Not exactly. Dexter is a Latin adjective meaning “on the right hand side, skillful, handy, proper, favorable.” The positive connotation arising as most people (being right handed) see the right hand as the more useful, hand while the left hand is clumsy and therefore unfavorable.
Oh yeah. Thanks for correcting me. My information sub-space storage area gets messy at night, and I maek mistacks. I am glad I did not cause great confusion in the minds of the children of tomorrow! Now remember kids: southpaws are evil, because Latin is always right. (Warning: Latin is not always right)
Dude… you were the one who brought etymology into the equation. The point wasn’t that Latin meaning was A therefore B; it was that just because Latin for A means alpha doesn’t mean Latin for B means beta.
Here’s some interesting tidbits. It seems that it’s uncertain if the left = bad association originates with lefthanded people or augury, and it’s all screwed up to begin with because it’s based on stuff the Romans mixed up when they stole it from the Greeks anyway.
1) Happiness is a warm gun.
2) The Iron Man armours in their various incarnations are made of weapons which obey the laws of thermodynamics unless otherwise noted (See: Repulsors being used to weld crap together, the Avengers )
QED Tony Stark has happiness.
My parents were like this when I was ten, but not when I was in college.
I think it’s perfectly fine when your kids are ten to micromanage what goes into their minds. Responsible, even! You don’t want them murdering hookers in GTA.
Some parents never really want to admit that their kids aren’t ten any more though. “Do you want me to go in with you? Are you okay to go in by yourself?” “Mom, I am 23 years old, I don’t need you to come in with me for a job interview.” “Are you sure? I’ll be right outside.”
Why so? Joyce´s mom respects her daugther´s decision to watch a show which she herself sees as “bad”. Expressing your opinion and forbidding your daugther to do this and that cause of your beliefs are two different pairs of shoes.
If anything this strip made me like Joyce´s family more. They might be a bit or alot jesus-crazy but they´re good people and love their children enough to let them do their own things.
No, she only respects the decision as long as it’s not what she sees as “bad”. That’s the issue. I don’t find them particularly annoying myself, but it’s a bit like parents who say they’re fine with their children exploring religion on their own… as long as they accept Christ as their Lord and Savior in the end. And only if they accept him the right way, not in a different sect or with a different/more liberal interpretation of the Bible.
It’s not that bad — I’m not being literal, here — but it’s reminiscent of that kind of behavior. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’d disown her for it, but I do find it irritating when people make a big deal out of being accepting over other beliefs (even within their own sect) only to basically end it with, “Well, that’s nice, dear… but you know that means you’re going to Hell, right?”
It’s a bit more like sharing your religion with your child. While I’d prefer that kids get to choose on their own, it’s not inherently cruel; kids grow up and learn to think for themselves, eventually.
It’s more on par with telling one’s children about the toothfairy, except in this case the parents believe in the toothfairy, too.
I’d also really rather people not use stuff like child abuse for their extreme and prejudiced exaggerations. One thing is maybe mildly irritating. The other is fucking child abuse. Let’s not downplay the fact that abusing a child is pretty goddamn monstrous.
The Westboro Baptist Church homeschool their children.
They indoctrinate, keep them from other people, tell them God hates everyone, threaten them with an afterlife of eternal fire, and force them to hold vulgar hateful signs on street corners. They force them to protest funerals of soldiers and innocent children. They force a hatred into their hearts and minds. They mentally cripple and warp them.
That is psychological child abuse. Not all abuse is physical. And it’s true that not all homeschooling is abusive.
But shit like the WBC and other extremist cults are abusive to their children. Just because the scars and bruises aren’t visible doesn’t mean they’re not there.
That’s likely a case of an exception, not a rule. There are many different reasons for homescooling, not all of them religious. I myself was homeschooling my mother for a year or so after a particularly viscous bullying incident in which a couple of guys thought it’d be funny to tell one of the black girls in my class I called her the N word. After she slapped me and started to try and press charges I had a nervous mental breakdown and was basically a sobbing quivering wreck, bullying had been a huge problem for me since elementary school and this was a situation where it was th straw that broke the camel back. Our schools out east had a “zero tolerance poliy” towards violence, meaning anyone involved ina fight was equally responsible. This meant hat if someone attacked you you couldn’t so much as defend yourself without getting expelled, it was irreverent anyway because even if you didn’t fight back your attacks friends would claim you instigated the fight and fought back and you’d be expelled anyway. After that mom withdrew m from the school system and I was home schooled with the assistance of my teachers providing text books lesson plans and the like for the rest of the year. I came back next year but it was just as bad if not worse. So yeah posting an extreme example won’t work when trying tp rpove your point, after all, only a sith deals in absolutes
And you’re entirely missing the point. Those religions aren’t just abusing their children, they’re abusing pretty much everyone they come into contact with, and they are NOT even remotely the same as believing in creationism. It’s offensive to anyone with a lick of intelligence to imply as much. It’s even more fucking offensive to even BEGIN to imply that that’s what homeschooling is generally like; homeschooling isn’t even religious by nature. You’re making wild leaps of logic to imply that homescholing is USUALLY religious and USUALLY abusive.
I’m not an idiot; I’m well fucking aware that not all abuse is physical. That doesn’t mean that people teaching their children things you don’t personally believe in or even think of as ridiculous is the same as emotional abuse, and, again, it waters down the importance of rooting out REAL emotional abuse (including, but not limited to, the type perpetrated by the WBC). Nobody’s going to take you very seriously if you bring up emotional abuse and then use teaching children creationism as an example; they’ll just think you’re an egotistical idiot.
Creationists pull the same “no true scotsman” nonsense all the time. They don’t automatically wish death on people, but many are still smug about “sin” and what not. They also try to force it to be taught in science classes. Someone who went to school to become a biologist doesn’t have a debate with a glorified evangelist who promotes pseudoscience. It’s only “personal belief” for creationists; evolution has been observed many times.
You talk about “offense”, yet you put creationism in the same category as the whole of religion. Plenty of religious people accept evolution. It may not be as harmful as many other things, but teaching creationism is still harmful. It leads to ignorance and stunted scientific/intellectual growth.
They might “think” people like Shilo are “egotistical idiots”, but that’s actually creationists. That’s classic psychological projection right there.
I think it’s a reference to Avatar: The Last Airbender, which was accused (not inaccurately) to teach kid about eastern religions.
Not that it’s a bad thing.
I’ll stomp on PC and say it is probably bad. Anything that promotes any religion is bad, unless the religion is true. All religions and thus anything promoting them are bad… unless one is true.. then only that one is good (As an agnostic I’m not going to make any claims that any specific ones are or are not the one if there is one).
Think about it. People dedicate everything to their religions. (Some more so than others). Imagine all the monks! Their entire lives, everything they could have done, seen, been, all sacrificed to go meditate/worship/study religious books (exactly which of these depends on the religion). If their religion isn’t true then it’s all a waste! That is horrible.
I’m the sort who believes that so long as you did your best to follow God or what you understand to be His equivalent as best you can, nothing you did in that vein is wasted. You did your best to be a good Catholic, or Muslim, or whatever you call people who follow Buddha? God will accept that you did your best and take you in anyways.
In short, even if the religion you follow isn’t the most correct, that doesn’t mean that the efforts you put in were wasted.
Of course, I’m positive that there are religions that vehemently disagree with me.
Now, I don’t count the people who can be talked into suicide bombing or mass conquering or whatever else some people use religion to justify. I honestly don’t think they read their holy texts enough to realize the hypocrisy of what they’re doing, and there are some basic things that they should know God/equivalent would never tell them to do.
“No matter what completely different deities you think exist, as long as you try hard to behave as appropriate for that deity, you’ll be accepted by a deity. Unless you do the above in a way which conflicts with my own values. Oh, and this assumes that some sort of deity exists in the first place.”
It’s not my values specifically, it’s doing those things that anyone who actually reads their own scriptures should know is not appropriate.
“Love one another” does not compute with “let’s kill them because they don’t accept Christ”.
“O ye who believe!… [do not] kill yourselves” does not translate into “I’m gonna blow myself up, kill a bunch of innocents, and get to party with virgins in the afterlife”.
In short, it is those who do things that are unequivocally wrong (mass murder, rape, enslavement, et cetera) in the name of their religions who are in trouble.
And yes, this does assume that there is a diety directing the affairs of the universe. For those of you who disagree, that’s fine, my arguments are not meant for you anyways. They’re meant for those who can, at the very least, agree that there is indeed a Being that should be followed. But if you’re expecting a religious person to go into a discussion NOT assuming the existence of God/Allah/what have you, you’re being silly. Just as silly as assuming an atheist to go into a discussion assuming the presence of such a Being.
“Mass murder” shouldn’t be the only thing on your list. The commandment is thou shalt not kill.
So, no murders at all. And not only that, but no killing at all, which includes things like acting in self-defense. (Turn the other cheek, Jesus would say; why are you so invested in staying alive anyway? You get to go to Heaven that much quicker like this!)
It says “Thou shall not kill” in English. It’s an imperfect translation. The original Hebrew word used in place of “kill” has a more nuanced meaning. For example, it is never used in contexts of war.
No, that particular bit of weird predates Avatar by forever. When I used to read some of those ‘Christian’ review sites for giggles way back at the turn of the century when some of them were still amusing, rather than horrifying, ‘promotes eastern religion’ was a very common criticism.
My “favorite” argument against Pokémon wasn’t the “evolution” issue (in the series, the term is basically shorthand for metamorphosis rather than actual evolution.) It’s that “Pokémon is Satanic because it includes creatures that grow horns when they grow up!”
I wonder how these people reconcile themselves eating beef. Maybe they’re the same crazies who condemn people that hunt animals for meat and demand that they buy the meat that’s “made at the store.”
Star Wars was accused of promoting Eastern Religion. And Willis’ parents banned him from watching He-Man because “Only Jesus has The Power”, which is what’s most likely relevant here.
I know I shouldn’t find the ideals of screwed up fundamentalists who indoctrinate children funny, but I can’t stop laughing at the mental imagery of Jesus holding up a sword and going “IIIIII HAVE THE POWEEEEERRRR!!!”
Thanks, I was drinking the left-over milk from my cereal when I read that. I nearly spewed (SPEWED I SAY!) the whole thing on my computer screen and computer!
Star Wars was based on “eastern religions”. The Force was based off Taoism, and the Jedi code partly on Buddhism. Obviously given a unique spin, but I thought it was interesting that it’s based off real religions.
The lightsabers are clearly phallic cigars though.
Nah, Star Wars is based off masonic legend. The Emperor turning Anakin to the dark side is supposedly a metaphor for the Pope/Catholic Church ‘subverting’ Christianity.
I kind of liked Stan, he was pretty fun. He was also not really ‘her’ in the psychological sense, so I’d have been fine with it – just think of Wed. as a ‘girlfriend free’ day and you’re fine.
An antelope, actually–it’s the title of the episode (“Date with an Antelope”). Written by Seth MacFarlane, believe it or not.
I’m still amazed that Johnny Bravo not only got past the pilot stage, but actually ran for several years on Cartoon Network. After all, it’s a TV-Y7-rated cartoon which is basically about a guy trying very hard to get laid.
Yea, I loved that cartoon, but I had the same question. I always figured whoever bought it for the network never actually watched it, and thought it was something similar to Jonny Quest. I was pleasantly surprised to see Seth MacFarlane show up in the writers credits for Dexters Lab as well.
Johnny Bravo was one of the shows that sprung up
from “WHAT. A. CARTOON!” – a program that featured oddball one-shots. Some of them, like Dexter/Johnny Bravo/Cow and Chicken made it to full shows, many more did not sadly – some where REALLY (I’m fucking serious) fucked up and awesome
I think the ones that got full shows where in part based on viewer response? I -think- I recall some sort of contest with viewers being encouraged to send in letter for it… I think.
But there comes a time when the only way to show off more powerful villain is to kill the main characters. And then you learn that teenagers are an expendable resource in today’s economy.
Not really. I mean, when was the last time you saw an ACTUAL teenager in Power Rangers, and not just an adult impersonating a teenager? Teenagers are an extremely scarce and expensive resource!
Hmm. I guess it HAS been a while. Most teenagers on TV are just really young old people now. Teenage actors are scarce, but five teenagers with ATTITUDE can be found almost everywhere.
I find the concept of calling any Power Rangers episode great, very jarring. The cognitive dissonance trying to process the concept makes my brain hurt.
Indeed, this truly is one of the things that can shatter the bonds between men. Other such things include politics, religion, philosophy, ancestry, and disagreements over who is best pony.
Sorry about that, I will try to make it up to you, if it helps any, I love Pretty Cure. By the way, you have really upset my poor brother Roboart, he has no idea why you are mad at him.
Not quite. There were other villains after Rita was written off the show. And when the actors playing the rangers got too old, there were no rangers. The Power Rangers ends when they run out of re-runs of Japanese live action senshi shows.
Well, that did happen once. Granted, Wile E. was about six inches tall at the time, but the plaintive look he gave the camera as he clung with one arm to the Roadrunner’s ankle was great. The sign he held up for us?
“Well, you always wanted me to catch him.” *flip*
“Now what?”
It is the belief in the 30 million gos, who are all called Bhudda who let you be reborn thousands of times. Each time you get more arms. The goal of life is to be reborn with a thousand arms. Then you offically become aBhudda, just like Shiva and Vishnu.
And then there are there is Zoroastrianism, which lent elements to both early Judaism and early Hinduism, and Sikhism, which is a blend of Islam and Hinduism.
Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Sikhism, Jainism, Mandaeism, Zoroastrianism, Shintoism, Cao Dai, Cheondoism, Tenrikyo, Bon, and the folk religions of Eastern Eurasia.
Depending on what era the roots of the phrase dig back to, it could even include Islam. I mean, it’s not like fundamentalist Christians are known for being choosy about their scary “other”.
I shall as well. Upon receiving badges pokemon of a higher level will obey you. Even if you’ve just beaten them to within an inch of their life. The badges Force them to obey. The joy and happy feeling? Stockholm syndrome. Every creature in the world, wishes to kill you. Or kill your pokemon and free them from enslavement. Hell, some pokemon are GHOSTS, and you don’t let them rest. You make them keep fighting.
You’re right Kernanator. Facts are simply adorable.
Pokemon of higher levels battle for you when you gain badges because they gain respect for you, despite having originally obeyed a different original trainer. You prove yourself to them and they learn to work alongside you in friendship and fellowship.
The joy and happy feeling is because you have treated them well, and they choose to side with you.
Pokemon battle naturally, against themselves and against traveling humans. It is your choice if you wish to use this natural power for yourself. And Pokemon return as ghosts because they feel they have some connection still to the world, or something left they must gain, and through helping them grow stronger, you help them to find peace.
Oh my gosh I love the Take Pokemon Way Too Seriously game! =D =D Seriously it would be horrible to do all that with real animals, but Pokemon are fictional creatures with their own in-universe natural laws, so it’s shizzle not that big a deal.
I agree, and it has been too long since I’ve had a worthy opponent.
Pokemon who have just been caught can’t have any knowledge of what the badges mean. Unless there’s an entire network of information throughout the pokemon world which informs them of the significance.
I believe LG and FR introduced a mechanic where your pokemon went further away or closer when you applied an item. But no matter how far they went, (hated you) they still fought for you. (Bonus: a couple ways to make the pokemon like you more is to walk with them in your pocket, or have them gain a level. They interpret things you pretty much don’t think of or have control over as positive reinforcement.)
Not all pokemon battle naturally, using the anime as a resource. Many pokemon simply avoid humans. In the games though, you can run around a single square, forcing a confrontation.
There are channelers in pokemon tower. Or mediums depending on the version. Based on that, either they call out to the ghosts, or the ghosts inhabit their body against their will. Given the amount, it is statistically probable, that both exist.
I return the ball into your court. Lobby it back whenever you wish. This game shall be MINE!
I really do enjoy this.)
Wasn’t there an episode of the anime where Team Rocket steals a trainers badges and his Marowak straight up abandoned him. Meowth than translated that Marowak was pissed at his trainer because losing all thier badges meant that everthing he did was completely pointless and that he couldn’t fight anyone in the pokemon league.
You don’t force confrontations in the games, you’re just walking, it’s the wild Pokémon who decide to stir up trouble. And Pokémon, even freshly caught ones do know what the badges mean, as I said before, Pokémon aren’t stupid, they’re an intelligent and aware species that knows what’s going on. They want you to battle and catch them. They want you to use them to battle against other trainers so they can get stronger.
“Pokemon who have just been caught can’t have any knowledge of what the badges mean. Unless there’s an entire network of information throughout the pokemon world which informs them of the significance.”
You don’t need badges to control Pokemon that you catch, just the ones that you trade for. This means they were owned by another trainer, and likely had knowledge of badges and the like, before they came to you.
“I believe LG and FR introduced a mechanic where your pokemon went further away or closer when you applied an item. But no matter how far they went, (hated you) they still fought for you. (Bonus: a couple ways to make the pokemon like you more is to walk with them in your pocket, or have them gain a level. They interpret things you pretty much don’t think of or have control over as positive reinforcement.)”
I’ve never heard of this, but it seems irrelevant. Of course it’s possible for your Pokemon to hate you. Otherwise, the move Frustration wouldn’t be a thing.
“Not all pokemon battle naturally, using the anime as a resource. Many pokemon simply avoid humans. In the games though, you can run around a single square, forcing a confrontation.”
You’re not forcing anything. If they didn’t want to attack you, they wouldn’t. Exhibit A: Repel. You can walk around all you want in the wild grass, but with Repel on, nothing will happen. This shows that they do, in fact, choose whether or not to attack.
“There are channelers in pokemon tower. Or mediums depending on the version. Based on that, either they call out to the ghosts, or the ghosts inhabit their body against their will. Given the amount, it is statistically probable, that both exist.”
This assertion is unfounded. None of the channelers react positively to being possessed. There is no reason to think that they are purposely drawing spirits into their bodies.
My take on all of it is that it’s ridiculous to claim that Pokemon are fighting for you completely of their own free will, but there are more benefits to being with a trainer than being in the wild, and it’s not the fact that they are owned that makes them unhappy.
Pokémon attack human trainers on PURPOSE. They do so because they want to find a human that will make them strong. A pokémon that attack a human is testing that human, and one that doesn’t want to fight will simply avoid humans altogether.
My pet theory — though not one I invested much faith in, mind — was always that Pokémon, in the world of Pokémon, was one huge, insanely popular augmented reality game.
The trainer is always a kid because kids are the ones who’d be really invested in something like that. The shops are actual shops which sell everyday items but also sell Pokémon stuff for Pokémon currency, in the same way that some stores might sell a range of products and also trading cards for the kiddies, while the Pokémon Centers are buildings built entirely for the game. The Pokémon themselves are simulations you fight with your own simulations, which is why they can be stored so easily.
So, you mean I shouldn’t have pushed my ten year old son out into the wilds of northern Canada then? Crap, no wonder I haven’t heard of him rising through the ranks of trainers. What has he been doing for the last ten years.
Hell, I think B2W2 outright said Pokemon are adorable little blood knights who like nothing more than the thrill of battle.
And the Canalave Library in the Sinnoh games has a legend on the origin of wild Pokemon in the tall grass- they stay there so that they could always be ready to help humans. (Incidentally, it also has one about why there are no weapons in Pokemon.)
Anime in general promotes eastern religion and tentacle rape and immaturity because cartoons. Yes, this is what some people I know actually believe. (well minus teh eastern religion part)
I think she’s speaking of the episode “Leaving it all Behindu”
where monkey master and Dexter attempt to become hindu so they can be reincarneted as more powerful beings. (of course we all know the classic ending where they come back as ants)
Was that the one with the creepy building? The computer, the fear (in the show), and the unending hunger? Yeah, that one. How exactly did that promote it?
The Minotaur had set itself up as a god and had people worship it. It was responsible for the deaths of millions and the body count kept increasing because people had faith. Only by abandoning their faith could the characters save themselves. It’s not hard to draw parallels with the God of Abraham.
Of course, the body count was because the moster ate people with high concentrations of faith, which the hotel-prison created by scaring them til they became crazy and began to say “praise him” or something like that.
Synopsis
Robby’s case worker visits him in his foster home and finds him preoccupied with his many robot toys and their death-dealing weapons, an obsession that is affecting his behavior at home and school.
They’re Dexter and the Ape
They’re Dexter and the Ape
One is a genius
The other wears a cape
They’re mutant aliens
Without a conscience
They’re Dexter, they’re Dexter and the
Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape!
Before each night is through, their plot will be unfurled
By the dawning of the sun, they’ll take over the world!
They’re Dexter and the Ape
Yes, Dexter and the Ape
Their narrow escapes destroy the landscape
To prove their alien worth
They’ll take over the Earth
They’re Dexter, they’re Dexter and the
Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape
OOK!
Monkey Master resembles the Indian god-figure Hanuman and the Chinese hero Son Wukong, and that monkey from the Chinese zodiac. And he’s paired with a purple-headed alien that’s obviously meant to resemble a penis, which I’m told is all the rage in the Orient.
I know some people think Joyce is hyperbole, but I totally was “friends” with a kid who had exactly that upbringing. I put friends in quotations because really it was our moms who were friends, so about once a week I’d get dragged over to play at this dude’s house just so the moms had an excuse to drink coffee and chat for a couple of hours.
Not that I didn’t like the guy, he was nice, but VERY sheltered and unsocialized. I think these sort of supervised play-dates were his only social interaction, since he was home-schooled. He had no video games but those unlicensed christian-themed once that the AVGN reviewed, coloring books that showed dinosaurs in the garden of eden, and all his videos were things like McGee and Me and Superbook.
There were a FEW secular movies, but not many. I took to bringing some of my own over for us to watch, but his mom would always check to make sure they met her approval. I specifically remembering her vetoing An American Tail (jewish mice and a pogrom via cats) and ET (apparently ET is a Christ metaphor; glowing heart, heals people, ascends to the heavens after dying).
That was almost 20 years ago now. Last I ever heard about him was ten years ago, when my mom told me he was in trouble for drugs for about the nth time. Joyce turned out pretty good, considering.
Also, how is the depiction of a fictionalized historical event unChristian? I mean, sure, portraying anybody that explicitly thinks differently in a positive light I can understand, but portrayal of pogroms?
Well, I was 8 at the time, and I doubt she gave me a full lecture with charts, but I THINK the problems were:
A) E.T. = Jesus, but he ISN’T Jesus. His powers don’t come from God or faith or anything, he’s just that way because he’s an alien. So basically science can do anything faith can do, but for realsies, neener neener.
B) If the mice in An American Tail represented Jews, then the cats represented Christians (the real Russian pogroms were because Jews refused to convert to Orthodox Christianity). And the cats were all villainous (with a single exception).
Yeah, doesn’t really make any sense to me either. Didn’t when I was a kid, doesn’t now. Hell, I don’t know if she’d even seen any of these films, or if she just heard bad things about them from other crazies. Like 90% of this kid’s entertainment was explicitly Jesus-themed anyway, so stuff that wasn’t probably fell under suspicion by default.
Well, Spielberg being Jewish and all (the name is a bit of a clue, as is his filmography), I wouldn’t be at all surprised if that [i]was[/i] the intent/implication of the second. Most people don’t like their own kind being cast as the bad guys, though. Go figure.
People who share your religion being cast as bad guys in a cartoon is almost as terrible as being systematically murdered in real life, so I can see the annoyance.
Yup. Case of “tone on the internet”; my intent was actually a bit more snarky, with elements of “or finding out that other people actually have very good cause to feel that way.”
(“Wait, you’re saying that ______ have actually done some pretty unpleasant things, and those who dislike us may not simply be envious or hateful? HOW CAN THIS BE??”)
Just checking, the people who are making these complaints about An American Tail are basically the same people who see no problem with Risky Rat, unless I’m misremembering something that was said, being a stereotypical “evil Jew villain”?
Cuz if that’s so, damn, that’s some serious Moral Myopia.
“Hath not a mouse ears? Hath not a mouse paws, a tail, senses, sight gags? Fed with the same cheese, hurt by the same slapstick, warmed and cooled by the same summer and winter? If you prick us, do we not squeal and jump? If you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you flatten us, do we not blink? And if you wrong us, do we not revenge?”
The mice in American Tail represented the oppressed underclass/European immigrants, the cats the oppressors of all stripes). Feivel’s family were Jewish, but there were also Irish (presumably Catholic) mice and assorted other ethnicities (note the assorted ethnic costumes of the mice on the boat singing “There Are No Cats in America”).
In Art Spiegelman’s “Maus” (a must-read, by the way) the mice are all Jewish, but An American Tail went for a somewhat different dynamic.
Very conservative Christians consider Jesus allegories to be either a mockery, idols, or just plain blasphemous by not being explicit enough in the idea that Jesus is the one and only savior. Therefore, anything which by any stretch of the imagination can be compared to the story of Jesus’s life, or any of his powers on Earth, leads viewers/readers/whoever away from God. Rising from the dead is particularly blasphemous, but walking on water and the like, or sometimes having any superhuman powers whatsoever, is bad, too.
Man, so the whole Life of Brian fiasco was kinda damned (heh) if you do, damned if you don’t, wasn’t it? If he was Christ you’re making a mockery of Christ, and if he’s not Christ then you’re leading people astray (though how the fuck someone would come away from the movie thinking they should worship Brian I dunno.)
Maybe its just because I’m Californian and this kind of person doesn’t exist out here, but the idea that there are real people like this surprises and terrifies me.
Actually. CA is full of folks like this. Just not in the Bay Area\LA public schools. Private schooling or anyone in the northern 1/3 or so of Cali (and southern 1/2 of OR) has a chance of this sort of thing.
Loom up the State of Jefferson for more info. It’s funny I promise.
Yeaaaah, echoing Fellstrike. My dad grew up in California near San Bernadino, and his parents, specifically his mother were quite like this. His aunt has freaked out at a couple of anime drawings of mine that she’s seen. Also, I certainly interacted with my share of folks from this sort of upbringing at university (Cal Poly); they were from the Central Valley mostly. I had my own share of this upbringing (not as much from my parents, although my dad contributed, but more from my hyper-conservative high school), but I was out of state (Hawaii).
I don’t know, Walkyverse Carol was all ‘I don’t even care if it’s premarital hanky-panky, I want some grandchildren NAO!’ from what I recall. DoAverse Carol seems more intent on things being as ‘by the Book’ as possible, but we’ve only had a couple of strips so far, so who knows.
It’s a half-joke and half-encouragement from grandparents. To be fair, my parents where 23 and 27 (I think) when I was born – my mother being 23. Getting married at 18-19 used to be the norm a couple of decades ago in many countries.
That’s one of the episodes that was too controversial and so they removed it from syndication before it was aired in the US. I don’t think they even made an English dub of it.
That was a fun episode. Dexter amassed an army of worshippers (who wouldn’t leave him alone), but then government agent Hooper responded by impersonating the prophet Muhammed, and things just got weirder from there.
Poseidon, Poseidon
Friendly Neighborhood Poseidon
Slings a wave, any size
Crush cities just like flies
Look out, here comes Lord Poseidon!
Is he strong? Listen bud
He’s the second best of the bunch
Can he kill from the depths?
Take a look, oops, can’t, you’re dead
Hey there, there goes Lord Poseidon
In the chill of night
In the wake of the brine
When the mortals fight
He’ll arrive just in time
Poseidon, Poseidon
Friendly Neighborhood Poseidon
Wealth and fame, don’t ignore
Or he’ll send a carnivore
To him, life is a great big off’ring
Don’t even try impost’ring
Or you’ll find Poseidon!
man webcomic writers sure take community interactions seriously(in reference to the alt-text). I’ve noticed quite a few getting upset about the reactions their work produces, which I find a bit incomprehensible because it’s the internet and I’d just automatically expect all forms of hurtful and fallacious statements.
I’d imagine it’s just really weird to see experiences that you actually HAD dismissed as unrealistic, or used as evidence that you’re “picking on” a demographic.
Considering most of my readers are pretty great, as the comments section betrays, resigning yourself to people being assholes seems really defeatist and only helpful to said assholes. I exact standards not only because I have self worth, but because it creates a better atmosphere for the other people who have established a community here.
Well I wasn’t saying moderation of comments shouldn’t be attempted, but I’m surprised when it seems to elicit an emotional response from you or Tom Siddell or Jeph Jacques. Rising to that sort of response also serves to encourage assholes.
Ignoring trolls doesn’t actually make them go away, though. On the Internet, silence is often interpreted — and not just by trolls — as victory. As long as there is ANY activity in a public space, they will happily respond to everything anyone else says, starting new arguments with new people, cheering every time their bile goes unchallenged. And if you ignore trolls, they will dominate public spaces, and then no one else will want to go there.
No, moderation is the BEST response and the only true way to get rid of them, it’s just a lot of work and we should all be grateful Willis is willing to put in the effort.
Maybe my posts were unclear? I wasn’t saying don’t do anything about it. I was saying it’s odd to express emotion in response to this behavior. Was this obfuscated by my diction or phrasing?
I think you’re seeing emotion where there’s not. Willis has to clarify this stuff a lot, especially over at SP!, and I doubt it’s anything more than tiresome repetition to him at this point.
Of course, you could be right. Neither of us are Willis, so who knows.
I’m pretty sure that trolls can interpret any response as victory. Therefore, the only victory is regulating the space to the non-troll’s comfort, without caring about the troll’s response at all.
It might also be that it’s more possible to moderate discussion in webcomics, where a lot of the fanbase gathers in the comment section. If you make a television programme you can hardly barge into half a million houses one by one and tell people how you want them to approach it, but when most of the fans are gathered like this you can talk to almost everyone (except the ones that don’t really participate in the discussion in the first place).
I’m almost curious what her dad is like. So far all of Joyce’s prejudices seem to come from her mum, while the only things we’ve gotten from her dad are ‘In my day, we walked through snow both ways, and we liked it!’ and that he didn’t let her ride a bike outside of the neighbourhood till she was 14.
Within most forms of Christianity, Jesus IS God. There is no separation. Since the Earthly form of Jesus is what many Christians believe is the cause of their ability to ascend to Heaven (before him there was no baptism, and no cleansing of original sin), that name is usually the one that gets the focus. “Jesus” as a name also represents the savior part of God, whereas saying “God” instead might invoke an image of the creator part.
I suspect it also has a little to do with separating Christianity from other Abrahamic religions, buuut that might just be my bitterness.
Well, I guess that depends a bit on what you consider Christianity; I’ve noticed that some groups that consider themselves Christians are not considered such by others. But yeah, IIRC there are groups that believe Jesus is the son of God, the savior, the Messiah, etc., but that he himself was a human, created and sent by God and not exactly the same being.
Actually, no. There are some that don’t recognise the divitnity of Christ. The Catholic Church did their best to stamp them out with fire and steel and llater the Protestant churches as well, but a couple survived or sprung up again later
It’s called Arianism. It was condemned as a heresy by the Council of Nicaea way back in the “determining what Christianity actually is” days, but keeps popping back up. I’d be comfortable with an assertion that it isn’t exactly “Christianity”, but I don’t think that’s necessarily an obvious conclusion.
Make that “foregone conclusion”. I dredged up the word that was itching at the back of my brain about half a second after giving up and pressing “Post”.
Well, John the Baptist was the first one to actually baptize people, hence his name. He was doing it to pave the way for Jesus, and then he baptized Jesus as an example to everyone. So, I’m pretty sure baptism existed about a day before Jesus was baptized. If I’m wrong, feel free to correct me.
Baptism is basically a repurposed Jewish ritual with a Greek name. Jewish folks would ritually wash a dude to represent purification, but they would do it repeatedly, while Christians would go on to do it only once. John the Baptist was repurposing the ritual for his apocalyptic schtick, hence the name.
I want to say “Christians: basically lazier than every other religion.” but instead I’ll just say “The more you know!” and also thank you for the knowledge. (Which I should have known, really. I knew about the ritual washing but never put two and two together.)
Willis, it’s called “T’vilah”, aka “Going to the Mikveh”, and has to do with the laws of ritual purity that Christians consider themselves too cool to actually study (let alone keep). These laws are too complex to explain here, but Orthodox Jewish women are still Tovel once a month, and Hasidim generally Tovel at least once a week.
VZG is correct. I myself am an Arian Christian, which means I think Jesus was created by God and is inferior to Him. Most churches would probably disagree with me.
This is essentially what was initially told to me at age 8 with Pokemon, except when I got caught watching it again my mom accused me of being obsessive and banned me from watching it again. While the idea of evolution was already bad in her eyes, the straw that broke the camel’s back was apparently due to her clearly hearing the American theme song line “Each Pokemon to understand the power that’s inside”. She flipped her shit and said that Jesus was the power that’s inside. Since I couldn’t watch Pokemon anymore, I slowly lost most of my male friends in 3rd grade since that was essentially all we discussed. So, to kinda get back at my mom I’ve been watching Pokemon nonstop on my laptop all week. I don’t think she cares anymore, though.
Haha, I remember this Christian movie review site called CAPALERT that had ‘Eastern Religion’ as one of its red flags. I remember the guy docking The Iron Giant for that reason because the beatnik who ran the junkyard wore a jacket with a yin-yang symbol on the back.
Shortly after I left my Bible college (finances/grades/health, though I needed to have got out of there long before), they put on a production of “The Secret Garden”–for which they obtained special permission to omit all references to “Eastern religion”. Um, there’s not much left to that play once you do that.
I had been wondering when her family would notice her outfit… and whether it would be this that would come up first or the “your breasts are staring at me and that’s indecent for a lady” sort of thing.
“Your breasts are watching me. That is improper form. NOW THEY ARE LOOKING AT THAT OTHER WOMAN’S BREASTS! IS THIS COLLEGE TURNING YOU? I’M GETTING YOU OUT OF HERE!”
She must have been browsing around something similar to Christian Game Reviews. (Which are HILARIOUS by the way. Majora’s Mask is 800% inappropriate, but Devil May Cry is AAAAALLLLLRIIIIIIGHT)
I can vouch for the fact that none of this is hyperbole. Though my Christian parents were very chill for Southern Charismatic/Non-denominational Protestants when I was growing up (and have only become more chill as the years have gone by), they were under pressure to be more hardcore by mom’s minister father, their church friends and mom’s so-hardcore-she-makes-her-preacher-uncle-uneasy cousin, who raised her children almost exactly like Joyce’s parents did. It…didn’t turn out so well when those kids grew up. Joyce is one of the lucky ones.
I’m now curious which cartoon David’s mom said that on. I’m thinking Pinkie and the Brain, but He-Man also seems plausible due to the Masters of the Universe subtitle.
This is exactly how my parents acted, it’s sad that it’s not hyperbole in America. No Captain Planet, because he says “the power is yours,” but the power is really God’s. No DBZ because eastern religions. No Harry Potter because witchcraft. Many Disney movies were out because they promoted magic or paganism or animism or something not Jesus. Pastors have to rail on some cultural thing to sound relevant, I guess.
I remember as a youngster there was all this hubbub in the church over “He-Man and the Masters of the Universe” making a claim that there was *any* Master of the Universe other than God. Um, did they watch that show? Those characters could barely master a plot.
Huh. Seriously, based on today’s comments, I’m wondering how many people here had fundAmentalist parents. And now I’m kinda feeling like I got off easy with just divorced parents and a few emotional problems.
It frightens me that there actually are people like that.
Ever watch Deception of a Generation? They talk about Thundercats being evil because one character uses an eeeevil eastern weapon (nunchaku) and so it’s the devil’s indoctrination. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfEnrbtMwMI
There’s an element of cultural paranoia about such things. There’s no distinct line between simple fundamentalist christian identity and fundamentalist white christian identity politics. On the fringes of the second group they have no qualms about demonizing cultural and racial differences, but in the gray areas between them the anxiety about culture and race get’s lumped in as a threat to the religion. In part this is because to the anxious they’re all of one piece, but also because being exclusionary in defense of faith is considered more acceptable than being racially or culturally exclusionary.
This strip is interesting for a few reasons — it shows that Joyce is willing to stand up to her mother (although only with an opinion that someone else has–pushed onto her seems too harsh, but she’s really moldable. She didn’t really believe in the ‘it’s totally harmless’ thing at first), and that Joyce’s mother stands aside for it. If the world keeps seeping into Joyce, she might outgrow her mother healthily.
Also, wow, Joyce seems pretty adult here. Maybe that’s just because of the way you have to write this stuff–when there’s one more extreme opinion and one milder, they tend to fit into the straight man and funnyman pattern, even if the straight man has been the funnyman before. Or just different characters interacting differently, with Joyce strangely enough acting less like a kid around her mother.
Randal: Dude, the Transformers were a total slight against God, in as much as God sent His only begotten Son to die on the cross to redeem mankind and all we did to pay Him back was make terrible fucking cartoons like the Transformers.
Elias: (pause) Nice shot. Well, see… At Bible Camp, we made a flow chart. Since God created man, and man created the Transformers, the Transformers are like a gift from God, Randal!
Now that I’m almost 30, my mom’s TURNED INTO Joyce’s mom. I completely ADORE Doctor Who and Supernatural, and (even though I TEACH religious education), she said that I need to stop watching those shows because they’re going to brainwash her little girl (me) into thinking that Jesus isn’t number one in my life. *facepalm* She never had a problem when I was a kid.
I had to read Harry Potter when I was in high school to make sure that it didn’t promote witchcraft before my mom would let my little brother read it. Four books later, I looked up and muttered “yeah, it’s fine” before diving back in.
I remember when the Disney movie Hercules came out, my family went and watched it. Right afterwards, my dad told my sister and me, “Now, girls, you know we don’t believe in these Greek gods and goddesses. They’re just stories.” And we rolled our eyes, even at 10 and 7, because we had studied this stuff before (I mean, we had a really cool book of Greek mythology in our house) and we weren’t stupid. Also, it was just a cartoon. It’s amazing how little parents can think of their children’s intellect, just because they happen to be young. Granted, my parents were never as bad as Joyce’s.
Reminds me of when my father took me to see a production of Othello. When Iago killed Roderigo, Dad leaned over to me and muttered “You know he’s not really dead, right?” Apparently he didn’t expect an eight-year-old boy to be familiar with the concept of “acting.”
I remember my dad broke my VHS of “The Nightmare Before Christmas” before I was even done watching it because of the scene where they said Christmas was cancelled since Santa wasn’t there. x.x
It’s kind of an interesting situation in my family. I write horror/science-fiction and Sci-Fi yet I’m a huge Christian. However, my sister-in-law who bans her kids from Harry Potter and all magic-related stuff looks down on me while letting her kids read the Hunger Games at age 11. Which I find too dark and disturbing for that age.
Am I the only one who finds those boob eyes creepy? I will admit, however, that Joyce could have some fun creating different expressions on Monkey Master’s face by arching her back, slouching or moving her arms around.
I’m reminded of a certain Shortpacked strip about a certain (Middle) Eastern religion and a fertility symbol… *smiles*
—
So, giving up on world peace then or any other version of the planet being united under one authority. Pity. –Incidentally, it would be interesting to see that version of such a cartoon in which Jesus or an equivalent appears with superweapons and conquers all the countries of the world by force. Speaking of which, did the Biblical instance ever show a display of military power other than cursing fruit trees out of season to never bear fruit?
I read the Old Testament years ago and never got around to reading all of the New Testament, but there is a lot of fighting in the Old Testament. One battle that comes to mind is Exodus 17:8-16.
There’s some really frightening thinking amongst the more apocalyptic sects that anyone who talks about peace and brotherhood and unity should be treated with suspicion, at best, because they’re probably the Antichrist.
Hyperbole, pfft. During his religious phase my dad thought Amy Grant (AMY GRANT) was too “rock n’ roll” to be Truly Christian. He was also convinced the neon clothing fad of my teens was demonic, for reasons I could never get out of him, I don’t know if he heard rumors of neon-colored sex parties or what. Anyway, he forbade me from buying ugly lime-green socks and fitting in with my peers. True story.
I have a feeling that joyce’s mom would not be fond of me since i am a palestinian Muslim. Thankfully except for a redneck who pushed my sister down and called us terrorists at a mall people haven’t treated me and my family that badly
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So this means… Jesus is Dexter’s archnemesis?? =o
It’s strange because Dexter means ‘good’
No, Dexter means ‘right’. The left/sinister/bad analogy doesn’t carry over to the other side.
No, Dexter is that stupid capuchin in the museum. 😛
Not exactly. Dexter is a Latin adjective meaning “on the right hand side, skillful, handy, proper, favorable.” The positive connotation arising as most people (being right handed) see the right hand as the more useful, hand while the left hand is clumsy and therefore unfavorable.
Oh yeah. Thanks for correcting me. My information sub-space storage area gets messy at night, and I maek mistacks. I am glad I did not cause great confusion in the minds of the children of tomorrow! Now remember kids: southpaws are evil, because Latin is always right. (Warning: Latin is not always right)
Dude… you were the one who brought etymology into the equation. The point wasn’t that Latin meaning was A therefore B; it was that just because Latin for A means alpha doesn’t mean Latin for B means beta.
Yeah, he… just conceded that point.
I’m sorry for having a sarcastic gravatar. It makes it difficult to sound sincere.
Can’t… Tell… If… Actually… Sorry…
Curse you, gravatars!
So many smart people… my brain hurts xP
It does in Greek.
It is worth noting that we lefties are plotting to take over the world, though.
You clumsy people will never succeed… !
Watch out for southpaws because until you see them eat or write or throw something you’ll never know their true nature. They’re sneaky like that.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=sinister&allowed_in_frame=0
Here’s some interesting tidbits. It seems that it’s uncertain if the left = bad association originates with lefthanded people or augury, and it’s all screwed up to begin with because it’s based on stuff the Romans mixed up when they stole it from the Greeks anyway.
And with discussion of augury, this comment thread just got far more pagan than Joyce’s mom would be comfortable with!
Same root as “dexterous”?
Yes
As well as his best friend.
“And I’m his best friend Jesus!”
Jesus was in the Season 3 finale. He didn’t last very long, though.
Biblical or Historical? I’m still trying to get all of the Season 1 episodes.
He had awesome ninja powers like walking on water and shooting nails from his palms.
He also knew Kung-Fu. He was pretty cool.
SPOILER ALERT: He turns out to be a robot imposter.
Was there also a teen Jesus,
A black Jesus, and an energy being Jesus?
In Christopher Moore’s Lamb Jesus INVENTS Kung Fu.
Darn, you beat me to the Moore’s Jesus comment. Loved that book.
Were the nails an offensive power, or non-genetic heredity one from being the son of a carpenter, like Susan Sto Helit and Death?
hereditary
…so historical Jesus, then?
And monkey master just stares like he’s had enough of this.
It’s Jesus keeping Gilligan and everyone on that island.
It’s Jesus that kept Gargamel from those Smurfs.
It’s Jesus that keeps the Starks from finding happiness.
Which Starks? Westeros or Marvel?
Either or.
1) Happiness is a warm gun.
2) The Iron Man armours in their various incarnations are made of weapons which obey the laws of thermodynamics unless otherwise noted (See: Repulsors being used to weld crap together, the Avengers )
QED Tony Stark has happiness.
It’s Jesus that makes all those customers squeeze the Charmin, despite the warnings of poor Mr. Whipple.
Wait, is that a good thing or bad thing…?
It’s Jesus that kept Samurai Jack from returning to his own time.
I thought that was Uncle Iroh?
No, that was in the Earth-51 timeline.
52. 51 was where Iroh killed Aku, and threw Jack further ahead.
And it was Frederator that finally allowed him to return.
Or so they’ve been saying for half a dozen years now…
is it ok that i already hate joyce’s familiy?. they are exhausting too watch, heck even joyce it ‘s from time to time.
They make me uncomfortable.
My parents were like this when I was ten, but not when I was in college.
I think it’s perfectly fine when your kids are ten to micromanage what goes into their minds. Responsible, even! You don’t want them murdering hookers in GTA.
Some parents never really want to admit that their kids aren’t ten any more though. “Do you want me to go in with you? Are you okay to go in by yourself?” “Mom, I am 23 years old, I don’t need you to come in with me for a job interview.” “Are you sure? I’ll be right outside.”
It doesn’t matter what age you are, to some degree, your parents will always treat you like children.
Yup, the helicopters can get pretty thick sometimes.
Joyce is annoying most of the time of corse her parents are gonna be worse.
I miss Joe’s Dad and his penis.
But Joe’s Dad’s penis never misses you.
If you know what I mean.
But will Mike’s penis ever miss your mom?
Why so? Joyce´s mom respects her daugther´s decision to watch a show which she herself sees as “bad”. Expressing your opinion and forbidding your daugther to do this and that cause of your beliefs are two different pairs of shoes.
If anything this strip made me like Joyce´s family more. They might be a bit or alot jesus-crazy but they´re good people and love their children enough to let them do their own things.
No, she only respects the decision as long as it’s not what she sees as “bad”. That’s the issue. I don’t find them particularly annoying myself, but it’s a bit like parents who say they’re fine with their children exploring religion on their own… as long as they accept Christ as their Lord and Savior in the end. And only if they accept him the right way, not in a different sect or with a different/more liberal interpretation of the Bible.
It’s not that bad — I’m not being literal, here — but it’s reminiscent of that kind of behavior. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’d disown her for it, but I do find it irritating when people make a big deal out of being accepting over other beliefs (even within their own sect) only to basically end it with, “Well, that’s nice, dear… but you know that means you’re going to Hell, right?”
The ignorance is really frustrating. They’re not intentionally malicious, but it “eastern religion” line is still offensive
Lol, especially considering that Christianity itself is an eastern religion. *Grin*
It’s like when British people complain about all the immigrants, lol…
Homeschooling children as creationists is child abuse, so I hated Joyce’s parents long before we met them.
“child abuse”
I don’t think you really know what those words mean.
It’s an hyperbole but I think it’s about as cruel as giving your children a stupid name that will get them teased forever.
It’s a bit more like sharing your religion with your child. While I’d prefer that kids get to choose on their own, it’s not inherently cruel; kids grow up and learn to think for themselves, eventually.
It’s more on par with telling one’s children about the toothfairy, except in this case the parents believe in the toothfairy, too.
I’d also really rather people not use stuff like child abuse for their extreme and prejudiced exaggerations. One thing is maybe mildly irritating. The other is fucking child abuse. Let’s not downplay the fact that abusing a child is pretty goddamn monstrous.
The Westboro Baptist Church homeschool their children.
They indoctrinate, keep them from other people, tell them God hates everyone, threaten them with an afterlife of eternal fire, and force them to hold vulgar hateful signs on street corners. They force them to protest funerals of soldiers and innocent children. They force a hatred into their hearts and minds. They mentally cripple and warp them.
That is psychological child abuse. Not all abuse is physical. And it’s true that not all homeschooling is abusive.
But shit like the WBC and other extremist cults are abusive to their children. Just because the scars and bruises aren’t visible doesn’t mean they’re not there.
That’s likely a case of an exception, not a rule. There are many different reasons for homescooling, not all of them religious. I myself was homeschooling my mother for a year or so after a particularly viscous bullying incident in which a couple of guys thought it’d be funny to tell one of the black girls in my class I called her the N word. After she slapped me and started to try and press charges I had a nervous mental breakdown and was basically a sobbing quivering wreck, bullying had been a huge problem for me since elementary school and this was a situation where it was th straw that broke the camel back. Our schools out east had a “zero tolerance poliy” towards violence, meaning anyone involved ina fight was equally responsible. This meant hat if someone attacked you you couldn’t so much as defend yourself without getting expelled, it was irreverent anyway because even if you didn’t fight back your attacks friends would claim you instigated the fight and fought back and you’d be expelled anyway. After that mom withdrew m from the school system and I was home schooled with the assistance of my teachers providing text books lesson plans and the like for the rest of the year. I came back next year but it was just as bad if not worse. So yeah posting an extreme example won’t work when trying tp rpove your point, after all, only a sith deals in absolutes
And you’re entirely missing the point. Those religions aren’t just abusing their children, they’re abusing pretty much everyone they come into contact with, and they are NOT even remotely the same as believing in creationism. It’s offensive to anyone with a lick of intelligence to imply as much. It’s even more fucking offensive to even BEGIN to imply that that’s what homeschooling is generally like; homeschooling isn’t even religious by nature. You’re making wild leaps of logic to imply that homescholing is USUALLY religious and USUALLY abusive.
I’m not an idiot; I’m well fucking aware that not all abuse is physical. That doesn’t mean that people teaching their children things you don’t personally believe in or even think of as ridiculous is the same as emotional abuse, and, again, it waters down the importance of rooting out REAL emotional abuse (including, but not limited to, the type perpetrated by the WBC). Nobody’s going to take you very seriously if you bring up emotional abuse and then use teaching children creationism as an example; they’ll just think you’re an egotistical idiot.
Creationists pull the same “no true scotsman” nonsense all the time. They don’t automatically wish death on people, but many are still smug about “sin” and what not. They also try to force it to be taught in science classes. Someone who went to school to become a biologist doesn’t have a debate with a glorified evangelist who promotes pseudoscience. It’s only “personal belief” for creationists; evolution has been observed many times.
You talk about “offense”, yet you put creationism in the same category as the whole of religion. Plenty of religious people accept evolution. It may not be as harmful as many other things, but teaching creationism is still harmful. It leads to ignorance and stunted scientific/intellectual growth.
They might “think” people like Shilo are “egotistical idiots”, but that’s actually creationists. That’s classic psychological projection right there.
While we’re at it, teaching abstinence-only education is unquestionably abuse.
She forgot to mention that the robot gorilla fires monkeys XD
Wet and irritable monkeys.
Now that I think about it, the two are probably connected.
This version does not. He’s much too small, and no longer has cannons.
RUINED FOREVER!
I honestly have to agree with this. For shame, Willis, for shame.
I’ll allow it so long as he did have the monkey-cannons in the original comic book and someone bongoes about it.
Isn’t that what just happened?
NO CANNUN, NOT MUNKEYMASTUR.
The toy does…
Are you saying the cannon is no longer canon?
So did someone accuse the walkyverse of promoting eastern religion or is this a reference to another show?
I think it’s a reference to Avatar: The Last Airbender, which was accused (not inaccurately) to teach kid about eastern religions.
Not that it’s a bad thing.
I think it’s a reference to the fact that (some) fundamentalists will always say something popular/fun somehow promotes something bad.
I hope you just phrased that badly and aren’t claiming that Eastern religions are somehow bad…
It’s bad from the fundamentalists’ point of view.
I’ll stomp on PC and say it is probably bad. Anything that promotes any religion is bad, unless the religion is true. All religions and thus anything promoting them are bad… unless one is true.. then only that one is good (As an agnostic I’m not going to make any claims that any specific ones are or are not the one if there is one).
Think about it. People dedicate everything to their religions. (Some more so than others). Imagine all the monks! Their entire lives, everything they could have done, seen, been, all sacrificed to go meditate/worship/study religious books (exactly which of these depends on the religion). If their religion isn’t true then it’s all a waste! That is horrible.
needed coffee, good to delete now, sry
I’m the sort who believes that so long as you did your best to follow God or what you understand to be His equivalent as best you can, nothing you did in that vein is wasted. You did your best to be a good Catholic, or Muslim, or whatever you call people who follow Buddha? God will accept that you did your best and take you in anyways.
In short, even if the religion you follow isn’t the most correct, that doesn’t mean that the efforts you put in were wasted.
Of course, I’m positive that there are religions that vehemently disagree with me.
Now, I don’t count the people who can be talked into suicide bombing or mass conquering or whatever else some people use religion to justify. I honestly don’t think they read their holy texts enough to realize the hypocrisy of what they’re doing, and there are some basic things that they should know God/equivalent would never tell them to do.
“No matter what completely different deities you think exist, as long as you try hard to behave as appropriate for that deity, you’ll be accepted by a deity. Unless you do the above in a way which conflicts with my own values. Oh, and this assumes that some sort of deity exists in the first place.”
It’s not my values specifically, it’s doing those things that anyone who actually reads their own scriptures should know is not appropriate.
“Love one another” does not compute with “let’s kill them because they don’t accept Christ”.
“O ye who believe!… [do not] kill yourselves” does not translate into “I’m gonna blow myself up, kill a bunch of innocents, and get to party with virgins in the afterlife”.
In short, it is those who do things that are unequivocally wrong (mass murder, rape, enslavement, et cetera) in the name of their religions who are in trouble.
And yes, this does assume that there is a diety directing the affairs of the universe. For those of you who disagree, that’s fine, my arguments are not meant for you anyways. They’re meant for those who can, at the very least, agree that there is indeed a Being that should be followed. But if you’re expecting a religious person to go into a discussion NOT assuming the existence of God/Allah/what have you, you’re being silly. Just as silly as assuming an atheist to go into a discussion assuming the presence of such a Being.
“Mass murder” shouldn’t be the only thing on your list. The commandment is thou shalt not kill.
So, no murders at all. And not only that, but no killing at all, which includes things like acting in self-defense. (Turn the other cheek, Jesus would say; why are you so invested in staying alive anyway? You get to go to Heaven that much quicker like this!)
It says “Thou shall not kill” in English. It’s an imperfect translation. The original Hebrew word used in place of “kill” has a more nuanced meaning. For example, it is never used in contexts of war.
Interesting. And here I thought that was pretty consistent with the “turn the other cheek” and the “letting himself be crucified” things. Ah well.
Thanks, Willis, that one I did not know. Part of what I like about this comic – the comment section is packed with interesting info and debates.
There’s nothing wrong with the show.
Yea, I remember the nutbars when D & D hit their radar, when I was in Uni.
Still looking for that D&D rulebook that teaches me to learn MAGIC FOR REAL like they claimed it did.
Tell me about it, I carved the mystic runes in the floor of my dorm room and everything. Not a single demon showed up.
I figured it was, but the floaty-text made me think otherwise, heh.
No, that particular bit of weird predates Avatar by forever. When I used to read some of those ‘Christian’ review sites for giggles way back at the turn of the century when some of them were still amusing, rather than horrifying, ‘promotes eastern religion’ was a very common criticism.
Horrifying? I’ve never seen that much though, so… Eh. I Can see horrifying, but, not.
How?
Yeah, the big one I remember people saying that about was Power Rangers, but I’m sure it has been around much longer.
My “favorite” argument against Pokémon wasn’t the “evolution” issue (in the series, the term is basically shorthand for metamorphosis rather than actual evolution.) It’s that “Pokémon is Satanic because it includes creatures that grow horns when they grow up!”
I wonder how these people reconcile themselves eating beef. Maybe they’re the same crazies who condemn people that hunt animals for meat and demand that they buy the meat that’s “made at the store.”
What kind of insane troll logic is that?!?!?
It doesn’t really “teach” anything, though it does get philosophical. The setting having its own gods doesn’t mean much to the viewer.
I was going to say something, until I remembered i never had the pleasure of watching that show-sigh.
Star Wars was accused of promoting Eastern Religion. And Willis’ parents banned him from watching He-Man because “Only Jesus has The Power”, which is what’s most likely relevant here.
I know I shouldn’t find the ideals of screwed up fundamentalists who indoctrinate children funny, but I can’t stop laughing at the mental imagery of Jesus holding up a sword and going “IIIIII HAVE THE POWEEEEERRRR!!!”
Thanks, I was drinking the left-over milk from my cereal when I read that. I nearly spewed (SPEWED I SAY!) the whole thing on my computer screen and computer!
Jesus prefers whips, anyway.
Star Wars was based on “eastern religions”. The Force was based off Taoism, and the Jedi code partly on Buddhism. Obviously given a unique spin, but I thought it was interesting that it’s based off real religions.
The lightsabers are clearly phallic cigars though.
Nah, Star Wars is based off masonic legend. The Emperor turning Anakin to the dark side is supposedly a metaphor for the Pope/Catholic Church ‘subverting’ Christianity.
It’s related to what my mom told me about cartoons when I was a child.
AND NOW LOOK AT YOU! JUST…JUST LOOK!
That obviously worked very well.
Like if the road runner caught the Coyote. Or if Samurai Jack killed Aku. Or if Johnny Bravo got a consistant girlfriend.
He had any form of girlfriend? I thought everyone hated him?
He’s dated a deer and a secret agent successfully but they both ended up leaving him due to being a deer and secret agent, respectively.
He also dated a werewolf. But that fell through because on Wednesdays she turns into a fat balding guy who collects stamps.
They need a cure for that…
For what? For being a werewolf or for being a fat balding guy who collects stamps?
Yes
Her turning into the latter.
I kind of liked Stan, he was pretty fun. He was also not really ‘her’ in the psychological sense, so I’d have been fine with it – just think of Wed. as a ‘girlfriend free’ day and you’re fine.
An antelope, actually–it’s the title of the episode (“Date with an Antelope”). Written by Seth MacFarlane, believe it or not.
I’m still amazed that Johnny Bravo not only got past the pilot stage, but actually ran for several years on Cartoon Network. After all, it’s a TV-Y7-rated cartoon which is basically about a guy trying very hard to get laid.
Yea, I loved that cartoon, but I had the same question. I always figured whoever bought it for the network never actually watched it, and thought it was something similar to Jonny Quest. I was pleasantly surprised to see Seth MacFarlane show up in the writers credits for Dexters Lab as well.
Johnny Bravo was one of the shows that sprung up
from “WHAT. A. CARTOON!” – a program that featured oddball one-shots. Some of them, like Dexter/Johnny Bravo/Cow and Chicken made it to full shows, many more did not sadly – some where REALLY (I’m fucking serious) fucked up and awesome
I think the ones that got full shows where in part based on viewer response? I -think- I recall some sort of contest with viewers being encouraged to send in letter for it… I think.
Almost forgot: Incidentally, ‘What A Cartoon’ is also
where Family Guy originates – though Peter was
a lot slimmer and was single.
I’m not sure he cared about sex. Attractive women just made his brain stop working.
He also had a brief on-again-off-again stint with Donny Osmond.
Or if the Power Rangers beat Rita Repulsa.
They have. She became the Mother of all Good Magic. It happened after Zordon died.
Yeah, Beating Villain X is never the end, because you can always introduce Villain Y to replace them and then hype the new villain up.
As long as they follow the important rule of not naming the series after specific characters.
But there comes a time when the only way to show off more powerful villain is to kill the main characters. And then you learn that teenagers are an expendable resource in today’s economy.
Not really. I mean, when was the last time you saw an ACTUAL teenager in Power Rangers, and not just an adult impersonating a teenager? Teenagers are an extremely scarce and expensive resource!
Hmm. I guess it HAS been a while. Most teenagers on TV are just really young old people now. Teenage actors are scarce, but five teenagers with ATTITUDE can be found almost everywhere.
Some TV Teenagers have been playing teenagers on TV longer than real teenagers have been alive.
“Every Ranger knows
Bad Guys come and go…”
That was quite possibly the greatest Power Rangers episode ever.
I find the concept of calling any Power Rangers episode great, very jarring. The cognitive dissonance trying to process the concept makes my brain hurt.
I trusted you, Roboart, and now you spring this on me.
Not sure if we can still be friends.
Indeed, this truly is one of the things that can shatter the bonds between men. Other such things include politics, religion, philosophy, ancestry, and disagreements over who is best pony.
No one who has an opinion on who is best pony can be my friend.
Candyman’s point still stands.
Sorry about that, I will try to make it up to you, if it helps any, I love Pretty Cure. By the way, you have really upset my poor brother Roboart, he has no idea why you are mad at him.
Why do I keep making spelling and grammar mistakes? I thought I was better than this.
Not quite. There were other villains after Rita was written off the show. And when the actors playing the rangers got too old, there were no rangers. The Power Rangers ends when they run out of re-runs of Japanese live action senshi shows.
Depends on whose in charge. By the third season they were practically filming entirely new footage save a few minutes of zords.
It’s been in development hell for YEARS, but there’s supposed to be a Samurai Jack season finale movie.
I think you mean if the Coyote caught the Road Runner?
Well, that did happen once. Granted, Wile E. was about six inches tall at the time, but the plaintive look he gave the camera as he clung with one arm to the Roadrunner’s ankle was great. The sign he held up for us?
“Well, you always wanted me to catch him.” *flip*
“Now what?”
THE END.
Brilliance.
What even is Eastern Religion?
Hinduism, Budhism and other religions I, as an ignorant American am unaware of yet strangely content on not using the vast interwebs to search for it.
It is the belief in the 30 million gos, who are all called Bhudda who let you be reborn thousands of times. Each time you get more arms. The goal of life is to be reborn with a thousand arms. Then you offically become aBhudda, just like Shiva and Vishnu.
Like Western religion but with more soul recycling.
Well, duh. Do if we don’t soul recycle we will only make multiversial warming worse!
…why does money not pass through computer screens? I’m trying to give you some, but nothing is happening…
And pluralistic.
There’s also Daoism, Shinto, and Confuciusism; but the last one is more like a philosophy.
And then there are there is Zoroastrianism, which lent elements to both early Judaism and early Hinduism, and Sikhism, which is a blend of Islam and Hinduism.
And there’s Jainism!
Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, Sikhism, Jainism, Mandaeism, Zoroastrianism, Shintoism, Cao Dai, Cheondoism, Tenrikyo, Bon, and the folk religions of Eastern Eurasia.
Depending on what era the roots of the phrase dig back to, it could even include Islam. I mean, it’s not like fundamentalist Christians are known for being choosy about their scary “other”.
Sooo, the second coming will include lots of shrimps? I am in!
Eastern religion? I thought that was Pokemon.
No, that promotes cruelty to animals. You’re thinking of Power Rangers.
Pokémon are intelligent and battle voluntarily.
You are using facts and logic. How cute.
I shall as well. Upon receiving badges pokemon of a higher level will obey you. Even if you’ve just beaten them to within an inch of their life. The badges Force them to obey. The joy and happy feeling? Stockholm syndrome. Every creature in the world, wishes to kill you. Or kill your pokemon and free them from enslavement. Hell, some pokemon are GHOSTS, and you don’t let them rest. You make them keep fighting.
You’re right Kernanator. Facts are simply adorable.
Pokemon of higher levels battle for you when you gain badges because they gain respect for you, despite having originally obeyed a different original trainer. You prove yourself to them and they learn to work alongside you in friendship and fellowship.
The joy and happy feeling is because you have treated them well, and they choose to side with you.
Pokemon battle naturally, against themselves and against traveling humans. It is your choice if you wish to use this natural power for yourself. And Pokemon return as ghosts because they feel they have some connection still to the world, or something left they must gain, and through helping them grow stronger, you help them to find peace.
Oh my gosh I love the Take Pokemon Way Too Seriously game! =D =D Seriously it would be horrible to do all that with real animals, but Pokemon are fictional creatures with their own in-universe natural laws, so it’s shizzle not that big a deal.
I agree, and it has been too long since I’ve had a worthy opponent.
Pokemon who have just been caught can’t have any knowledge of what the badges mean. Unless there’s an entire network of information throughout the pokemon world which informs them of the significance.
I believe LG and FR introduced a mechanic where your pokemon went further away or closer when you applied an item. But no matter how far they went, (hated you) they still fought for you. (Bonus: a couple ways to make the pokemon like you more is to walk with them in your pocket, or have them gain a level. They interpret things you pretty much don’t think of or have control over as positive reinforcement.)
Not all pokemon battle naturally, using the anime as a resource. Many pokemon simply avoid humans. In the games though, you can run around a single square, forcing a confrontation.
There are channelers in pokemon tower. Or mediums depending on the version. Based on that, either they call out to the ghosts, or the ghosts inhabit their body against their will. Given the amount, it is statistically probable, that both exist.
I return the ball into your court. Lobby it back whenever you wish. This game shall be MINE!
I really do enjoy this.)
Wasn’t there an episode of the anime where Team Rocket steals a trainers badges and his Marowak straight up abandoned him. Meowth than translated that Marowak was pissed at his trainer because losing all thier badges meant that everthing he did was completely pointless and that he couldn’t fight anyone in the pokemon league.
You don’t force confrontations in the games, you’re just walking, it’s the wild Pokémon who decide to stir up trouble. And Pokémon, even freshly caught ones do know what the badges mean, as I said before, Pokémon aren’t stupid, they’re an intelligent and aware species that knows what’s going on. They want you to battle and catch them. They want you to use them to battle against other trainers so they can get stronger.
“Pokemon who have just been caught can’t have any knowledge of what the badges mean. Unless there’s an entire network of information throughout the pokemon world which informs them of the significance.”
You don’t need badges to control Pokemon that you catch, just the ones that you trade for. This means they were owned by another trainer, and likely had knowledge of badges and the like, before they came to you.
“I believe LG and FR introduced a mechanic where your pokemon went further away or closer when you applied an item. But no matter how far they went, (hated you) they still fought for you. (Bonus: a couple ways to make the pokemon like you more is to walk with them in your pocket, or have them gain a level. They interpret things you pretty much don’t think of or have control over as positive reinforcement.)”
I’ve never heard of this, but it seems irrelevant. Of course it’s possible for your Pokemon to hate you. Otherwise, the move Frustration wouldn’t be a thing.
“Not all pokemon battle naturally, using the anime as a resource. Many pokemon simply avoid humans. In the games though, you can run around a single square, forcing a confrontation.”
You’re not forcing anything. If they didn’t want to attack you, they wouldn’t. Exhibit A: Repel. You can walk around all you want in the wild grass, but with Repel on, nothing will happen. This shows that they do, in fact, choose whether or not to attack.
“There are channelers in pokemon tower. Or mediums depending on the version. Based on that, either they call out to the ghosts, or the ghosts inhabit their body against their will. Given the amount, it is statistically probable, that both exist.”
This assertion is unfounded. None of the channelers react positively to being possessed. There is no reason to think that they are purposely drawing spirits into their bodies.
My take on all of it is that it’s ridiculous to claim that Pokemon are fighting for you completely of their own free will, but there are more benefits to being with a trainer than being in the wild, and it’s not the fact that they are owned that makes them unhappy.
Pokémon attack human trainers on PURPOSE. They do so because they want to find a human that will make them strong. A pokémon that attack a human is testing that human, and one that doesn’t want to fight will simply avoid humans altogether.
My pet theory — though not one I invested much faith in, mind — was always that Pokémon, in the world of Pokémon, was one huge, insanely popular augmented reality game.
The trainer is always a kid because kids are the ones who’d be really invested in something like that. The shops are actual shops which sell everyday items but also sell Pokémon stuff for Pokémon currency, in the same way that some stores might sell a range of products and also trading cards for the kiddies, while the Pokémon Centers are buildings built entirely for the game. The Pokémon themselves are simulations you fight with your own simulations, which is why they can be stored so easily.
You mean my life is a lie?!?! I think I’ll take that Blue Pill now. I prefer my reality!
mmmm blue raspberry….
So, you mean I shouldn’t have pushed my ten year old son out into the wilds of northern Canada then? Crap, no wonder I haven’t heard of him rising through the ranks of trainers. What has he been doing for the last ten years.
Oh he’s probably just amassed an army of bears to declare war on all civilization. Nothing to worry about.
Fool! Canada is too harsh for starting trainers! We’re the Battle Frontier to America’s Pokémon League!
Hell, I think B2W2 outright said Pokemon are adorable little blood knights who like nothing more than the thrill of battle.
And the Canalave Library in the Sinnoh games has a legend on the origin of wild Pokemon in the tall grass- they stay there so that they could always be ready to help humans. (Incidentally, it also has one about why there are no weapons in Pokemon.)
Also gambling
No obviousely pokemon promotes evolution even though it’s more like metamorphisis. They call it evolution and evolution=bad.
No, silly, that’s a western religion, too. It’s called ‘Consumerism.’
The irony is that The East tends to be even more consumerist than The West, while ‘anti-consumerism’ is big in modern Western countries.
There is more to “The East” than Japan & South Korea!
Especially since “The East” in itself is just a label created by the nations if Europe to describe everything that isn’t them.
*of.
Anime in general promotes eastern religion and tentacle rape and immaturity because cartoons. Yes, this is what some people I know actually believe. (well minus teh eastern religion part)
What about “western” animation? There are offensive things there too.
Maybe they’re just racist.
No, Pokemon promotes the “New Age Religion” and Satanism. At least that was the accusation I heard.
Jesus, of course, has his own agent of destruction: Himmel the humming hymnal.
And you thought he was just a singing bible, too.
By day a singing bible.
By knight a scrappy, scripture with a scroll for scrutinance!
THIS FALL ON FX.
At least it’s not Crusty, the Chanting Crucifix…
Or Roseanne the Rocking Rosary
Or Cozy the Comfy Confession Box.
Alex the Alcoholic Altar, never made it past his pilot.
Evan, the Ecstatic Eucharist.
Priscilla, the Prattling Prayer Book.
Irene, the Ice-cream-ingesting Icon.
And then there’s Ezekiel, the avenging sword of The Lord. Not a very happy person.
Which episode is it that seems to promote Eastern Religion?
I think she’s speaking of the episode “Leaving it all Behindu”
where monkey master and Dexter attempt to become hindu so they can be reincarneted as more powerful beings. (of course we all know the classic ending where they come back as ants)
This looks an awful lot like a conversation I’ve had about Doctor Who.
Oh man. Had they seen the one with the minotaur?
Was that the one with the creepy building? The computer, the fear (in the show), and the unending hunger? Yeah, that one. How exactly did that promote it?
The Minotaur had set itself up as a god and had people worship it. It was responsible for the deaths of millions and the body count kept increasing because people had faith. Only by abandoning their faith could the characters save themselves. It’s not hard to draw parallels with the God of Abraham.
TL;DR – faith gets you eaten by a space Minotaur.
I’ve seen worse lessons.
Of course, the body count was because the moster ate people with high concentrations of faith, which the hotel-prison created by scaring them til they became crazy and began to say “praise him” or something like that.
Dexter doesn’t recognize that, but he’s basically the villain anyway, so it’s probably okay.
And he’s been doing horribly.
Not to mention the long hours no overtime, health insurance, pension, vacations and extremely low pay.
I’m refer to jesus.
So what was Transformers alleged to have promoted, anyway?
Totally boss action figures.
Toy sales?
Also probably Satan or something.
Bad movies.
Explosions.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Robby-Really-Transforms-Grown-ups-Children/dp/0945354029
Oh, dear Primus. Really? REALLY?!
Thanks, Willis. I guess that was an obvious one.
Ugh…that hurts my brain so much.
I’m not seeing a description or image. What’s this all about?
Scroll down to the product description.
This is starting to seem like Joyce realizing her family is of a… different sort.
So I’m guessing it’s a sort of Pinky and the Brain analogue?
It’s Pinky and the Brain starring Cobra Commander and Destro.
Needs moar Baroness.
Uhm, Dexters girlfriend during the three episodes in season 4 does not count, why?
When did that happen?
Because “she” was just time-looped Dexter in drag?
I always wondered if their make-out scene counted as masturbation, or second base.
Forget that–how did it work with the helmets?
What doesn’t?
(My childhood crush.)
Cobra Commander wishes he was Pinky. Sss-narf!
They’re Dexter and the Ape
They’re Dexter and the Ape
One is a genius
The other wears a cape
They’re mutant aliens
Without a conscience
They’re Dexter, they’re Dexter and the
Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape!
Before each night is through, their plot will be unfurled
By the dawning of the sun, they’ll take over the world!
They’re Dexter and the Ape
Yes, Dexter and the Ape
Their narrow escapes destroy the landscape
To prove their alien worth
They’ll take over the Earth
They’re Dexter, they’re Dexter and the
Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape, Ape
OOK!
So Invader Zim, then?
Good, I was wondering who was gonna make the first P&TB reference.
What if Dexter is Jesus returned?
Monkey Master resembles the Indian god-figure Hanuman and the Chinese hero Son Wukong, and that monkey from the Chinese zodiac. And he’s paired with a purple-headed alien that’s obviously meant to resemble a penis, which I’m told is all the rage in the Orient.
http://www.timetravelturtle.com/2013/04/kawasaki-penis-festival-kanamara-matsuri-japan/
>Son Wukong,
Know in Japan as…Son Goku
I’m just going to leave this here…
http://phineasandferb.wikia.com/wiki/File:HanumanMan.jpg
I am going to allege that this is clearly hyperbole.
And I’m not a dude, so your alt text doesn’t even get to be right. 😛
CURSES
Among the people I interact with, “dude” is commonly a gender-neutral pronoun.
I know some people think Joyce is hyperbole, but I totally was “friends” with a kid who had exactly that upbringing. I put friends in quotations because really it was our moms who were friends, so about once a week I’d get dragged over to play at this dude’s house just so the moms had an excuse to drink coffee and chat for a couple of hours.
Not that I didn’t like the guy, he was nice, but VERY sheltered and unsocialized. I think these sort of supervised play-dates were his only social interaction, since he was home-schooled. He had no video games but those unlicensed christian-themed once that the AVGN reviewed, coloring books that showed dinosaurs in the garden of eden, and all his videos were things like McGee and Me and Superbook.
There were a FEW secular movies, but not many. I took to bringing some of my own over for us to watch, but his mom would always check to make sure they met her approval. I specifically remembering her vetoing An American Tail (jewish mice and a pogrom via cats) and ET (apparently ET is a Christ metaphor; glowing heart, heals people, ascends to the heavens after dying).
That was almost 20 years ago now. Last I ever heard about him was ten years ago, when my mom told me he was in trouble for drugs for about the nth time. Joyce turned out pretty good, considering.
Wait, Christ metaphor is BAD?
Also, how is the depiction of a fictionalized historical event unChristian? I mean, sure, portraying anybody that explicitly thinks differently in a positive light I can understand, but portrayal of pogroms?
Well, I was 8 at the time, and I doubt she gave me a full lecture with charts, but I THINK the problems were:
A) E.T. = Jesus, but he ISN’T Jesus. His powers don’t come from God or faith or anything, he’s just that way because he’s an alien. So basically science can do anything faith can do, but for realsies, neener neener.
B) If the mice in An American Tail represented Jews, then the cats represented Christians (the real Russian pogroms were because Jews refused to convert to Orthodox Christianity). And the cats were all villainous (with a single exception).
Yeah, doesn’t really make any sense to me either. Didn’t when I was a kid, doesn’t now. Hell, I don’t know if she’d even seen any of these films, or if she just heard bad things about them from other crazies. Like 90% of this kid’s entertainment was explicitly Jesus-themed anyway, so stuff that wasn’t probably fell under suspicion by default.
Well, Spielberg being Jewish and all (the name is a bit of a clue, as is his filmography), I wouldn’t be at all surprised if that [i]was[/i] the intent/implication of the second. Most people don’t like their own kind being cast as the bad guys, though. Go figure.
People who share your religion being cast as bad guys in a cartoon is almost as terrible as being systematically murdered in real life, so I can see the annoyance.
Yup. Case of “tone on the internet”; my intent was actually a bit more snarky, with elements of “or finding out that other people actually have very good cause to feel that way.”
(“Wait, you’re saying that ______ have actually done some pretty unpleasant things, and those who dislike us may not simply be envious or hateful? HOW CAN THIS BE??”)
Just checking, the people who are making these complaints about An American Tail are basically the same people who see no problem with Risky Rat, unless I’m misremembering something that was said, being a stereotypical “evil Jew villain”?
Cuz if that’s so, damn, that’s some serious Moral Myopia.
Don’t specifically remember Risky Rat among his stuff (that was Psalty, right?), but I wouldn’t be surprised.
“Hath not a mouse ears? Hath not a mouse paws, a tail, senses, sight gags? Fed with the same cheese, hurt by the same slapstick, warmed and cooled by the same summer and winter? If you prick us, do we not squeal and jump? If you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you flatten us, do we not blink? And if you wrong us, do we not revenge?”
The mice in American Tail represented the oppressed underclass/European immigrants, the cats the oppressors of all stripes). Feivel’s family were Jewish, but there were also Irish (presumably Catholic) mice and assorted other ethnicities (note the assorted ethnic costumes of the mice on the boat singing “There Are No Cats in America”).
In Art Spiegelman’s “Maus” (a must-read, by the way) the mice are all Jewish, but An American Tail went for a somewhat different dynamic.
Isn’t that an anti-semetic reason to be against a movie?
Yes. Yes, it is.
Hey, where’s Perry?
Very conservative Christians consider Jesus allegories to be either a mockery, idols, or just plain blasphemous by not being explicit enough in the idea that Jesus is the one and only savior. Therefore, anything which by any stretch of the imagination can be compared to the story of Jesus’s life, or any of his powers on Earth, leads viewers/readers/whoever away from God. Rising from the dead is particularly blasphemous, but walking on water and the like, or sometimes having any superhuman powers whatsoever, is bad, too.
Man, so the whole Life of Brian fiasco was kinda damned (heh) if you do, damned if you don’t, wasn’t it? If he was Christ you’re making a mockery of Christ, and if he’s not Christ then you’re leading people astray (though how the fuck someone would come away from the movie thinking they should worship Brian I dunno.)
McGee and Me! Lord. I saw a single episode of that years back, and I was damn near convinced I’d made that show up.
In many ways, Joyce’s mom is my mom. No hyperbole. She’d have stopped just short of what’s in the last panel, but I could hear her voice in panel 2.
Maybe its just because I’m Californian and this kind of person doesn’t exist out here, but the idea that there are real people like this surprises and terrifies me.
Actually. CA is full of folks like this. Just not in the Bay Area\LA public schools. Private schooling or anyone in the northern 1/3 or so of Cali (and southern 1/2 of OR) has a chance of this sort of thing.
Loom up the State of Jefferson for more info. It’s funny I promise.
Fair enough, I live in Sacramento, and grew up in the East Bay.
Wow, you must have been a really good swimmer.
Yeaaaah, echoing Fellstrike. My dad grew up in California near San Bernadino, and his parents, specifically his mother were quite like this. His aunt has freaked out at a couple of anime drawings of mine that she’s seen. Also, I certainly interacted with my share of folks from this sort of upbringing at university (Cal Poly); they were from the Central Valley mostly. I had my own share of this upbringing (not as much from my parents, although my dad contributed, but more from my hyper-conservative high school), but I was out of state (Hawaii).
When Carol meets Ethan, will she be bugging hima and Joyce to get married so they can provide with with some grandchildren?
I ask this cos she looks at least 60.
Carol won’t ask. She will threaten. Have you already forgotten that she is ’bout that life?
I don’t know, Walkyverse Carol was all ‘I don’t even care if it’s premarital hanky-panky, I want some grandchildren NAO!’ from what I recall. DoAverse Carol seems more intent on things being as ‘by the Book’ as possible, but we’ve only had a couple of strips so far, so who knows.
my boyfriend’s grandma hasn’t even met me but apparently he’s been asked when we’re getting married and how many children I have
for context I’m barely 21, in school, and have no children. We keep it a secret from his family that I’m not Christian.
It’s a half-joke and half-encouragement from grandparents. To be fair, my parents where 23 and 27 (I think) when I was born – my mother being 23. Getting married at 18-19 used to be the norm a couple of decades ago in many countries.
So, how long until Joyce hits an episode where Dexter impersonates Jesus?
That’s one of the episodes that was too controversial and so they removed it from syndication before it was aired in the US. I don’t think they even made an English dub of it.
There are a few unused clips of it. At best you can find a fan dub of the whole episode.
That was a fun episode. Dexter amassed an army of worshippers (who wouldn’t leave him alone), but then government agent Hooper responded by impersonating the prophet Muhammed, and things just got weirder from there.
Take over the world take over the world damn I missed that scripture where is it again?
You’re just lucky you came of age before the anime boom, then.
Moooooooooommmmmm could you keep your dopey religion away from favorite cartoon, please??? Gosh……
If they’re so religious, why are they wearing shirts with tridents on them? A clear sign of SATAN-WORSHIP!
Or Posiedon. Your friendly god of the sea.
Poseidon, Poseidon
Friendly Neighborhood Poseidon
Slings a wave, any size
Crush cities just like flies
Look out, here comes Lord Poseidon!
Is he strong? Listen bud
He’s the second best of the bunch
Can he kill from the depths?
Take a look, oops, can’t, you’re dead
Hey there, there goes Lord Poseidon
In the chill of night
In the wake of the brine
When the mortals fight
He’ll arrive just in time
Poseidon, Poseidon
Friendly Neighborhood Poseidon
Wealth and fame, don’t ignore
Or he’ll send a carnivore
To him, life is a great big off’ring
Don’t even try impost’ring
Or you’ll find Poseidon!
I am dissapointed in everyone not applauding this man right now.
Or maybe they just worship Poseidon.
And they’re red too!
It took me a long time to realize that Danny’s sweatshirt did not, in fact, bear a picture of a cactus.
man webcomic writers sure take community interactions seriously(in reference to the alt-text). I’ve noticed quite a few getting upset about the reactions their work produces, which I find a bit incomprehensible because it’s the internet and I’d just automatically expect all forms of hurtful and fallacious statements.
I’d imagine it’s just really weird to see experiences that you actually HAD dismissed as unrealistic, or used as evidence that you’re “picking on” a demographic.
Considering most of my readers are pretty great, as the comments section betrays, resigning yourself to people being assholes seems really defeatist and only helpful to said assholes. I exact standards not only because I have self worth, but because it creates a better atmosphere for the other people who have established a community here.
We hate assholes here.
…When can we get more Mike?
Well I wasn’t saying moderation of comments shouldn’t be attempted, but I’m surprised when it seems to elicit an emotional response from you or Tom Siddell or Jeph Jacques. Rising to that sort of response also serves to encourage assholes.
It seems to me that assholes are perfectly capable of encouraging themselves without outside influence.
Troll feeding DOES make things worse. But I suppose expressing disappointment is about as benign a reaction as one can produce.
Ignoring trolls doesn’t actually make them go away, though. On the Internet, silence is often interpreted — and not just by trolls — as victory. As long as there is ANY activity in a public space, they will happily respond to everything anyone else says, starting new arguments with new people, cheering every time their bile goes unchallenged. And if you ignore trolls, they will dominate public spaces, and then no one else will want to go there.
No, moderation is the BEST response and the only true way to get rid of them, it’s just a lot of work and we should all be grateful Willis is willing to put in the effort.
Maybe my posts were unclear? I wasn’t saying don’t do anything about it. I was saying it’s odd to express emotion in response to this behavior. Was this obfuscated by my diction or phrasing?
I think you’re seeing emotion where there’s not. Willis has to clarify this stuff a lot, especially over at SP!, and I doubt it’s anything more than tiresome repetition to him at this point.
Of course, you could be right. Neither of us are Willis, so who knows.
I’m pretty sure that trolls can interpret any response as victory. Therefore, the only victory is regulating the space to the non-troll’s comfort, without caring about the troll’s response at all.
What about pretending to agree?
You can always offer to tell their mum
http://www.channel4.com/news/mary-beard-troll-apologises-after-someone-threatens-to-tell
Maybe, instead of shrugging our shoulders and saying, “Ehhh, it’s the internet, what can we do?”, we should actually try doing something.
Basically.
It might also be that it’s more possible to moderate discussion in webcomics, where a lot of the fanbase gathers in the comment section. If you make a television programme you can hardly barge into half a million houses one by one and tell people how you want them to approach it, but when most of the fans are gathered like this you can talk to almost everyone (except the ones that don’t really participate in the discussion in the first place).
Wait, Jesus? Shouldn’t it be God?
I’m almost curious what her dad is like. So far all of Joyce’s prejudices seem to come from her mum, while the only things we’ve gotten from her dad are ‘In my day, we walked through snow both ways, and we liked it!’ and that he didn’t let her ride a bike outside of the neighbourhood till she was 14.
Within most forms of Christianity, Jesus IS God. There is no separation. Since the Earthly form of Jesus is what many Christians believe is the cause of their ability to ascend to Heaven (before him there was no baptism, and no cleansing of original sin), that name is usually the one that gets the focus. “Jesus” as a name also represents the savior part of God, whereas saying “God” instead might invoke an image of the creator part.
I suspect it also has a little to do with separating Christianity from other Abrahamic religions, buuut that might just be my bitterness.
So when they say Jesus, they ARE saying God.
I’m pretty sure that is the one and only thing that every Christian denomination agrees on.
They vary some in their interpretation of what, precisely, that means, but ‘Jesus is God’ is pretty much the low bar for entrance to the club.
Well, I guess that depends a bit on what you consider Christianity; I’ve noticed that some groups that consider themselves Christians are not considered such by others. But yeah, IIRC there are groups that believe Jesus is the son of God, the savior, the Messiah, etc., but that he himself was a human, created and sent by God and not exactly the same being.
Actually, no. There are some that don’t recognise the divitnity of Christ. The Catholic Church did their best to stamp them out with fire and steel and llater the Protestant churches as well, but a couple survived or sprung up again later
My spelling is terrible. That’s “divinity” and “later”, of course
That isn’t possible…you can’t have Christianity without Jesus.
It’s called Arianism. It was condemned as a heresy by the Council of Nicaea way back in the “determining what Christianity actually is” days, but keeps popping back up. I’d be comfortable with an assertion that it isn’t exactly “Christianity”, but I don’t think that’s necessarily an obvious conclusion.
Make that “foregone conclusion”. I dredged up the word that was itching at the back of my brain about half a second after giving up and pressing “Post”.
More than “without”, its a question of “what the fuck is Jesus exactly”. Son of god? Inspired man? (Nestorians) A simulacrum?(Cathars, methinks).
Baptism existed before Jesus. He was baptized in the river Jordan if memory serves.
I thought his was the first?
Okay, this just proves I am too long out of the church to know shit. Ignore me!
Well, John the Baptist was the first one to actually baptize people, hence his name. He was doing it to pave the way for Jesus, and then he baptized Jesus as an example to everyone. So, I’m pretty sure baptism existed about a day before Jesus was baptized. If I’m wrong, feel free to correct me.
Baptism is basically a repurposed Jewish ritual with a Greek name. Jewish folks would ritually wash a dude to represent purification, but they would do it repeatedly, while Christians would go on to do it only once. John the Baptist was repurposing the ritual for his apocalyptic schtick, hence the name.
I want to say “Christians: basically lazier than every other religion.” but instead I’ll just say “The more you know!” and also thank you for the knowledge. (Which I should have known, really. I knew about the ritual washing but never put two and two together.)
Willis, it’s called “T’vilah”, aka “Going to the Mikveh”, and has to do with the laws of ritual purity that Christians consider themselves too cool to actually study (let alone keep). These laws are too complex to explain here, but Orthodox Jewish women are still Tovel once a month, and Hasidim generally Tovel at least once a week.
VZG is correct. I myself am an Arian Christian, which means I think Jesus was created by God and is inferior to Him. Most churches would probably disagree with me.
Joyce may not be racist, but someone else on the other hand…
This is essentially what was initially told to me at age 8 with Pokemon, except when I got caught watching it again my mom accused me of being obsessive and banned me from watching it again. While the idea of evolution was already bad in her eyes, the straw that broke the camel’s back was apparently due to her clearly hearing the American theme song line “Each Pokemon to understand the power that’s inside”. She flipped her shit and said that Jesus was the power that’s inside. Since I couldn’t watch Pokemon anymore, I slowly lost most of my male friends in 3rd grade since that was essentially all we discussed. So, to kinda get back at my mom I’ve been watching Pokemon nonstop on my laptop all week. I don’t think she cares anymore, though.
What denomination are they supposed to be again?
“And like Joyce, I was raised as a nondenominational fundamentalist (nonaligned Protestant)”
From the FAQ section
Well, I’m a dummy for not looking in the FAQ, thanks!
Haha, I remember this Christian movie review site called CAPALERT that had ‘Eastern Religion’ as one of its red flags. I remember the guy docking The Iron Giant for that reason because the beatnik who ran the junkyard wore a jacket with a yin-yang symbol on the back.
Shortly after I left my Bible college (finances/grades/health, though I needed to have got out of there long before), they put on a production of “The Secret Garden”–for which they obtained special permission to omit all references to “Eastern religion”. Um, there’s not much left to that play once you do that.
I had been wondering when her family would notice her outfit… and whether it would be this that would come up first or the “your breasts are staring at me and that’s indecent for a lady” sort of thing.
“Your breasts are watching me. That is improper form. NOW THEY ARE LOOKING AT THAT OTHER WOMAN’S BREASTS! IS THIS COLLEGE TURNING YOU? I’M GETTING YOU OUT OF HERE!”
…. WHY CAN I SEE PEOPLE ACTUALLY DOING THIS?!
I can, too.
Ah, fundie parents…
She must have been browsing around something similar to Christian Game Reviews. (Which are HILARIOUS by the way. Majora’s Mask is 800% inappropriate, but Devil May Cry is AAAAALLLLLRIIIIIIGHT)
It must be that part about the devil crying.
I love the HyperBowl, especially the half time entertainment. You Americans put on a great show!
I can vouch for the fact that none of this is hyperbole. Though my Christian parents were very chill for Southern Charismatic/Non-denominational Protestants when I was growing up (and have only become more chill as the years have gone by), they were under pressure to be more hardcore by mom’s minister father, their church friends and mom’s so-hardcore-she-makes-her-preacher-uncle-uneasy cousin, who raised her children almost exactly like Joyce’s parents did. It…didn’t turn out so well when those kids grew up. Joyce is one of the lucky ones.
I’m now curious which cartoon David’s mom said that on. I’m thinking Pinkie and the Brain, but He-Man also seems plausible due to the Masters of the Universe subtitle.
There was a review by Cinema Snob of this piece of paranoia over He-man and others. The two guys were worse than that…even going as far as lying.
Where’s the snark? Did I miss the snark?!
This would be a lot funnier if I didn’t know people like this.
This is exactly how my parents acted, it’s sad that it’s not hyperbole in America. No Captain Planet, because he says “the power is yours,” but the power is really God’s. No DBZ because eastern religions. No Harry Potter because witchcraft. Many Disney movies were out because they promoted magic or paganism or animism or something not Jesus. Pastors have to rail on some cultural thing to sound relevant, I guess.
I remember as a youngster there was all this hubbub in the church over “He-Man and the Masters of the Universe” making a claim that there was *any* Master of the Universe other than God. Um, did they watch that show? Those characters could barely master a plot.
Huh. Seriously, based on today’s comments, I’m wondering how many people here had fundAmentalist parents. And now I’m kinda feeling like I got off easy with just divorced parents and a few emotional problems.
And there’s a pun I didn’t intend or realize was there. Huh.
I know how you feel. It really makes me appreciate my Pagan ‘but we’ll love you no matter what you decide’ parents.
I need to go call my mom…
It frightens me that there actually are people like that.
Ever watch Deception of a Generation? They talk about Thundercats being evil because one character uses an eeeevil eastern weapon (nunchaku) and so it’s the devil’s indoctrination.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfEnrbtMwMI
There’s an element of cultural paranoia about such things. There’s no distinct line between simple fundamentalist christian identity and fundamentalist white christian identity politics. On the fringes of the second group they have no qualms about demonizing cultural and racial differences, but in the gray areas between them the anxiety about culture and race get’s lumped in as a threat to the religion. In part this is because to the anxious they’re all of one piece, but also because being exclusionary in defense of faith is considered more acceptable than being racially or culturally exclusionary.
It’s a good thing we have people like Cinema Snob taking the piss out of it.
Good thing she didn’t have a My Little Pony shirt…
Oh I’m sure it’s not hyperbole, but I will snark at you for bad grammar.
— Some Dude
This strip is interesting for a few reasons — it shows that Joyce is willing to stand up to her mother (although only with an opinion that someone else has–pushed onto her seems too harsh, but she’s really moldable. She didn’t really believe in the ‘it’s totally harmless’ thing at first), and that Joyce’s mother stands aside for it. If the world keeps seeping into Joyce, she might outgrow her mother healthily.
Also, wow, Joyce seems pretty adult here. Maybe that’s just because of the way you have to write this stuff–when there’s one more extreme opinion and one milder, they tend to fit into the straight man and funnyman pattern, even if the straight man has been the funnyman before. Or just different characters interacting differently, with Joyce strangely enough acting less like a kid around her mother.
I’m guessing Willis’ conversation was about Transformers.
Transformers were fine in my parents’ household. It’s what my mom bought me to get me offa Sesame Street. It was most everything else that was bad.
Randal: Dude, the Transformers were a total slight against God, in as much as God sent His only begotten Son to die on the cross to redeem mankind and all we did to pay Him back was make terrible fucking cartoons like the Transformers.
Elias: (pause) Nice shot. Well, see… At Bible Camp, we made a flow chart. Since God created man, and man created the Transformers, the Transformers are like a gift from God, Randal!
so SP! Ethan is a partial allegory for you?
Before him was Joe, along with Danny and Walky. Joyce too, but Young Willis didn’t know it at the time.
Dude likes avatars almost as much as a Hindu god.
Now that I’m almost 30, my mom’s TURNED INTO Joyce’s mom. I completely ADORE Doctor Who and Supernatural, and (even though I TEACH religious education), she said that I need to stop watching those shows because they’re going to brainwash her little girl (me) into thinking that Jesus isn’t number one in my life. *facepalm* She never had a problem when I was a kid.
Dammit Willis. We need that shirt. Make it a thing.
If Joyce’s mom ever gets THAT worried that D&MM is promoting ‘wrong’ things, she can just demand that Cartoon Network pick the show up.
It’ll die a horrible death soon enough. CN HATES good shows.
Oh, they’d pick it up. But then run it at a bullshit time like 2:13 AM-2:13.1 AM.
I had to read Harry Potter when I was in high school to make sure that it didn’t promote witchcraft before my mom would let my little brother read it. Four books later, I looked up and muttered “yeah, it’s fine” before diving back in.
“Gee Dexter, what are we going to do tonight?”
Same thing we do every night, Monkey Master. Try to take over the world.
Same thing we do every Tuesday night, try to make a banana cream pie without you eating all the ingredients first.
Tough one.
If I were her mom I’d be more concerned about the “eyes” on her boobs.
I remember when the Disney movie Hercules came out, my family went and watched it. Right afterwards, my dad told my sister and me, “Now, girls, you know we don’t believe in these Greek gods and goddesses. They’re just stories.” And we rolled our eyes, even at 10 and 7, because we had studied this stuff before (I mean, we had a really cool book of Greek mythology in our house) and we weren’t stupid. Also, it was just a cartoon. It’s amazing how little parents can think of their children’s intellect, just because they happen to be young. Granted, my parents were never as bad as Joyce’s.
Reminds me of when my father took me to see a production of Othello. When Iago killed Roderigo, Dad leaned over to me and muttered “You know he’s not really dead, right?” Apparently he didn’t expect an eight-year-old boy to be familiar with the concept of “acting.”
I remember my dad broke my VHS of “The Nightmare Before Christmas” before I was even done watching it because of the scene where they said Christmas was cancelled since Santa wasn’t there. x.x
It’s kind of an interesting situation in my family. I write horror/science-fiction and Sci-Fi yet I’m a huge Christian. However, my sister-in-law who bans her kids from Harry Potter and all magic-related stuff looks down on me while letting her kids read the Hunger Games at age 11. Which I find too dark and disturbing for that age.
Sheesh.
Am I the only one who finds those boob eyes creepy? I will admit, however, that Joyce could have some fun creating different expressions on Monkey Master’s face by arching her back, slouching or moving her arms around.
Wow, I just noticed how much Joyce looks like Dina in the last panel.
Yah, she finally accomplished being more like Dina! Good for her.
I’m reminded of a certain Shortpacked strip about a certain (Middle) Eastern religion and a fertility symbol… *smiles*
—
So, giving up on world peace then or any other version of the planet being united under one authority. Pity. –Incidentally, it would be interesting to see that version of such a cartoon in which Jesus or an equivalent appears with superweapons and conquers all the countries of the world by force. Speaking of which, did the Biblical instance ever show a display of military power other than cursing fruit trees out of season to never bear fruit?
I read the Old Testament years ago and never got around to reading all of the New Testament, but there is a lot of fighting in the Old Testament. One battle that comes to mind is Exodus 17:8-16.
Well, Jesus did tell a storm to piss off when he was on a boat with the apostles once.
There’s some really frightening thinking amongst the more apocalyptic sects that anyone who talks about peace and brotherhood and unity should be treated with suspicion, at best, because they’re probably the Antichrist.
What have you done to me, Willis? As much as I like Joyce’s silly new getup, I want her to get her sweater vest back.
Sooo… should I take Carol’s comment about eastern religion as a sign that this version of the Browns do not possess a copy of the Kama Sutra?
I’m pretty sure if my mother ever said that, I would toss her down a flight of stairs into a brick wall lined with AIDS needles.
But since she’s my mother, I would refrain from setting her afire first.
Hyperbole, pfft. During his religious phase my dad thought Amy Grant (AMY GRANT) was too “rock n’ roll” to be Truly Christian. He was also convinced the neon clothing fad of my teens was demonic, for reasons I could never get out of him, I don’t know if he heard rumors of neon-colored sex parties or what. Anyway, he forbade me from buying ugly lime-green socks and fitting in with my peers. True story.
So, “good results, wrong reasons” situation then?
Man, now i want lime green socks.
I have a feeling that joyce’s mom would not be fond of me since i am a palestinian Muslim. Thankfully except for a redneck who pushed my sister down and called us terrorists at a mall people haven’t treated me and my family that badly
Oh heck no! Was it a guy? I swear I’ll find him and…
I’m Budhist in blood, just not religious… Am i still hated?
The expression on the Monkey Master shirt looks like a response to her mom’s comment in the last panel.
For a second there I was gonna snark, but not for exaggeration.