I imagine that an encounter Ruth and Faye Whitaker (from Questionable Content) would be intense . . . but in this ‘Verse, Faye’s father is alive, so maybe she’s not so violent?
“Ohmygosh! Is she looking at me? I hope she’s looking. Is she looking? I’m so nervous. Do my crunes look bad today? Is she watching? I hope she’s watching! Please be watching! Can’t turn around, she might be watching!”
Clunes is plural for the layer of fat located over the gluteus Maximus. So, what you stare at are called clunes. The singular term is clunis. So, a clunis is a buttock.
I believe the word you are looking for is ‘transvestite.’ And if you make a living off it, you might even get to be called an EXECUTIVE transvestite someday! 🙂
Never said he was, just he’s better at being one so far, since so far he’s stared at the breasts of one the opposite gender, while Ruth has pretty much shown no interest at all in the opposite gender, but is clearly interested in Billie, whom is the same gender. Of course, he might have gone round kissing Mike, Walky and other males before he turned up at Ruth’s door, for all we know…
yeah man. I was loading the comic up (come BACK theoldreader, come BACK) thinking to myself, “oh lordy, are we in for a few more 900 comment declarations of REAL christianity etc etc” and was way, way, way relieved to learn (delightfully!) that, for the time being, we are moving to other characters. especially characters as awesome as billie/ruth aaaaaahhhh
I for one would welcome a lesbian subplot. But chances are Leslie isn’t gonna get much focus, or the paper editor lady whose name I do not remember. Or that lesbian couple.
Nah, Howie. I bet you’re better at picking up girls quicker. You don’t have to inflict a strange form of Stockholm’s Syndrome on them first, after all.
Just gotta mobilize your game, maybe start resembling their father figures a bit.
The Browns and Mrs. Siegal are terrible people, but that doesn’t necessarily make them bad characters.
Howard, on the other hand… well, we haven’t seen enough of Dumbiverse Howard to really make a judgment yet, but Walkyverse Howard, as a person, was just a pathetic figure. As a character, I think I hate him more than any other character Willis has ever produced.
I can’t say I was a fan of him, but I still thought Walkyverse Howard was somewhat endearing (and, sadly, relatable). DoA Howard hasn’t gained that sympathy.
Really? Good GOD. After watching the Brown parents get a storyline in the past few strips, for Mary to be worse she must be some kind of serial killer.
ALL CHRISTIANS ARE BIGO… wait, we’ve switched scenes already?
And I get the picture that Ruth isn’t necessarily “straight” or “gay” – she needs affirmation, closeness, and someone to be with her. Gender isn’t really the biggest part of the equation.
She’s more Asuka. Shinji tended to shut down while Asuka and Ruth get angry and mean. The overbearing father figure thing is the only thing she really has in common with Shinji.
I wonder if it would make Howard feel better to know that Ruth’s strategy for picking up girls is apparently slamming them into a wall and then later getting drunk and vomiting on them. Doesn’t sound any better, objectively, than his staring-at-boobs strategies.
However, Ruth’s strategy DOES seem to be working, against all the odds!
I dunno, Howard. SOmething tells me “Goading girl into attacking you, throwing her around the room, psychologically tormenting her for weeks, then shoving and kissing her only to be rejected by her, then drinking yourself into a complete stupor” is a method that could use a little improvement.
I don’t mean to be offensive, but I honestly don’t see the distinction at all. People are people, and gender has only slight effect on our personalities; most of the effects here tend to be forced on us by society, and anyone can say “nope, I’ll do what I like”. See tomboys, crossdressers, and to some extent Bronies. The one exception being the alarmingly higher chance of men raping women, since the women obviously can’t just refuse to accept that; accept it or not, it happens, and it’s the men who have to change for that to stop happening.
That being the case, gender really only means something as a physical distinctor, although that does kinda get confusing with the transvestites or the hermaphrodites.
That being said, I am perfectly happy hearing the viewpoints of others, and if I can come away from this understanding, if nothing else, what the distinction is supposed to be, I’ll be content with that.
Before the (justifiably) angry people attack, let me see if I can explain. Many people claim to have an inner sense of what gender they are, which tells them from a very early age whether they are “a boy like dad” or “a girl like mum”. You may not be very aware of this sense, but if it matches both your anatomy and everything you’ve heard since birth, why would you be?
There is some evidence from DNA & brain scans to suggest that this sense is genetic, and in most people it matches their anatomy because the relevant gene is on the Y chromosome. But genetics isn’t reliable, and in a few people, their gender sense doesn’t match their anatomy. If you want to know quite how complicated all this can get, do a search. Not everyone is XY or XX.
The people in the awkward position of having a very strong sense of gender which doesn’t match their anatomy have been called various words beginning trans, and a lot seem to use trans* as a general term.
I get the idea that people’s mental gender sometimes doesn’t match their external biological gender. I even get that that different mental gender can be biologically based, and thus just as physical as the external physical gender.
What I don’t get is how that entitles people to get all up in my face about calling physical gender “gender”. Yeah, I know some mortal arbitrarily decided we were calling physical gender “sex” now, and mental sex “gender”, but I’m not seeing how that random decision trumps the momentum of seventy-bajillion years of using the word “gender” to refer to the physical distinction too. It’s not like we don’t have adjectives lying around to draw the distinction when we need to.
The old meaning of the word “gender” implied both mental & anatomical (and grammatical in many languages, and social in many cultures). If you recognise the distinction as real, then the word automatically becomes ambiguous. Your decision to use “gender” to mean “anatomical gender” is just as arbitrary as the alternative.
The reason people get upset is because you are only one step away from saying that anatomical gender is more important than mental gender, which is really only true if you value other people according to how they might have sex with you, or which sports contests they can enter. People can get offended by that sort of thing, particularly if they don’t find you very attractive, and aren’t any good at sport.
Using the definition that has centuries of momentum and which retains its meaning into the present day is hardly arbitrary. Whereas grabbing two existing, synonymous (in this context) words, closing your eyes, pointing, and saying this one means physical now, and this one means mental now – that’s pretty much how ‘arbitrary’ is defined.
Gender means gender – the division/classification of entities based on qualities that -surprise surprise- derive from or have a longtime association with physical sexual dimorphism. The fact that we’ve more recently discovered a distinct and sometimes conflicting mental state that also seems to align with similar qualities in a similar way doesn’t rob the word of its original meaning. Because, adjectives. You’ve got (physical) gender, and mental gender. Clear and simple.
As for that “one step away” stuff, that honestly makes no sense to me. Admittedly, I don’t really give a crap about anybody’s mental gender anyway because it’s none of my business; people can like what they like. Though I suppose I do find the idea of somebody who is a physical male saying, “I’m not a male”. Because you know, definitions and crap like that. Being a mental female doesn’t stop you from being a physical male. Mental self-definition does not eliminate physical biological definition.
So yeah, I suppose such people might get offended – or rather, apparently it would be a sure thing, since nobody could find me attractive and I actually do question the fairness of letting people on sports teams without taking into account special circumstances, like wearing a big male body or sporting a biological rocket pack. I guess all in all it’s fortunate that I’ve never met a dude who asked me to call him a dame.
But it’s not true that you’re using the old definition. History is full of examples of people who were treated for most of their lives as one sex (some even got married), then were discovered, often after their deaths, to be anatomically the other. We can’t ever know what their mental gender was, but their social gender was clearly not the same as their anatomical gender. Yet for most of their lives, it was their social gender which mattered in every way.
The point is that the old definition has never been unambiguously linked to anatomy, it simply assumed that there was no difference. Your definition of gender as anatomical gender is still a redefinition. With the new knowledge we have, there is no unambiguous way to keep the old definition.
Fun fact: sex use to refer to only refer to whether a human was male or female, as defined by their anatomy.
Gender, at one point, was a strictly grammatical term, describing whether a word was either masculine or feminine. In fact, in the switch over to re-defining “gender” as being synonymous with “sex” many people complained about how the word was being misused.
Mind you, the use of “gender” to mean whether someone is a man or a woman, boy or girl, is actually really recent. There are still people who complain about it. In fact, I just read an advice column where a reader asked if it was polite to correct people who misused the word “gender”.
Part of the reason is fairly obvious, at least for us Americans, English doesn’t have masculine and feminine forms, so it can be something that’s a little hard to wrap your head around. When I took French, it was something I struggled with. Part of it was because there was never any introduction to the concept, I don’t know if others who’ve studied romance languages (and the like) have had this problem, but every time I’ve encountered concept it was taken for granted. Even in texts designed for beginners. I don’t know why.
You seem to be saying the words sex and gender have been synonyms for longer than have, in fact, actually have been. If you want to be technical, and given your insistence on dictionary definitions I assume you want to be, we’re actually in a transition period where sex is being deemphasized for use as a name for whether someone is masculine or feminine and gender is being regarded as whether someone wants to be treated as a man or a woman in wider society.
Sense we’re in a transition period, and whether you go around acting in a way that makes people call you woman or a man has a huge impact on your life, there’s a lot of variations. Many people in the LGBT community argue over definitions of various labels, many insisting that strict adherence to their preferred terms, others no so much.
Take a loot at this video from a fairly controversial figure in the trans community:
Lastly, I think the wise words of Randall Munroe say it best: “The role of gender in society is the most complicated thing I’ve ever spent a lot of time learning about, and I’ve spent a lot of time learning about quantum mechanics.”
Just looked it up in online etymology dictionary, and Megatron’s quite right: the use of gender to mean human sex is first recorded in 1963. Before that its meaning was purely grammatical. English doesn’t have genders, French has two, German has three, Swahili has sixteen. Even languages with two genders often have animate/inanimate rather than masculine/feminine.
I think all the romance language have masculine/feminine genders. It shows my personal experience and bias that I didn’t know, or consider, that other languages might have more or call them by different names with different implications.
I say that dictionary is fake. Most people use gender inerchangeably, so I see no reason to stop regardless. I don’t care who de-emphasizes what…I’m not changing usage.
You see not reason to stop? The fact that transphobia (which includes using the wrong words and the wrong pronouns) hurts people does not bother you? Congrats on being an arsehole then.
Agreed. But frankly (sadly?) I wanted to make my debut in the commentariat under more pleasant circumstances than the bigotry-laden hot mess that is the Browns. And I think we all agree that Billie+Ruth is veerry pleasant!
14 and a half hours later and it’s up to 250 replies. It’s all about the countent and the issue, normal strips are lucky to get 150 replies overall but the religion based strips always get the most replies routinely breaking 400 replies and followed by sexuality strips that get 300-400 replies.
Well, we mostly have a maybe-lesbian sitting there talking about lesbians, in a not-erotic way. (Arguably, a depressing one.) A more fair comparison would some actual steamy on-screen girl-on-girl action, to match the actual scummy on-screen abusive-bigot-on-victim action. Has Willis posting anything like that lately? What were the post counts?
You’re right! So those of us wondering how the heck Joyce is holding up under the prayer her parents have laid on her should all say (…1…2…3…) DAMN YOU, WILLIS!!!
The reason I don’t like the phrase ‘I would die for you’ is the unspoken addition that seems to be added in far too many cases of ‘therefore you must do exactly what I day and accept my judgement in all cases’.
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Wow, I ffeel bad for Howard 😛
Yeah, that last line is about how I felt after my sister came out to me.
I love your name. Codex Alera for the win
*chestfist*
*Head to the right*
My sister and I used it to our advantage.
“Good evening, miss! See that girl over there? That’s my sister. If I can’t pick you up, she’s going to come over and try!”
That seems awfully predatory…
and obnoxious…
I don’t know, it would make me laugh.
Sounds kinda funny actually.
He apparently keeps a list of things his sister is better at than him.
After a point, you have to keep a list.
Does he keep it on a floppy?
That video is poor quality, but it’s the only one I can find. I’m surprised at that…
Does a list of thing my best friend does better than me count?
There *will* be a quiz.
Keeping Lists: One of the (few) things Howard is better at.
Ruth seems to have a pretty good list of what’s wrong with her life.
I’m not, odds are his technique for picking of the ‘chicks’ is better than Ruth’s verbally abuse and physically assault them technique.
Though she has a MUCH better track record, I expect.
You mean rack record?
Ruth is also better at being cute.
Ruth is also better at Billie
Ruth is better at being unlikable AND better at being likable.
Ruth is better at beating people with their own bloody femurs.
Ruth is better at being better than people
Anything you can do I can do better?
Ruth can do ANYTHING better than you!
No, she can’t.
Yes she can!
No, she can’t!
Yes she can!
“YEEEEEEEEEEEESSS IIIIIIIII CAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANN“
BUT can she shoot a partridge with a single cartridge?
Can she bake a pie?
You guys will run with anything, and especially if it’s song lyrics. Hmm, I wanna try something…
JUST A SMALL TOWN GIRL,
LIVING IN A LONELY WORLD
MY SHARONA!
Wait, oops…
Crap.
Ooh my little pretty one, my pretty one, when you gonna gimme some TIIIIME SHARONA!?
Ruth is better than people being better than ruth. ‘Nuff said.
But Can She See Why Kids Love the Taste of Cinnamon Toast Crunch?
She may never even find how many licks it takes to get to the center of a tootsie roll. How may she find why kids love cinnamon toast crunch?
Ruth is Batman
Ruth is better at being my favorite girl here
Better than Billie?! Blasphemy!
I dunno, I can’t explain why I like Ruth so much.
Red-headed tsunderes must be your type.
I imagine that an encounter Ruth and Faye Whitaker (from Questionable Content) would be intense . . . but in this ‘Verse, Faye’s father is alive, so maybe she’s not so violent?
my Gf is. 😀
… Well, I’m more a strawberry blond but meh, let’s roll with this for now.
I too LOOOOOOVE Ruth!!!
Ruth is also better at ripping peoples femurs out even do they need them to live.
Damn agent keen beat me to posting it.
It just means great minds think alike.
-High-fives-
This is late but i feel like doing it so
^-^ H↑gh 5
Now, what is Blillie thinking about?
She’s ascended to the astral plane.
I think she’s descended to the dorsal plane.
Dorsal fin? How long has she secretly been a dolphin?
“Ohmygosh! Is she looking at me? I hope she’s looking. Is she looking? I’m so nervous. Do my crunes look bad today? Is she watching? I hope she’s watching! Please be watching! Can’t turn around, she might be watching!”
*clunes
so I’ve still never heard “crunes” let alone the actual “clunes” you were going for
Clunes is plural for the layer of fat located over the gluteus Maximus. So, what you stare at are called clunes. The singular term is clunis. So, a clunis is a buttock.
“If I move slowly, maybe they wont notice that I’m not wearing pants.”
Pants are soooo over-rated anyhow.
Don’t be silly. When Billie doesn’t wear pants, she wants everyone to notice.
When they see those legs, they’ll know she used to be a cheerleader.
“used to be”
“Oh crap, what are Joyce’s parents doing to her?”
‘I wonder how many people in this room know I used to be a cheerleader?’
Poor Howard, but Ruth IS awesomer than everyone sometimes.
You’ll always have Star Trek trivia, Howard.
What if Ruth is better at that too, she just chooses not to talk about it.
Because she is better at showing pity.
And simultaneously better at being cool and a nerd.
Howard was better at inheriting the pathic genes.
If she inherited them at all, she clearly inherited them better than him – for her, they’ve gotta be recessive.
But he is wearing khakis.
Ruth is meaner and leaner.
Her hair is redder and her eyes are greener.
We’re all lesbians for Billie. All of us. Especially the men.
Especially the heterosexual men.
“I am a heterosexual male lesbian for Billie!” Something here is out of place.
We’ve got Izzard reading?
Only if Billie’s name becomes Jeff.
Sounds totally legit to me.
I believe the word you are looking for is ‘transvestite.’ And if you make a living off it, you might even get to be called an EXECUTIVE transvestite someday! 🙂
“Heterosexual Male Transvestite lesbian for Billie!” Someone should draw this person
Well I know I am in Lesbians with Billie!
“I said lesbians…” XD
I bet you’re better at being bullied 😀
And wanking it to Star Wars porn
Try as she might, Ruth can’t keep up.
She just imagines Billie in Leia’s metal bikini from RotJ.
She pulled a Robin?
I now need Willis to draw this. In fact, I think we ALL need Willis to draw this.
This ^ yes
Well, in another year or four, it’ll be Halloween in Dumbing of Age.
That said, Slave Leia as a costume doesn’t really seem a good fit for Billy’s personality.
Meg from Hercules?
That’s the reason I didn’t draw it.
Here’s a picture of Billie as Whistler’s Mother. http://squallloir.tumblr.com/post/57808621391/mr-bean-was-here
The Iron Billie commission a while back was totally spot-on. Gender-flipped Tony Stark is the role Billie was born for.
But I don’t think Ruth’s fantasies involve Billie drinking and operating powered armor.
I could be wrong.
Go Ruth!
Go NADS!
She just walks into your room, hands you a beer, sits down in front of the TV, and Game of Thrones is on before you’ve even processed the situation.
Game of thrones will come on the tv before she even opens the door.
I think Billie’s boob has taken a bite out of that glass.
^cleverly calls attention to Boobs
Either that or she did, which would explain the blank stare.
List of things Howard is better at than Ruth:
I started one up top :3
oh wait, I misread sorry
But that’s the list of things Ruth is better at, that could go on for days.
So far he’s better at having a consistent eye color.
He’s better at having a penis
I feel like Ruth could beat him at that too. She’d have two penises if she were a guy.
Howard is better at being male.
No he’s not.
that’s the best comment.
My brain made a 404 error not found when I tried to think of ways Howard is better.
okay howard is better at having a y chromosome than ruth
Ruth has one; she keeps it in a vial on a shelf next to Walky’s shoes and a femur from a freshman that talked back.
Howard is better at being howard.
Making a list of things Ruth does better than him
He’s better at being Hetrosexual, possibly?
This is a Willis comic. No one’s heterosexual.
Never said he was, just he’s better at being one so far, since so far he’s stared at the breasts of one the opposite gender, while Ruth has pretty much shown no interest at all in the opposite gender, but is clearly interested in Billie, whom is the same gender. Of course, he might have gone round kissing Mike, Walky and other males before he turned up at Ruth’s door, for all we know…
At the very least, every character is going to have a homosexual experience before this comic ends.
I was going to say he’s better at being a player-hater, but I think Ruth’s actually got that one, too.
Better at being worse than Ruth at things
Howard made out with Kate Mulgrew! Ruth hasn’t pulled that off…yet!
Ruth is also better at being an interesting character than Howard.
that’s really the big one I see too
To be fair, she did get a tiiiiny head start. He’s been in what, four strips? I’m pretty sure she’s been in at least seven.
Also she has tits, which is almost cheating.
I think, for the first and perhaps only time, this return to the lesbian subplot will draw general disapproval.
I will never displeased by lesbians. Especially if Billie’s one of them.
I like Ruth a lot, partially because she’s a Leafs fan.
I believe lesbians will be a welcome respite to religious acrimony.
yeah man. I was loading the comic up (come BACK theoldreader, come BACK) thinking to myself, “oh lordy, are we in for a few more 900 comment declarations of REAL christianity etc etc” and was way, way, way relieved to learn (delightfully!) that, for the time being, we are moving to other characters. especially characters as awesome as billie/ruth aaaaaahhhh
I believe lesbians will be welcome*
Fixed that for ya.
Yees.
It’s kind of a relief not to be thinking about how messed up Joyce’s parents are, for a change.
I for one would welcome a lesbian subplot. But chances are Leslie isn’t gonna get much focus, or the paper editor lady whose name I do not remember. Or that lesbian couple.
Daisy’s the editor.
Based on Walkyverse events, I think Grace and Mandy (and Sierra) are also bi, not exclusively lesbian.
I’d be totally down with more Leslie, though. Leslie is the awesomest.
I like his huffy little scowl. His impotent exacerbation is cute in its own way.
Oh, and exacerbating a situation is another thing Ruth is better at.
Nah, Howie. I bet you’re better at picking up girls quicker. You don’t have to inflict a strange form of Stockholm’s Syndrome on them first, after all.
Just gotta mobilize your game, maybe start resembling their father figures a bit.
Ruth- The better Howard. TM
I prefer “If Danny was even more awkward – Howard”TM
Howard – Just, he’s just not that great.*TM
It’s really not much of a challenge, Howard.
I feel kinda bad for Ruth. No matter what, Howard is a douche in my eyes.
“Now what are we gonna do about her. She went completely comotose over there.”
Seeing that his first words in this comic was “Game of Thrones”….Might as well put that on the list now.
Ruth is ruthlessly awsomer than people at lots of stuff so cheer up howard.
Is there anything you’re better at than anyone, Howard?
He’s the best at being the worst.
Worse than the Browns? Worse than Mrs. Siegal? I dunno, man.
The Browns and Mrs. Siegal are terrible people, but that doesn’t necessarily make them bad characters.
Howard, on the other hand… well, we haven’t seen enough of Dumbiverse Howard to really make a judgment yet, but Walkyverse Howard, as a person, was just a pathetic figure. As a character, I think I hate him more than any other character Willis has ever produced.
I can’t say I was a fan of him, but I still thought Walkyverse Howard was somewhat endearing (and, sadly, relatable). DoA Howard hasn’t gained that sympathy.
Mary might have him beat there… Even Willis dislikes her too much to give her a storyline.
Really? Good GOD. After watching the Brown parents get a storyline in the past few strips, for Mary to be worse she must be some kind of serial killer.
She enjoys devouring the flesh of the unborn.
By which I mean she likes eating eggs.
ALL CHRISTIANS ARE BIGO… wait, we’ve switched scenes already?
And I get the picture that Ruth isn’t necessarily “straight” or “gay” – she needs affirmation, closeness, and someone to be with her. Gender isn’t really the biggest part of the equation.
Billie’s boobs are.
Billie’s boobs are the biggest part of any equation.
Billie’s boobs > x.
Billie’s boobs are like vampires, you cannot escape their glammour. Once they draw near, all are enthralled.
Wait, I think I just hit a brainwave.
Overbearing and intimidating father figure. Dead parent(s). Heavy, if not crippling levels of depression. Desperate need for affection and closeness.
All she needs is less aggression and more withdrawn-ness, and Ruth is basically female Canadian Shinji.
She’s more Asuka. Shinji tended to shut down while Asuka and Ruth get angry and mean. The overbearing father figure thing is the only thing she really has in common with Shinji.
Yeah, you’re probably right. I just wanted to see if other people thought my thought was crazy or not.
I wouldn’t mind seeing a Ruthaquarium.
Either way, we have an answer to “Which DoA character is most likely to be an Evangelion pilot”.
Actually, if I remember correctly, we discussed it before in the comments for the strip where Billie admitted to having bullied goth kids.
We agreed that Dina would be Rei, but I forget who else would be who.
Billie could also be Misato cos of their boozing.
Bisexuality is a thing.
^That.
Queer is a thing.
Ben Grimm is the thing.
Buysexual is also a thing.
Bisextantual is NOT a thing.
DON’T OPPRESS ME
I refute your statement! 😀
Money ain’t a thing.
I don’t think that’s what Howard means by “really,” just “were you serious about what you said earlier?”
To be fair, most people tend to assume someone is gay upon seeing any kind of homosexual activity on their part.
Catsexuality should be a thing.
Pretty sure it is.
I wonder if it would make Howard feel better to know that Ruth’s strategy for picking up girls is apparently slamming them into a wall and then later getting drunk and vomiting on them. Doesn’t sound any better, objectively, than his staring-at-boobs strategies.
However, Ruth’s strategy DOES seem to be working, against all the odds!
And why not, after all it worked for QC’s Faye.
Oh thank goodness it’s Ruth and Billie again.
I feel you. We don’t need another 700 comments about religion and praying and not sex for a couple of days.
I too prefer the 400 posts about Billie’s boobs.
They are indeed glorious.
Oy, yes. Those things can be fun to discuss, but it’s mentally exhausting. This is much simpler.
Welp, now I know where this is going.
“Howard, you are superior in only one respect!”
“What is that?”
“You are better at dying!”
“Ah dammit, you just had to remind me that “making Dr Who references” was already on the list…”
Well this is a nice change of pace, isn’t it? This new bigotry seems less aggressive than the previous one at any rate.
don’t worry, she’s really not good at picking up chicks.
Still better than Howard.
That’s like saying, I got an F on the math test…but howard’s getting a 0 in the class.
What are you talking about? Ruth is way stronger than Howard. In fact, I bet he couldn’t even lift Dina.
She would bite him a lot.
Dina biting people has now been added to the list of things I desperately want to see
I think being bitten by Dina might be fun. Maybe she’ll only be play biting, like puppies do. Cuz that would be cute.
Have you seen that RAAAAWR? She could take your arm off.
But shed still be 9004.3% cute while its happening.
I ship Dina and Howard, but only if Dina is biting Howard nonstop.
If I were better at drawing, I’d draw this. Howard looking at Dina, and Dina standing there with Howard’s dismembered arm hanging out of her mouth.
Maybe I will someday. in the meantime have this
http://sadpanda.us/images/1784456-L5LV83V.png
(i’ve actually posted this before)
Didn’t she toss Billie around, that had to involve some picking up.
And Billie is probably one of the heavier girls, so you can assume every other girl would be just as easily thrown.
Unless she’s in the act of throwing them across the room.
Awww, come on Ruth! Indiana is just like Canada!
They both got moose?
Well, IIRC, they’re both pink on the map.
I think I’m reading Howard’s lines in Jack McBrayer’s voice. Not sure how to feel about that.
Sounds like the meanest thing anyone’s ever done to Jack McBrayer.
I’m reading Howard’s lines in Jack Bauer’s voice. Around hour 20, when he’s well past exhausted and running on pure adrenaline.
Somehow I can’t picture Jack McBrayer saying “GAME OF THRONES!” and sounding properly excited. It’d be more like, “GAME OF THRONES…???”
I actually have positive feelings towards this version of Howard. That’s interesting.
↑↓↑↓▲■●×L1R1L1R1 Damn no jet appeared.
I’m great at picking up hot chicks… I can two 1.5kg roast chickens for $20.
Two fried chicks and a Coke.
Two brain-fried chicks and a bag of coke = The 1980s.
Damn I miss the 80’s
I thought it was four fried chickens. and don’t forget the dry white toast
The Blues Brothers despite being made in 1980 feels more like a 70s movie.
As long as this doesn’t end like Higher Learning, I’ll be happy.
That just means she likes what I like!
So how far down that list is scowling? Cause Ruth has an infinitely better scowl that you Howard.
…at least he’s self-aware?
I dunno, Howard. SOmething tells me “Goading girl into attacking you, throwing her around the room, psychologically tormenting her for weeks, then shoving and kissing her only to be rejected by her, then drinking yourself into a complete stupor” is a method that could use a little improvement.
Exactly. That’s Ruth’s method and she’s STILL better at picking up girls than Howard. Life’s harsh.
Yeah that should tell you something about his game
As pick up lines go, “Game of Thrones” is likely one of the worst.
Yeah, but when it works you know she’s into what important.
boobs + vagina =/= woman
genitals are not gender
I have a hard time believing Howard would make that distinction
well then Howard’s an ass
I don’t mean to be offensive, but I honestly don’t see the distinction at all. People are people, and gender has only slight effect on our personalities; most of the effects here tend to be forced on us by society, and anyone can say “nope, I’ll do what I like”. See tomboys, crossdressers, and to some extent Bronies. The one exception being the alarmingly higher chance of men raping women, since the women obviously can’t just refuse to accept that; accept it or not, it happens, and it’s the men who have to change for that to stop happening.
That being the case, gender really only means something as a physical distinctor, although that does kinda get confusing with the transvestites or the hermaphrodites.
That being said, I am perfectly happy hearing the viewpoints of others, and if I can come away from this understanding, if nothing else, what the distinction is supposed to be, I’ll be content with that.
Before the (justifiably) angry people attack, let me see if I can explain. Many people claim to have an inner sense of what gender they are, which tells them from a very early age whether they are “a boy like dad” or “a girl like mum”. You may not be very aware of this sense, but if it matches both your anatomy and everything you’ve heard since birth, why would you be?
There is some evidence from DNA & brain scans to suggest that this sense is genetic, and in most people it matches their anatomy because the relevant gene is on the Y chromosome. But genetics isn’t reliable, and in a few people, their gender sense doesn’t match their anatomy. If you want to know quite how complicated all this can get, do a search. Not everyone is XY or XX.
The people in the awkward position of having a very strong sense of gender which doesn’t match their anatomy have been called various words beginning trans, and a lot seem to use trans* as a general term.
I get the idea that people’s mental gender sometimes doesn’t match their external biological gender. I even get that that different mental gender can be biologically based, and thus just as physical as the external physical gender.
What I don’t get is how that entitles people to get all up in my face about calling physical gender “gender”. Yeah, I know some mortal arbitrarily decided we were calling physical gender “sex” now, and mental sex “gender”, but I’m not seeing how that random decision trumps the momentum of seventy-bajillion years of using the word “gender” to refer to the physical distinction too. It’s not like we don’t have adjectives lying around to draw the distinction when we need to.
The old meaning of the word “gender” implied both mental & anatomical (and grammatical in many languages, and social in many cultures). If you recognise the distinction as real, then the word automatically becomes ambiguous. Your decision to use “gender” to mean “anatomical gender” is just as arbitrary as the alternative.
The reason people get upset is because you are only one step away from saying that anatomical gender is more important than mental gender, which is really only true if you value other people according to how they might have sex with you, or which sports contests they can enter. People can get offended by that sort of thing, particularly if they don’t find you very attractive, and aren’t any good at sport.
Using the definition that has centuries of momentum and which retains its meaning into the present day is hardly arbitrary. Whereas grabbing two existing, synonymous (in this context) words, closing your eyes, pointing, and saying this one means physical now, and this one means mental now – that’s pretty much how ‘arbitrary’ is defined.
Gender means gender – the division/classification of entities based on qualities that -surprise surprise- derive from or have a longtime association with physical sexual dimorphism. The fact that we’ve more recently discovered a distinct and sometimes conflicting mental state that also seems to align with similar qualities in a similar way doesn’t rob the word of its original meaning. Because, adjectives. You’ve got (physical) gender, and mental gender. Clear and simple.
As for that “one step away” stuff, that honestly makes no sense to me. Admittedly, I don’t really give a crap about anybody’s mental gender anyway because it’s none of my business; people can like what they like. Though I suppose I do find the idea of somebody who is a physical male saying, “I’m not a male”. Because you know, definitions and crap like that. Being a mental female doesn’t stop you from being a physical male. Mental self-definition does not eliminate physical biological definition.
So yeah, I suppose such people might get offended – or rather, apparently it would be a sure thing, since nobody could find me attractive and I actually do question the fairness of letting people on sports teams without taking into account special circumstances, like wearing a big male body or sporting a biological rocket pack. I guess all in all it’s fortunate that I’ve never met a dude who asked me to call him a dame.
But it’s not true that you’re using the old definition. History is full of examples of people who were treated for most of their lives as one sex (some even got married), then were discovered, often after their deaths, to be anatomically the other. We can’t ever know what their mental gender was, but their social gender was clearly not the same as their anatomical gender. Yet for most of their lives, it was their social gender which mattered in every way.
The point is that the old definition has never been unambiguously linked to anatomy, it simply assumed that there was no difference. Your definition of gender as anatomical gender is still a redefinition. With the new knowledge we have, there is no unambiguous way to keep the old definition.
Fun fact: sex use to refer to only refer to whether a human was male or female, as defined by their anatomy.
Gender, at one point, was a strictly grammatical term, describing whether a word was either masculine or feminine. In fact, in the switch over to re-defining “gender” as being synonymous with “sex” many people complained about how the word was being misused.
Mind you, the use of “gender” to mean whether someone is a man or a woman, boy or girl, is actually really recent. There are still people who complain about it. In fact, I just read an advice column where a reader asked if it was polite to correct people who misused the word “gender”.
Part of the reason is fairly obvious, at least for us Americans, English doesn’t have masculine and feminine forms, so it can be something that’s a little hard to wrap your head around. When I took French, it was something I struggled with. Part of it was because there was never any introduction to the concept, I don’t know if others who’ve studied romance languages (and the like) have had this problem, but every time I’ve encountered concept it was taken for granted. Even in texts designed for beginners. I don’t know why.
You seem to be saying the words sex and gender have been synonyms for longer than have, in fact, actually have been. If you want to be technical, and given your insistence on dictionary definitions I assume you want to be, we’re actually in a transition period where sex is being deemphasized for use as a name for whether someone is masculine or feminine and gender is being regarded as whether someone wants to be treated as a man or a woman in wider society.
Sense we’re in a transition period, and whether you go around acting in a way that makes people call you woman or a man has a huge impact on your life, there’s a lot of variations. Many people in the LGBT community argue over definitions of various labels, many insisting that strict adherence to their preferred terms, others no so much.
Take a loot at this video from a fairly controversial figure in the trans community:
http://youtu.be/PFa_ccNGwMI
Lastly, I think the wise words of Randall Munroe say it best: “The role of gender in society is the most complicated thing I’ve ever spent a lot of time learning about, and I’ve spent a lot of time learning about quantum mechanics.”
Just looked it up in online etymology dictionary, and Megatron’s quite right: the use of gender to mean human sex is first recorded in 1963. Before that its meaning was purely grammatical. English doesn’t have genders, French has two, German has three, Swahili has sixteen. Even languages with two genders often have animate/inanimate rather than masculine/feminine.
I think all the romance language have masculine/feminine genders. It shows my personal experience and bias that I didn’t know, or consider, that other languages might have more or call them by different names with different implications.
I say that dictionary is fake. Most people use gender inerchangeably, so I see no reason to stop regardless. I don’t care who de-emphasizes what…I’m not changing usage.
You see not reason to stop? The fact that transphobia (which includes using the wrong words and the wrong pronouns) hurts people does not bother you? Congrats on being an arsehole then.
Nobody said that…obviously they would include hormones and chromosomes.
The night before last’s strip: 1004 comments
Last night’s strip: 749 comments
Tonight’s strip: 162 comments
To be fair, the previous two were over approximately 24 hour periods.
But, yeah, I don’t think it’s going to match the last couple comics.
Yeah. After all, they even got me out of the woodworks.
… wait.
Yeah, it’s weird actually commenting in the, y’know, comments instead of doing my normal lurking.
Agreed. But frankly (sadly?) I wanted to make my debut in the commentariat under more pleasant circumstances than the bigotry-laden hot mess that is the Browns. And I think we all agree that Billie+Ruth is veerry pleasant!
14 and a half hours later and it’s up to 250 replies. It’s all about the countent and the issue, normal strips are lucky to get 150 replies overall but the religion based strips always get the most replies routinely breaking 400 replies and followed by sexuality strips that get 300-400 replies.
So that strip did break 1000 after all.
Apparently lesbians aren’t as great for traffic as Willis says.
Not as great as Hitler, anyhow.
Hmmmm….. but what if we combine the 2?
Well, we mostly have a maybe-lesbian sitting there talking about lesbians, in a not-erotic way. (Arguably, a depressing one.) A more fair comparison would some actual steamy on-screen girl-on-girl action, to match the actual scummy on-screen abusive-bigot-on-victim action. Has Willis posting anything like that lately? What were the post counts?
Well, the one where Ruth kisses Billie had 600 comments or so.
Maybe, but this one is actually named ‘Lesbian’.
Shit, if that’s true, I’d hate to see Howard’s plan A.
Willis, you have a big enough cast of characters that you don’t need a friday cliffhanger you can just look at someone else.
You’re right! So those of us wondering how the heck Joyce is holding up under the prayer her parents have laid on her should all say (…1…2…3…) DAMN YOU, WILLIS!!!
I feel like this is setting up a Ruth/Billie/Howard threesome, but I think that might even be too far for Willis.
NO
What part of Howard has no game do you not understand?
I think going to bed with your sister to get with her girlfriend is pretty much the epitome of “no game.”
Also, JESUS FUCK NO WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU DARTH CARISS.
Replace Howard with Walky and it suddenly becomes way more plausible for some reason.
Even though we only know of Billie, I still bet Ruth has kissed more girls then Howard has
Howard won’t be kissing Captain Janeway in this universe
I like this Howard better. The youthfulness and deeper, more explored relationship with Ruth is why…
“Finally,” Howard thinks, “I can have my fantasies come true! Now if only I were a midget…”
Oh Howard, that should’ve already been on the list a long time ago.
wow, this has happen to me way to often
DAMN YOU WIL…. wait… today’s comic doesn’t make me lose faith in humanity…
Look it on the bright side howard. She can be your wing-woman too.
Wow. Complete mood whiplash from yesterday’s comic.
hey Logician! awesome argument, compassionately done! nice work my friend!
why does everything sound sarcastic on the internet? I don’t mean it that way!
Your life is truely sad wwhen you find out your sister is better with wemon than you
The reason I don’t like the phrase ‘I would die for you’ is the unspoken addition that seems to be added in far too many cases of ‘therefore you must do exactly what I day and accept my judgement in all cases’.
Blooming heck! Willis, delete this comment chain if you notice it – I somehow managed to put it on the wrong page!