She didn’t insult either cartoon or say they’re not important, though. She said arguing over which is better is stupid.
Which is very true. Both Walky and Carla were trying to claim that their favorite is clearly superior while just listing the things that appealed to them personally.
Yes, but Walky has made this a ‘mega-truce’, which by definition, lasts a million times longer than a regular truce. This will outlast most peace treaties.
Well, if she wants to run for prez, she sadly has to drop the glasses and by then she won’t be a girl or dating anyone – from my knowledge every single president was married; you realistically won’t get elected unless you are married. Being a woman candidate will be hard enough, never mind crossing multiple other traditions to boot (which is sad because glasses on women just look hot >.> ).
There were actually 2. James Buchanan in 1857 and Grover Cleveland in 1886. Cleveland got married during his first term. Buchanan was rumored to be gay.
OTOH, there’s never been a married female president, so who knows. 🙂
Now I’m imagining Inspector Gadget saying that, his hat turning into a trilby, and him sprouting a neckbeard, so he can tell Penny that playing mobile games on her computer book doesn’t make her a REAL gamer.
She should have but then she would have had to deal with pissing off Walky…which she did anyway so yeah might as well have taken Carla’s side in this no win situation. She would have at least had the moral high ground.
has he though? I mean Carla’s big argument for ultracar felt like “it made me feel ok about being trans before I knew I was, but you don’t know i’m trans so I have to be vague and unclear about this” and walky’s argument was just “this is the better show, it had better episodes”
id argue he has, going from yesterdays page as after carla opened up about her story about how ultra car made her feel safe, walky completely pushed that aside like it was unimportant and said some episode about farting was better than a cartoon enabling you to feel safe
It’s almost like taste in subjective, and there’s no real objective standard they’re using to determine the quality of a tv show. For one group, having a show making them feel safe and accepted is important. For another, they don’t necessarily value that as much (as they may feel safer and accepted by default), and thus value the show by other criteria, such as humour and entertainment.
Neither are right and neither is wrong, both have different reasons for liking their respective show, and for not liking the other.
Walky certainly started the rudeness. All I said was that they were both talking on the same level of critique at first – superficial, vulgar and insulting, before Carla moved to the deep personal level.
Yes, she was insulting and dismissive – after someone else was dismissive bout her. For whatever reason I’m sure I can’t fathom, I’m rather irate at ‘both sides are wrong’ given how incomparable those two basic acts are.
It’s her decision to make. Just because someone’s an asshole doesn’t mean they’re wrong.
In this instance he’s presented a horrible argument for his show’s superiority, but Dorothy’s not taking an existing side, she’s presenting her stance. That’s admirable.
But we saw what admirable behaviour earned Ned Stark.
I guess there’s not a lot to be gained by stubbornly sticking to her guns in this situation, but….she clearly believes Walky is right, despite him making an obnoxious argument to Carla’s sincerity. You can’t really expect her first instinct to be to abandon her honest opinion in favor of strategy.
Eh, then she would have had a bunch of messy emotional care to do for Walky for “betraying him” and “turning on him”. And that can be a dicey thing for a straight woman because the downside of dating manchildren is that they can become full on children when they feel they have been wronged by a partner.
Really, this was a no win situation and she was fucked the moment Walky decided to drag her into this.
I can’t honestly see how to straddle a fence without acrobatics. So IMO, it’s flattering inasmuch as it provides a better picture of health than I usually figure for politicians.
Considering you only said “Clinton” I managed to deflect it into being a mental image of Chelsea Clinton as she was circa 2002 or so straddling a fence (her current image is a bit to similar to her mother for me personally).
Shouldn’t that be “redentsu” phonetically if we reverse the original Japanese characters or “deretsun” conceptually if we’re using the original intent rather than it’s current common usage? Maybe I’m overthinking this one.
For some reason, I thought Dorothy went by a nickname and was confused by Walky calling her by her full name. I must have been thinking of the family friend my family has, her name is Dorothy and she is called Dodie. Also ATTACK OF THE NERDS.
Man, I remember the super-creepy vitriol Malaya got over in Shortpacked for being indifferent to children’s toys, I hope the examples here being fictional might head that off here, but having faith in the haters…
(Joe has 666 votes in the poll right now and that’s vaguely amusing? Mike would be funnier, but he’s only at 659.)
Sure, loved them. But I’ve adored Malaya basically the whole time. She’s like Black Mage. She’s kind of a terrible person, but then the universe fucks her over. and that’s pretty much what happens all the time.
That’s what I don’t get about the omniloathe. She’s a bad person, but she’s almost always blatantly wrong, and the one time I can think of that she isn’t, she was too sleepy to be a bastard in general. The narrative already humiliates her, and makes me laugh in the process. Why should /I/ hate on her? She’s doing her job.
There’s a difference between not caring and sneering contempt for people who do care.
(Whether that’s sports geeks acting like dicks toward cartoon fans or the reverse. “IT IS IMPORTANT TO ME THAT YOU KNOW HOW LITTLE I CARE ABOUT SPORTSBALL.”)
Malaya got vitriol not for “being indifferent” to children’s toys, but for being rude and belittling to anyone who liked anything that she deemed “nerd stuff”. She actually acted a lot like Billie did toward the beginning of DoA, believing that she was inherently better than almost everyone else because her interests weren’t nerdy.
She was pretty unlikable until she struck up a friendship with Ultra Car.
The point I decided it was unjustified was when people were harping on her not being thrilled over Mike’s proposal to Amber. I don’t really care about total strangers getting married, and more importantly, I was really bothered that no one seemed to mind that the people who actually knew Mike were just smiling instead of being horrified by the idea of him raising a child.
Also, in my experience, most artistic/creative circles. Indifference is much worse than dislike or hate, because in those cases, they cared enough to react, and in meh/silence, you didn’t even get that.
Put another way, I have sold albums to people who saw a negative review of an album of mine and came to check it out on that basis, and no lack of review/reaction will ever produce a sale.
It’s the same thing in teaching. I’ve been dabbling as a tutor and Sunday School teacher for years, but I grew up around educators. A student who engages with the material positively? Great! A student who just wants to prove you wrong? Also great, because they actually have to listen to what you say (at least in theory) and study up to find counterpoints on their own, which you can then counter, thereby forcing them to do yet more research. The student who just sits in the class on those irregular occasions when they do show up who’s just bored and has no interest whatsoever, no matter what you do? What on earth do you do with that one?
Yup, the student who is completely disengaged, especially if because of past bad school experiences is always the hardest, because you have an uphill battle getting them to care. Super rewarding at the end when you do though.
Sure, leave Walky and Carla alone in FANMODE. I’m sure nothing bad/stupid/hillarious will come from that.
Five hours later.
Carla: We built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms.
Dorothy: …you built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms??
Walky: We built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms!!
Telecommunications!
Walky: This ten food statue of Ultra-Car works as antenna and we will broadcast all episodes of Dexter & Monkey Master over all of Indiana!
Eh. A politician is a politician is a politician. I’m not saying being a flip-flopper is a good quality, but a fool is they who thinks only a few politicians are dishonest with ugly ambition. Just because you tell people you’re not corrupt doesn’t mean you’re not.
Also, in fairness to the three ring circus that is this election cycle, appealing to as many demographics as you can is basically a position-runner’s job. It’s the point of even running – it’s how you get elected in the first place. Even JFK got votes because he was popular, handsome, spoke well on live TV in addition to his campaign slogans and such.
Indeed. The relationship between women, women who are trans and women who don’t identify as trans is an interesting and very touchy discussion. This makes me think of Caitlyn Jenner and her journey, and all the discussions that popped up as a result of people reacting to it.
As for politics, I feel so disappointed because I wish there were just candidates with really good experience and really good (as good as it can get) “resumes” so to speak. This cycle, it just.. well, none of these people are Pres. Obama I can tell you that, although he isn’t perfect by any means.
I’m only leaning towards Hilary because
1) right now she’s the most qualified Democract who is actually likely to win (no-write in for me- people don’t vote enough as it is, it just statistically and practically isn’t even possible)
2) I don’t want Trump to build a wall to keep what he considers undesirables out, he’s not qualified by any means, does not know anything about anything political basically, all he know are his opinions. He just shapes them to look like his policies.
3) I don’t want a Congress that will turn the clock back to the 1950s, because goddammit they have been TRYING double time since Pres. Obama got elected
I voted for Bernie in the NY primary, but then I heard he was at the Vatican like 3 days beforehand and I doubted that he or whoever was his campaign manager didn’t know what the hell they were doing, especially foreign policy wise, one of his weakest points.
Then when he lost and he understandably took it badly, but then he reacted like the privileged white person he kept claiming he wasn’t by basically freaking out and refusing to quit for a while, and calling out corruption in voting (which I don’t deny are issues) which I felt he wouldn’t have had a problem with had he won. Plus the zealousness of some of his supporters worries me.
You know, I predicted a while back that if Trump were to become president, he would succeed in rapidly bringing both Republicans and Democrats together in an impressive and unprecedented bipartisan unity.
To impeach him.
….
I’m very, very, very surprised to watch myself I type these words, but Dorothy is like Trump.
This is one of the major reasons I supported Sanders. His political career has been largely built on fighting against the enforced status quo of the two party system and Trump being the alternative would have given him a much more significant boost than Clinton will get from the left of party middle Republicans. Their existing views of her, despite her being closer to a socially liberal Republican than a party line Democrat, make her a tougher sell than Sanders even against Trump though she’s all but assured to get the majority of the swing anyway.
Lol wow, that’s a lot of nopes for a character who’s basically never done anything but randomly show up and be aggressively nice at people. COME ON FACETWIN, GIVE IN TO THE NICE
Norah: Kinda. I’m doing it on purpose. I figured out how to change my grav without registering. But I don’t know which one I’m getting until I make a post with that particular change. So I’m holding a grav roulette every evening with the new comic, and stick with it until the next comic. Maybe I’ll stop when I find one I like.
(I change capitalization within the email field, which is apparently part of what the randomness is based on. Still the same email, but different letters are capitalized. I started with all characters lower-case and got Mary. Actually I HAD Walky up until about a year ago when the algorithm changed and I got Mary instead. I discovered this trick by posting from my phone and auto-complete “helpfully” capitalized the first letter of my email, giving me Joyce. Second letter was Joe, third letter was Alice, and now I’m on the fourth letter with Agatha. My email has 17 letters in it, yielding 131,072 possible capitalizations. At a rate of 1 per night, that should last until I find one I like, get bored, or we get to the next month in-comic.)
Trump legitimately terrifies me. Like, I’m used to being scared of a Republican candidate becoming president, but Trump feels like I’m in one of those “creeping fascism can happen here too” movies. Like I can’t even snark about it, just pray that not enough US citizens are out-and-out fascist enough to elect him.
However the election goes, though, his empowering of neo-nazis in this country is going to have lasting damage and increase the rate of hate crimes around the country.
Look at the bright side. Americans are TOO fascist in-group-mentality* to elect him. He’s almost completely alienated the Republican evangelical base, AND the donors he needs to fund his campaign, and it’s showing in both the ground game and the ad war. The rabid tribalism is turning in on itself and rending itself to pieces. And while you’re probably right about the hate-bigots feeling empowered by his candidacy (and some will likely to become violent when it fails), they’re less something that Trump brought about and more an existing wave that other people brought about and that Trump is manipulating to his own ends.
….
YES THAT’S A BRIGHT SIDE whadyawant I’m a gloomy gus THAT’S YOUR BRIGHT SIDE ENJOY IT!
* This is a silly pet peeve of mine, but I always want to rant when people misuse the word fascism or fascist. For all his faults and whatever the awful that he actually is promoting, Trump is NOT promoting fascism. Fascism properly refers to a governmental/cultural notion which holds that a nation or society’s greatest potential is ideally and perfectly realized when it is engaged in a state of total war and restructured entirely under the imperative to win, from militaristic civilian hierarchies to mass conscription to placing the economy on a war footing. While fascism is deplorable in its own right and is inherently oriented against an other (the enemy), it is NOT intrinsically about racism, homophobia, etc. The Nazis brought that in as an extra and it stuck in people’s heads that that was fascism. (Or more accurately they brought in fascism as an extra to their racism, homophobia, etc.) Like so much else, the Nazis gave fascism a bad worse name.
All the signs are he’s going to lose and quite possibly by huge margins. Anything is of course possible in politics, but it would take something seriously unexpected to change direction at this point.
I’m not sure he’s actually alienated the evangelical base though. They were supporting him quite nicely through the end of the primary, if I recall the polling. That’s largely because most of the Republican evangelical base doesn’t really care about religion so much as hating the right people, even if they use a religious gloss to justify it.
He’s alienated the Republican political class. He’s alienated nearly everyone who isn’t in the Republican base. He’s going to lose minorities and women by yuuge margins and there aren’t enough angry white men left to make up for that.
As for fascism, you’re probably right, though I think given some of Trump’s comments (I won’t call them policies) on foreign policy, he might just stumble into that state of total war, as he pisses off the rest of the world. We might wind up in fascism by accident.
Well, that’s making an assumption. The enemy of your enemy MAY be your enemy. They may NOT be your enemy. You really don’t want to add to your pile of enemies unnecessarily. You have to make that judgement call independently of their status as your enemy’s enemy. Then, enemy or not, you have to decide which you’re more concerned about…
I’m reminded of Shlock Mercenary here: “The enemy of my enemy is my enemy’s enemy. No more. No less.”
Just because they hate the same person does not mean they don’t also hate you and everything you believe in (see that particular flavor of Bernie Bro who hates Clinton enough to join with Trump even though Trump hates them and hates everything they stand for).
I dunno, at least Trump is predictably stupid and we can expect his presidency to not last long if he gets into office. Clinton scares me more than Trump does.
And no worries on the repeat. It’s a quote worth repeating, and I always enjoy comparing & contrasting our opinions.
Trump is ‘predictably stupid’ in that we know for a fact a great deal of the horrible shit he will cause, but we don’t know all of it. There is no rational fear of Hilary that matches up to concentration camps and an extremely aggressive immigracion, unless you’re actually REALLY Worried for whoever she escalates into a quasi-war with. But that’s pretty predictable too so it’s eivdently fine.
I AM that worried about her, and reasonably confident Trump will be stonewalled by every other branch of government and then impeached before he can do too much damage, whereas Hillary will put down roots.
He can not, under any circumstances, be stonewalled on immigracion. Managing that is literally the job of the executive branch. It requires an actual constitutional amendment to change that. An aggressive immigracion hurts a lot of people, many of whom won’t be immigrants.
Trump will not arrive without a friendly, if not entirely subservient, senate and house. And if he arrives, you can bet your bippy that the establishment republicans will not try to force the founding of a New Know Nothing party. Shit is going to be bad.
Hillary probably is going tos crew people over in a quasi-war. But Trump will try to start REAL ones, in addition to escalating to quasi-wars.
I don’t think so. Carla is defending her identity through this argument. Calling it trivial would be enormously insensitive to her, and thus still infuriate her.
And Walky’s enough of a brat to think trivial stuff is hugely important. Y’know, like the time he dumped Dorothy over pajama jeans. So he’d be mad about calling this trivial, too.
I love everyone in this bar update! They’ve gotta be three of my fave characters in this entire comic because I can relate to all of them in different ways. Cuties. All cuties.
Okay, I’ve got to know, is it a play on tureen/Turenne? Google eventually admitted it was a eulogy for Henri de la Tour d’Auvergne, Vicomte de Turenne, but I only skimmed the Wikipedia page. Did I get the point, or do I need to go back and read in more depth?
Ethan will stand in the background and mumble about what transformers he like.
Billie will say “nerd” every five seconds, Malaya will just repeatedly do the sign for “I don’t care”
Ken will stand just behind Ethan saying “hey I like that too” because that is his role in life.
Lucy will try to maneuver the conversation to Young Justice. When she gets to Birdflash she will summon a wrathful Amber who proceeds to lay waste to everything for not having the right OTP.
That would be a dick move. The only way she can save her relationship now is going “meep meep”, jump into the air and let her legs rotate in a blurred circle. Then everything would be forgiven before she hits the ground running.
Dorothy needs to switch her ambitions from being a politician to a Supreme Court Justice, though. Why? Because you will have to agree and smile at a LOT of stupid crap which is utterly unimportant and probably accomplish less than the judges.
They don’t really just smile and agree though. Have you read a transcript of a Supreme Court hearing? They don’t take any crap from the lowly lawyers arguing the cases before them. They interrupt them constantly for clarification, because they’ve heard it all before, and they talk over the lawyers almost the whole time; the poor saps are lucky to get a word in while the justices discuss the case amongst themselves.
You misunderstand; Charles is saying politicians will smile and agree to a lot of stupid crap to ultimately accomplish less than the Supreme Court Justices do. Hence, Dorothy should give up on being a politician and focus on trying to become a Supreme Court Justice.
Dorothy is the Relena Peacecraft of the comic in that she’s the female character stradled with being wise, understanding, and less insane than the rest of the cast–while also being in love with someone who has serious serious issues. This, of course, makes the majority of the viewers hate her. Sadly, it is a well-trodden role.
If the past is any indication, their revenge will be a Rube Goldberg machine that ultimately fails to achieve its ultimate goal of releasing balloons that spell out, “No, you’re stupid”, because Walky never bothered to double check the spacing between the dominoes.
Success! I choose to read this as ace-level maneuvering by Dorothy. Next she lets them talk at her for a bit and goes ‘wow you’re both totally right, it’s not stupid at all cartoons are very important’ and deflection. Walky and Carla share a victory.
then they go ‘so which is better’ and then she can walk away. The other two roll their eyes at how she just doesn’t get it, but she’s gotten out of it, both feel vindicated, and yeah.
yeah
….. so what’s so special about early October, again? Nights getting longer, maybe? Oh, I know, people got an extra hour when Daylight Savings Time ended.
This isn’t a politician thing, rather that it is a wisdom of not getting in the way of arguments between geeks. For those of us who love Star Trek, we can rail against those who think that Next Gen is the best, when clearly the correct answer is Deep Space Nine. For those who love sports, there will be those who say that the Yankees are awesome and the Red Sox suck. But all of these are qualitative analyses that absolutely depend on the opinion of the person voicing it. If you don’t have a horse in the race, there’s no point in trying to settle any sort of argument.
The politician aspect, however, is that she’s really only interested, apparently, in arguing about things that actually require argument. Star Trek, sports, and cartoons, while having their various fans, will settle nothing with their arguments. Politics, however, is all about arguing, and deciding what to do with education, defense, taxes, and everything else to run the ship of state. She may not see the point, really, of arguing about something that will not affect people’s lives in the long run.
But what’s fun about that? Meanwhile, David Tennant is the best new series Doctor Who, Tom Baker is the best old series Doctor Who, Romana is the best companion, and anyone who tells you different is either horribly deluded or horribly misguided. 🙂
Using Carla’s argument, Romana is best companion because crushing hard on her when I was 7 was probably my first indication that I was queer. (And her French schoolgirl outfit was my first consumption of fan service, albeit a fan service never intended for me.)
Right the greater-than lesser-than symbols are reserved for formatting OHAITHERE!
Reposting:
_Insert rant here about DS9’s awfulness and how that’s actually relevant to society. Something about betraying ST’s vision of a bright and hopeful future and replacing it with a state of unending 40k-esque warfare, and how the modern world could use more optimism for the future and less endless war._
Is that what did it? I never knew, during my original wee-fan days nor my rediscovery. Figures, though.
See also what happened to Lucas after his divorce.
Sylvia was a huge creative force throughout all of their series and after the divorce he did his best to erase that. I’ve been personally working to restore her on my tumblr, for whatever that’s worth.
The Tracy family, in Thunderbirds? Her creation. The coherence of feel across everything, and the way that the worlds really, really fit together? As a rule, that’s her.
Insert counter rant about DS9’s still relevant discussions about not overreacting to terrorism, tackling poverty, and maintaining a moral code in wartime. Also extol the value of a continuing storyline, which led to the genius of the BSG reboot.
1. DS9 started in 1993, B5 in 1994
2. I never said anything about “introduced,” and it was solely a Trek v. Trek comparison
3. It is to BSG, because Ronald D. Moore, exec. producer of BSG, came up through the ranks of DS9.
and Moore’s dry run for “ship on its own, with limited resources and a crew with serious internal divisions, on a journey of indefinite duration” was VOY, until he found out that everyone else there just wanted to remake TNG.
Also the Ferengi get introduced to feminism. That’s pretty huge. So the “DS9 is devoid of hope” is unconvincing to me. War does suck, but seeing societies capable of change for the better is very encouraging to me. And showing that change happen, rather than just the finished product where magically people already get along to begin with, sometimes except for some of the clear villains, gives me more hope that it is actually possible from our starting point.
And it will shift again as comic book time moves them ever onward, into the HRC presidency, or the Trump presidency with HRC leading The Undergorund Resistance, etc.
Who got a Dorothy strip for his birthday???? THIS DUDE!!!!
Awwww, look who tries to be above it all. Sorry, Dotty. You can just as well give them your spiel about the sensitivity scanner now, there is no getting out of it. If you want to avoid pointless argument about stupid things, politics might not be the place for you.
But on the other hand this WAS a great politician moment. If this had been a real debate for real voters, a large chink of the voters (the ones opposing Carla and Walky) would just neatly go to her side.
I still think that Walky understands Carla’s situation fully well and tries to validate her in his own Walkyish way. Look how he goes out of his way to validate her gender identity in the first panel.
And I also think Carla appreciates it. Walky supports her belief of just how IMPORTANT cartoons are, even if he is too stupid to understand the majesty of UltraCar. He plays the game. Dorothy, on the other hand, threatens to smash the gameboard when she calls it stupid. Answering in kind to Carla’s jerkish snipe about politicians, but still. Megatruce indeed!
I’m sure Walky and Carla will be good friends…. in the Walky and Billie sense.
Is Walky validating her identity, or is he just being Walky? We’ve seen him being stuck very firmly on a solid, clearly-defined gender binary. “Dudes do ___; ladies do ____, it’s one or the other, and if you’re not one, you’re being the other.” So is he being sensitive or clueless? I can easily see him just automatically default to female on the grounds of, “Lives in the girls’ wing, has a female name, therefore is female” and possibly some “liked that stupid girl cartoon = must be a girl” as well.
I think Carla appreciates the argument, certainly, although I think she’s looking forward to crushing Walky for being wrong just as much as he’s looking forward to crushing her -that it’s as much a matter of asshole-off as it is a matter of common interest. ….did you just compare Dorothy to Belkar Bitterleaf?
I’m not as sure about friendship -I can see this evolving into a cartoon-centered prank-war for quite some time (and probably one that they both enjoy) that suddenly ends when Walky realizes (or someone tells him) exactly why UltraCar was and is so important to Carla, but I don’t see them trusting each other enough to call each other friends.
This. I’m thinking this is much more Carla “passing” for cis and Walky assuming: girl name, girl wing, girly cartoon, girly argument about feelings, must be girl. And mom always said to not call random women girls and instead ladies, so she’s a lady now.
Rather than it being him recognizing she’s a trans woman and affirming her identity. That all being said, I guarantee using her correct pronoun and not stumbling over that was appreciated by Carla because yeah.
Way to be a jerk Carla… it’s almost like she takes pride in it or something.
On the other hand, Carla was quick to pull back from something that genuinely hurt Dorothy (your chosen career is stupid) to a much safer venue (total geeks vs not as total geeks). She still tries to be as non-damaging with her jerkiness as she can.
I don’t really see the issue. Baby politicians need no coddling when if they’re successful, they’ll hold the reins of power, and the overwhelming majority of successful politicians are at least partial bastards.
Eh, I guess I view it as more, don’t just attack the baby politician for wanting to be a politician, let them inevitably disappoint you first before slagging them for being a bastard who can’t actually get your back.
Though that might be more because I want people to be critiqued and pushed back for what they actually did or the toxic stew they are actually reinforcing rather than what they might do in the future because their job description has a bad rap*.
Given that the disappointment is inevitable (And I say this as someone who rather strongly believes that we’re better off with a strong state), I really don’t see why we should pretend that THIS baby politician is sure to be the unicorn we’ve all waited for. Especially since the actual complaint is to a thing she’s doing right now.
As far as ‘what they’ve done’, especially if you’re dealing with a tiny anarchist, ‘reinforce the existing system’ is sort of a flaw, if you’re at all revolutionary. Not all anarchists are, at all, but… Dotty hasn’t given any indication of wanting to make systemic changes like that (though in further fairness, Carla isn’t necessarily a Tiny Anarchist either, who’d hold that against her).
Still, Baby Politicians in particular just… don’t seem to really deserve anything but doubt and disbelief.
Oh, I’d missed yesterday’s comic. “Monkey Master has to fart” vs. “I never got any toys of the one girl I wanted a toy of” garners a ‘both sides are good’? Yeaaaaaah, Carla’s ‘meh, politicians’ just went from understandable to deserved. Like, she’s not even raising a trans point there, but a somewhat more normal one for women.
Like, you don’t even have to get /into/ the argument to say “That’s really terrible.”
Yeah, I think it’s a great juxtaposition between seeing her soliloquize about how important Ultra Car is to her, and then have that followed up by Carla dismissing Dorothy’s political ambitions.
‘Cause Carla’s a jerk, and she’s a good character because she’s a jerk. I like moments like this because they make her a more complex character.
I really love it when characters like Carla and Becky show their actual flaws, cause it really makes them realer people and it reveals their weaknesses and where they still need to grow and more about their character as a whole.
Plus, it’s something I can point to when people are clinging to made-up stuff to slag the characters for. Like, no, look, actual flaws, they’re not actually some perfect god-character designed to attack your bigoted way of life, honest. Slag that instead.
Like all the people who were whining about $20 Becky haircuts when her actual issues of unchecked jealousy of Dorothy where fully on display and a much more glaring and real flaw.
So class, here we see the beginning of the rift between Dorothy Keener and the Cartoon Enthusiast Community that would one day nearly cost the aspiring young politician her chance at the presidency.
She narrowly loses the 2060 election owing to what future political science theorists dub the “Cartoon gaff”. Her career was put into turmoil for a number of years after that.
Best way to get 2 people to shut up about Kirk and Picard and join forces is for a Star Wars fans to enter an opinion. Dorothy is right though. It’s stupid because Carla and Walky love what they love because it’s a part of their childhood and no rational argument can change that.
Also it’s stupid because Carla just blatantly insulted Dorothy’s dreams because she won’t get involved in an argument over cartoons, and Walky takes this as an opportunity to get back at her over it.
Both of this. She was dragged into a no-win situation here and got shit on for it, with Carla insulting her dreams in a similar way that Walky dismissed Carla’s personal resonances and her bf treating it like some personal betrayal.
The argument was stupid, even if the works are important to each of them and it’s perfectly rational for Dorothy to not have wanted any piece of it with the strong feelings involved.
I cannot, for the life of me, understand how Walky is being judged so hard for arguing with Carla about a cartoon. They’re both passionate about it, and like Dorothy says, it is pretty stupid. But because Carla is trans and Walky /only/ likes his show because he thought it was good he’s an asshole for looking down on Carla’s love of Ultra Car, which Carla is doing towards Walky’s Monkey Master show but she’s totally in the right because she’s a strong trans woman who needed that show in a hard time in her life.
It’s really stupid, they’re both arguing over which cartoon they like better, Carla being tans does not make Walky an asshole because he’s not agreeing with her.
I think people are saying Walky is an asshole because he’s not listening to Carla or her heartfelt story because he wants to be RIGHT about something stupid. The story wouldn’t be changed if Ruth talked about My Little Pony Friendship is Magic keeping her from suicide and Walky still said Dragonballz Z was better becasue it had cool fights.
This. Walky being a bit of an asshole last comic more had to do with him insisting on continuing a pointless nerd fight and ignoring what Carla was actually saying and her vulnerability. It’s also that we’re in the position of being lucky enough to know that Carla is trans and that her vulnerability is a rare thing, so we know that Walky’s dismissal is bigger than he realizes.
That all being said, on the fight over “who’s cartoon is better” that Walky wants to have, yeah, who gives a shit. If there’s a team in play, I’m Team Dorothy on that one. And Carla had my major sympathy last comic, but here she’s actually done something rude and dismissive and is being just as much of an asshole in ways she doesn’t realize by being super dismissive of Dorothy’s dreams.
Because they’re Team Carla. If Carla isn’t “right” here, that means you’re on Team Walky, or some other team, and you’re not a “true fan”.
The trouble with so many people today – especially Americans, as I speak of my own people – is that everything is viewed through the lens of sports teams, or Coke vs. Pepsi or something. You can’t be a Cardinals fan AND a Cubs fan! That’s just not done!
Except that applying that mindset to people is stupid, and ultimately hurtful.
I have to disagree with you here. Arguing about cartoons isn’t stupid. Because it’s as much a part of their identity as any other thing about them.
Hell, you could easily argue that Dexter/Monkey Master and Ultracar are AS IMPORTANT to their self-identity to Walky/Carla respectively as their sexual identity.
Well, and McNuggets for Walky.
I know tons of people for whom their fandom is a cornerstone of their identity. And to dismiss something so core to their human experience as “Stupid” engenders just such a reaction as Walky and Carla has.
I mean, Ultracar, to Carla, seems to me to be as much a part of her identity as being trans. Maybe slightly less.
I will put in the disclaimer here that I may be wrong, and as a (mostly) straight cis dude I know practically nothing about what it would be like for a queer person in this world today.
Panel 1: Oh Walky… -1 boyfriend point for dragging Dorothy into your argument and expecting her to back you up in your pointless nerd flex off. That’s just a really uncomfortable thing and puts your romantic partner on the spot and in a position where they’ll feel they’ll be labeled negatively if they bow out.
Fight your own battles dude, don’t drag your gf into this.
Panel 2: And yeah, you can see her on the spot here. And it’s a no win situation. If she backs up her bf and does the dutiful gf role there’s social pressure on her to do, then she’s double teaming Carla about a fight she knew better to enter into and which Carla has just got done linking to her own experiences of discrimination, alienation, and her own family’s love.
If she backs up Carla, then she’s throwing her bf under the bus and that will likely mean her having to spend a lot of time doing emotional self-care with her bf because to him he won’t understand it and will feel he was betrayed in the middle of his nerd flex and that Dorothy doesn’t “support” him.
It’s quite literally a no win situation and her best angle is some form of dodge, either trying to appease both sides or affirming your desire to stay out of it completely or going into a long explanation of how both sides aren’t really having the same conversation, which can be hella risky because Carla is likely in a mood to be tetchy after Walky’s last dismissal and Walky is in full nerd machismo mode and is likely to interrupt her. So, really:
Panel 3: Her only option is a dodge. And she tries a classic peacemaker one.
Panel 4: And oh Carla. Oh Carla, no. People who’ve been looking for her doing something unequivocally rude, this is your moment, because yeah, this is a complete douche move by Carla. Dorothy wanted no part in this fight and was just put on the spot. And while this may be nerdicly important to Carla and tie in a lot with identity, this isn’t the same thing as a real queer politics fight about access to civil rights.
There’s really no reason for Carla to go on the attack like this and I say this as a person who can be similarly tetchy about the mushy middle as well as someone who understands her baby tranarchist “the system is corrupt, maaaaan” stance where “all politicians are evil, dude and will let you down” because that was suuuuper common among the trans college kids I used to mentor.
And it’s an understandable phase to be in when your rights are under attack and no one seems to be doing anything about it. But Carla’s rights are not under attack this conversation. This is not actually an authority figure disappointing Carla for the umpteenth time, this is just a girl put in an unwinable situation and so a firm tsk, tsking in Carla’s direction on this one.
Panel 5: Which is why it’s even more understandable for Dorothy to be like, well, fuck your argument, it’s stupid. Cause it is. Like Walky is just doing a nerd machismo thing and arguing one argument and Carla is having a completely different conversation about the personal resonance of queer-affirming media and Walky is not listening to it.
The “argument” itself is therefore incredibly stupid, because it’s so unavoidable and it’s started by Walky doing his standard putting down something important to someone else shtick which was often going to raise up hackles and lead to pointless fights.
If Walky “wins” here, he wins nothing. And if Carla “wins” in that she’s heard, that’s something, but that’s not hyper critical in the overall course of her day and she’s probably in a mood to settle for Walky walking away which he’s not in a mind to do because he wants to “win”.
So yeah, her refusing to be insulted for an argument that is stupid is absolutely her right. Unfortunately she’s a bit offended from being insulted and being dragged into this pointless fight and has a stance that cartoons really are just the thing you use to mindlessly recharge from the stresses of day-to-day life and doesn’t quite have the same resonances it does for both Walky and Carla.
Panel 6: Which is why, hilarious team-up aside, it makes sense that Walky and Carla would overplay how much they’re “offended” by Dorothy’s dismissal. Because Walky won’t admit it, but D&MM has personal history for him, a thing he got to share with his sister before everything went bad, a thing to share with a future loved one. And likely was similarly there for him when being neglected by his busy parents or dealing with casual racism microaggressions at school. And Carla’s personal history was all over the last strip.
Still, though, both of you stop being stupid, Dorothy was put in a no-win situation here and you both know it.
Panel 2 and 3’s correct response: Grin, laugh, tossle Walky’s hair, and say, “Oh no, this is YOUR fight. I’m having too much fun watching.” Make it playful and clear with your grin that you’re fond of him and find him cute, then cut him loose to the wolves.
….
…. sometimes the correct response is the vicious and cold-blooded one.
Okay, yeah, that would be the way to dodge out of that successfully compared to her attempt.
Though your comment makes me think that Dorothy’s main flaw might be that she’s too nice. And I mean that not only in how being super nice can actually be a flaw in her chosen career path, but that I feel she lets herself get sucked into things and feeling like she needs to help everyone around her with a problem really easily and that adds a lot of stress on an otherwise stressful plate. Not to mention her eagerness can sometimes put off people she’s trying to help (see Sal’s statement about not reaching out to Dorothy because she doesn’t want to be her project or Walky’s stiff-arming of her attempts to “better him” up).
I think her arc might be learning to temper that instinct while still holding on to her ideals and desire to do good by people and I feel to that end, her interactions with Joyce have been an excellent depiction of her working on that very issue.
I meant that part more as a critique of my own proposal than as a critique of Dorothy, but there might be something to it.
I think the bigger problem with Dorothy is that she doesn’t do presentation right. She’s got all these great ideals and wonderful desires and plans and she’s going to screw them up and fail hard because she doesn’t know how to talk to people. Well she knows how to talk to people as a person, but not how to talk to people as a leader who needs to align their desires with her vision. That type of political acumen requires understanding everyone’s desires and reframing your cause in terms of those desires, rather than just trying to explain your vision and assuming everyone (or at least a majority) will fall in love with it. That’s a what-Dorothy-wants narrative and as a politician she will need to reframe it as a what-you-want narrative.
Probably the best example I can think of this is the scene from Dead Man’s Chest (one of the bright spots in a flawed sequel) where Jack gets Elizabeth to use the compass. He identifies her driving passion (not hard) and explains, with repetition, how doing what he wants her to do will advance her own goals. He doesn’t plead his own case to her about how he’s in trouble and won’t she please help. Instead he makes her WANT to help by aligning his cause with her goals.
In this case, Walky wants validation. On the surface, he wants numerical support for Dexter and Monkey Master, but deeper down what he wants is emotional support that he isn’t being a complete dweeb here. What Dorothy wants is to give that validation, but also not get drawn into the trivial argument. She falls into the trap of thinking that it’s either-or, when if she recognized and spoke to the deeper desire for emotional support and signaled a fondness for him that had nothing to do with this argument, maybe even acknowledging that he IS a dweeb while simultaneously signalling that she loves that about him, she could stay out of the whole silly cartoon debate entirely.
Also, minor note, but argh, Walky, this is why you don’t try and drag other people into your pointless nerd fights, because it puts people in shitty positions with people who are likely to be running hot because you’re in the middle of an argument.
Hell, in general, it’s just awful behavior to drag anyone into your fights and especially in a “back me up” kinda way. Like by all means, signal someone to give you an out and an excuse to disengage or let them enter the conversation naturally if they so choose, but don’t just randomly grab a friend to get your back because you feel you are “losing”.
That’s just bad manners, whether it’s in a pointless nerd fight or in a really involved political conversation involving personal rights. Like, if Carla had actually been being racist and Walky asked her to get her back, that’s (while WAY more understandable) still a bit of a social faux pas to put her on the spot in demanding backup and putting her on the spot (though he’d be reasonable to expect her to step in and say what the fuck in that particular circumstance).
Fuck this is gonna go down like when Macho Man and Hulk Hogan made the Mega Powers isn’t it? All we need is Dina to be Dorothy’s Ultimate Warrior and we’ve got a show here tonight.
Would have thought Mary might be the more obvious analogue for Warrior, given some of his most infamous statements post-wrestling.
We could probably come up with a good Four Horsewomen from the cast, though. Becky Lynch is a perfect fit for… Well, Becky. Sal as Sasha Banks, Carla as Charlotte, and… Joyce’d probably be a good Bayley, although lacks the alliteration.
Sal is my guess. She knows about Dorothy’s political aspirations both from Walky, hanging out with her, and it probably being the major point of conversation from her parents the few times they bother to contact her.
And so it probably came up once or twice while they hung out. Though, that being said, I’m super excited, because it would mean that Sal is actually opening up to Carla and between that, her friendship with Danny, and her mentorship kinda deal with Joyce, she might be actually building herself a friends circle and an emotional support network.
I’m as nerdy as anyone, but I agree with Dorothy, too. I get defending your favorite show. But there’s no reason to bash some other nerd’s favorite.
Plus, unless Walky got the DVD of it, which it doesn’t sound like he would, he doesn’t know if the show was good. It could have been better. And no nerd says that a show being canceled means it was bad.
I can kinda get why these two think cartoons are so important.
It’s entertaining, and they can be stupid, yes.
But they give a young child a broader view of what’s possible and sometimes even what’s acceptable in the broader world.
The stories and characters may be silly, but the characters can resonate with younger viewers and help them build a better understanding of their identity.
Take theAvatar:Korra series. I imagine a few kids were watching and might have been a little confused by the ending, but it planted a few seeds of tolerance.
And even more than that, the more recent cartoons like Steven universe and Adventure time. They send different messages. Love and family are important, and the world can be grand and interesting no matter where you are.
Youth is a time where most of the time, you’re restricted to a relatively small space. But modern media allows our minds to travel quite far.
So in that, cartoons are important because they can teach people both about themselves and the broader world.
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Dotty, what did you JUST say like four strips ago
That they were going to get murdered?
that walky would get murdered
“Do as I say, not as I do.”
Which is how one talks to children and/or Walky.
but walky is a children
A manbaby.
He does lots of the sex times for a children
You’d be surprised
We see you, Freud.
She really is a politician!
also, perfect politician.
BEST AVATAR EVER, HOLMES
Ooooh Sherlock Hound <3
That was when WALKY did it. When SHE does it, it’s OK.
She didn’t insult either cartoon or say they’re not important, though. She said arguing over which is better is stupid.
Which is very true. Both Walky and Carla were trying to claim that their favorite is clearly superior while just listing the things that appealed to them personally.
look, some people value arguing
Perfect avatar for comment is perfect for comment.
New BFFs confirmed!
im kinda hoping the truce is temporary
Isn’t being temporary part of what makes that a truce?
a truce can be temporary, but not always
see: Korea
We don’t make peace with our allies.
Well, they’re obviously not allies *before* we make peace, but they can totally become allies later. And stay at peace, even!
At that point we’re likely to stop calling the peace a “truce,” though.
Yes, but Walky has made this a ‘mega-truce’, which by definition, lasts a million times longer than a regular truce. This will outlast most peace treaties.
Oooooh, Dorothy done did it now!
She gone and made a big mistake…
This can only lead to Slipshine.
Dorothy the peace maker. Elect her at once.
And that’s how she died.
And the reason why Dorothy won’t become President, she can’t get the nerd vote.
She should get advice from Robin and seek out the toy-buying necrophiliac vote.
She’s a cute geeky girl with glasses who dates nerds. She SO gets the nerd vote.
Plus a lot of creepy fan mail.
A lot.
Well, if she wants to run for prez, she sadly has to drop the glasses and by then she won’t be a girl or dating anyone – from my knowledge every single president was married; you realistically won’t get elected unless you are married. Being a woman candidate will be hard enough, never mind crossing multiple other traditions to boot (which is sad because glasses on women just look hot >.> ).
There were actually 2. James Buchanan in 1857 and Grover Cleveland in 1886. Cleveland got married during his first term. Buchanan was rumored to be gay.
OTOH, there’s never been a married female president, so who knows. 🙂
It’s on the horizon.
What.
Megatruce! 🙂
He’s the Decepticon in charge of compromises.
Which is the ideal position for BETRAYING FOOLISH AUTOBOTS (andevenmorefullishdecepticoncommanders)!
Looks like Starscream has some competition.
No, Megatruce would totally team up with Starscream to overthrow Megatron.
… and inform Megatron of the ploy.
… and use Megatron’s machinations against Starscream to-
you know what? Megatruce is now the Transformer Vetinari.
Panel 3 Dorothy is me a lot of the time, completely sincerely.
You know, normally I’d worry for Dorothy.
But right now I can get behind wrath. Go go gadget nerdrage.
Now I’m imagining Inspector Gadget saying that, his hat turning into a trilby, and him sprouting a neckbeard, so he can tell Penny that playing mobile games on her computer book doesn’t make her a REAL gamer.
On the other hand, the fact that she was doing that, and had a watch phone, IN THE EIGHTIES, is probably worth some cred.
The dog was capable of replicating the English language. I’d give her all the cred.
Fucking fuck and the fucking fuckin fuck!
Trilby and neckbeard—excellent. Also, don’t forget Birkenstocks, a kilt, and a manbun.
dotty when your relationship formed from a shared love of dexter and monkey master i’m not sure calling it stupid is the way to go
Hey, this way she gets to shape Walky’s so-far excluding and restrictive shared love into external friendships. Win for everyone!
Also, go Carla, batting .500 now for turning foes into allies!
She isn’t saying the show is stupid just that arguing over which show is “better”, which is a subjective opinion, is stupid.
Now, don’t you try making sense, here!
Finally, someone else that makes sense.
Yup, it’s a stupid argument about things that have personal resonances for both of them. But the argument is still stupid.
Hey, as long as they’re both enjoying it.
She should have taken Carla’s side, since you know Walky’s been an asshole the entire conversation.
exactly
She should have but then she would have had to deal with pissing off Walky…which she did anyway so yeah might as well have taken Carla’s side in this no win situation. She would have at least had the moral high ground.
Yeah I’m disappointed in her tbh. But again, this isn’t Correct Decisioning of Age after all.
has he though? I mean Carla’s big argument for ultracar felt like “it made me feel ok about being trans before I knew I was, but you don’t know i’m trans so I have to be vague and unclear about this” and walky’s argument was just “this is the better show, it had better episodes”
There’s nothing vague and unclear about Carla’s argument. The show made her feel good about herself at a time when few things did.
Also I’d say Walky has been an ass since the moment he decided to go on his big anti-Ultra Car rant right outside Carla’s door.
id argue he has, going from yesterdays page as after carla opened up about her story about how ultra car made her feel safe, walky completely pushed that aside like it was unimportant and said some episode about farting was better than a cartoon enabling you to feel safe
It’s almost like taste in subjective, and there’s no real objective standard they’re using to determine the quality of a tv show. For one group, having a show making them feel safe and accepted is important. For another, they don’t necessarily value that as much (as they may feel safer and accepted by default), and thus value the show by other criteria, such as humour and entertainment.
Neither are right and neither is wrong, both have different reasons for liking their respective show, and for not liking the other.
“this is the better show, it has farts” — Walky
“My show shits on your dumb, baby show” — Carla
Admittedly, she then segued into its personal importance to her, but she started out on the same level as Walky.
No, she didn’t. Walky was rude to her. She dropped courtesy when someone was discourteous to her.
It’s like, politeness is only a two way street some of the time or something.
Walky certainly started the rudeness. All I said was that they were both talking on the same level of critique at first – superficial, vulgar and insulting, before Carla moved to the deep personal level.
Yes, she was insulting and dismissive – after someone else was dismissive bout her. For whatever reason I’m sure I can’t fathom, I’m rather irate at ‘both sides are wrong’ given how incomparable those two basic acts are.
I never said “both sides are wrong”. Though I think I see why you misunderstood.
“Fart jokes are really important to me, so i can relate to this show on a personal level!”
It’s her decision to make. Just because someone’s an asshole doesn’t mean they’re wrong.
In this instance he’s presented a horrible argument for his show’s superiority, but Dorothy’s not taking an existing side, she’s presenting her stance. That’s admirable.
But we saw what admirable behaviour earned Ned Stark.
having to talk to an asshole named petyr baelish?
At least there was most likely enough left of Ned to HOLD A DOOR.
:p
*jumps away*
how dare you
I guess there’s not a lot to be gained by stubbornly sticking to her guns in this situation, but….she clearly believes Walky is right, despite him making an obnoxious argument to Carla’s sincerity. You can’t really expect her first instinct to be to abandon her honest opinion in favor of strategy.
Yeah, but she doesn’t actually believe the Ultra Car cartoon was not better.
THIS is why Dorothy will never actually be a national-level politician. She has integrity.
BAD Dorothy! BAD!
*was better. Not was not better.
Eh, then she would have had a bunch of messy emotional care to do for Walky for “betraying him” and “turning on him”. And that can be a dicey thing for a straight woman because the downside of dating manchildren is that they can become full on children when they feel they have been wronged by a partner.
Really, this was a no win situation and she was fucked the moment Walky decided to drag her into this.
banana cream pie
not enough mental bleach in the world to erase the mental image of Clinton straddling a fence.
I did not need that image in my head.
me either
It gets worse if you combine it with the Tori Amos parody in Bob’s Burgers.
why would you do that?
On the plus side, it’s flammable, and close enough to a stake.
Let’s be honest, that’s not a position that would make any politician would look flattering.
…well, okay. Maybe Obama.
I can’t honestly see how to straddle a fence without acrobatics. So IMO, it’s flattering inasmuch as it provides a better picture of health than I usually figure for politicians.
Considering you only said “Clinton” I managed to deflect it into being a mental image of Chelsea Clinton as she was circa 2002 or so straddling a fence (her current image is a bit to similar to her mother for me personally).
I’m picturing Bill, and I’m fine with it.
He is wearing a cowboy hat.
so apparently best possible outcome is somekinda reverse tsundre
Isn’t that pretty much just being passive-aggressive?
A erdnuts?
Shouldn’t that be “redentsu” phonetically if we reverse the original Japanese characters or “deretsun” conceptually if we’re using the original intent rather than it’s current common usage? Maybe I’m overthinking this one.
i just thought erdnuts sounded funny
Any joke worth making is worth nothing. Wait, that came out wrong.
Any joke worth making is worth a farthing?
Or is it being shilled?
For some reason, I thought Dorothy went by a nickname and was confused by Walky calling her by her full name. I must have been thinking of the family friend my family has, her name is Dorothy and she is called Dodie. Also ATTACK OF THE NERDS.
Becky calls her ‘Dotty’ sometimes, but people had been calling her that in the comments for ages before Becky even met her in the strip.
I like Dotty! I must have been mentally calling her Dotty in my head because seeing ‘Dorothy’ seriously tripped me up. I feel so derp.
Man, I remember the super-creepy vitriol Malaya got over in Shortpacked for being indifferent to children’s toys, I hope the examples here being fictional might head that off here, but having faith in the haters…
(Joe has 666 votes in the poll right now and that’s vaguely amusing? Mike would be funnier, but he’s only at 659.)
Malaya got vitriol for many reasons.
I forgot about that. Now I hate her again.
Yeah, but most of the vitriol she got that mike didn’t, was for /bad/ reasons.
/Willis/ made fun of her pretty consistently, when the thrust of the strip wasn’t her and ultra-car. There’s really nothing we need to add there.
That all being said, Ultra Car and Malaya were frickin’ adorable together.
Sure, loved them. But I’ve adored Malaya basically the whole time. She’s like Black Mage. She’s kind of a terrible person, but then the universe fucks her over. and that’s pretty much what happens all the time.
That’s what I don’t get about the omniloathe. She’s a bad person, but she’s almost always blatantly wrong, and the one time I can think of that she isn’t, she was too sleepy to be a bastard in general. The narrative already humiliates her, and makes me laugh in the process. Why should /I/ hate on her? She’s doing her job.
There’s a difference between not caring and sneering contempt for people who do care.
(Whether that’s sports geeks acting like dicks toward cartoon fans or the reverse. “IT IS IMPORTANT TO ME THAT YOU KNOW HOW LITTLE I CARE ABOUT SPORTSBALL.”)
Malaya got vitriol not for “being indifferent” to children’s toys, but for being rude and belittling to anyone who liked anything that she deemed “nerd stuff”. She actually acted a lot like Billie did toward the beginning of DoA, believing that she was inherently better than almost everyone else because her interests weren’t nerdy.
She was pretty unlikable until she struck up a friendship with Ultra Car.
The point I decided it was unjustified was when people were harping on her not being thrilled over Mike’s proposal to Amber. I don’t really care about total strangers getting married, and more importantly, I was really bothered that no one seemed to mind that the people who actually knew Mike were just smiling instead of being horrified by the idea of him raising a child.
Oh no, she didn’t!
The most foul word in nerddom is “meh.”
Also, in my experience, most artistic/creative circles. Indifference is much worse than dislike or hate, because in those cases, they cared enough to react, and in meh/silence, you didn’t even get that.
Put another way, I have sold albums to people who saw a negative review of an album of mine and came to check it out on that basis, and no lack of review/reaction will ever produce a sale.
It’s the same thing in teaching. I’ve been dabbling as a tutor and Sunday School teacher for years, but I grew up around educators. A student who engages with the material positively? Great! A student who just wants to prove you wrong? Also great, because they actually have to listen to what you say (at least in theory) and study up to find counterpoints on their own, which you can then counter, thereby forcing them to do yet more research. The student who just sits in the class on those irregular occasions when they do show up who’s just bored and has no interest whatsoever, no matter what you do? What on earth do you do with that one?
Yup, the student who is completely disengaged, especially if because of past bad school experiences is always the hardest, because you have an uphill battle getting them to care. Super rewarding at the end when you do though.
Just walk away, Dorothy.
Sure, leave Walky and Carla alone in FANMODE. I’m sure nothing bad/stupid/hillarious will come from that.
Five hours later.
Carla: We built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms.
Dorothy: …you built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms??
Walky: We built a ten foot statue of UltraCar in the dorms!!
And Walky thus found his call in life, switching from communication to mechanic/siderurgy/soldering/statue making.
Telecommunications!
Walky: This ten food statue of Ultra-Car works as antenna and we will broadcast all episodes of Dexter & Monkey Master over all of Indiana!
Hahaha, this is perfect 👌
Eh. A politician is a politician is a politician. I’m not saying being a flip-flopper is a good quality, but a fool is they who thinks only a few politicians are dishonest with ugly ambition. Just because you tell people you’re not corrupt doesn’t mean you’re not.
Also, in fairness to the three ring circus that is this election cycle, appealing to as many demographics as you can is basically a position-runner’s job. It’s the point of even running – it’s how you get elected in the first place. Even JFK got votes because he was popular, handsome, spoke well on live TV in addition to his campaign slogans and such.
In fairness, Clinton did bring in Gloria Steinem to support her a while back.
There are, er. A number of reasons that might make Carla look unfavorably on her.
As a solid Bernie voter, I have many many issues with Ms. Clinton. Nevertheless, I will be moving like the Flash to vote for her this November.
And that was meant to be Mrs. Weird typo there.
Ms. is valid, tho – Ms. is neutral in regards to marital status. A married woman can be called Ms.
Indeed. The relationship between women, women who are trans and women who don’t identify as trans is an interesting and very touchy discussion. This makes me think of Caitlyn Jenner and her journey, and all the discussions that popped up as a result of people reacting to it.
As for politics, I feel so disappointed because I wish there were just candidates with really good experience and really good (as good as it can get) “resumes” so to speak. This cycle, it just.. well, none of these people are Pres. Obama I can tell you that, although he isn’t perfect by any means.
I’m only leaning towards Hilary because
1) right now she’s the most qualified Democract who is actually likely to win (no-write in for me- people don’t vote enough as it is, it just statistically and practically isn’t even possible)
2) I don’t want Trump to build a wall to keep what he considers undesirables out, he’s not qualified by any means, does not know anything about anything political basically, all he know are his opinions. He just shapes them to look like his policies.
3) I don’t want a Congress that will turn the clock back to the 1950s, because goddammit they have been TRYING double time since Pres. Obama got elected
I voted for Bernie in the NY primary, but then I heard he was at the Vatican like 3 days beforehand and I doubted that he or whoever was his campaign manager didn’t know what the hell they were doing, especially foreign policy wise, one of his weakest points.
Then when he lost and he understandably took it badly, but then he reacted like the privileged white person he kept claiming he wasn’t by basically freaking out and refusing to quit for a while, and calling out corruption in voting (which I don’t deny are issues) which I felt he wouldn’t have had a problem with had he won. Plus the zealousness of some of his supporters worries me.
* Sorry, I meant presidential politics when I said “as for politics”. The rights of trans people is a political issue.
All that starts well ends… well…
RIP DOROTHY
INTO LITTLE PIECES
….
You know, I predicted a while back that if Trump were to become president, he would succeed in rapidly bringing both Republicans and Democrats together in an impressive and unprecedented bipartisan unity.
To impeach him.
….
I’m very, very, very surprised to watch myself I type these words, but Dorothy is like Trump.
Bob help us all.
((And gravatar roulette…. GO.))
thats a terrifying sentence if ever i saw one
Which? “Dorothy is like Trump” or “If Trump were to become president”?
if trump were to become president
To my understanding a good chuck of the rest of the world fears that phrase.
That could also happen, this year. Robert Zemekis predicted it.
The Cubs winning this year might happen.
But Trump is almost certainly NOT becoming president this year.
After all, Inauguration isn’t until January.
I had a similar thought, I just didn’t want to be the person to bring it up.
Of course, that ability to foster bipartisanship is probably the only thing they have in common.
She didn’t say anything about a wall though.
This is one of the major reasons I supported Sanders. His political career has been largely built on fighting against the enforced status quo of the two party system and Trump being the alternative would have given him a much more significant boost than Clinton will get from the left of party middle Republicans. Their existing views of her, despite her being closer to a socially liberal Republican than a party line Democrat, make her a tougher sell than Sanders even against Trump though she’s all but assured to get the majority of the swing anyway.
And I’m…. Angela? Is that her name?
Friendly… cheerful…. happy… Mormon background character.
……
NOPE!
Nopenopenopenopenopenopenope.
Agatha
Ah, yes.
…..
NOPE.
Lol wow, that’s a lot of nopes for a character who’s basically never done anything but randomly show up and be aggressively nice at people. COME ON FACETWIN, GIVE IN TO THE NICE
No! I’ve got my gloomy thundercloud AND I’M KEEPING IT alsoI’magingerandallergictosunlight.
http://i.imgur.com/EyObJtD.gif
Are other people getting random avatar changes?
Norah: Kinda. I’m doing it on purpose. I figured out how to change my grav without registering. But I don’t know which one I’m getting until I make a post with that particular change. So I’m holding a grav roulette every evening with the new comic, and stick with it until the next comic. Maybe I’ll stop when I find one I like.
(I change capitalization within the email field, which is apparently part of what the randomness is based on. Still the same email, but different letters are capitalized. I started with all characters lower-case and got Mary. Actually I HAD Walky up until about a year ago when the algorithm changed and I got Mary instead. I discovered this trick by posting from my phone and auto-complete “helpfully” capitalized the first letter of my email, giving me Joyce. Second letter was Joe, third letter was Alice, and now I’m on the fourth letter with Agatha. My email has 17 letters in it, yielding 131,072 possible capitalizations. At a rate of 1 per night, that should last until I find one I like, get bored, or we get to the next month in-comic.)
Even when email and capitalization stays the same, you get random gravatar changes when Willis uploads new gravatars.
Trump legitimately terrifies me. Like, I’m used to being scared of a Republican candidate becoming president, but Trump feels like I’m in one of those “creeping fascism can happen here too” movies. Like I can’t even snark about it, just pray that not enough US citizens are out-and-out fascist enough to elect him.
However the election goes, though, his empowering of neo-nazis in this country is going to have lasting damage and increase the rate of hate crimes around the country.
Look at the bright side. Americans are TOO
fascistin-group-mentality* to elect him. He’s almost completely alienated the Republican evangelical base, AND the donors he needs to fund his campaign, and it’s showing in both the ground game and the ad war. The rabid tribalism is turning in on itself and rending itself to pieces. And while you’re probably right about the hate-bigots feeling empowered by his candidacy (and some will likely to become violent when it fails), they’re less something that Trump brought about and more an existing wave that other people brought about and that Trump is manipulating to his own ends.….
YES THAT’S A BRIGHT SIDE whadyawant I’m a gloomy gus THAT’S YOUR BRIGHT SIDE ENJOY IT!
* This is a silly pet peeve of mine, but I always want to rant when people misuse the word fascism or fascist. For all his faults and whatever the awful that he actually is promoting, Trump is NOT promoting fascism. Fascism properly refers to a governmental/cultural notion which holds that a nation or society’s greatest potential is ideally and perfectly realized when it is engaged in a state of total war and restructured entirely under the imperative to win, from militaristic civilian hierarchies to mass conscription to placing the economy on a war footing. While fascism is deplorable in its own right and is inherently oriented against an other (the enemy), it is NOT intrinsically about racism, homophobia, etc. The Nazis brought that in as an extra and it stuck in people’s heads that that was fascism. (Or more accurately they brought in fascism as an extra to their racism, homophobia, etc.) Like so much else, the Nazis gave fascism a
badworse name.All the signs are he’s going to lose and quite possibly by huge margins. Anything is of course possible in politics, but it would take something seriously unexpected to change direction at this point.
I’m not sure he’s actually alienated the evangelical base though. They were supporting him quite nicely through the end of the primary, if I recall the polling. That’s largely because most of the Republican evangelical base doesn’t really care about religion so much as hating the right people, even if they use a religious gloss to justify it.
He’s alienated the Republican political class. He’s alienated nearly everyone who isn’t in the Republican base. He’s going to lose minorities and women by yuuge margins and there aren’t enough angry white men left to make up for that.
As for fascism, you’re probably right, though I think given some of Trump’s comments (I won’t call them policies) on foreign policy, he might just stumble into that state of total war, as he pisses off the rest of the world. We might wind up in fascism by accident.
“The enemy of my enemy is my friend.”
Dorothy’s about to learn what this phrase means.
The enemy of my enemy is my enemy’s enemy. Nothing more, nothing less.
A fellow fan of The “Seventy Maxims Of Maximally Effective Mercenaries”?
To be honest I’d forgotten that’s what it’s from. I just got sufficiently tired of being stabbed in the ass that I memorized it.
But yes.
To be fair, the maxims can be applied to many ventures in life. But yeah, being constantly backstabbed is no fun.
Of course the following can be applied:
What does not kill me has made a tactical error.
Reminds me of this. http://i.imgur.com/YITVCkB.jpg
That which does not kill me still hurts a lot.
There is no “overkill.” There is only “open fire” and “I need to reload.”
All customers are one missed payment away from becoming targets themselves.
How about “The enemy of my enemy is still my enemy”
Well, that’s making an assumption. The enemy of your enemy MAY be your enemy. They may NOT be your enemy. You really don’t want to add to your pile of enemies unnecessarily. You have to make that judgement call independently of their status as your enemy’s enemy. Then, enemy or not, you have to decide which you’re more concerned about…
I’m reminded of Shlock Mercenary here: “The enemy of my enemy is my enemy’s enemy. No more. No less.”
Just because they hate the same person does not mean they don’t also hate you and everything you believe in (see that particular flavor of Bernie Bro who hates Clinton enough to join with Trump even though Trump hates them and hates everything they stand for).
Ah, shoulda scrolled up before answering, sorry Disloyal Subject for repeating what you said.
I dunno, at least Trump is predictably stupid and we can expect his presidency to not last long if he gets into office. Clinton scares me more than Trump does.
And no worries on the repeat. It’s a quote worth repeating, and I always enjoy comparing & contrasting our opinions.
Trump is ‘predictably stupid’ in that we know for a fact a great deal of the horrible shit he will cause, but we don’t know all of it. There is no rational fear of Hilary that matches up to concentration camps and an extremely aggressive immigracion, unless you’re actually REALLY Worried for whoever she escalates into a quasi-war with. But that’s pretty predictable too so it’s eivdently fine.
I AM that worried about her, and reasonably confident Trump will be stonewalled by every other branch of government and then impeached before he can do too much damage, whereas Hillary will put down roots.
He can not, under any circumstances, be stonewalled on immigracion. Managing that is literally the job of the executive branch. It requires an actual constitutional amendment to change that. An aggressive immigracion hurts a lot of people, many of whom won’t be immigrants.
Trump will not arrive without a friendly, if not entirely subservient, senate and house. And if he arrives, you can bet your bippy that the establishment republicans will not try to force the founding of a New Know Nothing party. Shit is going to be bad.
Hillary probably is going tos crew people over in a quasi-war. But Trump will try to start REAL ones, in addition to escalating to quasi-wars.
I am totally making “megatruce” a thing in my life.
First lesson of politics – choose your words carefully. Calling the argument “trivial” would have gone over a LOT better than “stupid”.
I don’t think so. Carla is defending her identity through this argument. Calling it trivial would be enormously insensitive to her, and thus still infuriate her.
And Walky’s enough of a brat to think trivial stuff is hugely important. Y’know, like the time he dumped Dorothy over pajama jeans. So he’d be mad about calling this trivial, too.
Ah, there’s nothing that can forge relationships or tear them down as quickly as nerdrage.
It was nice knowing you, Dorothy!
I love everyone in this
barupdate! They’ve gotta be three of my fave characters in this entire comic because I can relate to all of them in different ways. Cuties. All cuties.BURN THE WITCH!
Monty Python quotes in 3…2…
witches dont burn! they float!
LIKE A LOG!
… wait, logs burn.
LIKE A DUCK!
… ducks burn, don’t they?
…. I don’t know? That one duck was on fire in Schlock Mercenary, but that’s not exactly a scientific journal.
… ARE there scientific journals on barnyard animal flamibility? If so, why, and if not, why not?
…. I’m sure it’s possible to burn duck in the oven, so I’m going with that.
anything can be burnt in the oven if youre not careful, pizza boxes for example
If you’re keeping a duck in the oven long enough to burn, you’re committing so many food atrocities I don’t even know where I want to begin.
Now excuse me, I need to see if my gravy floats (it’s generally reckoned very good to great, so it should).
……gravy shouldnt float unless its so thick it can be compared to concrete
If gravy floats, why does it need a boat?
If the gravy boat dies, the funeral is guaranteed to include the line “Il est mort aujourd’hui un homme qui faisat honneur a l’homme.”
….
Oh, wait, no, a gravy boat is called a tureen. My bad.
i could only translate half of that french
Just google the whole quote.
….
And while you do that, I’ll get a head start running away.
Google Translate is useless.
‘Today a man is dead who brought honor to mankind’
is what I make of it.
Okay, I’ve got to know, is it a play on tureen/Turenne? Google eventually admitted it was a eulogy for Henri de la Tour d’Auvergne, Vicomte de Turenne, but I only skimmed the Wikipedia page. Did I get the point, or do I need to go back and read in more depth?
(Who, me? Compulsive? Surely you jest.)
Lynzie: Bingo.
Back when I was a tween, I invented the turkey, mayonnaise, and peanutbutter sandwich.
Burnt duck is the least of my crimes against humanity.
that sandwich should be called the donald trump.
NO! THE DONALD GETS NOTHING OF MINE!
too late, the turkey, mayo, and peanut butter sandwich is now known as the donald trump.
Sounds like some artisan, hippy-dippy sandwich. Throw some sardines on there, and mustard instead of mayo, that I’d call a Trump.
Having sandwich condiments in separate jars is always such a hassle.
Fun fact: Peanut butter and bacon sandwiches used to be a thing, still are in some parts.
The duck wasn’t ON fire, he BREATHED fire. Much better.
I wonder if this all-out nerd war will envelope other parties? Lucy? Ken?
Ethan will stand in the background and mumble about what transformers he like.
Billie will say “nerd” every five seconds, Malaya will just repeatedly do the sign for “I don’t care”
Ken will stand just behind Ethan saying “hey I like that too” because that is his role in life.
Lucy will try to maneuver the conversation to Young Justice. When she gets to Birdflash she will summon a wrathful Amber who proceeds to lay waste to everything for not having the right OTP.
Time to glue Dorothy to the floor.
That would be a dick move. The only way she can save her relationship now is going “meep meep”, jump into the air and let her legs rotate in a blurred circle. Then everything would be forgiven before she hits the ground running.
Or she could get revenge by throwing a pie in Carla’s face.
Dorothy needs to switch her ambitions from being a politician to a Supreme Court Justice, though. Why? Because you will have to agree and smile at a LOT of stupid crap which is utterly unimportant and probably accomplish less than the judges.
They don’t really just smile and agree though. Have you read a transcript of a Supreme Court hearing? They don’t take any crap from the lowly lawyers arguing the cases before them. They interrupt them constantly for clarification, because they’ve heard it all before, and they talk over the lawyers almost the whole time; the poor saps are lucky to get a word in while the justices discuss the case amongst themselves.
It’s pretty entertaining, actually.
You misunderstand; Charles is saying politicians will smile and agree to a lot of stupid crap to ultimately accomplish less than the Supreme Court Justices do. Hence, Dorothy should give up on being a politician and focus on trying to become a Supreme Court Justice.
Dorothy doesn’t deserve what’s about to happen to her.
Dorothy is the Relena Peacecraft of the comic in that she’s the female character stradled with being wise, understanding, and less insane than the rest of the cast–while also being in love with someone who has serious serious issues. This, of course, makes the majority of the viewers hate her. Sadly, it is a well-trodden role.
I don’t hate dorothy.
I never noticed that much Dorothy-hate on here!
As someone who remember the 90s Gundam Wing fandom… poor Dorothy. Nobody deserves that.
I always liked Relena, myself, but I didn’t engage in the shipping wars.
Relena literally was standing on balconies screaming for a dude she just met to come kill her. She was not sane.
(I do think she is actually the only actual true hero of the series though.)
If the past is any indication, their revenge will be a Rube Goldberg machine that ultimately fails to achieve its ultimate goal of releasing balloons that spell out, “No, you’re stupid”, because Walky never bothered to double check the spacing between the dominoes.
Unless it involves tickling
All I can hear is Linus on the Charlie Brown Halloween Special:
“STUPID?! WHAT DO YOU MEAN ‘STUPID’?”
Or as the tape recording ended in my house, because of language:
“STUPID?! WHAT DO YOU MEAN ‘STUP-
Success! I choose to read this as ace-level maneuvering by Dorothy. Next she lets them talk at her for a bit and goes ‘wow you’re both totally right, it’s not stupid at all cartoons are very important’ and deflection. Walky and Carla share a victory.
then they go ‘so which is better’ and then she can walk away. The other two roll their eyes at how she just doesn’t get it, but she’s gotten out of it, both feel vindicated, and yeah.
yeah
I don’t think she planned all that out in advance.
But I DO think she might be able to improvise that on the fly.
[Insert Trite Willis Joke Here]
Dotty was probably kinda annoyed by the way Carla described her answer.
Just As Planned
Dorothy steeples fingers. And smiles.
My first meeting with one of my best friends was basically this conversation, but about the best generation of Pokemon.
Hahaha! As far as birthday comics go, I guess I could do worse than an epic nerdrage teamup.
(Given some upcoming preview panels tho, I can’t wait to see how this all goes to heck.)
Also, I CANNOT get over how adorable Carla is in that first panel. Look at her tiny little pouty mouth!!!
She’s like an angry piece of pie.
Hey, it’s your birthday too? High five!
Yay! Happy birthday!
Also, I’m loving that there’s a big clump of readers in the early July sweet spot. We should form a club.
I second that
….. so what’s so special about early October, again? Nights getting longer, maybe? Oh, I know, people got an extra hour when Daylight Savings Time ended.
Dotty should know that stepping in and calling a passionate argument ‘about something stupid’ is a bad idea.
She didn’t want to step in.
Dorothy’s foot, meet Dorothy’s mouth. Hillary Clinton, Jr. indeed.
This isn’t a politician thing, rather that it is a wisdom of not getting in the way of arguments between geeks. For those of us who love Star Trek, we can rail against those who think that Next Gen is the best, when clearly the correct answer is Deep Space Nine. For those who love sports, there will be those who say that the Yankees are awesome and the Red Sox suck. But all of these are qualitative analyses that absolutely depend on the opinion of the person voicing it. If you don’t have a horse in the race, there’s no point in trying to settle any sort of argument.
The politician aspect, however, is that she’s really only interested, apparently, in arguing about things that actually require argument. Star Trek, sports, and cartoons, while having their various fans, will settle nothing with their arguments. Politics, however, is all about arguing, and deciding what to do with education, defense, taxes, and everything else to run the ship of state. She may not see the point, really, of arguing about something that will not affect people’s lives in the long run.
But what’s fun about that? Meanwhile, David Tennant is the best new series Doctor Who, Tom Baker is the best old series Doctor Who, Romana is the best companion, and anyone who tells you different is either horribly deluded or horribly misguided. 🙂
“Tom Baker” sure is a funny way to spell “Sylvester McCoy” (and David Tennant a funny way to spell “Peter Capaldi”)
I see how you can confuse the spelling of “Patrick Troughton” and “Sylvester McCoy” but really you should be more careful about these things.
M-A-T-T. Four letters, can’t be that hard?
I know, right. Those are some really stupid ways to spell Matt Smith.
I do enjoy that no one has contested my pick for best companion. 🙂
Why should we, you are right!
Using Carla’s argument, Romana is best companion because crushing hard on her when I was 7 was probably my first indication that I was queer. (And her French schoolgirl outfit was my first consumption of fan service, albeit a fan service never intended for me.)
A-C-E is only three letters, so I can’t imagine how anyone could spell it “Romana”.
Can we at least agree that the best Doctor between the classic and new series was Paul McGann?
(Cue the Atkinson fans…)
That’s an odd way to spell ‘Joanna Lumley’.
[applauds wildly]
(seriously, Jonathan Pryce was amazing as the Master, I wanted to see him do it for real.)
Absolutely f’srs agreed.
Right the greater-than lesser-than symbols are reserved for formatting OHAITHERE!
Reposting:
_Insert rant here about DS9’s awfulness and how that’s actually relevant to society. Something about betraying ST’s vision of a bright and hopeful future and replacing it with a state of unending 40k-esque warfare, and how the modern world could use more optimism for the future and less endless war._
Space: 1999 kicked all their butts.
Series 1 was uneven but great.
Once Sylvia was gone between years (as she and Gerry broke up) the auguring-in of Series 2 was sadness made epic. But Series 1 was great.
Is that what did it? I never knew, during my original wee-fan days nor my rediscovery. Figures, though.
See also what happened to Lucas after his divorce.
Sylvia was a huge creative force throughout all of their series and after the divorce he did his best to erase that. I’ve been personally working to restore her on my tumblr, for whatever that’s worth.
The Tracy family, in Thunderbirds? Her creation. The coherence of feel across everything, and the way that the worlds really, really fit together? As a rule, that’s her.
See also: Fred Freiberger. The man who also brought us Season 3 Trek TOS.
S`why I use the Brackets. Though I wonder… ⁢>
Almost “lt” (lower-than), not “it”!
<
Ah, thanks. Not quite sure why I used an ‘i’ there.
Insert counter rant about DS9’s still relevant discussions about not overreacting to terrorism, tackling poverty, and maintaining a moral code in wartime. Also extol the value of a continuing storyline, which led to the genius of the BSG reboot.
🙂
*twitch* *twitch*
You think DS9 introduced the value of a continuing storyline?? BAB5 YOU UNEDUCATED HEATHEN *starts throwing chairs*
1. DS9 started in 1993, B5 in 1994
2. I never said anything about “introduced,” and it was solely a Trek v. Trek comparison
3. It is to BSG, because Ronald D. Moore, exec. producer of BSG, came up through the ranks of DS9.
and Moore’s dry run for “ship on its own, with limited resources and a crew with serious internal divisions, on a journey of indefinite duration” was VOY, until he found out that everyone else there just wanted to remake TNG.
Well yeah, cause TNG.
Also the Ferengi get introduced to feminism. That’s pretty huge. So the “DS9 is devoid of hope” is unconvincing to me. War does suck, but seeing societies capable of change for the better is very encouraging to me. And showing that change happen, rather than just the finished product where magically people already get along to begin with, sometimes except for some of the clear villains, gives me more hope that it is actually possible from our starting point.
I should go rewatch all the Ishka episodes…
I think you are completely right in how Dorothy wants to save her political debates for important stuff.
The sad thing is, of course, that if she ever gets into politics for real, she will be stuck discussing dumb things with idiots.
I REALLY hope she’ll end up in a debate with Robin before this arc is over.
Which is why her college experience is proving to be excellent training on how to be a politician.
Ahem. Leela by a long chalk.
Carla, calling Dorothy by that name has a completely different meaning now.
(Yeah, I know these strips were created months in advance… Sorry.)
And it will shift again as comic book time moves them ever onward, into the HRC presidency, or the Trump presidency with HRC leading The Undergorund Resistance, etc.
And yet will still be probably be a relevant reference to make either way.
hey wait, wheres cerberus? did i make them feel unsafe?
Nope. Right here. Just had birthday stuff go late last night.
happy belated birthday
Screw it, main post first. Why not an Optimal Truce? Or a Star Truce? Or maybe an Abbreviated Truce?
Dorothy, diss not the nerds’ dedication to their fandoms! It’s the only thing that can and will unite them! 😀
Who got a Dorothy strip for his birthday???? THIS DUDE!!!!
Awwww, look who tries to be above it all. Sorry, Dotty. You can just as well give them your spiel about the sensitivity scanner now, there is no getting out of it. If you want to avoid pointless argument about stupid things, politics might not be the place for you.
But on the other hand this WAS a great politician moment. If this had been a real debate for real voters, a large chink of the voters (the ones opposing Carla and Walky) would just neatly go to her side.
Happy birthday!!!!!!!
May all your days be filled with happy blue Becky flashback panels!
MEGATRUCE — the Transformer who sought to bring down Autobot society by passive resistance. He transforms into a typewriter.
I still think that Walky understands Carla’s situation fully well and tries to validate her in his own Walkyish way. Look how he goes out of his way to validate her gender identity in the first panel.
And I also think Carla appreciates it. Walky supports her belief of just how IMPORTANT cartoons are, even if he is too stupid to understand the majesty of UltraCar. He plays the game. Dorothy, on the other hand, threatens to smash the gameboard when she calls it stupid. Answering in kind to Carla’s jerkish snipe about politicians, but still. Megatruce indeed!
I’m sure Walky and Carla will be good friends…. in the Walky and Billie sense.
Is Walky validating her identity, or is he just being Walky? We’ve seen him being stuck very firmly on a solid, clearly-defined gender binary. “Dudes do ___; ladies do ____, it’s one or the other, and if you’re not one, you’re being the other.” So is he being sensitive or clueless? I can easily see him just automatically default to female on the grounds of, “Lives in the girls’ wing, has a female name, therefore is female” and possibly some “liked that stupid girl cartoon = must be a girl” as well.
I think Carla appreciates the argument, certainly, although I think she’s looking forward to crushing Walky for being wrong just as much as he’s looking forward to crushing her -that it’s as much a matter of asshole-off as it is a matter of common interest. ….did you just compare Dorothy to Belkar Bitterleaf?
I’m not as sure about friendship -I can see this evolving into a cartoon-centered prank-war for quite some time (and probably one that they both enjoy) that suddenly ends when Walky realizes (or someone tells him) exactly why UltraCar was and is so important to Carla, but I don’t see them trusting each other enough to call each other friends.
Dorothy can’t be Belkar. She has shoes.
Yeah, but SIERRA can’t be Belkar. She’s too tall.
This. I’m thinking this is much more Carla “passing” for cis and Walky assuming: girl name, girl wing, girly cartoon, girly argument about feelings, must be girl. And mom always said to not call random women girls and instead ladies, so she’s a lady now.
Rather than it being him recognizing she’s a trans woman and affirming her identity. That all being said, I guarantee using her correct pronoun and not stumbling over that was appreciated by Carla because yeah.
OOOH SHIT IS GOING DOOOOOWN
Dotty gonna get tenderised like the meat in a nerd sandwich.
That sounds surprisingly hot
Kinky
Okay, now they’re bonding. 😀
Oh, Carla, no. Just no.
Way to be a jerk Carla… it’s almost like she takes pride in it or something.
On the other hand, Carla was quick to pull back from something that genuinely hurt Dorothy (your chosen career is stupid) to a much safer venue (total geeks vs not as total geeks). She still tries to be as non-damaging with her jerkiness as she can.
I don’t really see the issue. Baby politicians need no coddling when if they’re successful, they’ll hold the reins of power, and the overwhelming majority of successful politicians are at least partial bastards.
Eh, I guess I view it as more, don’t just attack the baby politician for wanting to be a politician, let them inevitably disappoint you first before slagging them for being a bastard who can’t actually get your back.
Though that might be more because I want people to be critiqued and pushed back for what they actually did or the toxic stew they are actually reinforcing rather than what they might do in the future because their job description has a bad rap*.
Given that the disappointment is inevitable (And I say this as someone who rather strongly believes that we’re better off with a strong state), I really don’t see why we should pretend that THIS baby politician is sure to be the unicorn we’ve all waited for. Especially since the actual complaint is to a thing she’s doing right now.
As far as ‘what they’ve done’, especially if you’re dealing with a tiny anarchist, ‘reinforce the existing system’ is sort of a flaw, if you’re at all revolutionary. Not all anarchists are, at all, but… Dotty hasn’t given any indication of wanting to make systemic changes like that (though in further fairness, Carla isn’t necessarily a Tiny Anarchist either, who’d hold that against her).
Still, Baby Politicians in particular just… don’t seem to really deserve anything but doubt and disbelief.
Oh, I’d missed yesterday’s comic. “Monkey Master has to fart” vs. “I never got any toys of the one girl I wanted a toy of” garners a ‘both sides are good’? Yeaaaaaah, Carla’s ‘meh, politicians’ just went from understandable to deserved. Like, she’s not even raising a trans point there, but a somewhat more normal one for women.
Like, you don’t even have to get /into/ the argument to say “That’s really terrible.”
It’s hilarious you seem to be lost for words for once, Cerb (no offense ; )
Heh.
I made up for it in the morning, but that’s really all I could think to respond last night. I’m genuinely glad it was amusing. 🙂
Yeah, I think it’s a great juxtaposition between seeing her soliloquize about how important Ultra Car is to her, and then have that followed up by Carla dismissing Dorothy’s political ambitions.
‘Cause Carla’s a jerk, and she’s a good character because she’s a jerk. I like moments like this because they make her a more complex character.
I really love it when characters like Carla and Becky show their actual flaws, cause it really makes them realer people and it reveals their weaknesses and where they still need to grow and more about their character as a whole.
Plus, it’s something I can point to when people are clinging to made-up stuff to slag the characters for. Like, no, look, actual flaws, they’re not actually some perfect god-character designed to attack your bigoted way of life, honest. Slag that instead.
Like all the people who were whining about $20 Becky haircuts when her actual issues of unchecked jealousy of Dorothy where fully on display and a much more glaring and real flaw.
Do it, Carla!
Come to the Dark Side! He has cookies left over!
…..
Okay, realistically, no, but the ginger snaps come through him in the past and likely will again in the future. GINGER SNAPS, Carla! GINGER SNAPS!
Ha! Called it, y’all! Althpugh i have to admit I didn’t expect them to bond in LITERALLY one day!
Which is a reminder that, unfortunately, nothing tends to unite people like a common adversary.
Dorothy has a lot to learn about nerdrage management…
Especially if she wants to run for president, nerds are among the voters as well.
The beginning of a beautiful friendship.
A friendship based on murdering Dorothy for “insulting” their shows.
Murder and hiding the body can be excellent bonding experiences.
Oh Dorothy, if you think the argument was stupid before, just wait until you see the idoicy that results from their powers combined.
Ultra stupidity?
MEGA-stupidity!
Talk less, smile more. Don’t let them know what you’re against or what you’re for!
So class, here we see the beginning of the rift between Dorothy Keener and the Cartoon Enthusiast Community that would one day nearly cost the aspiring young politician her chance at the presidency.
She narrowly loses the 2060 election owing to what future political science theorists dub the “Cartoon gaff”. Her career was put into turmoil for a number of years after that.
Also, the fact that by 2060 she will be studying for Spring midterms.
I like to think Walky prounces it “Ayy Too.”
And thus walky was banished to the doghouse forever.
Best way to get 2 people to shut up about Kirk and Picard and join forces is for a Star Wars fans to enter an opinion. Dorothy is right though. It’s stupid because Carla and Walky love what they love because it’s a part of their childhood and no rational argument can change that.
Also it’s stupid because Carla just blatantly insulted Dorothy’s dreams because she won’t get involved in an argument over cartoons, and Walky takes this as an opportunity to get back at her over it.
Both of this. She was dragged into a no-win situation here and got shit on for it, with Carla insulting her dreams in a similar way that Walky dismissed Carla’s personal resonances and her bf treating it like some personal betrayal.
The argument was stupid, even if the works are important to each of them and it’s perfectly rational for Dorothy to not have wanted any piece of it with the strong feelings involved.
Hell hath no fury like nerds scorned.
And tomorrow :
TICKLE ATTACK !
And thus the Dexter & Monkey Master/Ultra Car Party was formed, uniting nerds into a political force…
I cannot, for the life of me, understand how Walky is being judged so hard for arguing with Carla about a cartoon. They’re both passionate about it, and like Dorothy says, it is pretty stupid. But because Carla is trans and Walky /only/ likes his show because he thought it was good he’s an asshole for looking down on Carla’s love of Ultra Car, which Carla is doing towards Walky’s Monkey Master show but she’s totally in the right because she’s a strong trans woman who needed that show in a hard time in her life.
It’s really stupid, they’re both arguing over which cartoon they like better, Carla being tans does not make Walky an asshole because he’s not agreeing with her.
I think people are saying Walky is an asshole because he’s not listening to Carla or her heartfelt story because he wants to be RIGHT about something stupid. The story wouldn’t be changed if Ruth talked about My Little Pony Friendship is Magic keeping her from suicide and Walky still said Dragonballz Z was better becasue it had cool fights.
This. Walky being a bit of an asshole last comic more had to do with him insisting on continuing a pointless nerd fight and ignoring what Carla was actually saying and her vulnerability. It’s also that we’re in the position of being lucky enough to know that Carla is trans and that her vulnerability is a rare thing, so we know that Walky’s dismissal is bigger than he realizes.
That all being said, on the fight over “who’s cartoon is better” that Walky wants to have, yeah, who gives a shit. If there’s a team in play, I’m Team Dorothy on that one. And Carla had my major sympathy last comic, but here she’s actually done something rude and dismissive and is being just as much of an asshole in ways she doesn’t realize by being super dismissive of Dorothy’s dreams.
Because they’re Team Carla. If Carla isn’t “right” here, that means you’re on Team Walky, or some other team, and you’re not a “true fan”.
The trouble with so many people today – especially Americans, as I speak of my own people – is that everything is viewed through the lens of sports teams, or Coke vs. Pepsi or something. You can’t be a Cardinals fan AND a Cubs fan! That’s just not done!
Except that applying that mindset to people is stupid, and ultimately hurtful.
o.0
Stupid?
I have to disagree with you here. Arguing about cartoons isn’t stupid. Because it’s as much a part of their identity as any other thing about them.
Hell, you could easily argue that Dexter/Monkey Master and Ultracar are AS IMPORTANT to their self-identity to Walky/Carla respectively as their sexual identity.
Well, and McNuggets for Walky.
I know tons of people for whom their fandom is a cornerstone of their identity. And to dismiss something so core to their human experience as “Stupid” engenders just such a reaction as Walky and Carla has.
I mean, Ultracar, to Carla, seems to me to be as much a part of her identity as being trans. Maybe slightly less.
I will put in the disclaimer here that I may be wrong, and as a (mostly) straight cis dude I know practically nothing about what it would be like for a queer person in this world today.
Comic Reactions:
Panel 1: Oh Walky… -1 boyfriend point for dragging Dorothy into your argument and expecting her to back you up in your pointless nerd flex off. That’s just a really uncomfortable thing and puts your romantic partner on the spot and in a position where they’ll feel they’ll be labeled negatively if they bow out.
Fight your own battles dude, don’t drag your gf into this.
Panel 2: And yeah, you can see her on the spot here. And it’s a no win situation. If she backs up her bf and does the dutiful gf role there’s social pressure on her to do, then she’s double teaming Carla about a fight she knew better to enter into and which Carla has just got done linking to her own experiences of discrimination, alienation, and her own family’s love.
If she backs up Carla, then she’s throwing her bf under the bus and that will likely mean her having to spend a lot of time doing emotional self-care with her bf because to him he won’t understand it and will feel he was betrayed in the middle of his nerd flex and that Dorothy doesn’t “support” him.
It’s quite literally a no win situation and her best angle is some form of dodge, either trying to appease both sides or affirming your desire to stay out of it completely or going into a long explanation of how both sides aren’t really having the same conversation, which can be hella risky because Carla is likely in a mood to be tetchy after Walky’s last dismissal and Walky is in full nerd machismo mode and is likely to interrupt her. So, really:
Panel 3: Her only option is a dodge. And she tries a classic peacemaker one.
Panel 4: And oh Carla. Oh Carla, no. People who’ve been looking for her doing something unequivocally rude, this is your moment, because yeah, this is a complete douche move by Carla. Dorothy wanted no part in this fight and was just put on the spot. And while this may be nerdicly important to Carla and tie in a lot with identity, this isn’t the same thing as a real queer politics fight about access to civil rights.
There’s really no reason for Carla to go on the attack like this and I say this as a person who can be similarly tetchy about the mushy middle as well as someone who understands her baby tranarchist “the system is corrupt, maaaaan” stance where “all politicians are evil, dude and will let you down” because that was suuuuper common among the trans college kids I used to mentor.
And it’s an understandable phase to be in when your rights are under attack and no one seems to be doing anything about it. But Carla’s rights are not under attack this conversation. This is not actually an authority figure disappointing Carla for the umpteenth time, this is just a girl put in an unwinable situation and so a firm tsk, tsking in Carla’s direction on this one.
Panel 5: Which is why it’s even more understandable for Dorothy to be like, well, fuck your argument, it’s stupid. Cause it is. Like Walky is just doing a nerd machismo thing and arguing one argument and Carla is having a completely different conversation about the personal resonance of queer-affirming media and Walky is not listening to it.
The “argument” itself is therefore incredibly stupid, because it’s so unavoidable and it’s started by Walky doing his standard putting down something important to someone else shtick which was often going to raise up hackles and lead to pointless fights.
If Walky “wins” here, he wins nothing. And if Carla “wins” in that she’s heard, that’s something, but that’s not hyper critical in the overall course of her day and she’s probably in a mood to settle for Walky walking away which he’s not in a mind to do because he wants to “win”.
So yeah, her refusing to be insulted for an argument that is stupid is absolutely her right. Unfortunately she’s a bit offended from being insulted and being dragged into this pointless fight and has a stance that cartoons really are just the thing you use to mindlessly recharge from the stresses of day-to-day life and doesn’t quite have the same resonances it does for both Walky and Carla.
Panel 6: Which is why, hilarious team-up aside, it makes sense that Walky and Carla would overplay how much they’re “offended” by Dorothy’s dismissal. Because Walky won’t admit it, but D&MM has personal history for him, a thing he got to share with his sister before everything went bad, a thing to share with a future loved one. And likely was similarly there for him when being neglected by his busy parents or dealing with casual racism microaggressions at school. And Carla’s personal history was all over the last strip.
Still, though, both of you stop being stupid, Dorothy was put in a no-win situation here and you both know it.
Panel 2 and 3’s correct response: Grin, laugh, tossle Walky’s hair, and say, “Oh no, this is YOUR fight. I’m having too much fun watching.” Make it playful and clear with your grin that you’re fond of him and find him cute, then cut him loose to the wolves.
….
…. sometimes the correct response is the vicious and cold-blooded one.
Okay, yeah, that would be the way to dodge out of that successfully compared to her attempt.
Though your comment makes me think that Dorothy’s main flaw might be that she’s too nice. And I mean that not only in how being super nice can actually be a flaw in her chosen career path, but that I feel she lets herself get sucked into things and feeling like she needs to help everyone around her with a problem really easily and that adds a lot of stress on an otherwise stressful plate. Not to mention her eagerness can sometimes put off people she’s trying to help (see Sal’s statement about not reaching out to Dorothy because she doesn’t want to be her project or Walky’s stiff-arming of her attempts to “better him” up).
I think her arc might be learning to temper that instinct while still holding on to her ideals and desire to do good by people and I feel to that end, her interactions with Joyce have been an excellent depiction of her working on that very issue.
I meant that part more as a critique of my own proposal than as a critique of Dorothy, but there might be something to it.
I think the bigger problem with Dorothy is that she doesn’t do presentation right. She’s got all these great ideals and wonderful desires and plans and she’s going to screw them up and fail hard because she doesn’t know how to talk to people. Well she knows how to talk to people as a person, but not how to talk to people as a leader who needs to align their desires with her vision. That type of political acumen requires understanding everyone’s desires and reframing your cause in terms of those desires, rather than just trying to explain your vision and assuming everyone (or at least a majority) will fall in love with it. That’s a what-Dorothy-wants narrative and as a politician she will need to reframe it as a what-you-want narrative.
Probably the best example I can think of this is the scene from Dead Man’s Chest (one of the bright spots in a flawed sequel) where Jack gets Elizabeth to use the compass. He identifies her driving passion (not hard) and explains, with repetition, how doing what he wants her to do will advance her own goals. He doesn’t plead his own case to her about how he’s in trouble and won’t she please help. Instead he makes her WANT to help by aligning his cause with her goals.
In this case, Walky wants validation. On the surface, he wants numerical support for Dexter and Monkey Master, but deeper down what he wants is emotional support that he isn’t being a complete dweeb here. What Dorothy wants is to give that validation, but also not get drawn into the trivial argument. She falls into the trap of thinking that it’s either-or, when if she recognized and spoke to the deeper desire for emotional support and signaled a fondness for him that had nothing to do with this argument, maybe even acknowledging that he IS a dweeb while simultaneously signalling that she loves that about him, she could stay out of the whole silly cartoon debate entirely.
Also, minor note, but argh, Walky, this is why you don’t try and drag other people into your pointless nerd fights, because it puts people in shitty positions with people who are likely to be running hot because you’re in the middle of an argument.
Hell, in general, it’s just awful behavior to drag anyone into your fights and especially in a “back me up” kinda way. Like by all means, signal someone to give you an out and an excuse to disengage or let them enter the conversation naturally if they so choose, but don’t just randomly grab a friend to get your back because you feel you are “losing”.
That’s just bad manners, whether it’s in a pointless nerd fight or in a really involved political conversation involving personal rights. Like, if Carla had actually been being racist and Walky asked her to get her back, that’s (while WAY more understandable) still a bit of a social faux pas to put her on the spot in demanding backup and putting her on the spot (though he’d be reasonable to expect her to step in and say what the fuck in that particular circumstance).
Bad bf move, bro. And bad friend move in general.
Fuck this is gonna go down like when Macho Man and Hulk Hogan made the Mega Powers isn’t it? All we need is Dina to be Dorothy’s Ultimate Warrior and we’ve got a show here tonight.
Load up the rocketship… with the accurate models of compsognathus?
Would have thought Mary might be the more obvious analogue for Warrior, given some of his most infamous statements post-wrestling.
We could probably come up with a good Four Horsewomen from the cast, though. Becky Lynch is a perfect fit for… Well, Becky. Sal as Sasha Banks, Carla as Charlotte, and… Joyce’d probably be a good Bayley, although lacks the alliteration.
The only way to truly unite opposing forces is against a third faction.
So it seems news about Dorothy’s political aspirations had made it across the dorm.
Wonder who told Carla about it and why she is interested in this / has memorised this?
Joe & Walky talk about it in public here, but wasn’t this the gender-studies class, which Carla does not attend?
Sal is my guess. She knows about Dorothy’s political aspirations both from Walky, hanging out with her, and it probably being the major point of conversation from her parents the few times they bother to contact her.
And so it probably came up once or twice while they hung out. Though, that being said, I’m super excited, because it would mean that Sal is actually opening up to Carla and between that, her friendship with Danny, and her mentorship kinda deal with Joyce, she might be actually building herself a friends circle and an emotional support network.
I’m as nerdy as anyone, but I agree with Dorothy, too. I get defending your favorite show. But there’s no reason to bash some other nerd’s favorite.
Plus, unless Walky got the DVD of it, which it doesn’t sound like he would, he doesn’t know if the show was good. It could have been better. And no nerd says that a show being canceled means it was bad.
R.I.P. Dorothy
Megatruce sounds like a folk music reaction to Megadeth.
Thus a new ship is born
Dorothy: “look i don’t see what you guys have to argue about when CLEARLY Powerpuff Girls is the superior show”
Completely unrelated to this specific comic, I FOUND THE FIRST APPEARANCE OF TOEDAD!
…and I can’t post the link…
faans dot com / books1-6 / index.php?p=2087
Oh, he appeared in Joyce & Walky! long before that. T just wanted to borrow him.
Oh. Damn.
Wow, calling her Hillary Clinton is a big insult.
Heh heh, she said straddled.
X3
I can kinda get why these two think cartoons are so important.
It’s entertaining, and they can be stupid, yes.
But they give a young child a broader view of what’s possible and sometimes even what’s acceptable in the broader world.
The stories and characters may be silly, but the characters can resonate with younger viewers and help them build a better understanding of their identity.
Take theAvatar:Korra series. I imagine a few kids were watching and might have been a little confused by the ending, but it planted a few seeds of tolerance.
And even more than that, the more recent cartoons like Steven universe and Adventure time. They send different messages. Love and family are important, and the world can be grand and interesting no matter where you are.
Youth is a time where most of the time, you’re restricted to a relatively small space. But modern media allows our minds to travel quite far.
So in that, cartoons are important because they can teach people both about themselves and the broader world.
walky then broke up with the treacherous blonde, started dating the redhead, and made fanshow called “dexter,monkeymaster, and ultracar”.
Carla is homoromantic. First time today that has been brought up.
It occurs to me that she’s not calling their hobbies stupid, but I think she merely thinks their argument is stupid.
she probs should’ve said “trivial” instead of stupid tbh
With only two sentences Dorothy managed to unify two warring factions in pursue of a common goal. She is going to be a great politician.