becomes even worse: person being held for pretrial detention risks losing their job. On top of this, many jails charge people for being held there (like the The Clinton County Jail in Indiana, which charges $30/night). So a DV victim who is arrested will end up with a debt and may lose their job, giving the perpetrator even more control.
And all of this is for people who have been CHARGED with something, not convicted. Which means that you can do nothing at all — you can be in the wrong place at the wrong time, or driving while black — and end up behind bars for weeks or months, losing your job.
So like… seeing this kind of “oh no! they post bail for anything?! that’s so ridiculous!” plotline is a little frustrating because this isn’t a comic that regularly deals with the justice system so this one-time representation feels like it holds more weight.
This wasn’t domestic violence, this was just a straight up kidnapping. I think a lot of people can both agree that 1) it is messed up the way bail is handled but also 2) that if your crime was witnessed by multiple people and it was a crime you could try to commit again that is of a very serious nature such as say… kidnapping someone with a gun, you shouldn’t be allowed bail.
These are not mutually exclusive ideas – you can accept bail as a concept is ruined by not accounting for wages of the accused properly and tends to be too high for the poor but not high enough for the rich and also accept that bail shouldn’t be offered for certain types of offences at all even if they weren’t literal murder and that it is kind of ridiculous that someone who did what Ross did could be allowed to walk around unhindered.
It’s kind of domestic violence though – he was kidnapping his daughter, not some random target. Not legally in the sense that’s what he’s charged with, but the motivation is control of a family member. The point of “perpetrator of domestic violence” here is that’s a kind of violent crime where the perpetrator is very likely to reoffend.
There is a law that states someone has to be arrested following a domestic violence call?
In some states, yes. Generally put into place back in the 80s after a long history of police basically ignoring domestic violence complaints. Thurman vs Torrington was the landmark case that led to a lot of the changes.
Dang, okay Joy
ah gross it’s malaya
god why
okay, marginally better b.c i can’t remember this one but i keep getting the sinking feeli- oh shit it’s that practically sociopathic dude with mary isn’t it?
It is.
Gotta give Joyce credit for thinking outside the box.
Can someone advise the conversation Dorothy seems to be implying? Is it the whole “should I tell Joyce we have this grainy picture or not” convo?
Also, I may have missed it, but is there anything that by law, if someone who tried to hurt you is released on bail, is it required to notify the person who is victim to that person be notified they’ve been released? You’d think it necessary, but I could see it not being a thing. Especially since Becky didn’t have a phone at that point.
Also Joyce needs to stop babying Becky like she’s a fragile birdy and treat her like a semi-adult at minimum.
I think Joyce is projecting on Becky. Becky is working through her own problems in her own sarcastic and black humor way. Joyce is the one that needs help, but doesn’t want to admit, so she passes all her insecurities to other people because her assholishness is a way to cope with being “weak”.
Not sure on the projecting, and I wouldn’t say it’s assholishness. Joyce has been hurt by so many people she once trusted with all her heart. Including her own mother. It’s painful to be so betrayed. But she does need help, she needs to speak with a professional with all the trauma she’s been put through (being roofied, having a gun pointed at her by a family friend, being oust by her community/church). Unfortunately, her advise with speaking with any professional has been from someone she doesn’t entirely trust or approve of (Roz) or was advised they’re worth jack shit and shouldn’t be trusted (Sal). I can only hope Dorothy encourages her to talk the right person.
Roz is right, but sounds cruel. Sal is wrong, but she looks cool. Dorothy is the voice of reason, but Joyce barely pays attention to her when she talks about something important.
I think it’s less Becky can’t handle it and more she feels she shouldn’t HAVE to handle it.
It’s still something that’s possible and Becky needs to be aware, whether she should have to or not. Life’s about dealing with a lot of things you don’t want to deal with, whether we want to or not. And right now, they all, including Becky and Dina, need to deal with the real possibility that Ross is going to get out of jail and they need to be safe. Because Becky and Dina are very large targets, both for kidnapping and someone to be murdered, because I wouldn’t put it pass Ross to kill her to remove temptation from his daughter.
You’re right, she does need to tell Becky. I’m just trying to clarify her motives.
Joyce went sicko mode
She went Walkyverse Joyce psycho mode.
Joyce, you idiot. If a serial killer or rapist wanted to attack you you would want to know to be prepared, contact non corrupt authorities and get allies that can deal with the assholes. You are just a selfish edgelord that is distrustful of authorities like Sal in her most jaded day. Have a godo day dumbass.
That’s not what she said at all. This has jackshit to do with trusting authorities and everything to do with feeling like Becky’s been through enough and shouldn’t have to lift a finger to deal with Toedad again.
Even if she were distrustful of authorities, that’s not an edge lord thing. That’s a ‘recognizing how often they don’t have your back’ thing.
Seriously, you’re just determined to call Joyce an edge lord aren’t you?
Yes, because I know what it is to be a raging jerk to other people. I have been there and I know what it is to think you are always right. Then you make a mistake and rage against the heaven because you can’t change your own negative traits. I am still a jerk, but I am trying to change.
I am sure that by the end of the year Joyce will realize religion isn’t the only problem in her life, but also the awful things she did, like trying to break a couple, slut shaming people, her attempt at a relationship with Ethan, hiring Mike to punch Joe, trying to separate Dorothy and Walky.
I rage against must of the bullshit of Joyce because she is relatable. She is human. She is like each of us when we fuck up and learn to stop fucking up.
Joyce is ALREADY aware that those were crappy things to do. She was upset her community sold her bullshit about the way the world works. Again, the things she specifically mentioned at the party (that atheism is some ‘get out of morality’ card and sexual purity) ARE bullshit and she’s right to be angry her community pushed it on her. Saying sexual purity is bullshit upset Becky but she isn’t a jerk for saying it. She isn’t being a jerk here either.
“Thinking she’s always right” is the opposite of Joyce’s problem.She thinks she can’t do anything right. She tried to do the thing that her community told her would mean she can do what she wants without consequence and discovered that wasn’t true – because people still have feelings and she still cares. She’s angry her community gave her MORE bullshit, not that she still cares about other people.
Becky was rightfully angry at Joyce, because even if sexuaal purity is bullshit, Becky thought Dina was someone special and didn’t want to mess up their first time being intimate. Just because sexual purity is bullshit doesn’t mean you have to mock people that want to wait for marriage or just have sex with their loved ones.
Joyce did all the breaking Jacob and Radiah apart after that atheist epiphany. Even if oyce broke free from fundie beliefs, she still can do awful things and doesn’t seem to try to change besides her “woe me I am evil and ca’t change!” mentality.
Once Joyce cuts ties with her church and toxic family member, the only devil to hate would be herself unless she learns to stop trying to control everything and take a hold of herself.
She didn’t do that after that atheist epiphany, that was the cause of her epiphany. She did that in the crux of her crisis of faith, because she believed what her faith said about atheists – that without the fear of God they could do anything with remorse. It was afterwards at the party that she talked about realizing that wasn’t true because people still have feelings and she still cares.
Doesn’t mean it wasn’t a shitty thing to do – I’ve long criticized her for the whole Jacob affair – but it does help explain why she did it and that she’s learned from it.
Becky was asking Joyce for reassurance on sexual purity. Waiting until marriage is important to Becky and that’s fine but Joyce is right that the sexual purity she’s basing it on is bullshit.
hello Nega-Joyce
Anti-Joyce.
Woah slow down, Satan
Finally found it. Link for reference:
“Becky and I have had this discussion.“
Thank you, I thought that’s what it was, but couldn’t dig and wasn’t 100% sure.
Maybe like Murder on the Orient Express, we can have EVERYBODY get in at least one stabby-stab
Hell yeah I love Sarah being all law student-y and throwing relevant knowledge around.
Warden’s don’t do the shivving. They just look the other way.
Is Joyce confusing wardens with warders?
BUT MIKEEEEEEE
JOYCE where did you learn “shiv”! that is not from the Bible, is it?
Joyce’s apparently managed to watch some bad prison movies. See also her bit about scooping eyeballs out with a rusty spoon back when they were breaking into Becky’s house.
I am suddenly very interested in finding out the list of “permitted” movies; Frozen is not permitted but prison movies are?
Well, “shiv“ was not in my vocabulary until now and therefore not in the bible version i read like 5 times when i was a teen.
There is, however, the story of Jael:
“But Jael, Heber’s wife, picked up a tent peg and a hammer and went quietly to him while he lay fast asleep, exhausted. She drove the peg through his temple into the ground, and he died.“ (Judges 4:21, NIV)
Can’t say that there aren’t good biblical female role models if you aspire to be a murderer for a good cause.
Alt txt: “ross macintyre didn’t kill himself”
Well with that attitude he didn’t
“I would die for you Becky.”
Am i a horrible person if i TOTALLY get Joyces sentiment in the last panel? 😉