IF THEY BREAK UP I WILL BE DEEPLY DISTRESSED- and also real surprised, seeing that they do seem to be still together and affectionate in everything we’ve seen thus far?
When you have a cold and your nose shuts down, you pretty much stop tasting things. If it weren’t for air, you’d have to rely on your tongue for tasting, and it’s honestly pretty limited.
…And now I am remembering the last time I had a real croissant, which was twenty years ago and in Munich, if I remember correctly. It was like biting into a cloud that was made of deliciousness. We Americans have no clue what a croissant is supposed to taste like.
…We Americans also have no idea what beer is supposed to taste like, but that is another rant or two or three or…anyway.
I find the idea that gossip will follow her interesting…I heard so little cross-dorm gossip in college. Or even that much same-dorm gossip. But I guess this involves an RA, so other RAs may know and in fact be the ones spreading the gossip.
I wonder if someone talked to Malaya about it or if she just overheard. Your point stands either way, but I’m just imaging how that conversation with Malaya would go.
I am getting the timeline all jumbled up, though. Trying to remember if Ruth and Billie were revealed before there was a break between Sal and Marcie, as a possible trail for Malaya knowing about it.
Malaya isn’t really all that interested in other people? So she’s not really interested in passing on gossip about them.
At the same time, she doesn’t really consider other people’s secrets worth protecting. So when she does hear something, she’ll be the first one to pass it on to anyone who is still talking to her.
Those people who are still talking to her are all, “If you can’t say anything nice about someone, come sit by me.”
However, Billie rooming with someone that has the sunny disposition of Joyce and is a huge nerd (what was Billie’s go to insult again?) still has plenty of places for funny jokes and hatred.
I think that would require Alice not having read the paperwork, like Sal didn’t read the paperwork. Surely there’s some level of protest she could make.
It would have needed to be some kind of weird three way swap too.
Ruth has such a soft look to her now in how she is drawn. Like it doesn’t even seem as faked on her part. Just like yes – part of it is obviously an act. But she really is growing as a person and way more…visually “normal” appearing when it comes to seeming empathetic and sociable to others
Even a box full of clothes, if it’s that big, isn’t going to be something you want to carry very far. How far from Read is Forest? And why didn’t either Billie or Malaya get either a dolly, or some friends, to help them carry their stuff?
And who would fardels bear, to grunt and sweat during a weary life?
Billie was a cheerleader. She lifted people over her head probably. Granted not for that long, but still. I have no idea why they don’t have carts or a dolly, but I think we have a pretty good idea of why the respective parties don’t have friends helping.
The dorms had carts available at my school. They were hard to get on move-in or move-out day, but easy to get the rest of the year. Not big enough to fit a PDP-11 rack, but fortunately those have wheels.
Also, it freaks people out when you load 4 racks of PDP-11 and accessories into a dorm.
I am indeed one of The Deranged Cousins. I was trying to figure out a nom du comment and it just came to me. I stumbled across the collection Amphigorey as a college freshman and I’ve been a fan ever since.
Sing Hushaboo, sing Hushaby,
The Wuggly-Ump is drawing nigh!
Remember all those times when Ruth needed you? Remember when they were all staring at Ruth when she returned? Remember when you took her hand and dared them to make a comment?
Heck, remember how you were there for Ruth when nobody else were? Remember how you were there for Ruth when she was taken to the hospital? Remember how you’d try and stand up for Ruth when she felt defeated, time and again, against different people?
I’m just saying, Ruth remembers. Ruth knows how much you’ve helped her.
And Ruth wants to help you back in any way she can.
And all things considered… I think you should just let her. I think she needs this, as much as she respects your decision.
And yeah, you may be right that gossip will follow you… So in that case, why bother hiding it? Why not just show from the get-go that you’re not going to give a single damn? And you know how to make gossip work for you.
You know, you’ve got a point.
But honestly, even if Ruth really needed to help her, I can understand Billie not wanting to cause extra drama. Taking Ruth with her into her new dorm, even if she doesn’t really care about the gossip… Itcan be extremely unnerving to still have to listen to it, so avoiding causing even more than there’ll already be seems like a good solution.
Billie’s just pragmatic – I doubt she’d want to overcomplicate things – I mean, they both have enough on their plates as it is, so anything causing extra stress seems kinda unnecessary, if avoidable. I don’t think she plans on hiding anything – but that doesn’t mean she has to demonstratively show it right at her move-in, before anyone even partly knows her. Maybe she just hopes to at least get along with those new folks in some way – and if it just is tolerating each others existence.
But that’s just my take on it…
My working theory is that she’s trying to minimize gossip, or rather, to be seen acting like she wants to minimize gossip, for the benefit of the administration. The whole reason she’s being moved is because her relationship with her RA was conflicting with Ruth’s ability to hold a job, and while not being in Ruth’s dorm anymore might make their relationship okay now, the problematic aspect of it looms close in the past. If she looks like she’s meekly complying with the ‘get them away from each other’ order, then that’s only good for Ruth.
Oh yeah, it’s not good for Billie either. Heck, let’s for not forget, she was also sent to therapy for her own depression issues.
Which is why I would try not to tell Billie she’s an asshole or something for what she just did; but just reminding her of some of the issues going on for Ruth here. See if she’d want to make a different decision that way.
Going from an archive binge of El Goonish Shive to this comic/alt-text just makes me think “Hey, Box has enough to deal with without being bodyshamed.”
Also, Joyce and the alt-text reminds me of a thing my wife and I say whenever we need to describe something, and we find ourselves lacking the necessary vocabulary to properly convey effective communication:
I:d be really surprised if they haven’t, given that people are into stuff as specific as fetishizing being the one coming to help a woman who’s freaking out at her broken down car on the side of the road, and hugging is plain old affectionate human contact.
Spotlight effect. She was similarly worried about everyone judging her after Ruth went to the hospital. She’s probably got a tendency to overestimate how much attention people will be paying to her and her issues
Billie also defined herself as a Problem Solver. She scoped parties for roofies, took down abusive boyfriends, and snuck (presumably high-school) females into Planned Parenthood clinics. Those are not to be disregarded.
The famous instance of declogging the trash chute with her still-considerable ability is part of her. Of course, also realizing her social goal of getting Walky with Dorothy happened without any of her input is also part of her.
Trust me, I’m not disregarding it. But the key word was “initial”. Nearly all of what you mentioned was not shown or mentioned until after the first book.
But all those first paragraph things are part of her preexisting paticular cheerleader alpha boingo* high school personality, and she carried them with her. She wasn’t an ordinary sort, even before the drunk driving and resulting crash and getting disinvited from IU cheerleading.
Yeah; here’s where Ruth and Billie’s relationship has its hardest test. Billie doesn’t want anymore hurtful gossip for either of them but at what point does that go back to that destructive game of pretending that they aren’t in a relationship at all?
Meanwhile, Joyce needs to learn to think ahead, or so I suspect.
the point is delicious candy and the catharsis of getting to pelt the guy you’re jealous for getting all the attention and presents and a party with gummy objects
I wish I could retort with saying I’d gladly throw entire bag of the Haribo gummy bears…
…But I know myself well enough to know that throwing a way a full bag of that delicious, yummy byproduct of animal muscle and skin flavoured with sugar would be a crime against my taste buds, so I’d have to find something else to throw at you.
…Although there are certainly places in Europe where you can find tiny bags of gummy bears.
Joyce has a building excess of affection as Amber didn’t get the allotted “share”. Last time, Billie let out an audible “oof”. This time she may end up with a cracked rib.
That box is secretly full of Yu-Gi-Oh! cards. Unbeknownst to everyone, Billie frequents the local TCG circles, and has secret DVDs of every single season of the show. She probably runs a Performapal deck, or maybe something Dragon-related.
Now I wonder what sort of decks most of this cast would use…
I get Billie is in an upset place.
Whereas she’s a bit off letting that affect her reaction to Ruth, I can ‘understand’ it
But her ‘excuse’ is sadly lacking.
Malaya already knows, the gossip is already out there. Ruth being with her won’t make one blind bit of difference other than they would ‘both’ (perhaps) be glanced at askance, instead of just an isolated Billie.
(And if that was her idea in the first place, to prevent Ruth from the added pressure… might have been better letting Ruth make that decision)
Apropos of nothing… Why do I keep spelling Malaya’s name as Mayala??
and now I know I’ve been ninja’d. Anyway, her going there alone might even start rumors that they broke up, which might get those sympathetic to Ruth angry at Billy for “abandoning” a recently suicidal girlfriend.
Did someone hit the reset button on Billie’s character development the last couple months or have I gotten it *that* wrong/read the comic strip where Billie *hadn’t* punched an old guy for Ruth’s honor or held her hand in public?
I think Rachel’s rant hit her hard, especially in all the bullshit victim-blaming ways Rachel specified. Add that to the fact that she has untreated depression too and massive self-esteem issues and it’d make sense that she’s in the space she is.
Panel 1: I feel for Ruth here. She’s still struggling with the depression, but she’s got energy today and she wants to pay forward all the care and attention Billie gave her when she didn’t and do right by her.
And that’s important for Ruth. Both her and Billie struggle with feeling like a worthy partner to the other.
But… Billie saying no and Ruth accepting that is good. Consent is important and sometimes a partner feels they need to struggle through something hard alone for their own internal reasons and it’s best not to push on that. And that’s also something Billie had to go through with Ruth, respecting her demands for isolation in specific moments or so on.
So seeing Ruth pay that respect forward is actually more meaningful and impactful than if she was to help Billie with her boxes and makes me feel so many positive feelings for a relationship that started in about as bad a way as it possibly could.
Panel 2: I feel so hard for Billie here. Like, she’s not being rude, she’s not trying to hurt Ruth, and she tries to explain her reasons and why it is not about rejecting Ruth, just her help in this moment.
And the part of this that breaks my heart is why she’s rejecting Ruth’s help here. She feels like she can’t do the normative thing of having her loved one help her move in to her new place because of the nasty rumors of others toward her.
We’ve seen how so many in the hall talked about folks potentially dating Ruth. How they were suffering from Stockholm Syndrome, how they were idiots, and so on. And since everything went down, she’s been reduced from Billie her own person to being seen mostly in context of being Ruth’s girlfriend.
And it’s clear from this that either the rumors or the way Billie feels about the conversations surrounding her that she’s being seen as incapable, insane, and owned by a violent abuser. That was part of the major theme that Rachel screamed in Ruth and Billie’s face.
And so I understand her feeling she needs to do this on her own, that having Ruth carry the boxes for her would look to folks like Rachel like more of her being a submissive dutiful wife in the thrall to her abusive partner*.
*Which by the way, fuck all the hate that survivors of abusive relationships get. Sometimes it’s hard to see red flags in one’s own relationship, you have reasons to doubt yourself that a specific slight means something and partners are good at gaslighting and using honeymoon phases to make all forgiven. And when you do figure it out, it’s not always safe to leave. Having just come out of what my therapist has helped me realize was an abusive relationship, it stings how much folks slag on the “idiocy” of folks who speak well of their abuser or have mixed feelings about the whole affair.
And I hate that Billie is made to feel that way. That she feels the need to reclaim her agency cruelly stolen from her by assholes who want to judge her love and choices. And I fully understand why she felt the need to do something to get that power back, even if it was not what she’d do in an ideal world.
I’m so glad you’re out of there. And if you, with your amazing insights into human emotions and relationships, found yourself in an abusive relationship, it’s a reminder that any of us can. I hope you’re surrounded by supportive people, and for what it’s worth, if you’re encountering victim blaming, I offer to issue an internet punch to those people.
I think that Billie’s reasoning is, on its face, not really a strong reason in itself.
But I think the important thing here is that Ruth sees behind the words and that what is -really- going on are Billie’s own depression and self-esteem issues, and how they are coming into play right now.
And that’s why she’s accepting it. Because she knows those things.
Yeah, I think Billie’s reasoning is lousy here. I think she’s doing the wrong thing.
I think it’s good for Ruth to accept it, for now. But if it leads to Billie cutting Ruth more out of her life because she wants to keep up appearances and keep the gossip down, that’s going to be bad for them and Ruth needs to push back on it. Or all that consent and acceptance leads to the end of the relationship.
After all, if Ruth helping her move in is too much for the gossip mill, what will spending nights back at Ruth’s be? We’ve all been expecting this to be a move of convenience, for her to treat this new place much like she did the room with Sal. It seems like she’s planning to take it more seriously.
It may be Billie’s own depression and self-esteem issues leading her in that direction, but if they keep leading her away and Ruth keeps accepting it, Billie’s gone.
OK, I think I worded myself somewhat badly: When I said Billie’s reasoning was not strong, I meant that it wasn’t really a reason, it was an excuse. It was not what she really meant.
Her real issues, her issues with depression and self-esteem, -those- are the reasons she could not say yes to Ruth. But she was not capable of articulating that, because those same issues prevents her from doing this.
Billie thinks of herself as a helper, not a help-ee. I’m pretty damn sure that her parents (at least her father) instilled in her the “values” that needing help is for the weak, for the pitiful. Everyone should just grab themselves up from their misery, because there’s no way one should be in a position to rely on others.
True, Billie’s nowhere near as bad as he. I mean, for one thing, she -does- try and help out people; and she’s rejecting the more obvious horrors of her father’s behaviour, once it becomes obvious to her what it really is he was doing. But still, some of that stuff remains and festers, in more insidious manners. And eventually ends up with a Billie that cannot feel happy, cannot feel like she’s worth anything, unless she’s being a “success”, an alpha bongo, the someone who solves problems.
Ruth may not understand exactly what Billie is going on about…
…But she understands that behind the excuse, there is a real reason.
… that was not what I was expecting. I didn’t think Billie would take Rachel’s BS that hard… but it does sound plausible.
What bothers me here is that Billie’s “don’t take this the wrong way” is not a magic anti-feelings charm. Ruth might well know that billie didn’t mean anything hurtful, but still *feel* hurt. Feelings do that a lot. Billie’s actions, to my feelings, scream “I’m embarrassed to be seen with you” and if Ruth’s feelings take it that way too, that’s gonna suck. 🙁
I really really hope Billie comes back and gives Ruth lots of hugs by the end of the day, because she’s likely to need it. Hell, even if billie’s comment doesn’t stir up feelings and insecurities, she’s got enough other crap on her plate already 😛 Ruth probably needs a reminder that people care about her and she doesn’t have to take everything on herself.
Panel 3: I love this panel. This is how being rejected after asking to do something with a partner that you want to do should go. She has feelings about it, a little bit of hurt and worry, which is natural, but she doesn’t dump that on Billie. She doesn’t argue and demand the right to ignore her consent.
Instead she trusts Billie and accepts it without argument and let’s her know that she respects her consent in all cases and that’s so powerful and important and beautiful.
And the wonderful irony is she wanted to help to be the good girlfriend, but by respecting her gf’s consent without question, she fulfilled that way better than helping her gf move some boxes.
This is the sort of shit that makes me feel happy for these two. That makes me want to root for these two even though their origins were so awful. And I hope Ruth can get to a place where she recognizes the quiet power of what she did.
Panel 4: And on the opposite end of the spectrum we have Joyce’s very questionable understanding of consent thanks to her religious background. In that pre-millennial dispensationalist Rapturist fundie culture, consent is seen as not a thing and may even be demonic.
What someone wants or requests doesn’t matter. Only what is good for them and good Christians are encouraged to give folks what they think is good for them whether or not they accept or not as non-acceptance or boundaries is clearly just the act of Satan trying to stiff-arm away Jesus.
And you see that starkly here, marrying the themes and showing how Joyce’s understanding of consent is as shaky as Joe’s and how both will have similar evolution processes crawling out of those worldviews.
Telling Billie she wasn’t allowed to move yet and expecting that to be obeyed and telling her she’ll receive the “hug of her life” with or without her consent. It smacks of all of that and really highlights the tender awesomeness of Ruth’s Panel 3 and how meaningful that really was when we see how hollow Joyce’s “I’m hugging you now” is.
Panel 5: I’m struck by this panel, Billie bracing and closing her eyes for this choice of Joyce’s. And it’s sad that Joyce can’t see how her choice of actions though well-meaning could be something her friend doesn’t actually want.
Panel 6: This is legitimately adorable. That is all.
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you thought you could cleverly hide the down up-arrow behind Billie’s arm, huh Willis
hey, we all have our kinks. his is messing with the natural order
His alphabet goes damnyouwilsbcefghjkpqrtuvxyz
* damnyouwilsbcefghjkpqrtuvxz
I can’t believe I fucked that up*
*this is a lie
Damnyouwilsbcefghjkpqrtvxz.
Fixed that for you.
Man I apparently suck at this?
Nice catch! I would never have noticed that at all!
Boxhugger, best moving aid ever! 😛
Better than a facehugger.
Joyce, no
Sal and her luxurious hair need you
you mean Jacob and his biceps bigger around than
JoyceSarah’s torsoWhy not both?
Ruth’s new hairstyle is growing on me.
…I should see my barber tomorrow to take care of that.
Huh. If Billie’s worried about gossip in Forest Quat, it sounds like she’s not just planning on moving in with Ruth.
I know. That really saddens me. It’s what I wanted to happen so bad. I honestly can’t help but fear at this point that they may break up…
IF THEY BREAK UP I WILL BE DEEPLY DISTRESSED- and also real surprised, seeing that they do seem to be still together and affectionate in everything we’ve seen thus far?
“I wuv you, box”
“I love you too, human female”
“AAAAH”
“AAAAH”
*Faz falls out of the box, scampers away on all fours*
I love you red solo cup
“i love you, cold unfeeling robot arm!”
He is not cold and unfeeling, but sentient and caring, and his name is Jeremy. (And he has since added limbs.)
http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3414
It’s Bo-ox
It’s Box
It’s big
It’s heavy
It’s brown
It’s Box
It’s Box
It’s better than round
It’s square
Oh, is that what they call “hugboxing”? I was wondering about that.
Boxes are not for hugs nor fugs.
“Hugbox” is one of the most condescending fucking terms I’ve ever seen tossed at someone.
It also just seems like a weird insult. “You’re a sweet, caring group that tries to keep everyone happy!”
Honestly, I’ve mostly seen it used ironically in queer communities.
Great, now Joyce is also face-first in Billie’s box! 😉
It’s basically inevitable.
Ha! But then Joyce dies of hanky pankreatitis.
I’m still upset that more people like cake donuts compared to yeast donuts.
It’s okay, more yeast donuts for us.
Unless I eat them all before you get to this mythical donut picnic, which. No promises.
“If she likes some beer,
She and I’ll agree,
If she dinnae like it
All the mair for me!”
Yeah, if I liked yeast donuts, I’d be constantly upset, too. I’ll pray for you!
Yeast-lovers need all the prayers they can get, the poor fools.
I’m not, but I am surprised that so many people like donuts that are mostly air.
Hey, don’t go dissing air. That shit’s piquant as fuck.
Let me help making the air a bit more piquant!
When you have a cold and your nose shuts down, you pretty much stop tasting things. If it weren’t for air, you’d have to rely on your tongue for tasting, and it’s honestly pretty limited.
…And now I am remembering the last time I had a real croissant, which was twenty years ago and in Munich, if I remember correctly. It was like biting into a cloud that was made of deliciousness. We Americans have no clue what a croissant is supposed to taste like.
…We Americans also have no idea what beer is supposed to taste like, but that is another rant or two or three or…anyway.
It’s like county fair fried dough, but you can get it any time you want!
Eh, Willis got it right.
More people like cake donuts.
But yeast donuts still win.
Boxes: Joyce’s true weakness.
What is the right way to take that, Billie? I can’t think of one.
Don’t worry, Billie, if you let Joyce carry your boxes over nobody will gossip about your sleeping with Ruth
They’ll just assume Joyce is Ruth.
Joyce, boundaries!
You mean, like a box?
I hope you’re serious about that book title.
I hope he’s not, because that title can be taken the wrong way.
I hope he is, because that title can be taken the wrong way.
Heh, Joyce flailing her arms as she tries to hug Billie is adorable.
*facepalm*
damnit billie… that is not the way to talk to your girlfriend.
Billie: SHE’S NOT MY GIRLFRIEND!!
*glances about, pulls Ruth into broom closet*
It really is not… Billie, please.
I find the idea that gossip will follow her interesting…I heard so little cross-dorm gossip in college. Or even that much same-dorm gossip. But I guess this involves an RA, so other RAs may know and in fact be the ones spreading the gossip.
Malaya already knows about it, so yeah it’s definitely spread to other wings.
I wonder if someone talked to Malaya about it or if she just overheard. Your point stands either way, but I’m just imaging how that conversation with Malaya would go.
I am getting the timeline all jumbled up, though. Trying to remember if Ruth and Billie were revealed before there was a break between Sal and Marcie, as a possible trail for Malaya knowing about it.
I didn’t really consider Malaya a gossiper. I thought she’d find other people too annoying to be worth talking about.
Malaya isn’t really all that interested in other people? So she’s not really interested in passing on gossip about them.
At the same time, she doesn’t really consider other people’s secrets worth protecting. So when she does hear something, she’ll be the first one to pass it on to anyone who is still talking to her.
Those people who are still talking to her are all, “If you can’t say anything nice about someone, come sit by me.”
So maximum drama predict:
Billie’s new roommate is Alice.
Pretty sure it’s Lucy.
However, Billie rooming with someone that has the sunny disposition of Joyce and is a huge nerd (what was Billie’s go to insult again?) still has plenty of places for funny jokes and hatred.
The funny thing is that with these gravatars this looks like Joe disagreeing with himself.
Minimum Drama Predict: Billie’s new roommate is Lucy.
Which is really the only reason I can think of for it to not happen.
I think that would require Alice not having read the paperwork, like Sal didn’t read the paperwork. Surely there’s some level of protest she could make.
It would have needed to be some kind of weird three way swap too.
And that would mean we wouldn’t see more of Lucy.
🙁
Ruth has such a soft look to her now in how she is drawn. Like it doesn’t even seem as faked on her part. Just like yes – part of it is obviously an act. But she really is growing as a person and way more…visually “normal” appearing when it comes to seeming empathetic and sociable to others
Personal growth combined with meds.
To quote Autolycus, What’s i’th’ fardel?
Even a box full of clothes, if it’s that big, isn’t going to be something you want to carry very far. How far from Read is Forest? And why didn’t either Billie or Malaya get either a dolly, or some friends, to help them carry their stuff?
And who would fardels bear, to grunt and sweat during a weary life?
Billie was a cheerleader. She lifted people over her head probably. Granted not for that long, but still. I have no idea why they don’t have carts or a dolly, but I think we have a pretty good idea of why the respective parties don’t have friends helping.
Yeah, Billie didn’t ask anyone and put off those who offered and Malaya hasn’t any.
They don’t have carts or a dolly because they’re 18.
So? I had friends who moved dorms during freshman year, and they did so with the assistance of things with wheels.
The dorms had carts available at my school. They were hard to get on move-in or move-out day, but easy to get the rest of the year. Not big enough to fit a PDP-11 rack, but fortunately those have wheels.
Also, it freaks people out when you load 4 racks of PDP-11 and accessories into a dorm.
That’s a very specific example item.
Are you from an Edward Gorey book, by the way?
I am indeed one of The Deranged Cousins. I was trying to figure out a nom du comment and it just came to me. I stumbled across the collection Amphigorey as a college freshman and I’ve been a fan ever since.
Sing Hushaboo, sing Hushaby,
The Wuggly-Ump is drawing nigh!
*plays Corey Hart’s “Boy In The Box” on the hacked Muzak*
Billie…
Remember all those times when Ruth needed you? Remember when they were all staring at Ruth when she returned? Remember when you took her hand and dared them to make a comment?
Heck, remember how you were there for Ruth when nobody else were? Remember how you were there for Ruth when she was taken to the hospital? Remember how you’d try and stand up for Ruth when she felt defeated, time and again, against different people?
I’m just saying, Ruth remembers. Ruth knows how much you’ve helped her.
And Ruth wants to help you back in any way she can.
And all things considered… I think you should just let her. I think she needs this, as much as she respects your decision.
And yeah, you may be right that gossip will follow you… So in that case, why bother hiding it? Why not just show from the get-go that you’re not going to give a single damn? And you know how to make gossip work for you.
You know, you’ve got a point.
But honestly, even if Ruth really needed to help her, I can understand Billie not wanting to cause extra drama. Taking Ruth with her into her new dorm, even if she doesn’t really care about the gossip… Itcan be extremely unnerving to still have to listen to it, so avoiding causing even more than there’ll already be seems like a good solution.
Billie’s just pragmatic – I doubt she’d want to overcomplicate things – I mean, they both have enough on their plates as it is, so anything causing extra stress seems kinda unnecessary, if avoidable. I don’t think she plans on hiding anything – but that doesn’t mean she has to demonstratively show it right at her move-in, before anyone even partly knows her. Maybe she just hopes to at least get along with those new folks in some way – and if it just is tolerating each others existence.
But that’s just my take on it…
My working theory is that she’s trying to minimize gossip, or rather, to be seen acting like she wants to minimize gossip, for the benefit of the administration. The whole reason she’s being moved is because her relationship with her RA was conflicting with Ruth’s ability to hold a job, and while not being in Ruth’s dorm anymore might make their relationship okay now, the problematic aspect of it looms close in the past. If she looks like she’s meekly complying with the ‘get them away from each other’ order, then that’s only good for Ruth.
Oh yeah, it’s not good for Billie either. Heck, let’s for not forget, she was also sent to therapy for her own depression issues.
Which is why I would try not to tell Billie she’s an asshole or something for what she just did; but just reminding her of some of the issues going on for Ruth here. See if she’d want to make a different decision that way.
I really would like to see some follow up on Billie’s therapy. We don’t even know if she’s actually gone, do we?
This is quite unusual. Normally Billie only lets Ruth handle her box.
In retrospect, I see I have been beaten to the double entendre.
I wonder if they ever did a ‘box opening’ video together. :3
It brings a whole new level of meaning to “open box sales”…
The gossip will probably follow Billie regardless, so she should’ve just let Ruth help anyway.
Going from an archive binge of El Goonish Shive to this comic/alt-text just makes me think “Hey, Box has enough to deal with without being bodyshamed.”
I’m pretty sure Box is shameless apart from the occasional attack of actual harm-based morality.
Plus she has some level of shapeshifting ability.
It’s probably been said a million times already, but Ruth looks super-cute with short hair!
That “okay” sounds pretty uncertain.
Joyce Hugs the DoA Universe
Isn’t Billie just going to move in with Ruth.
Also, Joyce and the alt-text reminds me of a thing my wife and I say whenever we need to describe something, and we find ourselves lacking the necessary vocabulary to properly convey effective communication:
“Words hard.”
That’s kinda nice 🙂 I usually refer to it with “language difficult” or “brain not thinking”
better than what I say, which is usually a self-deprecating: “God, I’m dumb”. Which normal me knows is wrong
Great job telling the depressed person with abandonment issues that you don’t want your new social circle to see that she exists.
Yeah. :/
Yeahhhh I’m really feeling for Ruth now. Ouch. :C
who’s your avatar? I like it
No idea, I don’t recognize it either.
The image title says she’s called Beatrice. New character, I guess?
all I know is she’s cute
That’s why she said.
Got a weird optical illusion going on with Ruth’s collarbones.
Joyce, you don’t give someone the hugging of their life without negotiating consent and establishing a safeword first.
and now I need to wiki walk to find out if anyone has ever been recorded orgasming from a hug. I blame you if I’m late to class, Mr. Ninjason
I:d be really surprised if they haven’t, given that people are into stuff as specific as fetishizing being the one coming to help a woman who’s freaking out at her broken down car on the side of the road, and hugging is plain old affectionate human contact.
Ok, so Malaya prodding her about Ruth made Billie defensive. But why does she think everyone else will be as aggressive about it?
Spotlight effect. She was similarly worried about everyone judging her after Ruth went to the hospital. She’s probably got a tendency to overestimate how much attention people will be paying to her and her issues
Remember, her initial character could be summed up as “I used to be a cheerleader, pay attention to me!”
Yeah, she’s based an unhealthy amount of her self-worth on how she’s perceived by others
and yet the image she projects has little appeal to anyone, outside of horny, dumb young kids. Ironic
Tries to project, at least. The image, and I hate to use this word, is “loose alpha bongo cheerleader”
Billie also defined herself as a Problem Solver. She scoped parties for roofies, took down abusive boyfriends, and snuck (presumably high-school) females into Planned Parenthood clinics. Those are not to be disregarded.
The famous instance of declogging the trash chute with her still-considerable ability is part of her. Of course, also realizing her social goal of getting Walky with Dorothy happened without any of her input is also part of her.
Trust me, I’m not disregarding it. But the key word was “initial”. Nearly all of what you mentioned was not shown or mentioned until after the first book.
But all those first paragraph things are part of her preexisting paticular cheerleader alpha boingo* high school personality, and she carried them with her. She wasn’t an ordinary sort, even before the drunk driving and resulting crash and getting disinvited from IU cheerleading.
*Misspelled on purpose.
Yeah; here’s where Ruth and Billie’s relationship has its hardest test. Billie doesn’t want anymore hurtful gossip for either of them but at what point does that go back to that destructive game of pretending that they aren’t in a relationship at all?
Meanwhile, Joyce needs to learn to think ahead, or so I suspect.
Don’t you mean Joyce needs to learn to think outside the box?
*Loud groans from the audience*
*throws sunkist gummies at the Emperor. A sign of respect in my religion*
Haribo gummy bears or death!
*joking* that’s antisemitism!
Don’t you mean anti-gummytism?
Nope. As I said, it’s basically a tradition old enough to be halachah (local traditions considered as valid as Talmud interpretations) by now
I suppose every pointless tradition has to start somewhere.
the point is delicious candy and the catharsis of getting to pelt the guy you’re jealous for getting all the attention and presents and a party with gummy objects
also, sunkists are pre-wrapped
I wish I could retort with saying I’d gladly throw entire bag of the Haribo gummy bears…
…But I know myself well enough to know that throwing a way a full bag of that delicious, yummy byproduct of animal muscle and skin flavoured with sugar would be a crime against my taste buds, so I’d have to find something else to throw at you.
…Although there are certainly places in Europe where you can find tiny bags of gummy bears.
i feel this is equally difficult for billie and ruth for different reasons.
Joyce has a building excess of affection as Amber didn’t get the allotted “share”. Last time, Billie let out an audible “oof”. This time she may end up with a cracked rib.
*http://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-7/04-the-do-list/comforting/
I’m starting to think that Joyce may be this universe’s Princess of Venus, given that love appears to give her superhuman strength. Henshin yo!
“Can’t… hug… box is too big and arms too small”
* Sound of fragile Billingsworth heirlooms cracking and shattering from the force of Joycehug *
That box is secretly full of Yu-Gi-Oh! cards. Unbeknownst to everyone, Billie frequents the local TCG circles, and has secret DVDs of every single season of the show. She probably runs a Performapal deck, or maybe something Dragon-related.
Now I wonder what sort of decks most of this cast would use…
Who has two thumbs and forgot to close his fucking bold code like a complete noob?
What about your regular bold code?
It took a vow of chastity and is currently in the middle of a five-year stay in the Andes.
Joyce is adorable.
I recognise your Gravatar from elsewhere. Is it a coincidence, by any chance?
I get Billie is in an upset place.
Whereas she’s a bit off letting that affect her reaction to Ruth, I can ‘understand’ it
But her ‘excuse’ is sadly lacking.
Malaya already knows, the gossip is already out there. Ruth being with her won’t make one blind bit of difference other than they would ‘both’ (perhaps) be glanced at askance, instead of just an isolated Billie.
(And if that was her idea in the first place, to prevent Ruth from the added pressure… might have been better letting Ruth make that decision)
Apropos of nothing… Why do I keep spelling Malaya’s name as Mayala??
and now I know I’ve been ninja’d. Anyway, her going there alone might even start rumors that they broke up, which might get those sympathetic to Ruth angry at Billy for “abandoning” a recently suicidal girlfriend.
Roses are red,
boxes are large,
where is Susan,
and where, also, is Marge?
That’s true you know. Box IS large.
1) You’re still trying to keep this relationship secret? Kid, that cat shredded the bag days ago. Someone will tell them.
2) If you go there with Joyce and her sexy, blood-stained sweater, that will just cause even more rumors.
Yes, new gravatar is go! And all I had to do was fragrantly bluff the rating system, as I am -sure- skulls at least require a pg rating
Also, are the blood-stains ever visible?
Did someone hit the reset button on Billie’s character development the last couple months or have I gotten it *that* wrong/read the comic strip where Billie *hadn’t* punched an old guy for Ruth’s honor or held her hand in public?
I think Rachel’s rant hit her hard, especially in all the bullshit victim-blaming ways Rachel specified. Add that to the fact that she has untreated depression too and massive self-esteem issues and it’d make sense that she’s in the space she is.
Is box the new euphemism for Billie’s boobs?
It’s already a euphemism for her box.
A box being a euphemism for a box…
This is going to be a deep rabbit hole to fall into, isn’t it?
Comic Reactions:
I have so many feels on this one.
Panel 1: I feel for Ruth here. She’s still struggling with the depression, but she’s got energy today and she wants to pay forward all the care and attention Billie gave her when she didn’t and do right by her.
And that’s important for Ruth. Both her and Billie struggle with feeling like a worthy partner to the other.
But… Billie saying no and Ruth accepting that is good. Consent is important and sometimes a partner feels they need to struggle through something hard alone for their own internal reasons and it’s best not to push on that. And that’s also something Billie had to go through with Ruth, respecting her demands for isolation in specific moments or so on.
So seeing Ruth pay that respect forward is actually more meaningful and impactful than if she was to help Billie with her boxes and makes me feel so many positive feelings for a relationship that started in about as bad a way as it possibly could.
Panel 2: I feel so hard for Billie here. Like, she’s not being rude, she’s not trying to hurt Ruth, and she tries to explain her reasons and why it is not about rejecting Ruth, just her help in this moment.
And the part of this that breaks my heart is why she’s rejecting Ruth’s help here. She feels like she can’t do the normative thing of having her loved one help her move in to her new place because of the nasty rumors of others toward her.
We’ve seen how so many in the hall talked about folks potentially dating Ruth. How they were suffering from Stockholm Syndrome, how they were idiots, and so on. And since everything went down, she’s been reduced from Billie her own person to being seen mostly in context of being Ruth’s girlfriend.
And it’s clear from this that either the rumors or the way Billie feels about the conversations surrounding her that she’s being seen as incapable, insane, and owned by a violent abuser. That was part of the major theme that Rachel screamed in Ruth and Billie’s face.
And so I understand her feeling she needs to do this on her own, that having Ruth carry the boxes for her would look to folks like Rachel like more of her being a submissive dutiful wife in the thrall to her abusive partner*.
*Which by the way, fuck all the hate that survivors of abusive relationships get. Sometimes it’s hard to see red flags in one’s own relationship, you have reasons to doubt yourself that a specific slight means something and partners are good at gaslighting and using honeymoon phases to make all forgiven. And when you do figure it out, it’s not always safe to leave. Having just come out of what my therapist has helped me realize was an abusive relationship, it stings how much folks slag on the “idiocy” of folks who speak well of their abuser or have mixed feelings about the whole affair.
And I hate that Billie is made to feel that way. That she feels the need to reclaim her agency cruelly stolen from her by assholes who want to judge her love and choices. And I fully understand why she felt the need to do something to get that power back, even if it was not what she’d do in an ideal world.
And that sucks.
I’m so glad you’re out of there. And if you, with your amazing insights into human emotions and relationships, found yourself in an abusive relationship, it’s a reminder that any of us can. I hope you’re surrounded by supportive people, and for what it’s worth, if you’re encountering victim blaming, I offer to issue an internet punch to those people.
I think that Billie’s reasoning is, on its face, not really a strong reason in itself.
But I think the important thing here is that Ruth sees behind the words and that what is -really- going on are Billie’s own depression and self-esteem issues, and how they are coming into play right now.
And that’s why she’s accepting it. Because she knows those things.
Yeah, I think Billie’s reasoning is lousy here. I think she’s doing the wrong thing.
I think it’s good for Ruth to accept it, for now. But if it leads to Billie cutting Ruth more out of her life because she wants to keep up appearances and keep the gossip down, that’s going to be bad for them and Ruth needs to push back on it. Or all that consent and acceptance leads to the end of the relationship.
After all, if Ruth helping her move in is too much for the gossip mill, what will spending nights back at Ruth’s be? We’ve all been expecting this to be a move of convenience, for her to treat this new place much like she did the room with Sal. It seems like she’s planning to take it more seriously.
It may be Billie’s own depression and self-esteem issues leading her in that direction, but if they keep leading her away and Ruth keeps accepting it, Billie’s gone.
OK, I think I worded myself somewhat badly: When I said Billie’s reasoning was not strong, I meant that it wasn’t really a reason, it was an excuse. It was not what she really meant.
Her real issues, her issues with depression and self-esteem, -those- are the reasons she could not say yes to Ruth. But she was not capable of articulating that, because those same issues prevents her from doing this.
Billie thinks of herself as a helper, not a help-ee. I’m pretty damn sure that her parents (at least her father) instilled in her the “values” that needing help is for the weak, for the pitiful. Everyone should just grab themselves up from their misery, because there’s no way one should be in a position to rely on others.
True, Billie’s nowhere near as bad as he. I mean, for one thing, she -does- try and help out people; and she’s rejecting the more obvious horrors of her father’s behaviour, once it becomes obvious to her what it really is he was doing. But still, some of that stuff remains and festers, in more insidious manners. And eventually ends up with a Billie that cannot feel happy, cannot feel like she’s worth anything, unless she’s being a “success”, an alpha bongo, the someone who solves problems.
Ruth may not understand exactly what Billie is going on about…
…But she understands that behind the excuse, there is a real reason.
And she knows more about that reason than many.
And that’s why she’s not pressing it.
… that was not what I was expecting. I didn’t think Billie would take Rachel’s BS that hard… but it does sound plausible.
What bothers me here is that Billie’s “don’t take this the wrong way” is not a magic anti-feelings charm. Ruth might well know that billie didn’t mean anything hurtful, but still *feel* hurt. Feelings do that a lot. Billie’s actions, to my feelings, scream “I’m embarrassed to be seen with you” and if Ruth’s feelings take it that way too, that’s gonna suck. 🙁
I really really hope Billie comes back and gives Ruth lots of hugs by the end of the day, because she’s likely to need it. Hell, even if billie’s comment doesn’t stir up feelings and insecurities, she’s got enough other crap on her plate already 😛 Ruth probably needs a reminder that people care about her and she doesn’t have to take everything on herself.
Panel 3: I love this panel. This is how being rejected after asking to do something with a partner that you want to do should go. She has feelings about it, a little bit of hurt and worry, which is natural, but she doesn’t dump that on Billie. She doesn’t argue and demand the right to ignore her consent.
Instead she trusts Billie and accepts it without argument and let’s her know that she respects her consent in all cases and that’s so powerful and important and beautiful.
And the wonderful irony is she wanted to help to be the good girlfriend, but by respecting her gf’s consent without question, she fulfilled that way better than helping her gf move some boxes.
This is the sort of shit that makes me feel happy for these two. That makes me want to root for these two even though their origins were so awful. And I hope Ruth can get to a place where she recognizes the quiet power of what she did.
Panel 4: And on the opposite end of the spectrum we have Joyce’s very questionable understanding of consent thanks to her religious background. In that pre-millennial dispensationalist Rapturist fundie culture, consent is seen as not a thing and may even be demonic.
What someone wants or requests doesn’t matter. Only what is good for them and good Christians are encouraged to give folks what they think is good for them whether or not they accept or not as non-acceptance or boundaries is clearly just the act of Satan trying to stiff-arm away Jesus.
And you see that starkly here, marrying the themes and showing how Joyce’s understanding of consent is as shaky as Joe’s and how both will have similar evolution processes crawling out of those worldviews.
Telling Billie she wasn’t allowed to move yet and expecting that to be obeyed and telling her she’ll receive the “hug of her life” with or without her consent. It smacks of all of that and really highlights the tender awesomeness of Ruth’s Panel 3 and how meaningful that really was when we see how hollow Joyce’s “I’m hugging you now” is.
Panel 5: I’m struck by this panel, Billie bracing and closing her eyes for this choice of Joyce’s. And it’s sad that Joyce can’t see how her choice of actions though well-meaning could be something her friend doesn’t actually want.
Panel 6: This is legitimately adorable. That is all.
wait, how is it adorable if it’s non-consensual?
perhaps in the same way that puppies can be adorable as they chew through valuable possessions 😉
My dog once ate a Fountains of Wayne CD. And the fact that you’ve never heard of them should tell you that they’re not exactly trivial to come by.
My dad still loves him, but he’s never quite forgiven him…
Also because it’s being blocked?
Hmmm…
I knew something bugged me about the art up there…
And it’s the way Billie is carrying the box.
Box isn’t really large at all.
Its base is narrow enough that it can rest between Billie’s elbow and her wrist.
And, (perspective being a thing) it’s also not particularly deep (west to east) being less than elbow to fingers end.
Box is TALL… (ish)
“Large” is relative. And it’s big enough to interfere with Joyce’s goal of hugging Billie.
Becky and Joyce aren’t the tallest of characters, and their arms aren’t that long.
I, too, was bugged by the box, at first, because I’m tall and gangly, and a box like that would be much easier for me to carry.
Sry, meant Billie, not Becky
Large is the box.
Unrelated to the current comic, but I just found out these exist, and the very first thing to pop into my mind was Joyce : https://www.amazon.com/Food-Cubby-Plate-Divider-PACK/dp/B01EJVFB5E
heck, i ain’t even a picky eater but that’s just useful.
you can have something with sauce without the sauce getting on everything on the plate!
Just wait until Billie realizes that everyone in her new dorm thinks Joyce is her girlfriend!
I can’t wait to see Lucy being friendly at Billie.
I know. It’s going to be so great! Maybe they can be best friends like roommates are supposed to be!
The roulette Taketh away
Woops, misspelling my email