My mother says she had a friend in college who went to St. Mattress in her first few Sundays at college.
And then there’s the Mark Lowry bit about shaking off morning people asking him to come to sunrise Bible study by naming his bed The Word, so he could tell his preacher, “I can’t talk now, I’m in The Word”.
I don’t remember anyone asking Walky to church before. I guess the results are predictable from him. (Not to mention, does he still have the same disbeliefs as in It’s Walky?)
I don’t think he’s religious, no. He’s made a lot of snarky comments about it, though often to get under Joyce’s skin, or when he pretended to be raptured.
Do we know everyone’s religious affiliation? I don’t think there’s been much diversity in that (maybe realistically for the setting). I want a Pagan character. Samhain is coming up! (In comic).
Also, what about Mike? I don’t think he is religious…and what about Danny? He seems kinda agnostic.
As I recall Danny’s probably about as nominally Christian as Billie – I think there was a strip where is mother was asking (over the phone) if he’d found a church to go to yet and he brushed the question off…
I think there’s a good deal of diversity, though admittedly mostly fairly mainstream. No pagans. A lot who are nominally something or other, but don’t currently go to services regularly, which is pretty common among college kids away from home for the first time. More non-practicing than agnostic.
Agatha’s Mormon. Raidah’s Muslim (and presumably Asma as well, though we haven’t seen much about her.) Amber and Roz are Catholic. Ethan and Joe are Jewish. Sierra goes to the same church Joyce has been going to, though she obviously comes from a more liberal background.
I’m not sure if it was clarified whether or not Sierra went to Joyce’s church more than once [or, in fact, whether Joyce did, as I believe that was the catholic one?].
In any case, just here to note that Sierra stated that her religious background was based in The Church of God. In other words, she was raised under a Pentecostal denomination. While Pentecostal faiths have several traits they can be associated with, the most notable element is their strong association with biblical inerrancy. In other words, Pentecostal denominations are generally not what one would refer to as “liberal”.
More simply put, Sierra’s background is probably very interesting, if she turned out as open as she is for reasons other than teenage rebellion/self-assertment.
In any case, we can at least consider it reasonable to label Sierra, our most likely candidate for paganism, as “Christian”, and leave it at that.
So yeah, I don’t think we’ve seen anyone among the regular cast who is pagan, of any eastern faith, or of any non-major faith. Well, who knows, maybe Sayid’ll surprise us! ..Galasso, probably not.
Not the Catholic one. Joyce hasn’t been to a Catholic church. She went to Jacob’s Episcopal church that has similar high church trappings and she only went there once.
She went on her first Sunday to a church that Mary suggested, along with Dorothy and Sierra. It was described as “awesome with a huge congregation” and having electric guitar and drums.
We saw her there at least one more time, again with Sierra, but this time with Ethan in tow (and Mike coming along to heckle.) Or at least I assume it was there, since it seemed similar and there was no mention of seeking another church. We know Joyce has been to church every sunday, but we can only assume it was the same one – other than the week she was home and when she went with Jacob.
There’s also apparently an Indiana version of Church of God that’s not Pentecostal, but does still look pretty conservative.
Here, have the main characters (as in those on the cast page or with profiles in the books)
Joyce – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant
Dorothy – Atheist
Walky – Agnostic of the ‘unconcerned’ variety (word of Willis)
Billie – Christian of some variety, not stated what.
Amber – Catholic (word of Willis)
Danny – Christian of some variety, not stated what.
Ethan – Jewish
Sarah – Not stated
Sal – Agnostic upbringing, went to Catholic school, no word whether any sort of religion ‘took’ (word of willis)
Ruth – Not stated iirc.
Dina – Atheist iirc (though I might be thinking of Walkyverse Dina so don’t quote me on her. Joyce also refers to her as non-Christian, but I’m not sure Joyce is accurate since she believes evolution is incompatible with Christianity)
Becky – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant, same as Joyce.
Joe – Jewish
Mike – Not stated, iirc.
Roz – Catholic
Jacob – Episcopalian
Marcie – Catholic (word of Willis)
Carla – Not stated
Leslie – Atheist
Malaya – Not stated
Lucy – Christian of some variety, not sure what. She was some stripe of ‘born again’ in Walkyverse, though.
Mary – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant
Raidah – Muslim.
According to Willis, most of the kids believe in god (as is true in real life Indiana) but whether or not that’s important to them varies. Billie, for instance, doesn’t place super great importance on her faith (and Danny says ‘church isn’t really super exciting or anything’). Meanwhile, Becky is faithful but irreverent (unless it’s important) and Joyce has it all memorized and internalized. Mary, on the other hand, is a definite believer but uses it like a cudgel to hurt people.
Also, Amber being Irish Catholic makes a ton of sense.
Roz…hrm. She seems likes someone who would de-convert. But then, faith is complicated. Is Robin also still Catholic?
Even though there aren’t any non-Abrahamic faiths represented (that we know of; it’d be cool if Nash turned out to be Jain or Sikh), it’s still a lot of diversity compared to most stories with a large cast. I think often characters religions are just never mentioned, which can be safer but not necessarily realistic.
Yeah, Mary referred to the DeSantos as Catholic, which is one reason she wouldn’t vote for Robin. Plus, this is the US. It would be a lot harder for Robin to get elected if she weren’t, at least nominally, religious.’ Word of Willis has also said Roz is at least nominally still Catholic, and that very few characters explicitly don’t believe because Indiana has like an 80% majority of folks who at least profess to believe in god (even if the belief isn’t super important to them, like with Billie).
I mean, you can be Catholic and hate a LOT of things about the church. Like it’s stances on sex, sexuality, reproductive rights, trans rights, it’s issue with pedophilia, etc.
You do. In the same way you need a reason to not smoke weed.
(This is in reference to the days when I was more surrounded by stoners who would ask me why I don’t smoke weed, as if it was some kind of strange aberration.) hi
I wonder why Lucy thought inviting the boy she likes to church was a good idea. I mean, I absolutely loved my church (only reason I stopped going was that we moved), but ‘fun’ and ‘good place to spend time with a crush’ aren’t exactly the descriptions I’d use for the place. Maybe her church is really informal.
Partly I think she’s just not as socially adept as she thinks she is, but also she’s not ashamed of the “uncool” things she likes, so maybe that extends to church? She doesn’t care if it’s seen as “square”, she likes to go to church.
But seriously, yeah, what was she thinking. Especially considering the boy she likes is Walky. Like, one look at the guy should let you know he’s not gonna wake up at 7 AM for anything.
When I was a teenager, I invited the girl I liked to church because I cared about her and at that time, that meant I wanted her to become a believer and be saved. She was never interested, though, and I was never pushy about it, so it didn’t go anywhere.
Inviting crushes to church is actually a common precursor to actual dating for some devout Christians.
Source: I went to a conservative Christian university in South Carolina for a couple years. Only got invited to church once. 🙁 I was one of a small handful of atheists on campus, so I respectfully declined.
Oof yeah, I forgot that’s a thing. Catholic here, was dating a kid who attended a Universal church in the second half of hs. He invited me to his church, to which I (goaded by fam) responded with an invitation to mine (apparently I just…can’t go to any ol’ church, gotta be Catholic) and he balked lmao which was great for me b.c we weren’t going to last. I think it’s a method employed by a number of Christians to attempt to make sure their possible future partner follows their same denomination, partially b.c it’s assumed that whoever strikes first and has the superior religion gets to decide their kids’ faith.
Except he didn’t even remember that he was in the show until this year. This insinuates that he really hasn’t been recognized before (at least not to his face).
I’m with Walky on this one.
I don’t even have anything insightful or clever to say about it.
Don’t go to church, especially out of obligation, just try to be a good person.
How does he not get sick? I bet there’s so many germs at the entrance to his immune system, they’re squeezing into each other at the door and they can’t get in.
That’s not how immune systems work. Bad hygiene does NOT give you a stronger immune system.
Mankind survived before we discovered hygienics in the same way rabbits do – by reproducing at a higher rate than disease, injury, and other forces killed them off. The average lifespan used to be much shorter for a reason.
Good grief. Germ Theory: Actually Not “Just A Theory.”
I really wish, like, middle school science classes had a whole unit on germ theory, how we discovered it, how it stood the rigorous testing of the scientific method, why other disease theories were discredited, and how that led to contemporary hygeine practices.
Just…just the sheer ignorance about underlying disease principles in our country is a serious problem. It’s how all these wacky “clean eating” “anti-vaccine” “cure cancer with smoothies” “whatever Gwenyth Paltro is pushing” junk science theories are taking root. People misunderstand the fundamentals, so alternate “theories” seem plausible.
Well, it kind of is how immune systems work. There’s at least some evidence that attempting to be too sterile is bad in a number of ways.
OTOH, it’s not how immune systems work when directly exposed to serious illnesses.
Hand-washing in daily life isn’t the panacea some treat it as. Washing (and other sterilization) in hospital settings were serious disease is common is of course critical.
In a communal setting like a college dorm, you’re probably slightly more likely to catch something someone else has if you don’t wash your hands regularly. You’re more likely to transmit something you have. OTOH, many common illnesses are airborne, so it doesn’t matter that much.
Just not washing your hands doesn’t cause germs to spontaneously infect you.
And mostly we survived without handwashing for so long because we lived in small communities with much less and slower travel, so it was harder for diseases to travel as well.
There was an experiment done is a US Army training facility about twenty-some years ago, which I read about in [i]Scientific American[/i].
What they did was to relax the inspection standards for hand-basins so that they only had to be properly clean when inspected once per week instead of pristine twice per day. Then they ordered everyone to wash they hands at least four times per day — once before each meal and at least once more.
The experimenters expected gastroenteritis to decline a bit, which it did. The thin that surprised them was that respiratory tract infections (colds and flu) fell by eighty percent. Since colds and flu made up 70% of the sick call, that means that they reduced the total sick call by 55%.
Wash your hands! Wash your hands! Wash them before you touch food. Wash them before you touch anything moist and pink, such as your lips, eyes, or genitals.
In a similar vein, study after study shows that the main cause of infections in hospitals is that senior staff don’t wash their hands between seeing one patient and the next. The more important people feel, the more likely they are to consider that they are too high-status to be dirty.
I suspect the results of the experiment is because, rather than constantly cleaning the sinks, they stopped using most of them, to have less things to clean for inspection; thus having more disease due to less hand washing, and what hand washing there was occurring in one or two common sinks. It is a common event in basic training, one of the first things that happens is some of the showers and toilets are put off limits, so they don’t have to be cleaned.
April 20…12? I was also 13 and the only school in the town I was living at was Catholic. Wednesday mass might be a contributing factor in my atheism lmfao
Excluding weddings, funerals, and baptisms,I’ve been in a church for a service five times in my life, most recently in 1979. I do visit to look at architecture, though.
Most in Australia don’t. Over 75% of marriages are performed by civil celebrants, and some of the rest by registrars at court-houses.
My brother got married four times in September: once in his wife’s family’s home, once in a courthouse, once in a surf club, and once at home. He’s doing his bit for the statistics!
The last time I went to church was a little over a year ago for a sociology class. Before that, not counting funerals and a couple weddings… probably when I was 7 or something?
Wedding and funeral squad, represent. I’ve also attended “Vacation Bible School” and been bamboozled into attending a real service at least twice. Churches always give me a vague feeling of anxiety and danger.
Nor does it deserve to be. You don’t ‘invite’ someone to church by knocking on their door on Sunday morning. You bring up the subject of religious belief in a different conversation, held days before you’re thinking about doing this, then, if they are at LEAST ambivalent about the subject, you can suggest going to your church sometime. The gentle assumption that anyone you meet is of the same/compatible faith as yourself is one of the better examples of the ‘gentle arrogance’ of most otherwise congenial Christians in the U.S.
I don’t see any problem with it here? She’s literally just inviting him to come with her
I get that religion makes it more complex, but to me it feels just as harmless as if she’d invited him to go see Endgame, without even knowing if he’s seen the 20 prerequisites or his movie tastes
“Would you like to do [activity] with me?” is a pretty gentle question, and is actually much less invasive than bringing up religion with them. This way it’s a yes or no question. There’s the opportunity to discuss their religion as part of their explanation if they feel comfortable doing so, or just saying “no thanks” and leaving it at that
So does asking people about their religious beliefs.
As an atheist, I would be more comfortable being invited to come along with someone to church than asked about my beliefs.
Invite me to church, and I only have to decline. Ask me what I believe out of the blue and I’m a lot more likely to worry about why you want to know, and whether answering honestly will lead to judgment or an annoying interrogation
Except she immediately jumps into trying to probe why he doesn’t want to go, asking about ‘irreconcilable beliefs’. And, again, the timing matters. “Hey, I’m going to church tomorrow/this Sunday, would you like to come?” is vastly different than, “Hey, you were obviously planning on sleeping in, but I don’t care because do you want to go to church?”
I’m not saying she’s doing this deliberately. I’m saying that, in her own way, she’s almost as clueless as Joyce on how people outside her sphere of experience actually interact with the world.
I guess? I would be fine with it in this context, since her motivation for asking is clearly just that she wants to do something together, but I at least understand how it could still be uncomfortable/unwelcome/worrying for other people
I agree she’s showing a degree of clueless, but I think she’s got MILES to do before she’s in Joyce’s ballpark
I think the problem has less to do with WHERE she’s inviting him, and more to do with WHEN she’s extending the invitation.
It’s not uncommon for people to be much less polite in their responses, when 10 seconds beforehand, they were asleep, as Walky probably was. It’s a nice consideration for the other person.
So while I doubt that he would’ve said yes anyway, Lucy would’ve been better served to have asked Walky later in the day, BEFORE Sunday.
On the plus side, Lucy does get to learn that Walky is not a morning person.
Waking him up to ask him to accompany her somewhere is kind of pushing it, though. Sure, maybe she thought he’d be a morning person, but even so, it’s a weird time to drop in on people, especially to ask them out.
If she’d run into him in the dining hall and asked him, sure, no problem. But she didn’t. She came to his room — in a different dorm, not even just a different wing of hers — which makes it hugely deliberate. It’s not -just- like asking him to watch a movie.
Sure, at first he seems amenable, but note that her original question sounds like “Hey, want to hang out later?” as opposed to right away. Which is sort of how Walky takes it — OK, go to church, then when you’re back we can figure out what else to do. Hanging out sounds fun, but NOT right now, because I’m going back to bed.
Knocking on the door in the morning to say “Come to church” is just… well, Mormon territory. Jehovah’s Witness territory. Even if it’s not intentional, that’s how it comes across.
Two strips ago she was inviting Billie to church, so if it’s a date it’s a very spontaneous one.
I think she mostly wants someone to go to church with her, and is asking her roommate and crush. Or inviting them because she’s the sort of Christian who does that.
What in the world does ‘pretty exciting service’ even mean? The only thing I can really think of that would fit that description is those services where people catch the holy ghost and roll around on the ground. Or maybe the ones where there’s a big choir and a whole lotta singing? Or the Sister Act movies. Basically what I’m saying is I’d totally watch the Sister Act movies every Sunday.
He’s not exactly awake, though. Even if he did open the door. Let’s recall that he once broke up with Dorothy for waking him up early to ask if he wanted to go running.
Actually, I disagree. Assuming that someone would be interested in going to church with you, without any sort of conversation that isn’t timed to put you on the spot (like, say, first thing Sunday morning) is actually rude as hell.
She’s clearly had no conversations with Walky about faith or religion, or even broached the subject with him, since she had no clue what his reaction was likely to be. She doesn’t know if he’s atheist, Jewish, Mormon or whatever. Church is NOT just a social gathering–it’s got a purpose, and inviting someone without first sounding them out about their interest in that purpose is simply clueless and rude.
No, I’m still right. Walky’s being rude, and Lucy is being naive maybe but still a very kind and sweet human. Remember she’s like 18. She doesn’t get all this crap about “not everyone wakes up at 6 in the morning to go to church”.
Okay, if we’re going to say, “These are just kids, and they’re still figuring out the social graces, and a little rudeness is to be expected all around,” I’m fine with that–it would apply to Walky as well as Lucy, and an old coot like me would probably find both of them equally annoying/amusing.
Actually, Ruth might say yes, depending on her frame of mind when asked. She’s kinda exploring what it’s like to not be depressed. I can foresee her trying a few things that she refused on gut reaction to before, just to see what they would be like in a more positive lens. Then, depending on the type of sermon, she might decide she liked it an keep going. Of course, if it’s the fire and brimstone type, I think she’d just storm out and write the concept of church off completely.
I feel more awkward being directly asked about my religious beliefs by acquaintances than I would turning down a polite invitation to someone’s church. A simple invitation allows you to elaborate or not based on how comfortable you feel with the person doing the inviting. IF Lucy did anything wrong I think it was asking followup questions (though that was kind of justified in light of Walky’s reaction. If he’d just said “no” she should have left the issue alone.)
I have said it before. I shall state it again now. With the exception of maybe Mary. Nobody deserves Walky. He’s really kinda rute, insensative, and a massive jerk.
He’s all of that occasionally, but he’s sometimes insightful, he cares about his friends, and he always drops the whole goofball routine when important things are happening. Yeah, there’s some improvement to be made, which I’m sure we’ll see over the course of his character arc, but overall there are much worse choices.
No, he does it here as well. Less dramatically. He’s been goofball in the aftermath of some things and he hasn’t been directly involved in the most serious things.
You can see this pretty obviously when he visits Billie and Ruth in the hospital: He comes in all goofy and a strip or so later essentially says “I thought being normal goofy Walky would help, but it isn’t so I’ll drop it.” (all the while not showing a hint that he’s pissed at Ruth as we find out a couple strips later.)
Apologizing to Joyce’s mom for Mike answering the phone with “Hail Satan”.
Or the whole breaking up with Dorothy arc where he planned to break up with her because he was being a distraction to her plans. Not a lot of 18 year old boys on their first love would do that. (And then in the actual break up scene went back to the gross goofball explicitly to make it easier for her.)
He can definitely be a jerk at times but you drastically underestimate how awful Mary is if you think she’s good enough for him or that he’s bad enough to deserve her
This strikes me as weird.
I’ve never met a college kid at state school that went to church. ( Except. For my college football team. They were all inducted into Church of Christ Cult, but every day was church to them )
Mind you, I’m not sure Walky’s shown any real interest in Lucy beyond hanging out. If he was seriously crushing, it might be different.
I’ve never pretended to want to be religious for a woman, but I did go to church a few times to keep one college girlfriend company. Not quite the same thing and it may have helped that she was mostly going to keep her parents from hassling her too much.
This is reminding me of that time I had a lunch date/attempted hookup with an american girl right after she got out of her regular presbyterian sunday service.
(I’ve often wondered if that last part contributed to the entire thing going south like it did)
I want this to go to Walky going to church with Lucy.
I want Lucy’s church to be a predominantly black church. The stereotypical kind with the singing, the dancing, and the “Puh-RAISE JEE-A-SUS!”
I want Walky to be surprised at how very different this is from the church that he’s used to.
I want Walky to get very into this.
I want this to be the starting point of Walky connecting to his black heritage in a way he hasn’t before, and realizing what Sal meant when she said she was blacker than him and all of this other stuff.
I want Walky to start developing a religious faith in direct contrast to Joyce losing hers.
I want these two characters to connect over their changing beliefs and give each other strength and support, even as they come to different conclusions, allowing their arcs to come together and influence each other.
Being woken up before eight A.M. by acquaintances is probably the number one motivator for college students deciding to move out of the dorms next year.
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“I’m a somniatheist”
“oh, sorry… please return to your morning service”
alt-text: ok I dated someone who didn’t clean, and yeahhhhhhh *sideeyes with enough force to create whiplash*
Your poor bits…
I chose to believe that Walky was asleep for the entire conversation.
My mother says she had a friend in college who went to St. Mattress in her first few Sundays at college.
And then there’s the Mark Lowry bit about shaking off morning people asking him to come to sunrise Bible study by naming his bed The Word, so he could tell his preacher, “I can’t talk now, I’m in The Word”.
I told people I was a Mattress Methodist in high school and college.
Lucy swiftly abandons her plans to seduce Walky by telling him to eat up because he’s skinny and come over here so she can pinch his cheeks.
Haha! 😀
Appealing to Walky’s stomach is a valid means of seducing him. Making him eat his greens is NOT.
I don’t remember anyone asking Walky to church before. I guess the results are predictable from him. (Not to mention, does he still have the same disbeliefs as in It’s Walky?)
I feel like Walky may have quipped against religion sometime in Book 2. Don’t remember exactly when, though.
I don’t think he’s religious, no. He’s made a lot of snarky comments about it, though often to get under Joyce’s skin, or when he pretended to be raptured.
Also, he already has a free get-to-haven-card since his days as a cute little mouse boy.
A literal churchmouse.
In that he is extremely 18 about being an atheist?
Walky is one of the few Atheist characters in the comic. I think it’s just him, Ruth and Dorothy.
Do we know everyone’s religious affiliation? I don’t think there’s been much diversity in that (maybe realistically for the setting). I want a Pagan character. Samhain is coming up! (In comic).
Also, what about Mike? I don’t think he is religious…and what about Danny? He seems kinda agnostic.
And don’t forget about Dina.
As I recall Danny’s probably about as nominally Christian as Billie – I think there was a strip where is mother was asking (over the phone) if he’d found a church to go to yet and he brushed the question off…
Mike is as religious as you don’t want him to be.
I think there’s a good deal of diversity, though admittedly mostly fairly mainstream. No pagans. A lot who are nominally something or other, but don’t currently go to services regularly, which is pretty common among college kids away from home for the first time. More non-practicing than agnostic.
Agatha’s Mormon. Raidah’s Muslim (and presumably Asma as well, though we haven’t seen much about her.) Amber and Roz are Catholic. Ethan and Joe are Jewish. Sierra goes to the same church Joyce has been going to, though she obviously comes from a more liberal background.
I’m not sure if it was clarified whether or not Sierra went to Joyce’s church more than once [or, in fact, whether Joyce did, as I believe that was the catholic one?].
In any case, just here to note that Sierra stated that her religious background was based in The Church of God. In other words, she was raised under a Pentecostal denomination. While Pentecostal faiths have several traits they can be associated with, the most notable element is their strong association with biblical inerrancy. In other words, Pentecostal denominations are generally not what one would refer to as “liberal”.
More simply put, Sierra’s background is probably very interesting, if she turned out as open as she is for reasons other than teenage rebellion/self-assertment.
In any case, we can at least consider it reasonable to label Sierra, our most likely candidate for paganism, as “Christian”, and leave it at that.
So yeah, I don’t think we’ve seen anyone among the regular cast who is pagan, of any eastern faith, or of any non-major faith. Well, who knows, maybe Sayid’ll surprise us! ..Galasso, probably not.
Not the Catholic one. Joyce hasn’t been to a Catholic church. She went to Jacob’s Episcopal church that has similar high church trappings and she only went there once.
She went on her first Sunday to a church that Mary suggested, along with Dorothy and Sierra. It was described as “awesome with a huge congregation” and having electric guitar and drums.
We saw her there at least one more time, again with Sierra, but this time with Ethan in tow (and Mike coming along to heckle.) Or at least I assume it was there, since it seemed similar and there was no mention of seeking another church. We know Joyce has been to church every sunday, but we can only assume it was the same one – other than the week she was home and when she went with Jacob.
There’s also apparently an Indiana version of Church of God that’s not Pentecostal, but does still look pretty conservative.
I think Agatha is a Mormon. There’s a lot of conversations back in the “Choosing My Religion” arc.
…and here I am repeating what Thejeff said. Ugh.
Is Nashita Muslim? She might be but I don’t know if it’s confirmed.
Yeah, Agatha is Mormon and Sierra is Church of God. Nash is most likely a Muslim (she has a hijab), as is Asma.
Here, have the main characters (as in those on the cast page or with profiles in the books)
Joyce – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant
Dorothy – Atheist
Walky – Agnostic of the ‘unconcerned’ variety (word of Willis)
Billie – Christian of some variety, not stated what.
Amber – Catholic (word of Willis)
Danny – Christian of some variety, not stated what.
Ethan – Jewish
Sarah – Not stated
Sal – Agnostic upbringing, went to Catholic school, no word whether any sort of religion ‘took’ (word of willis)
Ruth – Not stated iirc.
Dina – Atheist iirc (though I might be thinking of Walkyverse Dina so don’t quote me on her. Joyce also refers to her as non-Christian, but I’m not sure Joyce is accurate since she believes evolution is incompatible with Christianity)
Becky – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant, same as Joyce.
Joe – Jewish
Mike – Not stated, iirc.
Roz – Catholic
Jacob – Episcopalian
Marcie – Catholic (word of Willis)
Carla – Not stated
Leslie – Atheist
Malaya – Not stated
Lucy – Christian of some variety, not sure what. She was some stripe of ‘born again’ in Walkyverse, though.
Mary – Nondenominational fundamentalist Protestant
Raidah – Muslim.
According to Willis, most of the kids believe in god (as is true in real life Indiana) but whether or not that’s important to them varies. Billie, for instance, doesn’t place super great importance on her faith (and Danny says ‘church isn’t really super exciting or anything’). Meanwhile, Becky is faithful but irreverent (unless it’s important) and Joyce has it all memorized and internalized. Mary, on the other hand, is a definite believer but uses it like a cudgel to hurt people.
Amber being Catholic struck me as weird at first until I remembered Daredevil was a thing, and now I totally see it.
look, amber’s #1 problem is guilt
so
Catholic guilt.
*/ I could really use
To lose my Catholic conscience
‘Cause I’m getting sick
Of feeling guilty all the tiiiime */
Why?
Thank you for the list! This is helpful.
Also, Amber being Irish Catholic makes a ton of sense.
Roz…hrm. She seems likes someone who would de-convert. But then, faith is complicated. Is Robin also still Catholic?
Even though there aren’t any non-Abrahamic faiths represented (that we know of; it’d be cool if Nash turned out to be Jain or Sikh), it’s still a lot of diversity compared to most stories with a large cast. I think often characters religions are just never mentioned, which can be safer but not necessarily realistic.
Yeah, Mary referred to the DeSantos as Catholic, which is one reason she wouldn’t vote for Robin. Plus, this is the US. It would be a lot harder for Robin to get elected if she weren’t, at least nominally, religious.’ Word of Willis has also said Roz is at least nominally still Catholic, and that very few characters explicitly don’t believe because Indiana has like an 80% majority of folks who at least profess to believe in god (even if the belief isn’t super important to them, like with Billie).
Roz is most likely a cultural Catholic who rages against the Church’s teachings on sex and sexuality.
I mean, you can be Catholic and hate a LOT of things about the church. Like it’s stances on sex, sexuality, reproductive rights, trans rights, it’s issue with pedophilia, etc.
Mike hasn’t been on speaking terms with God since he was forced to move out.
As far as reasons for not going to church go, Walky’s is a good one.
Close enough, Walky. Close enough.
I mean it’s certainly not the worst I’ve heard, but I’d hesitate to call it good.
I mean… it’s not like you need a reason not to go to church.
You do. In the same way you need a reason to not smoke weed.
(This is in reference to the days when I was more surrounded by stoners who would ask me why I don’t smoke weed, as if it was some kind of strange aberration.) hi
It stinks isn’t good enough for you?
I never said you needed a reason not to go to Church.
I just said that Walky’s reason isn’t a good one, since he decided to provide a reason at all.
I can see certain problems with Walky’s belief system… but he could do worse.
Oh, well, almost every believe system comes with some problems.
I was about to say ‘Oooh, sweet, more Walkerton family info’ but then I read the alt text and I think I’m about to throw up in my mouth.
Walky, WASH YOUR HANDS.
Everyone knows germs can’t stick to McNuggets, they’re too greasy!
I wonder why Lucy thought inviting the boy she likes to church was a good idea. I mean, I absolutely loved my church (only reason I stopped going was that we moved), but ‘fun’ and ‘good place to spend time with a crush’ aren’t exactly the descriptions I’d use for the place. Maybe her church is really informal.
(aaaaaand I have no clue why my above comment is nested here. whoops?)
Partly I think she’s just not as socially adept as she thinks she is, but also she’s not ashamed of the “uncool” things she likes, so maybe that extends to church? She doesn’t care if it’s seen as “square”, she likes to go to church.
But seriously, yeah, what was she thinking. Especially considering the boy she likes is Walky. Like, one look at the guy should let you know he’s not gonna wake up at 7 AM for anything.
See, now I wonder if not knowing Walky is one of the biggest reasons why she likes Walky. 😛
That, and the fact that he’s into cartoons.
Her next seduction technique: get him to sit down and watch TTG with her.
When I was a teenager, I invited the girl I liked to church because I cared about her and at that time, that meant I wanted her to become a believer and be saved. She was never interested, though, and I was never pushy about it, so it didn’t go anywhere.
Inviting crushes to church is actually a common precursor to actual dating for some devout Christians.
Source: I went to a conservative Christian university in South Carolina for a couple years. Only got invited to church once. 🙁 I was one of a small handful of atheists on campus, so I respectfully declined.
Oof yeah, I forgot that’s a thing. Catholic here, was dating a kid who attended a Universal church in the second half of hs. He invited me to his church, to which I (goaded by fam) responded with an invitation to mine (apparently I just…can’t go to any ol’ church, gotta be Catholic) and he balked lmao which was great for me b.c we weren’t going to last. I think it’s a method employed by a number of Christians to attempt to make sure their possible future partner follows their same denomination, partially b.c it’s assumed that whoever strikes first and has the superior religion gets to decide their kids’ faith.
If I were Walky, I wouldn’t have answered my door. I feel like maybe Mike opened it and shoved him out of bed to the floor in front of it.
The first sentence isn’t anti-Lucy, by the way; it’s just pro-sleeping.
I would have thought it would have been “chorus kids keep chasing me and asking for my autograph” or somesuch.
Except he didn’t even remember that he was in the show until this year. This insinuates that he really hasn’t been recognized before (at least not to his face).
I’m with Walky on this one.
I don’t even have anything insightful or clever to say about it.
Don’t go to church, especially out of obligation, just try to be a good person.
How does he not get sick? I bet there’s so many germs at the entrance to his immune system, they’re squeezing into each other at the door and they can’t get in.
*re: alt text*
So Walky has the Three Stooges Syndrome?
He’s indestructible!
How does he not reek? He doesn’t wash his clothes and doesn’t change his underwear.
He puts on deodorant. I’m sure he has layers old old deodorant on his body, kind of like layers of lacquer on old wood.
How did mankind survive in the like several-hundred-thousand years without immediate access to a lavatory?
The answer is: the human body has an immune-system and you are not doing yourself any advantage if you do not train it.
That’s not how immune systems work. Bad hygiene does NOT give you a stronger immune system.
Mankind survived before we discovered hygienics in the same way rabbits do – by reproducing at a higher rate than disease, injury, and other forces killed them off. The average lifespan used to be much shorter for a reason.
+1
Good grief. Germ Theory: Actually Not “Just A Theory.”
I really wish, like, middle school science classes had a whole unit on germ theory, how we discovered it, how it stood the rigorous testing of the scientific method, why other disease theories were discredited, and how that led to contemporary hygeine practices.
Just…just the sheer ignorance about underlying disease principles in our country is a serious problem. It’s how all these wacky “clean eating” “anti-vaccine” “cure cancer with smoothies” “whatever Gwenyth Paltro is pushing” junk science theories are taking root. People misunderstand the fundamentals, so alternate “theories” seem plausible.
Well, it kind of is how immune systems work. There’s at least some evidence that attempting to be too sterile is bad in a number of ways.
OTOH, it’s not how immune systems work when directly exposed to serious illnesses.
Hand-washing in daily life isn’t the panacea some treat it as. Washing (and other sterilization) in hospital settings were serious disease is common is of course critical.
In a communal setting like a college dorm, you’re probably slightly more likely to catch something someone else has if you don’t wash your hands regularly. You’re more likely to transmit something you have. OTOH, many common illnesses are airborne, so it doesn’t matter that much.
Just not washing your hands doesn’t cause germs to spontaneously infect you.
And mostly we survived without handwashing for so long because we lived in small communities with much less and slower travel, so it was harder for diseases to travel as well.
There was an experiment done is a US Army training facility about twenty-some years ago, which I read about in [i]Scientific American[/i].
What they did was to relax the inspection standards for hand-basins so that they only had to be properly clean when inspected once per week instead of pristine twice per day. Then they ordered everyone to wash they hands at least four times per day — once before each meal and at least once more.
The experimenters expected gastroenteritis to decline a bit, which it did. The thin that surprised them was that respiratory tract infections (colds and flu) fell by eighty percent. Since colds and flu made up 70% of the sick call, that means that they reduced the total sick call by 55%.
Wash your hands! Wash your hands! Wash them before you touch food. Wash them before you touch anything moist and pink, such as your lips, eyes, or genitals.
In a similar vein, study after study shows that the main cause of infections in hospitals is that senior staff don’t wash their hands between seeing one patient and the next. The more important people feel, the more likely they are to consider that they are too high-status to be dirty.
THANK YOU
Neat! 🙂
There is definitely such a thing as washing too much, but that doesn’t change the fact that regular washing is good.
I suspect the results of the experiment is because, rather than constantly cleaning the sinks, they stopped using most of them, to have less things to clean for inspection; thus having more disease due to less hand washing, and what hand washing there was occurring in one or two common sinks. It is a common event in basic training, one of the first things that happens is some of the showers and toilets are put off limits, so they don’t have to be cleaned.
Not counting various weddings, I’m pretty sure the last time I was in church was with my grandma. Probably 10 or 11.
Not counting weddings and funerals, I think the last time I went to church was at Christmas in 2002, when I was 13.
April 20…12? I was also 13 and the only school in the town I was living at was Catholic. Wednesday mass might be a contributing factor in my atheism lmfao
Not counting weddings, the last time I was in a church was when I was baptized. Those happen in churches right? I must have been 1 or something.
Actually, come to think of it, I am, not sure if even been in a church wedding. So that would literally be the only time I’ve been in a church proper.
Excluding weddings, funerals, and baptisms,I’ve been in a church for a service five times in my life, most recently in 1979. I do visit to look at architecture, though.
The last wedding I was at didn’t even take place in a church.
Most in Australia don’t. Over 75% of marriages are performed by civil celebrants, and some of the rest by registrars at court-houses.
My brother got married four times in September: once in his wife’s family’s home, once in a courthouse, once in a surf club, and once at home. He’s doing his bit for the statistics!
So, does that mean that in the event your brother and his wife decide to split up, they have to get divorced four times?
Another Wedding-and-Funeralist checking in.
The last time I went to church was a little over a year ago for a sociology class. Before that, not counting funerals and a couple weddings… probably when I was 7 or something?
Wedding and funeral squad, represent. I’ve also attended “Vacation Bible School” and been bamboozled into attending a real service at least twice. Churches always give me a vague feeling of anxiety and danger.
I first read that as “Vatican Bible School” and was very confused.
Here here!!
I wholeheartedly agree with last-panel Walky!
Sleepy Walky for President!
-I’m Batz and I approve this message!
“Hear, hear.”
The easy way to remember is that the saying basically means “You should HEAR what this person has to say.”
Classic Walky response.
Lucy, continuing to be an absolute gem.
“Lucy makes a move”
It’s not super effective.
Nor does it deserve to be. You don’t ‘invite’ someone to church by knocking on their door on Sunday morning. You bring up the subject of religious belief in a different conversation, held days before you’re thinking about doing this, then, if they are at LEAST ambivalent about the subject, you can suggest going to your church sometime. The gentle assumption that anyone you meet is of the same/compatible faith as yourself is one of the better examples of the ‘gentle arrogance’ of most otherwise congenial Christians in the U.S.
I don’t see any problem with it here? She’s literally just inviting him to come with her
I get that religion makes it more complex, but to me it feels just as harmless as if she’d invited him to go see Endgame, without even knowing if he’s seen the 20 prerequisites or his movie tastes
“Would you like to do [activity] with me?” is a pretty gentle question, and is actually much less invasive than bringing up religion with them. This way it’s a yes or no question. There’s the opportunity to discuss their religion as part of their explanation if they feel comfortable doing so, or just saying “no thanks” and leaving it at that
no, it’s not as harmless and neutral as watching a movie, inviting someone to a religious gathering has a lot of connotations and baggage attached.
So does asking people about their religious beliefs.
As an atheist, I would be more comfortable being invited to come along with someone to church than asked about my beliefs.
Invite me to church, and I only have to decline. Ask me what I believe out of the blue and I’m a lot more likely to worry about why you want to know, and whether answering honestly will lead to judgment or an annoying interrogation
Except she immediately jumps into trying to probe why he doesn’t want to go, asking about ‘irreconcilable beliefs’. And, again, the timing matters. “Hey, I’m going to church tomorrow/this Sunday, would you like to come?” is vastly different than, “Hey, you were obviously planning on sleeping in, but I don’t care because do you want to go to church?”
I’m not saying she’s doing this deliberately. I’m saying that, in her own way, she’s almost as clueless as Joyce on how people outside her sphere of experience actually interact with the world.
Well there are supposed to be parallels between her and Joyce so that was probably intentional
I guess? I would be fine with it in this context, since her motivation for asking is clearly just that she wants to do something together, but I at least understand how it could still be uncomfortable/unwelcome/worrying for other people
I agree she’s showing a degree of clueless, but I think she’s got MILES to do before she’s in Joyce’s ballpark
I think the problem has less to do with WHERE she’s inviting him, and more to do with WHEN she’s extending the invitation.
It’s not uncommon for people to be much less polite in their responses, when 10 seconds beforehand, they were asleep, as Walky probably was. It’s a nice consideration for the other person.
So while I doubt that he would’ve said yes anyway, Lucy would’ve been better served to have asked Walky later in the day, BEFORE Sunday.
On the plus side, Lucy does get to learn that Walky is not a morning person.
Waking him up to ask him to accompany her somewhere is kind of pushing it, though. Sure, maybe she thought he’d be a morning person, but even so, it’s a weird time to drop in on people, especially to ask them out.
If she’d run into him in the dining hall and asked him, sure, no problem. But she didn’t. She came to his room — in a different dorm, not even just a different wing of hers — which makes it hugely deliberate. It’s not -just- like asking him to watch a movie.
Sure, at first he seems amenable, but note that her original question sounds like “Hey, want to hang out later?” as opposed to right away. Which is sort of how Walky takes it — OK, go to church, then when you’re back we can figure out what else to do. Hanging out sounds fun, but NOT right now, because I’m going back to bed.
Knocking on the door in the morning to say “Come to church” is just… well, Mormon territory. Jehovah’s Witness territory. Even if it’s not intentional, that’s how it comes across.
I think Lucy tried to ask Walky out for a date, but didn’t manage to pick a good excuse activity for it.
The date was the point, not the church.
Two strips ago she was inviting Billie to church, so if it’s a date it’s a very spontaneous one.
I think she mostly wants someone to go to church with her, and is asking her roommate and crush. Or inviting them because she’s the sort of Christian who does that.
So, my take on this is that Hymmel didn’t quite be the salvation for Walky’s soul it would want to be.
Actually, thanks to a little known clause, it not only saved his soul, but exempted him from church in perpetuity.
That’s probably for the best.
What in the world does ‘pretty exciting service’ even mean? The only thing I can really think of that would fit that description is those services where people catch the holy ghost and roll around on the ground. Or maybe the ones where there’s a big choir and a whole lotta singing? Or the Sister Act movies. Basically what I’m saying is I’d totally watch the Sister Act movies every Sunday.
I imagine a “pretty exciting service” would probably go something like this.
Walky is definitely too lazy to attend that service.
I knew, or at least guessed where that was going.
I’m still kind of sad that’s not what Jacob’s church was like. I would have loved to see Joyce’s reaction.
She might have liked it more…
That is the first thing that popped into my mind.
Maybe it’s like one of Reverend Curry’s sermons?
Any service at a Southern Black Church.
So… Not likely the one they’d be going to.
I assume skimmying might be involved.
Snarking coherently before your eyes have even opened in the morning: this is the most relatable Walky has ever been to me.
Avatar is appropriate!
I’m impressed by Lucy. It takes a lot of guts to invite the cute boy you have a crush on to church.
But don’t be dissuaded, Lucy. He totally gave you an opening for after the sermon. Take him to HIS place of worship… like a burger king.
Your positive spin on this is the comment this comments section needs.
Thank you, I needed this comment
Your gravatar goes pretty great with that comment.
I can totally see Lucy find her way to the wise sage
bartender pizza server Becky to ask for advice.Go me for fudging up the html.
OK, take two…
I can totally see Lucy find her way to the wise sage
bartenderpizza server Becky to ask for advice.Walky’s actually being a prick here. Not wanting to go to church is one thing but you don’t have to insult her for inviting you.
He’s not exactly awake, though. Even if he did open the door. Let’s recall that he once broke up with Dorothy for waking him up early to ask if he wanted to go running.
Actually, I disagree. Assuming that someone would be interested in going to church with you, without any sort of conversation that isn’t timed to put you on the spot (like, say, first thing Sunday morning) is actually rude as hell.
She’s clearly had no conversations with Walky about faith or religion, or even broached the subject with him, since she had no clue what his reaction was likely to be. She doesn’t know if he’s atheist, Jewish, Mormon or whatever. Church is NOT just a social gathering–it’s got a purpose, and inviting someone without first sounding them out about their interest in that purpose is simply clueless and rude.
I read Walky’s reaction as intending to insult church rather than Lucy
I’m fairly sure he doesn’t ACTUALLY think Lucy is mean
I can understand not being the most coherent or friendly when you’ve only just woke up.
Waking someone up at Butt O’Clock in the morning to ask if they want to go to church? You get what you deserve.
The kind of people who go to church are already up at this point.
*looks at last comic*
Yeah, that checks out.
There is a time for inviting someone to church.
That time is not right before you’d need to put pants on to head to church.
Sorry, but the only thing I’ll knock Walky for here is just not outright saying “I’m not religious and I like to sleep in”.
No, I’m still right. Walky’s being rude, and Lucy is being naive maybe but still a very kind and sweet human. Remember she’s like 18. She doesn’t get all this crap about “not everyone wakes up at 6 in the morning to go to church”.
like you can say Lucy’s also acting inappropriately, which makes a rude reaction justified, but… cool motive, still rude?
Like it’s not that grave an accusation, hes just being a dick.
No you are still wrong!
Inviting someone to church without ever having talked about their religious believe/world view is rude!
Okay, if we’re going to say, “These are just kids, and they’re still figuring out the social graces, and a little rudeness is to be expected all around,” I’m fine with that–it would apply to Walky as well as Lucy, and an old coot like me would probably find both of them equally annoying/amusing.
So I’m *not* the only person who feels neutral about this…
Like Walky and Billie I just want to rest on Sunday without having to explain why with philosophy and science.
If I wanted to be read a fantasy novel before noon I’d just listen to an audio book of lord of the rings. least I could fall back asleep then lmfao
Lucy is picking entirely the wrong people to ask to go to church with her today.
I wonder, will she try Ruth and Carla next? That’ll be hilarious.
Actually, Ruth might say yes, depending on her frame of mind when asked. She’s kinda exploring what it’s like to not be depressed. I can foresee her trying a few things that she refused on gut reaction to before, just to see what they would be like in a more positive lens. Then, depending on the type of sermon, she might decide she liked it an keep going. Of course, if it’s the fire and brimstone type, I think she’d just storm out and write the concept of church off completely.
Why can’t someone just introduce her to Sierra? Lucy deserves kindness.
Maybe they’ll run into each other!
Just ask him if he wants to hang out after church, Lucy.
Now I desperately want to meet Granny Walkerton.
Hopefully she’s better than Granny Mitchell, from Linda’s side.
I wholeheartedly agree with panel 5 Walky.
Lucy you’re the kindest twat I’ve ever seen and I’ve seen Joyce at the start of the series. Ask people before inviting them to church.
This is my problem with Lucy she’s a good person but she just slips up in what can be perceived as minor ways but just tick me right the heck off.
God forbid people have flaws
It’s okay to have flaws it’s just her flaws REALLY piss me off in a person
Is… Is inviting not asking?
I feel more awkward being directly asked about my religious beliefs by acquaintances than I would turning down a polite invitation to someone’s church. A simple invitation allows you to elaborate or not based on how comfortable you feel with the person doing the inviting. IF Lucy did anything wrong I think it was asking followup questions (though that was kind of justified in light of Walky’s reaction. If he’d just said “no” she should have left the issue alone.)
I disagree, I love bringing up religion when in first meeting someone just so I know boundaries in conversation
Wally has about the same eyes I have right now
I have said it before. I shall state it again now. With the exception of maybe Mary. Nobody deserves Walky. He’s really kinda rute, insensative, and a massive jerk.
He’s all of that occasionally, but he’s sometimes insightful, he cares about his friends, and he always drops the whole goofball routine when important things are happening. Yeah, there’s some improvement to be made, which I’m sure we’ll see over the course of his character arc, but overall there are much worse choices.
“but overall there are much worse choices.”
E.g., Ryan.
That was all over in the Walkyverse though.
Over here, thus far (as far as I can remember), he’s actually gone Full Goofball whenever things start to get serious.
No, he does it here as well. Less dramatically. He’s been goofball in the aftermath of some things and he hasn’t been directly involved in the most serious things.
You can see this pretty obviously when he visits Billie and Ruth in the hospital: He comes in all goofy and a strip or so later essentially says “I thought being normal goofy Walky would help, but it isn’t so I’ll drop it.” (all the while not showing a hint that he’s pissed at Ruth as we find out a couple strips later.)
Apologizing to Joyce’s mom for Mike answering the phone with “Hail Satan”.
Or the whole breaking up with Dorothy arc where he planned to break up with her because he was being a distraction to her plans. Not a lot of 18 year old boys on their first love would do that. (And then in the actual break up scene went back to the gross goofball explicitly to make it easier for her.)
Walky’s an interesting character.
He noticed Billies depressive mood and tried his best to help her.
How is that “full goofball”?
He can definitely be a jerk at times but you drastically underestimate how awful Mary is if you think she’s good enough for him or that he’s bad enough to deserve her
He’s a fuckup, not a monster
As someone with a massive hatred of germs on the hands, I must say this:
WALKY GO WASH YOUR DEXTER-DANGED HANDS OR I WILL FIND ENOUGH bongoES AND LET THEM STEAL YOUR NEXT NUGGET SET!
Is it just me, or does Walky look a lot like Arnold this morning?
This strikes me as weird.
I’ve never met a college kid at state school that went to church. ( Except. For my college football team. They were all inducted into Church of Christ Cult, but every day was church to them )
I work at a state university and there’s lots of students who go to church. Everything from cult-like CRU to Episcopalian to fundy.
Seems Walky won’t pretend to be religious in order to date someone. I like the honesty, because faith can be very important to some people.
Now, will we find out how important that is to Lucy?
(I’m agnostic, and never pretended to want to go to church in order to get on a woman’s good side. That may skew my opinion.)
Mind you, I’m not sure Walky’s shown any real interest in Lucy beyond hanging out. If he was seriously crushing, it might be different.
I’ve never pretended to want to be religious for a woman, but I did go to church a few times to keep one college girlfriend company. Not quite the same thing and it may have helped that she was mostly going to keep her parents from hassling her too much.
Does her church have pyrotechnics? Do they get to watch Spider-Man after the service? Or during it?
This is reminding me of that time I had a lunch date/attempted hookup with an american girl right after she got out of her regular presbyterian sunday service.
(I’ve often wondered if that last part contributed to the entire thing going south like it did)
(I know next to nothing about Presbytherians or what that strain says about sex in general)
See, I know where I want this to go.
I want this to go to Walky going to church with Lucy.
I want Lucy’s church to be a predominantly black church. The stereotypical kind with the singing, the dancing, and the “Puh-RAISE JEE-A-SUS!”
I want Walky to be surprised at how very different this is from the church that he’s used to.
I want Walky to get very into this.
I want this to be the starting point of Walky connecting to his black heritage in a way he hasn’t before, and realizing what Sal meant when she said she was blacker than him and all of this other stuff.
I want Walky to start developing a religious faith in direct contrast to Joyce losing hers.
I want these two characters to connect over their changing beliefs and give each other strength and support, even as they come to different conclusions, allowing their arcs to come together and influence each other.
I want a lot of things.
I don’t think Willis will give them to me.
Willis bares only one gift.
That gift is pain.
Invinting someone to church is a very cruel kind of bullying.
Lucy’s smile and Walky’s awake-but-not eyes are both delightful.
Being woken up before eight A.M. by acquaintances is probably the number one motivator for college students deciding to move out of the dorms next year.
does Walky look like Faz in Pannel one to anyone else?